Possible Script Breakdown *potential spoilers*

[BigDaddyJohn]

Why would it be anyone other than the protagonists?

True, don't have any problem with that honestly, it's what you somewhat expect from a movie like that, no ?

[Jigsaw85]

Mr. H, the guy who made that video posted earlier, is one of those obsessive Predator fans who think predators need to be portrayed as unstoppable badasses who can beat anyone and anything. He actually wants the predators to survive a movie. As if the predators are supposed to be characters we can root for. Instead of vile monsters we're supposed to root against. And there are plenty of predator fans who think like him. Just look at Wolf's fanbase. The kind of fans who lose their shit everytime a filmmaker doesn't treat the predator like a superhero. Remember the backlash of the Classic vs Beserker fight in Predators?

[Master]

I just hope the "Average Joe" predators aren't useless against the Upgrade.

From what I hear, they are.

Spoiler

They are because the upgrade is too damn strong and overpowering

[close]

Because bad writing.

[KiramidHead]

Shane Black isn't a bad writer. And "muh yautja" isn't an argument.

[Master]

Shane Black isn't a bad writer. And "muh yautja" isn't an argument.

Yeah it isn't

Spoiler

Killing all preds with one blow, just to show how powerfull their new freak is, is the very bad writing.

[close]

[BigDaddyJohn]

Mr. H, the guy who made that video posted earlier, is one of those obsessive Predator fans who think predators need to be portrayed as unstoppable badasses who can beat anyone and anything. He actually wants the predators to survive a movie. As if the predators are supposed to be characters we can root for. Instead of vile monsters we're supposed to root against. And there are plenty of predator fans who think like him. Just look at Wolf's fanbase. The kind of fans who lose their shit everytime a filmmaker doesn't treat the predator like a superhero. Remember the backlash of the Classic vs Beserker fight in Predators?

The thing is there is already an "unstoppable badass" pred in this movie, trust me 

[KiramidHead]

Shane Black isn't a bad writer. And "muh yautja" isn't an argument.

Yeah it isn't

Spoiler

Killing all preds with one blow, just to show how powerfull their new freak is, is the very bad writing.

[close]

Worked for Worf in TNG.

And it's hardly in the league of killing a child because you're too lazy to figure out what to do with them.

[Jigsaw85]

Mr. H, the guy who made that video posted earlier, is one of those obsessive Predator fans who think predators need to be portrayed as unstoppable badasses who can beat anyone and anything. He actually wants the predators to survive a movie. As if the predators are supposed to be characters we can root for. Instead of vile monsters we're supposed to root against. And there are plenty of predator fans who think like him. Just look at Wolf's fanbase. The kind of fans who lose their shit everytime a filmmaker doesn't treat the predator like a superhero. Remember the backlash of the Classic vs Beserker fight in Predators?

The thing is there is already an "unstoppable badass" pred in this movie, trust me 

You mean the upgrade? He dies at the end, right?

[BigDaddyJohn]

Mr. H, the guy who made that video posted earlier, is one of those obsessive Predator fans who think predators need to be portrayed as unstoppable badasses who can beat anyone and anything. He actually wants the predators to survive a movie. As if the predators are supposed to be characters we can root for. Instead of vile monsters we're supposed to root against. And there are plenty of predator fans who think like him. Just look at Wolf's fanbase. The kind of fans who lose their shit everytime a filmmaker doesn't treat the predator like a superhero. Remember the backlash of the Classic vs Beserker fight in Predators?

The thing is there is already an "unstoppable badass" pred in this movie, trust me 

You mean the upgrade? He dies at the end, right?

Spoiler

Yes, but he is presented as unstoppable and is a f**king beast, that's what i meant. There is no such thing as litterally invincible, Wolf died too and is adored by many for being a badass beast.

[close]

[Jigsaw85]

But most fans won't consider him a "true" predator. Just like some fans hate the "super" predators for outshining the Classic predators.

[BigDaddyJohn]

But most fans won't consider him a "true" predator. Just like some fans hate the "super" predators for outshining the Classic predators.

Yeah you're right. But it's part of a bigger problem : how do you portray a "true" predator ?
One that is only hunting ? Because this won't be the case in the upcoming movie, and it will be a memorable outcry for those who want to see that...

And just to talk about people who want to root for a predator,

Spoiler

i think they could do that with this movie, i found myself personnally rooting quite a bit for the first pred that crashes in the jungle

[close]

[OpenMaw]

And just to talk about people who want to root for a predator,

Spoiler

i think they could do that with this movie, i found myself personnally rooting quite a bit for the first pred that crashes in the jungle

[close]

Why is that?



