Is The Beast Cooked? (And Alien and Predator Under The House That Mickey Built) - AvPGalaxy Podcast #58

[kant]

And people who hate Covenant are now plebs. Good to know 

[grootsuit]

since it's pretty clear r.s. has no idea what to do with the beast, pass it over to people who have some ideas

[tleilaxu]

Yeah, all those questions are easy to answer, more or less with some minor speculation. I agree that the greatest thing about the prequels are the new opportunities and ideas we have for exploration in the universe. The ending of Covenant was great IMO, not only tonally, but for future exploration of xenomorphs on different planets.
The most dominant theme in these prequels is can be summed up by David himself: Doesn't everyone want there parents dead?
Even though I would've liked to see more of David's lab and his experiments, my only disappointment with him being the creator of the alien is that it's not an ancient creature anymore and it throws out all the novels and comics that reference to the alien as that. It makes the extended universe so much smaller now. We have new opportunities and greater themes, but at the moment with these two prequels, none of those ideas are getting explored enough IMO.

I think we still have great potential where we are now, I just believe someone needs to take care of the franchise so it doesn't get more logically convoluted.

But you know, all could be fixed with time travel...  (kidding, I hope they stay far away from that!)

Yep you have a good point. Many people here probably grew up with all those comics, video-games, fan-fics etc. and they built up a big head-canon and idea of what the franchise was and then Ridley who is probably not aware of this extended universe at all just comes along and renders them non-canon in a fundamental way. I can see why somebody might get upset over that.

[Scorpio]

The implication is a chest burster came out of him.

Watch this scene again:

Ridley Scott explicitly showed us what happens when the black goo gets loose.  You can see forms bursting out from the bodies.  No 'chestbursters'.

Yep you have a good point. Many people here probably grew up with all those comics, video-games, fan-fics etc. and they built up a big head-canon and idea of what the franchise was and then Ridley who is probably not aware of this extended universe at all just comes along and renders them non-canon in a fundamental way. I can see why somebody might get upset over that.

Good point.

So people who like Covenant are now apologists. Good grief   

Haters gonna hate.

[Dabaus]

Friend, after fiefield and biology bro look at the engineer that's had the assumed chest burster come out of it, the caption of the ship, yanek, or whatever tells them he's getting readings of a life form. At this point us the audiance member is supposed to assume that it should possibly the alien we are familiar with because that's exactly what that scene was implying. It ends up being an engineer but at the time it's supposed to make us think something else. Furthermore, one of the deleted scenes shows fielfield picking up the shed skin on a exonorph.
      Your jumping through hoops or being purposely dense if you genuinely believe Ridley had this black GOo IS the chest burster thought all along. He implied it was a chest burster, somewhere along the line he decided to retcon Prometheus and what we got was convent. It's really not that complicated

[Alionic]

Friend, after fiefield and biology bro look at the engineer that's had the assumed chest burster come out of it, the caption of the ship, yanek, or whatever tells them he's getting readings of a life form. At this point us the audiance member is supposed to assume that it should possibly the alien we are familiar with because that's exactly what that scene was implying. It ends up being an engineer but at the time it's supposed to make us think something else.

Settle down, kiddo. It was probably neomorphs or deacons which bursted from those Engineers.

Also, Hicks was the classiest person on the podcast.

[SM]

Genuinely surprised by the amount of alien covenant apologists.

Why would you be surprised that people on an Alien fansite might like an Alien movie?

Prometheus- Fiefield and biology bro find pile of dead engineers. Biology bro explicitly states it looks like something came out of him. The implication is a chest burster came out of him.

That pile of dead Engineers shows some with hole in their head or no hole in their chest.

Alien: Eggs on the derilect ship with a space jockey that also had a chest burster come out of it. If the 2000 crew members on the covenant ship are somehow turned into the eggs on the derilect ship and David is the space jockey, I'm out man.

There's no need to pretend that you're not already out.

We can argue all day how we feel the franchise is going but based off the tepid response covenant had at the box office, the divisive nature of the film, and the retconning of certain story elements, a large portion of alien fans aren't happy with it either.

According the fans of this site, the majority were pretty happy with it.

But don't let that get in the way of a narrative.

Yep you have a good point. Many people here probably grew up with all those comics, video-games, fan-fics etc. and they built up a big head-canon and idea of what the franchise was and then Ridley who is probably not aware of this extended universe at all just comes along and renders them non-canon in a fundamental way. I can see why somebody might get upset over that.

