Poll: AvP vs AvPR

[SM]

One thing you have to realize is that Science is not ever 100% correct, we always have correction to make to what we thought was correct in the past.  Even if we think we have correct past mistakes in the future people will correct mistakes we made now. 

When it comes to the current question, it is 100% correct because they've defined what a planet is and Pluto, Eris et al don't qualify.

You can't honestly tell me that they were heading too earth on the trajectory they were on with a straight face.

Either they were heading to Earth when they shot a hole in their ship, or it's the mother of all coincidences.  If you want to give this flick the benefit of the doubt - go with the former.

[DoomRulz]

Why could they not have just been heading in that direction? I don't understand why it's hard to fathom that to get back to the Pred homeworld, they have to keep going in the same direction as the mothership and not towards Earth.

[KingAngel ofthe Outergulf]

When it comes to the current question, it is 100% correct because they've defined what a planet is and Pluto, Eris et al don't qualify.

Well since they are talking about how many planets are in the solar system, unless State news is incorrect which I doubt, it would mean the matter is not clear cut and dry on how many planets there are in.

You can't honestly tell me that they were heading too earth on the trajectory they were on with a straight face.

Either they were heading to Earth when they shot a hole in their ship, or it's the mother of all coincidences.  If you want to give this flick the benefit of the doubt - go with the former.

Or it is Fate that the Aliens came down to earth, and that pred tech was obtained by Yutani corporation which would one day merge with Weyland industries, together they will develop engines for space craft.



The one thing I really love about AvP-R is that it shows how unpredictable Xenomorphs are in tactics and life cycle.  None of you most likely go to web sites that bash Xenomorphs, Predators and Colonial Marines to, and have long strange written papers on how Spartans from Sparta can beat Xenomorphs with just Spears and shields.  Stuff from the other mediums and AvP-R throws a big monkey wrench in there quote unquote Special tactics that there army like the Spartans can use to  devastate ,without losses, Xenomorphs.  The first one of those big monkey wrenches are Belly bursters.   People claim that AvP-R killed the series, well in truth it may have saved the series and the creatures in it from anti Alien, Predator, Colonial Marine, debaters.

[Ghostface]

The one thing I really love about AvP-R is that it shows how unpredictable Xenomorphs are in tactics and life cycle.  None of you most likely go to web sites that bash Xenomorphs, Predators and Colonial Marines to, and have long strange written papers on how Spartans from Sparta can beat Xenomorphs with just Spears and shields.  Stuff from the other mediums and AvP-R throws a big monkey wrench in there quote unquote Special tactics that there army like the Spartans can use to  devastate ,without losses, Xenomorphs.  The first one of those big monkey wrenches are Belly bursters.   People claim that AvP-R killed the series, well in truth it may have saved the series and the creatures in it from anti Alien, Predator, Colonial Marine, debaters.

Aside from how rediculous a debate on Aliens vs. Spartans is (I'm not even gonna go there), what unpredictable tactics does AVP-R show aside from the "run at the enemy and use none of your natural weapons"? How many time does that movie show the xeno as sacrificial lambs for wolf to slaughter? Having multiple xeno burst from a single host did change things (and shat on previous films in the process) but if they all grow up to be retarded targets then give me the old single competant burster anyday.

[KingAngel ofthe Outergulf]

Aside from how rediculous a debate on Aliens vs. Spartans is (I'm not even gonna go there), what unpredictable tactics does AVP-R show aside from the "run at the enemy and use none of your natural weapons"? How many time does that movie show the xeno as sacrificial lambs for wolf to slaughter? Having multiple xeno burst from a single host did change things (and shat on previous films in the process) but if they all grow up to be retarded targets then give me the old single competant burster anyday.

Well before I get into detail I will point out Wolf never would have survived the incident one way or another.  Well for one, and this goes against all the alien haters out there that also hate colonial marines and the weapons they use, they fought a modern military force and kicked it but with little losses. 

People, not here... I think, have complained about how retarded the Marines were for not using night vision goggles instead of infrared, the people I mentioned above, cracked.com, 40kers have also taken a look see at the specs for a pulse rifle and compared it to a M-16A2.

