Has AvPR improved wih age?

[proto leech]

It insults the audience by turning both great science-fiction series into a B-movie-esque slasher film

I'd say a B movie is far too generous.

[Perfect-Organism]

No one wants to admit the technology shown in Prometheus was inconsistent? 

There were at least several threads addressing that issue before Prometheus came out.  There are at least two threads I've made myself where that point has been brought up and discussed. 

But that doesn't even matter, because I'll definitely admit they've made mistakes with Prometheus (doesn't really support your point because I don't like Prometheus, but yes, I'll admit it).

Look, even if you brought up some plot hole in a film I do like, I believe that if a fan really loves a movie they would accept the mistakes (not defend with drivel ad hoc explanations).  Many times, movies can make up for the mistakes,  if the material transcends them.  Maybe a plot contrivance can be overlooked because the film is trying to say something, make a point. 

What point does AvP-R try to make?  That the government doesn't lie?

No, AvP-R cannot transcend its mistakes because it is kind of like a movie composed of mistakes. 

It bastardizes the Alien series, making the Aliens themselves pathetically weak in regards to fighting a single Predator and the mopey town residents of Gunnison.  It insults the audience by turning both great science-fiction series into a B-movie-esque slasher film, tastelessly killing pregnant women for shock value (NO.  Believe it or not, gore, killing a kid or killing pregnant women does not equal tension).  On the "human side" of the movie, the actors do little to bring any life to already uninteresting characters and uninteresting lines from a terrible script.  Yes, because a government would really nuke an entire town.  Real smart writing, there!  Totally believable motivations and outcome, huh?  That aside, it's not even made well on a cinematographic level - the lighting is abhorrent and the suits are probably the great ADI at their absolute worst.  The Aliens have a laughable overbite and look cheap as hell.  Even Wolf's face looks like a mask from a dollar store.  It's title doesn't even make sense, it was chosen to capitalize on its "R" rating.  There is like nothing genuine about this movie!

It's like every facet of this movie was made to either shamelessly copy or insult aspects of the Alien and Predator series.  AvP-R offers nothing new, nothing interesting, just tired cliches and no, AvP-R will not improve with time, because from basic concept to final execution it is just not good.

I agree with you mostly.  That about sums it up.  I do like Prometheus and I find myself overlooking some of its glaring flaws.  But AVPR just does not deserve that.  About the only thing interesting was the introduction of Ms. Yutani, but that is basically being retconned it seems.  The absolute nadir of the film if not the entire series was the attack on the pregnant woman.  How I wish I could unsee that...

[predxeno]

I'm not defending the movie (though I do enjoy it), I'm just pointing out that trying to make a bigger case out of the whole Predator-skinning-a-human bit is pointless in itself because it is so trivial.  Regardless, Wolf came to eradicate the Aliens but a human caught him doing it, so the Predator killed him and then decided that since the human was already did he would skin him as well.  Wolf spending a few minutes to skin a corpse is perfectly believable under the circumstances, it's not like he went on a sidetrack and spent hours hunting humans instead of doing his job of eradicating Aliens.

[Perfect-Organism]

I'm not defending the movie (though I do enjoy it), I'm just pointing out that trying to make a bigger case out of the whole Predator-skinning-a-human bit is pointless in itself because it is so trivial.  Regardless, Wolf came to eradicate the Aliens but a human caught him doing it, so the Predator killed him and then decided that since the human was already did he would skin him as well.  Wolf spending a few minutes to skin a corpse is perfectly believable under the circumstances, it's not like he went on a sidetrack and spent hours hunting humans instead of doing his job of eradicating Aliens.

Yeah, maybe Wolf figured he'd get a nice souvenir for his wife..

[SiL]

Wolf is an experienced Alien hunter, so he knew the general gist of their tactics and such; just like how Ripley knew to find the Runner hanging around in the prison's basement.

Ripley knew where the prison "basement" was, Wolf didn't know where the sewer was, or if they were in a cave, or any of a dozen other potential spots.

Wolf skinning the corpse made sense when it was written in the first draft, because he wasn't here to clean up Aliens. Later it was stupid fanservice.

[predxeno]

The whole point is moot, as demonstrated earlier, characters do stupid things all the time in movies however if the movie is successful then no one cares but if the movie is a flop then suddenly the critics scream like a gang of banshees.

[MrSpaceJockey]

You haven't demonstrated anything. Name a critically acclaimed Alien  or Predator film that has a mistake like the Wolf skinning a human nonsense.  You keep defending this again and again but when we prove a point, rather than acknowledge it,  you start screaming like a banshee about how all movies have stupid things and only flops get called out for it. 

AvP-R wasn't some poor victim in this situation, okay? It gets called out on because it's mistakes are so blatantly clear. Because it's a shit movie.  I might as well copy and paste my last response.  The one about being able to accept flaws if a movie can transcend those flaws!

[predxeno]

Here are a bunch of examples to feast on:

1. In Alien, when Dallas refuses to obey quarantine, no one cares that his stupidity costs almost the entire crew their lives.

2. In Prometheus, nobody is saying Charlie Holloway's decision to remove his helmet on the planet is stupid enough to bash the whole movie for it.

3. In James Cameron's Avatar, Jake Sully decides that right before an attack on the Na'vi village, he should tell the truth about his deception and betrayal of their people.  Right at the time when he needs them to trust him the most, he is convinced telling them he screwed them over is a good idea.

4. In Jurassic World when the I-Rex goes missing, instead of checking the entire cage first, our heroes fall for the oldest trick in the prison escape book and open the cage with the captive still in it.

If the movie is a success then nobody cares about a character's stupidity, if the movie is a flop then everyone suddenly has a voice.

[MrSpaceJockey]

Wow.  Just wow.  Really?

