Alien: Covenant Early Reactions

[gantarat]

Look, I know it means a lot to fans and we try and get some universe formed in our minds with a history and set of rules, but Fox does not care.  For a lot of fans that is tough to swallow because they want the people in charge of the property they love to care as much as they do.  But to them this is a franchise and a property they can generate a strong revenue stream out of.  The movie will dwarf any novel/comic book sales so they largely ignore them.

In my mind, that's pretty much the way to go.  They let people pay them to create materials based off of their licenses but you would be crazy to try and take anything that happens in them as canon.  If there is a way to make it more marketable they will negate anything they have ever done to do so.  There just isn't a real care for canon.  If you ask then, sure, they don't care, it's canon...   until there is another idea or they realize they didn't like that one.

It's a simple rule of business for them.  The only things that are fairly immovable are Alien and Prometheus.

Then why fox work with DH/Titan Writer ? if they don't care about canon/continuity ?

Fox Pretty much do like Disneys did with new star wars eu.

[Rudiger]

This isn't world-building, universe-building, canon-building or anything else. It's franchise-building and nothing else. If a studio doesn't have a franchise - or multiples thereof - it's toast.

[Imbrie]

This canon debate is entirely off-topic.

[Robopadna]

Don't suppose the canon discussion/arguments can go in a different thread?

They are sort of intertwined here if a major complaint in the review or opinion of a movie is about it directly contradicting something in a previous movie/source.  To some people that REALLY matters and they want the franchise to respect all aspects.

There seems to be some of that implied with what we have heard so far.

That's also combined with the general idea of every single early tweet will always be very positive.  It has happened on every movie to date (even terrible ones) and you won't find out anything until the embargo lifts.  that leaves little to no meaningful content except a series of tweets saying the exact same thing.

This canon debate is entirely off-topic.

I guess anything that isn't a sreen shot or link of a twitter account claiming how awesome it was is off topic.  If we talk about actual reviews it's pretty on topic

[Ragonk_Force]

Hope David It's not Alien Creator,I mean Crazy Robot made Most dangerous alien creature in the universe ?

That very horrible than retcon hicks alive and contradict first movie that Derelict ship on lv-426 was crash long time ago.

Like it or nor (and I'm not a fan of retconning), it doesn't actually contradict anything in Alien. Clearly the initial conceit of the filmmakers was that the SJ was long dead, but anything else is really just an assumption (even if implied), in terms of how long the derelict had been there, whether it was actually fossilised or not etc.

That depends, Xeno are depicted as ancient in different sources, even the AVP film which is or was canon showed that Xenos existed in ancient times, thus David cannot be the creator, I really hope he is not but after reading just a fraction of the comments here that seem to indicate disatifaction from the more serious fans, I am worried.

Don't want spoilers but I really want to be reassured that this isn't true much more than I don't want spoilers 

My theory is that David just replicated what the Engineers already created rather than outright creating them himself.

Those AvP shitty abominations are not canon.

This^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

[Imbrie]

Don't suppose the canon discussion/arguments can go in a different thread?

They are sort of intertwined here if a major complaint in the review or opinion of a movie is about it directly contradicting something in a previous movie/source.  To some people that REALLY matters and they want the franchise to respect all aspects.

There seems to be some of that implied with what we have heard so far.

That's also combined with the general idea of every single early tweet will always be very positive.  It has happened on every movie to date (even terrible ones) and you won't find out anything until the embargo lifts.  that leaves little to no meaningful content except a series of tweets saying the exact same thing.

This canon debate is entirely off-topic.

I guess anything that isn't a sreen shot or link of a twitter account claiming how awesome it was is off topic.  If we talk about actual reviews it's pretty on topic

But the thread has descended into a what is/what isn't canon debate which will never resolve because people's views are already formed and immovable.

[Adorianu]

Hope David It's not Alien Creator,I mean Crazy Robot made Most dangerous alien creature in the universe ?

That very horrible than retcon hicks alive and contradict first movie that Derelict ship on lv-426 was crash long time ago.

