The Cocoon Sequence

Started by Darkness, Dec 14, 2006, 10:40:55 PM

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The Cocoon Sequence (Read 28,361 times)

Darkness

Darkness

I was personally never fond of the deleted scene in Alien where the crew are transforming into Alien Eggs. What do you think?

maledoro

maledoro

#1
It's creepier than watching a queen alien popping out eggs; it makes more sense, as it would take less energy to do than to make eggs for hosts; from a narrative standpoint, it's an original concept.


VenomX

VenomX

#2
Definitely creepier, it bumps the icky-factor up a notch when it makes you consider what it would be like to just sit there, stuck, slowly having your body turn into an alien egg.

I think it's too original for me though actually. I find it unconvincing that it could work that way, not that it would have to be so impossible from a genetic standpoint if you really think about it, but it just doesn't come very natural for me to accept it because it's such a strange idea that something could morph you into an egg just like that. So while as an idea, I applaud its originality, it still killed a small bit of the realism for me while watching it so I didn't like to see it in the movie for that reason.

maledoro

maledoro

#3
It's more realisitic than you know. Someone (I think that it was deezelboy) said that some insect does something like that to its victims.

Besides, if an alien can bleed acid and grow that fast, this shouldn't be out of the realm of possibility.




The Ultimate Predator

The Ultimate Predator

#4
Don't think I've seen this scene. I don't like the idea, prefer the Queen involvement.

maledoro

maledoro

#5
Quote from: The Ultimate Predator on Dec 15, 2006, 02:41:38 PM
Don't think I've seen this scene. I don't like the idea, prefer the Queen involvement.
Watch the "Director's Cut" and see it for yourself. You may like it. It's chilling and it explains why the alien takes its victims (mind you, there was no queen in the life cycle when this was made.) and what had happened to the Jockeys.

As for the queen concept, that is best reserved for those cheesy sci-fi movies of the '50's when there was a "surprise monster" waiting in the wings.

The Ultimate Predator

The Ultimate Predator

#6
I will. I still prefer the Queen concept though, just seems better.

maledoro

maledoro

#7
Quote from: The Ultimate Predator on Dec 15, 2006, 04:59:59 PM
I will. I still prefer the Queen concept though, just seems better.

So, you're still going to pass judgement until all of the evidence is in?

The Ultimate Predator

The Ultimate Predator

#8
Yeh, ok, I have yet to see it.....

Corporal Hicks

Corporal Hicks

#9
Lovely sets and a lovely scene, I just don't like how it muddles up their life cycle. There are explanations of course. I mean, it could all fit in. For all we know, those eggs could have had a Queen hugger in there and then the normal life cycle would have taken over - I know, the Queen wasn't an idea alive then but bear with it.

When an egg is hatched and there is no other Aliens/Queen around, the egg/hugger might somehow be able to spawn an Alien with the specific task of infecting others so they turn into a Queen egg.

Wierd and it doesn't entirely make much sense but...it's an idea.

The Ultimate Predator

The Ultimate Predator

#10
No, I get what you're saying. Its the only explanation if there is no Queen about, surely? How would the queen face-hugger fit in though?

VenomX

VenomX

#11
Quote from: maledoro on Dec 15, 2006, 12:36:29 PM
It's more realisitic than you know. Someone (I think that it was deezelboy) said that some insect does something like that to its victims.

o_0 really? Not that I really doubt that it could be true, after all there's plenty of parasitic insects that lay eggs inside of other insects to pop out while they're alive just like in Alien, but actually turning another life form into an egg of their own species? Even if it's not precisely that, but just something close, I'd still be curious to find out which species it is and what the whole thing's about, I find it really fascinating. Is there a forum thread somewhere where this is talked about?

Quote from: maledoro on Dec 15, 2006, 12:36:29 PM
Besides, if an alien can bleed acid and grow that fast, this shouldn't be out of the realm of possibility.

;D true. Although some materials like glass are resistant to most acids, and let's say aliens are a silicon based life form, silicon is closely associated with sand ( = glass) so, I dunno, the ability to have acid for blood doesn't bug me too much. It's at least not too far fetched that some form of tissue in some form of life could eventually arise that would resist it.

