Reproduction Method Official

[The Chibi Kiriyama]

I don't see egg-laying happening at any point. Fans never get sudden appeasement in films. AVPR doesn't seem to be starting a new twist in cinema with a last-minute save.

[Otnip]

It doesn't sound right, but perhaps the directors don't give a s*** what was in A:R? However awful that piece of crap is, they have to deal with it being canon. The predator DNA part brought up by Dutch90 is something to think about. Good thinking

[Xenomorphine]

Did you even read what I wrote ?

Yees, and if it doesn't lead to egg morphing it's a continuity error. We don't know what happened to Lambert, but we have absolutely no reason to assume it was this.

We've never seen what the phase of reproduction was between a young queen and a fully aged egg laying queen.  Continuity has not only been maintained, but expanded upon.

As others have pointed out, we very much have seen precisely that. 'Alien 3' makes it clear that Queens are born with the multiple limbs and crest (plus legs, if we go by the model), while 'Alien Resurrection' has an unambiguous scientific statement of the process the Queen goes through.

Are we seriously going to believe those Auriga scientists never put a live animal in with the young Queen, to see what would happen?

Heck, they had Ripley 7 going free for spare parts, if nothing else.

I don't have problems with adding to the Alien, but claims of things never being seen, when they have been, do not reflect well.

I like how this might show what actually happened to Lambert.
And this is some kind of rape, too.

Oh, it is.

For the record, I think this new method fits perfectly well with the concept of what the Alien is. I think it could be creepy and horrific, if done right.

Unfortunately, I don't think it fits well with canon, because it's contradicting either how Queens are created or the purpose of egg transformation.

Previously, I was hoping we could say both methods could co-exist. Now that you've made it clear this is meant to be a creature maturing into a Queen, that seems to go out of the window.

It's a shame, because I'm one of the fans who's trying to find a way to have this all fit together. I'm prepared to overlook certain things (people complaining about the number of teeth all Predators must somehow be dictated as being born with, for instance), but this isn't affording me much ambiguity.

Also, it's dangerously close to being derivative of many eighties B-movies, where we saw lots of 'Alien' clones showing creatures trying to reproduce by forcing something down a human being's mouth. It could look much better here, of course, but it's a fine line, in terms of presentation.

How does it show what happened to Lambert?

The Alien in that movie wasn't a young Queen.

Where do you think the queen came from in Aliens? Perhaps one of the domiant warriors became a young and queen and started the process. The simple fact is that it has never been shown before, so what are you arguing about?

I can say what James Cameron thought happened, if you want, because there was a very public letter.

The Jordans are seen calling for help. According to that story, help came and a search party was sent in. They arrived in time, because there was obviously some sort of vehcile powered by flight; hence "the landing grid" quote. By the time the colonial Marines arrived, this was probably placed back into the garage or whatever.

It's likely that a search party would have been sent, in order to get some clues about what was being dealt with. They have a strange organism they need to get off a guy's face. They don't know what it's doing. This extraterrestrial derelict craft/facility might have some information.

They then get hugged. One is a Queen.

The alternative, which those such as myself and SM have favoured, is that the Jordan's creature got loose, did what happened in 'Alien', transformed someone into an egg, which then hatched into a Queen-laying facehugger.

Ordinary adults being able to transform into Queens is not necessary for either theory. It also contradicts the purpose of having a natural Queen. What's the point of them, if any adult can simply split away from the nest and be one?

Well, if the queen didnt make some aliens to protect her first, something like, i dont know, a PREDATOR could just walk right in and blow her the f**k away. This makes sense to me. And I love it. I shall be scorned along with you then Colin lol.

That's why the Queen lays a minefield of eggs. They are her protection.

Remember how Ripley almost set one off? Instant death and new young. That was what the scene in 'Aliens' was all about.

As shown with Kane, any freshly-impregnated host is going to be in no shape to fight in the immediate aftermath. If they show any signs of it, they'll be so groggy that the Queen would have more than enough time to commence battle.

Heck, she might even be able to order facehuggers to stay clamped until birth, if it seems necessary. Who's really to say?