Specs for Pulse rifle

M41A1 Specifications:
Rifle without magazine and sling 3.2 kg
Full magazine (100 rounds) 1.5 kg
Sling 0.2 kg
Firing weight (fully loaded w/sling) 4.9 kg
Length of rifle (stock retracted) 69.5 cm
Length of rifle (stock extended) 84.0 cm
Length of barrel 24.7 cm
Muzzle velocity 840 m/s
Maximum range 2,100 m
Maximum effective range 500 m
Cyclic rate of fire 900 rpm

Specs for M-16A2
Rifle without magazine and sling 3.5 kg
Full magazine (30 rounds) .3 kg
Sling 0.2 kg
Firing weight (fully loaded w/sling) 4.0 kg
Length of rifle 101 cm
Length of barrel 50.8 cm
Muzzle velocity 948 m/s
Maximum range 3,600 m
Maximum effective range 550 m(point)-800(area target)
Cyclic rate of fire 750-950

Now they like to ignore the fact that the Pulserifle fires 10mm steel explosive shells.  When you do this it does make the pulserifle looks kind bad.  And lots of anti-Alien anti-Colonial Marine debaters used the facts above to make it look like modern day US Army soldiers WILL easily kill Aliens and that Colonial Marines are retarded.   Then came AvP-R it shows that modern day US Army soldiers are screwed against Aliens, its shows that it nearly takes a whole clip from the M-16A2 to kill ONE XENOMORPH WARRIOR!

It also shows that even when the Aliens do not have hosts old enough to leach experiences and memories from there host, unborn babies, that there are still very dangerous Alpha aliens that come from these belly bursters.  At least 1 survived Wolf, the one in the power plant and it kick the crap out of him.  Technically so did the one that threw him down the elevator, the writers said that he, Wolf,  was supposed to be covered in blood from being injured, possible badly, by the warrior but the rain washed away all the blood in the scene when Wolf saves Dallas.

Then there the other mediums, they show that there is unlimited different types of Xenomorph and they can evolve rapidly, adapt to what ever problems they or the hive are facing.  Its one thing to deal with a Human Warrior its another to have to deal with a Onslaught Genom Warrior or a Razor Claw, or a Ravager.  You see those coming you might as well use that M-16A2 on yourself.

[SM]

Why could they not have just been heading in that direction? I don't understand why it's hard to fathom that to get back to the Pred homeworld, they have to keep going in the same direction as the mothership and not towards Earth.

Because space is unimaginably big that I find it hard to believe they were going anywhere but Earth.  They hadn't even left the solar ecliptic.  On top of that if Wolf was comgin from the homeworld, when he reviews the data about the crash, there's that crash zoom through space that ends on an angle behind the ship.  If that's a straight line back to the Predaplanet - it's a direction the ship was not going.

Well since they are talking about how many planets are in the solar system, unless State news is incorrect which I doubt, it would mean the matter is not clear cut and dry on how many planets there are in.

No.  Right now it's clear cut what defines a planet and what defines a dwarf planet.  Unless you can provide some info on how that's about to change, it's still clear cut.

Or it is Fate that the Aliens came down to earth, and that pred tech was obtained by Yutani corporation which would one day merge with Weyland industries, together they will develop engines for space craft.

Oh, okay.  'Fate' then... 

The one thing I really love about AvP-R is that it shows how unpredictable Xenomorphs are in tactics and life cycle.  None of you most likely go to web sites that bash Xenomorphs, Predators and Colonial Marines to, and have long strange written papers on how Spartans from Sparta can beat Xenomorphs with just Spears and shields.  Stuff from the other mediums and AvP-R throws a big monkey wrench in there quote unquote Special tactics that there army like the Spartans can use to  devastate ,without losses, Xenomorphs.  The first one of those big monkey wrenches are Belly bursters.   People claim that AvP-R killed the series, well in truth it may have saved the series and the creatures in it from anti Alien, Predator, Colonial Marine, debaters.

