*Spoilers* AvPR Sewer Battle Youtube *Spoilers*

[Weasel]

They said they can learn beyond hive mind. Which as much as I love aliens, know it's not very true.

Given you've only seen weeks-old Aliens with very limited experiences to learn from, and without any real need to develop into anything more complex, you can't say that.

Neither can you.

[SiL]

Neither can you.

I'm not the one making definite statements - You're the one flat-out saying they can't develop outside the hive mind. I'm saying maybe they could.

[Weasel]

Neither can you.

I'm not the one making definite statements - You're the one flat-out saying they can't develop outside the hive mind. I'm saying maybe they could.

Because we've seen what they can do. The xenomorphs in Aliens were around for at least a bit. It's not like they are babies and don't know how to do anything. We've seen the cycle and it's limits. Hudson compared it to Ants. I wouldn't call ants very intelligent. They have a vicious cycle which works for them.

[SiL]

Because we've seen what they can do. The xenomorphs in Aliens were around for at least a bit.

They were around for a few weeks, and their only learning experience before the marines rocked up was learning how to take out lightly armed civilians.

It's not like they are babies and don't know how to do anything.

It's exactly like that. The Aliens aren't only vicious, they're ignorant. We're seeing Aliens developing totally independently from their natural surroundings and acquired knowledge - A human child raised outside of human influence isn't going to turn out anything like a 'normal' person because they don't have the influence of acquired intelligence, knowledge, and behavioural structure. Inherited capabilities can only take anything so far.

I wouldn't call ants very intelligent.

Speaking of ignorance ...

[Weasel]

Because we've seen what they can do. The xenomorphs in Aliens were around for at least a bit.

They were around for a few weeks, and their only learning experience before the marines rocked up was learning how to take out lightly armed civilians.

It's not like they are babies and don't know how to do anything.

It's exactly like that. The Aliens aren't only vicious, they're ignorant. We're seeing Aliens developing totally independently from their natural surroundings and acquired knowledge - A human child raised outside of human influence isn't going to turn out anything like a 'normal' person because they don't have the influence of acquired intelligence, knowledge, and behavioural structure.

I wouldn't call ants very intelligent.

Speaking of ignorance ...

Aliens aren't humans. Take a lion out of Africa is still going to act like a lion. But after time you can train it. We've seen that aliens can't be taught at all, so why would they develop this higher thinking? Aliens are a basic hive mind. Bee's sting what they don't know. As soon as they can fly, they get to work. It's not like they get stronger by having human interaction, they just realize that something is bothering them and needs to get stung.

[SiL]

Take a lion out of Africa is still going to act like a lion.

No, take a lion out to Africa away from the other lions and it's going to starve to death because it can't learn to hunt properly. Naturally strong, vicious, yes. Naturally capable hunters? To a point, but they need training.

We've seen that aliens can't be taught at all,

Push button, make pain.

Run here, die. Don't run here, don't die.

Follow people into room, get locked in. People try to get you into room again, don't go in.

We've seen them learn. They react to stimulus, and re-arrange their thinking. What else is learning if not that?

Bee's sting what they don't know.

No, bees sting what threatens them.

[Weasel]

Take a lion out of Africa is still going to act like a lion.

No, take a lion out to Africa away from the other lions and it's going to starve to death because it can't learn to hunt properly. Naturally strong, vicious, yes. Naturally capable hunters? To a point, but they need training.

We've seen that aliens can't be taught at all,

Push button, make pain.

Run here, die. Don't run here, don't die.

Follow people into room, get locked in. People try to get you into room again, don't go in.

We've seen them learn. They react to stimulus, and re-arrange their thinking. What else is learning if not that?

Bee's sting what they don't know.

No, bees sting what threatens them.

Pretty basic. And the aliens in A:R were f**ked up anyway. Something that spawns from a queen that makes a human/alien hybrid has to be messed up. Aside from the hive mind...what else is there? Aside from being more aware of hostility. There not going to go out of there way to prevent humans from comming. If anything, they need the hostile organism. Ooh, you hurt, but come here so I can stick this facehugger onto you.

[Clydewyman]

Meh, f**k YouTube. The video was removed already!

[SiL]

Pretty basic.

The don't-go-into-the-room thing requires thought which overpowers base instinct. That alone shows that they aren't driven purely by a hive-minded primitive instinctual intelligence.

Something that spawns from a queen that makes a human/alien hybrid has to be messed up.

"At first, everything was normal".

Hell, why do you even keep using 'hive mind' as some sort of downplay? Go take a look at ant species some time - Some of them have developed agriculture, while others enslave other ants.

[Weasel]

Bloody disgusting put it up with the new clips. Head on over to that thread.

[Weasel]

Pretty basic.

The don't-go-into-the-room thing requires thought which overpowers base instinct. That alone shows that they aren't driven purely by a hive-minded primitive instinctual intelligence.

Something that spawns from a queen that makes a human/alien hybrid has to be messed up.

"At first, everything was normal".

Hell, why do you even keep using 'hive mind' as some sort of downplay? Go take a look at ant species some time - Some of them have developed agriculture, while others enslave other ants.

I'm saying that hivemind has limits. If you start to crush ants with your foot they are start freaking out and running around. Sure fireants attack you, but it's all just basic instinct to attack. Take winter. They've figured out that cold=death so gather food and live underground. Not that hard.

[SiL]

I'm saying that hivemind has limits.

And yet Aliens can function perfectly fine without a hive-mind. In fact they seem to function better without it.

Aliens don't even seem to have that much of a 'hive mind' to begin with. Their attacks are much more co-ordinated than ants bum-rushing someone stepping on them, and there are so many behavioural differences between ants and Aliens seen in the movies I really don't know why you insist in comparing them.

Even comparing them, you ignore the fact that ants, while they don't have technology or advanced mathematics, have developed some incredibly intelligent features.

I'm not saying Aliens should start making tools, just that they shouldn't be exclusively limited to running around, f**king, and killing like you seem to think they should.

[Weasel]

I'm saying that hivemind has limits.

And yet Aliens can function perfectly fine without a hive-mind. In fact they seem to function better without it.

Aliens don't even seem to have that much of a 'hive mind' to begin with. Their attacks are much more co-ordinated than ants bum-rushing someone stepping on them, and there are so many behavioural differences between ants and Aliens seen in the movies I really don't know why you insist in comparing them.

Even comparing them, you ignore the fact that ants, while they don't have technology or advanced mathematics, have developed some incredibly intelligent features.

I'm not saying Aliens should start making tools, just that they shouldn't be exclusively limited to running around, f**king, and killing like you seem to think they should.

What else do aliens do besides live for the hive? Go golfing? The aliens didn't bum rush the turrets? I mean, I'll give them Jurassic Park Raptor intelligence. But instead of opening doors they just smash them in.

[SiL]

The aliens didn't bum rush the turrets?

They then stopped and thought of a way around.

I mean, I'll give them Jurassic Park Raptor intelligence. But instead of opening doors they just smash them in.

Except for the two times they opened doors in Aliens.

[Weasel]

The aliens didn't bum rush the turrets?

They then stopped and thought of a way around.

I mean, I'll give them Jurassic Park Raptor intelligence. But instead of opening doors they just smash them in.

Except for the two times they opened doors in Aliens.

Everything can figure a way out after they realize turret=death. Besides, they only did that once. The other turrent went dry because the aliens kept advancing. The xenomorph in alien 3 obviously had trouble with doors.