Reproduction Method Official

[gameoverman]

I only saw maybe 6 facehuggers in medlab.  Two were alive, and one was removed before embryo implantation.  So, you maybe have one Queen and two drones.  If this was enough to build the hive - ?

That might be just what facehuggers were captured, not a definitive number of initial facehuggers from the group sent out to rescue Newt's family and investigate the Derelict.

They only captured two.  The others they would have gotten off the hosts after it came off like with Kane.

If they captured more - why would'nt Burke use them against the rest?

Here, you can clearly see there are 6 facehuggers - allowing for only 3 aliens to have been born initially:

whos to say the dead ones, didn't implant embryos in people, but were kept for study? We only know that two facehuggers hadn't implanted embryos yet. The one removed before embryo implantation in which they killed the guy taking it off, is indeed one of the two live ones. The rest must be made up by the one that impregnated newt's dad, and then three of the people from the rescue party. So its the queen, plus three drones. Sufficient to help set up the intial process of starting the hive and grabbing, relatively defenseless colonists. The best weapons they had for small arms fire, and seismic survey charges according to the movie. So its not hard for three aliens to grab people. Even one or two could have started the process of collecting hosts, while the others tended to the queen.

Ok so then you have 4 aliens - 3 drones and 1 Queen.  I guess that is enough to build a hive.

But what if there was only the Queen?  What would a lone Queen do?  That is the real question.

[gameoverman]

Why do we assume those were the only six huggers before all hell broke loose?

Small colony - one Operation, one Medlab.

Besides, SiL, it is you are arguing that it only takes a few aliens to start a hive. 

[Ballzanya]

Ya mean like Ripley?

she could have been, but she wasn't nabbed, so this essay in hindsight argues that two hosts are usually grabbed by an alien about to molt into a queen. One to form the egg containing a facehugger and one to have the facehugger impregnate. These hosts are grabbed in farily close succession to one another, as the queen intends to then settle down and finish the process of reaching full maturity.

What it was born a Queen - why would the Queen egg morph if she could just lay eggs?

well.. hmm. supposely the article, website.. whatever. is making the claims, i don't necessarily support them all. But im just reporting what its theories are and apparently when the queen is about to settle down, she requires one adult alien to help feed her nutrients, cocoon her egg laying sac to the wall and ceiling of the hive and help get hosts once she is ready to lay the eggs. If she doesn't, she in an immobile state, won't be able to do those things. Implying its all instinctive and she cannot ignore the drive to settle down and grow the egg laying sac once she has reached full maturity.
And in a rare case, a backup if the egg laying sac becomes damaged. She could still reproduce, and perhaps prep the egg to carry a queen facehugger maybe. (if any viable host existed in alien 3, that didn't have a death already accounted for by something else, this would be the only viable theory as to how the egg got there in alien 3, but there are also issues with it, as we account for the whereabouts of the queen the whole time she is in the sulaco dropship and the sulaco at the end of aliens.)

Well hang on..  does the Queen need her egg sac to make eggs or what?  Alien 3 seems to say no, but we don't know how those eggs got there.

The only way to do so without it, is to egg morph someone, as the queen apparently still would have the spores inside her body, but no yolk, or natural "pseudo host" to have them naturally integrate with one another in the egg sac. The loss of the egg sac doesn't mean, she loses the internal spores. But i doubt she has that many as clearly one egg can be layed at a time while others are being prepped inside the sac. She can't just lay the spore and have it leave her body through the opening in which the egg laying sac was connected to, since its only half the egg. The same way a sperm is only half what will become a zygote.

A gross analogy woud be if you cut someone's penis off. They wouldn't stop producing sperm in the testicles, but there's no delivery system anymore. lol. But if the sperm was still extracted and used in invitro fertilization it would work just fine. (sorry, but its the closest way to explain such a foreign concept)

Yeah but we can clearly see eggs in the Sulaco and the only logical way was if the Queen put them there.  It would also be too much of a coincidence that one of those eggs (if there was more than one) contained a queen-facehugger if someone else put them there.

well, theres only one egg first of all. Really not allowing for anything but the queen facehugger scenario. Plus yes the queen had to put it there for it be a queen egg or it would just be too convenient. Its just a mystery how it got there. Now if the queen doesn't need organic matter to combine with the spore taking the place of the "pseudo-spore" or yolk that would normally combine with it in the egg sac, i suppose you could say the queen used something else to create the egg. But i think it stretches believability a little too much.
Its just poor writing that lead to the unexplained egg onboard the sulaco. You'd have to believe that the queen escaped to some other part of the sulaco while we thought she was hiding in the landing gear of the dropship the whole time and then managed to sneak back in. lol.
It really is unexplainable. Unless her arms for long enough to reach into the sub-flooring, like when she was reaching for newt and she placed the egg where it ended up during that time. But then again how far was that location from the dropship.

[SiL]

Small colony - one Operation, one Medlab.

That doesn't answer my question in the slightest.

