Starmap: NOT an invitation - so what is it?

[Anonymous User]

But this is an organisation (Weyland) that have known about the aliens, and the alien civilisation, since the first movie ("Special Order 937" remember???). So why are they pretending they don't know??? Also - your point about Burke doesn't wash. Having a motive fuelled by greed is one thing... having absolutely no plan, or even worse, a plan that will result in your certain death is incredulous. Tell me - what was Burke actually going to do? Was his plan always to kill the rest of the crew and sneak an "acid for blood" alien on board (even before he was 'found out'? Believing that Burke arranged for the team to be purposely inept seems like a very large leap... and even if you were correct (and it would take Cameron announcing that plot point - as it's not in the movie), I think that it only serves to highlight the flawed logic even more.

I think you should watch the two films again.

• In Alien, Nostromo was a mining expedition. On their way back home to Earth, they had to land in LV 426 after detecting a distress signal. They were not sent intentionally to collect an alien being. The existence of the directive doesn't mean that the company was aware of a Xeno. It was a general directive for Ash to bring back any alien form with the crew being expendable. Any alien form, not necessarily a Xeno


• In Aliens, Burke's plan was to get a facehugger to impregnate one of the crew and sneak him/her back to Earth. He tried to do it to Ripley/Newt

Anyway, I think we are straying from the original topic.

Roofing does not extend out into corridors and over vast area's no matter what it's made from. Had they show the Aliens using the ducting as the means of entering it would have been a bit more believable (and really why didn't they?). As it was they are just crawling across the entire complex via roofing that somehow expands across the entire floor.

Think about it. Why would you have air locked steel doors with an overhead partition that extends out into the hallway? (and apparently further than that).

Perhaps it's not a plot hole but it's definitely as dumb as anything Prom spits out. There are all kinds of logic gaps throughout the Alien series. Prometheus is not a special case. Like Darth points out it's all down to the viewer and how they handle it.

They also come up through the floor at one point if I remember.

Honestly I wouldn't be bothered with that kind of detail in any of the movies I watch. I was not bothered with how Prometheus crew could breath in the temple while there was a big hole in the temple. I can live without small detail.

I am more interested in finding a story which has a continuity from one scene to another. Engineers showing a star map of LV-223 at the beginning of the movie which turns out to be a weapon storage facility in the end does not present a continuity in the story unless you add your own wild speculation to it. And I didn't watch the movie to have my own speculation.

Is this part of the cut scenes?

No...Weyland hired them to find out if our makers were on the planet. So he could meet them and prolong his life. He used them for the grunt work.

We know he had only days to live but there is nothing explaining about rushing the recruitment or the mission. FYI, we also know that he can live for years as long as he stays in cryosleep.

Well, to be fair he was on deaths bed when he made the hologram two years before they arrived, and at that point said he was probably going to be dead before they got there. This, it would seem, was part of the plan to conceal his true intentions (make them think he's dead). And staying in cryosleep indefinitely is hardly an existence anyone would want. Especially given how tolling waking up was shown to be, amplified further by his old age.

So there is nothing in the movie saying that Weyland had to rush the recruitment process and prefer to have a joint smoking mohican bloke sooner than having to wait longer for a highly skilled scientist.

[BANE]

How many individuals do you know that would actually tell a prospective employer that they smoke weed?

And I know nothing of Fifield's academic work history. He's clearly inventive (I.E the pups). The fact that he is eccentric is practically commonplace amongst scientists. I had a biochemistry teacher who used to dress in short shorts with socks and sandals, and who used to carry a dead squirrel with him. He's one of the most cited biochemists.

As for the rushing thing, the time lapse in between Shaw and Holloway discovering the pictogram and the arrival time, plus the time lapse necessary for publishing a thesis (which, trust me, isn't quick) indicate that it would have to have been rushed. Plus the fact that they don't know each other and haven't trained together is another indicator. And his own personal preparations, getting a ship ready, putting the word out for the crew of 17, getting the equipment ready...it all reeks of a rush job.

Plus, you know, Weyland's almost dead, so there's that reason to rush.

[Promethée]

Is there actually a timeline somewhere?

[Anonymous User]

How many individuals do you know that would actually tell a prospective employer that they smoke weed?

And I know nothing of Fifield's academic work history. He's clearly inventive (I.E the pups). The fact that he is eccentric is practically commonplace amongst scientists. I had a biochemistry teacher who used to dress in short shorts with socks and sandals, and who used to carry a dead squirrel with him. He's one of the most cited biochemists.

As for the rushing thing, the time lapse in between Shaw and Holloway discovering the pictogram and the arrival time, plus the time lapse necessary for publishing a thesis (which, trust me, isn't quick) indicate that it would have to have been rushed. Plus the fact that they don't know each other and haven't trained together is another indicator. And his own personal preparations, getting a ship ready, putting the word out for the crew of 17, getting the equipment ready...it all reeks of a rush job.

Plus, you know, Weyland's almost dead, so there's that reason to rush.

You can speculate all you want, but it doesn't change the fact that it is your own speculation which makes the story works ... for you. The movie didn't tell us anything about this.

[BANE]

Fair enough.

I'm just not bothered by a lack of them explicitly stating minor stuff. The time thing, for instance. We're told stuff like: Weyland being almost dead, Thesis publication, time in transit, lack of familiarity with other crew members. What we're told all screams rush job. I'm fine with the fact you don't agree, but it makes sense.

