Character family dynamic?

Started by NickisSmart, Mar 17, 2015, 01:07:59 PM

Author
Character family dynamic? (Read 4,254 times)

NickisSmart

NickisSmart

"It's not like we're engaged or anything."

Or are they?!

The survivors wake up, get out of the tubes, and get married, or at the very least live together (futuristic common law couple). I'm thinking Hicks and Rip as a couple raising Newt. Then something happens and the family must act, out of necessity or guilt, and it tears the family apart.

Actually, this sounds a little like the plot to the Incredibles, but I think it'd be fun. Maybe Ripley and Hicks would have a kid besides Newt, like a little brother or sister.

Or... option two:

A) Ripley and Hicks and Newt go their separate ways. Ripley raises Newt, who eventually moves out to live on her own. Hicks lives in a small apartment by himself, drinking himself into oblivion.

or

B) Hicks raises Newt, Ripley suffers a nervous breakdown and winds up in a mental hospital, and Bishop shows up, contacting Hicks, who along with Newt, the three of them go to break Ripley out of the looney bin and stop the company, Terminator 2-style.


whiterabbit

whiterabbit

#1
Hicks needs to go home and be a family man.

Feeds On Minds

Feeds On Minds

#2
is Alien 5 going to be on the Lifetime network, or what?

Xhan

Xhan

#3
Quote from: whiterabbit on Mar 18, 2015, 12:30:27 AM
Hicks needs to go home and be a family man.

Nowhere near enough hair.

NickisSmart

NickisSmart

#4
I imagine the acid would make it hard for him to grow a full head of hair.

These suggestions are meant to be somewhat silly but I have to wonder if there will be a family dynamic at all for the risk of sounding incongruous. It will seem strange if it does happen but think of the way Aliens ended: Ripley killed the Queen and earned herself a new daughter ("Can I still dream?" "All the way home!" *cue sappy James Horner music*). And given Hicks and Ripley's behavior towards the other near the end of the film, I think it's safe to say that they were in love with each other, or if they wound up that way in a sequel it wouldn't be all that surprising.

I guess this begs the question, does love belong in an Alien film? Or is it like Alien: Isolation? Long-haul sex partners? In Alien, the characters obviously had attractions, but they often were implied or went unsaid. Ripley cared about Dallas, but because of the professional environment, they never communicated their love openly. Still, he shields her with his body from the facehugger when it falls to the floor; and she grows angry with Dallas when he goes into the vents, risking his life for her. At the same time, Ripley had a daughter, but who was the father? Was he around, or was she divorced/a widow? Either of these two options make sense to me given her behavior towards Dallas, given "how seriously Ripley takes her responsibilities."

Probably the most obvious and blatant relationship in the Alien series was in Alien 4, with Michael Wincott's character to his female co-pilot. I didn't mind it, because couples that love each other have more to lose and in theory the deaths will have more impact. It didn't really work like that with that film, but it could have. Isaac had his wife in Dead Space. Sarah Connor had her relationship with Kyle Reese in Terminator 1. It can work, but it's not really something I've seen handled too well in the Alien films.


Born Of Cold Light

The Ripley/Hicks/Newt family dynamic is just too neat and clean for Alien.  There has to be some kind of tragedy even in the moment of triumph.  Having them all just skip off into the sunset would not fit the series at all.

NickisSmart

NickisSmart

#6
That's kind of how Aliens ends, though. I think in Alien 3, you have that tragedy that you're talking about, but it felt abrupt. The movie didn't benefit from it, I do not think.

Personally I never liked the idea of having a central character with a story like Alien. It would have ruined the first film, but the movie keeps you guessing until the end. In Aliens, Ripley is this central character from the start, and it felt a little silly to me, especially towards the end, when she's duking it out with the aliens and winning after everyone else is defeated. That kind of thing would have also been ridiculous in the first film. She does defeat the creature, but not easily and she's scared of it, runs away from it, only confronts it because she has no other choice. She didn't feel like a hero with this agenda against the company. She just felt like someone trying to survive. The moment she decided to spend the rest of her life fighting the creature and the company I kind of lost interest.

Granted, she's going to wind up with a chip on her shoulder and some PTSD. But the story just went in this grand, theatrical direction, with her and the creature "meeting once again" over and over like Dracula and Van Helsing.

The question is, does this continue in Alien 5? Does Ripley try to have a normal life, with her arch-nemesis seemingly defeated? Is she seemingly happy with fellow survivor Hicks and Newt, only to have her happiness dashed by the "goddamn company" and that pesky alien? It's obviously going to return, because the film isn't titled "The Adventures of Ripley." It's called Alien V (tenatively) and Ripley is in the film, and probably Hicks, as well. Not sure about Newt, but it would not be surprising if she were, too. So if all three survivors are in the film, and the alien is, how are the humans getting along together and how does the inevitable return of the alien affect their relationship as a group? Do they stick together, only to be broken apart? Do Newt and Hicks die before the film starts?

