Dark Horse To Reboot Comic Series

[PRJ_since1990]

There's a lot of Christian symbolism througout, in terms of crucifix imagery (the shape of the Betty or Call falling into the water after being shot by Wren) the shape of the Auriga docking bays and how they recall a a cathedral shape, Ripley's arms folded over her chest in the cloning tank in the same way a non-Catholic would receive a blessing during communion (Call crosses herself in the chapel but Ripley doesn't), the number 8 being the number of renewal and new beginnings, Ripley's 'stigmata' with Call's knife.

With the monomyth thing, Ressurection hits a number of beats:
Refusal of the Return - Ripley's general disinterest in the events early on in the film.
Magic Flight - Escape from the Aliens smashing into her cell using the 'boon' (ie. her Alien biology)
Rescue from without - Call coaxing out Ripley's humanity
Crossing the return threshold - Possibly Ripley shooting the Alien's head off and siding with the humans
Master of two worlds - The Newborn siding with Ripley rather than the Queen and how Ripley uses that to ultimately destroy it
Freedom to live - Pretty obvious

Now, I'm not saying that any of this is intentional, and it doesn't stop it being a flawed film.  But, as I said, there you go.

Huh that's cool that you made those distinctions. So do you like it for those reasons or do the flaws hurt it more, in your opinion?

-Alien acid will conveniently not burn away the environment should the producer/director not want it to

The thing is, that was true of all the movies even before 'AvP'.

In theory, yes, but on screen, I would argue that the movies all respected this piece of lore that was established in the original film. That is, which of the 4 Alien movies had a scene where the acid blood was anything less than acidic? AvPR in particular had a few scenes where the Alien blood had no effect on the area where it landed (presumably, we can't see every detail, darkness notwithstanding). 

[SM]

Huh that's cool that you made those distinctions. So do you like it for those reasons or do the flaws hurt it more, in your opinion?

I've always liked the movie in spite of it's flaws (the main one being lack of tension).  But after reading Campbell some years ago, some of the Hero's Journey stuff starts to emerge - or at least the viewer begins to apply it.

But you have to have some interest in the film to begin with.  If you hate Resurrection, this other stuff isn't going to make you suddenly like it.

[Xenomrph]

In theory, yes, but on screen, I would argue that the movies all respected this piece of lore that was established in the original film. That is, which of the 4 Alien movies had a scene where the acid blood was anything less than acidic? AvPR in particular had a few scenes where the Alien blood had no effect on the area where it landed (presumably, we can't see every detail, darkness notwithstanding). 

There's a bunch of scenes where the Alien acid is incredibly potent, arguably moreso than in any other movie in the series. The only scene in AvPR I can think of where the acid didn't have an apparent effect was when the Predalien spit up acid after Wolf yanked its inner jaw out at the very end, but I wrote that off as artistic license/Wolf being seconds away from dying and not giving a shit.

Meanwhile in 'Aliens' we see that Alien acid can go through multiple floors of metal grating ("Looks like someone bagged one of Ripley's bad guys") and melt Drake's face off in seconds, but when Hicks blows one's head off with a shotgun and gets acid on Hudson's arm it's hardly even debilitating for him, and later in the movie Hicks takes a face (and chest) full of acid in the elevator and he survives it. Likewise, who knows what circumstances caused the acid-hole through multiple floors, but it evidently wasn't explosives and gunfire because we see that happen all over the place in the Ops battle with no acid damage to anyone or anything we can see.

In 'Alien' 1 drop of facehugger blood is enough to go through several decks, but when the Alien takes a speargun shot to the stomach, the acid has no effect.
Although in its defense I'm more than willing to accept that facehugger blood is more potent than adult Alien blood (it even follows a real-world trend where the "venom" of adolescent animals is more potent than that of adults, as a defense mechanism), and that at that point in the series the creators may not have intended for the adult Alien to have acid blood like the facehugger did.

In 'Alien3', the Alien spits acid in Murphy's face and completely ruins his shit, but at the end of the movie when the thing literally explodes, there's no visible effect of the acid on anything at all.

In 'Alien Resurrection', an Alien bleeding goes through multiple decks (and sets the others loose), but when Ripley puts a gun in one's mouth and blows its head off, there's no apparent effect of the acid on anything (nor is there when Johner makes one's head explode on the ladder).

My point is the acid's effect has always been inconsistent, in every movie.

[SM]

In theory, yes, but on screen, I would argue that the movies all respected this piece of lore that was established in the original film. That is, which of the 4 Alien movies had a scene where the acid blood was anything less than acidic? AvPR in particular had a few scenes where the Alien blood had no effect on the area where it landed (presumably, we can't see every detail, darkness notwithstanding). 