Besides, SiL, it is you are arguing that it only takes a few aliens to start a hive. 

And you're trying to throw in a host of other crap to try and disprove it, so I'm adapting to your argument.

[Ballzanya]

I only saw maybe 6 facehuggers in medlab.  Two were alive, and one was removed before embryo implantation.  So, you maybe have one Queen and two drones.  If this was enough to build the hive - ?

That might be just what facehuggers were captured, not a definitive number of initial facehuggers from the group sent out to rescue Newt's family and investigate the Derelict.

They only captured two.  The others they would have gotten off the hosts after it came off like with Kane.

If they captured more - why would'nt Burke use them against the rest?

Here, you can clearly see there are 6 facehuggers - allowing for only 3 aliens to have been born initially:

whos to say the dead ones, didn't implant embryos in people, but were kept for study? We only know that two facehuggers hadn't implanted embryos yet. The one removed before embryo implantation in which they killed the guy taking it off, is indeed one of the two live ones. The rest must be made up by the one that impregnated newt's dad, and then three of the people from the rescue party. So its the queen, plus three drones. Sufficient to help set up the intial process of starting the hive and grabbing, relatively defenseless colonists. The best weapons they had for small arms fire, and seismic survey charges according to the movie. So its not hard for three aliens to grab people. Even one or two could have started the process of collecting hosts, while the others tended to the queen.

Ok so then you have 4 aliens - 3 drones and 1 Queen.  I guess that is enough to build a hive.

But what if there was only the Queen?  What would a lone Queen do?  That is the real question.

I think the article i mentioned and what i explained covered that. So i guess you'd have egg morphing in that scenario but by the queen and it doesn't necessarily need to be only to create a queen embryo. The article explains that the queen can prep the eggs as to create whatever was needed.
Of course she would have to egg morph hosts before she settled down to grow the egg laying tube. iIf she is in part of her cyclical egg laying phase where she needs more queens to go out and seek new hives or replace her if she is dying, she will egg morph a person, and cocoon a host for it and prep it to be a queen egg. If she needs warriors she will prep the egg created via egg morphing to create a warrior to help get more hosts.
I suppose egg morphing is undeniably essential but only if a queen is born first.

however we do not know which alien was born first. The queen could have been first, second, third or fourth. I
The queen could have been born by one of the facehuggers that happened to be a queen egg, or if a drone was first it could have grabbed hosts to egg morph and prep the egg to be a queen egg.
so you don't necessarily need the theory that one molted into a queen, unless egg morphing was not considered valid. in that case, I guess you can't deny that one molted into a queen(no im not going to lick colin's balls.. hear me out) Unless you accept the view that one of the eggs out of that got either newt's dad, or the others that went to search for him, was impregnated by a queen facehugger. But you have to void the two embryo ability, as it was invented yet, and cannot enter the mathematical equation of how many aliens should have resulted.
Damn, what a mess. lol

There are however three ways to get a queen without resorting to molting.

1. Egg morphing by a warrior to prep the egg to grow a facehugger containing a queen embryo.
2. Queen facehugger impregnates one of the colonists.
3. In the event of the queen facehugger being considered non-canon, a queen is born by a regular facehugger and never needed to be prepped by another alien.

If egg morphing and queen facehugger are regarded as non-canon. (the queen facehugger i don't think can be retroactively fitted back in Aliens where it was never intended, so i don't think its the most viable option here, and probably can't be used, but it seems more canonical than molting however.)

You still had the up to that point in the alien lore, regular facehuggers implanting people, out of a large number of eggs there would be more than one that would have facehuggers carrying queen embryos, and out of 6 facehuggers, 1 was a queen.
There could have been lots of eggs containing queen bearing facehuggers in the derelict ship, considering that they were gathered and not just laid by a queen onto the ship.

[gameoverman]

Small colony - one Operation, one Medlab.

That doesn't answer my question in the slightest.

Well I'm going by the evidence onscreen.  It's up to you to prove there are more facehuggers around somewhere.

Besides, SiL, it is you are arguing that it only takes a few aliens to start a hive. 

And you're trying to throw in a host of other crap to try and disprove it, so I'm adapting to your argument.

I agree that 3 aliens and a Queen could start a hive. 

One alien and a Queen is possible, but stretching it a little.

One Queen only - a lot more difficult to imagine.

[gameoverman]

I only saw maybe 6 facehuggers in medlab.  Two were alive, and one was removed before embryo implantation.  So, you maybe have one Queen and two drones.  If this was enough to build the hive - ?

That might be just what facehuggers were captured, not a definitive number of initial facehuggers from the group sent out to rescue Newt's family and investigate the Derelict.

They only captured two.  The others they would have gotten off the hosts after it came off like with Kane.

If they captured more - why would'nt Burke use them against the rest?

