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Films/TV => Alien Films => Topic started by: Ellen Ripley on Nov 02, 2007, 07:42:37 PM

Title: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Ellen Ripley on Nov 02, 2007, 07:42:37 PM
Can someone explain what the rape scene in alien is? When I was reading about the new reproductive system the PredAlien had, they related it to the rape scene.
Title: Re: ALIEN Rape scene
Post by: Fitzley on Nov 02, 2007, 07:45:36 PM
When the Alien kills Lambert...you have a shot of the tail slowly coming up between her legs. Later when Ripley finds her, you see her leg hanging there with no shoe or pants it appears. It has been said that the sequence is an allusion to rape.
Title: Re: ALIEN Rape scene
Post by: Ellen Ripley on Nov 02, 2007, 07:51:32 PM
Thanks :)
Title: Re: ALIEN Rape scene
Post by: Private Hudson on Nov 03, 2007, 03:51:37 AM
Its acctually quite disturbing to me.
Title: Re: ALIEN Rape scene
Post by: Predator-S on Nov 03, 2007, 01:14:36 PM
Quote from: Fitzley on Nov 02, 2007, 07:45:36 PM
When the Alien kills Lambert...you have a shot of the tail slowly coming up between her legs. Later when Ripley finds her, you see her leg hanging there with no shoe or pants it appears. It has been said that the sequence is an allusion to rape.
Was that in the DC? Becuase I don't remember it in the original.
Title: Re: ALIEN Rape scene
Post by: WisePredator on Nov 03, 2007, 03:01:26 PM
Quote from: Predator-S on Nov 03, 2007, 01:14:36 PM
Quote from: Fitzley on Nov 02, 2007, 07:45:36 PM
When the Alien kills Lambert...you have a shot of the tail slowly coming up between her legs. Later when Ripley finds her, you see her leg hanging there with no shoe or pants it appears. It has been said that the sequence is an allusion to rape.
Was that in the DC? Becuase I don't remember it in the original.
It was in the original.
Title: Re: ALIEN Rape scene
Post by: Russian_Predator on Nov 04, 2007, 06:22:30 AM
Without concept that there happens with Lambert, but Alien her somehow has rigidly killed. I remember that she shouted. And here that at her with legs before murder and after it?

(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg106.imageshack.us%2Fimg106%2F7645%2F1fi7xc6.jpg&hash=bb43e977be09a261bd5a30545e3a14f190236d3c)

(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg212.imageshack.us%2Fimg212%2F3913%2F2ik8at9.jpg&hash=e0abcc64ec1671fdfbeda3e06ec291ee84656dea)
Title: Re: ALIEN Rape scene
Post by: Fiorina 161 on Nov 04, 2007, 01:12:44 PM
Lol I like yor posts Russian-predator... I always have to read them about 3 times before they click... It's kinda fun translating the translation  ;D

But yeah... funny thing... I never paid any attention to that shot. I always thought it was her hand  ??? lol but that is definatley her foot.
Title: Re: ALIEN Rape scene
Post by: ShadowPred on Nov 04, 2007, 02:57:24 PM
It is rape, you can't convince me that it is not.
Title: Re: ALIEN Rape scene
Post by: Russian_Predator on Nov 04, 2007, 03:02:09 PM
I think, it has eaten her clothes. She has been killed during eating clothes.  ::)
Title: Re: ALIEN Rape scene
Post by: Huol on Nov 04, 2007, 03:09:05 PM
Quote from: Fiorina 161 on Nov 04, 2007, 01:12:44 PM
Lol I like yor posts Russian-predator... I always have to read them about 3 times before they click... It's kinda fun translating the translation  ;D

But yeah... funny thing... I never paid any attention to that shot. I always thought it was her hand  ??? lol but that is definatley her foot.
So did i.
I always thought it was her hand. I did think it was rape but i didnt realise it was a foot.
Title: Re: ALIEN Rape scene
Post by: ShadowPred on Nov 04, 2007, 03:10:54 PM
Quote from: Russian_Predator on Nov 04, 2007, 03:02:09 PM
I think, it has eaten her clothes. She has been killed during eating clothes.  ::)




???
Title: Re: ALIEN Rape scene
Post by: Kriszilla on Nov 04, 2007, 03:37:15 PM
Quote from: Russian_Predator on Nov 04, 2007, 03:02:09 PM
I think, it has eaten her clothes. She has been killed during eating clothes.  ::)

Again... What?
Title: Re: ALIEN Rape scene
Post by: Russian_Predator on Nov 04, 2007, 03:43:52 PM
Where I have confused?  ???
Title: Re: ALIEN Rape scene
Post by: Private Hudson on Nov 04, 2007, 04:22:13 PM
I'm confused for some reason.... ???
Title: Re: ALIEN Rape scene
Post by: ShadowPred on Nov 04, 2007, 04:28:46 PM
Ok, anyway, the rape scene is what stands out for me in that film because i woulod never had thought that the alien would do something like that, at the age of 4 your mind wanders after that.
Title: Re: ALIEN Rape scene
Post by: Fiorina 161 on Nov 04, 2007, 07:19:44 PM
Another question then... What did the alien actually rape Lambert with?
Title: Re: ALIEN Rape scene
Post by: ShadowPred on Nov 04, 2007, 07:24:10 PM
Quote from: Fiorina 161 on Nov 04, 2007, 07:19:44 PM
Another question then... What did the alien actually rape Lambert with?


Most likely it's tail as by the fact that it is slowly moving upwards to her vag.
Title: Re: ALIEN Rape scene
Post by: REYALS on Nov 04, 2007, 07:57:31 PM
 Was this scene actually confirmed to be a "rape" scene, or was it just something someone thought it to be? I mean I understand that Geiger is crazy with his art, and all, but to actually call it a "rape" scene doesnt really hold any confirmation for me.
Yes, the tail is between her legs, and she is "hanging" from something after they show her death, but that does not constitute a "rape" scene in my eyes. Maybe the ALIEN picked her up with its tail, and killed her in a manor they didnt show. :-\
Title: Re: ALIEN Rape scene
Post by: severen76 on Nov 04, 2007, 08:05:43 PM
I think ridley scott mentioned it maybe being a rape scene
Title: Re: ALIEN Rape scene
Post by: The Chibi Kiriyama on Nov 04, 2007, 11:03:19 PM
I'm listening to the commentary right now, and he rather vividly said that in his own mind the rape was due to the Alien's ravenous desire to reproduce. So, while we might call it rape, it was intended to show the creature spreading its seed and making the destruction of the Nostromo a must on Ripley's part.
Title: Re: ALIEN Rape scene
Post by: PRAETORIAN MONSTER on Nov 05, 2007, 07:50:30 PM
Quote from: Private Hudson on Nov 03, 2007, 03:51:37 AM
Its acctually quite disturbing to me.

yup and ripley can hear lambert over the loudspeaker with very disturbing sounds, like the alien is doing something horrific to her.
Title: Re: ALIEN Rape scene
Post by: Huol on Nov 05, 2007, 08:04:30 PM
I dont think it was a vaginal rape...
Title: Re: ALIEN Rape scene
Post by: Russian_Predator on Nov 05, 2007, 08:07:28 PM
There was nothing, Alien simply ate her clothes. It became reason of her death.  ::)
Title: weird thing in alien
Post by: Kelten on Nov 14, 2007, 11:13:53 PM
yo when the alien killed lambert... what the hell was it doing with its tail????
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: SM on Nov 14, 2007, 11:23:02 PM
This has been discussed ad nauseum, though for the life of me I can't find an existing thread.

I think part of what it did echoed Brett's original death where the Alien spears its tail into the back.  But that's probably only part of it.  Things like that are best left off screen.  The reality would probably be a lot more mundane than something your imagination could dream up.
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: Private Hudson on Nov 14, 2007, 11:40:51 PM
Aparently, it is supposed to be about to rape Lambert. Distgusting I know.
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: ShadowXeno on Nov 14, 2007, 11:45:38 PM
It was raping Lambert. This is true. As much as it sounds made up, it infact is what it did. You even see her feet hanging, naked at the part Ripley sees their dead bodies. I actually liked the idea of the rape scene. Sick and twisted. I know. ;D
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: Private Hudson on Nov 14, 2007, 11:49:02 PM
Yeah, it shows how brutal the aliens can actually be.
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: SM on Nov 14, 2007, 11:50:20 PM
QuoteAs much as it sounds made up

...and it is.
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: Accaris on Nov 15, 2007, 12:17:21 AM
Quote from: ShadowXeno on Nov 14, 2007, 11:45:38 PM
fact

Where?
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: XenoVC on Nov 15, 2007, 01:29:22 AM
Quote from: Private Hudson on Nov 14, 2007, 11:49:02 PM
Yeah, it shows how brutal the aliens can actually be.
yes i like the idea of aliens and violent brutal hostile creatures but rape doesn't sound so alien  

im cheap

lol
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: Accaris on Nov 15, 2007, 01:38:06 AM
Quote from: Venomcarnage24 on Nov 15, 2007, 01:29:22 AM
Quote from: Private Hudson on Nov 14, 2007, 11:49:02 PM
Yeah, it shows how brutal the aliens can actually be.
yes i like the idea of aliens and violent brutal hostile creatures but rape doesn't sound so alien  :)

What is more alien than being raped by an alien?
The act is so bizarre and perverse that it would only make sense.
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: Private Hudson on Nov 15, 2007, 01:48:05 AM
^ Nothing.
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: Kimarhi on Nov 15, 2007, 02:52:31 AM
Its never been proven either way, and Scott has said the scene is intented to be ambigious.
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: Russian_Predator on Nov 15, 2007, 06:55:52 AM
http://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/index.php?topic=7772.0

Already there is a similar theme. ) Merge in one. )
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: wolfboy on Nov 15, 2007, 07:46:04 AM
I found that entire scene retarded. Lambert just stands there and gets killed.
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: gameoverman on Nov 15, 2007, 07:49:47 AM
Quote from: wolfboy on Nov 15, 2007, 07:46:04 AM
I found that entire scene retarded. Lambert just stands there and gets killed.

It isn't retarded, it's science.  The fight or flight response is known to activate in all animals depending on circumstances.  With Lambert, it was an unfortunate case that it made her petrified with fear, so much so that she was like completely paralysed.  This was also part of her character.
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: The Diesel on Nov 15, 2007, 07:53:26 AM
Quote from: gameoverman on Nov 15, 2007, 07:49:47 AM
Quote from: wolfboy on Nov 15, 2007, 07:46:04 AM
I found that entire scene retarded. Lambert just stands there and gets killed.

It isn't retarded, it's science.  The fight or flight response is known to activate in all animals depending on circumstances.  With Lambert, it was an unfortunate case that it made her petrified with fear, so much so that she was like completely paralysed.  This was also part of her character.
Lambert was a dumbass. 
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: gameoverman on Nov 15, 2007, 07:55:56 AM
Quote from: The Diesel on Nov 15, 2007, 07:53:26 AM
Quote from: gameoverman on Nov 15, 2007, 07:49:47 AM
Quote from: wolfboy on Nov 15, 2007, 07:46:04 AM
I found that entire scene retarded. Lambert just stands there and gets killed.

It isn't retarded, it's science.  The fight or flight response is known to activate in all animals depending on circumstances.  With Lambert, it was an unfortunate case that it made her petrified with fear, so much so that she was like completely paralysed.  This was also part of her character.
Lambert was a dumbass. 

No you are the dumbass.  ::)  Honestly, the alien had blocked her exit anyway - there was no where she was going anywhere.  And she was too scared to fight the alien.
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: The Diesel on Nov 15, 2007, 08:02:11 AM
Quote from: gameoverman on Nov 15, 2007, 07:55:56 AM
Quote from: The Diesel on Nov 15, 2007, 07:53:26 AM
Quote from: gameoverman on Nov 15, 2007, 07:49:47 AM
Quote from: wolfboy on Nov 15, 2007, 07:46:04 AM
I found that entire scene retarded. Lambert just stands there and gets killed.

It isn't retarded, it's science.  The fight or flight response is known to activate in all animals depending on circumstances.  With Lambert, it was an unfortunate case that it made her petrified with fear, so much so that she was like completely paralysed.  This was also part of her character.
Lambert was a dumbass. 

No you are the dumbass.  ::)  Honestly, the alien had blocked her exit anyway - there was no where she was going anywhere.  And she was too scared to fight the alien.
I would have ran like Carl Lewis as soon as I saw the thing..  You stand there, you're a dumbass.  She could have moved and Parker could have toasted it extra-crispy. 
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: gameoverman on Nov 15, 2007, 08:14:12 AM
Quote from: The Diesel on Nov 15, 2007, 08:02:11 AM
Quote from: gameoverman on Nov 15, 2007, 07:55:56 AM
Quote from: The Diesel on Nov 15, 2007, 07:53:26 AM
Quote from: gameoverman on Nov 15, 2007, 07:49:47 AM
Quote from: wolfboy on Nov 15, 2007, 07:46:04 AM
I found that entire scene retarded. Lambert just stands there and gets killed.

It isn't retarded, it's science.  The fight or flight response is known to activate in all animals depending on circumstances.  With Lambert, it was an unfortunate case that it made her petrified with fear, so much so that she was like completely paralysed.  This was also part of her character.
Lambert was a dumbass. 

No you are the dumbass.  ::)  Honestly, the alien had blocked her exit anyway - there was no where she was going anywhere.  And she was too scared to fight the alien.
I would have ran like Carl Lewis as soon as I saw the thing..  You stand there, you're a dumbass.  She could have moved and Parker could have toasted it extra-crispy. 

Well you realise she couldn't move because the alien was standing right in front of her.
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: wolfboy on Nov 15, 2007, 08:40:28 AM
Well maybe she could've fought back even if it meant death.  I mean, who wants to see the alien taking down humans without any effort at all ::)
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: gameoverman on Nov 15, 2007, 09:03:24 AM
Quote from: wolfboy on Nov 15, 2007, 08:40:28 AM
Well maybe she could've fought back even if it meant death.  I mean, who wants to see the alien taking down humans without any effort at all ::)

Didn't you read my above post?  Some people fight, some people get scared.  This is more realistic.  Also, standing completely still can be a good tactic at dealing with dangerous animals.
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: The Chibi Kiriyama on Nov 15, 2007, 09:07:43 AM
After the Alien Alien-man-raped Parker like a small child, I think she was pretty screwed regardless. Even if she would have hurt it, the acid would have killed her or made an irreparable hole in the hull that would've had her die Newborn style. She was pretty much dead and knew it. What I doubt she was aware of was that the Alien was going to screw her over in a much less metaphorical fashion.
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: wolfboy on Nov 15, 2007, 09:55:40 AM
Quote from: gameoverman on Nov 15, 2007, 09:03:24 AM
Quote from: wolfboy on Nov 15, 2007, 08:40:28 AM
Well maybe she could've fought back even if it meant death.  I mean, who wants to see the alien taking down humans without any effort at all ::)

Didn't you read my above post?  Some people fight, some people get scared.  This is more realistic.  Also, standing completely still can be a good tactic at dealing with dangerous animals.

Standing completely still sounds like a terrible tactic when the thing is stalking you and killing your crew.

I don't buy the whole paralyzing crap, that's just a conjecture. And she was left wide open to run away when the alien turned around to kill Parker in a slow rate. That's realistic. But no, what does she do? Stand there like an idiot and get killed while the alien is moving at her in an equally slow rate.

Why don't I just sit here and cry about this everyday.
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: slipknotpredator on Nov 15, 2007, 10:14:46 AM
The Alien rape her, and...that wasnt its tail... :o :o :D
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: MartyPredator on Nov 15, 2007, 11:23:31 AM
Quote from: ShadowXeno on Nov 14, 2007, 11:45:38 PM
It was raping Lambert. This is true. As much as it sounds made up, it infact is what it did. You even see her feet hanging, naked at the part Ripley sees their dead bodies. I actually liked the idea of the rape scene. Sick and twisted. I know. ;D
its just left up to whatever you want it to be
yes its said to be a rape scene
but then that brings up the question do the aliens have memories etc from their hosts
cause in another thread this was brought up
if aliens take more than just their physcial shape from their hosts
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: Dark Passenger on Nov 15, 2007, 01:13:23 PM
Quote from: The Diesel on Nov 15, 2007, 08:02:11 AM
Quote from: gameoverman on Nov 15, 2007, 07:55:56 AM
Quote from: The Diesel on Nov 15, 2007, 07:53:26 AM
Quote from: gameoverman on Nov 15, 2007, 07:49:47 AM
Quote from: wolfboy on Nov 15, 2007, 07:46:04 AM
I found that entire scene retarded. Lambert just stands there and gets killed.

It isn't retarded, it's science.  The fight or flight response is known to activate in all animals depending on circumstances.  With Lambert, it was an unfortunate case that it made her petrified with fear, so much so that she was like completely paralysed.  This was also part of her character.
Lambert was a dumbass. 

No you are the dumbass.  ::)  Honestly, the alien had blocked her exit anyway - there was no where she was going anywhere.  And she was too scared to fight the alien.
I would have ran like Carl Lewis as soon as I saw the thing..  You stand there, you're a dumbass.  She could have moved and Parker could have toasted it extra-crispy. 

Thats east to say, unless your actually in that situation, i bet in th situation you would probably to scared to do anythin, and if ya run you could prokoke it so she didnt no what it could do.
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: Accaris on Nov 15, 2007, 01:21:46 PM
I'm surprised Lambert didn't faint.
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: ShadowXeno on Nov 15, 2007, 02:44:38 PM
Perhaps the Alien was also blocking her way while he was busy killing Parker. Besides. Even if she did run, you saw how quickly it whupped Parker with its tail as he was trying to attack it. Then while the Alien was walking towards her, the Alien was pretty much in the position to atleast grab her if she ran. And like what a few others said, there are times when you're so scared, you can't even run. Did Ridley Scott, H.R. Giger, or any other guy working on the film actually say this was a rape scene? I honestly just heard it from people here.
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: avpmad! on Nov 15, 2007, 08:14:38 PM
just if u wanted to no...

alien is on friday 16th november film 4 sky channel 315 (i think)

starts at 9, if any1 wanted to watch it
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: ShadowPred on Nov 15, 2007, 09:18:19 PM
The alien raped her, believed this since i was 4 i believe it now.
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: Accaris on Nov 15, 2007, 09:21:41 PM
Quote from: ShadowXeno on Nov 15, 2007, 02:44:38 PM
Did Ridley Scott, H.R. Giger, or any other guy working on the film actually say this was a rape scene? I honestly just heard it from people here.

