The Rage War: A three part Alien / Predator epic by Tim Lebbon

[Corporal Hicks]

That makes sense, it saves you the whole rebuilding afterwards, just clean up the mess. XD

Depends on the mess. If you can actually control them you can stop them building hive so it'd just be bodies and whatever acid damage.

[HuDaFuK]

Gedimen or Wren (can't remember who) said it best - urban pacification. If you can actually control the Aliens, they'd be the perfect way to go in and not actually destroy (for the most part, blood doesn't help that) the infrastructure. It's not ideal...but it's better than just nuking something

One of the most interesting things in that film - and one that often gets overlooked in favour of the slightly daft "we want supersoldiers" spiel - is when Wren points out what they're really after are all the new alloys, vaccines etc. they can derive from the Aliens' biology. That sort of thing makes far more sense than just painting numbers on their foreheads and sending them into battle. Plus, it opens up some potentially really interesting avenues.

Sadly, in the film, the concept's relegated to an off-hand comment that's never followed up on and a lot of people seem to miss.

[happypred]

Re: Aliens -

Spoiler

I interpreted it (and it wasn't openly explained and it was sort of left hanging for the sequels) that the Aliens were being controlled as a result of some sort of biotech that the Rage had been able to implement into their synthetics characters. I think it was more the complete and utter control of them that made them more threatening.

The Aliens weren't really seen in open conditions, mostly close quarters making that self destruct (as in they proper go pop) a bit more deadly. And it was generally quite fast too. Drop in, overwhelm, move on. Worked quite well.

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Re: Predator self-destruct -

Spoiler

As in the Predators don't get a chance to activate it. It's only ever shown activated via that panel and slicing it in half worked well enough in Predator 2 that City Hunter had to high-tail it back to the ship. No reason the same wouldn't work here.

[close]

Thanks...I mean wouldn't killing a predator be even more effective than tearing off his arm re his ability to activate self-destruct

Also...is it established whether the aliens are intelligent or just controlled by an intelligent master?

[Xenomorphine]

That's what neutron bombs are for. Kill all organic life, wait a couple of weeks for radiation to disperse, them walk in and calmly take over.

[Corporal Hicks]

Had never heard of that before. Fair enough.

Guess it's more of a psychological thing then. Because they certainly effect some of the Predators into a bit of a frenzy.

[HuDaFuK]

That's what neutron bombs are for. Kill all organic life, wait a couple of weeks for radiation to disperse, them walk in and calmly take over.

Peeps could still hide in bunkers though. Aliens would get in there and paint the walls.

[Xenomorphine]

That's what neutron bombs are for. Kill all organic life, wait a couple of weeks for radiation to disperse, them walk in and calmly take over.

Peeps could still hide in bunkers though. Aliens would get in there and paint the walls.

Neutron bombs, genetically-engineered biological agents, chemical warfare... Any of those are perfectly legitimate choices. Especially if you smuggle it into the target area and activate it - no warning. Especially bio-warfare, which might not have any odour or colour and an incubation length of your choice. Invisible, silent death (or any other symptom of your choice, including paralysis).

[The Alien Predator]

Why not use Aliens for the sake of variety?

They do the same thing a biological or chemical agent would, exterminate the populace.

And a Neutron bomb will destroy the city, what if you're too lazy to rebuild? It's a lot simpler to clean up a room than having to rebuild the entire building (after clearing up the rubble as well.)

And bio-weapons can contaminate an area, look at what happened to the Engineers themselves in their own facility. And in a deleted scene in Prometheus, Captain Janek tells Vickers about a bio-weapon breakout somewhere on Earth, it was in a desert because just like the Engineers, we weren't stupid enough to build it in a populated area, and yet the whole facility got contaminated due to a leak and had to be destroyed along with everyone in it.

It's a lot safer and cleaner to just use an army of acid bleeding scary looking Aliens completely under your thrall rather than a potentially mutative virus that could harbour unpredictable results if you plan on settling the area afterwards.

And like mentioned before, the psychological aspect. Promising your enemy a quick death isn't as scary as promising to send an army of crawling darkness with your name plastered on its head straight to their doorstep.

But in the end, I would agree that Aliens aren't the perfect and ultimate weapon like some characters in the EU make it out to be. But damn are they effective when unleashed as a surprise attack.