Where do you think the queen came from in Aliens? Perhaps one of the domiant warriors became a young and queen and started the process. The simple fact is that it has never been shown before, so what are you arguing about?

...Honestly, did you ever watch any movie made after Aliens? Queens are born Queens.

All I've seen is that these very complex creatures find a way to reproduce in strange and unique ways... hence them being Aliens and not simple bugs.

Which is precisely what egg transformation supplied us with. I'm seriously curious as to why you felt the need to do away with it. What was wrong with it? Time considerations? It only took a few hours. A simple cut away, complete with legend to indicate a brief passing of time, could have sufficed for that.

Especially if multiple hosts are taken for the very first abduction sequences.

I guess Sil just wants simple Bugs.... how sad.

Colin, I know you probably feel a bit trod upon, today (and I don't mean that in a sarcastic way). You've just seen a massive negative public reaction to two of what should have been your flagship marks placed upon this franchise. Nevertheless, please try to understand that SiL is trying to articulate frustration at why you felt the need to do away with egg transformation. Can you please give us an answer, even if it was just down to personal preference?

I love how something is "lame-ass" when you haven't seen it at all.

To clarify things, I'm willing to see it. I think it could be very atmospheric and I think that we can all agree that the Aliens need a way to multiply in the absence of a Queen.

The problem is that it renders either natural Queens or egg transformation as obselete, when both those concepts came before this.

The Queen's messed-up nature only came into play the end, after she'd gone through her natural reproductive process.

Correct. Human genetic contamination would not have accelerated the Queen's cycle. If anything, it would have delayed it. Her brief period of preparation for laying eggs might even have been slower than an ordinary Queen's would be.

Remember, she has to spend time hooking herself up and growing the beginnings of that sack, then maturing eggs. Eggs aren't just created in a minute. We saw how many there were in the original Queen's body and she was laying them fairly slowly. Even if she was putting them out at a rate of two every minute, it would still take a long while for those undeveloped ones to fully mature and get shunted to the rear.

All of that time is what accounts for what the creature is supposedly doing.

Plus, any Queen candidate should realise how valuable it is and seal itself away, not go looking for threats to face it.

But it still doesn't change the fact egg morphing would be infinitely better. It's slower and meaner and ickier. How does that make them like a bug? It doesn't. But it introduces a level of body-horror that you don't get these days.

That's why 'The Fly' works so well. Cronenberg understood that turning someone into what was basically a walking, evolving cancer, touches upon primal fears in the human mind, like nothing else can do.

Egg transformation is a disease, a cancer, yet, to quote 'Blade 2, a "cancer with a purpose".

That makes it scary. The unknowing of whether you'll be sentient for as long as the creature within needs the egg to protect it. Could you be in agony for months, years, decades, centuries? Perhaps more?

If nothing else, you know you'll slowly become a mental vegetable, aware only to the sensation of tormenting pain, as you're gradually turned into embryonic yolk. Knowing that the thing growing inside you has only one purpose. To hatch out from you and infect someone else. Your suffering can only be brought to an end by the sacrifice of another.

That doesn't make them insects. In fact, it totally divorces them from that analogy.

It was also why 'The Thing' is still able to impress.

By comparison, although obviously unpleasant, the Predalien's method won't be able to touch upon the same psychosexual territory, although it'll come close to the facehugger's, obviously.

Why wasn't egg morphing good enough for you?

This is precisely what I want to know. Time constraints can be worked around and easily so. I even gave an example of how to do that. The directors already confirmed they were able to get alterations to the story done.

Oh well, this has been fun but it's time to get back to work.

Peace

Thanks for coming here to interact and defend your own vision, regardless of how many of us feel about it. As you can see, I'm interested to see this on the screen. I just lament that it won't be the egg transformation so many of us had wanted to be there.

Who said the Predalien wasen't a Queen from the beganing?

Chestburster who had no arms nor crest.

Like the Queen they removed from Ripley at the beginning of Alien Resurrection?

Very good point there, so the predalien could be a queen from the start.
The rez queen looked like a normal chestburster too.

