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Author Topic: Mechanics Needing To Be Changed  (Read 60953 times)


Sifer2
Jan 22, 2010, 10:33:48 AM
Reply #61 on: Jan 22, 2010, 10:33:48 AM
Out of all the stuff the OP listed only one I really agree with is the Alien roaring. Which is completely immersion killing since in my mind Aliens don't sound like that.

Other stuff I can see why they did it the way they did. Like the Mask recording if that had been played in Thermal you couldn't see the Alien. If you complain about this you could also complain about the Aliens vision being similar to Human with a fisheye. When I reality I bet the Alien sees nothing like that since it doesn't even have eyes.

An the claws/caster thing. I don't think context sensitive claws would work since you need to be actively deciding whether to use a light or heavy attack with each swing based on what your opponent is doing or you think they will do. So its a case of not enough buttons again. Also would probably annoy Alien if Pred could both block an fight him in melee an blast him at the same time.

Oh and about the Plasm caster I agree I always thought it blowing people to pieces was a bit silly. Big hole in the chest is cooler.


Drewid
Jan 22, 2010, 11:03:58 AM
Reply #62 on: Jan 22, 2010, 11:03:58 AM
Quote
Agreed, but the final product is only about a month away and these are apparently part of the official campaign, being as they're part of a series (a 'ten minute long' theme). I can't see them using old stuff closer to the release date and, as I say, a lot of it is more advanced than what we had seen.

Don't forget that there is a (rougly) six week turn around on console submissions, (platform holder testing and other checking,) then a week or two for manufacturing.   There's also a lead 'final test' time for PC games. Adding features late-on generates a huge risk of adding bugs, so code generally gets locked down (except for bug fixes) several weeks before release.


Oh, and I agree about the plasma caster as well, I'd have preferred another effect.  Still, as long as they they end up dead...  :)


hardwired
Jan 22, 2010, 11:56:41 AM
Reply #63 on: Jan 22, 2010, 11:56:41 AM
I think i find somethin, that really breakes the game for me.
As it seems you can make stealthkills, whenever you get behind someone (which is nosense, cause you arent hidden, if someone saw you and he turns around, he knows that you are still there!)
So like i saw in videos from the MP, a few times someone faced a enemy in combat and then get stealth killed from another enemy, he allready saw, but then get behind him.
And cause that isnt Ninja Gaiden or some other game like it, you cant fight multiply enemys around you.
So everytime you chose to fight against someone in melee (specially if it takes a bit longer and we know how fast aliens and preds can be), you be in danger to get an instant kill from behind, EVEN you saw the one. Can be a little bit frustrating, hm?
I mean, if you got enough imigination and be able to think rational, you can see where that leads.
I mean...What the hell?!?!?!

« Last Edit: Jan 22, 2010, 11:59:46 AM by hardwired »

AJL
Jan 22, 2010, 12:12:48 PM
Reply #64 on: Jan 22, 2010, 12:12:48 PM
I think i find somethin, that really breakes the game for me.
As it seems you can make stealthkills, whenever you get behind someone (which is nosense, cause you arent hidden, if someone saw you and he turns around, he knows that you are still there!)

Those stealth kills from behind could have been coded so you can only make them
if you have been behind the enemy continuously for more than couple seconds for
example...

So like i saw in videos from the MP, a few times someone faced a enemy in combat and then get stealth killed from another enemy, he allready saw...

Perfectly fine for you to get backstabbed by one enemy while fighting another...


visagepoissons
Jan 22, 2010, 12:25:05 PM
Reply #65 on: Jan 22, 2010, 12:25:05 PM
I think i find somethin, that really breakes the game for me.
As it seems you can make stealthkills, whenever you get behind someone (which is nosense, cause you arent hidden, if someone saw you and he turns around, he knows that you are still there!)
So like i saw in videos from the MP, a few times someone faced a enemy in combat and then get stealth killed from another enemy, he allready saw, but then get behind him.
And cause that isnt Ninja Gaiden or some other game like it, you cant fight multiply enemys around you.
So everytime you chose to fight against someone in melee (specially if it takes a bit longer and we know how fast aliens and preds can be), you be in danger to get an instant kill from behind, EVEN you saw the one. Can be a little bit frustrating, hm?
I mean, if you got enough imigination and be able to think rational, you can see where that leads.
I mean...What the hell?!?!?!
It's just an attack from behind. The reason they do it when indetected is because the enemy has left an opening. If the enemy is facing away there is nothing physically stopping you from doing the exact same thing. It would be VERY unnrealistic if you had to stay behind for a few seconds before you could stealth kill. It's JUST A NAME. It doesn't mean that it is performed through stealth.


hardwired
Jan 22, 2010, 12:32:00 PM
Reply #66 on: Jan 22, 2010, 12:32:00 PM
-Those stealth kills from behind could have been coded so you can only make them
if you have been behind the enemy continuously for more than couple seconds for
example...