Acid is as nasty as the scene demands.  If an Alien gets shot and it doesn't matter where the acid hits - the won't bother showing it.  Doesn't make is less acidic.  However shoot an Alien up close - then it becomes relevant.

[PRJ_since1990]

In theory, yes, but on screen, I would argue that the movies all respected this piece of lore that was established in the original film. That is, which of the 4 Alien movies had a scene where the acid blood was anything less than acidic? AvPR in particular had a few scenes where the Alien blood had no effect on the area where it landed (presumably, we can't see every detail, darkness notwithstanding). 

There's a bunch of scenes where the Alien acid is incredibly potent, arguably moreso than in any other movie in the series. The only scene in AvPR I can think of where the acid didn't have an apparent effect was when the Predalien spit up acid after Wolf yanked its inner jaw out at the very end, but I wrote that off as artistic license/Wolf being seconds away from dying and not giving a shit.

Meanwhile in 'Aliens' we see that Alien acid can go through multiple floors of metal grating ("Looks like someone bagged one of Ripley's bad guys") and melt Drake's face off in seconds, but when Hicks blows one's head off with a shotgun and gets acid on Hudson's arm it's hardly even debilitating for him, and later in the movie Hicks takes a face (and chest) full of acid in the elevator and he survives it. Likewise, who knows what circumstances caused the acid-hole through multiple floors, but it evidently wasn't explosives and gunfire because we see that happen all over the place in the Ops battle with no acid damage to anyone or anything we can see.

In 'Alien' 1 drop of facehugger blood is enough to go through several decks, but when the Alien takes a speargun shot to the stomach, the acid has no effect.
Although in its defense I'm more than willing to accept that facehugger blood is more potent than adult Alien blood (it even follows a real-world trend where the "venom" of adolescent animals is more potent than that of adults, as a defense mechanism), and that at that point in the series the creators may not have intended for the adult Alien to have acid blood like the facehugger did.

In 'Alien3', the Alien spits acid in Murphy's face and completely ruins his shit, but at the end of the movie when the thing literally explodes, there's no visible effect of the acid on anything at all.

In 'Alien Resurrection', an Alien bleeding goes through multiple decks (and sets the others loose), but when Ripley puts a gun in one's mouth and blows its head off, there's no apparent effect of the acid on anything (nor is there when Johner makes one's head explode on the ladder).

My point is the acid's effect has always been inconsistent, in every movie.

The first scene I think of is when Kelly shoots one that's on the helicopter and there's no sign of the blood doing anything, even though it presumably spilled all over the copter. Although, had they not survived, I wouldn't have cared either way lol

I would say in Alien, the spear tip shoots into the creature and sticks, not creating a hole such that a bullet would when shot through it. No exit hole. Coupled with the fact that the void of space was pulling everything not tied down out of the Narcissus, any blood as a result of the injury would have been removed immediately. For all intents and purposes, Big Chap might have well not had acidic blood since he was never injured during the film (even though the ADF novelization has a scene where it loses a limb and the damage is significant to the Nostromo).

Aliens, yeah you make a good point. It's rather inconsistent in that it'll melt faces and arms but won't kill everyone. My only thought would be the amount of acid was more in Drake's case than Hick's or Hudson's.

Alien3... would the acid even bother the massive lead works anyways? Would it have begun to boil and evaporate even in the Dog Alien's final moments? Personally, I don't think so.

A:R, both Alien deaths involve head shots, right? Take it for what it's worth, but the comics/novels point out that the marines in certain stories are told to specifically avoid shooting the torsos, to try to go for knee shots and finish with head shots to avoid acid splash. I'm not saying they don't have acid blood in their heads but I would argue it's to a lesser extent/potency.

In theory, yes, but on screen, I would argue that the movies all respected this piece of lore that was established in the original film. That is, which of the 4 Alien movies had a scene where the acid blood was anything less than acidic? AvPR in particular had a few scenes where the Alien blood had no effect on the area where it landed (presumably, we can't see every detail, darkness notwithstanding). 

Acid is as nasty as the scene demands.  If an Alien gets shot and it doesn't matter where the acid hits - the won't bother showing it.  Doesn't make is less acidic.  However shoot an Alien up close - then it becomes relevant.

I would agree with you SM. Overall, I find that the ALIEN films actually portray the acidic blood being deadly/destructive with minimal lapse where the AvP films, AvPR especially, does not, to the point where the scene makes no sense when you realize the acid should have done something and didn't due to convenience. For example, Dallas should have died when he blasted the Xeno with the stolen Predator pistol into the air and the shards rained down over him. 

[SM]

The lack of acid damage when the Predator got showered in it was mindbogglingly dumb.  Same when he stomped on the Aliens head.

