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Author Topic: AvPGalaxy Podcast #29 – Alien: Paradise Lost  (Read 9782 times)


markweatherill
Oct 09, 2015, 07:02:26 AM
Reply #16 on: Oct 09, 2015, 07:02:26 AM
So the title Paradise Lost is based on a poem, or, er, something? Who'd have thought it! ;D


oduodu
Oct 09, 2015, 09:13:04 AM
Reply #17 on: Oct 09, 2015, 09:13:04 AM
Is this poem Milton's Paradise Lost that Ridley  spoke of ??


Anonymous
Oct 07, 2015, 07:55:25 PM
Reply #18 on: Oct 07, 2015, 07:55:25 PM
You guys should really get someone in there with opposing ideas to yours. This whole thing is just a preaching to the choir...

« Last Edit: Oct 07, 2015, 08:24:59 PM by Doesitmatter »


Corporal Hicks
Oct 12, 2015, 09:46:57 AM
Reply #20 on: Oct 12, 2015, 09:46:57 AM
Sorry guys for getting heated and being an ass...My intentions isn't insult anyone one person or the community at large. I just can't stand the excessive whining about what could have been.

In general I really agree with you. However, Prometheus had so much promise that the end result was a bitter disappointment and the complaints are legitimate.

Quote
As far a Blomkamp being able to do what he wants with his movie that fine, but I think he should tread lightly with making as you put it a "fan service film". The majority of fans no nothing of what makes a good film. Taking the elements of previous films that we enjoyed and simply adding more or going over the top with them, as Blomkamp's concept art suggests isn't the way. I believe that when original Alien came out, nothing like it had ever been seen before. It left a permanent mark in the psyche of many people. It left them wanting more. Which is a good thing. But not at the cost of having the same stuff rehashed over and over.

The only "fan service" aspects seem to be the revival of Hicks and Newt. I've seen nothing in his concept art that would make me think he's doing "more of the same". Are you referring to anything specifically? If anything, I like how open Blomkamp has been about his own film making and how Weaver and Isolation have made him reconsider his film. At the end of the day, we simply know too little about the film and people are complaining too much about the one thing that is a given and we don't know how he's going to pull it off.

Quote
Prometheus was a great entry, not saying flawless, not even Alien is flawless, but way better than Ressurection and those god awful AVP movies.

I'm not sure I'd go that far. It's better than AvPR, definitely but I find Resurrection interesting in a trainwreck kind of way and AvP is mildly entertaining. Prometheus I just find frustrating because it could have been so much better.

If I do have some questions it would be perhaps three questions.. Why was Machiko changed to Hiroko? Were there anymore drafts and what differences were between them? And perhaps this one.. fourteen years since Predator 2, and eight years after Resurrection.. why didn't we get this movie especially considering the advancement in film technology? Was it because studio heads were always changing or the studio didn't have faith in Brigg's script?

Thanks, Rakai. I'll try and make sure we answer (or at least discuss) these for you.


HuDaFuK
Oct 12, 2015, 03:11:05 PM
Reply #21 on: Oct 12, 2015, 03:11:05 PM
It's better than AvPR, definitely but I find Resurrection interesting in a trainwreck kind of way and AvP is mildly entertaining. Prometheus I just find frustrating because it could have been so much better.

Mirrors my thoughts. Prometheus might be a better film than Resurrection on a technical level, but Resurrection at least has the power to entertain me in a cheesy, b-movie kinda way. It knows what it is and makes no apologies for it.

Prometheus on the other hand seems to think I'll ignore how stupid it is at times just because it asks a few lofty questions about the origins of man and the creation of life. I find it so impossibly frustrating to watch, it's like they were so interested in asking those epic questions that they forgot to check whether the little things around them made sense. Well I'm sorry, but you can't do that if you're trying to be a serious, important movie.


XenoHunter99
Oct 13, 2015, 03:32:27 PM
Reply #22 on: Oct 13, 2015, 03:32:27 PM

In general I really agree with you. However, Prometheus had so much promise that the end result was a bitter disappointment and the complaints are legitimate.
This! Bitter disappointment. But I'm not convinced the Spaihts movie would have turned out that much better.