Most of us around when the comics were popular in the 1990s realised they were non-canon 20 years ago.

Your jumping through hoops or being purposely dense if you genuinely believe Ridley had this black GOo IS the chest burster thought all along. He implied it was a chest burster, somewhere along the line he decided to retcon Prometheus and what we got was convent. It's really not that complicated

It's meant to make us think "chestburster".  It's not intended to be a literal chestburster.

Via hyperbole and heavy doses of salt.

[Dabaus]

@ SM:
Believe it or not you can be a fan of something but not love the current direction it's going. I hate the phantom menace but still love Star Wars. I love all the alien movies including Prometheus. Alien covenant is in my opinion an absolute pile of trash. If your fine that David is the creator of the alien retconning 20 plus years of lore, be it extended universe or interviews Ridley himself stated  in the past good for you. I care about the franchise, as I'm sure you do too, so it performing badly at the box office matters. Fans opinions matter because they're the ones who go to the movies. If your happy with with the prequels trajectory good for you. Happy thanksgiving to yours and yours.

[SM]

Believe it or not you can be a fan of something but not love the current direction it's going.

I didn't suggest otherwise.

As I said earlier...

Of course you're not obliged to like what they ultimately did.

What lore do you believe is being retconned?

And I don't celebrate Thanksgiving, but thanks anyway.

[Huggs]

"It was probably neomorphs or deacons which bursted from those Engineers."

Yep. The deacon's cry can be heard as the recording begins, just before the engineer holographs run down the tunnel. The alien events at the base (I might add) would've made a very interesting short story, if anyone from titan reads this. At least we could get a written description of the deacon's methods and power.


" I think we still have great potential where we are now".

I agree, but only if Ridley, the entire writers staff, and the entire prometheus storyline is let go. We're nearing the precipice. I think with these movies fox and ridley have fallen into that rhythm where (like in the NFL) a team has one bad season after another, and instead of making any changes, the coach just keeps saying "well there's a lot I've seen that we can build on, and uh we've seen some things we can work with so we're gonna work on building on that".

Perhaps this just wasn't meant to be a wide universe. It may only be divisive right now, but divisive is still not what you want. And if money talks, the divide is gonna reach the point where fox loses money on one of these movies and the xeno will go dormant. Some movies, you just know what to expect. Jaws, Godzilla or terminator films, they're out to bring a specific experience, and that's okay. Sometimes just letting the monster do its thing is enough. I think we should get back to that with the xenomorph. It can be the trapdoor spider of the universe.

[skhellter]

The Derelict in LV426 is gonna be exactly what it looks like...

Some Engineers run into David, David introduces them to his new pets.
Engineers get rekt, escape in their Juggernaut, they send a distress beacon,
a chestburster pops out, kills the pilot and the ship crashes on LV426.
A queen has fun filling the cargo holds full of eggs.

They all lie in wait until the Nostromo picks up the distress signal.

Simples

David still probably out there, somewhere?

Gimme a Ripley 8 vs David 8 movie. 

[Munkeywrench]

David still probably out there, somewhere?

Ive even wondered if maybe Ash is actually David. I'm probably way off.

[Paranoid Android]

Genuinely surprised by the amount of alien covenant apologists.

Welcome to the hater camp, brother!

Always nice to have another joiner to our ever growing ranks. Do not despair by the unusual support Covenant gets around here; You're in the equivalent of The Matrix's Zion, and it too shall soon be overrun (possibly sooner than you'd think if Ridley Scott is allowed to keep publicly talking about his prequels).


Hope you enjoy your stay! Here is your complimentary pitchfork and David shaped toilet bowl.

I'll show you the secret handshake later!

[SM]

Gimme a Ripley 8 vs David 8 movie.

With these guys.

[GreybackElder]

I do not believe the beast cooked. If it was would we even be having this discussion? Would there be hundreds of books and comics about the creature? Or movies and games? For me the biggest problem is that the direction the prequels took for the origin of the species . I've always felt the alien was an ancient horror found in the furthest reaches of space. Not the creation of an Android(although I do realize the novelized version explains that it was in fact the engineers who made the xenos and David simply copied the recipe) weather or not R.S acknowledges this is another story. He could correct this divide among many of us if he simply says this in AC 2. I felt alien covenant was a decent movie overall. I felt the Xeno was almost an after thought of his. I'm not sure he's passionate about the xeno anymore but that doesn't mean WE aren't.