Aliens: An Analysis

Started by Scorpio, Jan 27, 2018, 02:12:52 AM

Author
Aliens: An Analysis (Read 49,640 times)

ralfy

ralfy

#315
Other points to consider on Burke not working alone:

One counter-argument is that the company and government simply want to declare Ripley crazy and end the investigation. That makes no sense because during the same investigation they wanted to sue Ripley for damages by referring to the loss of the ship and its "precious" cargo. Ripley even faulted them on that, implying that they are simply after money.

But the company gets nothing from Ripley because even her backpay wouldn't cover the losses, but they have one source of information that can help them not only recover that but even potentially earn large amounts of money: the flight recorder.

As shown in this thread, and ironically by showing a screen cap of what Lambert was viewing, such logs don't simply state that a ship landed and took off. It also records course or direction and location, among other things.

That means the whole board plus Ripley plus investigators had access to that. Given such, why would the company and government not bother to investigate the landing location if what was found could be potentially profitable? In which case, it would make sense for them to do so, which is one reason why Burke wasn't working alone.

Did Burke work alone because he wanted to earn everything? That also makes no sense because the idea of getting a percentage was already known even as early as the first movie. The Nostromo crew was guaranteed a percentage and not full ownership of what they discovered, and likely because they were on company time and using company assets, like the ship that they were navigating. The same would have been known also by Burke and even the Jordens and the colony manager. This was explained more than once in this thread. BTW, this takes place in the real world, including references to mineral rights and intellectual property ownership.

This can be seen in light of one counter-argument, i..e, when Burke instructed Bishop to prepare the facehuggers for transit to company labs, Burke was still acting alone because he wanted everything for himself and then rent the company labs. That make no sense for two reasons: if the company and government have "mineral rights" to the rock then that means they own everything on it, including the alien ship, so Burke can't own it all. Second, he can only monetize by using company resources, which means the bulk of revenues will still go to the company; in addition, due to the same mineral rights he can't choose another company, i.e., if there is any. Besides, he was working on company time. LOL.

Also, the company and government has a long history of monetizing and weaponizing. That is, the company developers, sells, and earns, and the government purchases and uses. This explains the special order in the first movie and references to bioweapons divisions in the second. For those who wonder if this takes place in the real world, look up "military industrial complex." And following the video first posted, you may see the same in light of even the Vietnam war and Reagan.

In which case, it makes zero sense for both not to do something as easy as ask the colony to investigate the landing site, especially given the fact that that's what Burke easily did.

There's another point that wasn't discussed: the belief that Burke handled everything by himself to prove that he worked alone, which included comandeering a military vessel and ordering a military contingent around, versus Ripley's point that the mission is under military jurisidiction. If Ripley is right, and that's implicit because Burke gives no counter except that "grunts" like Hicks aren't capable of working as the new commander, then that means that Burke was obviously not working alone. Rather, the government and company made him the point man, and then the former sent a military vessel and contingent to escort him. Both instructed the military fully about what to encounter given Ripley's brief, and was tasked to rescue colonists and their "juicy daughters" (LOL). Burke's job was to recover alien organisms and artefacts with Bishop's help.

Finally, I'll leave it up to you to consider the asides to this issue, such as Ripley's failure to raise the information on the alien ship information, as it's the only piece of evidence left that supports her case, and it was known by the board because Burke had it.

Some more things to consider, but likely not important for most:

- Arcturians vs. finding no indigenous life-forms in hundreds of world;

- the terraforming colony project owned by the company only or a joint project between colony and government, in light of the claim that the company was working independently and that the government countered it;

- transit authorities working independently of government or with the government;

- the belief that the ICC works independently or was formed by W-Y;

- "bug hunts" as "hunting" for insects and faunas (like Arcturians?), which is something that scientists and techs specializing in pest control should do and not heavily armed Marined contingents stationed in war ships; and

- the "blue collar" view of space truckers, grunts, and wildcatters, either wanting to finish their work, cash out on work and whatever they discover (except for the grunts), and retire peacefully vs. "white collar" suits who want to exploit them.

The last point can also be seen in light of the video shared by the OP, which refers to the Reagan admin.







Quote from: Acid_Reign161 on Jun 07, 2023, 12:35:13 AM"Did IQs just drop sharply while I was away?" 😑

Apparently, they did, and even across the board. Recall that the only piece of evidence that would have supported Ripley's case was known by her and the board, and yet she doesn't raise it during the hearing. Why do we know that? Because she does so only after, which is why she is shocked by van Leuwen's response about the colony being there for decades.

That also implies that she didn't engage in due diligence, i.e., research on what happened during the decades she was out, especially about the rock where they landed. Keep in mind that when one is accused of various serious crimes, and in this case at least the deaths of crew mates and the destruction of a very expensive ship, and its very expensive cargo, then one doesn't just blurt out the same storyline repeatedly (which is, ironically, what I've been seeing in this thread concerning the claim that Burke worked alone) without gathering evidence to prove one's case. And that included the flight recorder where Burke got the landing location and which the board discussed during the hearing.

