Am I alone ?

Started by Predator@Alien, Dec 06, 2017, 05:46:42 PM

Author
Am I alone ? (Read 15,809 times)

Scorpio

Scorpio

#60
Well the premise of Prometheus is that life did not evolve on Earth, a humanoid race seeded the universe with their dna so of course they look similar to us as we are genetically related to them.

But even if life could evolve elsewhere separately, it's not far fetched to assume they could evolve on a similar path to Earth's lifeforms.

SiL

SiL

#61
Quote from: Scorpio on Dec 18, 2017, 10:32:18 PM
Then best you just watch Alien 1-4 where the origin isn't explained, because how is a narrative going to work if you don't include humans?  How would the opening scene of Prometheus work if it was a 10 foot skeleton or an elephant creature?  It would be laughably ridiculous. 
You could easily have the same story in Prometheus and not have the Engineers be men in suits. David could be developing the Alien rather than creating it.

The idea that for humans to be involved must mean they need to be kissing cousins with every species in space is moronic.

OpenMaw

OpenMaw

#62
Quote from: Scorpio on Dec 18, 2017, 10:32:18 PM
Then best you just watch Alien 1-4 where the origin isn't explained, because how is a narrative going to work if you don't include humans?  How would the opening scene of Prometheus work if it was a 10 foot skeleton or an elephant creature?  It would be laughably ridiculous. 

You're being purposely obtuse. The PREMISE of Prometheus is faulty from the outset. Humans and the creature from the derelict should not be related in any manner. It is very clear from everything that existed at the time Alien was made, there was no such intent with the movie to make that claim. That was an Alien ship with an alien creature from another part of the galaxy and likely from a distant time in the past. The entire milestone of Alien is that it gave us a credible Alien presence. Not just Giger's beast, but the skeleton. So Prometheus sets out to basically undo that achievement from "go."

Let me ask how exactly, for one, is an alien creature that's actually alien inherently laughable? You don't know that. You have no way of knowing that. The truth is we've had decades of very alien creatures that were not laughable.

Are we going to make the Predators some half-human splinter species from 100,000 years ago too?


Quote from: SiL on Dec 18, 2017, 11:06:15 PM
You could easily have the same story in Prometheus and not have the Engineers be men in suits. David could be developing the Alien rather than creating it.

The idea that for humans to be involved must mean they need to be kissing cousins with every species in space is moronic.

Yeah. Seriously.

Biomechanoid

Biomechanoid

#63
Quote from: OpenMaw on Dec 18, 2017, 11:23:15 PM
You're being purposely obtuse.

"Purposely obtuse." That almost feels like an oxymoron.  :laugh:

Sorry for the pointless interruption. Carry on.

windebieste

windebieste

#64
Quote from: Gash on Dec 18, 2017, 08:41:05 PM
The Skull with Peter Cushing? Yes, that's a good film too.

He's referring to THE Skull. 

One of the few debates on these forums regarding the movies that's actually in possession of any merit.  lol.

-Windebieste.

kwisatz

kwisatz

#65
QuoteHe's referring to THE Skull. 



Scorpio

Scorpio

#66
Quote from: SiL on Dec 18, 2017, 11:06:15 PM

The idea that for humans to be involved must mean they need to be kissing cousins with every species in space is moronic.

It isn't moronic, it's called panspermia and is a valid scientific idea.

It's the premise that life evolved at some time/place, and spread throughout the universe via various means.

It isn't a moronic idea at all, it's actually a very interesting idea and has never been explored in any film.

But I suppose you just want some generic Star Trek plot where human astronauts stumble upon alien life.

Quote from: OpenMaw on Dec 18, 2017, 11:23:15 PM


You're being purposely obtuse. The PREMISE of Prometheus is faulty from the outset. Humans and the creature from the derelict should not be related in any manner. It is very clear from everything that existed at the time Alien was made, there was no such intent with the movie to make that claim. That was an Alien ship with an alien creature from another part of the galaxy and likely from a distant time in the past. The entire milestone of Alien is that it gave us a credible Alien presence. Not just Giger's beast, but the skeleton. So Prometheus sets out to basically undo that achievement from "go."

You're right it wasn't the original intention, but the basic idea isn't new, it was Giger's designs and the execution that made it a milestone.

QuoteLet me ask how exactly, for one, is an alien creature that's actually alien inherently laughable? You don't know that. You have no way of knowing that. The truth is we've had decades of very alien creatures that were not laughable.