Because it was massively under-developed. Human babies don't look much like humans, either, if they're early enough. It did, however, have the beginnings of a crest and the mouth had a protective sheath, which this does not.

The one it should be compared with is what we saw in 'Alien 3', which had a specific aesthetic.

we know that the pred-women were stronger then males

We don't even know if female Predators exist or what the gender was of the ones we saw in the various films.

Back to the theory again, this is contradicting stuff.

Theory 1:
Aliens transform victims into eggs. One or all have embryonic Queen facehuggers within them. Regular adults can be created through the, uh, 'oral' concept.
Conclusion:
Wrong. We now know this is a moulting Queen (which contradicts another interview, but there we are).

Theory 2:
Aliens moult into Queens. They can breed orally.
Conclusion:
This contradicts natural Queens. If any adult can transform, what's the point of birthing natural Queens? Any adult could simply move away from the nest and be one.

Theory 3:
Aiens moult into Queens. They can breed orally. They can transform victims into eggs. Both will create regular adults.
Conclusion:
What's the points of egg transformation? Oral would be the quickest method. It means the creature in 'Alien' was being completely illogical.

See where we are? If the Predalien can moult, then it renders natural Queens obselete. If they can breed orally or through egg alteration, then why bother with egging?

I just don't see a way to make this fit with what we've seen in the other films. That doesn't mean this one won't be entertaining, but this is leaving me with little alternative but to conclude this series as not being canon.

Which annoys me, because I've been trying damn hard to want this to all somehow fit together.

The bitch of it is, this could have actually fitted together, were it not for the Predalien having to grow and be a Queen. The only hope seems to be that we might not actually see that and it's just the directors' personal theory for what's 'really' going on.

We could say that maybe they egg people early on, only able to do the oral thing after a certain time, but I don't know why that would be.

[SiL]

Bravo!

[Saberjunky]

Pardon my ignorance but what actually happened to Lambert? other than being killed by the alien

[SiL]

No-one knows.

[pred_alien]

im not sure if this has already been mention but whatever...

when chet plants the embryo (sp?) ina person's mouth could that be the way for egg-morphing to occur???

[Xenomorphine]

im not sure if this has already been mention but whatever...

when chet plants the embryo (sp?) ina person's mouth could that be the way for egg-morphing to occur???

Most of us are hoping that is so.

Because we still have yet to get a confirmation or denial of it, I fear not.

That or the Predalien is so generally impatient that it can't be bothered to stick around and complete that process. Which is no excuse for one of the others not simply taking the victim to be cocooned and all of that.

[Hybrid PM]

I wonder where the eggs come from when she throws up on the victims, her stomach???

[SiL]

If it was egg morphing, he would'a said so to calm people down. But it clearly isn't egg morphing.

[Ballzanya]

im not sure if this has already been mention but whatever...

when chet plants the embryo (sp?) ina person's mouth could that be the way for egg-morphing to occur???

well in the DC of Alien, brett was cocooned to the wall first and before that he recieved a headbite and was taken, as opposed to cornered and implanted with whatever starts the egg morphing process. So i fail to see how it could still be related to egg morphing and yet still make sense.

If the predalien is molting into a queen ( ) and needs to settle down and finish the process and then lay eggs, why would it be out hunting hosts and making itself vulnerable. So I'm not buying the whole "it needs to create an army to protect it" since it could be killed in the process of doing that, which is counterproductive to the perpetuation of the species.

[TheAncientEnemy]

Holy crap. Wow!

Brand new member here (hello everyone!).

I just made my account today to see what the general reaction was with these new ideas pertaining to reproduction. I have to say that I am pleasantly surprised to see that most of you here are intelligent enough to have respect for the canon established in the series. I expected to come here and see the same people from the IMDB boards; misguided fanboys who don't know anything about the series and don't care as long as they can see their way cool monsters duke it out in campy, modern caricatures of past amazing films.

