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Author Topic: [SPOILERS] So Covenant confirms that AvP and AvPR ...  (Read 13626 times)

bacchus
May 13, 2017, 11:29:48 PM
Topic on: May 13, 2017, 11:29:48 PM
Q
With Covenant taking place in 2104, and David having created the first Xeno via the facehugger that attacked Oram, I guess Covenant confirms once and for all that AvP and AvPR are not canon. AvP taking place in 2004 and AvPR not long after that. Even in AvP they reference 1904 in the film as being a date that the Alien Queen in that film was still in deep freeze.

Good.


Ingwar
May 13, 2017, 11:31:20 PM
Reply #1 on: May 13, 2017, 11:31:20 PM
Q
Covenant doesn't have to confirm that. AvP movies are cross-overs. They never been part of canon.


bacchus
May 13, 2017, 11:34:01 PM
Reply #2 on: May 13, 2017, 11:34:01 PM
Q
Covenant doesn't have to confirm that. AvP movies are cross-overs. They never been part of canon.

According to who? Both the AvP films and Prometheus/Covenant are produced by 20th Century Fox - and they have never (as far as I am aware) confirmed what is canon or not. The default position until Covenant was that they were canon due to being produced by the same company. Covenant confirms they are not though.

« Last Edit: May 14, 2017, 12:03:15 AM by bacchus »

Samhain13
May 13, 2017, 11:44:15 PM
Reply #3 on: May 13, 2017, 11:44:15 PM
Q
The avp movies were canon at that time, Anderson and the Strauses had said so. But it's a fictional franchise, they can change the "canon" in whatever way they like. Didn't Fox had said the new EU material was canon not so long ago? Well those titan books aren't anymore.

If Fox wants in the future to make a new movie that goes against Covenant they can, then Covenant won't be canon anymore.


fiveways
May 13, 2017, 11:45:42 PM
Reply #4 on: May 13, 2017, 11:45:42 PM
Q
Covenant doesn't have to confirm that. AvP movies are cross-overs. They never been part of canon.

According to who? Both the AvP films and Prometheus/Covenant are produced by 20th Century Fox - and they have never (as far as I am aware) confirmed what is canon or not. The default position until Covenant was that they were canon due to be produced by the same company. Covenant confirms they are not though.

Ridley Scott said they weren't included in the continuity around the time of Prometheus.   So they have been out since at least 2012.



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5TQLRMIGA2I


klesk4ever
May 13, 2017, 11:51:50 PM
Reply #5 on: May 13, 2017, 11:51:50 PM
Q
Covenant doesn't have to confirm that. AvP movies are cross-overs. They never been part of canon.

According to who? Both the AvP films and Prometheus/Covenant are produced by 20th Century Fox - and they have never (as far as I am aware) confirmed what is canon or not. The default position until Covenant was that they were canon due to be produced by the same company. Covenant confirms they are not though.

Let's not forget Alien Colonial Marines were cannon for a certain time.
Fox didn't make a official canon, AvP is not officially a crossover.

Alien, AvP and Predator media cannot make a coherent cannon without butchering the whole thing with time travel and extremely improbable scenarios.

It is possible to create multiple possible cannons however in every one of those some content has to be rejected.

Do we really have to push our favorite version of cannon down each others throat to feel better about the whole thing?

Simply make your own version of cannon that suits.

My version of cannon has Prometheus, A.C. Alien, Alien Isolation, Aliens and Alien 3 (+ some other content) as Alien cannon. It is elegant, it has no holes, and I had also ejected Alien Resurrection from it and placed it into "that shitty alien movie" universe.

And at the same time I had made my own AvP cannon that includes all Predator movies, all AvP movies (and 2 games) and some Alien movies.





DaddyYautja
May 13, 2017, 11:58:10 PM
Reply #6 on: May 13, 2017, 11:58:10 PM
Q
Actually, Prom and AC are not canon.

They are their own continuity..... with Kenner toys.


bacchus
May 13, 2017, 11:59:11 PM
Reply #7 on: May 13, 2017, 11:59:11 PM
Q
Covenant doesn't have to confirm that. AvP movies are cross-overs. They never been part of canon.

According to who? Both the AvP films and Prometheus/Covenant are produced by 20th Century Fox - and they have never (as far as I am aware) confirmed what is canon or not. The default position until Covenant was that they were canon due to be produced by the same company. Covenant confirms they are not though.

Ridley Scott said they weren't included in the continuity around the time of Prometheus.   So they have been out since at least 2012.


Do you have a link to a source/quote that proves Ridley said they weren't canon? That video you linked to was just Ridley saying he "doesn't know how he feels" about AvP.

Covenant doesn't have to confirm that. AvP movies are cross-overs. They never been part of canon.