In interviews from any of them (or Veronica Cartwright) that mention the scene, they strongly suggest that it's true. But I don't think they actually said it outright.
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: ShadowPred on Nov 15, 2007, 09:22:43 PM
Veronica said that it seemed like rape to her.
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: wolfboy on Nov 15, 2007, 10:37:06 PM
Before Cameron got his hands on the alien and turned it into an action-packed adventure, I'm sure there were subtle sensual/erotic undertones to the alien as Giger would have intended it, so the whole rape thing isn't entirely out of the question. We're okay with a giant penis-head that is covered in slimy ejaculate terrorizing people, a flying vagina that forces you to deep throat, yet implied alien rape is absolutely an absurd idea.
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: Private Hudson on Nov 15, 2007, 10:39:10 PM
WTF?? A flying vagina?? Where that come from!!?? :-\ :-X :P ???
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: Kimarhi on Nov 16, 2007, 01:24:24 AM
Quote from: wolfboy on Nov 15, 2007, 09:55:40 AM
Quote from: gameoverman on Nov 15, 2007, 09:03:24 AM
Quote from: wolfboy on Nov 15, 2007, 08:40:28 AM
Well maybe she could've fought back even if it meant death.  I mean, who wants to see the alien taking down humans without any effort at all ::)

Didn't you read my above post?  Some people fight, some people get scared.  This is more realistic.  Also, standing completely still can be a good tactic at dealing with dangerous animals.

Standing completely still sounds like a terrible tactic when the thing is stalking you and killing your crew.

I don't buy the whole paralyzing crap, that's just a conjecture. And she was left wide open to run away when the alien turned around to kill Parker in a slow rate. That's realistic. But no, what does she do? Stand there like an idiot and get killed while the alien is moving at her in an equally slow rate.

Why don't I just sit here and cry about this everyday.

Fight or flight isn't conjecture.  Try google.  Or a psychology book.

There is a reason some kids never respond to bullying in school, its because their body is saying if they stand up to the bully, they'll get beaten.  Its the same thing when somebody beats kids or women.  Why don't they just "fight back"?  Its the same thing when a gunman holds a store hostage when there is absolutely no way he should be able too (21 people, seven rounds in the automatic).  Its the same thing when terrorist hijack four airplanes and only one group of passengers fights back.

People don't want to die, and the vast majority of people are pussies.  You can try to slice it anyway you want, but people get scared to the point they don't function rationally.  Lamberts death was justified by her hysterics earlier in the movie and by the nature of humankind itself.
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: The Diesel on Nov 16, 2007, 05:35:03 AM
Quote from: PredatorBruth on Nov 15, 2007, 01:13:23 PM
Quote from: The Diesel on Nov 15, 2007, 08:02:11 AM
Quote from: gameoverman on Nov 15, 2007, 07:55:56 AM
Quote from: The Diesel on Nov 15, 2007, 07:53:26 AM
Quote from: gameoverman on Nov 15, 2007, 07:49:47 AM
Quote from: wolfboy on Nov 15, 2007, 07:46:04 AM
I found that entire scene retarded. Lambert just stands there and gets killed.

It isn't retarded, it's science.  The fight or flight response is known to activate in all animals depending on circumstances.  With Lambert, it was an unfortunate case that it made her petrified with fear, so much so that she was like completely paralysed.  This was also part of her character.
Lambert was a dumbass. 

No you are the dumbass.  ::)  Honestly, the alien had blocked her exit anyway - there was no where she was going anywhere.  And she was too scared to fight the alien.
I would have ran like Carl Lewis as soon as I saw the thing..  You stand there, you're a dumbass.  She could have moved and Parker could have toasted it extra-crispy. 

Thats east to say, unless your actually in that situation, i bet in th situation you would probably to scared to do anythin, and if ya run you could prokoke it so she didnt no what it could do.
First off, I wouldn't have been on that damn ship unless I had a gun.  I would have slept with it.  You never know what the f**k is out there in space.  So I would have shot the hell out of the thing the first chance I got.  I probably would have killed the whole crew in the process but so what.  I don't want an eight-foot douchebag with a tongue that could split my head open having his way with me.  Better to kill it or die trying.

Secondly, I do a lot of jogging.  I jog over two miles everyday and lift a lot of heavy weights.  I have had dogs try to attack me while I was jogging.  I didn't have my gun with me so I had to improvise by stopping to pick up some rocks and bust the mutherf**kers in the head.  That's the kind of person I am.  My fight-or-flight is kill or be killed.  If I was in a confined space with no gun and something approaching I would have had to make a run for it or improvise with something.  Not stand there like a dear caught in headlights.
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: SM on Nov 16, 2007, 05:38:24 AM
Gotta love hindsight.

Why didn't those dumbass space truckers KNOW they were going to be eaten by a 8 foot monster??
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: Uncanny Antman on Nov 16, 2007, 05:42:40 AM
Quote from: Kimarhi on Nov 16, 2007, 01:24:24 AM
Fight or flight isn't conjecture.  Try google.  Or a psychology book.
Except that Lambert neither fought nor flew.  I guess 'frozen in fear' could be shoehorned into the 'flight' part of the definition, but it's a stretch.  It's more like "Fight, flight, or fright."
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: Kimarhi on Nov 16, 2007, 05:46:57 AM
I consider myself a pretty aggressive person.  Sometimes the red vision overrides common sense in my case and gets me in trouble.  That said, I don't presume to know how I would act in a certain situation until it actually occurs.  I lift heavy weights and used to box, I don't find any one person particularly scary, but that said, if somebody pointed a gun at me, would I freak out?

Who knows.  Maybe, maybe not.

My grandfather said that while fighting in france and germany in WWII that you didn't know who was going to be the brave one on the battlefield.  The little mousy f**kup in boot could be the superheroic drag you out from behind enemy lines type guy during combat, and the toughest meanest mofo in boot, could be the biggest sissy when the fighting occurs.  Sometimes it'd even change from battle to battle.  Human nature is such that its only constant is its unpredictability.
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: Kimarhi on Nov 16, 2007, 05:47:36 AM
Quote from: Uncanny Antman on Nov 16, 2007, 05:42:40 AM
Quote from: Kimarhi on Nov 16, 2007, 01:24:24 AM
Fight or flight isn't conjecture.  Try google.  Or a psychology book.
Except that Lambert neither fought nor flew.  I guess 'frozen in fear' could be shoehorned into the 'flight' part of the definition, but it's a stretch.  It's more like "Fight, flight, or fright."

flight covers the fear aspect of a threatening situation.
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: SM on Nov 16, 2007, 05:48:28 AM
QuoteIt's more like "Fight, flight, or fright."

In which ones pants are filled with "shite".
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: Uncanny Antman on Nov 16, 2007, 05:50:38 AM
Quote from: Kimarhi on Nov 16, 2007, 05:47:36 AM
flight covers the fear aspect of a threatening situation.

So 'fight' covers the aggressive, offensive reaction.  And 'flight' covers...absolutely everything else?

I don't pretend to know much about the subject, but how does flight cover the idea of someone being frozen in fear?  Flight within ones own mind? 
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: Kimarhi on Nov 16, 2007, 05:52:06 AM
Flight is basically the minds reaction to withdraw from the conflict.  It can either physically remove you from the scenario, or it can make you pretend your not in the scenario.

I should mention that this all comes from my community college psych teacher.  Its possible that fight or flight covers a broader range of different reactions but he just compacted them together to make it more understandable to his students.

Kind of like autism vs autism spectrum disorders.

Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: The Diesel on Nov 16, 2007, 06:04:28 AM
Quote from: SM on Nov 16, 2007, 05:38:24 AM
Gotta love hindsight.

Why didn't those dumbass space truckers KNOW they were going to be eaten by a 8 foot monster??
I know that if I ever went into space my ass would have some weapons.  Otherwise I'm staying on Earth.  Lol.
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: The Diesel on Nov 16, 2007, 06:06:29 AM
Quote from: SM on Nov 16, 2007, 05:48:28 AM
QuoteIt's more like "Fight, flight, or fright."

In which ones pants are filled with "shite".
Oh man!  (https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi78.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fj118%2FRuss_Diesel%2Frofl.gif&hash=ceef04ef1e5cec648349e7ab1b597a9987ce8d2b)
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: Kimarhi on Nov 16, 2007, 06:08:45 AM
Quote from: The Diesel on Nov 16, 2007, 06:04:28 AM
Quote from: SM on Nov 16, 2007, 05:38:24 AM
Gotta love hindsight.

Why didn't those dumbass space truckers KNOW they were going to be eaten by a 8 foot monster??
I know that if I ever went into space my ass would have some weapons.  Otherwise I'm staying on Earth.  Lol.

They had guns.  Just couldn't use them cause of the acid blood.
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: SM on Nov 16, 2007, 06:13:54 AM
That don't phase The Deisel, team player that he is.
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: The Diesel on Nov 16, 2007, 06:24:54 AM
Quote from: SM on Nov 16, 2007, 06:13:54 AM
That don't phase The Deisel, team player that he is.
Well said.
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: Kimarhi on Nov 16, 2007, 06:25:47 AM
Your probably a shaq fan aren't you diesel.
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: SiL on Nov 16, 2007, 06:28:01 AM
Quote from: SM on Nov 16, 2007, 05:38:24 AM
Gotta love hindsight.

Why didn't those dumbass space truckers KNOW they were going to be eaten by a 8 foot monster??
Yeah, i mean didn't they ever see Alien?
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: The Diesel on Nov 16, 2007, 06:29:18 AM
Quote from: Kimarhi on Nov 16, 2007, 06:25:47 AM
Your probably a shaq fan aren't you diesel.
Nope.  It's just been my nickname for a long time.
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: wolfboy on Nov 16, 2007, 06:30:06 AM
Quote from: Kimarhi on Nov 16, 2007, 01:24:24 AM
Quote from: wolfboy on Nov 15, 2007, 09:55:40 AM
Quote from: gameoverman on Nov 15, 2007, 09:03:24 AM
Quote from: wolfboy on Nov 15, 2007, 08:40:28 AM
Well maybe she could've fought back even if it meant death.  I mean, who wants to see the alien taking down humans without any effort at all ::)

Didn't you read my above post?  Some people fight, some people get scared.  This is more realistic.  Also, standing completely still can be a good tactic at dealing with dangerous animals.

Standing completely still sounds like a terrible tactic when the thing is stalking you and killing your crew.

I don't buy the whole paralyzing crap, that's just a conjecture. And she was left wide open to run away when the alien turned around to kill Parker in a slow rate. That's realistic. But no, what does she do? Stand there like an idiot and get killed while the alien is moving at her in an equally slow rate.

Why don't I just sit here and cry about this everyday.

Fight or flight isn't conjecture.  Try google.  Or a psychology book.

There is a reason some kids never respond to bullying in school, its because their body is saying if they stand up to the bully, they'll get beaten.  Its the same thing when somebody beats kids or women.  Why don't they just "fight back"?  Its the same thing when a gunman holds a store hostage when there is absolutely no way he should be able too (21 people, seven rounds in the automatic).  Its the same thing when terrorist hijack four airplanes and only one group of passengers fights back.

People don't want to die, and the vast majority of people are pussies.  You can try to slice it anyway you want, but people get scared to the point they don't function rationally.  Lamberts death was justified by her hysterics earlier in the movie and by the nature of humankind itself.

I know what fight or flight is. I've taken Psychology 101 too ::) Lambert had a good 15-20 seconds to get out of her initial shock during which time the adrenaline rush would be building sky high. Realistically, she would've been running for her own life at full speed the second she saw Parker was a goner. Maybe she would trip over everything, I don't know, but that to me is more believable then standing there, waiting for the alien to kill Parker, then having the alien reaching up her leg without any kind of pushing away reflex.

People don't do anything when they're held hostage on the off-chance that they may be spared. Also, you're comparing this to kids getting bullied in school when you should be comparing it to a serial killer that's in your house, has you trapped in the corner and you know WILL kill you. I don't believe for a second that if this said serial killer is temporarily distracted for 10 seconds that anyone would just remain standing there in the corner. You said it yourself, people don't want to die.
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: Kimarhi on Nov 16, 2007, 06:44:51 AM
In a fight or flight response your body doesn't just release adrenaline.  It can also release other chems that inhibit your body from functioning properly (see the flight response in fight or flight). 

Again, terrorist on a plane during 9/11, only one group of people fought back after the terrorist revealed the plane was bombed.  The same thing in school shootings happens.  Guy with limited ammo literally holds up hundreds of kids he couldn't possibly all kill, yet nobody makes a move to stop him.  Take the columbine shooters, people in the library were WAITING to be executed by those mofo's, as they went from desk to desk killing people.  They were even reloading while doing this.

And pausing and not running from some animals in the wild will spare you.  Try to run away from a grizzly and he'll decapitate you as you flee.  Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't.

(on the flipside if you pause or play dead with a brown bear, he'll eat you, scavenger).
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: ShadowXeno on Nov 16, 2007, 03:04:25 PM
Well. We saw how quickly the Alien was able to whip Parker down with its tail. Maybe she knew that if she tried running off, the Alien would whup her ass down with the tail. She didn't seem too far from the Alien while it was killing Parker.
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: Private Hudson on Nov 16, 2007, 10:56:10 PM
Agreed.
Title: Waitwaitwait... rape? Really?
Post by: Cutch on Dec 11, 2007, 01:59:50 AM
Lambert was RAPED?
I knew that scene always bothered me as a kid... more of the uncomfortable sexuality of Alien... bravo....
What rape-like elements were left in?
Title: Re: Waitwaitwait... rape? Really?
Post by: That Yellow Alien on Dec 11, 2007, 02:07:59 AM
There's never been a straight up answer to what was going on, it was always intended to be mysterious and disturbing. However, Ridley Scott has mentioned many times that it could be raping her. Plus we see the tail going up between her legs and the agonizing moaning.
Title: Re: Waitwaitwait... rape? Really?
Post by: SM on Dec 11, 2007, 02:11:11 AM
QuoteReally?

Possibly.
Title: Re: Waitwaitwait... rape? Really?
Post by: Thedus on Dec 11, 2007, 02:57:34 AM
Yeah, possibly.

Though I tend to believe that it wasn't rape.  Rape is a human concept - the alien is not human.  Rape, when it comes right down it, is done as a means of exerting power over another (it has nothing to do with sex) - why would the alien need, or want, to do this?

I always assumed the alien was stinging Lambert in the small of her back. And I was struck by something, some years back, when I caught a show on sting rays: that Lambert's breathing (heard over the PA, just before she screams) sounds remarkably like that of a person who's been stung by a sting ray.
Title: Re: Waitwaitwait... rape? Really?
Post by: ShadowPred on Dec 11, 2007, 02:59:24 AM
It was Rape......i believe that it was, believed this the day I saw it, I do now. If I am not mistaken the tail became erect didn't?

I love Giger.
Title: Re: Waitwaitwait... rape? Really?
Post by: That Yellow Alien on Dec 11, 2007, 03:04:14 AM
Rape is unwanted penetration. If the Alien did indeed stick it's tail up her hoochy-coo, than I call that rape.
Title: Re: Waitwaitwait... rape? Really?
Post by: SM on Dec 11, 2007, 03:15:15 AM
QuoteIf I am not mistaken the tail became erect didn't?

You're mistaken.
Title: Re: Waitwaitwait... rape? Really?
Post by: ShadowPred on Dec 11, 2007, 03:16:37 AM
Ok.....but the fact that It was going up to her leg and slwoly still makes it rape to me....especially that she was then naked (from what we saw) after said rape and there was blood.
Title: Re: Waitwaitwait... rape? Really?
Post by: The Chibi Kiriyama on Dec 11, 2007, 05:00:32 AM
The alien was...

Gettin jiggy wit it
Na na na na na na na nana
Na na na na nana
Gettin jiggy wit it...
Title: Re: Waitwaitwait... rape? Really?
Post by: SM on Dec 11, 2007, 05:12:54 AM
QuoteOk.....but the fact that It was going up to her leg and slwoly still makes it rape to me....especially that she was then naked (from what we saw) after said rape and there was blood.

So.  Taking Brett's original death into account where the tail went between his legs and speared him the back - that's rape too?

And the ragged breathing from Lambert can alos be explained away by the same thing - punctured lung.
Title: Re: Waitwaitwait... rape? Really?
Post by: ShadowPred on Dec 11, 2007, 05:23:28 AM
Damn it's been a long ass time since I saw that movie, i'll need to go see it again then and see if I can count Brett's death as rape.
Title: Re: Waitwaitwait... rape? Really?
Post by: maledoro on Dec 11, 2007, 11:52:21 AM
How many of these "Lambert was raped?" threads are we up to?

(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fv338%2Fmaledoro%2FElves%2Fhuh.gif&hash=c20aec5aa2668fd83791457bc7939ee942ec3605)
Title: Re: Waitwaitwait... rape? Really?
Post by: Huol on Dec 11, 2007, 01:04:38 PM
Quote from: SM on Dec 11, 2007, 05:12:54 AM
QuoteOk.....but the fact that It was going up to her leg and slwoly still makes it rape to me....especially that she was then naked (from what we saw) after said rape and there was blood.

So.  Taking Brett's original death into account where the tail went between his legs and speared him the back - that's rape too?

Brett doesn't have anything to do with it.
Sure it's his legs but it's cut so it's supposed to be Lambert.

It's Lambert, we didn't get a random flash back, it's Lambert. Okidoky?

Scott has hinted many times that it could have been rape, Cartwright thinks it was rape too.
Title: Re: Waitwaitwait... rape? Really?
Post by: ShadowXeno on Dec 11, 2007, 02:48:29 PM
Well we don't know. Some say it is rape(Like what I want to believe) others don't. The designer of the Alien was H.R. Giger(MOST KICKASS ARTIST EVER) and his artwork usually always has some sort of sexuality to it. Besides. A facehugger pregnating somebody with an embryo can also be considered rape.
Title: Re: Waitwaitwait... rape? Really?
Post by: mostlycome@nite on Dec 11, 2007, 03:17:46 PM
wow did'nt ever think of it as rape....you twisted monkeys
Title: Re: Waitwaitwait... rape? Really?
Post by: Private Hudson on Dec 11, 2007, 04:01:35 PM
Its rape!! If Ridley and Giger say it is rape, it is rape!!!!
Title: Re: Waitwaitwait... rape? Really?
Post by: mostlycome@nite on Dec 11, 2007, 04:29:33 PM
dude has a point....it is "there" "Kid"
Title: Re: Waitwaitwait... rape? Really?
Post by: Purebreedalien on Dec 11, 2007, 05:29:04 PM
Now I really need to watch the film again.
Title: Re: Waitwaitwait... rape? Really?
Post by: Private Hudson on Dec 11, 2007, 11:03:40 PM
Quote from: purebreedalien on Dec 11, 2007, 05:29:04 PM
Now I really need to watch the film again.


Lol.
Title: Re: Waitwaitwait... rape? Really?
Post by: SM on Dec 12, 2007, 12:19:23 AM
QuoteBrett doesn't have anything to do with it.
Sure it's his legs but it's cut so it's supposed to be Lambert.

It's Lambert, we didn't get a random flash back, it's Lambert. Okidoky?

Scott has hinted many times that it could have been rape, Cartwright thinks it was rape too.