No, in one case for example it just were a second, in where you saw the alien get behind a pred and then stealthkilled him.

-Perfectly fine for you to get backstabbed by one enemy while fighting another...

Yeah for sure, really satisfiing, if you get backstaped, everytime you get in a  (longer )meleecombat.
I just want a real chance, to kill an enemy, without being instantly killed by another, who just have to press a button. And that you perform this kills, by beeing so wide away from the victim, is absurd too. Combined its just horrible.





Drewid
Jan 22, 2010, 12:47:50 PM
Reply #67 on: Jan 22, 2010, 12:47:50 PM
So you go for a fast kill instead, rather than a slow stealth kill.  If you're going to grandstand and do trophy kills in the middle of a chaotic melee you get all you deserve.   :D 


hardwired
Jan 22, 2010, 12:54:41 PM
Reply #68 on: Jan 22, 2010, 12:54:41 PM
If it wouldnt be a stealthkill, it would be simply an overpowered attack.
I just mean it shouldnt be impossible to fight against to some preds/aliens, without a chance to win or end with endless quicktime-event-kills, which require no real skill.
Of course you vulnerable if you turn your back at someone, but you still recognize if and where he moves (somethin you normally cant in a FPS) and got other abilitys and factors that differs from reality, so the "realism"-argument is nonsense. No crouching for all species, no aimingvariety for rines and some other things arent realistic too besides.
A game should make fun and I dont want to get forced to being "SO" vulnerable, if i "HAD" to fight in melee.
The system seems good and quite balanced (till now...how good it really is, you just see after weeks of onlineplaying, where all possiblitys become visible and some cheap killabilities, exploits etc.), but the stealthkill really seems too hard and not well thought about (it would explain too, why some players did nothing then backstabbing). I wouldnt wonder, if they didnt recognized that or it was to late to change.

« Last Edit: Jan 22, 2010, 12:57:40 PM by hardwired »

hardwired
Jan 22, 2010, 01:05:11 PM
Reply #69 on: Jan 22, 2010, 01:05:11 PM
So you go for a fast kill instead, rather than a slow stealth kill.  If you're going to grandstand and do trophy kills in the middle of a chaotic melee you get all you deserve.   :D 

Aha...Wonderfull. If a MP-match always ends in a chaotic meleebattle, rebellion simply fails.
Sure, you can expect people to play fair, IF you play with buddies and not any kids and people, who have to win, but if you didnt avert the constantly danger of not planned gameplayabuses and sensless, uncontrolled slaughtering, where you have no chance to avoid the situation with skill, you failed as devolper.


Drewid
Jan 26, 2010, 02:11:50 PM
Reply #70 on: Jan 26, 2010, 02:11:50 PM
That's not what I'm saying,  You'll need to be aware of what's going on around you.  If it's a chaotic melee then do a quick kill, if it isn't then do whatever you want.


The Replacement
Jan 26, 2010, 05:03:13 PM
Reply #71 on: Jan 26, 2010, 05:03:13 PM
So you go for a fast kill instead, rather than a slow stealth kill.  If you're going to grandstand and do trophy kills in the middle of a chaotic melee you get all you deserve.   :D 

Aha...Wonderfull. If a MP-match always ends in a chaotic meleebattle, rebellion simply fails.
Sure, you can expect people to play fair, IF you play with buddies and not any kids and people, who have to win, but if you didnt avert the constantly danger of not planned gameplayabuses and sensless, uncontrolled slaughtering, where you have no chance to avoid the situation with skill, you failed as devolper.
Well, if we take your logic one step further, you could say the the developer has failed by putting the predator into a multi player platform in the first place. After all, they hunt using stealth and cunning, like panthers or all big cats. So the idea of having them in a big multi player bust up isn't true to the genre.

But where would the game be without the predator? Well it'd lose far more than just half its title, thats for sure.

My point is, you can't account for every eventuality in something as random as a multi player platform. At the end of the day, the developer most probably has strived to keep the three species as balanced as possible, whilst retaining the uniqueness of each. We as the players will have to do the best we can with what we are given.


Xenomorphine
Jan 26, 2010, 05:59:51 PM
Reply #72 on: Jan 26, 2010, 05:59:51 PM
Aye obviously. But why? I expected the predator campaign to be quite stealth oriented. But from what I've seen so far it looks like after you get a stealth kill or two, someone sees you and you're only option is to beat them to death or run.

In fairness, that's mostly because the players in that footage seem intent on treating it like a generic shooter thing. If they remained cloaked, used thermal and made a proper effort to stay undetected, instead of just charging forth, then jumped out of the way to prevent counter-attacks, it would probably be better.

The lack of people bothering to use thermal when they're looking for humans is odd. It highlights them specifically so that you can plan ahead of encountering them.


worriors
Jan 26, 2010, 08:09:19 PM
Reply #73 on: Jan 26, 2010, 08:09:19 PM
Just buy the game first before complaining. You'll either love or hate it.



 

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