I guess we'd have to wait for "Alien: Invasion" to find out just how it goes.

[Xenomorphine]

Why not use Aliens for the sake of variety?

They do the same thing a biological or chemical agent would, exterminate the populace.

Much less efficient. You'd have to transport a huge number to overwhelm most prepared defences. A single Alien is larger than a man. Warheads are much smaller - and can be transported a lot quicker.

Might as well ask yourself why a company doesn't do the same thing, right now, with cloned tigers. Can you imagine all the logistical problems involved?

And a Neutron bomb will destroy the city, what if you're too lazy to rebuild? It's a lot simpler to clean up a room than having to rebuild the entire building (after clearing up the rubble as well.)

Neutron bombs can be very low-yield. The whole point of them, back in the Cold War, was to do exactly this: Release a huge burst of radiation in a city, kill everyone and leave the infrastructure intact to take over. The radiation disperses surprisingly quickly.

Different to thermonuclear war, which would literally vaporise everything.

And bio-weapons can contaminate an area, look at what happened to the Engineers themselves in their own facility. And in a deleted scene in Prometheus, Captain Janek tells Vickers about a bio-weapon breakout somewhere on Earth, it was in a desert because just like the Engineers, we weren't stupid enough to build it in a populated area, and yet the whole facility got contaminated due to a leak and had to be destroyed along with everyone in it.

It's a lot safer and cleaner to just use an army of acid bleeding scary looking Aliens completely under your thrall rather than a potentially mutative virus that could harbour unpredictable results if you plan on settling the area afterwards.

Biological agents, sure - now. By the time the films are happening, it stands to reason that technology would allow them to be modified to only target certain people or burn out after a designated time. That's stuff which has been worked on since at least the nineties, if not earlier.

But even there, you still have neutron bombs - or chemical warfare. In fact, 'Aliens' show that the Colonial Marines seem to take along not just nuclear weapons, but canisters of nerve gas - just for regular scouting missions. There don't seem to be any political problems with authorising them for use.

And like mentioned before, the psychological aspect. Promising your enemy a quick death isn't as scary as promising to send an army of crawling darkness with your name plastered on its head straight to their doorstep.

When it's at the cost of efficiency, what's the point when you already have weapons which achieve the same result much easier? If you're wiping out entire populations, anyone you're terrorising isn't going to live to tell about it.

But in the end, I would agree that Aliens aren't the perfect and ultimate weapon like some characters in the EU make it out to be. But damn are they effective when unleashed as a surprise attack.

I guess we'd have to wait for "Alien: Invasion" to find out just how it goes.

Yeah, as I say, I'll withhold my judgement until I read it, but if it's literally a case of just being able to control Aliens, it's no better than General Spears' plan. At least his idea was to use them against other Aliens, though. To reclaim Earth from the Alien by using them against one another. There's a sort of logic there.

But using them against humans and Predators? Ehhh... We're two species which have access to really powerful ranged weapons and Aliens can't realistically compete against that. Not if it's open, galactic-wide warfare.

Using an Alien as an assassin, on the other hand... Now, that's something they'd be very good at. A small number of them locating a specific target, evading defences and killing him/her/it. That's what they excel at in urban environments. Very different to using them as an army of doom.

I could also see their brains and sensory abilities possibly being removed/cloned/farmed and placed in some kind of synthetic contraption, to augment robotic abilities (like a kind of ED-209 with a few Alien components inside).

[The Alien Predator]

Why not use Aliens for the sake of variety?

They do the same thing a biological or chemical agent would, exterminate the populace.

Much less efficient. You'd have to transport a huge number to overwhelm most prepared defences. A single Alien is larger than a man. Warheads are much smaller - and can be transported a lot quicker.

Might as well ask yourself why a company doesn't do the same thing, right now, with cloned tigers. Can you imagine all the logistical problems involved?

And a Neutron bomb will destroy the city, what if you're too lazy to rebuild? It's a lot simpler to clean up a room than having to rebuild the entire building (after clearing up the rubble as well.)

Neutron bombs can be very low-yield. The whole point of them, back in the Cold War, was to do exactly this: Release a huge burst of radiation in a city, kill everyone and leave the infrastructure intact to take over. The radiation disperses surprisingly quickly.