Try again when you've read AND understood my post.
Title: Re: Waitwaitwait... rape? Really?
Post by: §niperhawk on Dec 12, 2007, 03:59:52 AM
i always found the rape idea slightly funny, but not in a bad way. just kinda odd
Title: Re: Waitwaitwait... rape? Really?
Post by: PredClanLeadrr85 on Dec 13, 2007, 06:52:24 PM
it seems like the ALien in the first movie was just a horny perverted dude, and the aliens after that werent soo much ;)
Title: Re: Waitwaitwait... rape? Really?
Post by: Resurrection on Dec 13, 2007, 06:56:59 PM
Quote from: PredClanLeadrr85 on Dec 13, 2007, 06:52:24 PM
it seems like the ALien in the first movie was just a horny perverted dude, and the aliens after that werent soo much ;)

They had a beautiful queen around.  They did not need to prey on humans :P  Just kidding, of course.
Title: Re: Waitwaitwait... rape? Really?
Post by: Tarog on Dec 14, 2007, 01:37:44 AM
Even Veronica Cartwright says it was rape, In the BTS of Alien 2 Disc Edition , and Ridley and Giger, No denying it, if all they sya it was rape, then it was rape, plus when Ripley gos back to find them Lamberts got no pants on
Title: Re: Waitwaitwait... rape? Really?
Post by: SM on Dec 14, 2007, 02:28:02 AM
Of course!  It all makes sense now!!!


::)
Title: Re: Waitwaitwait... rape? Really?
Post by: Munkeywrench on Dec 14, 2007, 04:47:20 AM
Quote from: Yellow Alien on Dec 11, 2007, 03:04:14 AM
Rape is unwanted penetration. If the Alien did indeed stick it's tail up her hoochy-coo, than I call that rape.

Hoochy-Coo? lol thats the first time I ever heard it referred to as that

As for it being rape I dont know maybe it was maybe not I thought it was disturbing whatever it did to her
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: chubbs3 on Dec 24, 2007, 03:26:05 AM
Rape is a human cocept and the alien was just trying to survive like any other animal would. So how is raping a human helping it to survive?
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: Dark Passenger on Dec 24, 2007, 03:28:38 AM
Quote from: chubbs3 on Dec 24, 2007, 03:26:05 AM
Rape is a human cocept and the alien was just trying to survive like any other animal would. So how is raping a human helping it to survive?

He was just exploring her body learning and penetrating, haha :D
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: WhySoSerious on Dec 24, 2007, 03:30:18 AM
What you don't see is more powerful than what you see on screen. The Imagination is a powerful thing when you use it.
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: ChasuFett on Dec 24, 2007, 03:45:27 AM
I'd like to see a screenshot of this scene from Alien y'all are talking about. I never noticed such a thing. Much appreciated.
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: Dark Passenger on Dec 24, 2007, 03:48:47 AM
^ there isnt an actual shot of this, but you see the aliens tale go between her legs(erected) and then you hear her screaming.....
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: WhySoSerious on Dec 24, 2007, 04:16:59 AM
Hence the rest is left up to your imagination...the fear of the unknown.
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: Purebreedalien on Dec 24, 2007, 09:39:39 AM
I watched Alien again on December 17th and I noticed that as the tail goes 'up there' Lambert sort of whimpers and makes 'sex noises'.
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: Dark Passenger on Dec 24, 2007, 12:11:04 PM
Quote from: purebreedalien on Dec 24, 2007, 09:39:39 AM
I watched Alien again on December 17th and I noticed that as the tail goes 'up there' Lambert sort of whimpers and makes 'sex noises'.

Yep, kinda obvious what happens.....its funny when you watch it and dont think it as rape you dont see anything but when ya looking for the proof, it sticks out like a sore thumb....
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: ChasuFett on Dec 24, 2007, 12:43:17 PM
Quote from: Optimus Prime on Dec 24, 2007, 03:48:47 AM
^ there isnt an actual shot of this, but you see the aliens tale go between her legs(erected) and then you hear her screaming.....

Well, that's what I want to see a screenshot of.
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: SM on Dec 26, 2007, 08:40:07 AM
Quoteand makes 'sex noises'.

I pity the women you've been having sex with...
Title: Alien, Lambert's death.
Post by: TheMonolith on Jun 18, 2009, 05:08:33 AM
I always wondered something about the first Alien film.

Did anyone else notice where the Alien was putting its tail when it was with Lambert?
??? :-\ :-X :o
Title: Re: Alien, Lambert's death.
Post by: SM on Jun 18, 2009, 05:09:38 AM
No, no one has ever even considered that.  Ever.










;)
Title: Re: Alien, Lambert's death.
Post by: Xhan on Jun 18, 2009, 05:13:58 AM
wahfair theen.
Title: Re: Alien, Lambert's death.
Post by: ShadowPred on Jun 18, 2009, 01:17:21 PM
I noticed that the first time i saw it back in 1994 and even at that young age I knew where it was going.
Title: Re: Alien, Lambert's death.
Post by: EEV2650 on Jun 18, 2009, 01:18:40 PM
I've always kind of wondered how far he went with that tail of his.
Title: Re: Alien, Lambert's death.
Post by: ShadowPred on Jun 18, 2009, 01:21:12 PM
Well I saw no pants, socks or shoes on Lambert when Ripley got there, and thwre was blood...so yeah.
Title: Re: Alien, Lambert's death.
Post by: EEV2650 on Jun 18, 2009, 01:24:03 PM
All i remember seeing was her arm hanging there.
Title: Re: Alien, Lambert's death.
Post by: FearPeteySodes on Jun 18, 2009, 02:33:24 PM
Quote from: EEV2650 on Jun 18, 2009, 01:24:03 PM
All i remember seeing was her arm hanging there.

Too bad it didn't have a cig otherwise it would have been case closed...
Title: Re: Alien, Lambert's death.
Post by: Vulhala on Jun 18, 2009, 02:53:24 PM
Quote from: Peteysodes on Jun 18, 2009, 02:33:24 PM
Quote from: EEV2650 on Jun 18, 2009, 01:24:03 PM
All i remember seeing was her arm hanging there.

Too bad it didn't have a cig otherwise it would have been case closed...

That was classy  8)
Title: Re: Alien, Lambert's death.
Post by: ShadowPred on Jun 18, 2009, 03:02:50 PM
Quote from: EEV2650 on Jun 18, 2009, 01:24:03 PM
All i remember seeing was her arm hanging there.

It was her feet.
Title: Re: Alien, Lambert's death.
Post by: Johnny Handsome on Jun 18, 2009, 04:42:05 PM
The original idea of that scene was that Lambert got raped by the alien. The Alien then infested her with it's semen which would cause more aliens to come.

Ripley knew that soon the whole ship would be invested with the Alien and therefore caused the self destruct of the Nostromo.
Title: Re: Alien, Lambert's death.
Post by: EEV2650 on Jun 18, 2009, 04:44:02 PM
do you mean infested
Title: Re: Alien, Lambert's death.
Post by: Johnny Handsome on Jun 18, 2009, 04:45:57 PM
Quote from: EEV2650 on Jun 18, 2009, 04:44:02 PM
do you mean infested
Exactly.
Title: Re: Alien, Lambert's death.
Post by: xxxPREDBUGxxx on Jun 18, 2009, 05:04:44 PM
Yes I Did..................Giggity!! lolz
Title: Re: Alien, Lambert's death.
Post by: pjdoodle on Jun 18, 2009, 05:06:54 PM
She was lucky it wasnt an avp alien that did it. :-X
Title: Re: Alien, Lambert's death.
Post by: TheMonolith on Jun 18, 2009, 06:39:53 PM
I have a theory.
Drones are sterile so sexual pleasure would not be achieved through the act.
Keep in mind the previous three victims, Kane, Brett and Dallas were male.
Xenomorphs seem to sense primarily by pheromone detection.
Due to the differences between male and female hormones, Lambert, being the first female the alien encountered, would have seemed unusual.
The alien, IMO, was using its tail to try and find the source of the pheromones Lambert was giving off. Poor Lambert would have interpreted this differently.
Oh well. At least the damn birds didn't get her.
Title: Re: Alien, Lambert's death.
Post by: Simbobs12345 on Jun 19, 2009, 12:16:25 AM
Quote from: nostalgiaaddict88 on Jun 18, 2009, 06:39:53 PM
I have a theory.
Drones are sterile so sexual pleasure would not be achieved through the act.
Keep in mind the previous three victims, Kane, Brett and Dallas were male.
Xenomorphs seem to sense primarily by pheromone detection.
Due to the differences between male and female hormones, Lambert, being the first female the alien encountered, would have seemed unusual.
The alien, IMO, was using its tail to try and find the source of the pheromones Lambert was giving off. Poor Lambert would have interpreted this differently.
Oh well. At least the damn birds didn't get her.

:D :D
Title: Re: Alien, Lambert's death.
Post by: xeno_alpha_07 on Jun 19, 2009, 12:42:26 AM
Quote from: nostalgiaaddict88 on Jun 18, 2009, 06:39:53 PM
I have a theory.
Drones are sterile so sexual pleasure would not be achieved through the act.
Keep in mind the previous three victims, Kane, Brett and Dallas were male.
Xenomorphs seem to sense primarily by pheromone detection.
Due to the differences between male and female hormones, Lambert, being the first female the alien encountered, would have seemed unusual.
The alien, IMO, was using its tail to try and find the source of the pheromones Lambert was giving off. Poor Lambert would have interpreted this differently.
Oh well. At least the damn birds didn't get her.

Griker? that you?

:D :D :D
Title: Re: Alien, Lambert's death.
Post by: SiL on Jun 19, 2009, 12:50:05 AM
Quote from: Johnny Handsome on Jun 18, 2009, 04:42:05 PM
The original idea of that scene was that Lambert got raped by the alien. The Alien then infested her with it's semen which would cause more aliens to come.
I'm not sure if you're being serious, but;

Well, not really. I remember someone saying that Ridley mentioned it in the commentary - I listened to both, and he never really said that at all. It was always meant to be completely ambiguous.

Not to mention the tail going between the legs was shot for Brett's death, not Lambert's.

From script to screen, it was always meant to be a mystery.
Title: Re: Alien, Lambert's death.
Post by: JamesCameronOnline on Jun 19, 2009, 12:57:37 AM
btw, its a leg hanging, not hand.

(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi13.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fa277%2Flovegunner%2FAVP%2Fleg.jpg&hash=fb2e1b5413bd4087fc0c91d7854e06475377d1d9)

when the shot goes up you see both legs naked hanging there in a way pointing that lambert was lying face down. And SiL is right. Scott never said what happened to Lambert. Both he and Cartwright said something along the lines of "and the alien did who knows what to her"

Title: Re: Alien, Lambert's death.
Post by: Kevin164 on Jun 19, 2009, 04:49:35 PM
I always thought that the dangling foot was one of Parker's legs that had been torn off. I was looking at the pic and it appears that pretty much to his thigh had been ripped off.
Title: Re: Alien, Lambert's death.
Post by: Johnny Handsome on Jun 19, 2009, 04:55:07 PM
Quote from: SiL on Jun 19, 2009, 12:50:05 AM
Quote from: Johnny Handsome on Jun 18, 2009, 04:42:05 PM
The original idea of that scene was that Lambert got raped by the alien. The Alien then infested her with it's semen which would cause more aliens to come.
I'm not sure if you're being serious, but;

Well, not really. I remember someone saying that Ridley mentioned it in the commentary - I listened to both, and he never really said that at all. It was always meant to be completely ambiguous.

Not to mention the tail going between the legs was shot for Brett's death, not Lambert's.

From script to screen, it was always meant to be a mystery.
I heard it from the commentary too, i have to listen to it again but I'm pretty sure he (Ridley) said that, i never read that before in any forum, what i wrote was solely from memory.
Title: Re: Alien, Lambert's death.
Post by: Kevin164 on Jun 19, 2009, 05:06:24 PM
If you listen to the actors commentary the Actress who plays Lambert was pretty pissed off. She was to film having a heart attack while crawling into a locker. She confirms that what you're seeing is Brett's death with the Alien using its tail to push Brett closer so it could crush his head ( That footage is also included in the Quadrilogy specials.). Lambert throughout the movie has cowboy boots on.
Title: Re: Alien, Lambert's death.
Post by: Johnny Handsome on Jun 19, 2009, 05:13:38 PM
Quote from: Kevin164 on Jun 19, 2009, 05:06:24 PM
If you listen to the actors commentary the Actress who plays Lambert was pretty pissed off. She was to film having a heart attack while crawling into a locker. She confirms that what you're seeing is Brett's death with the Alien using its tail to push Brett closer so it could crush his head ( That footage is also included in the Quadrilogy specials.). Lambert throughout the movie has cowboy boots on.
In know that they were Brett's legs in the scene and that the scene was later cut to Lambert's death.

But there is a reason why he cut it and put it in the Lambert scene.
Title: Re: Alien, Lambert's death.
Post by: JamesCameronOnline on Jun 19, 2009, 05:45:05 PM
Quote from: Kevin164 on Jun 19, 2009, 04:49:35 PM
I always thought that the dangling foot was one of Parker's legs that had been torn off. I was looking at the pic and it appears that pretty much to his thigh had been ripped off.

nah, when the camera goes up you see parker lying on the floor in the background and the second leg of lambert sticking out. Both her legs are faced down, so shes lying on her belly, or whatever's left of it
Title: Re: Alien, Lambert's death.
Post by: Maxyboy on Jun 19, 2009, 07:20:47 PM
Quote from: Johnny Handsome on Jun 18, 2009, 04:42:05 PM
The original idea of that scene was that Lambert got raped by the alien. The Alien then infested her with it's semen which would cause more aliens to come.

Ripley knew that soon the whole ship would be invested with the Alien and therefore caused the self destruct of the Nostromo.
i assume that was Gigers idea, that sick, demented, creative, awesome bastard.
Title: Re: Alien, Lambert's death.
Post by: TJ Doc on Jun 19, 2009, 07:45:06 PM
What happens in the coolant storage room, stays in the coolant storage room.
Title: Re: Alien, Lambert's death.
Post by: Maxyboy on Jun 19, 2009, 07:50:41 PM
I can just see what Lamberts and The Alien's bastard child looks like. An Alien. That screams. A lot.
Title: Re: Alien, Lambert's death.
Post by: Darwinsgirl on Jun 20, 2009, 08:29:30 AM
Quote from: Kevin164 on Jun 19, 2009, 04:49:35 PM
I always thought that the dangling foot was one of Parker's legs that had been torn off.

I had thought this myself. But it looked too odd seeing a leg dangling & the slumped form of Parker in the back ground. Tonight..(while waiting for the water to recede) I watched the extra features of Alien from the Legacy box set. In the Art & Photo section. Under the Alien heading there is a pic of Lambert's dangling nude legs up to the "thigh" with blood running down them. Parker is in the back ground slumped over. So yes it looks like her death was more horrific then I had assumed.

Veronica Cartwright did an article for Starlog magazine years ago titled "I was raped by an Alien". I read this a few months back. She was pretty vague in her statements about what actually happened to Lambert. (if memory serves me ;)) In fact it made me think the title was chosen for its shock/buy n see appeal.

The Legacy box set  "Alien" extra features has so many pics & extras on it that I'd never seen. If I watched them when I first bought it...I'd forgotten them. Thanks again Sil for pointing the way to this! :)

Title: Re: Alien, Lambert's death.
Post by: SiL on Jun 20, 2009, 08:56:05 AM
No worries! Did you watch the extended crab crawl bit as well?
Title: Re: Alien, Lambert's death.
Post by: Darwinsgirl on Jun 20, 2009, 12:50:18 PM
Quote from: SiL on Jun 20, 2009, 08:56:05 AM
No worries! Did you watch the extended crab crawl bit as well?

Yes I did. I wasn't that creeped/spooked by the actual crab walking part. But when it rose up from the sitting/squat position to full standing facing Lambert. That was very fluid...graceful & deadly. For someone as tall n slender as Bolaji he didn't come across as awkward or gangly.

I watched all the deleted scene's. All except for the air lock scene are on the work print I have.

Some of the other pics I enjoyed were a practice shot of Ripley/Sig firing a flame thrower with at  least a 10 foot stream of flame. John Hurt reading a paperback while lying on the examining table face hugger in place! :D 

Lots of fun stuff. ;D
Title: Re: Alien, Lambert's death.
Post by: xeno_alpha_07 on Jun 20, 2009, 12:53:47 PM
Quote from: Darwinsgirl on Jun 20, 2009, 12:50:18 PM
Quote from: SiL on Jun 20, 2009, 08:56:05 AM
No worries! Did you watch the extended crab crawl bit as well?

Yes I did. I wasn't that creeped/spooked by the actual crab walking part. But when it rose up from the sitting/squat position to full standing facing Lambert. That was very fluid...graceful & deadly. For someone as tall n slender as Bolaji he didn't come across as awkward or gangly.

I watched all the deleted scene's. All except for the air lock scene are on the work print I have.

Some of the other pics I enjoyed were a practice shot of Ripley/Sig firing a flame thrower with at  least a 10 foot stream of flame. John Hurt reading a paperback while lying on the examining table face hugger in place! :D 

Lots of fun stuff. ;D

Ive not gone through my alien Legacy Special Features in a long time.  In fact ive not watched the Alien Legacy Documentary disc that comes with it in a while either, not doing anything at the moment so I'm off to watch!
Title: Re: Alien, Lambert's death.
Post by: mjacobson on Jun 21, 2009, 06:41:51 AM
Quote from: Darwinsgirl on Jun 20, 2009, 08:29:30 AM

Veronica Cartwright did an article for Starlog magazine years ago titled "I was raped by an Alien". I read this a few months back. She was pretty vague in her statements about what actually happened to Lambert. (if memory serves me ;)) In fact it made me think the title was chosen for its shock/buy n see appeal.

I remembered this too. But, I guess the answer wasn't there.
Title: Re: Alien, Lambert's death.
Post by: EEV2650 on Jun 21, 2009, 12:58:41 PM
Quote from: SiL on Jun 20, 2009, 08:56:05 AM
No worries! Did you watch the extended crab crawl bit as well?

Is there footage where you see the alien crawling toward her? I've only seen the picture from the shoot. Do you have a link for that shot?
Title: Re: Alien, Lambert's death.
Post by: TheMonolith on Jun 21, 2009, 04:05:26 PM
Quote from: EEV2650 on Jun 21, 2009, 12:58:41 PM
Quote from: SiL on Jun 20, 2009, 08:56:05 AM
No worries! Did you watch the extended crab crawl bit as well?

Is there footage where you see the alien crawling toward her? I've only seen the picture from the shoot. Do you have a link for that shot?

It is on the Quadrilogy box set.
Title: Re: Alien, Lambert's death.
Post by: EEV2650 on Jun 21, 2009, 04:32:11 PM
Is it now. Where might i ask. I've never seen it.
Title: Re: Alien, Lambert's death.
Post by: TheMonolith on Jun 21, 2009, 04:55:08 PM
The clip, if my memory serves me correctly, was on the 9th disc in the either the production or post production galleries for ALIEN.

