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Author Topic: Scott says "Covenant is about mortality and immort...  (Read 18611 times)

axor993
Jan 03, 2017, 03:32:46 PM
Reply #165 on: Jan 03, 2017, 03:32:46 PM
Sagardoa just got back to me, and yeah, he backed up what 4chan guy said.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

This really worries me. I know that what I "expect" is of no interest to anybody, really. Even though I am a dying fan.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Added spoiler tags. Hicks.

« Last Edit: Jan 03, 2017, 03:49:16 PM by Corporal Hicks »

Astronoë
Jan 03, 2017, 03:49:49 PM
Reply #166 on: Jan 03, 2017, 03:49:49 PM
Quote
"We're not just a random biological accident," he insisted. "For you and I to be sitting here right now [by accident] would take trillions of correct decisions to be made randomly by nature, which of course is ridiculous.
Damm Ridley is completely ignorant to how evolution works, he may know how to make movies but in regards for science he have the mental capacity of a 12 year old.

Was he home-schooled n religious upbringing? That tends to fudge up peoples brains...


Corporal Hicks
Jan 03, 2017, 03:50:45 PM
Reply #167 on: Jan 03, 2017, 03:50:45 PM
Sagardoa just got back to me, and yeah, he backed up what 4chan guy said.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

This really worries me. I know that what I "expect" is of no interest to anybody, really. Even though I am a dying fan.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Added spoiler tags. Hicks.

I don't think it's unreasonable to expect there's likely other Engineers dotted around on other outposts or colonies throughout the galaxy.

Quote
"We're not just a random biological accident," he insisted. "For you and I to be sitting here right now [by accident] would take trillions of correct decisions to be made randomly by nature, which of course is ridiculous.
Damm Ridley is completely ignorant to how evolution works, he may know how to make movies but in regards for science he have the mental capacity of a 12 year old.

Was he home-schooled n religious upbringing? That tends to fudge up peoples brains...

Chill out with the insults please. We have religious members here that don't warrant your attacks. Only warning.


Mustangjeff
Jan 03, 2017, 04:11:40 PM
Reply #168 on: Jan 03, 2017, 04:11:40 PM
Sagardoa just got back to me, and yeah, he backed up what 4chan guy said.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

This really worries me. I know that what I "expect" is of no interest to anybody, really. Even though I am a dying fan. However, killing of all engineers, just like that, seems rather dumb. Unless they are present on other planets etc. If this will appear to be true, I will be very disappointed, but that's just me. This may backfire at Fox, as keeping Engineers and their lore for the sequel or a movie further down the line, may appear to people as too much of a wait. People may show less interest. I genuinely hope that things change.

My biggest issue is that Scott is doing the whole bait and switch on us.  Pre-Promtheus he was telling us that he wanted to explore the space Jockey.  He wanted to tell their story.  Instead we got 15 minutes of roid rage. 

We learned they seeded life on many planets, we learned they seeded humans, we learned they have really poor quality video surveillance systems, we learned they aren't very good at keeping their creations under control, and we learned they had at some point decided to hit ctrl-alt-del on earth.  We really know nothing about their culture, who they are, or what their overall goals include.

I could honestly care less about the Xeno or other random creations themselves, but I do find them interesting as a tool of the engineers because it lends insight into their world.

At least now we know where all those eggs on LV426 come from.

« Last Edit: Jan 03, 2017, 04:15:03 PM by Mustangjeff »

Corporal Hicks
Jan 03, 2017, 04:16:01 PM
Reply #169 on: Jan 03, 2017, 04:16:01 PM
I could honestly care less about the Xeno or other random creations themselves, but I do find them interesting as a tool of the engineers because it lends insight into their world.

That's one of the things I find interesting about the concept of Aliens being an ancient artificial creation. It implies quite some power in their creators and also in some major threat that they needed to face.


Enoch
Jan 03, 2017, 04:51:27 PM
Reply #170 on: Jan 03, 2017, 04:51:27 PM
Engineers are just an ancient human race... first ones. Everyone want to imitate their masters (gods/creators), so they just copied the patterns of God, or perhaps the patterns of their creators (some ancient sentient race/ maybe the Xenolike sentient beings/mural in the pyramid is in accordance with this theory). I speculated long ago that Engineers were given the sacred right to use the agent of life to create life in accordance to divine law... to sacrifice their life in order to create new. Some rebellious group stole the agent from their GODS and used it to enhance their bodies (bio suit resembling the Xeno exoskeleton), their technology and eventually they used it to create new lifeforms, or perhaps to create something that could destroy their parents (gods), instead that very weapon (agent or perhaps the blood of the primordial creator) they stole and tempered with on LV-223 turned against them or perhaps someone came and let loose some other weapon on them and destroyed every Engineers (except the last one) before they could leave for Earth to complete their plan. Thats about Engineers story. Perhaps there are begins way above them in cosmic hierarchy. Maybe the wall mural with crucified Xenolike entity shows what Engineers did with their Gods, the very same thing humans allegedly did to their Gods (engineers / Christ). Fine parable. Except every entity in the equation (humans, engineers, jockeys) forgot the one thing - there is always someone on the top of the pyramid... The  all-seeing Eye!! :)

« Last Edit: Jan 03, 2017, 04:57:13 PM by Enoch »

Xenoscream
Jan 03, 2017, 05:40:13 PM
Reply #171 on: Jan 03, 2017, 05:40:13 PM
So are the spoilers true? Hicks can you confirm?


Spiderpope
Jan 03, 2017, 06:25:04 PM
Reply #172 on: Jan 03, 2017, 06:25:04 PM
Disappointing that Scott doesn't understand evolution. Its not a random process.