Different to thermonuclear war, which would literally vaporise everything.

And bio-weapons can contaminate an area, look at what happened to the Engineers themselves in their own facility. And in a deleted scene in Prometheus, Captain Janek tells Vickers about a bio-weapon breakout somewhere on Earth, it was in a desert because just like the Engineers, we weren't stupid enough to build it in a populated area, and yet the whole facility got contaminated due to a leak and had to be destroyed along with everyone in it.

It's a lot safer and cleaner to just use an army of acid bleeding scary looking Aliens completely under your thrall rather than a potentially mutative virus that could harbour unpredictable results if you plan on settling the area afterwards.

Biological agents, sure - now. By the time the films are happening, it stands to reason that technology would allow them to be modified to only target certain people or burn out after a designated time. That's stuff which has been worked on since at least the nineties, if not earlier.

But even there, you still have neutron bombs - or chemical warfare. In fact, 'Aliens' show that the Colonial Marines seem to take along not just nuclear weapons, but canisters of nerve gas - just for regular scouting missions. There don't seem to be any political problems with authorising them for use.

And like mentioned before, the psychological aspect. Promising your enemy a quick death isn't as scary as promising to send an army of crawling darkness with your name plastered on its head straight to their doorstep.

When it's at the cost of efficiency, what's the point when you already have weapons which achieve the same result much easier? If you're wiping out entire populations, anyone you're terrorising isn't going to live to tell about it.

But in the end, I would agree that Aliens aren't the perfect and ultimate weapon like some characters in the EU make it out to be. But damn are they effective when unleashed as a surprise attack.

I guess we'd have to wait for "Alien: Invasion" to find out just how it goes.

Yeah, as I say, I'll withhold my judgement until I read it, but if it's literally a case of just being able to control Aliens, it's no better than General Spears' plan. At least his idea was to use them against other Aliens, though. To reclaim Earth from the Alien by using them against one another. There's a sort of logic there.

But using them against humans and Predators? Ehhh... We're two species which have access to really powerful ranged weapons and Aliens can't realistically compete against that. Not if it's open, galactic-wide warfare.

Using an Alien as an assassin, on the other hand... Now, that's something they'd be very good at. A small number of them locating a specific target, evading defences and killing him/her/it. That's what they excel at in urban environments. Very different to using them as an army of doom.

I could also see their brains and sensory abilities possibly being removed/cloned/farmed and placed in some kind of synthetic contraption, to augment robotic abilities (like a kind of ED-209 with a few Alien components inside).

Aliens can't really be compared to tigers, both will easily kill a human, but one does far more damage than the other. Do you see tigers killing a large amount of Colonial Marines? Tigers don't bleed molecular acid either and tigers feel more fear than your average Alien who will gladly die for the Queen.

Don't forget that single aliens can easily sneak into prepared defences such as Number Six or any other Alien you play as in the games and cause a huge amount of casualties. They even know how to cut the power. Plus scaling walls really helps when going through air ducts and stuff, something tigers can't do. 

As for your neutron bomb point, fair enough.

Speaking of bio weapons and chemical warfare, the Rage have a far deadlier weapon than all of this stuff combined.

Spoiler

They can turn your neurons into nanobots that makes you a fanatical loyalist to their cause simply by broadcasting a message across space and time spanning the entire Human Sphere...

Kinda makes you wonder, why do they even bother with the Xenomorphs? Just send some fanatical bullshit and have the people in charge commit mass suicide or something.

It was able to turn completely innocent people into fanatical saboteurs.

[close]

The psychological impact could be something that would deter people from standing against you, or you just want them to be scared shitless as you unleash the Aliens in a twisted sense of cruelty rather than have them go tell others. The Rage are a faction that seems to hate the rest of humanity, so it doesn't seem surprising that they want them to die with terror being the last thing on their minds.

I do agree that Aliens can't really compare against humans and Predators. When you think about it, it's very likely that we'll both prevail against the Aliens by the end of the third book. You just know it'll happen lol. But there'll be lots of casualties for sure. I think what makes Aliens deadly is when you're unprepared, and Predators weren't exactly prepared, but in this book, we find out at the end so we at least know they're coming...

