Why do people hate the Predalien embryo implantation into the pregnant women?

Started by predxeno, May 25, 2010, 05:41:42 PM

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Why do people hate the Predalien embryo implantation into the pregnant women? (Read 91,071 times)

MadassAlex

Apparently, someone high up thought the Alien's lifecycle was not an obvious enough perversion of human pregnancy.

It's not so much the use of a pregnant woman as Alien fodder; every mistake was in execution. From the egg-barfing to the Predalien's own design, man-in-a-suit vibe and silly behaviour, that scene reeked of artificial horror.

You could make that scene hold so much more impact, although at that stage of production I guess it was already too late.

A redesigned, lithe, creepy Predalien hangs over the pregnant woman, observing her. The lights are flickering on and off as emergency power fails, but the Alien is clever enough to have chosen an especially enshrouded corner to lurk in, its long tail imitating hospital equipment in the shadows. But the woman caught a glimpse. She knows something's in the room with her. And she's in labour.

Her screaming and weeping carries down the desolate, abandoned hallways like the echo of a ghost until, finally, her child is born. The lights flicker and lightning strikes outside, and the Alien looms above her, holding her child. Curious. An experimental application of finger pressure crushes the child, blood and innards escaping from its ruined corpse wherever they can. The Alien, appearing a little disappointed if anything, moves back into its dark place and begins observing the woman again.

First Blood

The scene was disgusting.

Are we also supposed to assume the PredAlien killed all the babies in the nursery as well off camera? And if not, surly they would be wiped out in the nuclear explosion.

Damn, that movie is such a low point for both franchises.  :'(

predxeno

Quote from: First Blood on May 26, 2010, 01:04:55 AM
The scene was disgusting.

Are we also supposed to assume the PredAlien killed all the babies in the nursery as well off camera? And if not, surly they would be wiped out in the nuclear explosion.

Damn, that movie is such a low point for both franchises.  :'(

I thought the murders of the children added a sense of realism to the storyline.  Many movies try to distance themselves from the murders of children and pregnant women.  This is perhaps the most realistic film in the whole franchise.  Many humans don't act rationally.  There could be many reasons why the Predalien only started egg-barfing later into the movie.  She might not have been fully developed to reproduce yet, similar to how a human needs to go through puberty before having children.  Anyways, since many of us can see this method as following or not following continuity, let's move on to a different subject.  Does anyone think we'll be seeing references to this method in future movies, games, comics, etc.?  What are our opinions of this?

SM

QuoteA redesigned, lithe, creepy Predalien hangs over the pregnant woman, observing her. The lights are flickering on and off as emergency power fails, but the Alien is clever enough to have chosen an especially enshrouded corner to lurk in, its long tail imitating hospital equipment in the shadows. But the woman caught a glimpse. She knows something's in the room with her. And she's in labour.

Has potential.

QuoteHer screaming and weeping carries down the desolate, abandoned hallways like the echo of a ghost until, finally, her child is born. The lights flicker and lightning strikes outside, and the Alien looms above her, holding her child. Curious. An experimental application of finger pressure crushes the child, blood and innards escaping from its ruined corpse wherever they can.

This however, is just revolting.

Speaking of which...
Quotei thought the murders of the children added a sense of realism to the storyline.  Many movies try to distance themselves from the murders of children and pregnant women.  This is perhaps the most realistic film in the whole franchise.

It's not realism to show such things - it simply creates disgust.  In Aliens dozens of womean and children died.  Cameron didn't even have any dead children as hosts.  We don't need to see it happen to appreciate it. 

QuoteDoes anyone think we'll be seeing references to this method in future movies, games, comics, etc.?  What are our opinions of this?

f**k... I hope not.  Ill conceived shit like this shouldn't even be excused let alone reinforced.

Spaghetti

Quote from: predxeno on May 26, 2010, 01:08:02 AM
Does anyone think we'll be seeing references to this method in future movies, games, comics, etc.?  What are our opinions of this?

f**k no.

Let this shit be buried with its equally shit movie and hopefully someone down the line will reboot the AVP movie franchise. Can't see why anyone in their right mind, be it new movies, comics or novels would want to associate a future AVP project with AVPR.

SiL

Quote from: MadassAlex on May 26, 2010, 12:57:56 AM
Her screaming and weeping carries down the desolate, abandoned hallways like the echo of a ghost until, finally, her child is born. The lights flicker and lightning strikes outside, and the Alien looms above her, holding her child. Curious. An experimental application of finger pressure crushes the child, blood and innards escaping from its ruined corpse wherever they can. The Alien, appearing a little disappointed if anything, moves back into its dark place and begins observing the woman again.
This is why filmmakers shouldn't listen to fans.

We come up with retarded shit like this. Repeatedly.

XenoVC

Quote from: MadassAlex on May 26, 2010, 12:57:56 AM
holding her child. Curious. An experimental application of finger pressure crushes the child, blood and innards escaping from its ruined corpse wherever they can. The Alien, appearing a little disappointed if anything, moves back into its dark place and begins observing the woman again.

