Newts or Shaw's death?

Started by Berend, Oct 20, 2017, 04:36:00 AM

Author
Newts or Shaw's death? (Read 6,106 times)

D88M

D88M

#45
Disappointed with Shaw. Is like we lost a movie between Prometheus and Covenant and took the movie equivalent of Skyrim "fast travel" to a place not so interesting as what the Prometheus ending was hinting.

FenGiddel

FenGiddel

#46
Quote from: SM on Nov 30, 2017, 03:50:40 AM
The motivations of Shaw, Holloway, Vickers and Janek are pretty distinctive.
True, that.


And I'd add that Janek's motivations, driven by his past experience with SNAFUs like the engineers', would be very interesting to hear. It opens up the Alien universe just a little wider.

Snake

Snake

#47
I think Newt's death is far more emotionally powerful than Shaw's; not only because Newt sort of replaced Ripley's deceased daughter, but also because she's a completely innocent character and way more fragile than others since she's a kid. It begs the question wether they should have left her 'unmarked' or chop her up instead...as they did. Anyway, the shots where she is lying on the table and you see the shadows of the surgical instruments pass over her closed eyes or when Ripley is checking her mouth always get to me. Shaw's death was like: 'well, here she is'. No drama whatsoever.

Scorpio

Scorpio

#48
Shaw all the way.  Newt is overrated as a character.  She is basically a plot device in Aliens.  A 'damsel in distress' to gain the audience's sympathy and cheer on the hero.  Her funeral scene in Alien 3 ironically made her more of a complete character than the entirety of the previous film.

PsyKore

PsyKore

#49
Quote from: Snake on Dec 10, 2017, 02:55:18 AM
I think Newt's death is far more emotionally powerful than Shaw's; not only because Newt sort of replaced Ripley's deceased daughter, but also because she's a completely innocent character and way more fragile than others since she's a kid. It begs the question wether they should have left her 'unmarked' or chop her up instead...as they did. Anyway, the shots where she is lying on the table and you see the shadows of the surgical instruments pass over her closed eyes or when Ripley is checking her mouth always get to me. Shaw's death was like: 'well, here she is'. No drama whatsoever.

Some people say Newt's autopsy is in bad taste, but it was definitely gut-wrenching to watch, probably more so because from Ripley's POV it was only moments ago that they were both going to hypersleep.

But for all the flak Alien 3 gets, I really feel it did give a terrific and respectful send off for Hicks and Newt during the funeral. Writing out the characters that way - killing them off in the opening credits - may be a cheap method, but it wasn't like they were just ignored. I thought it was well done.

I definitely agree that Shaw's had no drama, which was disappointing.

skhellter

skhellter

#50
Quote from: PsyKore on Dec 10, 2017, 08:50:08 AM
Some people say Newt's autopsy is in bad taste,

Well. It's a horror movie. For adults.

I'm not entirely sure why some people go
to a horror movie and expect to be coddled...

PsyKore

PsyKore

#51
Quote from: skhellter on Dec 10, 2017, 08:56:07 AM
Quote from: PsyKore on Dec 10, 2017, 08:50:08 AM
Some people say Newt's autopsy is in bad taste,

Well. It's a horror movie. For adults.

I'm not entirely sure why some people go
to a horror movie and expect to be coddled...

Probably because it's a child. I can respect it may be crossing the line for some, even though I think it fits well for the ruthless nature of the Alien series.

BishopShouldGo

BishopShouldGo

#52
Quote from: skhellter on Dec 10, 2017, 08:56:07 AM
Quote from: PsyKore on Dec 10, 2017, 08:50:08 AM
Some people say Newt's autopsy is in bad taste,

Well. It's a horror movie. For adults.

I'm not entirely sure why some people go
to a horror movie and expect to be coddled...

This isn't how life works.

tleilaxu

tleilaxu

#53
Quote from: skhellter on Dec 10, 2017, 08:56:07 AM
Quote from: PsyKore on Dec 10, 2017, 08:50:08 AM
Some people say Newt's autopsy is in bad taste,

Well. It's a horror movie. For adults.

I'm not entirely sure why some people go
to a horror movie and expect to be coddled...
Probably because of the broader audience Aliens appealed to e.g. soccer moms.

PierreVW

PierreVW

#54
Quote from: Scorpio on Dec 10, 2017, 03:15:13 AM
Shaw all the way.  Newt is overrated as a character.  She is basically a plot device in Aliens.  A 'damsel in distress' to gain the audience's sympathy and cheer on the hero.  Her funeral scene in Alien 3 ironically made her more of a complete character than the entirety of the previous film.

I agree.

SM

SM

#55
Quote from: tleilaxu on Dec 10, 2017, 05:21:53 PM
Quote from: skhellter on Dec 10, 2017, 08:56:07 AM
Quote from: PsyKore on Dec 10, 2017, 08:50:08 AM
Some people say Newt's autopsy is in bad taste,

Well. It's a horror movie. For adults.

I'm not entirely sure why some people go
to a horror movie and expect to be coddled...
Probably because of the broader audience Aliens appealed to e.g. soccer moms.

:laugh:

OpenMaw

OpenMaw

#56
I never had a problem with the autopsy, even as a kid. Oh it's uncomfortable and it made me somewhat sick to my stomach, but how it's handled in the story, really adds to the trauma that Ripley is suffering. Not enough that Newt died, but that she may have been a host, and having to see her cut into like that. Ugh. Weaver does a great job in that scene, as always.

SM

SM

#57
The autopsy was done about as tastefully as such a scene could be done.  There's no lingering wide shots with Newt's guts hanging out.  It's all close ups, and quick cuts, and Ripley's response conveys sorrow rather than shock, along with Clemens reluctance.  Even the shots of bloody instruments are tempered by the fact they're not being used on anyone that's alive.

Biomechanoid

Biomechanoid

#58
Quote from: PsyKore on Dec 10, 2017, 09:02:17 AM
Probably because it's a child. I can respect it may be crossing the line for some, even though I think it fits well for the ruthless nature of the Alien series.

Poor adults, they get no respect. If a child is being mutilated, a gush of empathy ensues, but if it's an adult or even older teenager, too bad so sad, mutilate, amputate, hack, and stab to their heart's delight.  :laugh:

PsyKore

PsyKore

#59
I once saw a sticker on the back of a car that read "Adults on board, we want to live too". :laugh:

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