If you can't find it, here is a link to the clip. Sorry about the poor quality.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f0QwLTLH1bg (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f0QwLTLH1bg)
Title: Re: Alien, Lambert's death.
Post by: EEV2650 on Jun 21, 2009, 06:34:00 PM
Yeah, i've never seen this before. thanks nostalgiaaddict88
Title: Re: Alien, Lambert's death.
Post by: SiL on Jun 21, 2009, 11:16:18 PM
The version from the virtual workprint was on YouTube, but the guy removed it. Much better quality, about twice as long.
Title: Re: Alien, Lambert's death.
Post by: Maxyboy on Jun 22, 2009, 04:30:40 AM
Quote from: nostalgiaaddict88 on Jun 21, 2009, 04:55:08 PM
The clip, if my memory serves me correctly, was on the 9th disc in the either the production or post production galleries for ALIEN.

If you can't find it, here is a link to the clip. Sorry about the poor quality.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f0QwLTLH1bg (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f0QwLTLH1bg)
Scott removed that scene because he felt it made the Alien more human.
Title: Re: Alien, Lambert's death.
Post by: The G-man on Jun 22, 2009, 08:17:57 AM
Yeah I'm glad they removed that scene, imo, the Alien looked kinda like Lambert's pet for a second...
Title: Re: Alien, Lambert's death.
Post by: Alien³ on Jun 22, 2009, 01:02:21 PM
Looks really stupid. I'm rather glad it was taken out.
Title: Re: Alien, Lambert's death.
Post by: Übermensch on Jun 22, 2009, 01:39:46 PM
I do like the shot of it just crouching there.  But it is better in the final movie, where you just see a shadown and something moving in the foreground.  Makes it much more suspenseful.
Title: Re: Alien, Lambert's death.
Post by: TJ Doc on Jun 22, 2009, 02:25:53 PM
Wow. That really shows off its height.
Title: Re: Alien, Lambert's death.
Post by: Maxyboy on Jun 23, 2009, 09:57:33 PM
Personally, I'm glad she's dead. She was basically just Hudson without a gun.
Title: Re: Alien, Lambert's death.
Post by: FearPeteySodes on Jun 23, 2009, 09:59:32 PM
Quote from: Maxyboy on Jun 23, 2009, 09:57:33 PM
Personally, I'm glad she's dead. She was basically just Hudson without a gun.

Oh cmon Hudson at least ran his mouth, Lambert just screamed and bitched.  :P
Title: Re: Alien, Lambert's death.
Post by: Maxyboy on Jun 23, 2009, 10:05:36 PM
Quote from: Peteysodes on Jun 23, 2009, 09:59:32 PM
Quote from: Maxyboy on Jun 23, 2009, 09:57:33 PM
Personally, I'm glad she's dead. She was basically just Hudson without a gun.

Oh cmon Hudson at least ran his mouth, Lambert just screamed and bitched.  :P
She was there to reflect the thoughts and feelings of the audience, I think that was the purpose of Hudson too(besides supplying sci-fi shooters with 98% of all the lines.
Title: Re: Alien, Lambert's death.
Post by: SM on Jun 23, 2009, 11:12:34 PM
Hudson was little more than comic relief.
Title: Re: Alien, Lambert's death.
Post by: Maxyboy on Jun 24, 2009, 12:59:56 PM
Quote from: SM on Jun 23, 2009, 11:12:34 PM
Hudson was little more than comic relief.
I only laughed when he pulled the "you should put her in charge" bit.
Besides, how is it relieving to have some asshole following you around constantly reminding you about how f**ked you are?
Title: Re: Alien, Lambert's death.
Post by: SM on Jun 24, 2009, 11:24:00 PM
Comic relief doesn't relate to the other characters.  It's for the audience.
Title: Re: Alien, Lambert's death.
Post by: Maxyboy on Jun 25, 2009, 04:24:09 AM
Quote from: SM on Jun 24, 2009, 11:24:00 PM
Comic relief doesn't relate to the other characters.  It's for the audience.
I know, but when you are watching the film, you still dont laugh, because you are concerned for your favorite characters well being, and it is not relieving to hear some asshole bitch all the time.
Title: Re: Alien, Lambert's death.
Post by: SM on Jun 25, 2009, 04:56:05 AM
Hudsons wisecrackage gets laughs.  It always has got laughs.  Why do you think it's quoted so much?
Title: Re: Alien, Lambert's death.
Post by: Maxyboy on Jun 25, 2009, 06:05:34 AM
For me, It really started to get funny after the third or fourth time watching the movie, I didn't laugh at all when I first saw it, it really starts to get funny and quotable after the first time for me.
Title: Re: Alien, Lambert's death.
Post by: SM on Jun 25, 2009, 06:13:15 AM
I remember chuckles aplenty when I first saw it in the cinema.  Stuff like "Game over man, game over!" has become almost iconic.
Title: Re: Alien, Lambert's death.
Post by: Maxyboy on Jun 25, 2009, 06:42:01 AM
Christ, I KNOW it has, okay?
>:(

Sigh.

Iconic lines dont have to be funny you know?
Title: Re: Alien, Lambert's death.
Post by: SM on Jun 25, 2009, 07:04:30 AM
Temper, temper.

IN this instance they were intended to be funny, and generally achieved the desired effect.
Title: Re: Alien, Lambert's death.
Post by: Alien³ on Jun 28, 2009, 12:15:12 PM
Hudson rules. End.
Title: Re: Alien, Lambert's death.
Post by: TheMonolith on Jun 29, 2009, 08:23:50 PM
Dang. A lot of you are hard on Lambert.
You know Veronica Cartwright won a Saturn Award for the role?
She has also been in a lot of my favorite films. Invasion of the Body Snatchers (1978), The Birds and the ever amazing The Right Stuff are good examples.
She has also appeared on the X Files, Law and Order, and was even in an episode of the original The Twilight Zone.
I personally kind of liked Lambert.
One look at her cast photo and you can see why.  ;)
Title: Lambert's Death
Post by: Wolf Sazen on Apr 10, 2010, 04:24:07 AM
I've been thinking about how Lambert was killed recently since playing AvP.  The special kill where the alien jams its tail somewhere below out of the screen, then the tail extends fully through the victims mouth impaling them vertically in a way i guess.  Wut do u all think?
Title: Re: Lambert's Death
Post by: XenoVC on Apr 10, 2010, 04:33:11 AM
That's a cool looking kill for a videogame.

Alien had none of these ideas in mind 30 years ago.
Title: Re: Lambert's Death
Post by: MadassAlex on Apr 10, 2010, 06:09:48 AM
Actually, that very well could be the intent.

I'm absolutely sure that kill animation in AvP2010 is a reference to Lambert's death.
Title: Re: Lambert's Death
Post by: SiL on Apr 10, 2010, 06:11:41 AM
I'll stick with the implied rape.
Title: Re: Lambert's Death
Post by: maledoro on Apr 10, 2010, 11:14:11 AM
Quote from: Wolf Sazen on Apr 10, 2010, 04:24:07 AM
Wut do u all think?
I think that you should have used an existing thread that covers this topic instead of you making yet another one.
Title: Re: Lambert's Death
Post by: Wolf Sazen on Apr 11, 2010, 03:26:29 AM
Quote from: maledoro on Apr 10, 2010, 11:14:11 AM
Quote from: Wolf Sazen on Apr 10, 2010, 04:24:07 AM
Wut do u all think?
I think that you should have used an existing thread that covers this topic instead of you making yet another one.
Yeah, but how old would that thread be, plus who has the patience to search that long. 
Title: Re: Lambert's Death
Post by: SiL on Apr 11, 2010, 04:15:23 AM
Using the Search function I found these threads in like two seconds.

And the last posts in them aren't even that old.

http://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/index.php?topic=25239.msg526714#msg526714
http://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/index.php?topic=24128.msg497752#msg497752
Title: Re: Lambert's Death
Post by: StarBeast79 on Apr 13, 2010, 10:10:49 PM
I can see what you're saying since it relates to the new game and not necessarily the topic wondering wether or not she was dead.  Yeah, I get the feeling some of the comics went with that idea and Rebellion were in turn inspired by the expanded universe.  I like the idea of the tail up the ass, crotch, vagina, or lower back and out the mouth as show in the game because it goes with the implied rape of sorts that Scott touches on in his dvd commentary.
Title: Re: Lambert's Death
Post by: maledoro on Apr 13, 2010, 10:24:33 PM
Another opportunity to use a previous thread shot to hell...
::)
Title: Re: Lambert's Death
Post by: x2SMONEY on Apr 14, 2010, 11:40:36 PM
Up the ass,out the mouth.Hell of a ride. ;D
Title: Re: Lambert's Death
Post by: ShadowPred on Apr 14, 2010, 11:41:24 PM
Quote from: SiL on Apr 10, 2010, 06:11:41 AM
I'll stick with the implied rape.

Same here.
Title: Re: Lambert's Death
Post by: coolshow on Apr 22, 2010, 09:15:16 AM
Maybe this will answer your question



Title: Re: Lambert's Death
Post by: Sabres21768 on Apr 22, 2010, 04:02:29 PM
Quote from: coolshow on Apr 22, 2010, 09:15:16 AM
Maybe this will answer your question



LOVE that scene.
Title: Re: Lambert's Death
Post by: Salt The Fries on Apr 22, 2010, 04:24:20 PM
By the way, I have been pondering for ages, why exactly is there a blood in Parker's mouth when Alien grabs him ???
Title: Re: Lambert's Death
Post by: MadassAlex on Apr 22, 2010, 04:25:44 PM
It's squeezing his head. A lot.
Title: Re: Lambert's Death
Post by: Salt The Fries on Apr 22, 2010, 04:40:07 PM
I've never seen that clearly, how is Alien holding Parker in that scene, and I have been always confused about this. Watching it for the majority of life on VHS, and on Quadrilogy only once or twice didn't help, either.
Title: Re: Lambert's Death
Post by: Sabres21768 on Apr 22, 2010, 06:09:05 PM
Before it grabs Parker, it knocks him back HARD with it's tail.
This is more than likely the source of the blood.

Here's a pic of it holding Parker.

(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi49.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Ff291%2Fsabres21768%2FAlienReference%2FALIEN%2Fprodpic06.jpg&hash=4fb801acc14836703cdc825eef410fd40eaf38e0)
Title: Re: Lambert's Death
Post by: SiL on Apr 22, 2010, 10:26:09 PM
The Alien hands in the close-up of Parker's headbite were apparently played by Jon Sorenson, one of the model dudes.

THE MOAR U KNOW.
Title: Re: Lambert's Death
Post by: StarBeast79 on Apr 25, 2010, 12:50:31 AM
Quote from: SiL on Apr 22, 2010, 10:26:09 PM
The Alien hands in the close-up of Parker's headbite were apparently played by Jon Sorenson, one of the model dudes.

THE MOAR U KNOW.

Where did you pick up that piece of obscure trivia?
Title: Re: Lambert's Death
Post by: SiL on Apr 25, 2010, 12:52:21 AM
The horse's mouth, so to speak, over at Alien Experience. In the Forums.
Title: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: predxeno on May 26, 2010, 02:12:40 PM
Lambert makes some really weird noises when Ripley is running to her and Parker.  Yeah, we could say that that was the sound of her being disemboweled or whatever.  However, I'm pretty sure I read or heard somewhere from one of the producers of something that there was a possibility of Lambert being raped.  Everyone knows that Giger made the Alien on sexual concepts, since this film was created before Aliens and AVP, it was still fresh with many new ideas and directions so this may have been an idea that the director, writers, or producers were coming up with.  Also, I noted that we can see Lambert's bare feet when Ripley arrived at the coolant place.  I'm pretty sure Lambert had shoes and pants on.  Why would she be barefoot unless the Alien took them off to get a little action.  What does everybody else think of this?
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Omegamorph on May 26, 2010, 02:52:04 PM
The Alien shoved its tail up from some hole to the mouth.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: ShadowPred on May 26, 2010, 03:03:35 PM
I have called Rape, Veronica Cartwright has said that she believes that it was rape. The whole movie was practically about sex and sexual frustration (that's just me). I called rape 16 years ago, that's as close as I can get to calling it. Of course she died and all, but the first thing in my mind was rape.


Most times I've ever typed the word "rape" before.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: cmc on May 26, 2010, 03:22:02 PM
You "called rape"?
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: ShadowPred on May 26, 2010, 03:24:36 PM
(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fcolbertnation.mtvnimages.com%2Fimages%2Fshows%2Fcolbert_report%2Fvideo_archive%2Fseason_2%2Fcr_02028_03_col_v6.jpg&hash=97668b124946809443437634d83b7e5395ef21d6)
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Xenoscream on May 26, 2010, 03:37:22 PM
I used to think she was just killed, but then again I used to think it was her arm that you saw.

After reading the other topics about this (one of them has the pic of the foot) I started to wonder.

The noises she made are really strange, and there is no reason that her cloths would be taken off except...
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: ShadowPred on May 26, 2010, 03:46:33 PM
Quote from: Xenoscream on May 26, 2010, 03:37:22 PM
I used to think she was just killed, but then again I used to think it was her arm that you saw.

After reading the other topics about this (one of them has the pic of the foot) I started to wonder.

The noises she made are really strange, and there is no reason that her cloths would be taken off except...


(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi124.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fp30%2FShadowPred%2Fgates-lambertred-white2.jpg&hash=3656e76fff8d03c265fb079f08804a237770973b)

Thanks to Gates for having that sig many moons ago.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Omegamorph on May 26, 2010, 04:38:21 PM
Also look at the weird position of the alluce...
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: predxeno on May 26, 2010, 05:30:59 PM
What's an alluce?
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: xxxBIOHAZARDxxx on May 26, 2010, 06:30:40 PM
I never thought of it that way. I'm watching alien again today. MAN that makes the movie a shitload more disturbing to me... :o
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Spaghetti on May 26, 2010, 07:21:49 PM
Quote from: ShadowPred on May 26, 2010, 03:46:33 PM
(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi124.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fp30%2FShadowPred%2Fgates-lambertred-white2.jpg&hash=3656e76fff8d03c265fb079f08804a237770973b)

Thanks to Gates for having that sig many moons ago.

Ah, Gates. I miss him and his long pauses.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: AvPvTerminator on May 26, 2010, 07:36:03 PM
Quote from: OmegaZilla on May 26, 2010, 02:52:04 PM
The Alien shoved its tail up from some hole to the mouth.
Gruesome!
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SiL on May 26, 2010, 09:48:35 PM
Quote from: OmegaZilla on May 26, 2010, 02:52:04 PM
The Alien shoved its tail up from some hole to the mouth.
Not according to anything on-screen it didn't.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: maledoro on May 26, 2010, 10:24:13 PM
How many of these "Lambert raped?" threads are there, now?
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SM on May 26, 2010, 11:29:05 PM
180,924,609
Title: Re: Lambert's Death
Post by: StrangeShape on May 27, 2010, 11:42:48 PM
The idea of a rape sounds generally interesting but I wouldnt like it at all in the movie. It doesnt make any sense. Her death lasted only 5 seconds so I doubt theres any room for rape. Besides, with what (no penis) and for what? The creature is asexual and would have no point in doing anything sexual since its not how it reproducts. 5 seconds off scream and shes dead. In those 5 seconds he grabbed her and killed her. So the sex thing could only happen in about 2 seconds

The explanation I take is what we see on screen which is the tail closing in. Since it was originally Brett's death, I take what happened with the tail next as a canon explanation

(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi13.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fa277%2Flovegunner%2FAVP%2Fbrett.jpg&hash=1b98388bd58869fd5af455af5b420ae8fe320845)

What's certain is that he killed her fast. Because it sounded like she was choking Im guessing he ripped her open or something similar to this effect.
Title: Re: Lambert's Death
Post by: SM on May 27, 2010, 11:46:50 PM
Pretty sure her death a little longer than 5 seconds.

And I'd hardly call it "fast" based on the noises she was making.
Title: Re: Lambert's Death
Post by: StrangeShape on May 27, 2010, 11:51:15 PM
It was a couple of seconds, when Ill get a minute Ill check it out
Title: Re: Lambert's Death
Post by: SM on May 27, 2010, 11:53:45 PM
I think it's closer to 15.

Which, compared to simply getting your bonce bit like Brett, is an eternity.
Title: Re: Lambert's Death
Post by: StrangeShape on May 28, 2010, 12:14:16 AM
Just checked. 9 seconds from the second "no" to the last scream

Again, for me impaling with the tale is much more plausible and logical
Title: Re: Lambert's Death
Post by: PredalienXenomorph on May 28, 2010, 05:07:38 AM
It would also explain what the shot of the tail was for.
Title: Re: Lambert's Death
Post by: SM on May 28, 2010, 05:09:39 AM
QuoteAgain, for me impaling with the tale is much more plausible and logical

Oh I don't think she was raped.  At least not in the traditional sense.
Title: Re: Lambert's Death
Post by: Wolf Sazen on May 28, 2010, 08:50:01 PM
Quote from: Sabres21768 on Apr 22, 2010, 06:09:05 PM
Before it grabs Parker, it knocks him back HARD with it's tail.
This is more than likely the source of the blood.

Here's a pic of it holding Parker.

(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi49.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Ff291%2Fsabres21768%2FAlienReference%2FALIEN%2Fprodpic06.jpg&hash=4fb801acc14836703cdc825eef410fd40eaf38e0)
That's an awesome still shot bro.  Poor Parker, so much charm, so much courage.  He went out like a G
Title: Re: Lambert's Death
Post by: The PredBen on May 29, 2010, 05:09:30 AM
Didn't the Predator kill Lambert in the subway? ;D
Title: Re: Lambert's Death
Post by: maledoro on May 29, 2010, 09:43:25 PM
Quote from: The PredBen on May 29, 2010, 05:09:30 AM
Didn't the Predator kill Lambert in the subway? ;D
Isn't the Predator an alien, just as an Alien is a predator?
Title: Re: Lambert's Death
Post by: Private Hudson on May 29, 2010, 11:37:21 PM
Quote from: StrangeShape on May 27, 2010, 11:42:48 PM
The idea of a rape sounds generally interesting but I wouldnt like it at all in the movie. It doesnt make any sense. Her death lasted only 5 seconds so I doubt theres any room for rape. Besides, with what (no penis) and for what? The creature is asexual and would have no point in doing anything sexual since its not how it reproducts. 5 seconds off scream and shes dead. In those 5 seconds he grabbed her and killed her. So the sex thing could only happen in about 2 seconds

The explanation I take is what we see on screen which is the tail closing in. Since it was originally Brett's death, I take what happened with the tail next as a canon explanation

(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi13.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fa277%2Flovegunner%2FAVP%2Fbrett.jpg&hash=1b98388bd58869fd5af455af5b420ae8fe320845)

What's certain is that he killed her fast. Because it sounded like she was choking Im guessing he ripped her open or something similar to this effect.

