David the creator

[Voodoo Magic]

True, it has no purpose after the impregnation and is designed to die. But maybe it is more of a strategic choice then one of conservation. A victim  that has no recollection of what happend and does not know that it is infected has advantages in a lot of situations. Especially if the host is not in a hive.

A strategic choice? Nah, I think you're giving the facehugger too much intelligent credit here, to assess the situation and administer amnesia accordingly. Its got one job to do, then die.

Again, why wouldn't the facehugger inject its full load of toxin into a host regardless if it was in a hive or out of one? What advantage is there to inject less toxin into someone in the hive? Just give hosts in both situations amnesia. Why would it hold back? The facehugger is going to die anyway. And the toxin's main purpose is sedation. I can't find the evolutionary logic in that approach.

[The Kurgan]

True, it has no purpose after the impregnation and is designed to die. But maybe it is more of a strategic choice then one of conservation. A victim  that has no recollection of what happend and does not know that it is infected has advantages in a lot of situations. Especially if the host is not in a hive.

A strategic choice? Nah, I think you're giving the facehugger too much intelligent credit here, to assess the situation and administer amnesia accordingly. Its got one job to do, then die.

Again, why wouldn't the facehugger inject its full load of toxin into a host regardless if it was in a hive or out of one? What advantage is there to inject less toxin into someone in the hive? Just give hosts in both situations amnesia. Why would it hold back? The facehugger is going to die anyway. And the toxin's main purpose is sedation. I can't find the evolutionary logic in that approach.

The facehugger itself does not need to be intelligent, it would be enough that it could notice the difference between in hive/near queen, outside/away from queen or something to that extent.

I can't think of a reason why  they should not give the hosts in the hive amnesia though...

But again, maybe they do. I dont think you can clearly rule out in Aliens that the woman did not have amnesia.

[Voodoo Magic]

But again, maybe they do. I dont think you can clearly rule out in Aliens that the woman did not have amnesia.

Agreed. That can't be ruled out.

[The Old One]

You're not giving them enough credit. They strategize.
As shown by a tendency to wait, hide and then attack.

LV-426/Acheron, Sevastopol Station & "Planet 4"


https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/index.php?topic=60415.0
 

[Voodoo Magic]

You know I'm strictly a film canon only guy, Old One. 

[The Old One]

 
The Med-Lab & David's Lab then.

[Voodoo Magic]

But wait, hide and attack are simple behavioral responses even found in insects.

I guess I should have better clarified myself. I don't give facehuggers credit to effectly strategize a toxin deployment to maximize an amnesia side effect in certain situations.

[Still Collating...]

But wait, hide and attack are simple behavioral responses even found in insects.

I guess I should have better clarified myself. I don't give facehuggers credit to effectly strategize a toxin deployment to maximize an amnesia side effect in certain situations.

Some insects can choose how much venom they use when they sting. I even think it's the same wasp that inspired the alien. It has to give the right dose.

As for benefits? Lone facehugger - amnesia - easier spreading. Now, when you're in a hive, not only do you not need the amnesia, but it won't make sense to you when you wake up if you had amnesia. So maybe it's a backup option? Hear me out: in a hive, the chances are you're gonna die there. BUT if you wake up, escape, you'll run away faster and spread the alien better if you remember the aliens taking you?
I admit it's not a great hypotheses.
It would make more sense if everyone gets amnesia regardless of the situation (even Ripley from Alien 3 had it) but pair it up with a "longer" gestation and make sure the facehugger hides. If you get saved in a hive and you don't remember being hugged, there's more chance that you'll be let to live by your friends if they don't know you're "expecting". If you're alone in the world when unexpectedly you get hugged, even better.

Amnesia plus a longer gestation period is a perfect combo for infecting a huge area, especially in the first wave of facehuggings. Desirable advantages when you remember you can't hide from the little bugger and it can melt through small barriers.

[Voodoo Magic]

But wait, hide and attack are simple behavioral responses even found in insects.

I guess I should have better clarified myself. I don't give facehuggers credit to effectly strategize a toxin deployment to maximize an amnesia side effect in certain situations.

Some insects can choose how much venom they use when they sting. I even think it's the same wasp that inspired the alien. It has to give the right dose.

I would buy that premise more if the main purpose of the facehugger's toxin was amnesia, rather than a side-effect byproduct of it. But since the toxin's primary reason is to sedate the host, immobilizing the host to assure a safe chestburster implantation, then I can't see the facehugger limiting that dose on any basis, therefore resulting in a co-equal byproduct of amnesia side effect for every facehug.

Unless we start hypothesizing two separate toxin excretions, then all bets are off. 

