AvPGalaxy Forums

The good folk over at HN Entertainment recently had the opportunity to talk to Amalgamated Dynamics Inc‘s Alec Gillis and the topic of Neill Blomkamp’s Alien 5 inevitably came up. Though unable to talk in much detail about ADI’s work on the film, Alec did reveal that Neill had been intending to go practical with the Alien effects and re-affirmed that the asthetic would have referred closer to H.R Giger’s original design.

"That's why I was looking forward to Neill Blomkamp's Alien 5 because that would have given us the opportunity to do more in the spirit of Giger's alien. We were looking at the 1979 alien all the way but Neill did want changes to make on it. As great as Neill's CGI looks, I don't know if you've seen the latest thing he did Anthem? His CGI just looks so there and present, Chris Harvey his VFX supervisor they just have a great team.

And I said to Neill like 'Why aren't you doing this all digitally?' cause if it's biomechanical and harder-edged it lends itself to digital and I'm just surprised that a digital. He said 'I want real a real man in a suit on set because it forces you into a certain way of shooting that would be more like what Ridley Scott did in the first film. If it's all digital I won't have those parameters work within and it's gonna end up looking like something different and I don't want that, I want it to look like Ridley Scott did it'. That's how he thinks and I can guarantee you there's no studio executive in the world that would say that because they don't see things in that specific and nuanced of a way."

Last October Blomkamp released an image of a marquette that ADI had done for the film, showing an Alien that looked very much like Giger’s original Alien – except this one had an extra set of arms.

View this post on Instagram

Repost from @neillblomkamp who allowed us to play in his ALIEN5 universe. Happy he's letting you all see some of the design work we did. There's no doubt in my mind you would have loved what Neill had planned. Project supervisor @h2.originals This sculpt is by @monsterman03gmail along with @monstermania2017 and @ayumi.fx . Molds by @jon_k_miller with tech work by @saratheterra and Brian Clawson. @paulkomoda had a hand in other design/sculpt on A5 too. If I missed anybody's name, chime in!

A post shared by alec_gillis (@alec_gillis) on Oct 5, 2018 at 3:06pm PDT

Though Neill Blomkamp has previously said that his Alien 5 is dead in the water, James Cameron recently commented that he was working on making Blomkamp’s vision of an Alien film a relatively. How serious that comment was still remains to be seen.

Keep a close eye on Alien vs. Predator Galaxy for the latest Alien news! You can follow us on Facebook, Twitter and Instagram to get the latest on your social media walls. You can also join in with fellow Alien fans on our forums!

Link To Post

It's a shame it wasn't made, I hated Prometheus and covenant. Puppetry and practical effects look better,cgi to me is used way too much,same as green screens. Movies today look more like video games.

Man, all Cameron said was 'yeaaaah, working on that!', when someone asked him about Blomkamp's Alien project. Imo that translates to: Game over man, game over!!

Anyway, a good Alien movie would use both practical effects and cgi.

Quote from: Jesscobb on Feb 25, 2019, 11:46:02 AM
It's a shame it wasn't made...

I'd be interested to know how Blomkaliens would have been like  :)

Quote from: Jesscobb on Feb 25, 2019, 11:46:02 AM
I hated Prometheus and covenant. Puppetry and practical effects look better,cgi to me is used way too much,same as green screens. Movies today look more like video games.

but BUT! Prometheus had a decent balance between practical effects & cgi ??? and the Engineer/Prometheus setting is real and solid as life itself  :-\

What could have (and should have) been  :'(

I hope this film gets made!  (Jumping in to the conversation)

I hope it doesn't! Blomkamp is a very mediocre director.

My problem is that Blomkamp has shown no growth as a storyteller. If anything, he has regressed after Chappie. His shorts, including Anthem, are trailers with no self-contained stories to tell. Just a collection of cool visuals.

I hope they retcon the entire franchise to only Alien and Aliens(plus Isolation) being canon.

