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Author Topic: Dark Horse To Reboot Comic Series  (Read 147330 times)

Xenomrph
Mar 30, 2014, 04:17:20 AM
Reply #975 on: Mar 30, 2014, 04:17:20 AM
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But I think we'll get something along the lines: "We're not an authority on what's canon or isn't" in regards to that question.
Dark Horse doesn't need to be an authority in order to say what FOX thinks. :P At least, it hasn't stopped them in the past.

The point is that just because one writer chooses to not incorporate a plot element from a source doesn't mean that source "isn't canon" anymore in the grand scheme of things - it just means that one writer is choosing not to let that source color the story they want to tell.
Case in point: the upcoming Predator comics not having Super-Predators, or 'Predators' not directly referencing the plots of the AvP movies, or the writers of the upcoming comics saying they weren't going to reference the old comics. That doesn't mean that stuff "isn't canon", just that the writers aren't saddling the new stuff with that baggage because it doesn't help them tell the story they want to tell.
AvP2010 referenced 'AvP' because Rebellion thought it would help their story.

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I don't see how merchandise has any bearing on the canon or storyline of the franchise. Merchandise is something which fans buy to add to their collection.
It's also something that keeps a franchise in the public consciousness and reminds people that something exists. If FOX didn't want people remembering the AvP movies and all the things in them, why would they keep authorizing things from it and keep reminding people of something they want everyone to forget or ignore?

Compare it to, say, the Hish concept - evidently FOX literally told other EU writers to outright not reference the Hish concept. That could mean it's been retconned out of existence per FOX, but who knows?


RakaiThwei
Mar 30, 2014, 04:53:09 AM
Reply #976 on: Mar 30, 2014, 04:53:09 AM
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Dark Horse doesn't need to be an authority in order to say what FOX thinks. :P At least, it hasn't stopped them in the past.

No arguments, but I want to hear somethings from the writers themselves. Any wrong in that?

AvP2010 referenced 'AvP' because Rebellion thought it would help their story.

Unpopular opinion, but I thought Rebellion did that quite beautifully. I loved AvP2010. I would go as even far as to say that might as well have been the third AvP installment in continuity with the AvP movies.

It's also something that keeps a franchise in the public consciousness and reminds people that something exists. If FOX didn't want people remembering the AvP movies and all the things in them, why would they keep authorizing things from it and keep reminding people of something they want everyone to forget or ignore?

I don't think that they really so much as care about maintaining the reminder of two less than well received films. Granted I liked the AvPs, again another unpopular opinion but if anything merchandise is really meant to hook in the fans, reel them in and grab them for whatever cash that they can really dish out to obtain said items. Fans collect, for one reason for another.. Either way, Fox and the partners ends up getting the profits. It's about the money as far as merchandise is concerned.

Compare it to, say, the Hish concept - evidently FOX literally told other EU writers to outright not reference the Hish concept. That could mean it's been retconned out of existence per FOX, but who knows?

The Hish concept, as... awful as that pill was to swallow could still be used in Predator novels or such. Just write the Super Predators as Hish and the regular Predators as Yautja, there you go.


happypred
Mar 31, 2014, 03:12:40 AM
Reply #977 on: Mar 31, 2014, 03:12:40 AM
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The Hish concept, as... awful as that pill was to swallow could still be used in Predator novels or such. Just write the Super Predators as Hish and the regular Predators as Yautja, there you go.

I like neither the Hish concept nor the Super Predator concept...but if I had keep one, I'd prefer Super Predators to Hish. Of course, my first choice would be to have neither. Yautja and Bad Bloods is what I've always been fond of.

It sounds like this new series will probably stick to the "original movie predators". I've always felt like Yaujta are a solid expansion of the predator mythos based on the clan in Predator 2. I can only hope that this reboot keeps some elements of the nomadic, clan-based Yautja who hunt for both sport and honour. Aside from Steve Perry's Yautja, I thought Jeff Vandermeer's version of the predators in South China Sea was quite good.     

 

« Last Edit: Mar 31, 2014, 03:15:05 AM by happypred »

Xenomrph
Mar 31, 2014, 03:17:52 AM
Reply #978 on: Mar 31, 2014, 03:17:52 AM
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No arguments, but I want to hear somethings from the writers themselves. Any wrong in that?
Certainly not. :)

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Unpopular opinion, but I thought Rebellion did that quite beautifully. I loved AvP2010. I would go as even far as to say that might as well have been the third AvP installment in continuity with the AvP movies.
I don't disagree there.