Aside from how rediculous a debate on Aliens vs. Spartans is (I'm not even gonna go there), what unpredictable tactics does AVP-R show aside from the "run at the enemy and use none of your natural weapons"? How many time does that movie show the xeno as sacrificial lambs for wolf to slaughter? Having multiple xeno burst from a single host did change things (and shat on previous films in the process) but if they all grow up to be retarded targets then give me the old single competant burster anyday.

'ken oath.

If their new tactics include playing possum - they're doing it wrong.

[KingAngel ofthe Outergulf]

Because space is unimaginably big that I find it hard to believe they were going anywhere but Earth.  They hadn't even left the solar ecliptic.  On top of that if Wolf was comgin from the homeworld, when he reviews the data about the crash, there's that crash zoom through space that ends on an angle behind the ship.  If that's a straight line back to the Predaplanet - it's a direction the ship was not going.

I would have to watch that part again  but for all we know Wolf was using some sort of external camera view to look at the ship and what it was doing before during and after the crash.

Also who is to say they were heading home, if that is even there home to begin with, there ship may be there true home.

No.  Right now it's clear cut what defines a planet and what defines a dwarf planet.  Unless you can provide some info on how that's about to change, it's still clear cut.

If the scientific community wasn't debating about the status of the other dwarf planets, if they should count as planets, I would say it is cut and dry.  The problem is they are talking about it so the matter can't be cut and dry.

Or it is Fate that the Aliens came down to earth, and that pred tech was obtained by Yutani corporation which would one day merge with Weyland industries, together they will develop engines for space craft.

'ken oath.

If their new tactics include playing possum - they're doing it wrong.

Well you may not realize this but for people that hate Aliens, Predators or Colonial Marines, this movies shows How dangerous they are to modern US Army Soldiers.  Lots of talk on websites before that movie came out about how much better current weapons are and tactics than what the Colonial Marines were using.  Before they started show faster gestation periods in like in Alien 3 AvP AvP-R haters would talk about how easy it would be to crush Alien infestation because it takes a couple days, well now with all that has been show, including how stealthy Aliens are,  they never showed aliens being at point blank range, that I can recall at the moment, while moving at the same time and not being detected by a lethal enemy/s, actually taking the initiative and wining most the time.

I also like the fact that it show that Plasma Casters, depending on the model, is not a one shot kill weapon against Aliens.  Also I like that they followed the lore and that Aliens inherit the knowledge and abilities of its host.  It makes since that some like 5/10 of the Warriors in AvP-R acted childish because they came from babies, and at the same time the Predalien came from Scar and had his Yautja hunting instinct and practices.

[Ghostface]

Didn't the belly bursters come from the mother? They shared her belly with a baby, but the baby wasnt the host. If they do indeed retain memories and instincts, shouldn't they retain memories and instincts from an adult and therefore act like adults?

[SM]

The problem is they are talking about it so the matter can't be cut and dry.

You keep claiming this yet continue to fail to provide any info to back it up.  Who says they're still talking about it?  If you can't provide proof, all we can assume is you're making it up.

Also who is to say they were heading home

Doomrulz.

Well you may not realize this but for people that hate Aliens, Predators or Colonial Marines, this movies shows How dangerous they are to modern US Army Soldiers.

Well you may not realise but you're not talking to people that hate Aliens, Predators and Colonial Marines.

Before they started show faster gestation periods in like in Alien 3

Neither Spike nor Ripley were fast.

Also I like that they followed the lore and that Aliens inherit the knowledge and abilities of its host.  It makes since that some like 5/10 of the Warriors in AvP-R acted childish because they came from babies

That's taking the concept of generational memory - of which we know almost next to nothing - to a ridiculous and unsubstantiated extreme.

[OmegaZilla]

It makes since that some like 5/10 of the Warriors in AvP-R acted childish because they came from babies,

[KingAngel ofthe Outergulf]

Didn't the belly bursters come from the mother? They shared her belly with a baby, but the baby wasn't the host. If they do indeed retain memories and instincts, shouldn't they retain memories and instincts from an adult and therefore act like adults?

