"Fans" are Embarrassing

[Ijapa]

But how do we draw the line? AvP, the ideas it brought with it... more expansive than anything in the two Predator movies.

And it seems that people have an aversion to new ideas. Few like to keep an open mind.

It all comes down to your imagination. If you know everything about them they become less scary. The whole point to the predator franchise is that they're an alien race who have standards that we hardly know anything about, they're unpredictable and monstrous and that is why they're threatening. If we knew everything about them we'd lose interest in watching them.

Your imagination is a powerful tool and taking that away can ruin an entire film. Do you think ALIEN or JAWS would have worked as well if we saw the creatures in full at the beginning of the film?

Well this is the reason I want to see new things in this movie - We already know too much about them.

If Predators was just a rinse and repeat of the same Predator creature we've been exposed to... it would be boring.

This film has a number of new things going for it. The dogs, the hawks, the extreme weapons. The difference between this "super" Predator and the ones we've already seen.

If we already know "too much" about them why do you want more?

I think the implication is that this is something new and makes us re-think what we thought we knew before. Basically, that we don't have the Predators all figured out.

[jordan]

As far as I'm concerned only Predator and Predator 2 are canon.

[MoBiUGeArSkIn]

But how do we draw the line? AvP, the ideas it brought with it... more expansive than anything in the two Predator movies.

And it seems that people have an aversion to new ideas. Few like to keep an open mind.

It all comes down to your imagination. If you know everything about them they become less scary. The whole point to the predator franchise is that they're an alien race who have standards that we hardly know anything about, they're unpredictable and monstrous and that is why they're threatening. If we knew everything about them we'd lose interest in watching them.

Your imagination is a powerful tool and taking that away can ruin an entire film. Do you think ALIEN or JAWS would have worked as well if we saw the creatures in full at the beginning of the film?

Well this is the reason I want to see new things in this movie - We already know too much about them.

If Predators was just a rinse and repeat of the same Predator creature we've been exposed to... it would be boring.

This film has a number of new things going for it. The dogs, the hawks, the extreme weapons. The difference between this "super" Predator and the ones we've already seen.

If we already know "too much" about them why do you want more?

I think the implication is that this is something new and makes us re-think what we thought we knew before. Basically, that we don't have the Predators all figured out.

Exactly!

less might be more on occasion. But this isn't one of those occasions. We need something more. The franchise needs something more.

And it looks like we'll get it.

[Alien³]

Even so it might not be good, but we'll see.

[MoBiUGeArSkIn]

For me, the only thing that could spoil it... is if the design of this "Super" pred is especially far removed from what we've already seen.

Ya know, like literally painting him black with red eyes and... a different face or something.

That would be daft. So long as it looks like an extention of what we do know it might be cool. I didn't mind all the new masks and stuff in the first AvP films. The suits were just too cumbersome. But that's something they can fix with better designed SFX. If the creature is to be large.

[Xhan]

But how do we draw the line? AvP, the ideas it brought with it... more expansive than anything in the two Predator movies.

And it seems that people have an aversion to new ideas. Few like to keep an open mind.

It all comes down to your imagination. If you know everything about them they become less scary. The whole point to the predator franchise is that they're an alien race who have standards that we hardly know anything about, they're unpredictable and monstrous and that is why they're threatening. If we knew everything about them we'd lose interest in watching them.

Your imagination is a powerful tool and taking that away can ruin an entire film. Do you think ALIEN or JAWS would have worked as well if we saw the creatures in full at the beginning of the film?

Well this is the reason I want to see new things in this movie - We already know too much about them.

If Predators was just a rinse and repeat of the same Predator creature we've been exposed to... it would be boring.

This film has a number of new things going for it. The dogs, the hawks, the extreme weapons. The difference between this "super" Predator and the ones we've already seen.

You seriously need to consider your slant before committing words. You basically contradict your self several times, when all you need to say is "I like the script."

Seeing "new things" does not obviate mystery, nor does enhance it particularly when the "mystery" as you put it is gone after you watch the f**king movie.

Your justifications don't have much ground other than opinion to stand on, which is just as easily covered by saying "I think the negative opinions are dismissive and unfair while I like the script."

The Litvak/Finch script does jack all to enhance their culture or broaden the horizon in any way shape or form, in fact it does the opposite by introducing artificial antagonists with one shot superficial motives.

[MoBiUGeArSkIn]

How is there any contradiction in what I've said?

And whilst the Predators script isn't chapter and verse on what makes the creatures tick, it at least introduces new elements.

We've not seen them fight. We've not seen or heard of them hunting something to test out/improve their gear next time out.

Better something be introduced than nothing.

Fox has apparently optioned sequels to this film. Any ground it lays may well be explored in the future.

A simple rinse and repeat excercise is not what this franchise needs. There's more potential on display here than in Predator 2, which just relocated the creature.

[Jonny05]

It's gunna be crap, simple as that.  The script is garbage and not a patch on the original film.  It's even more of a joke than AvP 1 and 2, especially that blood Dutch scene! 

[MoBiUGeArSkIn]

That scene is an alternate. A side. It's unlikely that will be used. Even assuming the script that leaked is the final, shooting script.