As for benefits? Lone facehugger - amnesia - easier spreading. Now, when you're in a hive, not only do you not need the amnesia, but it won't make sense to you when you wake up if you had amnesia. So maybe it's a backup option? Hear me out: in a hive, the chances are you're gonna die there. BUT if you wake up, escape, you'll run away faster and spread the alien better if you remember the aliens taking you?
I admit it's not a great hypotheses.

I would agree with that sentiment. 

If it causes Amnesia, it definitely would make more sense if every host gets amnesia regardless of the situation.

[SM]

I always associated that with dissociative amnesia, i.e. emotional shock amnesia. Did you take that as a byproduct of the facehugger's toxin?

I took it that way. If a victim does not know it got infected it will propably carry the infection elsewhere, not try to inform other potential victims of the danger, not kill itself or try to get it out or something like that.

Yup.

[SiL]

I mean, I guess? That means he woke up, saw his dead friends, and then passed out again in the same room with them?

I guess it's possible?

Yeah, that's basically what the film shows. He's huddled behind a container holding a metal bar, clearly he got up and moved around.

Meanwhile, we know he saw the egg and facehugger, he was awake and screaming before he got facehugged.

As SM said, he's still got his eyes shut during that scene.

[Necronomicon II]

[Frosty Venom]

Just read the Alien 3 novelisation to see the cold instinctual intelligence of a facehugger.

[Xenomrph]

There is no precedent in the video games as far as I can remember at the top of my head but some of the novels seem to imply hosts still being conscious, namely sea of sorrows.

There are definitely conscious hosts in AvP2 on PC, you come across them in the Marine campaign.

I always associated that with dissociative amnesia, i.e. emotional shock amnesia. Did you take that as a byproduct of the facehugger's toxin?

I took it that way. If a victim does not know it got infected it will propably carry the infection elsewhere, not try to inform other potential victims of the danger, not kill itself or try to get it out or something like that.

I'm 100% sure there are infected people in the comics and novels who knew they were infected when they woke up. I know Church in 'Labyrinth' remembered his facehugging in pretty great detail, off the top of my head.

As for facehugger intelligence, I like to think of them as more than just an "ambulatory penis" operating on pure instinct, that they have some degree of intelligence.

Then again I'm also a fan of the videogames and whatnot where this is literally demonstrated to be the case.

[The Cruentus]

If I'm remembering correctly, I always thought the general consensus was that the facehugger administers a quick acting sedative toxin, rendering their "victim" unconscious. There is no amnesia in play, the attack and sedative effects are just that fast.

Now if it is indeed a toxin, it will not impact all creatures equally.  Heck, it won't even affect all humans equally. For instance, less than 1% of patients under anesthesia during surgery experience the hellish 'anesthesia awareness' where they actually become conscious during surgery, but can't control their body.

So generally, with only a rudimentary understanding of the biology of facehuggers, to me it's fair to suggest that it may be possible for a host to become conscious during the process, human or otherwise.

The amnesia has happened to multiple hosts and it usually when they have been rendered unconscious by the hugger, those who do know what has happened to them either was cocooned and conscious throughout or was cocooned and just so happened to have seen the process first hand on someone else who was cocooned.

I always associated that with dissociative amnesia, i.e. emotional shock amnesia. Did you take that as a byproduct of the facehugger's toxin?

I took it that way. If a victim does not know it got infected it will propably carry the infection elsewhere, not try to inform other potential victims of the danger, not kill itself or try to get it out or something like that.

My, my. Well that certainly would be the perfect organism, wouldn't it.

Still, based on that premise, I would continue to believe that with approximately one out of every 1,000 humans or so, such affect wouldn't properly take hold, based on what we see in medical science today.

*Edit: Addendum

For what it's worth, thinking this through a bit more, cocooned victims appear to have clear memories that they have been impregnated by a facehugger. It's doubtful an amnesia effect is only being selectively administered based on the situation, and therefore I would personally lean back to Kane having dissociative amnesia.

The reason why cocooned victims likely remember is that they have not been sedated at all, Verheiden was cocooned and conscious while having a hugger on him,  it is possible a facehugger won't sedate cocooned victims because it is unnecessary, the hosts can't escape or fight back.

There is no precedent in the video games as far as I can remember at the top of my head but some of the novels seem to imply hosts still being conscious, namely sea of sorrows.

There are definitely conscious hosts in AvP2 on PC, you come across them in the Marine campaign.

There is no facehugged hosts that are still conscious, I don't think anyone meant those hosts who have already been impregnated and are asking to be killed.
verheided was still conscious while being impregnated.