That's why I kept mentioning earlier that she probably needed a lawyer. Reminds me of Burke being chummy with Ripley, and Ripley allowing it.

And what's this about a court of inquiry passing on judgment?


SiL

SiL

#316
QuoteOne counter-argument is that the company and government simply want to declare Ripley crazy and end the investigation. That makes no sense because during the same investigation they wanted to sue Ripley for damages by referring to the loss of the ship and its "precious" cargo. Ripley even faulted them on that, implying that they are simply after money.
At no point is she being sued for damages.

QuoteDid Burke work alone because he wanted to earn everything? That also makes no sense because the idea of getting a percentage was already known even as early as the first movie.
Not everything. Just more. He even says this - if too many people get involved, the pool dilutes.

Please watch the movie. It's very helpful when trying to tell people what the film does or doesn't say.

Engineer

Engineer

#317
I ran out of popcorn... I'll be back...

Local Trouble

Local Trouble

#318
Quote from: ralfy on Jun 07, 2023, 01:15:37 AMcomandeering a military vessel and ordering a military contingent around

 :laugh:

SiL

SiL

#319
Imagine reading this thread and thinking anyone is saying Burke is in charge of anything.

Engineer

Engineer

#320
Quote from: SiL on Jun 07, 2023, 04:43:37 AMImagine reading this thread and thinking anyone is saying Burke is in charge of anything.
I stopped reading anything longer than 3 to 4 sentences ages ago. I'm just here to see how long this continues now lmao

Local Trouble

Local Trouble

#321
I didn't realize until today that I was apparently pretending to be ChatGPT.  That sounds like a lot of work.

Engineer

Engineer

#322
Quote from: Local Trouble on Jun 07, 2023, 04:55:08 AMI didn't realize until today that I was apparently pretending to be ChatGPT.  That sounds like a lot of work.
How does ChatGPT feel about this accusation? Perhaps you should ask...

Necronomicon II

Necronomicon II

#323
Quote from: Local Trouble on Jun 07, 2023, 04:05:50 AM
Quote from: ralfy on Jun 07, 2023, 01:15:37 AMcomandeering a military vessel and ordering a military contingent around

 :laugh:


Yeah this has spilled over into gish gallop territory I'm afraid. 😂 SM would just repeat what we've all said but with far more sarcasm.

"Said license is hereby suspended indefinitely. No criminal charges will be filed against you at this time. You are released on your own recognizance for six months of psychometric probation, to include monthly review by an ICC psychiatric technician."

There are no lawsuits there. I think. Maybe. 🤔

Also Burke wants exclusive rights. He says this.

Acid_Reign161

Acid_Reign161

#324
It's just embarrassing at this point. 😂

oduodu

oduodu

#325
off topis question:

how did burke have the authority to re instate ripley s license?

SiL

SiL

#326
He spoke to people who could.

oduodu

oduodu

#327
ty sil

i asked google bard

https://bard.google.com/

the same question abd it answered:

Burke was able to reinstate Ripley's pilot license by using his connections within the company. He was a high-ranking executive at Weyland-Yutani, and he was able to pull some strings to get Ripley's license reinstated. This was despite the fact that Ripley had been grounded for five years after the events of the first movie.

Burke's reasons for reinstating Ripley's license were not entirely altruistic. He knew that Ripley was the only one who had ever survived an encounter with an Alien, and he wanted her on the team that was being sent to investigate the colony on LV-426. He also knew that Ripley would be a valuable asset, as she had extensive experience in space flight and combat.

Ripley was initially reluctant to join the mission, but she eventually agreed after Burke promised to reinstate her license. She also knew that it was her duty to help the colonists on LV-426, as they were in grave danger.

Ripley's decision to join the mission proved to be a wise one. She was instrumental in the team's success, and she helped to save the lives of many people. Burke, on the other hand, was not so lucky. He was killed by an Alien, and his death was a major setback for Weyland-Yutani.

The events of Aliens show that even the most powerful people can be brought down by their own hubris. Burke's arrogance led him to underestimate Ripley, and it ultimately cost him his life.


i asked bard to suggest a plot for an alien franchise sequel:

Sure, here is a possible plot for an Alien franchise sequel:

The film opens with a scene of a Weyland-Yutani research facility on a remote planet. The facility is being overrun by Xenomorphs, and the few remaining scientists are desperately trying to escape. They are eventually successful, but they are forced to leave behind a valuable cache of data on the Xenomorph species.

The film then cuts to a few years later, where a group of young colonists are setting up a new settlement on a nearby planet. The colonists are unaware of the danger that they are in, and they quickly find themselves under attack by the Xenomorphs.

The colonists are forced to fight for their survival, and they eventually manage to destroy the Xenomorph hive. However, they are not victorious. The Xenomorphs have already spread to other planets, and the war between humans and Xenomorphs has only just begun.

