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Author Topic: ALIEN DAY: Sigourney Weaver Talks A5 at Aliens Spe...  (Read 22535 times)

Primordial
Apr 29, 2016, 06:06:47 PM
Reply #120 on: Apr 29, 2016, 06:06:47 PM
Q
Unified Timeline


I would like it this way. Unify the movies beyond 2379 AD. It would be a smart move to set 'Alien 6' say from 2500 and have no mention to the previous ones or at least absolutely nothing that would hint any event of fact from a timeline or from another. Just stating year 25XX or whatever, is enough for us to understand that it acknowledges what has been done before, and everybody would be 'happy' ! ;D

Suppose 'Alien 5' or '3.2' is THE perfect movie everyone was waiting for and would even make silent the most sceptical person. That doesn't mean we should ignore 'Alien³' and 'Alien Res', they were present for more than 20 years and I won't deny the pleasure they gave me, I'll continue to watch them of course.


RakaiThwei
Apr 29, 2016, 06:34:20 PM
Reply #121 on: Apr 29, 2016, 06:34:20 PM
Q
Hey Primordial, that's actually a pretty good chart! You should see the one which me and Norm Keillor made sometime!  :laugh: Infact, here... I'll put it under spoilers for you!

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Someone (I don't know who but kudos to them!) did a REALLY good chart, and to me, it makes a lot of sense. It shows that there are intersecting timelines which diverge and converge in certain areas. I mean considering that... Weaver said this was a parallel universe to Alien 3 and Resurrection, I see this effectively being the case.

Considering how BIG this chart is... I'm gonna put under spoilers.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)


THE CITY HUNTER
Apr 29, 2016, 08:06:20 PM
Reply #122 on: Apr 29, 2016, 08:06:20 PM
Q
Hey Primordial, that's actually a pretty good chart! You should see the one which me and Norm Keillor made sometime!  :laugh: Infact, here... I'll put it under spoilers for you!

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Someone (I don't know who but kudos to them!) did a REALLY good chart, and to me, it makes a lot of sense. It shows that there are intersecting timelines which diverge and converge in certain areas. I mean considering that... Weaver said this was a parallel universe to Alien 3 and Resurrection, I see this effectively being the case.

Considering how BIG this chart is... I'm gonna put under spoilers.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Spoiler (click to show/hide)


RakaiThwei
Apr 29, 2016, 08:29:07 PM
Reply #123 on: Apr 29, 2016, 08:29:07 PM
Q
Concerning the first chart Norm and I made, we kept in mind of what the directors at the time wanted to do and bridge the two together. So... it doesn't really matter if it's own timeline or not. We know it follows after Predator 2, and serves as a prequel to Alien.

Then the other films, such as PREDATORS and Prometheus, more or less didn't agree with the direction and instead took cues from the previous movies, PREDATORS being touted as the third movie, and Prometheus being touted as an indirect Alien prequel. So now it's pretty much become a pick your own path. And with Weaver saying that Alien 5 is pretty much an AU... well... everything sort of falls into place.

As for the second chart, I'm not sure WHO made that one but... I like it, I like it a lot.


Giger Beast
Apr 30, 2016, 02:39:42 AM
Reply #124 on: Apr 30, 2016, 02:39:42 AM
Q
Yes, have Ripley say "I had a bad dream I lost my hair" in a tongue in cheek way and be done with it.  One line.  No elaborate justification for the dream sequence.  Go the Marvel / Deadpool route and make a joke of it, and move on.

Corporal Hicks:  Not keen on this idea! Don't need that kind of humour.

Corporal, on principle I agree that Alien 3 and Alien: R should just be ignored, but if they really had to mention it, I would consider the off-handed joke above, which could be a reference to any other jokes Ripley may have had in cryo-sleep, to be the maximum extent of what is needed.  I would prefer if they would just let it go and not mention anything.

But...

I think I have a solution for everything.  I have taken into account mostly what Cainsson said here, though keeping in mind what the skeptical Mr. Huda had said.  To make the story make sense, there would have to be motivation for the cloning.  I think I figured it out in a way that is neither convoluted, nor requires a retcon, and can in fact sync everything up nicely.  So here goes, in point form.