Like it or nor (and I'm not a fan of retconning), it doesn't actually contradict anything in Alien. Clearly the initial conceit of the filmmakers was that the SJ was long dead, but anything else is really just an assumption (even if implied), in terms of how long the derelict had been there, whether it was actually fossilised or not etc.

That depends, Xeno are depicted as ancient in different sources, even the AVP film which is or was canon showed that Xenos existed in ancient times, thus David cannot be the creator, I really hope he is not but after reading just a fraction of the comments here that seem to indicate disatifaction from the more serious fans, I am worried.

Don't want spoilers but I really want to be reassured that this isn't true much more than I don't want spoilers 

My theory is that David just replicated what the Engineers already created rather than outright creating them himself.

Those AvP shitty abominations are not canon.

Says you, while they may or may not have been retconned now (status unclear) and I agree they were abominations, they were canon.

I strongly agree that Fox doesn't care hence why they never clarified the old eu but they do have more authority than Ridley...and as I said, unfortunately, though in this case, I would not agree with Ridley contradicting Alien (if covenant actually does of course)

The Devs were the ones that were mostly kept telling everyone CM was canon, Fox probably did too but the extreme negative reaction made them back off. Fox is both non caring and fickle, whatever allows them to continue milking the franchise.

I would also hope Ridley does not directly contradict Alien (because how hard is it to keep the first story consistent).

The devs told everyone Fox considered it canon because, well, fox did.  Until, like you said, they didn't. 

You perfectly summed it up as they care as far as doing so helps them make money.  If contradicting something helps them make a more accessible or marketable product, they will contradict anything.  So, essentially, nothing is honestly canon to them.  Which leaves Ridley and he has shown a lot of disdain for everything outside of the first two films and is probably not aware that the comics even exist.

He will probably keep roughly consistent with Alien but even then he has played fast and loose with the identity of the SJ (size differences are silly) but he clearly has decided it was always an engineer.  I think everything else, including Aliens and Prometheus, is entirely malleable.

I know Ridley doesn't like AVP, not sure what he thinks of the current comics/books and Isolation game...if he as you said, was even aware of it.

The Size differences regarding SJ has a few theories, one is that like humans and any animal really, that size simply varies among individuals, the other (which I find interesting) is that the Engineers are just emulating the SJs. Sjs being to them what Engineers are to us.

There were not canon.Those comics are not too.For this moment Aliens and Predators are not in the same universe.

[Predaker]

Don't suppose the canon discussion/arguments can go in a different thread?

They are sort of intertwined here if a major complaint in the review or opinion of a movie is about it directly contradicting something in a previous movie/source.  To some people that REALLY matters and they want the franchise to respect all aspects.

There seems to be some of that implied with what we have heard so far.

That's also combined with the general idea of every single early tweet will always be very positive.  It has happened on every movie to date (even terrible ones) and you won't find out anything until the embargo lifts.  that leaves little to no meaningful content except a series of tweets saying the exact same thing.

This canon debate is entirely off-topic.

I guess anything that isn't a sreen shot or link of a twitter account claiming how awesome it was is off topic.  If we talk about actual reviews it's pretty on topic

How is this even remotely on topic? What aspect of Alien: Covenant are you discussing in reference to FOX, the EU, and canon?

[Adorianu]

Fox care canon and continuty. Fox will not release Weyland-Yutani Report  and let Alien 5 happen if they don't care



PS. AvP 1-2 Its not canon (Aliens: CM too)

True.

[Ragonk_Force]

At this point, cannon is decided by Ridley and Fox. Probably why they scrapped Blomkamps thing. Alien 5 would have had a Queen, and Im pretty sure Ridleys Ideas are not going that direction. Which I personally am fine with. I thought the Queen in Aliens was great, but its scarier if the eggs are created through morphing, or goo or whatever, as opposed to the aliens essentially being giant deadly ants

[Attack.no1]

What are the sound effects like in the film? Egg opening, alien hissing that sort of thing?