That doesn't explain why she has no shoes or pants after the alien is done with her.
Title: Re: Lambert's Death
Post by: StrangeShape on May 30, 2010, 01:30:58 AM
Yes I know. I still prefer the tail kill over the illogical and pointless rape that just couldnt happen. The way I explain it to myself is that she was so violently ripped apart that some of her clothes got ripped. Parker got his shirt ripped apart during his fight with Ash so I take it as a similar situation
Title: Re: Lambert's Death
Post by: SiL on May 30, 2010, 01:35:33 AM
Whatever the Alien did it wasn't as simple as stabbing her and headbiting her. It did something absolutely horrible that we will never know.

Parker's shirt got recked, sure, but his shoes and socks didn't come off.
Title: Re: Lambert's Death
Post by: StrangeShape on May 30, 2010, 01:42:21 AM
Quote from: SiL on May 30, 2010, 01:35:33 AM
Whatever the Alien did it wasn't as simple as stabbing her and headbiting her. It did something absolutely horrible that we will never know.

Parker's shirt got recked, sure, but his shoes and socks didn't come off.

I agree with you. Im thinking about the impaling because quite frankly nothing else comes to mind. But perhaps there shouldnt be a forced explanation and it should be left as a mystery. One of the biggest appeals of ALIEN for me are the mysteries. Who are the space jockeys, what happened to their ship, where did the aliens came from etc etc
Title: Re: Lambert's Death
Post by: Wolf Sazen on May 30, 2010, 11:39:34 AM
Quote from: StrangeShape on May 30, 2010, 01:42:21 AM
Quote from: SiL on May 30, 2010, 01:35:33 AM
Whatever the Alien did it wasn't as simple as stabbing her and headbiting her. It did something absolutely horrible that we will never know.

Parker's shirt got recked, sure, but his shoes and socks didn't come off.

I agree with you. Im thinking about the impaling because quite frankly nothing else comes to mind. But perhaps there shouldnt be a forced explanation and it should be left as a mystery. One of the biggest appeals of ALIEN for me are the mysteries. Who are the space jockeys, what happened to their ship, where did the aliens came from etc etc
Still, with a small cast, and it being horror/sci-fi, i would have liked to see her death be a little less vague. 
Title: Re: Lambert's Death
Post by: St_Eddie on Jun 07, 2010, 01:08:55 PM
I really don't understand why a lot of people seem to think that the implication of the alien 'raping' Lambert would involve the actions of a human rape.  This, of course, would not make much sense.  Whereas I always thought that the alien used the tip of its tail to not only rip her clothes apart but also to actually 'rape' her (this would be when you hear Lambert panting) and then at the moment of the alien's metaphorical orgasm; it sends it's entire tail upwards at a great speed, essentially gutting her (and this is when you hear that final, ear-piercing scream).

As for those who can't fathom why the alien would be inclined to behave this way; why on Earth (or LV-246, if you like) do you assume that the alien would not inherit some of its human host's psychology (as well as physicality). I imagine that the alien itself does not necessarily understand the sexual desires it feels when faced with its first female victim, much like a teenager discovering masturbation for the first time.

As for comments that the alien would not have enough time to perform this rape; why does a rape have to last longer then 10 seconds or so?! This is an alien creature, it is not pure human and therefore our pre-conceived notions of rape on Earth do not dictate how an alien would approach such a terrible act (especially when it lacks the standard necessary 'equipment' for such a task).

In my mind the whole scene is a horrific depiction of the bastardisation of human lust, coupled with an asexual species  :o

These are all my own personal interpretations of course but some people in this thread seem to have never even considered such themes... food for thought  :)
Title: Re: Lambert's Death
Post by: Omegamorph on Jun 07, 2010, 02:08:45 PM
Maybe the Alien got Lambert down, and she, in an attempt to survive kicked desperately, but the Alien managed to pull her pants off and... do whatever it did. ???
Title: Re: Lambert's Death
Post by: PredalienXenomorph on Jun 08, 2010, 06:26:31 AM
Quote from: St_Eddie on Jun 07, 2010, 01:08:55 PM
I really don't understand why a lot of people seem to think that the implication of the alien 'raping' Lambert would involve the actions of a human rape.  This, of course, would not make much sense.  Whereas I always thought that the alien used the tip of its tail to not only rip her clothes apart but also to actually 'rape' her (this would be when you hear Lambert panting) and then at the moment of the alien's metaphorical orgasm; it sends it's entire tail upwards at a great speed, essentially gutting her (and this is when you hear that final, ear-piercing scream).
This disturbes me and makes some sense.(sorry for cutting the post but the PS3 has a word limit.
Title: Re: Lambert's Death
Post by: StrangeShape on Jun 08, 2010, 07:22:04 AM
Quote from: St_Eddie on Jun 07, 2010, 01:08:55 PM
I really don't understand why a lot of people seem to think that the implication of the alien 'raping' Lambert would involve the actions of a human rape.  This, of course, would not make much sense.  Whereas I always thought that the alien used the tip of its tail to not only rip her clothes apart but also to actually 'rape' her (this would be when you hear Lambert panting) and then at the moment of the alien's metaphorical orgasm; it sends it's entire tail upwards at a great speed, essentially gutting her (and this is when you hear that final, ear-piercing scream).

The problem is it used its tail to kill, its his weapon. Its also designed and sharp like a weapon. In adition to that I doubt he has any sexual sensation on the tail. That would not be very clever since it is its weapon and having some delicate sexual organs there wouldnt be a good idea.

QuoteAs for those who can't fathom why the alien would be inclined to behave this way; why on Earth (or LV-246, if you like) do you assume that the alien would not inherit some of its human host's psychology (as well as physicality). I imagine that the alien itself does not necessarily understand the sexual desires it feels when faced with its first female victim, much like a teenager discovering masturbation for the first time
.

Because sexual desires come from the urge to merge. Our biology dictates that so we will want to reproduce. Alien does not reproduce in such way and is asexual.
Besides, we already had a similar discussion lately about alien not inheriting its hosts intellect

QuoteAs for comments that the alien would not have enough time to perform this rape; why does a rape have to last longer then 10 seconds or so?!

Thats really stretching the concept. Its only 9 seconds untill Lambert dies and thats involving her first "no" so when the alien didnt even get to her yet. It sounds too much like forcing the idea of a rape when theres so many things going against it
Title: Re: Lambert's Death
Post by: xxxBIOHAZARDxxx on Jun 09, 2010, 09:16:21 PM
It was RAPE, RAPE, I TELL YOU!!!!
Title: Re: Lambert's Death
Post by: TheMonolith on Jun 19, 2010, 12:13:05 AM
I mentioned this on an old topic about a year ago. It is generally understood that the alien hunts by smell and pheromone detection right?
Keep in mind, all the previous victims were male, and Lambert was the first female it came across.
She would have been giving off different scents then the previous victims, so the alien would have been, while still in predatory mode, a bit curious. I felt that it was using its tale to try and pinpoint the source of the pheromones Lambert was giving off, and the rout it took was, unfortunately for Lambert, the easiest way to seek it out.
(Now I must reprise my previous joke)
Oh well. At least the damn birds didn't get her.  :P
Title: Re: Lambert's Death
Post by: SiL on Jun 19, 2010, 01:07:17 AM
Quote from: TheMonolith on Jun 19, 2010, 12:13:05 AM
It is generally understood that the alien hunts by smell and pheromone detection right?
Well, no.

A³ shows they can see the visible light spectrum - That's as much as we know. It's obvious they have other methods of sensing their prey, but we don't know exactly what they are.

That being said, I always thought maybe her being female had something to do with it, in keeping with O'Bannon's comments that the original Alien wasn't just violent, it was ignorant (Kind'a backed up by the slow, almost curious way it reached out for Brett in the extended death, not seen in either released version).
Title: Re: Lambert's Death
Post by: Aeus on Jun 19, 2010, 02:00:20 AM
Quote from: SiL on Jun 19, 2010, 01:07:17 AM
A³ shows they can see the visible light spectrum - That's as much as we know. It's obvious they have other methods of sensing their prey, but we don't know exactly what they are.

Says you. I like to believe the Alien just bumps into the people it kills.
Title: Re: Lambert's Death
Post by: TheMonolith on Jun 19, 2010, 02:03:57 AM
Now we know THAT is not true.
Title: Re: Lambert's Death
Post by: SiL on Jun 19, 2010, 02:05:42 AM
Quote from: Aeus on Jun 19, 2010, 02:00:20 AM
Says you. I like to believe the Alien just bumps into the people it kills.
"Where am I where am -- oh God what's that kill it kill it okay it's dead where the hell am I goin -- ohshit not again kill kill!"
Title: Re: Lambert's Death
Post by: Aeus on Jun 19, 2010, 02:08:53 AM
Quote from: SiL on Jun 19, 2010, 02:05:42 AM
Quote from: Aeus on Jun 19, 2010, 02:00:20 AM
Says you. I like to believe the Alien just bumps into the people it kills.
"Where am I where am -- oh God what's that kill it kill it okay it's dead where the hell am I goin -- ohshit not again kill kill!"

It would be so true, if it wasn't for Dallas's encounter.

(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi532.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fee322%2FVisklol%2Fsurprisemotherf%2A%2Aker.jpg&hash=e6dc0d9156359dafcdb8b9eaceb5696877b02756)

I bet it was so excited, sitting there in the dark, just waiting to spring out at him. Then it went straight back to confused when he died of fright.
Title: Re: Lambert's Death
Post by: TheMonolith on Jun 19, 2010, 02:11:51 AM
Lets see, except for finding Brett without touching him, the grabbing of the first marine in the hive, the attack of Ferro in the dropship, the ENTIRE medlab battle, the battle with the Queen.......
Title: Re: Lambert's Death
Post by: SiL on Jun 19, 2010, 02:16:17 AM
I think it is maybe okay to accept that we are, as they say, 'taking the piss'.
Title: Re: Lambert's Death
Post by: Aeus on Jun 19, 2010, 02:16:56 AM
I for one fully appreciate the Alien is super death penis machine from space, which you absolutely 100% cannot hide from. Unless you're Jonesy and you can just stare the f**ker down because of your coconut sized balls.
Title: Re: Lambert's Death
Post by: DiabloGuapo on Jun 20, 2010, 01:13:07 PM
I was always interested in Lambert's death scene. I don't think we'll ever really know how the Alien killed her, but I think that's the point. I love the mystery of the film. It's about these normal people who end up in an alien situation in an alien environment with an alien creature. The less we know about it, the more frightening it is.
Title: Re: Lambert's Death
Post by: StrangeShape on Jun 21, 2010, 07:20:49 PM
Quote from: DiabloGuapo on Jun 20, 2010, 01:13:07 PM
I was always interested in Lambert's death scene. I don't think we'll ever really know how the Alien killed her, but I think that's the point. I love the mystery of the film. It's about these normal people who end up in an alien situation in an alien environment with an alien creature. The less we know about it, the more frightening it is.

Absolutely agree. The mysteries of alien are one of its best aspects for me. We never see a live space jockey. We never see some sophisticated jockey technology working. We see an old, fossilized skeleton and a long nonfunctional wreck. We have no clue what happened. Or who the creatures were. or what the aliens were for matter too. This is why I absolutely hate the idea of a prequel and the idea of demystifying ALIEN's mysteries
Title: Re: Lambert's Death
Post by: TheMonolith on Jun 22, 2010, 05:00:34 PM
Mystery is what makes a lot of films work, A-la 2001.

I do not mean to butt back in, but what do you guys think of my theory on page 3? I never got a chance to discuss it and was looking forward to input and/or debate.
Title: Re: Lambert's Death
Post by: SM on Jun 22, 2010, 11:01:47 PM
I tend to agree with SiL that the pheromone detection thing is only theory rather than 'generally understood'.

Though there may well be something in the Alien's apparently different treatment of Lambert because she was female.
Title: The lambert/Alien Rape.
Post by: samoht on Jun 27, 2010, 10:53:00 AM
On other sites I have been on, people have been saying that the Alien attempted to rape lambert. I, myself, partly agree on this.

I just saw the movie and when it slowly approached her and slid its tail up her leg, I got the expression that the alien had sexual intentions. And when Ripley finds her body later, her pants are completely removed and blood is running down her legs.


I have read somewhere that the writer, O' bannon (or whatever his name is) commented once that the alien had some of Kane's memories and "needs", so perhaps it was trying to have sex with Lambert, it just didn't quite know how to go about it. In the film, the rape was implied but not a 'fact' IMO.

The alien is also supposed to have sexual overtones. Just like Gigers artwork, so I'm sure you can see the possability.

Well, anyway I just want to generate some discussion on this.
Title: Re: The lambert/Alien Rape.
Post by: Omegamorph on Jun 27, 2010, 11:29:09 AM
The Alien would have, literally, no freakin' reason to rape Lambert. Aliens do not prove sexual desire nor any other human needs, and neither can reproduce by "raping" seeing they already raped someone with their birth.
Title: Re: The lambert/Alien Rape.
Post by: samoht on Jun 27, 2010, 11:44:42 AM
Good to hear someone elses opinion.
Title: Re: The lambert/Alien Rape.
Post by: Mus on Jun 27, 2010, 12:45:55 PM
That idea has intrigued me, the whole inherited personality thing. In a way that would make the Alien a reborn host to some extent. The theoretical rape could then be seen as an innuendo to Kane's secret desires, which would maybe add a dramatic twist to the character or something. And then it would explain why the Runner is such a rampant lil beast. It's a dog.
Title: Re: The lambert/Alien Rape.
Post by: Stalker on Jun 27, 2010, 12:56:46 PM
All of Giger's artwork is completely shadowed with sexuality, however disturbed it may be. I don't think the alien actually 'raped' Lambert, but rather just took a sadistic pleasure in watching her squirm. In the original film the creature seemed to be more curious than anything, almost trying to study & inspect its prey before actually attacking. Not to mention enjoying its victims recoil in terror.
Title: Re: The lambert/Alien Rape.
Post by: maledoro on Jun 27, 2010, 01:07:21 PM
Quote from: samoht on Jun 27, 2010, 10:53:00 AM
On other sites I have been on, people have been saying that the Alien attempted to rape lambert.
And, like other sites, this forum has a Search function to find other threads concerning this topic.
Title: Re: The lambert/Alien Rape.
Post by: Bad Replicant on Jun 27, 2010, 05:50:50 PM
http://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/index.php?topic=31365.0
Title: Re: The lambert/Alien Rape.
Post by: Private Hudson on Jun 27, 2010, 08:24:05 PM
I've lost count how many topics on this there are....
Title: Re: The lambert/Alien Rape.
Post by: samoht on Jun 28, 2010, 12:14:25 AM
LOL even on this thread http://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/index.php?topic=31365.0, your fretting to people about not making new threads on old topics, Maledoro.
Title: Re: The lambert/Alien Rape.
Post by: maledoro on Jun 28, 2010, 01:17:56 AM
Quote from: samoht on Jun 28, 2010, 12:14:25 AM
LOL even on this thread http://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/index.php?topic=31365.0, your fretting to people about not making new threads on old topics, Maledoro.
Your sense of diction exceeds your sense of perception.
;D

It's considered proper netiquette to post in an existing thread rather than to create a new one.
Title: Re: The lambert/Alien Rape.
Post by: ShadowPred on Jun 28, 2010, 04:07:30 AM
It was "rape", no reason for her clothes to also have been moved. Always believed that, and even when I first saw it, despite not knowing what sex was, I kinda "knew" what it was.
Title: Re: The lambert/Alien Rape.
Post by: Spaghetti on Jun 28, 2010, 04:29:10 AM
Quote from: Mus on Jun 27, 2010, 12:45:55 PM
That idea has intrigued me, the whole inherited personality thing. In a way that would make the Alien a reborn host to some extent. The theoretical rape could then be seen as an innuendo to Kane's secret desires, which would maybe add a dramatic twist to the character or something. And then it would explain why the Runner is such a rampant lil beast. It's a dog.

Always liked this idea. Un-socialized/un-hived aliens taking on aspects of their host's personality is something I wouldn't mind exploring.
Title: What did that alien do to Lambert with it's tail?
Post by: Inverse Effect on Jul 03, 2010, 02:26:54 PM
Ive never understood it. Can someone enlighten me. And those noises she made durring her death, uhmm sounds like she is getting loved by the alien.
Title: Re: The lambert/Alien Rape.
Post by: Inverse Effect on Jul 03, 2010, 02:44:28 PM
Quote from: samoht on Jun 27, 2010, 10:53:00 AM
On other sites I have been on, people have been saying that the Alien attempted to rape lambert. I, myself, partly agree on this.

I just saw the movie and when it slowly approached her and slid its tail up her leg, I got the expression that the alien had sexual intentions. And when Ripley finds her body later, her pants are completely removed and blood is running down her legs.


I have read somewhere that the writer, O' bannon (or whatever his name is) commented once that the alien had some of Kane's memories and "needs", so perhaps it was trying to have sex with Lambert, it just didn't quite know how to go about it. In the film, the rape was implied but not a 'fact' IMO.

The alien is also supposed to have sexual overtones. Just like Gigers artwork, so I'm sure you can see the possability.

Well, anyway I just want to generate some discussion on this.

where is her body found?
Title: Re: Lambert's Death
Post by: Inverse Effect on Jul 03, 2010, 02:53:06 PM
Quote from: Private Hudson on May 29, 2010, 11:37:21 PM
Quote from: StrangeShape on May 27, 2010, 11:42:48 PM
The idea of a rape sounds generally interesting but I wouldnt like it at all in the movie. It doesnt make any sense. Her death lasted only 5 seconds so I doubt theres any room for rape. Besides, with what (no penis) and for what? The creature is asexual and would have no point in doing anything sexual since its not how it reproducts. 5 seconds off scream and shes dead. In those 5 seconds he grabbed her and killed her. So the sex thing could only happen in about 2 seconds

The explanation I take is what we see on screen which is the tail closing in. Since it was originally Brett's death, I take what happened with the tail next as a canon explanation

(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi13.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fa277%2Flovegunner%2FAVP%2Fbrett.jpg&hash=1b98388bd58869fd5af455af5b420ae8fe320845)

What's certain is that he killed her fast. Because it sounded like she was choking Im guessing he ripped her open or something similar to this effect.

That doesn't explain why she has no shoes or pants after the alien is done with her.

Again where is that scene?
Title: Re: What did that alien do to Lambert with it's tail?
Post by: cmc on Jul 03, 2010, 07:46:03 PM
you didnt even look for a second at the thread names in this section did you?
Title: Re: What did that alien do to Lambert with it's tail?
Post by: Friendly Wise on Jul 03, 2010, 08:26:02 PM
Quote from: QueenofDeath on Jul 03, 2010, 02:26:54 PM
Ive never understood it. Can someone enlighten me. And those noises she made durring her death, uhmm sounds like she is getting loved by the alien.