I'd agree that the description had potential until you had to eggmorph into a Strause and show it over the top,effectively turning it into unsubtle disgust.


MadassAlex

Quote from: SiL on May 26, 2010, 05:55:11 AM
This is why filmmakers shouldn't listen to fans.

We come up with retarded shit like this. Repeatedly.

I dunno, I thought Labyrinth's take on Alien curiosity was really good.


XenoVC

Quote from: MadassAlex on May 26, 2010, 06:42:59 AM
Quote from: SiL on May 26, 2010, 05:55:11 AM
This is why filmmakers shouldn't listen to fans.

We come up with retarded shit like this. Repeatedly.

I dunno, I thought Labyrinth's take on Alien curiosity was really good.

I'm pretty sure there was a panel of an Alien holding dead undeveloped bursters.

But never turning a human baby into a gore bomb.

SM

Yeah.  Dude.  Srsly...

Who is going to even film that, let alone want to watch it?  Especially considering the relative restraint of the original films.

MadassAlex

Baby or no, Parker got the same treatment.

But the point is less holding up a baby and more observing human pregnancy and the human lifecycle. If you don't want a crushed kid, then that's fine 'cause it's completely beside the point.

Quoterelative restraint

Tell that to Kane. And pre-edited scene Parker. And Lambert's sound effects.

SM

SM

#26
Kane's scene was a lot less gory than it could've been.
Ditto Parker (who wasn't squeezed to death like your baby).
And Lambert doesn't even enter into the equation cos it was all off screen.

That's what I mean by "restraint".  Whatever it was doing to Parker is unknown till it bites him in the bonce because it's all done in close up on his face.

The Alien observing has merit - especially posing as some medical equipment a la hanging in the chains before it nailed Brett.  The rest is just gore porn.  A baby crying off screen - that suddenly stops crying off screen would do - if there was a need to slaughter new born children.

SiL

Quote from: MadassAlex on May 26, 2010, 06:42:59 AM
I dunno, I thought Labyrinth's take on Alien curiosity was really good.
Yes, it was.

But what you just posted is very, very far away from that.

Quote from: MadassAlex on May 26, 2010, 06:55:24 AM
Baby or no, Parker got the same treatment.
Blood and guts didn't shoot from every hole.

So no.

QuoteIf you don't want a crushed kid, then that's fine 'cause it's completely beside the point.
You made it part of the point.

Which is the same reason people hate AvPR.

Keg

Quote from: SM on May 26, 2010, 07:09:15 AM
Kane's scene was a lot less gory than it could've been.
Ditto Parker (who wasn't squeezed to death like your baby).
And Lambert doesn't even enter into the equation cos it was all off screen.

The Alien observing has merit - especially posing as some medical equipment a la hanging in the chains before it nailed Brett.  The rest is just gore porn.

Agreed. i liked the idea of it hiding and not being seen while it observes, but the rest was just as bad as what we got in the final film, if not worse.

for me the biggest reason why the maternity ward scene doesnt work is that it flat out makes no sense on a couple of levels. one is why would an alien creature only be able to use pregnant women as hosts? It doesnt make sense. And for those that say it may have been able to do it to others then why did it go and seek out pregnant women after it came across the one in the cafe? and thats the second reason why it makes no sense. its idiotic to believe that a creature that can only reproduce using pregnant women, just happens to stumble across a maternity ward. far too convienient.

All this isnt even taking into account the unneccessary and childish attempt at shocking the audience or the complete disregard of canon and established facts about the creatures in 7 previous films.

anybody who doesnt mind the predalien and/or its reproductive method is probably a teenager who has seen the AVP movies first and doesnt have the appreciation for the series that others do. if theres blood and gore, plenty of monsters and some "cool" deaths, these morons are happy, and unfortunately it was these people that AVPR was aimed at.

MadassAlex

QuoteBlood and guts didn't shoot from every hole.

So no.

Perhaps this is a part of the misinterpretation. The kid was never meant to spurt, just crumple and bleed.

QuoteYou made it part of the point.

Rescinded, if that pleases you.

QuoteKane's scene was a lot less gory than it could've been.

Doesn't really say much. Just because Kane's death scene could've been gorier doesn't mean it was restrained. Slamming down twelve shots of vodka isn't restrained if you know you can go to sixteen. It's still irresponsible and likely to end in stupidity.

QuoteThat's what I mean by "restraint".  Whatever it was doing to Parker is unknown till it bites him in the bonce because it's all done in close up on his face.

If memory serves, he was beginning to just bleed from what we could see. Given the Alien's posture, grip and strength, it's pretty safe to assume he was being squeezed to death, as per a restrained version of what was originally going to happen.

(But that doesn't count, 'cause Riddles wanted the unrestrained version. S'just that the studio put its foot down hard).

Alien has subtlety, but that's different from restraint. It did what was effective, everyone be damned (mostly).

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