Why do people hate Alien3?

[Valaquen]

There's also the fact that some major changes were made to Dan O'Bannons original script by Giler and Hill and then studio head Alan Ladd jr - changes that remained in the final film.

They didn't change the finale. The script of that sequence remained the same until shooting. At one point the producers wanted to drop the Alien appearing on the Narcissus altogether, but Ridley fought for it. He changed the mechanics of the showdown to allow for a lull in the action, as in O'Bannon and Giler/Hill's script the Alien appeared immediately after the Nostromo explodes. Ridley allowed for the little break that allows Ripley to undress. They couldn't shoot Ripley flying out of the shuttle with the Alien; that's the only real differences from when it was first written until release.

[stephen]

I thought the ending with the Alien on the Shuttle was Ridley's idea?  didn't he say in the commentary that he wanted a "fourth act"?

[Valaquen]

I thought the ending with the Alien on the Shuttle was Ridley's idea?  didn't he say in the commentary that he wanted a "fourth act"?

The fourth act refers to the lull in action and the false sense of security, which originally wasn't there. The Alien just attacked outright. Then the producers said that Ridley couldn't film the scenes at all. He got his way both times. http://alienseries.blogspot.com/2011/11/fourth-act.html

[stephen]

I thought the ending with the Alien on the Shuttle was Ridley's idea?  didn't he say in the commentary that he wanted a "fourth act"?

The fourth act refers to the lull in action and the false sense of security, which originally wasn't there. The Alien just attacked outright. Then the producers said that Ridley couldn't film the scenes at all. He got his way both times. http://alienseries.blogspot.com/2011/11/fourth-act.html

Ahh fair enough then.

What was said in the commentary certainly implies that it was all Ridley's idea to have the alien on the shuttle in the first place.

Glad Ridley got his way.

PS Does anyone ever stuff up when they're typing (or speaking) and type or say Ripley/Ridley when they meant the other?  I just did it then but caught it in time.

[Valaquen]

What was said in the commentary certainly implies that it was all Ridley's idea to have the alien on the shuttle in the first place.

Glad Ridley got his way.

It was certainly his idea to fight for those elements, but the scenes appear in O'Bannon's script and in the numerous Giler/Hill drafts that are circulating the web.

[Eva]

Except for In the Mouth of Madness, easily his best film from the 90s and one of my personal favorite Carpenter films.

Although I haven't seen it for ages, that's one of the better films from his 'weak era', I would agree with that. 

Come to think of it, the short called Cigarette Burns he made not long ago, also had some interesting ideas. It definately had mood and atmosphere right up until it became a gorefeast in the end. But he didn't write that story if memory serves me. But otherwise, his directing efforts of late is a boredom of B-movie material (in the bad sense) we've seen a 100 times before and often done much better.

@Valaquen - damn, you are very knowledgable. When Alien is re-released on dvd at it's 35th anniversary, you should team up with Ridley and make a brand new commentary track:

Scott:
"..and when we shot this scene, Giger couldn't figure out if the lighting ruined his setup and carefully placed - ...."

Valaquen:
"...ahem no Ridley, that was actually the previous scene in the egg chamber, the third take and if you remember.... "

[SM]

The script was written on the spot, there was no time for intricate explanations. The egg was there, audience assumes the Queen left it, thats it. The problems in details only

Those are some pretty huge details. But the writing on the spot wasn't the problem, as mystery eggs and magic Aliens appear in every iteration of the script, from Gibson-Hill/Giler, from 1987-1991. Four years to come up with a logical scenario.

Nothing compared to why W&Y waited for 57 years to investigate the derelict.

Nothing?  No.  Not even close.

There's also the fact that some major changes were made to Dan O'Bannons original script by Giler and Hill and then studio head Alan Ladd jr - changes that remained in the final film.

What "major changes"?

They added Ash and the subplot of the company wanting the Alien.

[Valaquen]

@Valaquen - damn, you are very knowledgable. When Alien is re-released on dvd at it's 35th anniversary, you should team up with Ridley and make a brand new commentary track:

Scott:
"..and when we shot this scene, Giger couldn't figure out if the lighting ruined his setup and carefully placed - ...."

Valaquen:
"...ahem no Ridley, that was actually the previous scene in the egg chamber, the third take and if you remember.... "

Pick up the phone, Ridley. That's all you need to do 

[stephen]

There's also the fact that some major changes were made to Dan O'Bannons original script by Giler and Hill and then studio head Alan Ladd jr - changes that remained in the final film.

What "major changes"?

They added Ash and the subplot of the company wanting the Alien.

Ash seems like a major change to me.

[Cvalda]

What "major changes"?

They added Ash and the subplot of the company wanting the Alien.

They also made Ripley a woman. And they also rewrote 90% of the dialogue. And they also made it not suck.

[StrangeShape]

There's also the fact that some major changes were made to Dan O'Bannons original script by Giler and Hill and then studio head Alan Ladd jr - changes that remained in the final film.

What "major changes"?

They added Ash and the subplot of the company wanting the Alien.

Ash seems like a major change to me.

I definitely think that the addition of Ash and his subplot warrants a co-writing credit

[SM]

Ash seems like a major change to me.

"Change" singular.

None of the other changes they made were "major".  I wouldn't call the condensing of the Derelict and pyramid into just the Derelict particularly major.  The plot essentially stayed the same from first draft to final film.

[Eva]

What "major changes"?

They added Ash and the subplot of the company wanting the Alien.

Well, this is of course a subjective observation, but to me, those exact changes were major and defining for the film and all the sequels as well, not to mention Prometheus. Some character deaths and all the names were changed. Then there's Ladds ingenious lightbulb moment with making Ripley a female character. Imo it completely changed the film. 

Oh, I better leave it at this, since Valaquen will come down on my ass if I get some obscure detail wrong. 

[SM]

Dan and Ron said the genders of roles were interchangeable on the first draft of Starbeast.  It's not that big a revelation that someone decided to go with it during the films gestation.

[StrangeShape]

Dan and Ron said the genders of roles were interchangeable on the first draft of Starbeast.  It's not that big a revelation that someone decided to go with it during the films gestation.

But the decision to make the main character in a scifi movie a woman was a big step