As to the idea of depicting the Predators in the right light, well, for one it is always bad form to use the old big bad to make your new big bad look biggerer and badderer. With few exceptions, this almost always alienates fans.

Two, the problem with the Predator franchises is that the first film did a really good job of making Dutch and his team a group of really likable, macho, charismatic guys. This made the Predator seem even more imposing, if even these guys barely stand any kind of a chance, then anyone else is in real trouble. So you're not rooting for this invisible killer, you're rooting for the guys you've gotten to know for the first 40 minutes of screen time.

Predator 2, things get a little shaky, because most of the Predator's body count is either criminals or antagonistic government agents. (The El Scorpio guys, the Colombian drug lord guys, the faceless commuters, and the O.W.L.F. capture team.). So what happens when you're watching the Monster slaughter people you don't really like or care for? Your interest as an audience member is going to fall back to the creature and the interesting stuff it's doing, and the spectacle. Predator 2 has some great "stuff" but most of the body count is inherently disposable. It turns focus to the Predator as much more of a Jason Vorhees slasher where the fun is derived from watching it slaughter people.

Then you get to AVP, between the Alien and the Predator the only one  we have any chance of communicating with on the same level if the Predator. Scar is the anti-hero of the story. He's still shown gutting humans like nobody's business, but he's also Alexa's only hope.

Then you have Predators, which communicated the aforementioned sin of making the "old" Predators look not-so-great by having the ever-so-awesome super-duper-over-hyped predators literally decapitating them mortal combat style.


Personally, I think, what the series needs is a back-to-basics approach. Or continuing on the very narrow thread left by Predator 2 of humans trying to turn-the-tables on the Predator species. The macro-story of the entire franchise; Hunted becoming Hunter.

[Russ]

And that was an entirely geniuns analysis Open Maw. That's nailed the issue entirey for me. Great work, man!

[BigDaddyJohn]

And just to talk about people who want to root for a predator,

Spoiler

i think they could do that with this movie, i found myself personnally rooting quite a bit for the first pred that crashes in the jungle

[close]

Why is that?



As to the idea of depicting the Predators in the right light, well, for one it is always bad form to use the old big bad to make your new big bad look biggerer and badderer. With few exceptions, this almost always alienates fans.

Two, the problem with the Predator franchises is that the first film did a really good job of making Dutch and his team a group of really likable, macho, charismatic guys. This made the Predator seem even more imposing, if even these guys barely stand any kind of a chance, then anyone else is in real trouble. So you're not rooting for this invisible killer, you're rooting for the guys you've gotten to know for the first 40 minutes of screen time.

Predator 2, things get a little shaky, because most of the Predator's body count is either criminals or antagonistic government agents. (The El Scorpio guys, the Colombian drug lord guys, the faceless commuters, and the O.W.L.F. capture team.). So what happens when you're watching the Monster slaughter people you don't really like or care for? Your interest as an audience member is going to fall back to the creature and the interesting stuff it's doing, and the spectacle. Predator 2 has some great "stuff" but most of the body count is inherently disposable. It turns focus to the Predator as much more of a Jason Vorhees slasher where the fun is derived from watching it slaughter people.

Then you get to AVP, between the Alien and the Predator the only one  we have any chance of communicating with on the same level if the Predator. Scar is the anti-hero of the story. He's still shown gutting humans like nobody's business, but he's also Alexa's only hope.

Then you have Predators, which communicated the aforementioned sin of making the "old" Predators look not-so-great by having the ever-so-awesome super-duper-over-hyped predators literally decapitating them mortal combat style.


Personally, I think, what the series needs is a back-to-basics approach. Or continuing on the very narrow thread left by Predator 2 of humans trying to turn-the-tables on the Predator species. The macro-story of the entire franchise; Hunted becoming Hunter.

Yeah, then again i must agree with you entirely, damn  . But before answering your question about my empathy for the pred in the upcoming movie, i need to know what you know from the script, so that i don't spoil you 

[salomonj]

So I have yet to read the script but I notice the general consensus seems to be highly negative with many calling Black's script "shit". Black is one of my favorite writers and he's never written a bad script in my eyes, so I don't imagine he starts now with 'The Predator'. Is this script objectively terrible as a film or is it just pissing off hardcore Predator fans? I'm really just here to see a well made film and I'm not one to get autistic about the canon stuff.