I've seen his short with Sigourney and that was, from what I remember, pretty bad.

All of those kind of news are just depressing at this point.

Quote from: Jesscobb on Feb 25, 2019, 11:46:02 AM
It's a shame it wasn't made, I hated Prometheus and covenant. Puppetry and practical effects look better,cgi to me is used way too much,same as green screens. Movies today look more like video games.

Quote from: Kane's other son on Feb 25, 2019, 02:16:58 PM
My problem is that Blomkamp has shown no growth as a storyteller. If anything, he has regressed after Chappie. His shorts, including Anthem, are trailers with no self-contained stories to tell. Just a collection of cool visuals.

You're looking at them wrong. The Oats Studio stuff is intentionally full of what amount to pitches. They aren't meant to be seen as self-contained end results. They show the potential of a concept and are shown around to other studios, in the hope of securing funding for full-length projects.

Of course, not surprising to hear.

#MakeItHappen Neil!

Whatever.

A new quote.
& A pastiche, one alteration maquette.

Spoiler

Poor alteration.

[close]

Why does that alien have four arms?

Because Neill Blomkamp.

Eh, I'm pretty sure it was to imply that that specific alien was going to molt into a queen, not that Big Chap was a queen all along.
No way to be sure though unless we see the script one day.

Well there's a lot of EU lore that would support a normal alien molting into a queen so I don't really see any issue with it

But...it makes sense for the first alien to be hatched would molt into a queen if it lived long enough. If it had a ridged head would you still hate it or does the fact it has a dome like BC make you hate it?

If it wasn't just Big Chap with two extra arms I might be more willing to buy it.  If it's supposed to be a molting into a queen, then it should display some of the queen's other signature traits as well.

Given the facility we saw in the early concept art, it seems to me that the film would have dealt with a Resurrection-esque mad scientist setup and Alien experimentation; if Goro-Alien isn't molting into a Queen, it could potentially be the result of some of WY's tests.

With any luck, we'll never know.

Quote from: The Old One on Feb 25, 2019, 10:14:24 PM

Quote from: JokersWarPig on Feb 25, 2019, 10:06:54 PM
But...it makes sense for the first alien to be hatched would molt into a queen if it lived long enough. If it had a ridged head would you still hate it or does the fact it has a dome like BC make you hate it?

The idea that the Big Chaps became Warriors was bad enough, but the idea that they become Queens is even worse.

To each their own I guess.

Quote from: The Old One on Feb 25, 2019, 10:14:24 PM
The idea that the Big Chaps became Warriors was bad enough, but the idea that they become Queens is even worse.

Why? I always love that theory and consider it as logical continuation of creature's evolution.

I don't really follow that logic. Nothing was replaced, it just got added to

Quote from: The Old One on Feb 25, 2019, 10:25:28 PM
Because you're essentially saying that  H.R Giger's creation is replaced with James Cameron's in due time, and that's immensely f**ked.

I think that Cameron's Queen stands on the same level with Giger's Alien in terms of design and in terms of valueness for franchise's lore.

---

Quote from: JokersWarPig on Feb 25, 2019, 10:27:43 PM
I don't really follow that logic. Nothing was replaced, it just got added to

Exactly

Quote from: The Old One on Feb 25, 2019, 10:32:46 PM
You're retroactively turning HR Giger's Alien into the juvenile or "immature" form of another creature, greatly diminishing the 1979 version.

Not at all. Didn't Giger himself admit that Queen was true to his original design?

Neill is great with visuals. I'm sure his practical alien/s would have been great. Yeah, practical always looks awesome, but it's expensive to do right. I'm sure his budget would have been big enough to do awesome work though.

Quote from: The Old One on Feb 25, 2019, 10:39:15 PM
He said it was a beautiful design and it is, a beautiful separate creature. Not a replacement.