Quote
The only "fan service" aspects seem to be the revival of Hicks and Newt. I've seen nothing in his concept art that would make me think he's doing "more of the same". Are you referring to anything specifically? If anything, I like how open Blomkamp has been about his own film making and how Weaver and Isolation have made him reconsider his film. At the end of the day, we simply know too little about the film and people are complaining too much about the one thing that is a given and we don't know how he's going to pull it off.

Perhaps we'll be pleasantly surprised, but I'm not holding my breath.

Quote
Quote
Prometheus was a great entry, not saying flawless, not even Alien is flawless, but way better than Ressurection and those god awful AVP movies.

I'm not sure I'd go that far. It's better than AvPR, definitely but I find Resurrection interesting in a trainwreck kind of way and AvP is mildly entertaining. Prometheus I just find frustrating because it could have been so much better.

I think AvP Director's Cut is a fun movie. AvPR is the one that makes no sense. It's. So. Painfully. Bad. But if you're looking for continuity, AvP causes a lot of problems. AvP says the preds already had significant influence on the development of humanity. And the xenos have already been on earth. Hardly seems that would be possible, but whatever. Resurrection is what it is. I understand what it is and why; but like you, I put it pretty far down the list.


TheBATMAN
Oct 13, 2015, 03:56:38 PM
Reply #23 on: Oct 13, 2015, 03:56:38 PM
Another fine discussion gents. I think whatever the result of Paradise Lost and the ultimate explanation of the Alien; I think it's only fitting that Ridley Scott be the person to do it. Not James Cameron or anyone else. (Once upon a time I'd say Dan O'Bannon too, but then didn't he say the alien would slowly evolve into a predator?)

Although deeply flawed, I think Prometheus is one of those films that will be far more enjoyable to revisit once the sequel is available and some of it's long-running questions are finally answered.


RakaiThwei
Oct 13, 2015, 06:08:01 PM
Reply #24 on: Oct 13, 2015, 06:08:01 PM
At the end of the day, we simply know too little about the film and people are complaining too much about the one thing that is a given and we don't know how he's going to pull it off.

I know I'm repeating myself but I honestly hope Blomkamp just simply ignores Alien 3 and Resurrection but not for the reasons which most people would think. I love Alien 3, and Resurrection could at best be described as... underwhelming but I need to reform my opinion on it again. I rather he wouldn't touch these films and attempt to explain them. I mean it could fit in with a timeframe between Aliens and Alien 3, but there is a two week travel from LV-426 to Fury-161, and Weaver's age.. is also a problem unless digital de-aging is done.

Another form of retconning is that he could go the easy way out, and that's with the dream or memory implantation route. Personally, I call this the Bobby Ewing route. Sure it's an easy fix and a lot of fans speculate that Alien 3 and Resurrection were hyperspace dreams but I find this.. to be a cop out. Also, as a casual fan of the Alien series, I would feel a little bit insulted. The whole dream thing is just a way of saying that Alien 3 never happened, but it did happen as a dream, but it never really happened anyway..

I hope when Biehn says is true, that Blomkamp simply pretends that they never happened. I don't want something contrived and easy as going the dream route. If this is going to be an alternative Alien 3, then simply just ignore the last two films and take off after Aliens.

Done, done, no harm, no foul.


Corporal Hicks
Oct 14, 2015, 07:57:57 AM
Reply #25 on: Oct 14, 2015, 07:57:57 AM

In general I really agree with you. However, Prometheus had so much promise that the end result was a bitter disappointment and the complaints are legitimate.
This! Bitter disappointment. But I'm not convinced the Spaihts movie would have turned out that much better.

I still think it would have been a far better film. All Prometheus had over Engineers was David and Fassbender. We intend on doing an episode discussing the Engineers script at some point early next year.