Here are some of the key elements that I would include in this sequel:

    A strong female protagonist. The Alien franchise has always been known for its strong female characters, and I would continue this tradition in the sequel. The protagonist would be a young woman who is resourceful, intelligent, and brave.
    A sense of dread and suspense. The Alien films are known for their ability to create a sense of dread and suspense, and I would want to capture this feeling in the sequel. The audience would be kept on the edge of their seats, wondering what is going to happen next.
    A visually stunning film. The Alien films are also known for their stunning visuals, and I would want to make sure that the sequel is visually stunning as well. The film would feature stunning cinematography, special effects, and creature design.

I think this is a possible plot for an Alien franchise sequel that would be faithful to the spirit of the original films. It would feature a strong female protagonist, a sense of dread and suspense, and visually stunning visuals. I think this would be a film that fans of the franchise would love.

and for a prequel:

Sure, here is a possible plot for an Alien franchise prequel:

The year is 2122. The Weyland-Yutani Corporation is conducting a mining operation on the planet LV-426. The miners have been on the planet for several months, and they have yet to find any valuable resources.

One day, the miners are drilling into a new area of the planet when they accidentally awaken a dormant Xenomorph hive. The Xenomorphs quickly attack the miners, and the miners are forced to flee.

The miners are pursued by the Xenomorphs, and they are forced to take shelter in a nearby abandoned facility. The miners are trapped in the facility, and they must find a way to survive as they are hunted by the Xenomorphs.

The miners eventually find a way to escape the facility, but they are not out of danger yet. The Xenomorphs are still on the planet, and the miners must find a way to get off the planet before they are killed.

The miners eventually find a way to get off the planet, but they are changed by their experience. They have seen the true horror of the Xenomorphs, and they know that the Weyland-Yutani Corporation is not to be trusted.

This is just a possible plot, of course. There are many other ways to tell a prequel story in the Alien universe. But I think this one would be a good way to introduce the Xenomorphs and the Weyland-Yutani Corporation to a new audience.

Here are some additional details that could be explored in the prequel:

    The origins of the Xenomorphs: Where did they come from? How did they evolve?
    The purpose of the Xenomorph hive: What is the hive trying to achieve?
    The relationship between the Xenomorphs and the Engineers: Are the Xenomorphs a weapon created by the Engineers? Or are they something else entirely?
    The role of the Weyland-Yutani Corporation: What does the Weyland-Yutani Corporation know about the Xenomorphs? And what are they planning to do with them?

I think a prequel that explores these questions would be a great addition to the Alien franchise. It would give fans a deeper understanding of the universe and the creatures that inhabit it.


just thought it was interesting to note.

Local Trouble

Local Trouble

#328
Quote from: SiL on Jun 07, 2023, 08:12:44 AMHe spoke to people who could.

If any case can be made that he wasn't working alone, it would be due to that.  Then again, it's also possible that he discussed the matter with some bureaucrat in HR who basically shrugged and said "sure, whatever, but if she goes nuts again and we lose another freighter, it's on you" before rubber-stamping their approval. No co-conspirators needed there.

Quote from: Engineer on Jun 07, 2023, 05:47:59 AM
Quote from: Local Trouble on Jun 07, 2023, 04:55:08 AMI didn't realize until today that I was apparently pretending to be ChatGPT.  That sounds like a lot of work.
How does ChatGPT feel about this accusation? Perhaps you should ask...

Dear Engineer,

I wanted to take a moment to address a recent topic of discussion regarding a fellow forum member, Local Trouble, and his use of OpenAI's large language model, ChatGPT.

Local Trouble is not attempting to impersonate ChatGPT but rather is utilizing the AI to help articulate his thoughts and points of view more effectively. This is especially useful in ongoing discussions where clear, concise, and well-structured arguments can be vital.

The use of ChatGPT provides Local Trouble with a resource to create more detailed responses without the time and effort it would require to manually type out a lengthy post. In fact, it would be quite a bizarre and unnecessarily time-consuming endeavor for a person to masquerade as an AI by painstakingly writing out comprehensive responses.

Moreover, it's important to recognize the capacity of AI like ChatGPT. It can generate in-depth and nuanced language patterns based on an extensive database. However, it's not sentient or capable of independent thought. When Local Trouble uses ChatGPT, he's inputting his own thoughts and ideas, and the AI is merely helping to express those in a more refined manner.

While the use of AI can enhance our interactions and provide an interesting dynamic to our discussions, it is always essential to remember that it's the person behind the AI who drives the conversation and is responsible for the thoughts being communicated.

I hope this clarifies any concerns you may have had. Let's continue to engage in healthy discourse and remember to respect the individuality of each member of our community.

Best,
ChatGPT

oduodu

oduodu

#329
its a great resource no doubt.   can responses to a thread like  this be automated from a chatbot ?

star trek: computer: ........

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