Still, i don't understand how turning-into-queen idea devalues original creature to any degree. I mean, they belong to the same specie, so what the problem? Alien is perfect inteligent lethal creature, Queen is perfect inteligent creature that can birth death.

It's no a replacement, but she is the final boss/threat during the climax (a prequel to the bigger & badder fetish of recent years).

Quote from: The Old One on Feb 25, 2019, 10:59:54 PM
Because the H.R Giger design is perfect, there should be no afterwards, just variants.

Know what? I think that it turns into argument for the sake of argument and when it's the case i can be f**king rude and saying things about which i will regret. At the end of the day it's matter of personal taste. You think that Giger's design is perfect enough and there is no need for trying to overcome that. I disagree with that. So, i think it willbe be better if i stop right here.

Giger didn't think it was perfect.

"Art is never finished, only abandoned."

Quote from: The Old One on Feb 25, 2019, 10:59:54 PM
Because the H.R Giger design is perfect, there should be no afterwards, just variants.

Quote from: The Old One on Feb 25, 2019, 11:14:36 PM
No piece of art is perfect.

But they are complete.

Quote from: SM on Feb 25, 2019, 11:23:03 PM

Quote from: The Old One on Feb 25, 2019, 10:59:54 PM
Because the H.R Giger design is perfect, there should be no afterwards, just variants.

Quote from: The Old One on Feb 25, 2019, 11:14:36 PM
No piece of art is perfect.

But they are complete.

Now, that's a retcon :laugh:

Also he didn't like the tubes. I wonder if he was unhappy with some details in the Space Jockey.

Quote from: The Old One on Feb 25, 2019, 11:19:54 PM
George Lucas?

Touché.

So, not perfect then.

Righto.

Ash said it's perfect.

And so did David.  Now I'm confused.

Quote from: SM on Jul 24, 2013, 01:22:19 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pAyKJAtDNCw# (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pAyKJAtDNCw#)

If the studio would have let him, sure. Anyway i dont care, his ideas were fan fiction level.

I could do without retconning A3.  AR is the one he should ignore.

Let Blomkamp make his Alien5 and let Scott make his 3rd Alien Prequel... then EVERYTHING is done and wrapped up in neat little packages. BOTH would make back what was spent on making them and then some... After both films, 20th Century Fox can off and reboot the entire damn franchise and just do its thing from there on out with new directors and new characters. Dont get whats so hard about all this?!

Because no one wants a reboot that ignores Alien and/or Aliens?

Quote from: Local Trouble on Feb 25, 2019, 11:30:03 PM
Ash said it's perfect.

Ash lost his head.

This second pair of arms is a remarkably bad alteration to the original design.

I dig it.

Quote from: JokersWarPig on Feb 25, 2019, 09:51:20 PM
Eh, I'm pretty sure it was to imply that that specific alien was going to molt into a queen, not that Big Chap was a queen all along.
No way to be sure though unless we see the script one day.

That's the first thought that springs to mind but Carlos Huante shared some art from the project and it was all mutated Aliens, many of which had multiple limbs. I think it might have been experimentation.

Quote from: Oasis Nadrama on Feb 26, 2019, 04:36:18 AM
This second pair of arms is a remarkably bad alteration to the original design.

Looks pretty damn good.  A well balanced design that is respectful of the original and doesn't disturb it too much.

How is sticking titty arms in the front not disturbing it much?

Quote from: Corporal Hicks on Feb 26, 2019, 08:48:09 AM

Quote from: JokersWarPig on Feb 25, 2019, 09:51:20 PM
Eh, I'm pretty sure it was to imply that that specific alien was going to molt into a queen, not that Big Chap was a queen all along.
No way to be sure though unless we see the script one day.

That's the first thought that springs to mind but Carlos Huante shared some art from the project and it was all mutated Aliens, many of which had multiple limbs. I think it might have been experimentation.