And how do you define 'alien'?  Something that doesn't look 'human'?  The Engineers are clearly not human and are 'alien'.

You have no idea what an actual alien would look like.  It might look freaky and Giger-esque or it might resemble us.

What I'm saying is a 10 foot tall elephant thing walking around (like how it was depicted in the comics) would be laughable.



^Cool design bro.

If that's the best they could come up with, no wonder Ridley Scott was like "f**k that" and made them look like mythological beings straight out of a classic painting.


windebieste

windebieste

#67


Spoiler
BWAHAHAHAHAAAA!!!1!!!
[close]

-Windebieste.

kwisatz

kwisatz

#68
Hey, i drew that.






:-[


windebieste

windebieste

#69
I'm sure some people love it! 

I'm just not one of them. 

-Windebieste.

OpenMaw

OpenMaw

#70







Who said it should be like the comics? They should be towering, sophisticated, dangerous, and Alien. It should have been like that moment in Jurassic Park when the T'rex is revealed. ground breaking, terrifying, real.

These things aren't us. They are Alien in every sense, and aside of maybe a few passing physical similarities, their intentions are alien to us. That's f**king terrifying. We could be food, we could be play things, we could be curiosities to them.


I'm not saying any one of these would be it. I'm saying there were so many ways they could have taken it that would have been far more compelling and interesting and different. They took one of the most stock, dull Von Daniken derivative approaches to the greater Alien mythos, and they cheapened a number of it's unique qualities in the process.

Corporal Hicks

Corporal Hicks

#71
Quote from: Scorpio on Dec 18, 2017, 10:32:18 PM
Then best you just watch Alien 1-4 where the origin isn't explained, because how is a narrative going to work if you don't include humans?  How would the opening scene of Prometheus work if it was a 10 foot skeleton or an elephant creature?  It would be laughably ridiculous. 

Was it ridiculous in Alien? No, it certainly wasn't.

QuoteAnd how else is Ridley Scott supposed to show the evolution of the xenomorph?  That's the entire basis of these prequels.

That's not what the prequels are about. It might be where the last one took it in an attempt to "course-correct" but that is not what these things were about.

Quote from: Scorpio on Dec 19, 2017, 03:51:15 AM
It isn't moronic, it's called panspermia and is a valid scientific idea.

It's the premise that life evolved at some time/place, and spread throughout the universe via various means.

It isn't a moronic idea at all, it's actually a very interesting idea and has never been explored in any film.

But I suppose you just want some generic Star Trek plot where human astronauts stumble upon alien life.

I have to wonder if you've watched Star Trek.  ??? Because panspermia has been done in the past. In Star Trek. And Stargate. And I'm sure countless others.  It's not original. It was an attempt to humanise the Space Jockeys so they were more "relatable" to the audience or something to that effect.

OpenMaw

OpenMaw

#72
That's actually really funny. Yes, indeed, in Star Trek lore, most of the major alpha and beta quadrant species are apparently related due to an ancient alien species being very lonely and deciding to seed a bunch of worlds. See TNG "The Chase." It's dumb. So very very dumb. So much so that none of the following series so much as play lip service to the idea.

Incidentally that aspect has nothing to do with the theory/hypothesis of Panspermia. Panspermia is the idea that genetic material could be transplanted from one place in the cosmos to another. The theory is talking more about meteors and meteor impacts. Unintentional transfer. It was a concern that one of the Apollo missions might bring something back with them. See, that part is totally plausible.

One idea was that an impact on Mars, nearly a billion years back, ejected basic organic material into space and it ended up on Earth, which is what kick started the big boom here. Though, most scientists don't think that idea really holds up and it's more likely that the natural conditions on Earth simply brought about the basic building blocks that lead to organic life to rise up and thrive.

What isn't plausible is pre-destined evolution, or having a species basically seed life a billion years ago, with any kind of nuanced intention, said species still being alive with relatively little change in their appearance. Which is what Prometheus and Covenant both want us to believe happened. Not only is that dumb, but it's wholly unnecessary.

SM

SM

#73
What is the deal with the 'aliens' in TOS who all appear to be completely human (aside from budget restraints)?  Are they all the result of this 'seeding'?

Corporal Hicks

Corporal Hicks

#74
From what I remember that was The Chase's justification for it, yeah. I'll see if I can dig up a clip.



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