[Robopadna]

Don't suppose the canon discussion/arguments can go in a different thread?

They are sort of intertwined here if a major complaint in the review or opinion of a movie is about it directly contradicting something in a previous movie/source.  To some people that REALLY matters and they want the franchise to respect all aspects.

There seems to be some of that implied with what we have heard so far.

That's also combined with the general idea of every single early tweet will always be very positive.  It has happened on every movie to date (even terrible ones) and you won't find out anything until the embargo lifts.  that leaves little to no meaningful content except a series of tweets saying the exact same thing.

This canon debate is entirely off-topic.

I guess anything that isn't a sreen shot or link of a twitter account claiming how awesome it was is off topic.  If we talk about actual reviews it's pretty on topic

How is this even remotely on topic? What aspect of Alien: Covenant are you discussing in reference to FOX, the EU, and canon?

Not sure if you read this whole thread or not (don't blame you if you haven't because it's really long) but there are things mentioned or hinted at that occur in the movie that go 'against' what some people consider canon.  This matters to people so it will generate discussion.  Fox is the owner of the Alien franchise and the EU is their licensed out aspects of the franchise.  So a discussion about what people think has/has not been established inherently involves those products.

If you want this thread to be nothing but the mirrored tweets or links from people who said the early showing was awesome, I can understand but that will be a short and entirely ignored thread.  They all say the same thing and always do.

A separate thread could be started that just discusses the film but, at this stage, most people haven't seen it and want to discuss SOMETHING.  That is why you get people discussing what appears in A:C and what they think about it (often in context of the franchise).

But the thread has descended into a what is/what isn't canon debate which will never resolve because people's views are already formed and immovable.

The thread probably did get coopted a little but that is going to happen when most people haven't seen it and people who have start to release a little info.  That info is largely in this thread so they talk about it here.

[Predaker]

Right, but what "things" from Covenant are you discussing? Because right now it's just generalized canon arguments mucking up the thread.

If it's going to continue, at least have some reference or context related to the new film to stay on topic.

[The Cruentus]

I thought the Queen in Aliens was great, but its scarier if the eggs are created through morphing, or goo or whatever, as opposed to the aliens essentially being giant deadly ants

The insect quality was always there from the start, the only thing Aliens added was a Queen and hive, the latter of which was in Alien as scrapped content.

Getting back to reactions to the movie, I can understand why some fans are upset, continuity is important to some of us and to see it thrown out of the window by Covenant (if it actually does that) then no wonder some of us are not happy. The film is probably still better any Alien film post Aliens if the some of the comments around here are any indication but that doesn't stop aspects of that film being disliked. 

I am not going to hold my breath but I do dare to hope that my worries won't come true. Still I might actually enjoy the movie regardless.

Out of Shadows is a good book for example, well written and enjoyable but a lot of folk agree it didn't need Ripley or even Ash involved in it, so maybe we shouldn't take one bad/criticized aspect as a reason to worry about the whole film or let it cloud our judgement before we even see the film.

[Robopadna]

Right, but what "things" from Covenant are you discussing? Because right now it's just generalized canon arguments mucking up the thread.

I think calling it 'mucking up' is a little dishonest and condescending because the discussions were pretty calm.  If you don't like the discussion I can understand but you can really comb through twitter declarations saying how awesome the movie was without any effort.  Were you really coming to this thread and hoping for literally nothing but screenshots or links to those?

SPOILER WARNING

I don't know if you followed the spoilers at all so I don't want to ruin anything for you but people are discussing the changes to SJ/engineers the alien, the alien birth cycle and the creation of the alien.  These are all things that were discussed here as having changed and many people were entirely unaware of them.  Some people like these changes, others don't and others don't care.

This generates discussion, which brings us to this place.

If it's going to continue, at least have some reference or context related to the new film to stay on topic.

That is literally what generated all of it.  I understand you would like to control the discussion and it to only be about what you want it to be about but that isn't the nature of threads.  So far it's all been pretty civil and focused on A;C and how it relates to other things.

You are now tangentializing it even further from A:C