I found this minutes ago, and it is the best video on youtube I've ever watched. If your a christian beware, you may find this offensive.
I found it's points to be real good, and that's why I liked it.
Atheist powah :D
You should see some of Richard Dawkin's stuff.
I'm religious (I don't class myself as a Christian or Catholic, though, I still believe in God), but I also believe in Evolution, I don't take the whole of the Bible as truth, except for some parts like the Tower of Babel(It actually exsists and it's in the Bible! :o ) Oh yeah, and I'm also friends with Atheists.
Extreme non-believers are just as bad as extreme believers.
Quote from: SM on Jun 11, 2007, 03:33:09 AM
Extreme non-believers are just as bad as extreme believers.
How many murders have been commited specifically for the purposes of advancing non-religion?
Think Stalin and Mao...
By the same token how many people who do follow a religion have never killed anyone?
Anyway, I was thinking more along the lines of respect for the beliefs (or lack thereof) of others.
QuoteAnyway, I was thinking more along the lines of respect for the beliefs (or lack thereof) of others.
Well, this thread name does give away what kind of discussion this is, if religious people don't like it, they don't have to post in here.
Quote from: Wolfy on Jun 10, 2007, 01:05:29 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2HWVkS2g7xo
I found this minutes ago, and it is the best video on youtube I've ever watched. If your a christian beware, you may find this offensive.
I found it's points to be real good, and that's why I liked it.
Atheist powah :D
Propaganda,inaccurate,loutish,inciteful,and very very damaging.There really should be a law against posting this sort of rubbish on the internet,religion is different totally to faith,to quote SM:
"I was thinking more along the lines of respect for the beliefs (or lack thereof) of others."
exactly! respect for others beliefs and lifestyle,even Atheists are now trying to push stuff on others.
Quote from: SM on Jun 11, 2007, 05:48:46 AMAnyway, I was thinking more along the lines of respect for the beliefs (or lack thereof) of others.
Why respect beliefs? There are some pretty horrible beliefs out there. Respect people (if they deserve it), but not their beliefs.
Quote from: frost on Jun 11, 2007, 08:49:59 AM
Propaganda,inaccurate,loutish,inciteful,and very very damaging.There really should be a law against posting this sort of rubbish on the internet,religion is different totally to faith...
A law to ban free speech? Where have I heard that before?
And damaging to who? Religious people? I'd like to hear why exactly.
Also, "inciteful" isn't a word as far as I am aware, unless you meant
insightful. (Which I doubt, considering the rest of the words you chose.)
Quote from: The Ultimate Predator on Jun 11, 2007, 08:17:31 AM
QuoteAnyway, I was thinking more along the lines of respect for the beliefs (or lack thereof) of others.
Well, this thread name does give away what kind of discussion this is, if religious people don't like it, they don't have to post in here.
If you don't like it, don't moan.
Quote from: frost on Jun 11, 2007, 08:49:59 AM
even Atheists are now trying to push stuff on others.
Christianity was pushed on me from a small child due to the enforcement of it being taught in 99% of schools in the UK. As it pretty much says in the video, if we dont't believe we are an antichrist, and "God: Thine hand shall be first upon him to put him to death", which is pushing using fear. Eternal suffering in hell sounds pretty sweet to me too.
My other reason for pushing is:
If your friend believed Barney the dinosaur was in fact a real dinosaur and not a person in a suit, wouldn't you try to explain and convince him that's its not real? That's how I look on religions in a whole as there is no evidence beyond "their holy books and beliefs".
QuoteWhy respect beliefs? There are some pretty horrible beliefs out there.
Irony...
How is that irony?
I agree with him...I cannot respect beliefs that intrinsically do harm unto others. Can't and won't.
Isn't that implied in the word "respect"? Their beliefs aren't respectful of others. Why would I be talking about about those sorts of beliefs. Respect doesn't automatically equate to foolishness.
You believe what you want and I'll believe what I want and as long as we don't impose those beliefs on each other no one loses an eye.
Fundamentalist atheists are just as bad as fundamentalist religious nuts, as far as I'm concerned.
Quote from: SM on Jun 11, 2007, 11:55:25 AMYou believe what you want and I'll believe what I want and as long as we don't impose those beliefs on each other no one loses an eye.
The problem is religion (esp. Islam and Christianity) tries to dominate. Freedom, science and reason is what we should be aiming for.
But their are examples of atheist philosophies being enforced on people as well. SM is right, at either end of the spectrum you are going to find people who wish to suppress the rights of others either by forcing their religion on to someone, or on the other end of the spectrum, denying people the right to believe whatever they wish.
Quote from: Uncanny Antman on Jun 11, 2007, 09:33:13 AM
Quote from: frost on Jun 11, 2007, 08:49:59 AM
Propaganda,inaccurate,loutish,inciteful,and very very damaging.There really should be a law against posting this sort of rubbish on the internet,religion is different totally to faith...
A law to ban free speech? Where have I heard that before?
And damaging to who? Religious people? I'd like to hear why exactly.
