Let's be honest. Retcon, Reboot or Not. Should they let Ripley, Hicks & Co. RIP?

Started by Chris!(($$))!, Mar 04, 2015, 02:36:00 AM

Retcon, Reboot, Sequel: Should they let Ripley, Hicks & Co. RIP?

Yes.
39 (50%)
No.
32 (41%)
Cameo/Supporting Characters at the most.
7 (9%)

Total Members Voted: 77

Author
Let's be honest. Retcon, Reboot or Not. Should they let Ripley, Hicks & Co. RIP? (Read 12,496 times)

Chris!(($$))!

So after reading through the thread and checking the poll I've so far come to general consensus of.....

We all would LIKE Ripley, Hicks, and Newt to have had equally rewarding closure to their stories BUT we would overall as a fan base RATHER have new characters step in and take the series in a new direction rather than remain glued to Ripley and Hicks and even Newt.

Which is why I'm really hoping if the movie does end up being an alternate timeline, that Ripley, Hicks and Newt either end up dead by the movie's finale or are simply strong supporting characters behind a new lead from the get go.

The reason I'm fine with them not having a happy ending is because at the end I feel the Xenos represent Death as the True End above all else. ALIEN3 did a pretty good job at this when the Xeno bursted during Dillon's speech. ALIEN had more subtle ways of suggesting this. ALIENS had a few but not as much as ALIEN and ALIEN3 as to what the Xenos represented.

Russ

I reckon that NB is not lying when he says he's a massive fan of movies - I'm sure he gets this aspect of no happy endings. I think that it's pretty clear that Sigourney Weaver wants a satisfying closure for her signature character (I imagine she's also tired of being asked about sequels and continuations 20 odd years after the last movie finished).

Now - for all its faults (sic) Alien3 provided that definitive, satisfying ending. But, for reasons discussed, I think I can wrap it up and say "right ending, wrong film."

As for new characters - there's been a lot of discussion about this on here and I'm really confident that NB's movie will be pushing that agenda - probably with Jorden as the new protagonist that carries whatever story will follow on from this forward. Even if its purely for practical reasons - as more mature people, how long can Biehn and Weaver conceivably be involved in this type of movie as anything other than "the general" or "the consultant."

I think that Rippers and Hicks may not survive this encounter with the Aliens and that characters introduced in the new film will carry the torch.

I think that all of us are going into this with our eyes open, expecting a new series of films and are looking past the first one to see what happens next, so the call for new characters will be answered.

Strange Shapes posted a great article on his FB page and that aspect - the characters - was at the heart of it. Lots of modern films focus on spectacle and are ultimately disposable because of that (and that's fine, Michael Bay is great at what he does and I enjoy his films because they are cookie-cutter, written to BS2 form and tick every single box), but Alien isn't really about the Xeno, its about how people deal with the Xeno. Great characters (so you need great actors for this). Look at Alien - Weaver, Skerrit, Holm, Hurt, Dean-Stanton (Kotto and Cartwright do brilliantly to even be in the same ring as those guys - and Weaver incredible in her first film role). Though I accept that conversely, Aliens didn't have that - but given the tone of the film, that ensemble was elevated by a guy who was to go on to become the most successful film maker in history. So with him in your corner, even if you're an "OK" actor, your performance is probably going to be elevated. I

Maybe this is one of the issues with Prometheus - aside from Theron (and Pearce, but he didn't have a lot to do) maybe the actors were part of the luke-warm reception (in critical terms if not box office) were the only heavyweights in the film?


HuDaFuK

Quote from: Chris!(($$))! on Mar 04, 2015, 08:13:03 PMSo after reading through the thread and checking the poll I've so far come to general consensus of.....

Lolwut?

The poll quite overwhelmingly shows people would rather they just left the three of them dead.

Jarac

Quote from: HuDaFuK on Mar 05, 2015, 12:13:07 PM
Quote from: Chris!(($$))! on Mar 04, 2015, 08:13:03 PMSo after reading through the thread and checking the poll I've so far come to general consensus of.....

Lolwut?

The poll quite overwhelmingly shows people would rather they just left the three of them dead.

I think the poll is a bit narrow. I want their time to finally come to an end, however I am excited that they are in this movie and I hope they are all given a satisfying conclusion to their stories so that new protagonists and new stories can emerge without being shackled by Ripley.

Alien³

Quote from: HuDaFuK on Mar 05, 2015, 12:13:07 PM
Quote from: Chris!(($$))! on Mar 04, 2015, 08:13:03 PMSo after reading through the thread and checking the poll I've so far come to general consensus of.....

Lolwut?

The poll quite overwhelmingly shows people would rather they just left the three of them dead.

Funny that ::)

The Cruentus

Quote from: marrerom on Mar 04, 2015, 03:20:38 AM
An alternate timeline is also cheap and lazy.  Its done for the same exact reasons a retcon is and it further muddles things by adding weird fantastical elements to what should be a series that's grounded in gritty realism.