If the arms are do to experimentation I still don't hate it. It's not as cool as if we were to see the evolution process on screen, but it's not bad either. Way better than the super fleshy AR experiments/aliens.

Quote from: SiL on Feb 26, 2019, 01:13:29 PM
How is sticking titty arms in the front not disturbing it much?

You always have to analyze the overall effect.  In this case it works well.  It is balanced by the dorsal tubes.  It looks mare insectile.

Quote from: Perfect-Organism on Feb 26, 2019, 02:05:15 PM

Quote from: SiL on Feb 26, 2019, 01:13:29 PM
How is sticking titty arms in the front not disturbing it much?

You always have to analyze the overall effect.  In this case it works well.  It is balanced by the dorsal tubes.  It looks mare insectile.

It makes it more insectile, but i find it way to topheavy. There is already so much going on in the upper half of the creature, more arms makes it too much imo.

In truth, it is probably ill-advised to ever really show the entire creature.  Otherwise it's just a man in a suit.  If you just see a small section and you see those extra hands, it is not really problematic.

The new design is no great revelation, but neither is it the disaster some people make it out to be.

Agreed Oasis Nadrama.

Quote from: Perfect-Organism on Feb 26, 2019, 02:05:15 PM
You always have to analyze the overall effect.

I am, and in this case I'm seeing arbitrarily bolted on arms interfering with the main arms' range of motion.

The more news that comes out about this film the more sad I get about it not happening.

The script then?

Quote from: The Old One on Feb 27, 2019, 11:37:12 AM
The script then?

Absolutely no reason why they can't give us an adaptation of it eventually, though I suspect they'd wait until Ridley finishes his trilogy. If there is a script, of course. Iirc, Cameron said there was one and Ridley said there wasn't?

Personally, I like this design. The arms look like a completely natural addition, unlike the additional mouthparts on the Predalien design. If this had the Winston ridged head, it might have even been my favourite ever design, but regardless, this sculpt has to be the most authentic Giger-like sculpt potentially for big screen treatment, that we've had in decades.

I suspect it's meant to be the 'ultimate Alien' arisen by genetic modification: Agile and fast enough to be a predatory menace without being a big target, but with the additional arms implying it can potentially lay eggs. The best of both worlds. That's just my guess, though. Can imagine it can could a lot more horrifying scenes death scenes with those additional arms, too: Imagine it holding a victim in the air, before it, crucifixion-style, while doing something slow and terrible with the secondary arms, below the victim's neck. Wouldn't even need to see anything aside from the agonised facial expressions and ominous noises. That's total Lambert territory...

The tail's useful, but those hands give it something more than a massive prehensile spear to do things to victims.

Doesn't come across as top-heavy to me. Those arms look relatively light.

The ultimate Alien is Isolation's H.R Giger interpretation.

Needs more condom lips.

Quote from: The Old One on Mar 05, 2019, 04:39:30 PM
The ultimate Alien is Isolation's H.R Giger interpretation.

Counter argument: no. His square jaw is ridiculous and makes him look blocky and lumpy, totally spoiling the sleeker, gaunt lines of Giger's Alien's face. And the digitigrade legs make it look gangly and awkwardly stretched

The face is a cliche monster face, yes- agreed. The H.R Giger's original "face" is superior.

I believe the "gangly" aspect's good though and the proportions, it's the perfect uncanny-valley
between the obvious man-in-a-suit and the unbelievable digital Alien.

(https://www.gamercast.net/media/blogs/gamercast/a/alien_isolation/alienisolation_1.jpg?mtime=1408452481)
(https://www.alphr.com/sites/alphr/files/2015/10/fear_games_alien_isolation.jpg)
(https://cdn.vox-cdn.com/thumbor/q08HkZfXgErDoUpPFbK6sV-xJTQ=/0x0:2000x1125/1600x900/cdn.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_image/image/40398354/alienisolation1.0.0.jpg)

Evocative of

Spoiler

(https://pmcdeadline2.files.wordpress.com/2014/05/hr_giger_alien__140513170753.jpg)

[close]

IMO

Quote from: SiL on Mar 05, 2019, 10:48:33 PMCounter argument: no. His square jaw is ridiculous and makes him look blocky and lumpy, totally spoiling the sleeker, gaunt lines of Giger's Alien's face. And the digitigrade legs make it look gangly and awkwardly stretched

Not unlike the AR version, on both counts.