[happypred]

I disliked TWW a lot when it first came out, but on re-reading it.... I still like it the least out of the 3 2009 series that came out

IMO TWW was a mess of a series. Random human/pred team up,Machiko killing preds with one blow, using karete against xenos,ETC.

I think the allying of Machiko with the Predators in TWW was some vain attempt to pay homage to the original AVP comics, which was pretty stupid; a new entry into a series needs to make its own footprint, not step into one that was made decades back.

Do we agree that TWW's art is atrocious?

[predxeno]

Do we agree that TWW's art is atrocious?

I never really paid attention to that; the plot was my main focus.

[Xenomrph]

I disliked TWW a lot when it first came out, but on re-reading it.... I still like it the least out of the 3 2009 series that came out

IMO TWW was a mess of a series. Random human/pred team up,Machiko killing preds with one blow, using karete against xenos,ETC.

I think the allying of Machiko with the Predators in TWW was some vain attempt to pay homage to the original AVP comics, which was pretty stupid; a new entry into a series needs to make its own footprint, not step into one that was made decades back.

Do we agree that TWW's art is atrocious?

TWW's art was pretty f**king bad. However I seem to recall reading that they actually cleaned the art up a bit between the single-issue release and the trade-paperback release. I've got both, but I've only read the TPB recently. The art in the TPB is still pretty bad, though.

[StrangeShape]

When Dallas shoots the omplaloopmpamorph who is hovering right above him with a predator gun, he doesnt get any acid damage or acid on him at all

[happypred]

I never really paid attention to that; the plot was my main focus.

A comic book's art kinda affects my experience of the story

A bad plot can be partially saved by incredible art and vice versa...TWW was bad story + bad art = steaming turd

TWW's art was pretty f**king bad. However I seem to recall reading that they actually cleaned the art up a bit between the single-issue release and the trade-paperback release. I've got both, but I've only read the TPB recently. The art in the TPB is still pretty bad, though.

Let's put it this way...if the new AvP series has art like TWW, I will not be pleased

Dunno if you guys are with me on this, but Civilised Beasts has pretty good art, not phenomenal, but solid

[PRJ_since1990]

The lack of acid damage when the Predator got showered in it was mindbogglingly dumb.  Same when he stomped on the Aliens head.

Exactly. It wouldn't be so bad had we seen him don some kind of acid-proof armor but we had no indication of it. We must assume that he had no additional protection. To the films discredit, as if it needed more.

[happypred]

There's a bunch of scenes where the Alien acid is incredibly potent, arguably moreso than in any other movie in the series. The only scene in AvPR I can think of where the acid didn't have an apparent effect was when the Predalien spit up acid after Wolf yanked its inner jaw out at the very end, but I wrote that off as artistic license/Wolf being seconds away from dying and not giving a shit.

It wasn't so much that the acid splattered onto Wolf and failed to burn him, it was that the acid seemed to somehow miss Wolf as it flowed out of the predalien's mouth. Instead of squirting horizontally into Wolf's face, the stream of acid conveniently flowed down toward the ground.

Another possibility (although this one is a bit doubtful) is that the Strause bros were inspired by AvP Prey:

Yeyinde held his head high as `A'ni-de traced a claw wet with Hard Meat thwei in the space between his eyes. He ignored the sharp sting as the acid thwei cut into his flesh to mingle with his own blood, blood that neutralized much of the Hard Meat's power. The burning mark was proof of his skill and his adulthood, a jagged etched badge for all to see......The warrior dipped one claw into the alien blood and then spat on the claw. His own blood mixed with the alien's acidic ichor. That was part of it. His blood would partly neutralize the potent chemicals from the Hard Meat. Moving with great care, he reached out and etched his mark into her pale skin, on the forehead, between her eyes. He managed to keep his hand from shaking long enough to draw his symbol.

...however, I doubt the Strauses did that much research

Exactly. It wouldn't be so bad had we seen him don some kind of acid-proof armor

I doubt the Strauses were trying to portray naturally acid-proof predators. Most people complain about the acid vomit scene. It was really more a case of the acid narrowly missing (rather implausibly) than a case of "wow...the predator's skin is acid-proof"

[Kimarhi]

omplaloopmpamorph

Win. 

[Bender1988]

We may end up laughing at them too.

Personally, I just can't help but shake my head at all of this. Maybe that's the pessimist in me though.

-Rakai'Thwei

Not a pessimist-Last i checked the comics about aliens and predators-those quite recent ones sucked soo badly in the department of story,and especially the art.
Better not to have tooo big hopes for this new "stuff" to bee goood,because when it turn out like andersons avp the sadness and rage and the hopes will be too big,and may destroy from the inside...f# I know i am still in rage for predators ommiting existence of predator2 and bulls#t predators/super predators idea.
Untill I read it i will be scepticall.