They were in the uterus, and more than likely the baby/s themselves.  If this statement is correct they would have interned through the Placenta and into the child itself through the umbilical cord.  If the Aliens had been in the stomach and not the uterus during the beginning of there beginning development she would have been dead way before the Doctor got to her.  The uterus during pregnancy is so full of blood that damage caused there can be extremely fatal and a quick painful death.  That's not what we saw in the movie until they ate through her uterus stomach muscles and skin.

[SM]

Thereby proving what mindlessly stupid idea it was in the first place.

I always thought the unborn child was supposed to be food for the Aliens anyway.  Which is still mindlessly stupid.

BS kill kids and unborn babies...


Dey so hardcore.

[KingAngel ofthe Outergulf]

You keep claiming this yet continue to fail to provide any info to back it up.  Who says they're still talking about it?  If you can't provide proof, all we can assume is you're making it up.

Yeah sure and what motive would I have to make it up  

Doomrulz.

Great so an ork says so.

Well you may not realise but you're not talking to people that hate Aliens, Predators and Colonial Marines.

You might not realize that a lot of people think that they are pathetic.  Just because you are on a website devoted to AvP talking to people right now that know better doesn't mean you wont end up having a debate about Aliens vs whatever on a complete different website.  Just try having a Aliens vs something debate on Robotech.com if you say that an alien can beat whatever it is they have picked it to fight you will be talked down to and called pathetic.

Neither Spike nor Ripley were fast.

Well Spike is not a host for an alien anymore its an Ox and the Ox has a very fast gestation period.  It is also stated that the Queens choose when they will be born (FemaleWars), Ripely is one example of a majorly delayed Gestation (Days).

Also it appears that the Browns in Resurrection had a fast gestation period.

That's taking the concept of generational memory - of which we know almost next to nothing - to a ridiculous and unsubstantiated extreme.

Really how, its been established in canon that is one of there attributes.  It shows it in the movies, books, comics, and games.  Heck they had the Predalien take the cooks head and spine in AvP-R, and even though they tried to remove the skinned Predaliens you can still see them in the movie itself.   That is another Reason why Commando (Warrior LV-1201) was so freaking dangerous it came from a dangerous host.

Thereby proving what mindlessly stupid idea it was in the first place.

I always thought the unborn child was supposed to be food for the Aliens anyway.  Which is still mindlessly stupid.

BS kill kids and unborn babies...
http://weknowmemes.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/11/watch-out-we-got-a-badass-over-here-meme-240x180.png

Dey so hardcore.

Stupid how?  Instead of getting one Warrior per person like with non-pregnant host, with a pregnant host you get 6 warriors. Theoretically it could be possible that depending on how many babies the host has it may plant 6 embroes per child.  Since multiples are more common now days you could end up with 12 warrior from one women, more if you include Septuplets (42 Warriors).  With belly bursters included it makes Xenomorph infestations much more dangerous and because of how much faster the hive grows.  Granted because of the bellyburster process the Warrior will not have any inherited skills but it was still show that there are some Alpha Aliens that come from the bellybursters and Alpha are dangerous even if they didn't inherit jack.

[SM]

Yeah sure and what motive would I have to make it up

Quite beyond me.  Possibly to back a baseless statement you made earlier about how many planets are in the solar system.  Which is still baseless due to your lack of proof I might add.

Great so an ork says so.

He's an ork?  He never told me!

You might not realize that a lot of people think that they are pathetic.  Just because you are on a website devoted to AvP talking to people right now that know better doesn't mean you wont end up having a debate about Aliens vs whatever on a complete different website.  Just try having a Aliens vs something debate on Robotech.com if you say that an alien can beat whatever it is they have picked it to fight you will be talked down to and called pathetic.

Despite the fact a single Alien is unlikely to last very long against a giant mech with energy weapons, I'm not seeing the relevance of this.

Well Spike is not a host for an alien anymore its an Ox and the Ox has a very fast gestation period.  It is also stated that the Queens choose when they will be born (FemaleWars), Ripely is one example of a majorly delayed Gestation (Days).