[psychonaut25]

Is there actually a timeline somewhere?

And another question, timeline made from canon sources including AVP, and AVP:R ?

[Darth Vile]

I think you should watch the two films again.

• In Alien, Nostromo was a mining expedition. On their way back home to Earth, they had to land in LV 426 after detecting a distress signal. They were not sent intentionally to collect an alien being. The existence of the directive doesn't mean that the company was aware of a Xeno. It was a general directive for Ash to bring back any alien form with the crew being expendable. Any alien form, not necessarily a Xeno


• In Aliens, Burke's plan was to get a facehugger to impregnate one of the crew and sneak him/her back to Earth. He tried to do it to Ripley/Newt

Anyway, I think we are straying from the original topic.

Are you serious??? I think it's you who needs to "watch the 2 films again". The company feckin sneaked an android onto the Nostromo or are you stating that Ash just happened to be on the ship by coincidence??? Interested in your take on that one. Secondly... Are you stating that was Burke's plan from the get go? How did he plan to make that a reality??? Seemed to me that it was an impromptu plan once he'd been rumbled by Ripley (which seemed very desperate to me as he doesn't know the incubation time of the embryo or whether the embryo would hatch even in cryo). What was his original plan before getting there? So many holes...

You can speculate all you want, but it doesn't change the fact that it is your own speculation which makes the story works ... for you. The movie didn't tell us anything about this.

As pointed out... you are doing the same thing with both Alien and Aliens... funny that. ;-)

[Anonymous User]

Which part of these was not in the movies?

• In Alien, Nostromo was a mining expedition. On their way back home to Earth, they had to land in LV 426 after detecting a distress signal. They were not sent intentionally to collect an alien being. The existence of the directive doesn't mean that the company was aware of a Xeno. It was a general directive for Ash to bring back any alien form with the crew being expendable. Any alien form, not necessarily a Xeno


• In Aliens, Burke's plan was to get a facehugger to impregnate one of the crew and sneak him/her back to Earth. He tried to do it to Ripley/Newt

[Promethée]

So assuming the http://www.weylandindustries.com/timeline and the viral videos are canon,

Accordind to it and according to the movie data we get this :


.2073 Weyland begins the Prometheus production after locating a new destination.



.2079 E.Shaw is contacting Weyland



.2089 Cave paintings discovery

Nice 10 years gap there.

.2091 Prometheus departure
.2093 Arrival at Lv-223

So Shaw first contacted Weyland in 2079, we don't know what happened then.
(We can assume he was interested an funded Shaw's team to do more research while the Prometheus was still being built.? or he needed more proof ?)
If he was already interested that's a 10+ years to choose a team.

Worst case scenario, that last cave painting they found finally convinces Weyland in 2089 and gives him 1 year more or less
since the Prometheus left earth in 2091.

What do you guys think ? correct me if I made a mistake.

[BANE]

That is interesting. I've got to check that timeline out. Is Prometheus production the building of the ship?

As for Shaw contacting Weyland, I would imagine that was when they had found a few of the maps.

[Anonymous User]

Nice research ..

[Promethée]

That is interesting. I've got to check that timeline out. Is Prometheus production the building of the ship?
[...]

I'm just speculating about production, they call it "a long time pet project" so I suppose they've been working on it in the design/concept department for some time.

And then they found a new classified destination that justifies a new round of investments, then I assume they started the production process to build the spaceshift in order to go to that place.
(they must have discovered something great that makes it worth spending all that money, and at that time it wasn't engineers..I'm curious about what it was.)

[Anonymous User]

Also from a different page of the same site http://www.projectprometheus.com/crew/

The mission of Project Prometheus is to seek out the actual origin of mankind, wherever it may be. Weyland Industries believes this voyage will yield extraordinary dividends for its investors; financially and spiritually. This mission is incredible in scope: not only do we endeavor to bring vital knowledge back to investors, but it will mark the furthest a human has ever ventured into our universe. Because of the high level of risk involved, Weyland has searched far and wide to find the most skilled, dedicated and exceptional professionals to contribute their expertise to the mission. These are the people who will build a better world for us all.

And yet ....... 

[Darth Vile]

Which part of these was not in the movies?

• In Alien, Nostromo was a mining expedition. On their way back home to Earth, they had to land in LV 426 after detecting a distress signal. They were not sent intentionally to collect an alien being. The existence of the directive doesn't mean that the company was aware of a Xeno. It was a general directive for Ash to bring back any alien form with the crew being expendable. Any alien form, not necessarily a Xeno


• In Aliens, Burke's plan was to get a facehugger to impregnate one of the crew and sneak him/her back to Earth. He tried to do it to Ripley/Newt

I'm not sure what your point is now as you didn't really respond to my points. It's not about something being in the movie, or referenced in the movie, it's about its internal logic - I thought that was the original critiscm? Ash being on board, the company knowing about the alien... and sending hapless Marines with a bumbling Burke who doesnt have a plan... other than making it up as he goes defies internal logic... but you/we are happy (it seems) to overlook it. This is where I say things are relative and need to be viewed in context.

[Anonymous User]

My point is I didn't use any speculation like you said I did. I only said what I saw. I disagreed when you said that the company knew all along about Aliens civilisation. It was mentioned nowhere in Alien.

And I didn't need to add internal logic to the movie. Alien was already outstanding as is.