You do realize resurrection did away with gritty realism right? Which is why I wouldn't mind the fourth film being retconned, no scratch that, I would like it to be retconned, conflicted on the third though as it wrapped Ripley's story up. I hate that the studio won't let the character go, they shoehorned her into the new books.

Resurrection was just too silly and far-fetched, I enjoy it for what it is but I don't believe it belongs in the Alien series, nearly everything about it slaps the previous entries in the face:  (A123)Gritty realism - (AR)far-fetched, (A123)subtle company who may or may not only be amoral at worst - (AR)blatant evil organization that kidnaps people and uses them as hosts, (A123)Bio-mechanical Alien - (AR)Fleshy unexplained dog-legged Alien.
The last film entry doesn't fit the series.

Alien³

Quote from: The Cruentus on Mar 05, 2015, 02:42:20 PM
(AR)Fleshy unexplained dog-legged Alien.

In its defence the aliens are more fleshy because of Ripley's DNA and their legs are dog-legged due to the Queen's DNA.


HuDaFuK

Yeah, while I don't necessarily like what Resurrection did with the Alien, it does at least make sense in the context of the film.

The Cruentus

Quote from: Alien³ on Mar 05, 2015, 03:12:30 PM
Quote from: The Cruentus on Mar 05, 2015, 02:42:20 PM
(AR)Fleshy unexplained dog-legged Alien.

In its defence the aliens are more fleshy because of Ripley's DNA and their legs are dog-legged due to the Queen's DNA.

Oh I already do attribute the fleshy look to that, not the leg though because it doesn't explain why normal aliens lacked it before, unless the unstable crossover caused multiple mutations...all silly stuff that doesn't belong in a series that is supposed to be grounded in gritty realism.

Son Of Kane

Quote from: The Cruentus on Mar 06, 2015, 01:20:01 PM
Quote from: Alien³ on Mar 05, 2015, 03:12:30 PM
Quote from: The Cruentus on Mar 05, 2015, 02:42:20 PM
(AR)Fleshy unexplained dog-legged Alien.

In its defence the aliens are more fleshy because of Ripley's DNA and their legs are dog-legged due to the Queen's DNA.

Oh I already do attribute the fleshy look to that, not the leg though because it doesn't explain why normal aliens lacked it before, unless the unstable crossover caused multiple mutations...all silly stuff that doesn't belong in a series that is supposed to be grounded in gritty realism.

The Legs may in fact be a retcon if you count Alien Isolation.

The Cruentus

Quote from: Son Of Kane on Mar 06, 2015, 03:06:15 PM
Quote from: The Cruentus on Mar 06, 2015, 01:20:01 PM
Quote from: Alien³ on Mar 05, 2015, 03:12:30 PM
Quote from: The Cruentus on Mar 05, 2015, 02:42:20 PM
(AR)Fleshy unexplained dog-legged Alien.

In its defence the aliens are more fleshy because of Ripley's DNA and their legs are dog-legged due to the Queen's DNA.

Oh I already do attribute the fleshy look to that, not the leg though because it doesn't explain why normal aliens lacked it before, unless the unstable crossover caused multiple mutations...all silly stuff that doesn't belong in a series that is supposed to be grounded in gritty realism.

The Legs may in fact be a retcon if you count Alien Isolation.

Except two things, first, they went back to plantigrade for AVP and second, in Isolation they intended to have the plantigrade feet because they wanted the Alien to be faithful to the original, it just didn't do so good in animation apparently, so they had to change it.


Alien³

Quote from: The Cruentus on Mar 06, 2015, 01:20:01 PM
not the leg though because it doesn't explain why normal aliens lacked it before, unless the unstable crossover caused multiple mutations

The different legs on the aliens in A:R comes from the the Queen's DNA.



I agree its all stupid but there is an in-film explanation.


The Cruentus

Quote from: Alien³ on Mar 06, 2015, 03:24:33 PM
Quote from: The Cruentus on Mar 06, 2015, 01:20:01 PM
not the leg though because it doesn't explain why normal aliens lacked it before, unless the unstable crossover caused multiple mutations

The different legs on the aliens in A:R comes from the the Queen's DNA.

http://img3.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20120923192947/villains/images/c/c7/Queen_Xenomorph.jpg

I agree its all stupid but there is an in-film explanation.

Actually its our fan speculation, never in the film is it stated to be the reason, its just us making the conclusion. I recently posted a section from wikipedia and basically the reason why the Aliens have dog legs? because according to an ADI member, it "felt" like a dog.... :P
I would have laughed if it wasn't so pathetic.

Alien³

Also the human DNA making the aliens fleshy is fan speculation. ;)

The Cruentus

Of course, never denied it  ;D Just conclusions coming from us to try and justify the mess  :laugh:

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