First off, do you know what critically acclaimed means?  You know, to be well received ("acclaimed: to be praised enthusiastically and publicly") by critics (hence "critically")? 

I know we are speaking in general terms here, but with so much subjectivity at hand, generality is what is needed to narrow down your strange choices in film to picks that actually fit the bill of what I asked you.  Which pretty much leaves us with ALIEN, because no, Prometheus was not 'critically acclaimed' and no, not even being a commercial box-office success equals critically acclamation either.  Sorry, Jurassic World.

So, regarding ALIEN, Dallas doesn't obey quarantine because he's panicking about an alien life-form that has just attached to Kane.  He was forced to make one decision or another, so he chose the one he saw gave him the best opportunity to save Kane's life.  So, even while being under immense pressure, lest we forget, Dallas made a call he saw fit for the time.  There's a followup conversation with Ripley (as well as a followup conversation between Ripley and Ash) that further solidify these points. 

No one cares about his "stupidity" because A) that wasn't stupidity, it's actually pretty easy to see how he came to his own decision and B) he did not commit those acts intending to unleash a killer extraterrestrial lifeforms onto the Nostromo, so no, no one is tries to single out that scene for the ensuing carnage (which was more Ash's fault in that scene, anyway).

So no, that really isn't anything like Wolf skinning that human.

But I think you are also misinterpreting what I (and some others) have been saying.  No, despite what you seem to think and said under #2

"nobody is saying Charlie Holloway's decision to remove his helmet on the planet is stupid enough to bash the whole movie for it

we are not bashing a movie, in this case AvP-R, because of a single plot stupidity, in this case Wolf wasting time to skin a human being during a critical mission.  Rather, we're saying that's one of many stupid plot points - hell, it's you constantly defending that detail that has led to this long-winded back on forth on the issue. 

Quit it with the selective reading.

[HuDaFuK]

1. In Alien, when Dallas refuses to obey quarantine, no one cares that his stupidity costs almost the entire crew their lives.

Ripley begs to differ.

2. In Prometheus, nobody is saying Charlie Holloway's decision to remove his helmet on the planet is stupid enough to bash the whole movie for it.

Literally everyone has complained about how idiotic that was.

3. In James Cameron's Avatar, Jake Sully decides that right before an attack on the Na'vi village, he should tell the truth about his deception and betrayal of their people.  Right at the time when he needs them to trust him the most, he is convinced telling them he screwed them over is a good idea.

It's called coming clean.

4. In Jurassic World when the I-Rex goes missing, instead of checking the entire cage first, our heroes fall for the oldest trick in the prison escape book and open the cage with the captive still in it.

I've called that film on its stupid moments since it came out.

[windebieste]

Has the passing of time been kind enough to improve this movie?  That's a good question.  So I just watched it to find out and here's my take on it:

This movie is terrible.  It has no pace.  No style.  No rhythm.  No sophistication.  The story is nothing particularly outstanding.  It's characters are lame.  The lighting is poor. The Aliens look awful (when you can see them).  Wolf is a super antihero who can do no wrong - and that's an oxymoron on its own.  Chet the Rastafalien is a joke. There's no satisfying resolution between them before the whole town gets nuked.  It's loaded with unnecessary homages to the previous films for no greater benefit.  The horror elements are moments of gratuitous bad taste just for the sake of it.  The action sequences are a travesty.  Why anyone likes this disappointing piece of cinematic junk and thinks it is any good is beyond me. 

This movie has no merit.  It's garbage.  It's inane.  It's idiotic.  'ALIEN: Resurrection' is a better movie than this mal-formed and mis-shapen thing - and that's saying something!

It sucks knobs.  It always did.  It always will. 

RATING: 1/10  (It gets a single point for being short as that's the only good thing this movie has to offer.)

-Windebieste.

[426Buddy]

I can understand if someone likes the movie because they think its sooo bad that its good. In the same way I like crappy horror movies. But I dont understand how anyone could truly consider it have any real quality.

[predxeno]

1. In Alien, when Dallas refuses to obey quarantine, no one cares that his stupidity costs almost the entire crew their lives.

Ripley begs to differ.

2. In Prometheus, nobody is saying Charlie Holloway's decision to remove his helmet on the planet is stupid enough to bash the whole movie for it.

Literally everyone has complained about how idiotic that was.

3. In James Cameron's Avatar, Jake Sully decides that right before an attack on the Na'vi village, he should tell the truth about his deception and betrayal of their people.  Right at the time when he needs them to trust him the most, he is convinced telling them he screwed them over is a good idea.

It's called coming clean.

4. In Jurassic World when the I-Rex goes missing, instead of checking the entire cage first, our heroes fall for the oldest trick in the prison escape book and open the cage with the captive still in it.

I've called that film on its stupid moments since it came out.

You're missing the point, characters do stupid things all the time and regardless if the movie was popular or not, one little technicality isn't sufficient to sink the entire film.

[MrSpaceJockey]

How many times do we have to say that's not the only fault of AvP-R?

[predxeno]

I readily acknowledge that AVPR is more indulgent on gore and violence than previous films and that the cast resembles a typical teen slasher flick but I also acknowledge that at best, a one minute scene is at best a subordinate reason to hate the movie and not a primary one.  Besides, I know why that scene was included in the film; by the time the Aliens land, they have acided a man's arm off, impregnated 4 people, and Chet ruthlessly killed a helpless homeless woman.  As a result, Wolf was given some action sequences of his own where he kills and then skins a human being; this is needed in the film to help balance the amount of screen time Wolf has in comparison to the other stars of the film, the Aliens.  If the skin job were to be deleted from the film then the Aliens would have had drastically more focus (on their own actions) then their Predator counterpart which isn't a good idea for a a film titled Aliens vs. Predator where each star deserves its own fair share of action.