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Author Topic: Alien 3: A Sore Subject for Michael Biehn & Sigour...  (Read 4500 times)


Voodoo Magic
Aug 12, 2019, 03:04:13 PM
Reply #121 on: Aug 12, 2019, 03:04:13 PM
Q
When I look at Alien 3 and Clemens, I wonder what the big deal would have been to have that be Hicks instead? Of course maybe he isn't going to deliver medical care, but as far as filling the role of a supportive voice I think that they could have been relatively interchangeable. I think Hicks being male, and a marine may have allowed more respect with Andrews to where the role wouldn't have been much different overall. No need for guns, no need for Hicks to do anything heroic. I could have been an interesting direction, and still would have turned into the dark, nihilistic piece we received. Its just the darkness would have unfolded a bit later.

Now imagine the runner grabs Hicks and punches a hole in his head lol. I wonder how that reaction would have went over?






Russ
Aug 12, 2019, 03:15:57 PM
Reply #123 on: Aug 12, 2019, 03:15:57 PM
Q
I really don't get it, complaining about various aspects of the film's real issues I understand, even if I disagree (pacing, composition, not empathising, editing) but I never seen the deaths of two/three of the most cliché characters in cinema to be one of them.

Sure, but kill them off during the film; give their "sacrifice" some reason. As PO says - this is a sequel. But the whole premise is let down (there was no egg, joke sound effect or not) and two of the main characters from the predecessor are killed off screen.

That said, WhoDa does argue a good point when its also true to say that whilst they're killed off camera, their funerals and the emotional weight thereof is really impactful.

But yeah - standalone, its a great movie. Indeed even with the obvious flaws (like the egg) it's still brilliant. But I've never really been able to forgive it's casual treatment of these characters... or the fact that we have an eleventy billion page thread on the egg... *lol*


TC
Aug 12, 2019, 05:43:02 PM
Reply #124 on: Aug 12, 2019, 05:43:02 PM
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Sure, but kill them off during the film; give their "sacrifice" some reason.

Biehn is in some YT video somewhere in which he elaborates on how the script treated his character. He says, sure, kill him off, but make it meaningful. He understands that some plots require certain characters be killed off - of course he knows this; he's been killed off plenty of times, in fact, they've been his best roles!

I'd go so far as to say every actor harbours a desire to play a great death scene at least once in their career. It's just that the hope is that it will be as good as the one Leonard Nimoy got when Spock dies at the end of Wrath of Khan - heroic, emotional, and meaningful. Hicks's death in A3 was the opposite of that. Forget about 'death scene' - it was barely even a scene! - relegated as it was to background montage behind the opening titles. No wonder he found it insulting.

TC


[cancerblack]
Aug 12, 2019, 07:05:15 PM
Reply #125 on: Aug 12, 2019, 07:05:15 PM
Q
Honestly, Newt on a planet full of child molesters isn't a movie I'd like to see. Even with the protection of Hicks, Ripley et al, it's just not a situation I'd enjoy watching or thinking about, it's tasteless.


Voodoo Magic
Aug 12, 2019, 07:14:17 PM
Reply #126 on: Aug 12, 2019, 07:14:17 PM
Q
Honestly, Newt on a planet full of child molesters isn't a movie I'd like to see. Even with the protection of Hicks, Ripley et al, it's just not a situation I'd enjoy watching or thinking about, it's tasteless.

I agree, so just drop that aspect then. Just make them murderers, etc.. The understanding is those type of criminals go into prison with a target on their back anyway. Even convicts seem to have a code regarding such horrible actions of abuse.


[cancerblack]
Aug 12, 2019, 07:37:02 PM
Reply #127 on: Aug 12, 2019, 07:37:02 PM
Q
Honestly, Newt on a planet full of child molesters isn't a movie I'd like to see. Even with the protection of Hicks, Ripley et al, it's just not a situation I'd enjoy watching or thinking about, it's tasteless.

I agree, so just drop that aspect then. Just make them murderers, etc.. The understanding is those type of criminals go into prison with a target on their back anyway. Even convicts seem to have a code regarding such horrible actions of abuse.

It's so much easier to just embrace the movie we got, warts and all.


