Prometheus and Alien: Ridley Scott’s feeling for flutes

[bb-15]

Prometheus and Covenant both have very simple narratives. There's nothing artsy or complex about either plot.

For you obviously it was simple. (For someone who appreciates art films such as from Fellini, Bergman, Kubrick, & Lynch, Ridley's artsy science fiction is pretty easy to follow.) 
- But from over a 1000 of discussions I've had about "Prometheus" on IMDb many viewers didn't understand lots of it.

We are not all the same in terms of our experiences and film knowledge. The viewer brings that with them when they watch a movie.
- For instance I know about Agatha Christie's "And then There Were None" which was a very influential in the mystery/horror genre.
I immediately recognized in "Prometheus" that the Weyland character (with David as an accomplice) was patterned after the killer in Agatha Christie's story.
For lots of people they didn't have a clue about what was going on with Weyland because it wasn't spelled out enough for them.

Artsy doesn't have to equal crap (Prometheus); but it can indeed make films that are both excellent and perplexing to the average audience.
(Under The Skin, Mulholland Drive)

Keep Alien weird.

For my taste I found "Under The Skin" easy to follow and ultimately I was bored with it. The director used visuals/accents to obscure a simple story about aliens trapping humans for food (and where an alien seems to be having a bad day).

"Mulholland Drive" is brilliant in its dream sequences but adapting that style to hard science fiction requires a lot more solid narrative.
An example would be "2001" where artsy elements are injected into sections which are grounded in a fairly clear story.

An example of popular / mainstream science fiction is to look at Spielberg's science fiction, "Minority Report" or "Jurassic Park" where everything is spelled out.
Contrast that with "Blade Runner" (Director's Cut) or "Prometheus" where the reasons for events often are not spelled out.

[The Old One]

Blade Runner the original yes, but Prometheus' vagueness in major part comes from throwing disparate and sometimes contradictory elements at the wall to see what sticks, it lets the viewer make something worthwhile of the story.

The problem is with Prometheus these elements don't follow a through line like in Blade Runner, that are logically entertwined in the world it presents.

Despite Prometheus' failure to be a well written Blade Runner/ 2001 equivalent in the Alien mythology.
I still think it's more admirable to try using Alien to make more of an "arthouse" subtle, film rather than making something more straightforward.

[Huggs]

I still think it's more admirable to try using Alien to make more of an "arthouse" subtle, film rather than making something more straightforward.

We've had 2 admirable tries. I want to be able to say "damn that was a good Alien movie" again. 

[The Old One]

It's possible to do both.

I don't want Alien to become the superhero genre as it is currently, where I can look at a trailer and go;

"That looks good, it'll probably be alright; I feel like I've already seen it."

Alien has always had creative auteurs behind the camera at it's best. The worst thing it could do would be to go the focus group, safe route.

[bb-15]

Despite Prometheus' failure to be a well written Blade Runner/ 2001 equivalent in the Alien mythology.
I still think it's more admirable to try using Alien to make more of an "arthouse" subtle, film rather than making something more straightforward.

Agreed. "Prometheus" is not at the level of "Blade Runner" or "2001" (which I rank very high in my science fiction film list).
- But the answers and questions presented in "Prometheus" opened up the Alien franchise in terms of story ideas.
It gets the franchise out of basing films on monster hunts.

Blade Runner the original yes,

That's another debate which I don't want to go too far with; which is better, "Blade Runner" theatrical cut or Director's Cut.
Not surprisingly for my taste I prefer the Director's Cut.
But when I first introduce "Blade Runner" to someone, I play the theatrical cut because the narration does so much guiding of the audience making the film more accessible.

but Prometheus' vagueness in major part comes from throwing disparate and sometimes contradictory elements at the wall to see what sticks, it lets the viewer make something worthwhile of the story.

Partly true imo.
"Jurassic Park" also has different elements; two introduction scenes and a character who gets lost on an island he has worked at for years which has one road splitting into two roads.
- What's the difference? Spielberg has "Jurassic Park" explain everything all the way through the film. Nedrey in detail is shown getting lost.
The dialogue from the game keeper, Nedrey, the Mr. DNA cartoon, Dr. Grant, Malcolm and Dr. Sadler predict and explain the movie.
- With all of that help, the audience doesn't have to work to follow "Jurassic Park".
- But with science fiction (except for "The Martian") Ridley does not use that very explained style.

The problem is with Prometheus these elements don't follow a through line like in Blade Runner, that are logically entertwined in the world it presents.

Well, "Prometheus" is showing a bigger world than "Blade Runner".
Still "Blade Runner" has story ideas which are also used in "Prometheus".
- Role reversal;
BR; Roy Batty starts as a villain and becomes a hero.
BR; Tyrell begins as a just a CEO and later seems more like a villain.
Pro; Weyland starts as a benevolent company leader and becomes a villain.

- Human traits and AI;
BR; To the viewer Rachel begins as a human but she turns out to be artificially created.
It is also strongly hinted in the Director's Cut that Deckard is a replicant.
Pro; David starts as a fairly emotionless android but he has more human traits like holding a grudge (when he poisons Holloway). "Covenant" expands on David's emotions.

** Finally, I came across a video of old "Alien" sequel ideas from 1979/early 80s. (See below.)
It looks like Jon Spaihts reviewed these story concepts and put them in his "Prometheus" scripts.
(Part of the crew is stranded in the Derelict while weathering a storm, they are attacked by aliens and Space Jockeys make an appearance.)



https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=S2Dr5LtaQRM&t=525s

[The Old One]

Blade Runner The Final Cut is Blade Runner perfected.

No other cut of Blade Runner should be bothered with IMO.
They're all attempts to reach a vision, which the Final Cut is the culmination of.