[Xhan]

How is there any contradiction in what I've said?

You say they need new fiddly bits and then give the reason why new fiddly bits removes the mystery to the creature and makes them mundane.

You say look at all this new stuff, it's great; there's nothing wrong with it. Anyone who's even gone near the EU can tell you NONE of what's been introduced is new, right down to BSP's being likened to "Bad Bloods".

We've not seen or heard of them hunting something to test out/improve their gear next time out.

R U 4 SRS?

Scar's vision modes and rapid fire plasma caster kick the shit out of the previous two's and Wolf has a tactical overlay complete with 3d mapping and he uses passive weapons and a multifacted interchangeable plasma kit complete with variable output strength, not even counting his ridiculously over burdened weapon rack and magic instatranmission super omnispatial GPS cam, complete with magical external view where there are no cameras present.

Progression of gear is out in front EVERY time we see them.

[MoBiUGeArSkIn]

How is there any contradiction in what I've said?

You say they need new fiddly bits and then give the reason why new fiddly bits removes the mystery to the creature and makes them mundane.

You say look at all this new stuff, it's great; there's nothing wrong with it. Anyone who's even gone near the EU can tell you NONE of what's been introduced is new, right down to BSP's being likened to "Bad Bloods".

We've not seen or heard of them hunting something to test out/improve their gear next time out.

R U 4 SRS?

Scar's vision modes and rapid fire plasma caster kick the shit out of the previous two's and Wolf has a tactical overlay complete with 3d mapping and he uses passive weapons and a multifacted interchangeable plasma kit complete with variable output strength, not even counting his ridiculously over burdened weapon rack and magic instatranmission super omnispatial GPS cam, complete with magical external view where there are no cameras present.

Progression of gear is out in front EVERY time we see them.

Are you reading me wrong? I never said anything about removing the mystery of the creature. Someone else said knowing too much removes the mystery. I pointed out that showing things we haven't seen before proves we don't know them well at all, and provides further mystery.

Ijapa understood what I was getting at, up there.

And whilst the occasional gizmo is introduced, we've never seen them use something, have it fail, and then go back to the drawing board. It's only alluded to in the Predators script when that guy they find mentions it. But I'd like to see it explored further in some way.

"Scar's vision modes and rapid fire plasma caster"

... he fired a bit faster so it's considered "rapid fire"? Like... he actually had a rapid fire version of the weapon, and it's not simply the fact that the script required him to shoot these things quickly?

In Predator 2, the creature actually sees in infrared... when the creature removed its mask in the first film, it couldn't see in infrared.

I assume he was short sighted or something.

End of the day, the script shows us Predators doing something a little differently. More power to that.

[SiL]

Better something be introduced than nothing.

No. No.

That line of thinking is what gets us Jaws the Revenge and AvP Requiem.

New does not mean good, it does not mean bad, it means new. It might be good. People like the Queen. It might be ass-tastic - Few people like the Newborn and the way the PredAlien was executed in AvPR.

A shark does not need to be reinvented to be scary; it's a God-damned shark. The reason every shark movie since Jaws has failed, however, is that sharks are a pretty limited concept. They're in the water, people with boats are in the water, there are only so many options.

The Predator is more diverse, however.

You can drop a Predator in any environment and make it unique by simply changing the situation it moves into. A zombie's a zombie, but by just changing the location, or changing the movie's thematic stance, you can turn a horde of brain-sucking monsters into a new and unique threat every time.

Adding arbitrary elements leads to convolution and a series getting retarded by its own standards.

What these movies need to do is develop what's already there and logically expand what we have. You get to have your cake and eat it - You aren't stepping on people's toes, but you are giving people something fresh, at least in execution.

The idea of bad blood Predators works within what's set down in the original movies and expands the idea of good sportsmanship in the Preds - Or at least their facade of good sportsmanship. "You won, now I blow myself up. Ha-ha!" doesn't seem very sporting.

What we get in this new script ... I dunno. It's having its cake, eating it, and then eating someone else's cake too, just to be a dick.

[Xhan]

proves we don't know them well at all, and provides further mystery.

doesn't prove anything as they act in accordance with the rest, "mutations" and all.

he actually had a rapid fire version of the weapon, and it's not simply the fact that the script required him to shoot these things quickly?

Uh, yeah it does, and looking at the Arnie flight from the log fight pretty much sets it in stone as does all the new fangled bits in P2, including the expanding of the "tribal" motif.

when the creature removed its mask in the first film, it couldn't see in infrared.

:|

k...

[Jango1201]

All i want to know is why can't we have a reboot without having extremely over-exagerated characters ad weapons. Why can't we have a reboot with slightly alterted concepts of the first two films and not going completely overboard? We don't need to see new hunting methods (especially ones that don't make sense) or "bigger and badder" predators. I think an alien thats 7'2-7'6 with a crab face and hunts my ass for sport is scary and badass enough. If its not broken don't fix it.

[SM]

This isn't a reboot - it's a sequel.

If its not broken don't fix it.

True, but you have to bring something new to the party otherwise it's just a rehash what's gone before.