Here, you can clearly see there are 6 facehuggers - allowing for only 3 aliens to have been born initially:

whos to say the dead ones, didn't implant embryos in people, but were kept for study? We only know that two facehuggers hadn't implanted embryos yet. The one removed before embryo implantation in which they killed the guy taking it off, is indeed one of the two live ones. The rest must be made up by the one that impregnated newt's dad, and then three of the people from the rescue party. So its the queen, plus three drones. Sufficient to help set up the intial process of starting the hive and grabbing, relatively defenseless colonists. The best weapons they had for small arms fire, and seismic survey charges according to the movie. So its not hard for three aliens to grab people. Even one or two could have started the process of collecting hosts, while the others tended to the queen.

Ok so then you have 4 aliens - 3 drones and 1 Queen.  I guess that is enough to build a hive.

But what if there was only the Queen?  What would a lone Queen do?  That is the real question.

I think the article i mentioned and what i explained covered that. So i guess you'd have egg morphing in that scenario but by the queen and it doesn't necessarily need to be only to create a queen embryo. The article explains that the queen can prep the eggs as to create whatever was needed.
Of course she would have to egg morph hosts before she settled down to grow the egg laying tube. iIf she is in part of her cyclical egg laying phase where she needs more queens to go out and seek new hives or replace her if she is dying, she will egg morph a person, and cocoon a host for it and prep it to be a queen egg. If she needs warriors she will prep the egg created via egg morphing to create a warrior to help get more hosts.
I suppose egg morphing is undeniably essential but only if a queen is born first.

however we do not know which alien was born first. The queen could have been first, second, third or fourth. If anything but first, egg morphing would not necessarily have had to take place to start the infestation.

Yeah but it contradicts Alien 3 that says a Queen can lay eggs without an egg sac.  And in Alien 3 it was obviously two facehuggers - one to impregnate Ripley and one to impregnate the dog/ox.  It wasn't the super facehugger that got Ripley because you see a normal one facehugging her.

[dDave]

This must set the record for the longest thread on something no one has actually seen yet.

yeah, he is really right with that, when i looked yesterday in this thread, it was 55 pages long, but now^^ 120^^ pages, man thats crazy...
i want to know what thing are you discussing, but i have no lust to read over 60 pages, when there is standing every page the same, like in the 50 before....
guys, isnt it better to wait for the movie???

but on the other side^^, respect for such a thread!

[SiL]

I agree that 3 aliens and a Queen could start a hive. 

One alien and a Queen is possible, but stretching it a little.

One Queen only - a lot more difficult to imagine.

And who's to say all those huggers didn't come from the investigative team?

Someone goes out, something bad happens. More people are sent out to investigate, now armed with knowledge of what to expect to happen. They themselves get huggered, the people brought back, and all hell breaks loose not long after.

[Master]

Still super facehugger is the best clue to explain Alien3. If we assume that queen can lay emergency egg, that is carying super facehugger able to implant two people, that is explaining all. But this did not appeared in TR of A3 and therfore is not canon, is it?

Going back to AvP-R. In this film there is on need for second RC, because we have got two facehuggers which will give us two drones. Two adult aliens is just enough to protect young predalien queen when she will create her own egg sack, and one of them can easily grab hosts in hospital. Place full of potential hosts. I can`t see reason for this stupid idea.

[Xenomorphine]

I maintain that it would only take one Queen to get things going. All it has to do is lay some eggs. Whether or not it starts physically constructing the hive material does not matter.

If an ordinary adult happens to be the one let loose, then it could egg a victim and make a Queen facehugger.

In the former, only one derelict facehugger is required. In the latter, one derelict facehugger and two extra victims.

Either way only necessitates the Jordans' to be the only ones required.

[SiL]

Also taking into account the atmosphere processors are fully automated; the colonists are there in case something goes wrong. There'd be little to no reason for them to go to the processor, so the Queen would have a nice neat place in the sub levels to sit around waiting to become mature enough to poop out eggs.

[Predalienslayer]

Well, I'd have to say that although I don't mind this new reproductive system, there have been made a lot of points against it.

I'm gonna say it is something unique to Predalien. Something in the Predator genetics prevents it from developing an egg sack, and its reproductive system functions in an entirely different way.

But IMO, egg-morphing sucks. The idea of transforming a human into an egg with a facehugger inside? Doesn't work for me at all.

[gameoverman]

Also taking into account the atmosphere processors are fully automated; the colonists are there in case something goes wrong. There'd be little to no reason for them to go to the processor, so the Queen would have a nice neat place in the sub levels to sit around waiting to become mature enough to poop out eggs.

Yeah but she has to go out and grab hosts, so she can't build an egg sac yet.

[The Chibi Kiriyama]

I'm gonna say it is something unique to Predalien. Something in the Predator genetics prevents it from developing an egg sack, and its reproductive system functions in an entirely different way.

Colin is clearly saying this is something all Queens go through, so that doesn't really hold up.

But IMO, egg-morphing sucks. The idea of transforming a human into an egg with a facehugger inside? Doesn't work for me at all.

Why? It's an alien creature. The thing has a penis for a head. It's not as if it's making it any more weird.