The scene where you see the Alien putting its tail between Lambert's legs is in fact a scene inserted from Brett's death. Idk what exactly it did to her, but I guess you have to use your imagination for that. As for the noise, I guess it's just more for effect, and enhancing the moment than anything else.
Title: Re: What did that alien do to Lambert with it's tail?
Post by: Omegamorph on Jul 03, 2010, 08:44:36 PM
In a comic adaptation we see that Brett is punctured in the back; the alien technically could have done so with Lambert.
Title: Re: What did that alien do to Lambert with it's tail?
Post by: ElderPredator on Jul 03, 2010, 08:47:39 PM
Title: Re: What did that alien do to Lambert with it's tail?
Post by: Omegamorph on Jul 03, 2010, 09:00:39 PM
Thanks for the link Elder. Effectively it's the same shot, maybe with different lighting imposed in it.
Also, is it me, or the Alien really does hang with its feet?
Title: Re: Lambert's Death
Post by: Omegamorph on Jul 03, 2010, 09:23:41 PM
When Ripley checks what happened.
We see Parker's body in the background and a bloody foot hanging in first sight - certainly Lambert's.
Title: Re: What did that alien do to Lambert with it's tail?
Post by: maledoro on Jul 03, 2010, 10:27:43 PM
Yet another thread about Lambert's death.
Title: Re: What did that alien do to Lambert with it's tail?
Post by: Valaquen on Jul 04, 2010, 12:44:36 AM
Quote from: maledoro on Jul 03, 2010, 10:27:43 PM
Yet another thread about Lambert's death.
This.
In fact, the other thread is seperated from this one by about, what, three other threads? You can't miss it! Three Lambert death threads on one page...
Title: Re: What did that alien do to Lambert with it's tail?
Post by: samoht on Jul 04, 2010, 01:17:40 AM
I have already made a thread about this, discussing how the alien may have raped her.

Lots of people say yes, lots of people say no.
Title: Re: What did that alien do to Lambert with it's tail?
Post by: Private Hudson on Jul 04, 2010, 05:27:25 AM
*Sigh....*


The search button would have revealed more than enough answers to your questions on this....

::)
Title: Re: Lambert's Death
Post by: SM on Jul 04, 2010, 11:08:31 PM
QuoteAgain where is that scene?

You have seen Alien, yes?
Title: Re: What did that alien do to Lambert with it's tail?
Post by: ANYTIME 420 on Jul 08, 2010, 12:44:55 AM
Well one thing is for sure the Alien did not make sweet love with her down by the Firelight.
Title: Re: What did that alien do to Lambert with it's tail?
Post by: AlienatedPredator on Jul 08, 2010, 06:54:26 PM
Quote from: OmegaZilla on Jul 03, 2010, 09:00:39 PM
Thanks for the link Elder. Effectively it's the same shot, maybe with different lighting imposed in it.
Also, is it me, or the Alien really does hang with its feet?

Yeah, the whole feet thing looks a bit . . . weird. It's sticking to the metal surface like a gecko.
Title: Re: What did that alien do to Lambert with it's tail?
Post by: ShadowPred on Jul 08, 2010, 11:44:49 PM
Rape
Title: Re: What did that alien do to Lambert with it's tail?
Post by: Kimarhi on Jul 09, 2010, 12:29:40 AM
The Alien got him some.
Title: Re: What did that alien do to Lambert with it's tail?
Post by: RidgeTop on Jul 09, 2010, 09:39:46 AM
Tail rape.
Title: Re: What did that alien do to Lambert with it's tail?
Post by: Shark_Predator on Jul 10, 2010, 01:12:59 AM
Quote from: RidgeTop on Jul 09, 2010, 09:39:46 AM
Tail rape.

Dude, the moment I read this and looked at your avvie, I chuckled.

Immature, I know I am, but worth it.

To stay on-topic, I agree with this quote.
Title: Re: What did that alien do to Lambert with it's tail?
Post by: Mr. Self Destruct on Jul 10, 2010, 06:20:00 PM
Quote from: ElderPredator on Jul 03, 2010, 08:47:39 PM

I like this video. The Alien seems so huge, and powerful. A creature of godly power and strength.
Title: Re: What did that alien do to Lambert with it's tail?
Post by: Jody=Geek on Jul 12, 2010, 09:16:19 AM
The alien killed her with it's tail. Or stabbed her in the head with it's tongue.
Title: Re: The lambert/Alien Rape.
Post by: x2SMONEY on Jul 14, 2010, 02:22:14 AM
Not to sound too perverted but,maybe the alien just wanted to get his tail "up there" to see what it was like and to see the pain it caused... :-\ Kind of a creepy thought...
Title: Re: The lambert/Alien Rape.
Post by: samoht on Jul 14, 2010, 06:52:54 AM
Quote from: QueenofDeath on Jul 03, 2010, 02:44:28 PM
Quote from: samoht on Jun 27, 2010, 10:53:00 AM
On other sites I have been on, people have been saying that the Alien attempted to rape lambert. I, myself, partly agree on this.

I just saw the movie and when it slowly approached her and slid its tail up her leg, I got the expression that the alien had sexual intentions. And when Ripley finds her body later, her pants are completely removed and blood is running down her legs.


I have read somewhere that the writer, O' bannon (or whatever his name is) commented once that the alien had some of Kane's memories and "needs", so perhaps it was trying to have sex with Lambert, it just didn't quite know how to go about it. In the film, the rape was implied but not a 'fact' IMO.

The alien is also supposed to have sexual overtones. Just like Gigers artwork, so I'm sure you can see the possability.

Well, anyway I just want to generate some discussion on this.

where is her body found?

In the same room as she died I believe.
Title: Re: The lambert/Alien Rape.
Post by: Ballzanya on Jul 16, 2010, 02:07:32 AM
Well aliens don't reproduce sexually and the warrior aliens don't have penises.(nor do any aliens for that matter)
I'm sure it was just curious and found her unthreatening enough to kill her via a method other than one inner-jaw strike to the skull.
Title: Re: What did that alien do to Lambert with it's tail?
Post by: Ballzanya on Jul 16, 2010, 02:38:00 AM
This again? It wasn't "Tail rape "for f**k's sake. We don't see anything and her convulsions could have been from being partially impaled.
Title: Re: What did that alien do to Lambert with it's tail?
Post by: SM on Jul 16, 2010, 02:40:23 AM
Couldn't a mod just pick one of these neverending threads and sticky it?
Title: Re: What did that alien do to Lambert with it's tail?
Post by: Private Hudson on Jul 16, 2010, 02:41:43 AM
I agree with SM, it's tiresome reading the same thread whenever a new member joins.
Title: Re: What did that alien do to Lambert with it's tail?
Post by: Ballzanya on Jul 16, 2010, 02:42:34 AM
Quote from: SM on Jul 16, 2010, 02:40:23 AM
Couldn't a mod just pick one of these neverending threads and sticky it?
No! No f**king tail rape. It's Alien not a f**king hentai cartoon. lol
I don't care how many sick f**ks want to get off on the idea that the alien "raped" her, because its not what officially happened.
Title: Re: What did that alien do to Lambert with it's tail?
Post by: SM on Jul 16, 2010, 02:52:04 AM
...

'kay...
Title: Re: What did that alien do to Lambert with it's tail?
Post by: StrangeShape on Jul 16, 2010, 03:03:09 AM
As I explained in a different thread (but about the same thing) -  in short: I dont like it because I want ALIEN to be logical and make sense, be different than other 70s scifi movies and the raping not only couldnt happen within that time frame but is highly illogical
Title: Re: What did that alien do to Lambert with it's tail?
Post by: SM on Jul 16, 2010, 03:07:06 AM
How does a rape take?  ???
Title: Re: What did that alien do to Lambert with it's tail?
Post by: StrangeShape on Jul 16, 2010, 03:28:18 AM
Quote from: SM on Jul 16, 2010, 03:07:06 AM
How does a rape take?  ???

Longer than 3 seconds I believe. The alien simply had no time for games. And besides, time for what? And why? and with what? and for what?
Title: Re: What did that alien do to Lambert with it's tail?
Post by: SM on Jul 16, 2010, 03:29:58 AM
So if a dude raped a woman and ejaculated in 3 seconds - it doesn't count as rape?

And why "3 seconds"?  Lambert is howling longer than that.
Title: Re: What did that alien do to Lambert with it's tail?
Post by: StrangeShape on Jul 16, 2010, 03:42:09 AM
Quote from: SM on Jul 16, 2010, 03:29:58 AM
So if a dude raped a woman and ejaculated in 3 seconds - it doesn't count as rape?

And why "3 seconds"?  Lambert is howling longer than that.

It was only 9 seconds untill Lambert dies and thats involving her first "no" so when the alien didnt even get to her yet. Not only the time is against it, but logic and reasoning too.
The idea of a rape sounds generally interesting but I wouldnt like it at all in the movie. It doesnt make any sense.What would it rape Lambert with (no penis or any genitalia - its asexual) and for what? The creature is asexual and would have no point in doing anything sexual since its not how it reproducts. Sexual desires come from the urge to merge. Our biology dictates that so we will want to reproduce. Alien does not reproduce in such way and - like already mentioned -  is asexual.

Im also against the idea of the alien doing anything sexual with the tail. It used its tail to kill, its his weapon, so its designed and sharp and tough like a weapon. In addition to that I doubt he has any sexual sensation on the tail because its something hes fighting with. That would not be very clever since it is its weapon and having some delicate sexual organs there wouldnt be a good idea.

What's certain is that he killed her fast. Because it sounded like she was choking Im guessing he ripped her open or something similar to this effect
Title: Re: What did that alien do to Lambert with it's tail?
Post by: StrangeShape on Jul 16, 2010, 03:46:07 AM
I just prefer the idea of a tail kill over the illogical and pointless rape that just couldnt happen. The way I explain it to myself is that she was so violently ripped apart that some of her clothes got ripped. Parker got his shirt ripped apart during his fight with Ash so I take it as a similar situation, plus Dallas didnt have shoes on in the coccoon
Title: Re: What did that alien do to Lambert with it's tail?
Post by: SM on Jul 16, 2010, 04:18:11 AM
Logic and reasoning don't enter into it.  Brett was killed, Dallas, wasn't.  Both were taken back to th Alien's nest, Parker and Lambert weren't.  There's no pattern to it.

And rape has nothing to do with reproduction.  If people are raped anally, it's not so the rapist can get them pregnant.  Esepcially if the rapist uses a bottle or broom handle or something.

I don't really have an opinion one way or the other.  I'd rather it was kept unknown.

However I find you reasons against tail rape lacking in substance.
Title: Re: What did that alien do to Lambert with it's tail?
Post by: StrangeShape on Jul 16, 2010, 04:24:10 AM
Quote from: SM on Jul 16, 2010, 04:18:11 AM
Logic and reasoning don't enter into it.  Brett was killed, Dallas, wasn't.  Both were taken back to th Alien's nest, Parker and Lambert weren't.  There's no pattern to it.


Well, no movie is perfect

But anyway, while the creature in the first 2 movies is full of sexuality visually, I never felt its sexual in any way in its behavior. Again, it doesnt even have genitalias.
Title: Re: What did that alien do to Lambert with it's tail?
Post by: StrangeShape on Jul 16, 2010, 04:26:27 AM
Oh, and going back to the tail again: it uses it as weapon. Its bones, its sharp, its tough. If I would want to hit somebody or break something, I would use the hardest parts of my body, like knuckles or elbows. Not my penis or any delicate, touch sensitive areas
Title: Re: What did that alien do to Lambert with it's tail?
Post by: SM on Jul 16, 2010, 04:41:52 AM
To go back to my post above - one does not rape to impregnate (mostly), nor does one need a penis to rape.
Title: Re: What did that alien do to Lambert with it's tail?
Post by: StrangeShape on Jul 16, 2010, 05:03:46 AM
Quote from: SM on Jul 16, 2010, 04:41:52 AM
To go back to my post above - one does not rape to impregnate (mostly), nor does one need a penis to rape.

Yes but the urge for sex comes from our nature and the organism's need to reproduce. Since alien has neither genitalia nor does he reproduce in such way, it makes no sense whatsoever
Title: Re: What did that alien do to Lambert with it's tail?
Post by: SM on Jul 16, 2010, 05:09:23 AM
You do know there is a difference between rape and sex right?
Title: Re: What did that alien do to Lambert with it's tail?
Post by: StrangeShape on Jul 16, 2010, 05:12:15 AM
Quote from: SM on Jul 16, 2010, 05:09:23 AM
You do know there is a difference between rape and sex right?

:D! But both have something to do with us being horny. And we're horny because our bodies feel the need to reproduce, thats how we're designed. It all comes down to reproducing
Title: Re: What did that alien do to Lambert with it's tail?
Post by: SM on Jul 16, 2010, 05:31:52 AM
Rape is about power; not reproduction.
Title: Re: What did that alien do to Lambert with it's tail?
Post by: StrangeShape on Jul 16, 2010, 05:44:50 AM
Quote from: SM on Jul 16, 2010, 05:31:52 AM
Rape is about power; not reproduction.

Its about sexual relief AND power
Title: Re: What did that alien do to Lambert with it's tail?
Post by: SM on Jul 16, 2010, 05:45:44 AM
Neither of which have anything to do with procreation.
Title: Re: What did that alien do to Lambert with it's tail?
Post by: StrangeShape on Jul 16, 2010, 05:52:58 AM
Quote from: SM on Jul 16, 2010, 05:45:44 AM
Neither of which have anything to do with procreation.

It does. Again, it comes from the urge to merge. Our body's urge to merge. We want sex because of that. We want relief because of that. We feel pleasure this way because of that. Alien did not reproduce this way so it makes no sense for it to have those feelings and needs
Title: Re: What did that alien do to Lambert with it's tail?
Post by: SM on Jul 16, 2010, 06:06:54 AM
So some prison inmate who f**ks another one up the arse with a broom handle has an "urge to merge" does he?
Title: Re: What did that alien do to Lambert with it's tail?
Post by: StrangeShape on Jul 16, 2010, 06:11:51 AM
Quote from: SM on Jul 16, 2010, 06:06:54 AM
So some prison inmate who f**ks another one up the arse with a broom handle has an "urge to merge" does he?

You dont understand what Im saying. Its not that WE want to have babies, its our body. And to force us to have babies our body makes us horny and makes it feel good. So this way, it all comes down to reproduction urges of the body, not necessary our mind
Title: Re: What did that alien do to Lambert with it's tail?
Post by: SM on Jul 16, 2010, 06:20:42 AM
I don't understand because you keep talking about reproduction.  Rape isn't about reproduction - it's about having power over another person, and hurting them while you exercise that power.  People don't say the Alien is trying to shag Lambert - they use the term "rape".

You try to dispute the Alien is trying to rape her because you say it doesn't reproduce that way.  Male prison inmates don't reproduce by butt f**king when someone makes the mistake of bending over to the pick up the soap.  It's about exercising power over another.
Title: Re: What did that alien do to Lambert with it's tail?
Post by: SiL on Jul 16, 2010, 06:24:02 AM
A significant percentage of rape is done with a foreign object anyway.
Title: Re: What did that alien do to Lambert with it's tail?
Post by: StrangeShape on Jul 16, 2010, 06:36:07 AM
Quote from: SM on Jul 16, 2010, 06:20:42 AM
I don't understand because you keep talking about reproduction.  Rape isn't about reproduction - it's about having power over another person, and hurting them while you exercise that power.  People don't say the Alien is trying to shag Lambert - they use the term "rape".

You try to dispute the Alien is trying to rape her because you say it doesn't reproduce that way.  Male prison inmates don't reproduce by butt f**king when someone makes the mistake of bending over to the pick up the soap.  It's about exercising power over another.

Yeah but they get a hardon because they need to get some like every human being. Either with the help of someones butt or their own hand. And like I said before, it all comes from our biological urge to merge. Our body force us to be horny from time to time in order to reproduce. But, like you said, there are other reasons to spread the siemen then reproducing, but the initial reason for it all is reproduction
Title: Re: What did that alien do to Lambert with it's tail?
Post by: StrangeShape on Jul 16, 2010, 06:37:37 AM
Quote from: SiL on Jul 16, 2010, 06:24:02 AM
A significant percentage of rape is done with a foreign object anyway.

Yes, but its still born from sexual deviation caused by the sexual needs which are caused by the organism's urge to merge
Title: Re: What did that alien do to Lambert with it's tail?
Post by: SiL on Jul 16, 2010, 06:45:34 AM
Quote from: StrangeShape on Jul 16, 2010, 06:36:07 AM
Either with the help of someones butt or their own hand. And like I said before, it all comes from our biological urge to merge. Our body force us to be horny from time to time in order to reproduce. But, like you said, there are other reasons to spread the siemen then reproducing, but the initial reason for it all is reproduction
It really isn't that simple across the board. Reproductive urges aren't the sole deciding force in all rapes.
Title: Re: What did that alien do to Lambert with it's tail?
Post by: StrangeShape on Jul 16, 2010, 06:53:54 AM
Quote from: SiL on Jul 16, 2010, 06:45:34 AM
Quote from: StrangeShape on Jul 16, 2010, 06:36:07 AM
Either with the help of someones butt or their own hand. And like I said before, it all comes from our biological urge to merge. Our body force us to be horny from time to time in order to reproduce. But, like you said, there are other reasons to spread the siemen then reproducing, but the initial reason for it all is reproduction
It really isn't that simple across the board. Reproductive urges aren't the sole deciding force in all rapes.

I agree. Theyre not the sole one, but theyre the most important, driving force behind anything sexual
Title: Re: What did that alien do to Lambert with it's tail?
Post by: SM on Jul 16, 2010, 07:02:07 AM
Not in rape.  In rape it's generally about violating someone because you can.  Not because you're horny.

Someone who shoves broken bottle up your bumhole does not have an "urge to merge" which you seem to be harping on.
Title: Re: What did that alien do to Lambert with it's tail?
Post by: chupacabras acheronsis on Jul 16, 2010, 12:46:41 PM

as SM put it, rape isn't about sex, its about power. so if decide to impale a woman in a gigant horse dildo and hang her on my wall it doesn't mean im horny, it means im a deviant, evil f**k.
Title: Re: What did that alien do to Lambert with it's tail?
Post by: Omegamorph on Jul 16, 2010, 01:40:17 PM
Quote from: AlienatedPredator on Jul 08, 2010, 06:54:26 PM
It's sticking to the metal surface like a gecko.
I don't know why, but I really like this statement.
Title: Re: What did that alien do to Lambert with it's tail?
Post by: TheBATMAN on Jul 18, 2010, 01:21:58 PM
I'm just going off memory with this as I don't have the film to hand at the moment but are we absolutely sure the Alien removed her pants? Is the shot not of her arms and hands and it just looks a little like her legs and feet? Anyone got a cap?
Title: Re: What did that alien do to Lambert with it's tail?
Post by: Omegamorph on Jul 18, 2010, 01:25:34 PM
It's her foot hanging.
Moments before, she had shoes.
Title: Re: What did that alien do to Lambert with it's tail?
Post by: Valaquen on Jul 18, 2010, 03:18:28 PM
Quote from: TheBATMAN on Jul 18, 2010, 01:21:58 PM
I'm just going off memory with this as I don't have the film to hand at the moment but are we absolutely sure the Alien removed her pants? Is the shot not of her arms and hands and it just looks a little like her legs and feet? Anyone got a cap?

