Mechanics Needing To Be Changed

Started by Xenomorphine, Jan 21, 2010, 02:27:51 AM

Author
Mechanics Needing To Be Changed (Read 78,691 times)

ScardyFox

ScardyFox

#540
FIX THE ALIEN SIGHT MODE - IT SUCKS.

Now that I have been spending more and more time on other species, I have to say I love Alien a lot more than I thought I would. Doing so has given me perspective on things (such as Pred being slightly over powered) and can't help but notice vision mode sucks.

Predators are all but invisible from a distance or in the sun, while a Predator can see you from 17.9 miles away. Even humans are hard to see from a distance. The pheromone-glow should be turned up a notch in my opinion. Aliens universal sight is their biggest advantage and it kinda blows in this version.

FiveByFive

FiveByFive

#541
Quote from: ScardyFox on Feb 26, 2010, 03:49:48 PM
FIX THE ALIEN SIGHT MODE - IT SUCKS.

Now that I have been spending more and more time on other species, I have to say I love Alien a lot more than I thought I would. Doing so has given me perspective on things (such as Pred being slightly over powered) and can't help but notice vision mode sucks.

Predators are all but invisible from a distance or in the sun, while a Predator can see you from 17.9 miles away. Even humans are hard to see from a distance. The pheromone-glow should be turned up a notch in my opinion. Aliens universal sight is their biggest advantage and it kinda blows in this version.

I could be wrong, but I think the basis for this is that the alien seethrough sight has a maximum range. It's more likely a "smell" than a sight. So at a great distance, prey "smells" would be so fade that they wouldn't even be picked up by the xeno.

hardwired

hardwired

#542
Quote from: AJL on Feb 26, 2010, 02:08:55 PM
Quote from: Steve C on Feb 26, 2010, 01:41:29 PM
Speaking of the alien, does anybody else find it irritating to play as the alien and get knocked on your ass by a predator or marine?...

I think its great that Aliens can be knocked down by Predators in Melee
but what isn't so great is that its one sided! Aliens should be able to do
the same! Alien should be Equal OR Superior to Pred in normal face to
face melee match!


Equal. If one should be superior then the pred.

AV-On

AV-On

#543
The Predator is overpowered, strongest melee (Alien should be able to knock it down too) and one shot kill ranged weapons . . . the disc spamming is just sad. What really gives the Predator the advantage is how all the lame Tomb Raider maps favour its abilities. The Alien is seriously compromised in all the daylight maps and naviagting some areas of the maps is a ******* chore.

redxavier

redxavier

#544
Quote from: FiveByFive on Feb 26, 2010, 03:56:11 PM
I could be wrong, but I think the basis for this is that the alien seethrough sight has a maximum range. It's more likely a "smell" than a sight. So at a great distance, prey "smells" would be so fade that they wouldn't even be picked up by the xeno.

The aliens don't have eyes, so yeah it's based on other senses. It doesn't actually make sense for them to be able to 'see' through solid walls either but take that away and you'll have fans complaining as it removes a mostly overlooked advantage that they have over the other species.


AJL

AJL

#545
Quote from: hardwired on Feb 26, 2010, 04:46:05 PM
Quote from: AJL on Feb 26, 2010, 02:08:55 PM
Alien should be Equal OR Superior to Pred in normal face to face melee match!
Equal. If one should be superior then the pred.

NOO-O!

If one is Superior in face to face melee match it should be the ALIEN!

Preds and Marines can always shoot at the Alien from distance safely
while Aliens HAVE TO get up close and take the risks. (which are big)

As it is... Using melee only for defense (blocking/countering) is a lot
safer than attacking (safer for Preds and Marines that is..) who ever
makes the first offensive melee move tends to lose and if the Alien
waits for Pred/Marine to make the move, they will simply shoot it...

Only way how Alien can really win against good Pred or Marine is by
waiting for it to go to some area where the Alien can zap it with its
tail from some wall (and good player should know not to make that
mistake...) or wait for opportunity to use the stealth kill... (which
also may never come)

FiveByFive

FiveByFive

#546
Alien and Pred should be equal in melee.

Reason:

-Predator has ranged advantage over Alien ( and 3 one hit killing weapons - disc, PC, spear) and faster HA
-Behind a wall (or at range) an Alien can see where the pred is facing, thus has an advantage when it comes to stealthkilling

So these two ranged advantages cancel eachother out, leaving the close combat melee as tipping the scale in the favor of the pred, which makes the pred overpowered. By equalizing their melee, the scale is balanced.

The Preds can keep the same health, because they need to have the same resistance to marine gunfire as they do right now (+ they can't run away from gunfire as fast as xenos can)

So their high health is justified (150 HP)

The only thing that can be tipped in the favor for the aliens is a slightly faster HA, which would counter the fact that its easy as hell to block the aliens LA as a marine and pump an alien full of lead. By having a slightly faster HA, the aliens can mix up their attacks without fear of being pulse rifled to death while winding up to HA a marine.