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I don't think that they really so much as care about maintaining the reminder of two less than well received films. Granted I liked the AvPs, again another unpopular opinion but if anything merchandise is really meant to hook in the fans, reel them in and grab them for whatever cash that they can really dish out to obtain said items. Fans collect, for one reason for another.. Either way, Fox and the partners ends up getting the profits. It's about the money as far as merchandise is concerned.
I don't disagree with anything you've said, but it also doesn't really change anything I'd said. :P


RakaiThwei
Mar 31, 2014, 04:28:43 AM
Reply #979 on: Mar 31, 2014, 04:28:43 AM
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I like neither the Hish concept nor the Super Predator concept...but if I had keep one, I'd prefer Super Predators to Hish. Of course, my first choice would be to have neither. Yautja and Bad Bloods is what I've always been fond of.   

I don't like the Hish or the Super Predator concept neither, so I agree with you there. However the Super Predators are supposed to be a cousin race or species to the traditional Predators. It wouldn't be too far-fetched to write the Hish as the Super Predators, and suggest that the Yautja and the Hish descended from a common ancestor but one branched off the other. This could also explain the cultural differences and the different hunting practices. Thinking about it now, the Dog and Wolf analogy isn't that too far off but neither would be comparing Chimpanzees to Banobos. Chimpanzees sort of have cultural differences to Banobos.. Chimps are aggressive and violent, and use violence to sort out pack issues where as Banobos believe in making love, not war to solve their problems.

It sounds like this new series will probably stick to the "original movie predators". I've always felt like Yaujta are a solid expansion of the predator mythos based on the clan in Predator 2. I can only hope that this reboot keeps some elements of the nomadic, clan-based Yautja who hunt for both sport and honour. Aside from Steve Perry's Yautja, I thought Jeff Vandermeer's version of the predators in South China Sea was quite good.     

What would make me either pass these books, or read them is if they write the "original" Predators as they were depicted in the first two films, but I wouldn't really like it if they were using the attack dogs in the hunt. I mean previous material suggested that the traditional hunters abhor the idea of using attack dogs, as seen in Three World War and even Evolution. So I would have problems with the traditional Predators using the attack dogs. I really hope those things we saw aren't hell-hounds, and given the look of the anatomy as they have six legs and different bodily build.. I don't think they are but.. I can't be too sure.


King Xeno
Mar 31, 2014, 04:29:07 AM
Reply #980 on: Mar 31, 2014, 04:29:07 AM
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Looks really good, have been waiting a long time for some aliens and predators books.! Can't wait.


happypred
Mar 31, 2014, 06:16:29 AM
Reply #981 on: Mar 31, 2014, 06:16:29 AM
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However the Super Predators are supposed to be a cousin race or species to the traditional Predators. It wouldn't be too far-fetched to write the Hish as the Super Predators
I guess you could...but the question is why? The Hish and the Super Predators are both rather lame concepts, but the Hish are even worse IMO. If they decide to use the Super Predators, I'd prefer that they don't try to write them as Hish. Why mix up the two concepts? Writing the Super Predators as Hish wouldn't improve the Super Predators, it would make them even more lame 


RakaiThwei
Mar 31, 2014, 06:56:09 AM
Reply #982 on: Mar 31, 2014, 06:56:09 AM
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I guess you could...but the question is why? The Hish and the Super Predators are both rather lame concepts, but the Hish are even worse IMO. If they decide to use the Super Predators, I'd prefer that they don't try to write them as Hish. Why mix up the two concepts? Writing the Super Predators as Hish wouldn't improve the Super Predators, it would make them even more lame

Oh I agree that both are lame concepts and I would rather they didn't exist at all, but I also don't like the idea of the Super Predators being labeled as Yautja when the movie suggest that they are something similar along the lines to what a Romulan is to a Vulcan. So if you ask me, they shouldn't be labeled as Yautja at all.


happypred
Mar 31, 2014, 07:12:51 AM
Reply #983 on: Mar 31, 2014, 07:12:51 AM
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The Super Predators could just be their own thing. They don't have to be Yautja or Hish. I understand that you don't want them to be Yautja, but writing them as Hish would only bring back the Hish concept. Better to just let the Hish concept die and have unique Super Predators.

Who knows...maybe a good writer in the future might be able to make the "Super" Predators actually super. They don't come off as super in Predators. They come across as extremely arrogant and careless, even moreso than regular predators...and they end up dying rather stupidly (especially Tracker) 

The Super Predators resemble the "Killers" of the 2009 series more than they do the Hish. I think it would make more sense to equate Supers and Killers as opposed to Supers and Hish   


Xenomrph
Mar 31, 2014, 02:01:23 PM
Reply #984 on: Mar 31, 2014, 02:01:23 PM
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I mean previous material suggested that the traditional hunters abhor the idea of using attack dogs, as seen in Three World War and even Evolution.
I'm not so sure on that. Just because the Super Predators do something doesn't mean non-Super Predators automatically hate it. Super Predators use cloaking, wristblades, shoulder cannons, masks, and tri-lasers, after all.