Voodoo Magic
Aug 12, 2019, 07:42:34 PM
Reply #128 on: Aug 12, 2019, 07:42:34 PM
Q
Honestly, Newt on a planet full of child molesters isn't a movie I'd like to see. Even with the protection of Hicks, Ripley et al, it's just not a situation I'd enjoy watching or thinking about, it's tasteless.

I agree, so just drop that aspect then. Just make them murderers, etc.. The understanding is those type of criminals go into prison with a target on their back anyway. Even convicts seem to have a code regarding such horrible actions of abuse.

It's so much easier to just embrace the movie we got, warts and all.

Well now that the movie has already been made, indeed.  ;D


razeak
Aug 12, 2019, 08:18:16 PM
Reply #129 on: Aug 12, 2019, 08:18:16 PM
Q
Honestly, Newt on a planet full of child molesters isn't a movie I'd like to see. Even with the protection of Hicks, Ripley et al, it's just not a situation I'd enjoy watching or thinking about, it's tasteless.

I agree, so just drop that aspect then. Just make them murderers, etc.. The understanding is those type of criminals go into prison with a target on their back anyway. Even convicts seem to have a code regarding such horrible actions of abuse.

Simple. In real life, most convicts are fathers, and I would lean more toward protection of a child than any sort of group dynamic allowing harm, even amongst a group of murderers. It would have to be someone catching the others inattentive or during an attack or something. The simple solution is the pedophiles amongst the group would be as fearful of reprisal from the fathers/murderers as they would be the xeno. At least the xeno would probably be quick. Probably.

I would assume Andrews would order a quarantine, and with a healthy fear of convicts, Ripley and crew may actually adhere to it until a xeno shows up.

The moment could be hinted as a potential threat rather than being the stereotypical centerpiece,and not have to make it on screen visually.  From my understanding of protective custody and classification systems amongst differing correctional agencies, I would speculate WY may not lock pedophiles up on a remote world like that anyways due to the probable "distraction" it would become for the non-pedophiles.  You're pretty much guaranteeing an incident. It's true pedophiles are locked up in general population, but there are also specific facilities where state funding allows.  Then again, government and corporate decisions don't always approach logic.

Were any of the inmates pedophiles in Alien 3? I would be shocked if any made it through the years following the change of status of Fury 161.

« Last Edit: Aug 12, 2019, 08:20:04 PM by razeak »

[cancerblack]
Aug 12, 2019, 08:39:56 PM
Reply #130 on: Aug 12, 2019, 08:39:56 PM
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I believe Andrews explicitly mentions that some of them are.


SM
Aug 13, 2019, 12:41:40 AM
Reply #131 on: Aug 13, 2019, 12:41:40 AM
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Yep. "All thieves, rapists, murderers, child molesters."

Golic also hints that was his crime as well.

« Last Edit: Aug 13, 2019, 12:44:50 AM by SM »

Perfect-Organism
Aug 13, 2019, 12:54:49 AM
Reply #132 on: Aug 13, 2019, 12:54:49 AM
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Or.... Ripley and friends may not have landed on a prison planet at all.

I'm inclined to think Ripley splits, Hicks becomes drunken and disorderly, and Newt gets institutionalize until the discovery of the Aliens' home world triggers a reunion of sorts!  Bam!  Academy award nominations start rolling in again!


Local Trouble
Aug 13, 2019, 01:08:02 AM
Reply #133 on: Aug 13, 2019, 01:08:02 AM
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Or.... Ripley and friends may not have landed on a prison planet at all.

Or...

Hell, they could have given each cryotube its own personal escape pod and written the story so that only Ripley's crashed on Fury while the others didn't.

No Hicks.  No Newt.  No pointless deaths.  Ripley gets her solo adventure.  Mission accomplished.


Perfect-Organism
Aug 13, 2019, 01:25:53 AM
Reply #134 on: Aug 13, 2019, 01:25:53 AM
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Any of the above works really.  The truth is, and I've said it before, the Aliens series is not about a pre-set final DESTINATION where the story needs to end up because that is how it was written in stone somewhere.  It is a
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
that could go in many different directions.  All of which are valid.

Some will please the masses, others, ehem, Alien 3, will not.


 

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