Spaghetti

Spaghetti

#547
Quote from: Steve C on Feb 26, 2010, 02:06:53 PM
I'm a predator fan first and foremost, but just playing devil's advocate here, it doesn't seem at all ridiculous that the predator knocks the alien down?  Going by the original movies, there's nothing to prove that a predator should be able to manhandle a bug like that.  The alien should be at least on par with the predator in meele, but as the situation stands now, the predator is head and shoulders above the rest.  Just doesn't seem right to me.

Welcome to the club bud

AJL

AJL

#548
Quote from: FiveByFive on Feb 26, 2010, 06:46:29 PM
-Predator has ranged advantage over Alien...
-...Alien can see where the pred is facing...

So these two ranged advantages cancel eachother out...

Not even close... ::)

If Pred vision only worked from short range like Alien vision
does, or Alien vision worked from long range like Pred vision
does.. Then "perhaps"... Propably still... Not...

FiveByFive

FiveByFive

#549
Quote from: AJL on Feb 26, 2010, 07:00:18 PM
Quote from: FiveByFive on Feb 26, 2010, 06:46:29 PM
-Predator has ranged advantage over Alien...
-...Alien can see where the pred is facing...

So these two ranged advantages cancel eachother out...

Not even close... ::)

If Pred vision only worked from short range like Alien vision
does, or Alien vision worked from long range like Pred vision
does.. Then "perhaps"... Propably still... Not...

I think the fact that you are speedy makes it hard for a pred to hit you, even with his one-hit-kills ranged weapons. Just by being on par in melee would make it balanced.

hardwired

hardwired

#550
Thats the way "you" think about it. And there is no prove, that aliens are stronger or no objective argument why they have to be stronger. So you have to respect other opinions like all other "alien have to be stronger in melee"-guys.
But I really dont want that preds are stronger in melee.

Sorry, but overall some "points" people make here pretty often are just opinions.
And i think its no secret, that the majority are aliensplayers and the majority overall isnt better then some hardcore Star Trek-nerds.

Any pseudoarguments, that are based "facts" from movies are just subjective. Like someone wrote in an other thread: The skills of an creature/character/etc. based on the script of the movie and can vairy from scene to scene.
And people have to respect people, who like to see preds goin into melee and be equal (what i want for example, i dont want to be predators as superior meleespecies) and even if they want to be superior in melee, if aliens and preds are overall equal, its just their opinion.

Im fine if both get equal but I dont want to see a real advantage for one of them, cause predators are not dependet on their ranged weapons and you see them fighting in CQC very well, specially if they fight the strongest/leader/alpha/etc. , if you remind the movies.

Like you, I cant speak for everyone. But i appreciate fighting single aliens in melee and the meleesystem overall. I want same chances for both to win the game, so noone have to feel disadvanteged and its makes overall sense to go in melee with a pred.

Overall you "seem" (actually i dont think you really do it) to speak for the ones who primary want to win. I dont care for that, i play for the fun, the experience, the tension.
What kinda people care that much about a high score? Why should i have to play "save", if I like to fight aliens in melee?

Whats the point of the whole system? I think its pretty clear now, that Rebellion wanted to expand the melee-part in the gameplay, so its a huge part of it.
And thats something I always hated about the previous titles. Melee is something important in this franchise. And in AVP 1 and 2 you just can just bunnyhop and push the left mousebutton. So there is no real melee at all.

Its simply not true, that the one that attacks first lose the game. There are many situations, where its not that easy to detect.
And Im pretty sure, you can solve the problem if the aliens and preds are equal in melee and become stronger/the predators become weaker in other aspects.
Aliens got some advantages, like the speed and the look through walls, that are important and can be advanced.
The ranged weapons of preds could be less effective against aliens, too.

So i agree, if aliens become equal in melee, but i see no reason why they have to be superior. But someothers trend to that and think their opinion would be anyhow more important than the one of others.
And after seeing that over and over again, sorry, but Im a bit pissed, even Im no real "fan" of aliens or predators.

Anyway I think its allmost impossible to really make them equal.
Specially cause the maps are so different (and here aliens really deserve more, in their style).

BTW: And for people who frag like the one today in my match (*clantag* bullet sponge was his name), they just deserve to get killed by the disc over and over again, if they just stealthkill and tailspam from walls. I really try to play fair, but its just poor if someone plays that way just to push his score.


FiveByFive

FiveByFive

#551
Ok, respectfully, I'm not totally sure what your whole point was. The only thing I stated previously was that, in my opinion, aliens and preds should be equal in melee, that's all.

I felt that preds had ranged offensive advantages (one hit kill weapons), while aliens had defensive and offensive advantages (seeing through walls, being the fastest species), so to me, it feels that these advantages cancel out. But I do understand that not everyone plays species the same way, I'dd rather sneak around and use alien vision to try a stealth kill on a predator, than running head on to fight one face to face. When it does happen, that I do need to fight one with melee, it's because it turned around and saw me.

That's basically all I had to say.

hardwired

hardwired

#552
Sorry, I respond to a post from AJL and a bit generally to some other people.

FiveByFive

FiveByFive

#553
ok, no problem

ScardyFox

ScardyFox

#554
Honestly, Aliens would be far better off if they had the visual strength they had in AvP2.

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