Jurassic Park Series

[DoomRulz]

You're arguing semantics.

[SiL]

Kind of like a Great White is kind of larger than a minnow?

Sure.

Although Wikipedia (yes, yes I know...) lists them as "up to" six and a half feet, not 9-12 (Although if you've got sources for that size, go ahead and post - I'd love to educate myself some more on them).

[DoomRulz]

Wikipedia is pretty accurate in that regard. But if want a scholarly source, hold on.

Source: Dinosaurus: The Complete Guide to Dinosaurs by Steve Parker.

Utahraptor fact file
Length: 5-6 metres (16-20 feet)
Weight: 500 kgs (1100 lbs)

"[Utahraptor] shot to fame in 1993 after Jurassic Park, in which the clever, co-operative dinosaurs of the film were based on smaller dromaeosaurs, such as Velociraptor and Deinonychus but to make them a match for human adversaries, they were enlarged to slightly more than the height of an adult person and to several metres in length. During the film's production in 1991, fossil remains of just such a rapto were uncovered in eastern Utah, giving a factual basis for the film's fearsome monsters."

[Xhan]

How bout Raptor Red?

Wikipedia is pretty accurate in that regard. But if want a scholarly source, hold on

Except their own size chart doesn't match the description.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/72/Utahraptor_size_estimate_chart.svg

[SiL]

How bout Raptor Red?

Read it. Walking With Dinosaurs lists "up to 2 meters" as well.

Except their own size chart doesn't match the description.

This one does:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/4a/Utahraptor_scale.png

[Xhan]

Sure, if their neck doesn't bend up. Hazarding a wild guess it does.

If you've read Bakker's book then you know it's pretty moot. Red is able to chaw things higher than 2 meters up.

[DoomRulz]

I don't think so. At least not by much. While Utahraptor is classified as a dromaeosaurid, its size makes it more comparable to carnosaurs. That said, Utahraptor walked perfectly balanced on two legs with its tail held out for balance. Most depictions of large, meat-eating dinosaurs have them more or less rigid with their head movement, and they don't curve up much. I'm not saying the head doesn't do that, but I don't think it was common place.

[SiL]

If you've read Bakker's book then you know it's pretty moot. Red is able to chaw things higher than 2 meters up.

I'm able to grab things eight feet up, doesn't mean I'm eight feet tall.

I still don't even get what the point of all this is, though. I said Utahraptors were bigger than what we saw in JP, and then you come in saying ... the Utahraptors are bigger than what we saw in JP. And then this happened.

[Xhan]

I don't think so. At least not by much. While Utahraptor is classified as a dromaeosaurid, its size makes it more comparable to carnosaurs. That said, Utahraptor walked perfectly balanced on two legs with its tail held out for balance. Most depictions of large, meat-eating dinosaurs have them more or less rigid with their head movement, and they don't curve up much. I'm not saying the head doesn't do that, but I don't think it was common place.

T-Rex had plenty range of motion, and needed it, as the head is pretty much the go to organ for all things interactive, short of stomping something.

I still don't even get what the point of all this is

Lol, you're the guy that responded. My point was that nothing CLOSE to Utah Raptor was available, no more, no less.

I'm able to grab things eight feet up, doesn't mean I'm eight feet tall.

And Utah Raptor is able to crane it's neck to that height, hence the statement. You tilting your head back would make you shorter.

[DoomRulz]

I don't think so. At least not by much. While Utahraptor is classified as a dromaeosaurid, its size makes it more comparable to carnosaurs. That said, Utahraptor walked perfectly balanced on two legs with its tail held out for balance. Most depictions of large, meat-eating dinosaurs have them more or less rigid with their head movement, and they don't curve up much. I'm not saying the head doesn't do that, but I don't think it was common place.

T-Rex had plenty range of motion, and needed it, as the head is pretty much the go to organ for all things interactive, short of stomping something.

Remember: T. Rex had stereoscopic vision. No other large meat-eating dinosaur had that. Even the bigger ones (Giganotosaurus, Carcharodontosaurus, Spinosaurus) didn't have that. That helped a great deal, since it had depth perception.

[SiL]

Lol, you're the guy that responded.

Because you responded to something I said.

My point was that nothing CLOSE to Utah Raptor was available, no more, no less.

You then listed a 9-12 foot height for the creature, which all readily available information would say is objectively false.

[Xhan]

Yeah, because the median height is measured from the shoulder, not the head... except the animal can raise its neck and probably did all the time to see/hunt. So going back to the model and looking at the neck and head gives you an actual height.

Remember: T. Rex had stereoscopic vision. No other large meat-eating dinosaur had that. Even the bigger ones (Giganotosaurus, Carcharodontosaurus, Spinosaurus) didn't have that. That helped a great deal, since it had depth perception.

And it still had the means to crane back or chomp something at face level, which is borne out by other TRex's having chaw marks on the front sides of their heads and tall Hadrosaurs being clomped on the head.

[SiL]

Yeah, because the median height is measured from the shoulder, not the head... except the animal can raise its neck and probably did all the time to see/hunt. So going back ot he model and looking at the neck and head gives you an actual height.

But like I said - Just because I can stand on the tips of my toes and stretch out my arms doesn't mean I'm eight feet tall. There's a reason they go by median shoulder height rather than measuring the highest the animal could possibly stretch and saying that's the "actual" height. It's like measuring how high it is crouched and saying that's the thing's height.

[Xhan]

Which is again, not remotely accurate to MODALITY of the animal, as all the scratch marks on the bones of plant eaters attest. If the animal was unable to raise its head, there would be no point (or basis) in jumping on the sides of large plant eaters with your head raised up. Which they did, as they've been found smashed in that exact position, much less standing up to properly employ the sickle claw forward. Ergo, 9-12 feet TALL. The end. That was my point.

[SiL]

The raptor rearing up on the table in JP while everyone's in the vents would've been about nine feet tall. So I guess they're the right size after all.