Or do we?

Spoiler

It's left up to us to decide if the message in the last chapter was broadcasted before the Aliens arrived.

[close]

The Alien assassin idea sounds brilliant.

[happypred]

Using hyper-intelligent aliens to guard high-priority assets could also make sense. Their sensory abilities and stealth make them suitable as counter-infiltration weapons

Predator Concrete Jungle and Aliens Music of the Spears touch upon this idea

[Ultramorph]

I finally finished the book, and wow was that an ending! I'll have more thoughts up probably tomorrow, but a few preliminary things that jumped out at me.

Spoiler

I like how the conference with the Yautja was handled, and it was pretty cool when Kalakta touched heads with Palant the same way Ahab did with Elden in Omega.

Mains' line about W-Y having a queen and it not ending well has me interested to see what Lebbon has to say about the prologue.

[close]

I'm quite looking forward to what Lebbon has up his sleeve for the next books.

[The Alien Predator]

I finally finished the book, and wow was that an ending! I'll have more thoughts up probably tomorrow, but a few preliminary things that jumped out at me.

Spoiler

I like how the conference with the Yautja was handled, and it was pretty cool when Kalakta touched heads with Palant the same way Ahab did with Elden in Omega.

Mains' line about W-Y having a queen and it not ending well has me interested to see what Lebbon has to say about the prologue.

[close]

I'm quite looking forward to what Lebbon has up his sleeve for the next books.

Spoiler

The line about the queen and it not ending well made me assume he was talking about the samples they collected after Sea of Sorrows. Which I think is a separate incident from the prologue samples which may or may not have been collected by the USM or a different company seeing as how Weyland-Yutani may have been in bankruptcy at this period.

[close]

[robbritton]

I finally finished the book, and wow was that an ending! I'll have more thoughts up probably tomorrow, but a few preliminary things that jumped out at me.

Spoiler

I like how the conference with the Yautja was handled, and it was pretty cool when Kalakta touched heads with Palant the same way Ahab did with Elden in Omega.

Mains' line about W-Y having a queen and it not ending well has me interested to see what Lebbon has to say about the prologue.

[close]

I'm quite looking forward to what Lebbon has up his sleeve for the next books.

I took it as a nod to the events of Aliens Book One, myself. The use of Yautja seems to validate some of the old DH books, so why not make sly references to others? Loved the

Spoiler

mention of Harrigan and also the use of a familiar name for one of the Fiennes ships! Also really liked to see a post Alien Resurrection book have technology that showed advancement from the original three movies. Like the Preds being a known entity and like that they could be talked to. Seems entirely reasonable so many years since Keyes's team were shown to know about them.

[close]

[The Alien Predator]

I finally finished the book, and wow was that an ending! I'll have more thoughts up probably tomorrow, but a few preliminary things that jumped out at me.

Spoiler

I like how the conference with the Yautja was handled, and it was pretty cool when Kalakta touched heads with Palant the same way Ahab did with Elden in Omega.

Mains' line about W-Y having a queen and it not ending well has me interested to see what Lebbon has to say about the prologue.

[close]

I'm quite looking forward to what Lebbon has up his sleeve for the next books.

I took it as a nod to the events of Aliens Book One, myself. The use of Yautja seems to validate some of the old DH books, so why not make sly references to others? Loved the

Spoiler

mention of Harrigan and also the use of a familiar name for one of the Fiennes ships! Also really liked to see a post Alien Resurrection book have technology that showed advancement from the original three movies. Like the Preds being a known entity and like that they could be talked to. Seems entirely reasonable so many years since Keyes's team were shown to know about them.

[close]

Spoiler

I wondered, how the heck did Predators know Harrigan had dark skin? 

I also liked everything you listed. This is my favourite book I've read so far out of anything. I too loved the advancement and world building.

I also loved that Yautja advanced as well. They never showed much progress for thousands of years (as we see in AvP), but that's because they're the best at what they do!

But steal their cloaking and become equal?

Oh no you don't! They improve their tech and come back with something better within a week or so. 

I also liked how Hashori designed her own cloaking device on the ship. And how Yautja in general are very competent and independent when it comes to making technology and build their own ships personally or so the humans speculate. They're structured and treated so differently from us and I loved it!

[close]