Personally I think Ripley was such a huge success as a character because it came off as a surprise. She wasn't this obvious hero from the start. The biggest problem with Alien V is I doubt they'll be willing to take a risk and try something new. Ripley is captain of this ship, the heroine of the series. Hicks and Newt are, too, in their own ways. For better or for worse, they are the central characters of the series, an effect bolstered by Aliens and the direction it took its characters in. I wish that Alien V would deal with them more as ordinary people trying to survive and not these grand heroes in some kind of space opera. A good way to ground them would be to treat them like ordinary people


Alien³

Alien³

#7

NickisSmart

NickisSmart

#8
Newsflash, not everyone in the world likes Alien 3.

If I had to choose a direction for Alien 5 to take with the relationship of the 3 surviving human characters from Aliens, it would not be to kill two of them off during the opening credits scene.

Alien³

Alien³

#9
Quote from: NickisSmart on Mar 18, 2015, 10:29:23 AM
Oldflash, not everyone in the world likes Alien 3.

Fixed  ;)

whiterabbit

whiterabbit

#10
Quote from: NickisSmart on Mar 18, 2015, 10:29:23 AM
Newsflash, not everyone in the world likes Alien 3.

If I had to choose a direction for Alien 5 to take with the relationship of the 3 surviving human characters from Aliens, it would not be to kill two of them off during the opening credits scene.
Just imagine if Alien 5 ends with Ripley
Spoiler
capping everyone off like the dad did in the movie "The Mist" and then all of the Aliens suddenly dropping dead like the droid army in the "Phantom Menace" when Ripley demands that they kill her.
[close]
Best irony ever?

NickisSmart

NickisSmart

#11
I really don't understand endings (or beginnings) where people die suddenly for no reason. Does it happen in real life? Yes. Is it something I want in a movie? No. The whole point with characters is to have them live long enough for something meaningful. Otherwise its a bad play. Sound and fury. Kill the characters after they've lived long enough to accomplish something at the very least, and don't do it for the sake of doing it (the pilot from Firefly). Have it at least be memorable. Not sudden, senseless and cheap. Treat the characters like they're valuable and that killing them off needlessly or spontaneously is the waste of a precious commodity.

Case in point: Captain Kirk in Star Trek generations. Lets have Kirk fall down a hole. Or Boba Fett in Return of the Jedi. Nothing is worse for a movie than having an ignominious demise for a beloved character. What's worse are ignominious demises where the characters die before the movie starts.

Hopefully the characters will not suffer such terrible fates. They don't have to be central, but if you're pursuing that storyline, it would be foolish to kill them off right away. I mean, let's have Hicks not even appear in the film, but die of a heart attack in his bed, so we don't even have to cast Michael Beihn to reprise his role. And Newt can choke on a ham sandwich in the opening credits. Then it's just Ripley.

That's my version of hell, right there.

Russ

Russ

#12
I'm with you, Nick. It's interesting because we've discussed the retcon to death on here and I quite like the hypersleep nightmare explanation of how this may pan out to serve the plot. It's been said of that idea that its lazy and stupid etc etc. Yet, I've seen vehement defenses of Alien3 and I think killing major characters off camera to make the story work is lazy and insulting to the audience. Especially when the premise is a deus ex.

I don't have an issue with any of them getting offed (in a better story, Ellen Ripley's sacrifice of Alien3 would have been epic - hell, to be fair, even IN Alien3 it's epic), but their deaths need to have some resonance outside of serving a plot point to ensure the protagonist is the driving force of the story. Even Alien Resurrection managed to do that, allowing Ripley 8 to take command after the bloke from the Crow had been offed, but Alien3 doesn't do that - it just says "oh, they're dead and it was horrid, the little girl was awake when she drowned." Horrific, yes. Serves the plot, yes. Lazy and stupid - definitely because the only reason she had the horrid death was because of something we pulled out of arses that didn't happen in the previous movie. Oh, we didn't see the mystery egg getting placed but it was obvious that's what happened.

I remember sitting in the cinema thinking wtf (in the days before we used wtf as an abbreviation).


HuDaFuK

HuDaFuK

#13
Quote from: NickisSmart on Mar 18, 2015, 12:40:50 PMThe whole point with characters is to have them live long enough for something meaningful.

No it isn't. Sure, that's the point of sappy, generic, run-of-the-mill popcorn movies, but to say every movie should be like that is just stupid and incredibly narrow-minded.

There are literally hundreds of films out that don't follow that logic, are harsh with their characters, and explore much darker themes. And there's absolutely nothing wrong with that.

Alien³

Alien³

#14

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