Also, "inciteful" isn't a word as far as I am aware, unless you meant insightful. (Which I doubt, considering the rest of the words you chose.)
to incite to be inciteful,to stir up trouble,or provoke ,look up religion there is a difference between religious people and people of faith.
Incite means all that, inciteful is not a word. Someone who incites is an inciter or an instigator.
Since religion is predicated on faith, I do not see a difference. Religious people by the very definition claim to have faith.
Quote from: Fitzley on Jun 11, 2007, 03:38:34 PM
But their are examples of atheist philosophies being enforced on people as well. SM is right, at either end of the spectrum you are going to find people who wish to suppress the rights of others either by forcing their religion on to someone, or on the other end of the spectrum, denying people the right to believe whatever they wish.
I agree. But at least atheism and gnosticism, as said before, is aiming for rationality. Though there are cases of near-death experiences, etc.
Quote from: Fitzley on Jun 11, 2007, 04:56:03 PM
Incite means all that, inciteful is not a word. Someone who incites is an inciter or an instigator.
Since religion is predicated on faith, I do not see a difference. Religious people by the very definition claim to have faith.
it is a word
Jeez man, pick up a dictionary!
QuoteThe problem is religion (esp. Islam and Christianity) tries to dominate.
That's being overly general. I know a few born again Christians - who have something of a reputation for wanting to convert others. None of them have ever tried to push their faith on me. In fact one of them said that religion is something you have to find yourself rather than having it pushed on you.
Quote from: Fitzley on Jun 11, 2007, 08:21:31 PM
Jeez man, pick up a dictionary!
it is a word
Quote from: Fitzley on Jun 11, 2007, 03:38:34 PM
But their are examples of atheist philosophies being enforced on people as well. SM is right, at either end of the spectrum you are going to find people who wish to suppress the rights of others either by forcing their religion on to someone, or on the other end of the spectrum, denying people the right to believe whatever they wish.
I think you will find that is the incorrect use of their or at least the incorrect spelling of there.Jeez as you say pick up a dictionary! :P
Not according to a bunch of dictionaries I just looked up.
Quote from: SM on Jun 11, 2007, 11:10:57 PM
Not according to a bunch of dictionaries I just looked up.
okay,lets start a new grown up thread 'spell the perfect way with the avp galaxy' :D
Go on www.askoxford.com, Inciteful is not a word, now get back on topic
Quote from: Fitzley on Jun 11, 2007, 03:38:34 PM
But their are examples of atheist philosophies being enforced on people as well. SM is right, at either end of the spectrum you are going to find people who wish to suppress the rights of others either by forcing their religion on to someone, or on the other end of the spectrum, denying people the right to believe whatever they wish.
The only way you can force a belief on someone is to instruct them from birth. Because a kid will believe it's parents as a survival tactic. This is what religion does. And if you have a predominantly religious population, when the kid gets older they will have peer pressure to join the crowd.
I don't know what you mean by atheist philosophies, so I'll just call it humanism (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Humanism).
Quote from: SM on Jun 11, 2007, 09:54:45 PM
QuoteThe problem is religion (esp. Islam and Christianity) tries to dominate.
That's being overly general. I know a few born again Christians - who have something of a reputation for wanting to convert others. None of them have ever tried to push their faith on me. In fact one of them said that religion is something you have to find yourself rather than having it pushed on you.
Usually they only target the very young, the dispossessed and the vulnerable.
Since the belief in a deity is often a philosophical question, atheism is the branch that theorizes their is no god. Humanism is something completely different in my mind.
Could you not indoctrinate a child from birth to reject the very notion of god? The same way as you indoctrinate them to believe in god? Many children will accept parental socialization, others reject it.
I rejected the notion of god from an early age despite my parent's best efforts. Santa Clause was better anyway, he brought me stuff.
Quote from: Fitzley on Jun 12, 2007, 02:00:08 AM
Could you not indoctrinate a child from birth to reject the very notion of god? The same way as you indoctrinate them to believe in god? Many children will accept parental socialization, others reject it.
Yes you could but it seems kind of pointless to tell a kid not to believe in God. Religion is not just about that, it's about a whole lot of rituals and stuff. Atheism doesn't have all those rituals so it's not like you can actually indoctrinate a kid into atheism.
QuoteI rejected the notion of god from an early age despite my parent's best efforts. Santa Clause was better anyway, he brought me stuff.
That's because you live in a relatively free society and there are many other atheists out there so you aren't alone.
Quote from: Fitzley on Jun 12, 2007, 02:00:08 AM
I rejected the notion of god from an early age despite my parent's best efforts.
I followed my mother's lead until I was 11 or 12, when the thought finally occured to me that I could decide for myself what I thought of religion. From then on, I've been non-religious. Not an atheist, just non-religious.
QuoteSanta Clause was better anyway, he brought me stuff.
Me too, when I was little. I don't do Christmas or Easter or any of that stuff any more either. I just don't see the point. (And thankfully, my girlfriend agrees, which makes it much easier.)
But I'm not an idiot...I'll still take off work the public holiday when they come around. :)