I also have a problem with the word "traditional" being thrown around when it comes to Predators, since there's so much variety and uniqueness shown in both the movies and the EU that Predators' sport-hunting practices could be very similar to human sport-hunting practices - that there isn't so much "tradition" as there's individuals (or at best, small groups, tribes, or clans) who have personal preferences. Each clan might have internal "traditions", but they certainly aren't "traditions" that apply to the entire species.


happypred
Mar 31, 2014, 04:07:20 PM
Reply #985 on: Mar 31, 2014, 04:07:20 PM
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there's so much variety and uniqueness shown in both the movies and the EU that Predators' sport-hunting practices could be very similar to human sport-hunting practices - that there isn't so much "tradition" as there's individuals (or at best, small groups, tribes, or clans) who have personal preferences. Each clan might have internal "traditions", but they certainly aren't "traditions" that apply to the entire species.

Even if there is a "code of honour", each individual predator decides how strictly he'll observe it on an actual hunt, especially if the predator is hunting solo. In Prey, it's obvious Broken Tusk is a predator who actually takes honour seriously, whereas many of his students couldn't give two sh*ts about honour when the senior hunters are no longer around. They just want to murder whatever crosses their path


Xenomrph
Apr 01, 2014, 02:20:03 AM
Reply #986 on: Apr 01, 2014, 02:20:03 AM
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there's so much variety and uniqueness shown in both the movies and the EU that Predators' sport-hunting practices could be very similar to human sport-hunting practices - that there isn't so much "tradition" as there's individuals (or at best, small groups, tribes, or clans) who have personal preferences. Each clan might have internal "traditions", but they certainly aren't "traditions" that apply to the entire species.

Even if there is a "code of honour", each individual predator decides how strictly he'll observe it on an actual hunt, especially if the predator is hunting solo. In Prey, it's obvious Broken Tusk is a predator who actually takes honour seriously, whereas many of his students couldn't give two sh*ts about honour when the senior hunters are no longer around. They just want to murder whatever crosses their path
To take that one step further, even if the individual decides to eschew "honor" for whatever reason, he still might be held accountable by the other members of his clan if he gets caught (see: "AvP: Blood Time").


Ultramorph
Apr 01, 2014, 02:14:51 PM
Reply #987 on: Apr 01, 2014, 02:14:51 PM
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Chris Roberson was just interviewed by CBR and spilled some major spoilers about his Aliens series, and had some exclusive new art work. Looks like I was unfortunately right about a few things:


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CR: Initially we were really bummed when Fox came in and told us to trash our scripts. My first issue was already written and Patric [Reynolds] was already well into the pencils, but when we got the mandate that we include Amanda Ripley, Ripley's daughter who, I think, appears in one deleted scene of Aliens, that just opened a whole new world of really cool possibilities for us.

CBR: So your series will dovetail with the new game, Alien: Isolation? Was there any collaboration between the writers and the game developers?

CR: Creative Assembly was great to us. Obviously since those guys are over in the UK they couldn't physically be there in the writers room with us, but we got to see a lot of fantastic concept art, and, of course, they sent us enough story details for us to work around. All I can say is that my Aliens series picks up about two years after the events of the game, and it sort of provides the next logical step for Amanda's story. She's gone toe to toe with the creatures her mother faced, and now she's looking for answers. Through a few twists that Paul [Tobin] sets up in Prometheus, she winds up making her way LV-223, but I can't say much more on that.

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CBR: We know that Prometheus is the "beating heart" of this reboot, so how much of a role will the Engineers play in your story?

CR: The Engineers will be a very consistent presence in all the books. What's funny is that people very rarely ever address the other aliens in the Aliens universe. Randy Stradley, who has done a lot of work on Alien and Predator books in the past and wrote the very first AvP story, along with Kelley Sue [DeConnick] had a huge binder this thick of Alien bible stuff. I kind of made it my mission to pick and choose a few choice thing from the universe Dark Horse has built and work them in to give fans something to get excited about. So part of what I do in Aliens is address the relationship between the Engineers and this species called the 'Giffs', who are from a novel that John Shirley wrote a few years back. There a couple of things like that in the different series that fans should really love.



Giffs. Of all things, Giffs.  :P My enthusiasm for this reboot was low after that disappointing ECCC panel, but I think this has finally broken my back. I'm passing on these until reviews are out and they're collected in trade. Why is it so hard to not screw Aliens stories up?

http://www.comicbookresources.com/?page=article&id4114


Nightmare Asylum
Apr 01, 2014, 02:40:22 PM
Reply #988 on: Apr 01, 2014, 02:40:22 PM
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So, uhh... what's a Giff, exactly?

Also, Amanda Ripley is going to be in this comic series too? Yeah, this whole thing sounds dumb :P


Corporal Hicks
Apr 01, 2014, 02:41:03 PM
Reply #989 on: Apr 01, 2014, 02:41:03 PM
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April Fools?

The link doesn't work and that picture looks like a Tholian from Trek.

« Last Edit: Apr 01, 2014, 02:44:35 PM by Corporal Hicks »

 

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