According to who? Both the AvP films and Prometheus/Covenant are produced by 20th Century Fox - and they have never (as far as I am aware) confirmed what is canon or not. The default position until Covenant was that they were canon due to be produced by the same company. Covenant confirms they are not though.

Let's not forget Alien Colonial Marines were cannon for a certain time.
Fox didn't make a official canon, AvP is not officially a crossover.

Alien, AvP and Predator media cannot make a coherent cannon without butchering the whole thing with time travel and extremely improbable scenarios.

It is possible to create multiple possible cannons however in every one of those some content has to be rejected.

Do we really have to push our favorite version of cannon down each others throat to feel better about the whole thing?

Simply make your own version of cannon that suits.

My version of cannon has Prometheus, A.C. Alien, Alien Isolation, Aliens and Alien 3 (+ some other content) as Alien cannon. It is elegant, it has no holes, and I had also ejected Alien Resurrection from it and placed it into "that shitty alien movie" universe.

And at the same time I had made my own AvP cannon that includes all Predator movies, all AvP movies (and 2 games) and some Alien movies.

I agree that the canon and order is: Prometheus - A.C - Alien - Alien Isolation - Aliens - Alien 3. I go back and forth on Resurrection, but would lean towards it not being included as its easily expendable.

I can't ignore AvP and AvPR as much as I want to - because so much of it thematically links in with all of the Alien films - the mention of Weyland, the smaller references, the design of the Xeno and the way they evolve etc. It all matches what was in the original films.

I just wish 20th Century Fox would come out and say AvP and AvPR are not part of it.

« Last Edit: May 14, 2017, 12:02:47 AM by bacchus »


bacchus
May 14, 2017, 12:06:54 AM
Reply #9 on: May 14, 2017, 12:06:54 AM
Q
Actually, Prom and AC are not canon.

They are their own continuity..... with Kenner toys.

That's pretty much how I'm taking this whole situation.

Wouldn't this whole Alien universe be so much better off without Prometheus and Covenant? Or at the very least, a prequel with a separate explanation for the space jockey/juggernaut instead of all the engineer stuff.

Deep down I just think Ridley and others went too far with Prometheus and Covenant, and way too far from the content of the original films.

I'd truly forgive Ridley if he chose to scrap Prometheus and Covenant from the cycle and chose to do an alternative prequel with a different explanation for the space jockey.

There really is no need to explain where the Xeno came from - thats part of the mystery.



Samhain13
May 14, 2017, 12:09:52 AM
Reply #10 on: May 14, 2017, 12:09:52 AM
Q
Sure... the prequels could have ended up better if they went in a different way but just like the avp movies, they didn't.

And that's all we are going to get.


FunkyJawa
May 14, 2017, 12:30:21 AM
Reply #11 on: May 14, 2017, 12:30:21 AM
Q
The AVP movies? I remember Penguin, Predator, Pizza boy, Pred Alien and Pregnant lady. They certainly took the P.


Sway
May 14, 2017, 12:42:44 AM
Reply #12 on: May 14, 2017, 12:42:44 AM
Q
I don't think any serious fan ever took AVP seriously. Especially those of us who were already adults by the time they were released.


klesk4ever
May 14, 2017, 12:48:18 AM
Reply #13 on: May 14, 2017, 12:48:18 AM
Q
I can't ignore AvP and AvPR as much as I want to - because so much of it thematically links in with all of the Alien films - the mention of Weyland, the smaller references, the design of the Xeno and the way they evolve etc. It all matches what was in the original films.

I just wish 20th Century Fox would come out and say AvP and AvPR are not part of it.

Well it would be great if Fox made official cannon and timeline and regularly update it when something has to be ejected from it. Way better then all this problems.

Anyway check this out: Predator, Predator 2, AvP, AvPR, Predators, Alien, Aliens, Alien 3 + extra content that fits in (AvP games, comics etc.).

There, now we have clean Alien and AvP cannons and timelines that simply share some content :)


bacchus
May 14, 2017, 12:52:10 AM
Reply #14 on: May 14, 2017, 12:52:10 AM
Q
I can't ignore AvP and AvPR as much as I want to - because so much of it thematically links in with all of the Alien films - the mention of Weyland, the smaller references, the design of the Xeno and the way they evolve etc. It all matches what was in the original films.

I just wish 20th Century Fox would come out and say AvP and AvPR are not part of it.

Well it would be great if Fox made official cannon and timeline and regularly update it when something has to be ejected from it. Way better then all this problems.

Anyway check this out: Predator, Predator 2, AvP, AvPR, Predators, Alien, Aliens, Alien 3 + extra content that fits in (AvP games, comics etc.).

There, now we have clean Alien and AvP cannons and timelines that simply share some content :)

Look far better the way you've put it.

Prometheus and Covenant are so awkward and inconvenient.


 

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