(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi104.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fm191%2FIzzys88%2Fpicture026-1.jpg&hash=7f0d4ce33eb9e2646e7143c2a2b3dafed6f56532)

Dark, but it's her foot.
Title: Re: What did that alien do to Lambert with it's tail?
Post by: Xhan on Jul 19, 2010, 05:49:14 AM
Pneumothorax.
Title: Re: What did that alien do to Lambert with it's tail?
Post by: StrangeShape on Jul 19, 2010, 01:08:45 PM
Heres a better shot

(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi13.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fa277%2Flovegunner%2FAVP%2Fleg.jpg&hash=fb2e1b5413bd4087fc0c91d7854e06475377d1d9)
Title: Re: What did that alien do to Lambert with it's tail?
Post by: TheBATMAN on Jul 19, 2010, 03:09:12 PM
I see, you are right. Thanks for that.
Title: Re: What did that alien do to Lambert with it's tail?
Post by: Ultimate Hunter on Jul 22, 2010, 12:08:17 AM
I always thought it was just a deliberate sexually provocative way of shooting her death, that the Xeno impaled her with it's tail going up through the *ahem* "nether region".

But if it really was rape, it begs the question since the Xeno is asexual would it do the same to males as well?
Title: Re: What did that alien do to Lambert with it's tail?
Post by: Bishop2 on Jul 22, 2010, 12:37:15 AM
It killed the shit out of her really slowly.
Title: Re: What did that alien do to Lambert with it's tail?
Post by: Valaquen on Jul 22, 2010, 10:49:50 AM
Quote from: Xhan on Jul 19, 2010, 05:49:14 AM
Pneumothorax.
She had gas?
Title: Re: What did that alien do to Lambert with it's tail?
Post by: SM on Jul 23, 2010, 12:55:04 AM
In her lungs.
Title: Re: What did that alien do to Lambert with it's tail?
Post by: Keg on Jul 23, 2010, 01:51:15 AM
i thought it was doing her a favour. they didnt have proper regulation toilet paper on board and the rough stuff was gving her a rash so she didnt bother wiping. the alien was just using its tail to scrape off excess soilage around the old rusty sheriffs badge!
Title: Re: What did that alien do to Lambert with it's tail?
Post by: chupacabras acheronsis on Jul 23, 2010, 01:54:18 AM
Bow Chika Bow Bow
Title: Re: Lambert's Death
Post by: galaxys ultimate hunter on Aug 15, 2010, 09:39:56 PM
Not to get to sexual but I think it's tail just wraped around Lambert so the alien could pull her in so it could mate with her. But he just ended up wounding her and she died.
Title: Re: Lambert's Death
Post by: Ballzanya on Aug 15, 2010, 10:44:31 PM
Quote from: Salt The Fries on Apr 22, 2010, 04:24:20 PM
By the way, I have been pondering for ages, why exactly is there a blood in Parker's mouth when Alien grabs him ???

I thought it was jabbing him in the chest with its tail as he was trying to hold it back. That's what it looked like to me.
Title: Re: Lambert's Death
Post by: TheMonolith on Aug 16, 2010, 01:39:13 AM
Quote from: Ballzanya on Aug 15, 2010, 10:44:31 PM
Quote from: Salt The Fries on Apr 22, 2010, 04:24:20 PM
By the way, I have been pondering for ages, why exactly is there a blood in Parker's mouth when Alien grabs him ???

I thought it was jabbing him in the chest with its tail as he was trying to hold it back. That's what it looked like to me.
In a shot that was cut from the film, the alien presses Parker's head against a pannel, causing his mouth to bleed.
In the context of the film, it could be argued Parker bit his tongue when the tail struck him.
Title: Re: Lambert's Death
Post by: samoht on Aug 16, 2010, 01:48:42 AM
Quote from: Aeus on Jun 19, 2010, 02:16:56 AM
I for one fully appreciate the Alien is super death penis machine from space, which you absolutely 100% cannot hide from. Unless you're Jonesy and you can just stare the f**ker down because of your coconut sized balls.

WIN


Quote from: SM on Jun 22, 2010, 11:01:47 PM
I tend to agree with SiL that the pheromone detection thing is only theory rather than 'generally understood'.

Though there may well be something in the Alien's apparently different treatment of Lambert because she was female.

True. Lets just say the alien was male. (it came from a male anyway). If a male human was going to go around killing people, he would probs murder other males normally but may rape and murder his female victims.

Bit strange with an alien but there you go.


Quote from: DiabloGuapo on Jun 20, 2010, 01:13:07 PM
I was always interested in Lambert's death scene. I don't think we'll ever really know how the Alien killed her, but I think that's the point. I love the mystery of the film. It's about these normal people who end up in an alien situation in an alien environment with an alien creature. The less we know about it, the more frightening it is.


This sounds good.
Title: Re: Lambert's Death
Post by: PredalienXenomorph on Aug 16, 2010, 03:14:05 AM
Quote from: galaxys ultimate hunter on Aug 15, 2010, 09:39:56 PM
Not to get to sexual but I think it's tail just wraped around Lambert so the alien could pull her in so it could mate with her. But he just ended up wounding her and she died.

...... What gives you this idea?
Title: Re: Lambert's Death
Post by: Omegamorph on Aug 16, 2010, 02:58:36 PM
Quote from: PredalienXenomorph on Aug 16, 2010, 03:14:05 AM
Quote from: galaxys ultimate hunter on Aug 15, 2010, 09:39:56 PM
Not to get to sexual but I think it's tail just wraped around Lambert so the alien could pull her in so it could mate with her. But he just ended up wounding her and she died.

...... What gives you this idea?
Perversion.
Title: Re: Lambert's Death
Post by: Alienhunter15 on Aug 17, 2010, 03:37:05 PM
Quote from: coolshow on Apr 22, 2010, 09:15:16 AM
Maybe this will answer your question



Nice scene, I love it. ;D

-alienhunter14
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Primordial on Jul 22, 2012, 03:34:39 PM
Ridley Scott's audio commentaries during the scene between Lambert and the Alien :
"I mean we didn't know how she died but the implication of this was a kind of sexuality to this androgynous male/female who could give birth itself but could also impregnate so it's like er, there are insects like that so we're based on, you know, a little bit of good old mother nature and was that some dreadful ending, was that some terrible, you know, invasion of her body, a rape, and therefore would there be a (an alien) version of the Cartwright character ? There'll certainly what happens, there will be more humanoïd alien now on board of this craft now so that's what she is going to destroy."

Up to now, I though there was only one xenomorph on board of the Nostromo but without selfdestruction, there would be two of them chasing Ripley alone :o
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: StrangeShape on Jul 22, 2012, 06:13:32 PM
If you have other quotes from him in mind, you know hes talking about facehuggin or turning her into alien. He elaborated more on that scene in different places, and explained the alien wants to survive and make more eggs and hes interested in the crew to get more eggs, shutting down any sexual interest which Weaver suggested and Scott described as an odd comment. Lamber died in the locker/airshaft, which is revealed in novelization , by Scott and Lambert
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Primordial on Jul 22, 2012, 07:31:06 PM
I didn't read the Novelization and I didn't have other quotes in mind.
You mean that when Ripley sees Parker and Lambert and then goes to selfdestruct the spaceship, the Alien comes back to take Lambert ?
By the way, when I first saw the movie longtime ago, I though it was playing with Lambert and she was so afraid she was making these strange noises, I didn't think of a rape.
But if the xeno can impregnate, that doesn't mean it has a sexual interest in her. Even if Scott said something else afterwards, I still like the idea that Lambert could "give birth" to another xeno.
Thanks anyway for your information
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: DaddyYautja on Jul 22, 2012, 07:54:54 PM
So that's why the Alien at the end didnt do anything to Ripley?He didnt find her attractive? Or he was sleepy from the sex.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Primordial on Jul 23, 2012, 09:06:44 PM
Quote from: DaddyYautja on Jul 22, 2012, 07:54:54 PMOr he was sleepy from the sex.
That must be it  :laugh:
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Bjørn Half-hand on Jul 29, 2012, 01:43:14 PM
I always just assumed that the tail went up the legs and impaled her, perhaps through the lower back. Maybe when the alien retracted its tail the trousers came off with it?
Or maybe it was rape. Alien tail raped.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Inverse Effect on Aug 03, 2012, 05:02:27 PM
But why didn't the aliens rape any of the marines? I mean that alien who pulling Hudson down into the hole could of gotten a little bit of behind action on him. I mean the positioning of the two was ideal from the aliens perspective.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: samoht on Aug 04, 2012, 05:32:31 AM
Quote from: Guts on Aug 03, 2012, 05:02:27 PM
But why didn't the aliens rape any of the marines? I mean that alien who pulling Hudson down into the hole could of gotten a little bit of behind action on him. I mean the positioning of the two was ideal from the aliens perspective.

Well he could have raped hudson. We don't know. But they want them alive as hosts, not dead. When Kane's son raped lambert it wanted to kill her.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: chupacabras acheronsis on Aug 04, 2012, 05:40:33 AM
perhaps it wanted more privacy.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: samoht on Aug 04, 2012, 12:35:46 PM
Well, Cameron never mentioned this so it could be true.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: worriors on Aug 05, 2012, 01:28:51 PM
Acording to the special features on the Alien Legacy disc's the tail was suposed to act like a wasp sting. The end if the tail would break off after impailing it victim and inject a poison, imobileising the victim.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: swarm87 on Oct 04, 2012, 08:36:58 PM
Quote from: PrimitifAlien on Jul 22, 2012, 07:31:06 PM
I didn't read the Novelization and I didn't have other quotes in mind.
You mean that when Ripley sees Parker and Lambert and then goes to selfdestruct the spaceship, the Alien comes back to take Lambert ?
By the way, when I first saw the movie longtime ago, I though it was playing with Lambert and she was so afraid she was making these strange noises, I didn't think of a rape.
But if the xeno can impregnate, that doesn't mean it has a sexual interest in her. Even if Scott said something else afterwards, I still like the idea that Lambert could "give birth" to another xeno.
Thanks anyway for your information

like in avp-r?
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Gash on Oct 05, 2012, 12:48:05 AM
Quote from: Guts on Aug 03, 2012, 05:02:27 PM
But why didn't the aliens rape any of the marines? I mean that alien who pulling Hudson down into the hole could of gotten a little bit of behind action on him. I mean the positioning of the two was ideal from the aliens perspective.

Aliens doesn't have the psycho-sexual overtones of A L I E N, that's why.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: chupacabras acheronsis on Oct 05, 2012, 01:08:35 AM
yeah, that would have made the Vietnam analogy TOO strong...
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: StrangeShape on Oct 05, 2012, 02:34:34 AM
And yet scott and cartwright said she died of fright squeezing into locker. Novelization says so too. Amazing what ppl read  into  it.Which is what schuset and scott said too
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SiL on Oct 05, 2012, 07:52:29 AM
Novelisation doesn't say she dies of fright in the food locker. Alien attacks Lambert, Parker attacks so it drops her, kills him, turns back to Lambert, Ripley hears screaming. Although the screaming is "mercifully short" in the novel.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Gilfryd on Oct 05, 2012, 03:58:22 PM
This was before Aliens were giant space termites and if all the other weird sexual allusions are any indication, yeah, the Alien did something to her.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Omegamorph on Oct 05, 2012, 03:59:20 PM
Let me put a link to Valaquen's blo-

oh but why do I bother.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: The Runner on Oct 05, 2012, 07:20:04 PM
Your pain is mutual Omega......
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: StrangeShape on Oct 05, 2012, 07:26:58 PM
Quote from: SiL on Oct 05, 2012, 07:52:29 AM
Novelisation doesn't say she dies of fright in the food locker. Alien attacks Lambert, Parker attacks so it drops her, kills him, turns back to Lambert, Ripley hears screaming. Although the screaming is "mercifully short" in the novel.

And then Ripley finds her stacked in the shaft
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SiL on Oct 05, 2012, 10:24:48 PM
They're both gone in the novel. Ripley hopes there might be someone left there, because the Alien would have to get itself and two people through the vent, but when she gets to the food locker "what remained" showed her how the Alien had succeeded in getting them all through.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: StrangeShape on Oct 05, 2012, 11:19:43 PM
Yes but the idea of stacking  or running into some kind of shaft  remains, which was  close to the final idea of  lambert  dyin of freight while tryin to escape to a shaft  or a locker
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SiL on Oct 05, 2012, 11:42:07 PM
In the end the novel's as vague as the movie. Ripley hears screams, then sees the aftermath. We still don't know what it does.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: echobbase79 on Oct 06, 2012, 12:23:18 AM

Isn't that shot of the tail going up between the legs originally taken from Brett's death anyway?

Back to Topic Question:
I've always thought it might have teased her a bit with its tail and then it finally gives her the fatal kiss.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Kol on Oct 06, 2012, 12:57:01 AM
(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2F25.media.tumblr.com%2Ftumblr_lxy32nlHcT1qmz9r9o1_500.jpg&hash=10eeb291cc75375ee82e791598cb721cf2670049)
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Enigma on Oct 06, 2012, 08:47:58 AM
that's

just

wrong

wrong on so many levels...   :-\
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Omegamorph on Oct 06, 2012, 11:47:45 AM
Quote from: echobbase79 on Oct 06, 2012, 12:23:18 AM

Isn't that shot of the tail going up between the legs originally taken from Brett's death anyway?
Yup. No Lambert boots (c).
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: chupacabras acheronsis on Oct 06, 2012, 02:38:41 PM
Quote from: Kol on Oct 06, 2012, 12:57:01 AM
(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2F25.media.tumblr.com%2Ftumblr_lxy32nlHcT1qmz9r9o1_500.jpg&hash=10eeb291cc75375ee82e791598cb721cf2670049)

the crossover i've always dreamed of.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: The Runner on Oct 06, 2012, 05:34:09 PM
Xenomorphs have dildos?????
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Gilfryd on Oct 07, 2012, 01:34:11 AM
Is that Giger's signature?

I don't think what's in the novelization or that they used a shot from Brett's death should overrule what's shown in the final film. It's a giant horrible penis monster.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: chupacabras acheronsis on Oct 07, 2012, 01:38:43 AM
Quote from: Gilfryd on Oct 07, 2012, 01:34:11 AM
Is that Giger's signature?

yes. it's probably the tamest sex he's drawn.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Amaterasu on Oct 07, 2012, 01:55:08 AM
Quote from: Kol on Oct 06, 2012, 12:57:01 AM
(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2F25.media.tumblr.com%2Ftumblr_lxy32nlHcT1qmz9r9o1_500.jpg&hash=10eeb291cc75375ee82e791598cb721cf2670049)

*crawls back into her doghouse*

Can't unsee...
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: samoht on Oct 07, 2012, 02:07:37 AM
Quote from: Kol on Oct 06, 2012, 12:57:01 AM
(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2F25.media.tumblr.com%2Ftumblr_lxy32nlHcT1qmz9r9o1_500.jpg&hash=10eeb291cc75375ee82e791598cb721cf2670049)

Oh god yes.

*right click/save as
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: chupacabras acheronsis on Oct 07, 2012, 02:36:37 AM
(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FN4vkU.jpg&hash=e964dc6aa5ff3df5d0deacdc7f6a4f3afc6eacce)

If Giger says the xenomorph has a penis then it has a goddamn penis. I won't question it's ability to rape.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: The Runner on Oct 07, 2012, 03:00:35 AM
Musta bursted out of a male porn star......
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Amaterasu on Oct 07, 2012, 03:06:09 AM
Oh god, oh god, oh god.

*pulls out paper bag and starts breathing with it*
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: samoht on Oct 07, 2012, 03:24:36 AM
So in conclusion, yes the alien raped lambert.

/thread
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: StrangeShape on Oct 07, 2012, 03:34:58 AM
In gigers sexually deviant imagination, yes. In the movie, not so much
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Gates on Oct 07, 2012, 05:22:55 PM
Quote from: OmegaZilla on Oct 06, 2012, 11:47:45 AM
Quote from: echobbase79 on Oct 06, 2012, 12:23:18 AM
Isn't that shot of the tail going up between the legs originally taken from Brett's death anyway?
Yup. No Lambert boots (c).

And yet, it's omitted from that scene and deliberately placed with Lambert's...interesting to say the least...

Quote from: ShadowPred on May 26, 2010, 03:46:33 PM
(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi124.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fp30%2FShadowPred%2Fgates-lambertred-white2.jpg&hash=3656e76fff8d03c265fb079f08804a237770973b)

Thanks to Gates for having that sig many moons ago.

Talk about a blast from the past... :)

Quote from: Spaghetti on May 26, 2010, 07:21:49 PM
Ah, Gates. I miss him and his long pauses.

<3
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: echobbase79 on Oct 08, 2012, 12:26:36 AM
Quote from: Gates on Oct 07, 2012, 05:22:55 PM
Quote from: OmegaZilla on Oct 06, 2012, 11:47:45 AM
Quote from: echobbase79 on Oct 06, 2012, 12:23:18 AM
Isn't that shot of the tail going up between the legs originally taken from Brett's death anyway?
Yup. No Lambert boots (c).

And yet, it's omitted from that scene and deliberately placed with Lambert's...interesting to say the least...

Quote from: ShadowPred on May 26, 2010, 03:46:33 PM
(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi124.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fp30%2FShadowPred%2Fgates-lambertred-white2.jpg&hash=3656e76fff8d03c265fb079f08804a237770973b)

Thanks to Gates for having that sig many moons ago.

Talk about a blast from the past... :)[/b]

Quote from: Spaghetti on May 26, 2010, 07:21:49 PM
Ah, Gates. I miss him and his long pauses.

<3

I remember that. Brings back old memories. ;)
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Primordial on Oct 08, 2012, 09:05:48 AM
Quote from: swarm87 on Oct 04, 2012, 08:36:58 PM
Quote from: PrimitifAlien on Jul 22, 2012, 07:31:06 PM
I didn't read the Novelization and I didn't have other quotes in mind.
You mean that when Ripley sees Parker and Lambert and then goes to selfdestruct the spaceship, the Alien comes back to take Lambert ?
By the way, when I first saw the movie longtime ago, I though it was playing with Lambert and she was so afraid she was making these strange noises, I didn't think of a rape.
But if the xeno can impregnate, that doesn't mean it has a sexual interest in her. Even if Scott said something else afterwards, I still like the idea that Lambert could "give birth" to another xeno.
Thanks anyway for your information

like in avp-r?