-Firstly, we have to accept the premise that Bishop is operating under conflicting directives.  Firstly, he is unable to harm a human being, but secondly, he has a specific request to secure an  return an alien to company labs.  But would Bishop consider a clone to be a human?  Do you see where I am going with this?

-So how did the eggs get on the Sulaco?  Simply, when Bishop was sent into the tunnels to get the second Dropship from the Sulaco, he went and secured 3 eggs from the egg chamber before the second dropship arrived.  At this time he knew that there were only 3 survivors.  He packed them neatly on the Dropship for return to company labs.  At no time did he intend any malice towards any of the humans though, because since he was a scientific android sent on a scientific mission, he had a lab on board the Sulaco where he could store and secure such organisms.

-Once everyone is sleeping, Bishop wakes up and gets to work.  But he is a bit of a spaz now that he is damaged.  During the weeks of sleep that everyone is under, he clones Ripley, Newt and Hicks for the purpose of incubation.  This does not conflict with his prime directive, because they are not humans.  He could just deliver the eggs whole to the company labs, but he is concerned that they may hatch and screw things up for everyone, so he figures the best bet is to have the eggs get fertilized inside the clones, so that they can be frozen for further study once he arrives back at company labs.

-He successfully impregnates CloneRipley, and while he is delivering the second egg, being a spaz, he falls over, it hatches, and just goes for Clone Hicks on its own but it cracks the glass, hurts itself, and the blood starts the electrical fire that destroys the ship.  This also explains why we have the burn marks inside the capsule from the acid. The clones are jettisoned along with Bishop to Fury 161, along with data on the cloning methods used.  Perhaps Bishop was funneling DNA directly from the originals and that is how memories got included?  I know this bit is a stretch.   So we have a dead facehugger that causes burn marks in the capsule, an impregnated Ripley Clone, Clones of Newt and Hicks, Bishop plus 1 unopened egg in the capsule, + the data.  When Bishop is reactivated in Alien 3, he sees that his Ripley clone is conscious and has all her memories and now that makes him guilty of violating his prime code.  So he asks to be deactivated.  The other egg hatches and impregnates the dog or ox.  Hicks and Newt clones never once had an y consciousness.

-In Alien Resurrection, the marines are still trying to use Bishops original data for cloning purposes.  In fact the previous point explains exactly why they went the cloning route, and how Ripley 8 was able to have memories.  They never bothered to clone Hicks and Newt because they had no Alien DNA associated with them.

-And that leaves the 3 remaining survivors from Aliens who are also jettisoned in their own EEV, but without Bishop.  That will deserve an explanation.  Then they are floating out there until Alien 5.  They are picked up eventually after they age about 30 years in stasis.  Ultimately, the theme of Alien 5 could be about them learning what happened.  Perhaps they could even end up frozen again after Alien 5 so that Ripley meets Ripley 8 eventually..

Dude that's actually really sweet.

No one's talking about this, but I think it works.

Still wouldn't be a huge fan and could get a little cheesy, but as far as keeping them both in the SAME UNIVERSE, I think this plan is the best I've heard so far


Perfect-Organism
Apr 30, 2016, 05:46:36 AM
Reply #125 on: Apr 30, 2016, 05:46:36 AM
Q
Thanks Giger Beast.   :)

Really though, Cainsson had the idea with the clones and it was the fact that Huda challenged the idea of clones by asking why would they need to exist that made this come together.  I mean cloning was a simple and obvious solution that works with the premise of Resurrection.  It is an existing part of the Alien my this since 97.  But Huda was right, you have to validate the cloning of those people.  This is one way to do it.

What's more is that the grey area of Bishop is further extrapolated, and is consistent with the character.  Throughout Aliens, we had no idea if he would be good or bad.  What I'm proposing, actually amplifies that.  In his mind, cloning the 3 people would be the preferred solution as they would not be conscious humans.  So he would not feel that he is hurting anybody.  Not until he wakes up in Alien 3 anyway.

This idea really follows up on the Ridley Scott sort of questions about what it means to be human, and what it means to be an artificial human, and what it means to be a human clone.