Although deeply flawed, I think Prometheus is one of those films that will be far more enjoyable to revisit once the sequel is available and some of it's long-running questions are finally answered.

I certainly hope so! I just hope it all gels well together. I fear it being quite haphazard.

I know I'm repeating myself but I honestly hope Blomkamp just simply ignores Alien 3 and Resurrection but not for the reasons which most people would think. I love Alien 3, and Resurrection could at best be described as... underwhelming but I need to reform my opinion on it again. I rather he wouldn't touch these films and attempt to explain them. I mean it could fit in with a timeframe between Aliens and Alien 3, but there is a two week travel from LV-426 to Fury-161, and Weaver's age.. is also a problem unless digital de-aging is done.

Another form of retconning is that he could go the easy way out, and that's with the dream or memory implantation route. Personally, I call this the Bobby Ewing route. Sure it's an easy fix and a lot of fans speculate that Alien 3 and Resurrection were hyperspace dreams but I find this.. to be a cop out. Also, as a casual fan of the Alien series, I would feel a little bit insulted. The whole dream thing is just a way of saying that Alien 3 never happened, but it did happen as a dream, but it never really happened anyway..

I hope when Biehn says is true, that Blomkamp simply pretends that they never happened. I don't want something contrived and easy as going the dream route. If this is going to be an alternative Alien 3, then simply just ignore the last two films and take off after Aliens.

I'd rather they just ignore Alien 3 and Resurrection. Things like memory implants, dreams, etc are just pathetic IMHO and far more of a cop-out. Unfortunately it does actually make a lot of sense for it to be a hyperspace dream because of things like Prometheus and the Alien novelization. I would just hate it.

« Last Edit: Oct 14, 2015, 07:59:43 AM by Corporal Hicks »

XenoHunter99
Oct 14, 2015, 06:39:06 PM
Reply #26 on: Oct 14, 2015, 06:39:06 PM

In general I really agree with you. However, Prometheus had so much promise that the end result was a bitter disappointment and the complaints are legitimate.
This! Bitter disappointment. But I'm not convinced the Spaihts movie would have turned out that much better.

I still think it would have been a far better film. All Prometheus had over Engineers was David and Fassbender. We intend on doing an episode discussing the Engineers script at some point early next year.

Since it was not made, we can only speculate. It seemed to me the various creatures were too easily destroyed, and the idea of producing a giant-sized warrior was sort of silly. But I'm sure your discussion about it will be worth a listen.


HuDaFuK
Oct 15, 2015, 07:41:19 AM
Reply #27 on: Oct 15, 2015, 07:41:19 AM
It seemed to me the various creatures were too easily destroyed, and the idea of producing a giant-sized warrior was sort of silly. But I'm sure your discussion about it will be worth a listen.

We've said countless times the script was not without problems, and needed more work. But when they gave it to Lindelof to do that work, he broke far more than he fixed.


XenoHunter99
Oct 15, 2015, 11:59:16 AM
Reply #28 on: Oct 15, 2015, 11:59:16 AM
It seemed to me the various creatures were too easily destroyed, and the idea of producing a giant-sized warrior was sort of silly. But I'm sure your discussion about it will be worth a listen.

We've said countless times the script was not without problems, and needed more work. But when they gave it to Lindelof to do that work, he broke far more than he fixed.

I know. But that does not mean the Spaihts script would have resulted in a significantly better film. Everyone hopes that would have happened, but we'll never know. Prometheus was not very good, and it remains to be seen whether the new movie will be any better.


HuDaFuK
Oct 15, 2015, 12:41:15 PM
Reply #29 on: Oct 15, 2015, 12:41:15 PM
I know. But that does not mean the Spaihts script would have resulted in a significantly better film.

I think it would have. My number one problem with Prometheus was how utterly illogical the characters were at times, they'd do things simply to further the plot rather than because a rational person would. That issue didn't exist in the Spaihts script. The characters' actions were logical and justifiable.

All that needed cleaning up were the underpowered Aliens, but even as it was I consider Spaihts' version superior to what we got.


 

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