No,

Spoiler

The AR version's chin's pointed, the AI version's chin's squared.

The AR version's legs are thin, the AI version's legs are thick.

[close]

I also dislike the perpetually hunched-over look, which is again typical monster fare.

Dang, SiL is just tearing Stompy to shreds.

The two jointed/chicken legs were unecessary.

I would've preferred a straight up recreation of big chap. But I can live with stompy.

Same. Despite some complains, it still looks great, at least on the games the aliens usually maintain their biomechanical details. Even on AVP2010 where they copied the predator design from the avp movies, they decided to follow the Cameron aliens instead of the ADI version.

Regardless Stompy is on the top of the aliens's portayal on videogames. But the AVP2 alien with a Giger skin mod looks pretty good as well:

(https://i.pinimg.com/564x/92/b9/de/92b9dedb6f869a9c916a8b1c35ab65ca.jpg)

(https://i.pinimg.com/564x/f6/62/54/f66254cbf54598187d152df09cffdc54.jpg)

(https://i.pinimg.com/564x/5b/43/c3/5b43c3f9472035e83c8f05a32969b334.jpg)

Stompy is at the pit of the Uncanny Valley of Alien designs. Close enough to the original to feel related, but with so many little tweaks that really, really f**k with the feel of the design.

Quote from: Samhain13 on Mar 06, 2019, 03:36:11 AM
The two jointed/chicken legs were unecessary.

I've never agreed with you more about anything.

A true, agree to disagree then. lol

The appendage alterations <3
Especially the back appendages (& positions), shoulder areas, the wrists and hands.
(https://i.pinimg.com/originals/32/40/a1/3240a197292102c9cb557dff497a7814.png)

QuoteA true, agree to disagree then. lol

Absolutely! Joys of a truly subjective discussion.

Quote from: The Old One on Mar 06, 2019, 08:22:26 AM
(https://i.pinimg.com/originals/32/40/a1/3240a197292102c9cb557dff497a7814.png)

That broad, stupid chin ...

There is something to what Sil is saying.  Stompy is not a bad design, but there is something oddly over-square about the chin.  Too wide maybe.  Definitely missing the lips.  There is something that breaks the illusion of the creature.  Maybe it needs more crazy drool..

The face area and no saliva. But believable salvia's nigh impossible. (videogames)
No translucent labia oris.

Hunched over posture also doesn't help it. The original was often curled, but this is hunched at the shoulders all the time and it feels off. Scott actually got the posture right for the first time in like 40ish years in the shot of the protomorph entering the hangar bay. Chilling.

I believe the AI creature's posture's superior throughout exploration.

The reason the human posture's excellent throughout the cargo bay- ( and the original 1979 Alien and others) is the depiction's the Xenomorph's midsection, and above not below.

The Alien design full view; the elongated limbs, arms and digitigrade legs is superior IMO.

Quote from: The Old One on Mar 06, 2019, 10:51:16 AM
Love the hunch, markedly improves how the design comes off to me. Looks like you can actively tell it's hunting, or aggressive and if it was just walking about casually with the human silhouette and plantigrade legs it would look silly af.

The problem for me is it looks like every other hunched over man in a suit, which is my issue with every time Woodruff Jnr is in the suit. Upright and looking around calmly gives it a more intelligent aspect; it's scanning, searching, assessing, thinking. You see it even in Bolaji's suit tests, where he's not exactly stick straight, but he's not slouching at his shoulders.