But yes, I agree, that any of these ideas could turn into cheese.  I am a big proponent of the Blomkamp film, but don't doubt that I am knuckle-biting it through this process.  The Alien 5 film has a greater potential to go so wrong, than to go so right...


Primordial
Apr 30, 2016, 06:21:52 AM
Reply #126 on: Apr 30, 2016, 06:21:52 AM
Q
Rakai, I posted a 'branch', you gave me the whole trees ! Thanks for that  :)
For the first one, I like that the first 4 movies are on the borderline of universe 1 et 2, and for the second it is aesthetically perfect. I wonder why the dates are delayed of 1 year for 'Alien' or 'Aliens' for example.

Perfect-O,
I understood your state of mind and I know you are helping Cainsson's theory, but I'll switch on to sceptical mode for a bit. Thanks in advance for your forgivness  :-*...  :laugh:
- The company labs, for experiment purposes, would prefer to have an egg rather than an already infected host. You say Bishop may be concerned that the eggs would hatch so he figures the best bet is to have the eggs get fertilized inside the clones, so that they can be frozen. I would argue that if the eggs didn't hatch in the dropship then why would they do so in the Sulaco ? And why not simply freeze the eggs ?
- Bishops wants the clones infected so why not have each egg near the host instead of putting one of them in a weird place like we see in the beginning of 'Alien³' ? and why doesn't he open the cryo tubes when the face hugger is near the tube in order to avoid the fire that happened, if himself wasn't in one of them ? If he was, then why ?
- 200 years later, the cloning technology is not achieved. Sure, cloning Ripley is easier than cloning infected Ripley but still. So Bishop managed to clone her, and did he do some learning sessions with her like in 'Resurrection' ? I also recall that in a deleted scene of this movie, Ripley 8 had feelings about Newt. So you can't say she is not conscious.

Anyway, I doubt there is a neat way to fill the gaps no matter how hard we try.   


RakaiThwei
Apr 30, 2016, 06:37:43 AM
Reply #127 on: Apr 30, 2016, 06:37:43 AM
Q
Rakai, I posted a 'branch', you gave me the whole trees ! Thanks for that  :)

You're welcome, and seeing that Alien 5 is very much going to be an AU, I figured that I might as well share with you what Norm and I had come up with. I think this pretty much cements what I've been saying the last couple of years regarding the franchises. I mean while we don't know much of the plot of Alien 5, the fact that Weaver seems to be the only one who KNOWS what's going on, and the fact that she re-asserts Blomkamp not touching Alien 3 and Resurrection, and says that these movies are occurring in a parallel universe... to me anyway, and maybe a few others, cements that there is more than one universe. Of course, I will admit, I COULD be looking too much into this but.. her statements seem to have weight to them.

I wonder why the dates are delayed of 1 year for 'Alien' or 'Aliens' for example.

I have no idea as to who created that particular chart. Aesthetically speaking, it does show where everything goes, and how their paths are laid out very nicely. But the dates, I won't argue, are very much wrong in terms of Alien and Aliens. They should be listed as 2122, and 2179. Whoever had done that particular chart, likely had some wrong dates listed but I liked the layout of the second chart.


Whiskeybrewer
Apr 30, 2016, 12:58:41 PM
Reply #128 on: Apr 30, 2016, 12:58:41 PM
Q
Yes, have Ripley say "I had a bad dream I lost my hair" in a tongue in cheek way and be done with it.  One line.  No elaborate justification for the dream sequence.  Go the Marvel / Deadpool route and make a joke of it, and move on.

Corporal Hicks:  Not keen on this idea! Don't need that kind of humour.

Corporal, on principle I agree that Alien 3 and Alien: R should just be ignored, but if they really had to mention it, I would consider the off-handed joke above, which could be a reference to any other jokes Ripley may have had in cryo-sleep, to be the maximum extent of what is needed.  I would prefer if they would just let it go and not mention anything.

But...