Personally, I agree with just about everything SiL has said pertaining to this idea. It's very cool of Colin to come here and actually interact a little with the fans, but he doesn't seem to care that the people here have paid more attention to the series the he has in spite of the fact that he is the one getting paid millions of dollars to make an addition to it. It's shameful really, and there is a difference between taking the series in a ballsy new direction and just taking a dump on the facts already established in the Aliens universe.

Personally, I had high hopes for this film. To be completely honest, I never saw AVP because I was sure that if I did I would cry. As soon as the director was announced my boycott began (and still stands to this day). However, AVPR seemed to be giving me all I wanted which was mostly a nice, big line of seperation between this film and Anderson's. It also came with the reassurance from the directors that canon would be respected.

"If this movie is a real knockout then I can easily just pretend that Anderson's AVP never happened!" I told myself... until today when I read the news pertaining to the predalien/queen's reproductive method. Shame on the directors for this misstep. However, even more shameful is the fact that SiL mentioned various facts in opposition to this new idea and Colin ignored those and instead focused his short responses in another direction. While personally I have always hated the idea of egg morphing (and I am surprised that anyone even considers it a viable reproductive option since it was retroactively re-cut into the extended version of Alien in direct conflict with what Cameron showed us in Aliens), I still think SiL pretty much took Colin to school here. Mad props and much respect to, so far, the only alien fanatic I have seen online who cares as much as I do.

Things were going so well too. Looks like I might not see AVPR after all.

[Demonio Cazador]

Oh my...I can't believe the level of childish whining I just witnessed...
I'm sorry guys,
this is just plain ridiculous...Oh boy...

Why can't people just wait to see the fricking movie??  

[Ballzanya]

Holy crap. Wow!

Brand new member here (hello everyone!).

I just made my account today to see what the general reaction was with these new ideas pertaining to reproduction. I have to say that I am pleasantly surprised to see that most of you here are intelligent enough to have respect for the canon established in the series. I expected to come here and see the same people from the IMDB boards; misguided fanboys who don't know anything about the series and don't care as long as they can see their way cool monsters duke it out in campy, modern caricatures of past amazing films.

Personally, I agree with just about everything SiL has said pertaining to this idea. It's very cool of Colin to come here and actually interact a little with the fans, but he doesn't seem to care that the people here have paid more attention to the series the he has in spite of the fact that he is the one getting paid millions of dollars to make an addition to it. It's shameful really, and there is a difference between taking the series in a ballsy new direction and just taking a dump on the facts already established in the Aliens universe.

Personally, I had high hopes for this film. To be completely honest, I never saw AVP because I was sure that if I did I would cry. As soon as the director was announced my boycott began (and still stands to this day). However, AVPR seemed to be giving me all I wanted which was mostly a nice, big line of seperation between this film and Anderson's. It also came with the reassurance from the directors that canon would be respected.

"If this movie is a real knockout then I can easily just pretend that Anderson's AVP never happened!" I told myself... until today when I read the news pertaining to the predalien/queen's reproductive method. Shame on the directors for this misstep. However, even more shameful is the fact that SiL mentioned various facts in opposition to this new idea and Colin ignored those and instead focused his short responses in another direction. While personally I have always hated the idea of egg morphing (and I am surprised that anyone even considers it a viable reproductive option since it was retroactively re-cut into the extended version of Alien in direct conflict with what Cameron showed us in Aliens), I still think SiL pretty much took Colin to school here. Mad props and much respect to, so far, the only alien fanatic I have seen online who cares as much as I do.

Things were going so well too. Looks like I might not see AVPR after all.

yeah, what makes this worse is that the directors have mentioned several times that "continuity would remain intact".

[SiL]

Well, TheAncientEnemy, while I understand your views on egg morphing, you're wrong about the contradiction comment. It's a companion piece to the Queen cycle, not a replacement. No Queen? Aliens make eggs out of people. Eggs birth huggers with Queens. Process goes as 'normal'.

The egg transmutation has been established since 1979 and I find it ridiculous that the Bros, 28 years after the fact, decide that one of the most creative and horrifying additions to an already grotesque and, as far as cinematic monsters are concerned, largely unique life cycle isn't good enough for them and opt to go for something like an Alien vomiting into other people's mouths.