Mustangjeff
Jan 03, 2017, 06:32:40 PM
Reply #173 on: Jan 03, 2017, 06:32:40 PM
Engineers are just an ancient human race... first ones. Everyone want to imitate their masters (gods/creators), so they just copied the patterns of God, or perhaps the patterns of their creators (some ancient sentient race/ maybe the Xenolike sentient beings/mural in the pyramid is in accordance with this theory). I speculated long ago that Engineers were given the sacred right to use the agent of life to create life in accordance to divine law... to sacrifice their life in order to create new. Some rebellious group stole the agent from their GODS and used it to enhance their bodies (bio suit resembling the Xeno exoskeleton), their technology and eventually they used it to create new lifeforms, or perhaps to create something that could destroy their parents (gods), instead that very weapon (agent or perhaps the blood of the primordial creator) they stole and tempered with on LV-223 turned against them or perhaps someone came and let loose some other weapon on them and destroyed every Engineers (except the last one) before they could leave for Earth to complete their plan. Thats about Engineers story. Perhaps there are begins way above them in cosmic hierarchy. Maybe the wall mural with crucified Xenolike entity shows what Engineers did with their Gods, the very same thing humans allegedly did to their Gods (engineers / Christ). Fine parable. Except every entity in the equation (humans, engineers, jockeys) forgot the one thing - there is always someone on the top of the pyramid... The  all-seeing Eye!! :)

Hopefully we'll find out about the Engineers from David.  It's better than nothing I guess. 

It would be much more interesting to learn about the Engineers through first hand interactions.  But I'd take David regurgitating information in a scene of exposition versus nothing at all.


Deuterium
Jan 03, 2017, 07:51:03 PM
Reply #174 on: Jan 03, 2017, 07:51:03 PM
Disappointing that Scott doesn't understand evolution. Its not a random process.

Well, that is not quite true.  The first part of the process is random, i.e. mutation to genome.  It is the 2nd part that is non-random,...i.e. Natural Selection working upon the expressed mutation (phenotype), typically at the organism level, and differentially selecting that adaptation best conferring survival/reproductive advantage in a changing local environment.


Enoch
Jan 03, 2017, 08:24:40 PM
Reply #175 on: Jan 03, 2017, 08:24:40 PM
Who are we to question nature... who are we to qualify the ways of nature as random...
we can only observe, learn but our own judgments are irrelevant... Till yesterday
we spoke about lightening as if it was a sign of God... and now we took the right to
qualify things as random and yet we do not fully understand the meaning of random or
causal...


Deuterium
Jan 03, 2017, 08:56:33 PM
Reply #176 on: Jan 03, 2017, 08:56:33 PM
Who are we to question nature... who are we to qualify the ways of nature as random...
we can only observe, learn but our own judgments are irrelevant... Till yesterday
we spoke about lightening as if it was a sign of God... and now we took the right to
qualify things as random and yet we do not fully understand the meaning of random or
causal...

Hello Enoch,
I certainty am not questioning Nature, nor the inscrutable Wisdom of our Creator, which completely transcends our finite intellect.  However, from a purely scientific perspective , a purely random (stochastic) process has a precise definition and understanding.  With that said, it is my belief that what will forever be a non-deterministic event or process, for our finite intellect, is completely known (determined) by an infinite Creator.


Spiderpope
Jan 03, 2017, 09:01:09 PM
Reply #177 on: Jan 03, 2017, 09:01:09 PM
Mutation is random. Evolution through natural selection is not, the process is not a random one. Unfortunately it looks like Covenant is going to be as unscientific as Prometheus.


Enoch
Jan 03, 2017, 09:14:14 PM
Reply #178 on: Jan 03, 2017, 09:14:14 PM
" purely random (stochastic) process has a precise definition and understanding"

Why do we call them random in the first place... If we have an explanation, definition and understanding of them..then they are not random. They do not need to be tagged as stochastic or deterministic because all divisions are limiting in their nature... all divisions and classifications are deterministic...  We humans tend to be too deterministic and chained by the limitations of our understandings (systems) and interpretations... while our "Creator" or Logos or Cosmos (however you wan to call it) is certainly liberated from those chains of determinism, certainty, randomness and something we call reason... etc. God is reason per se and therefore is infinite, while human reason is by nature limited within itself... To understand something like cosmos and "laws of very existence" we would need more than science and our current rationality. We need to free the mind of all limitations... but again, how can someone do that... as you said, with our FINITE intellect?

« Last Edit: Jan 03, 2017, 09:31:40 PM by Enoch »

The Alien Predator
Jan 03, 2017, 09:20:07 PM
Reply #179 on: Jan 03, 2017, 09:20:07 PM
instead that very weapon (agent or perhaps the blood of the primordial creator) they stole and tempered with on LV-223 turned against them

Ridley Scott once referred to the Black Goo as "evil bacteriology."

Fire and Stone says the Goo has constantly changing DNA, as if it cannot decide what it is.

So - DNA + "Bacteria" = it could be alive. Viruses are just proteins with shards of DNA, but bacteria are simple single cellular life.

So, the "Gods" could ironically be a form of bacteria or other single celled life that eventually gives rise to more complex life. And the "Gods" are a unique type, perhaps more aware.

Maybe as you mentioned, it didn't just turn on them, it punished them for trying to use it for their own gains rather than the purpose of creating life.

Those are some interesting theories you shared that got me thinking about it a bit. I've always found the Black Goo to be really fascinating and would love to see what else it does.

Remember how Elden became a walking Genesis? Every step he took, plants and trees grew? Amazing! The ship bridge he sat in eventually became an Eden.


 

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