I think I have a solution for everything.  I have taken into account mostly what Cainsson said here, though keeping in mind what the skeptical Mr. Huda had said.  To make the story make sense, there would have to be motivation for the cloning.  I think I figured it out in a way that is neither convoluted, nor requires a retcon, and can in fact sync everything up nicely.  So here goes, in point form.

-Firstly, we have to accept the premise that Bishop is operating under conflicting directives.  Firstly, he is unable to harm a human being, but secondly, he has a specific request to secure an  return an alien to company labs.  But would Bishop consider a clone to be a human?  Do you see where I am going with this?

-So how did the eggs get on the Sulaco?  Simply, when Bishop was sent into the tunnels to get the second Dropship from the Sulaco, he went and secured 3 eggs from the egg chamber before the second dropship arrived.  At this time he knew that there were only 3 survivors.  He packed them neatly on the Dropship for return to company labs.  At no time did he intend any malice towards any of the humans though, because since he was a scientific android sent on a scientific mission, he had a lab on board the Sulaco where he could store and secure such organisms.

-Once everyone is sleeping, Bishop wakes up and gets to work.  But he is a bit of a spaz now that he is damaged.  During the weeks of sleep that everyone is under, he clones Ripley, Newt and Hicks for the purpose of incubation.  This does not conflict with his prime directive, because they are not humans.  He could just deliver the eggs whole to the company labs, but he is concerned that they may hatch and screw things up for everyone, so he figures the best bet is to have the eggs get fertilized inside the clones, so that they can be frozen for further study once he arrives back at company labs.

-He successfully impregnates CloneRipley, and while he is delivering the second egg, being a spaz, he falls over, it hatches, and just goes for Clone Hicks on its own but it cracks the glass, hurts itself, and the blood starts the electrical fire that destroys the ship.  This also explains why we have the burn marks inside the capsule from the acid. The clones are jettisoned along with Bishop to Fury 161, along with data on the cloning methods used.  Perhaps Bishop was funneling DNA directly from the originals and that is how memories got included?  I know this bit is a stretch.   So we have a dead facehugger that causes burn marks in the capsule, an impregnated Ripley Clone, Clones of Newt and Hicks, Bishop plus 1 unopened egg in the capsule, + the data.  When Bishop is reactivated in Alien 3, he sees that his Ripley clone is conscious and has all her memories and now that makes him guilty of violating his prime code.  So he asks to be deactivated.  The other egg hatches and impregnates the dog or ox.  Hicks and Newt clones never once had an y consciousness.

-In Alien Resurrection, the marines are still trying to use Bishops original data for cloning purposes.  In fact the previous point explains exactly why they went the cloning route, and how Ripley 8 was able to have memories.  They never bothered to clone Hicks and Newt because they had no Alien DNA associated with them.

-And that leaves the 3 remaining survivors from Aliens who are also jettisoned in their own EEV, but without Bishop.  That will deserve an explanation.  Then they are floating out there until Alien 5.  They are picked up eventually after they age about 30 years in stasis.  Ultimately, the theme of Alien 5 could be about them learning what happened.  Perhaps they could even end up frozen again after Alien 5 so that Ripley meets Ripley 8 eventually..

Dude that's actually really sweet.

No one's talking about this, but I think it works.

Still wouldn't be a huge fan and could get a little cheesy, but as far as keeping them both in the SAME UNIVERSE, I think this plan is the best I've heard so far

Honestly i was like Huda in regards to the clones aspect, but reading all this. It actually works so well. Its a cleverly extrapolated reason as to why it could be seen as parralell. And it would explain why the first clones in Resurrection didnt quite work. They were cloning a clone. Someone email this to Blomkamp, Scott and Weaver lol


LastSurvivor92
Apr 30, 2016, 01:47:03 PM
Reply #129 on: Apr 30, 2016, 01:47:03 PM
Q
Everything surrounding Blomkamp's Alien 5 project has been nothing but GREAT news! Why am I so much more pumped for this than Alien Covenant. I'm assuming FOX is saving the best for last. Its crazy to think its already been 4 YEARS since the release of Prometheus!!


Shamo
Apr 30, 2016, 01:54:36 PM
Reply #130 on: Apr 30, 2016, 01:54:36 PM
Q
I am not keen on Bishop becoming the Super Clone Doctor.