Now why on earth a life form WOULD have acid for blood, that's another matter. Sure, it makes the movie monster just that much cooler, and of course once a creature develops acid blood, natural evolution might suggest it would probably keep it around for future generations since it is, after all, a handy defensive mechanism. But as far as why something would spontaneously get acid for blood in the first place I have no answer to, nor do I have one for the speed of growth.

Then again if they really are genetically engineered and designed by the Jockeys, then the whole issue goes out the window completely since there'd be nothing spontaneous about it. But, even with very advanced genetic manipulation, I still have a harder time with the turning its victims into eggs than any of the other things. Not impossible, just very far fetched.

Corporal Hicks

Corporal Hicks

#12
There was the theory that it created energy of some form so it could be harvested.

maledoro

maledoro

#13
Quote from: VenomX on Dec 15, 2006, 11:26:10 PM
Is there a forum thread somewhere where this is talked about?
Not any more. It was posted on the IMDb back in 2005.

Quote from: VenomX on Dec 15, 2006, 11:26:10 PM
Now why on earth a life form WOULD have acid for blood, that's another matter. Sure, it makes the movie monster just that much cooler, and of course once a creature develops acid blood, natural evolution might suggest it would probably keep it around for future generations since it is, after all, a handy defensive mechanism. But as far as why something would spontaneously get acid for blood in the first place I have no answer to, nor do I have one for the speed of growth.
All blood has acidity to various degrees. The aliens' ecosystem may require a lower pH in their blood in order to survive in their environment.

Quote from: VenomX on Dec 15, 2006, 11:26:10 PM
I still have a harder time with the turning its victims into eggs than any of the other things. Not impossible, just very far fetched.
Well, it happened on the Nostromo and was almost shown on Fury 161. Open your mind.


As for the process, it's very simple:

The process by which this occurs may be functionally similar to the embryo implantation process as carried out by a facehugger. As the facehugger-implanted embryo converts a portion of the host into an embryo, so does the imago-implanted factor convert a much larger portion of the host into an egg, further supporting the idea of functional and morphological identity being conserved between the juvenile and adult life stages. This factor will hereafter be referred to as the "spore".

The development of the queen-imago as sole reproducing member of a nest may be explained via the existence of the postulated spore. A maturation phase has been suggested for eggs during which they are not capable of identifying a valid host or of producing a viable larva. This maturation phase would correspond to the period of time after the spore is introduced to the host body during which the tissue of the host is converted into egg tissue. In addition to her large size, the queen is impressive in her continuous production of eggs. It remains unclear as to whether or not these eggs are mature immediately after they have been released from the ovipositor, however the rapid creation of eggs in this fashion would be greatly facilitated if the bulk of the egg matter as seen within the translucent egg creating organs was merely specially aggregated "yolk" material which had been implanted with a spore by the queen. The infected yolk would then be converted into an egg by the spore, just as would an infected host.

In this case, the development of the queen-imago and her complex egg production organs reflect the creation of a system whereby the queen converts nutrients into a yolk or "pseudo-host", specially designed to be implanted with a spore. The queen, in addition to being the organizational hub of the nest, can then be seen as a special processor designed to convert raw materials into pseudo-hosts, while the spore is seen as the remains of the ancestral system of reproduction wherein hosts were aquired by adults for implantation. Possibly, queens retain the ancestral ability to infect real hosts with spores, and may rely on this capacity in the event that the egg production organs sustain irreparable damage.

This implies that there were two periods of host-mediated adaptation during the lifecycle of ancestral organisms. The first occurred during the maturation phase of the egg, and the second occurred during the gestation phase of the embryo. It further implies that the queen may direct the adaptation of her offspring by creating special pseudo-hosts based on the information obtained during her own gestation phase. This may permit a faster or more efficient means of achieving adaptation to a new environment, and may allow the queen to control the makeup of the nest by changing the character of the pseudo-hosts.

The Ultimate Predator

The Ultimate Predator

#14
You know your stuff don't you maledoro.

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