The Terminator, of all things, is a good example of this. When he's tracking something down he scans the area upright, to get a complete view.

Hunched is beastly, which is lazy and unimaginative.

QuoteWhen you see it roaming around in full view, the digitigrade legs and leaning forward posture works best.

I really disagree here. Long, slender, human legs with an elegant walking motion could've worked wonders. The problem in Alien is that the full body shots were exclusively stunt people, not Bolaji. If they'd blown him out the airlock that ending wouldn't have looked quite as dodgy.

Quote from: The Old One on Mar 06, 2019, 12:42:38 PM
but it's not something the Isolation design's incapable of doing.

Well no argument there; I guess that goes more into how they applied it. Bad direction.

(https://i.pinimg.com/originals/9c/00/73/9c0073cacf433b35c25e08c62e776570.jpg)
...

Saliva is actually easy to render in CGI. All you need is a transparent PNG image and place an animated 'waterfall' effect of fluid constantly moving down it. There are other methods for closer range renders.

Watching the recent digital series thing definitely reminded me about that weird jaw, I have to agree. A lot of the time, it doesn't matter, because the game uses shadowing to good effect, but it stands out when we see it.

From what I recall, weren't the digitigrade legs used because they couldn't get it look convincing when animating it on ordinary legs? Personally, I've always preferred the tri-jointed look in some of the comics, but it goes against canon for the human-hosted creatures and there are times it looks oddly bendy in the game.

CA said that since the player was going to do a lot of hiding under beds, tables, desks etc, we were going to spend a lot of time staring at the alien's feet, and they felt the human plantigrade feet looked too ordinary and therefore not so scary.

As far as the hunched over posture goes, nowadays this is what you get from dinosaur movies. IOW the hunched over alien looks very similar in silhouette to all those velociraptors and t-rexes we see all the time, and the alien deserves better than that.

Also, (and I know this is counter-intuitive when you're greatest fear is that it will look like a man in a rubber suit), but when it's standing upright the fact that it is more human-like adds to the grotesque, perverted-nature effect.

Just my opinion.

TC

The posture has never really been something that has bothered but me considering the Alien's terraforming bay entrance and it's human-like stance was one of the creepiest Alien moments in ages for me, I can completely agree with wanting a more upright posture.

Agreed, but always? No.

Balance both IMO.

Quote from: Corporal Hicks on Mar 09, 2019, 05:38:53 PM
The posture has never really been something that has bothered but me considering the Alien's terraforming bay entrance and it's human-like stance was one of the creepiest Alien moments in ages for me, I can completely agree with wanting a more upright posture.

I agree! I'm not the biggest fan of Covenant but seeing it come walking in like that literally gave me chills

If only it didn't ran on four legs.

How should it have ran? Like a person?

I like my aliens looking like men not dogs.

Spoiler

Unless they came out of a dog  :P

[close]

Stalking around is one thing, but I can't imagine them sprinting on two legs and looking right. I'm okay with what was shown.

https://vimeo.com/205282438

Balance both traversal stances.
Isolation's "hunter" stance (Fast)
and the 1979 original's homosapien,
straight stance. (Slow)

Quote from: Kelgaard on Mar 11, 2019, 03:10:41 AM
Stalking around is one thing, but I can't imagine them sprinting on two legs and looking right. I'm okay with what was shown.

In aliens movie we saw them jump and run on two legs/upright and not running on four legs, besides in the airducts but that was due to the cramped space.
I prefer the xenomorphs running and moving on two legs and dislike how they after AVP movies and games been made like always running on four legs and is smaller and more dinosaur like.

Quote from: The Old One on Mar 11, 2019, 04:15:02 AM
https://vimeo.com/205282438

Balance both traversal stances.
Isolation's "hunter" stance (Fast)
and the 1979 original's homosapien,
straight stance. (Slow)

I still think those thighs are gorgeous.