I still want the engineers to be some kind of entity. Ripley deserves a glimpse at the bigger picture of things- she deserves to find out why the Alien exists.

There is a Blonkamp Artwork that showed Ripley with something that resembles Biomechanic Tech. It was among the first Artworks released. Covenant can explore the engineers in a way, that would give em a plausible agenda to interfere with events after Aliens.

I say they board sulaco! They plant the egg! And they clone another Ripley. They either replace the bodies of Newt and Hicks- or they recreate them es artificial persons to give their Ripley clone some form of stability.

As we know from the books the Aliens cursed Ripleys Bloodline. The engineers somehow need that blood. And at some point it should tie in with Amandas path.


BringbackJonesy!
Apr 30, 2016, 05:49:59 PM
Reply #131 on: Apr 30, 2016, 05:49:59 PM
Q
I'm loving that this is still potentially going to happen.  I'm used to seeing some beloved characters being brought back onscreen by older actors now, and would welcome seeing Weaver and Biehn back onscreen againg in these particular roles.

I still intend to re-edit ALIEN 3 and ALIEN RESURRECTION (seperately) in a way where I can watch these movies without feeling that Ripley, Newt, and Hicks died...and it sounds like I could STILLl include my versions in a 'marathon viewing' if I ever took the notion...and then carry on with Blomkamp's entry afterwards, without contradicting it as being the 'true' follow-up to ALIENS.  So I'm very pleased with this possibility.

...and if 'Jonesy' reappears onscreen once more too, then all the better!

  ;D  ;D

Excuse my typos in previous post.  I was rushing.

« Last Edit: Apr 30, 2016, 05:53:46 PM by BringbackJonesy! »

Shamo
May 01, 2016, 10:36:43 AM
Reply #132 on: May 01, 2016, 10:36:43 AM
Q
I would love a Jonesy vs Chestburster Alien Isolation DLC Kickstarter ;D


AVP-CAPCOM
May 01, 2016, 04:37:51 PM
Reply #133 on: May 01, 2016, 04:37:51 PM
Q
Everything surrounding Blomkamp's Alien 5 project has been nothing but GREAT news! Why am I so much more pumped for this than Alien Covenant. I'm assuming FOX is saving the best for last. Its crazy to think its already been 4 YEARS since the release of Prometheus!!

I am assuming its because they know Ridley Scott is a "safe bet"- whereas Blomkamp recent films have had lukewarm box office returns.

Prometheus did make $403 Million box office against a $130 Million budget after all.

That said I hope Prometheus 2 (COVENANT) doesn't bomb or else it can/could affect ALIEN 5 in the same way both financially and creativity wise.

Remember it was studio meddling that lead to Xenomorphs being cut from Prometheus according to....

https://monsterlegacy.net/2013/03/04/prometheus-horrors-trilobite-deacon/


Primordial
May 01, 2016, 07:05:55 PM
Reply #134 on: May 01, 2016, 07:05:55 PM
Q
You're welcome, and seeing that Alien 5 is very much going to be an AU, I figured that I might as well share with you what Norm and I had come up with. I think this pretty much cements what I've been saying the last couple of years regarding the franchises. I mean while we don't know much of the plot of Alien 5, the fact that Weaver seems to be the only one who KNOWS what's going on, and the fact that she re-asserts Blomkamp not touching Alien 3 and Resurrection, and says that these movies are occurring in a parallel universe... to me anyway, and maybe a few others, cements that there is more than one universe. Of course, I will admit, I COULD be looking too much into this but.. her statements seem to have weight to them.

I agree, for the time being, it seems a legit thought.


For reminders, here's a piece of interview form february 2015 :

We asked if there was more to Ripley she was interested in exploring. “It’s not that so much is that we just left it at such a creepy place, sort of stranded above Earth. I was quite happy to move onto other things and I didn’t want to go to Earth. I didn’t want to manufacture a sequel and I felt like we were starting to do that. If something happens from this, it would be very organic and very original, and because of that, it would make me want to do it. If it was someone as talented as Neill, I’d certainly listen.


 

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