Who says Spike isn't the host anymore?  He was the host in the theatrical version, and the theatrical version still exists, so he is still the host in that version.  Ultimately it doesn't matter.  Babe was very likely hugged around the same time Spike was meaning the gestation was the same and about normal.  Where are you getting info that ox gestation is fast?

Also it appears that the Browns in Resurrection had a fast gestation period.

That's open to debate.  The script makes mention of a faster gestation due to genetic shenanigans, but all this was dropped from the film and enough time is shown to have passed in the film for the gestation to also be about normal.

Really how, its been established in canon that is one of there attributes.

AvP:Poo aside - which to be honest, very few give the slightest bit of credence - all we know is Aliens take on minimal physical aspects of their host.  Ripley had fragments of memories of her former life - but we have no way of knowing for sure if Aliens take on host memory or if that's a side effect unique to Ripley#8.

You might find people more receptive to your ideas if you didn't deal so much in absolutes.

Stupid how?

Stupid because anything that big going down the hosts throat is going to do a lot of internal damage even before they start chewing their way through to the womb.  Kinda defeats the purpose.  If it was in such a hurry to get those things to the womb, there's a much more direct route.

[KingAngel ofthe Outergulf]

Quite beyond me.  Possibly to back a baseless statement you made earlier about how many planets are in the solar system.  Which is still baseless due to your lack of proof I might add.

I said it, that should be prof enough especially since I see no point in lying in an argument, debate, or flame-fest.

He's an ork?  He never told me!

I do not know who or what it he/she is and I do not care.  I have never heard that name in any videos or that have to do with Aliens or Predators nor seen that name in any books.

Despite the fact a single Alien is unlikely to last very long against a giant mech with energy weapons, I'm not seeing the relevance of this.

It depends on the Alien, its host, and how evolved it is, but that is beside the point.  They talk about modern day  infantry weapons in the warzone section and how pathetic the weapons are in Aliens, but the greatest insult of all is that they like to say the Starfleet from Startrek ground force including Borg would beat the crap out of Aliens although in the end most admit the Aliens will win against Starfleet but with heavy losses, that is still a joke hypothesis.

Who says Spike isn't the host anymore?  He was the host in the theatrical version, and the theatrical version still exists, so he is still the host in that version.  Ultimately it doesn't matter.  Babe was very likely hugged around the same time Spike was meaning the gestation was the same and about normal.  Where are you getting info that ox gestation is fast?

I do not think Babe was not hugged at the same time even if she was it appears the funereal takes place much sooner in the new version.   

That's open to debate.  The script makes mention of a faster gestation due to genetic shenanigans, but all this was dropped from the film and enough time is shown to have passed in the film for the gestation to also be about normal.

There really isn't anything considered normal, besideds what I wrote above in the Blu-ray version of Alien.  It shows in the disc menu that the recorded gestation period for an Alien is 1-10 hours still it is shown faster in other movies and mediums.

AvP:Poo aside - which to be honest, very few give the slightest bit of credence - all we know is Aliens take on minimal physical aspects of their host.  Ripley had fragments of memories of her former life - but we have no way of knowing for sure if Aliens take on host memory or if that's a side effect unique to Ripley#8.

You might find people more receptive to your ideas if you didn't deal so much in absolutes.

My ideas, I have hardly written anything that is opinionated like 85%-90% is canonical fact.  I see where this topic is going now so I am done with this one too.

Stupid because anything that big going down the hosts throat is going to do a lot of internal damage even before they start chewing their way through to the womb.  Kinda defeats the purpose.  If it was in such a hurry to get those things to the womb, there's a much more direct route.

Well no one can know for sure the exact process of how they got to the womb but chewing from the stomach to the womb more than likely didn't happen unless they repaired the damage on the way because when the Pregnant woman woke up she looked more puzzled than in pain.   If they put the embryos in the other way it would cause to much embryonic fluid to leave the womb also causing labor.  It doesn't matter though I am done with this.