Eggbarfing you mean ? I was more thinking about impregnating with the tail.
As life of Kane's son was starting to reach its end (hiding in the Narcissus and waiting to die), impregnation and giving birth to a new xeno was the best solution to chase the rest of the Nostromo crew (Ripley)

Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SM on Oct 08, 2012, 07:42:27 PM
Aliens come from facehuggers - not tails.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Gilfryd on Oct 08, 2012, 10:35:04 PM
Who says it only has one mode of reproduction?
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SM on Oct 08, 2012, 10:37:10 PM
A bunch of movies.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: whiterabbit on Oct 08, 2012, 11:30:35 PM
Except that none of the aliens ever live long enough to know for sure...

I was also laughing at the facehugger segment on robot chicken last night. Where someone asks for the morning after pill with a facehugger attached to her face. Seriously, if it is only via a face hugger, then surely there is a vaccine for that. haha
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SM on Oct 08, 2012, 11:33:58 PM
Quote from: whiterabbit on Oct 08, 2012, 11:30:35 PM
Except that none of the aliens ever live long enough to know for sure...

Of course we do.

AvP:Poo aside.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: whiterabbit on Oct 09, 2012, 01:16:33 AM
Quote from: SM on Oct 08, 2012, 11:33:58 PM
Quote from: whiterabbit on Oct 08, 2012, 11:30:35 PM
Except that none of the aliens ever live long enough to know for sure...

Of course we do.

AvP:Poo aside.
Two words, Black Magic. Eh?
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SM on Oct 09, 2012, 01:22:15 AM
Not if you pay attention.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: whiterabbit on Oct 09, 2012, 01:24:11 AM
lol

The black goo is pretty much a black magic. However a survivor, perfect organism is going to find a way to survive. Facehuggers alone will eventually become useless. Then what? It'll just sit there and die as suggested?
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SM on Oct 09, 2012, 01:28:12 AM
Yep.

The Alien isn't immortal or omnipotent.

Black goo is neither here nor there in this instance.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Local Trouble on Oct 09, 2012, 01:41:51 AM
How does SM usually respond to the "perfect organism" argument?  ;)
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SM on Oct 09, 2012, 01:47:00 AM
SM usually says that "perfect organisms" aren't susceptible to machine guns.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: samoht on Oct 09, 2012, 02:52:11 AM
It depends what you classify as the "perfect organism", and what contexts and external attributes we take into consideration. If we compare them to the rest of existence and everything in it then no, they are not "perfect".

However, if we don't get too pedantic over the word "perfect" then we are left with a nice description of the aliens superior survival qualities compared to other critters.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SM on Oct 09, 2012, 02:57:58 AM
Another things that makes it less than perfect is that it requires an entirely different species in order to procreate.

It's perfect in terms of it's adaptability though.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: StrangeShape on Oct 09, 2012, 03:07:20 AM
Theres an interesting thing that novelization says. It basically implies that everything Ash's head said was a lie to try to terrorize the rest of the crew and scare them with this invincible monster story, so they will plug Ash back in thinking his their only chance. Then he would try to kill them again. Hence the omitted "have you tried to communicate with it" part of the speech, which was a more direct try at getting them to plug him back in and seek his cooperation
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: whiterabbit on Oct 09, 2012, 11:45:41 AM
True. When asked by Lambert, you admire it, Ash said that he admired it's purity. A survivor. Unclouded by conscience, remorse or delusions of morality. Almost pitying himself for what he was programmed to do which likely was against his base programming which was to serve human beings. He doesn't actually try to outright kill Ripley and I thought it was obvious that he was internally trying to fight the order as he roll up the perfect murder weapon, a titty magazine. I mean honestly there was something going on there. He didn't even want to soil his own hands which was why he used a magazine.

However as far as being a lie or an exaggeration, three obviously exhausted people vs an 8 foot tall monster with giant claws, acid blood and profoundly strong. He wasn't lying when he said they can't kill it.

Also re watching the Lambert alien scene again... well shit, it dose rape her. I mean just look how interested the alien is in her. Also Parker was still muttering even after being head bite. There was also an alien groan of ecstasy translated as a roar in the subtitles. Lambert's toes were also bent the f**k out of shape. I still have no idea what she was hanging from unless the Alien decided to play barbie dolls and fit her into a space suit.

The worst of it all is that now the question has to be, was Dallas also raped? Well of course something happened.

Also I didn't notice it at first but the Ripley Ash whooping kind of resembled the Shaw Engineer fight.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Primordial on Oct 09, 2012, 11:49:35 AM
Quote from: SM on Oct 08, 2012, 07:42:27 PM
Aliens come from facehuggers - not tails.
I was referring to R.Scott's audio commentaries (Alien Quadrilogy) about impregnation like I already wrote in this thread. There aren't many other ways to impregnate (as we can hear Lambert, it is almost sure it is not eggbarfing).

Quote from: SM on Oct 09, 2012, 02:57:58 AM
Another things that makes it less than perfect is that it requires an entirely different species in order to procreate.
It's a "perfect" parasite.

Quote from: StrangeShape on Oct 09, 2012, 03:07:20 AM
It basically implies that everything Ash's head said was a lie to try to terrorize the rest of the crew and scare them with this invincible monster story,
Interesting. When he says :"You still don't know what you are dealing with" implies he knows what he is dealing with, how could he know ? He certainly is bluffing...or he encountered one in a previous mission (but that's off topic)
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Gilfryd on Oct 09, 2012, 06:07:08 PM
Quote from: SM on Oct 08, 2012, 10:37:10 PM
A bunch of movies.

When talking about stuff like this it makes sense to look at Alien as a stand alone thing... there was no queen or hive or any of that. It was this inconceivable Lovecraftian thing. You really didn't know what it's motives were, just that they weren't good for the Nostromo crew or the Derelict for that matter.

This goes into what Ash's head said... yeah it was his head but I think what he was saying was the truth. The Alien was perfect in it's psychology. It just didn't care. You could kill it but it'd rip you apart and not care. Know what I mean? That's why the company wanted it. It was thorough and got the job done. It's so merciless and the sad part is they think they can control it.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Valaquen on Oct 09, 2012, 06:34:27 PM
You could probably retroactively apply some of David's psychology to Ash - he's a machine and thinks he's better than the humans. He meets this Alien (d'aww): an organic/machine hybrid beast that also transcends them. He's fascinated and a little in lurve. It has no scruples at all. Maybe Ash also felt a little superior to the Nostromo crew because he was actively deceiving them.
All speculative, o' course.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SM on Oct 09, 2012, 09:56:17 PM
QuoteWhen talking about stuff like this it makes sense to look at Alien as a stand alone thing...

In the context of the stand alone movie - Aliens still come from facehuggers.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Local Trouble on Oct 09, 2012, 09:57:48 PM
At some point, wouldn't the alien need to inject an eggmorphing host with some genetic material anyway?
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SM on Oct 09, 2012, 10:01:19 PM
Don't know.  It'd have to do something to them.  What, precisely isn't known.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Local Trouble on Oct 09, 2012, 10:10:24 PM
So rape is still on the menu then, just no rape to produce a chestburster?
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SM on Oct 09, 2012, 10:17:55 PM
Depends on how you want to define 'rape'.  If the tail is involved here, I'm just going to call it 'stabbed'.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: stephen on Oct 09, 2012, 10:30:13 PM
If Lambert was "raped" - then I don't think she was raped from the Alien's point of view.  Maybe from her point of view but not the alien's.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Primordial on Oct 09, 2012, 11:31:07 PM
Quote from: RaisingCane on Oct 09, 2012, 10:10:24 PM
So rape is still on the menu then, just no rape to produce a chestburster?
Facehugger needs an orifice to implant a chestbuster embryo. Maybe it's the same with the tail, thus being a rape ?

Quote from: stephen on Oct 09, 2012, 10:30:13 PM
Maybe from her point of view but not the alien's.
For sure !
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SM on Oct 10, 2012, 12:23:21 AM
Quote
Facehugger needs an orifice to implant a chestbuster embryo. Maybe it's the same with the tail, thus being a rape ?

Thus making facehuggers redundant.


Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: whiterabbit on Oct 10, 2012, 12:36:17 AM
Quote from: SM on Oct 10, 2012, 12:23:21 AM
Quote
Facehugger needs an orifice to implant a chestbuster embryo. Maybe it's the same with the tail, thus being a rape ?

Thus making facehuggers redundant.
From how I understand it, the alien needs a good supply of blood and thus being near the lungs and heart, those delicious carotid arteries are the best environment. Mouth --> esophagus --> heart wall seems to be the most convenient way. However the same thing can be easily done via a uterus. I'm not sure an anus could provide the same amount of blood flow though.

All successful creatures have another way of reproducing. Looks at us, we can use our penis or we can take some DNA and mix and match it to make clones... I for one rather use my penis and it could be the same thing with the alien. They rather do it with the facehugger.

Point is how can an alien be limited in it's reproductive methods? Facehuggers is just one method I think.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SM on Oct 10, 2012, 12:44:35 AM
QuoteAll successful creatures have another way of reproducing.

Such as?

QuoteLooks at us, we can use our penis or we can take some DNA and mix and match it to make clones...

Cloning is a naturally occurring way of procreating for humans is it?
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Local Trouble on Oct 10, 2012, 01:01:37 AM
Quote from: whiterabbit on Oct 10, 2012, 12:36:17 AMAll successful creatures have another way of reproducing. Looks at us, we can use our penis or we can take some DNA and mix and match it to make clones... I for one rather use my penis and it could be the same thing with the alien. They rather do it with the facehugger.
???

(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.filehurricane.com%2Fphotos%2F9182008100539AM_rape40lbs.jpg&hash=6bc9ea17d77a8718eadea8b9b6aab7501a2fa887)
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: whiterabbit on Oct 10, 2012, 01:07:01 AM
Quote from: SM on Oct 10, 2012, 12:44:35 AM
QuoteAll successful creatures have another way of reproducing.

Such as?

QuoteLooks at us, we can use our penis or we can take some DNA and mix and match it to make clones...

Cloning is a naturally occurring way of procreating for humans is it?
Are the aliens a natural occurring being? Maybe a better question is just how alien are the aliens. Many organisms can either reproduce sexual or asexually. An engineered method of reproduction, such as genetic cloning, is just a response to human intelligence. Robots are another example of possible reproduction.

The thing is that the alien is exactly that, alien. If it is a weapon then it surely has more than one way to procreate.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SM on Oct 10, 2012, 01:12:17 AM
Why?

Beyond whatever the f**k the PredAlien (may its name be forever cursed) was - it goes hugger + host = Alien.

QuoteAre the aliens a natural occurring being?

Aren't they?

QuoteMany organisms can either reproduce sexual or asexually.

I note you use the words 'either' and 'or'.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Local Trouble on Oct 10, 2012, 01:14:18 AM
If they're a weapon, maybe they were deliberately designed to require hosts for reproduction so they would die out shortly after a target's populace had been eradicated.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SM on Oct 10, 2012, 01:15:26 AM
Egss aren't going to die out though.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Local Trouble on Oct 10, 2012, 01:19:58 AM
I'm not convinced of that.  The eggs on the derelict were being preserved within some sort of engineer-tech stasis field, weren't they?
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SM on Oct 10, 2012, 01:22:43 AM
I don't know - were they?

And I should clarify that I didn't mean 'won't die out ever'.  They'll just last a long time.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Local Trouble on Oct 10, 2012, 01:28:15 AM
Okay, granted.  I was expecting you to tell me that the eggs are immortal because the aliens are a perfect organism.

However, I imagine the undefended eggs would be far easier for the engineers to deal with than an army of fully grown soldiers.  Especially if the aliens nested in isolated places.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SM on Oct 10, 2012, 01:30:36 AM
If you can do like Ripley and take out a shit tonne of eggs from range - yeah it would be easier to deal with.  But if one or more of them gets out, things start getting a tad tricky.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Local Trouble on Oct 10, 2012, 01:39:08 AM
True, but I assume the engineers would be careful not to allow that.  Which, of course, means they probably did...
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SM on Oct 10, 2012, 01:42:59 AM
One obviously didn't.

I have no idea if the Aliens were created by Jockies, or whether they're naturally occurring and what the Prometheus crew encountered was Jockey attempts to genetically engineer their own versions.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Local Trouble on Oct 10, 2012, 01:44:26 AM
I expect you to know these things.  Don't disappoint me now.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SM on Oct 10, 2012, 01:46:39 AM
I could make some shit up - but I generally leave that to other people.

;)
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Local Trouble on Oct 10, 2012, 01:49:19 AM
Did I mention my new theory that the super facehugger might just be a regular facehugger that mutated to survive in the aquatic environment that the EEV crashed into?
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SM on Oct 10, 2012, 01:50:49 AM
I dunno if that's especially 'new'.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Local Trouble on Oct 10, 2012, 01:53:05 AM
Someone beat me to it?
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SM on Oct 10, 2012, 01:54:38 AM
Pretty sure I've heard it over the years.  Happens a lot, especially with a film series this old.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Local Trouble on Oct 10, 2012, 02:07:30 AM
Do you recall shooting it down?
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SM on Oct 10, 2012, 02:10:44 AM
Not really.  I think it's patently ridiculous, but there's things going on at the start of Alien that can fall into the same category.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Local Trouble on Oct 10, 2012, 02:19:31 AM
Hey, they can shed their cells and replace them with polarized silicon.  Maybe the tough little sons-of-bitches can grow webbing and spikes too.  :-\

It is, after all, a perfect organism.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: whiterabbit on Oct 10, 2012, 02:41:02 AM
Perfect nothing, Ridley say's it's a damn weapon and I'm running with that.  :laugh:

Which is why there must be a sleuth of reproduction methods available. If it is a naturally occurring creature then yes I agree the facehugger would be the way to go. If we ignore the DC of alien mind you. :P

Stinging tails does sound dumb though, I must admit. It's a stabbing tool, used to murder.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SM on Oct 10, 2012, 02:45:23 AM
QuoteWhich is why there must be a sleuth of reproduction methods available.

Oh, of course "there must"...


:D
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Local Trouble on Oct 10, 2012, 02:51:43 AM
Sleuth.  Gumshoe.  Whatever.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SM on Oct 10, 2012, 02:56:26 AM
...private dick?
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Local Trouble on Oct 10, 2012, 02:58:43 AM
No thanks.  I'm trying to quit.  8)
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SM on Oct 10, 2012, 03:16:50 AM
 ;D
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: whiterabbit on Oct 10, 2012, 08:44:55 AM
Oh wow gotta jump on the lazy ass spell check error eh. Still doesn't change the fact that both of you clearly lack a perverted mind. :P
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Primordial on Oct 10, 2012, 09:29:29 AM
Quote from: SM on Oct 10, 2012, 12:23:21 AM
Thus making facehuggers redundant.
In Alien, the Xeno was capturing people and was changing them into eggs. As time is going on, its life was reaching to the end. In this case and from the Alien's point of view, better have :
- 3 certain eggs (leaving Parker aside) and one survivor (Ripley) : that means changing Lambert into an egg, or
- 2 certain eggs and a possible third one (Ripley) and no survivor : that means impregnating Lambert with a chestbuster ?
(this is the 'worst case' : the Xeno is not supposed to know there is only one survivor)

Quote from: whiterabbit on Oct 10, 2012, 02:41:02 AM
Stinging tails does sound dumb though, I must admit. It's a stabbing tool, used to murder.
It could be both. Look at a parasitic wasp, it has on ovipositor with a needle at the end, but it's less practical than a tail  :)
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Vepariga on Oct 10, 2012, 11:47:23 AM
I think she just got a tail up the vajayjay to her death.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SM on Oct 10, 2012, 09:57:46 PM
QuoteIn Alien, the Xeno was capturing people and was changing them into eggs. As time is going on, its life was reaching to the end. In this case and from the Alien's point of view, better have :
- 3 certain eggs (leaving Parker aside) and one survivor (Ripley) : that means changing Lambert into an egg, or
- 2 certain eggs and a possible third one (Ripley) and no survivor : that means impregnating Lambert with a chestbuster ?
(this is the 'worst case' : the Xeno is not supposed to know there is only one survivor)


Not sure of the point you're trying to make.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: ShadowPred on Oct 10, 2012, 10:05:53 PM
Quote from: Vepariga on Oct 10, 2012, 11:47:23 AM
I think she just got a tail up the vajayjay to her death.

Or if you go by AvP3 2010...all the way through the mouth.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: chupacabras acheronsis on Oct 10, 2012, 10:14:44 PM
Quote from: ShadowPred on Oct 10, 2012, 10:05:53 PM
Quote from: Vepariga on Oct 10, 2012, 11:47:23 AM
I think she just got a tail up the vajayjay to her death.

Or if you go by AvP3 2010...all the way through the mouth.

same thing, really.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: The Runner on Oct 10, 2012, 11:35:33 PM
Quote from: ShadowPred on Oct 10, 2012, 10:05:53 PM
Quote from: Vepariga on Oct 10, 2012, 11:47:23 AM
I think she just got a tail up the vajayjay to her death.

Or if you go by AvP3 2010...all the way through the mouth.

Cept this was before the Alien had a giant unrealistic butcher blade tail that made it look like it came out of a dinosaur or host which had a decent size tail.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: ShadowPred on Oct 11, 2012, 01:09:42 AM
Quote from: The Runner on Oct 10, 2012, 11:35:33 PM
Quote from: ShadowPred on Oct 10, 2012, 10:05:53 PM
Quote from: Vepariga on Oct 10, 2012, 11:47:23 AM
I think she just got a tail up the vajayjay to her death.

Or if you go by AvP3 2010...all the way through the mouth.

Cept this was before the Alien had a giant unrealistic butcher blade tail that made it look like it came out of a dinosaur or host which had a decent size tail.

I expect Gearbox to fix this.   :P
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: The Runner on Oct 11, 2012, 01:48:57 AM
They probably won't. Just like the double jointed legs and floppy tubes, damn ADI influence.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Primordial on Oct 11, 2012, 08:16:29 AM
Quote from: SM on Oct 10, 2012, 09:57:46 PM
QuoteIn Alien, the Xeno was capturing people and was changing them into eggs. As time is going on, its life was reaching to the end. In this case and from the Alien's point of view, better have :
- 3 certain eggs (leaving Parker aside) and one survivor (Ripley) : that means changing Lambert into an egg, or
- 2 certain eggs and a possible third one (Ripley) and no survivor : that means impregnating Lambert with a chestbuster ?
(this is the 'worst case' : the Xeno is not supposed to know there is only one survivor)


Not sure of the point you're trying to make.

Ok. I was trying to say the Alien probably wants to make the more eggs as possible.
But if it's going to die, it can't chase anymore and eggmorph hosts. So the best way to continue to make eggs would be to create a new chestbuster.
So eggs and impregnation could coexist  :)
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SM on Oct 11, 2012, 09:53:09 PM
Why?  It's made at least 2 eggs.  Meaning two people could be impregnated sometime in the future.  It's fulfilled it's primary function.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Primordial on Oct 12, 2012, 08:54:30 AM
Yes, it's fulfilled its primary function by making at least 2 eggs (but then why 2 and not just one ?...in a way, it gives more mystery to Alien's behaviour  :))

Actually, I had in mind this quote of StrangeShape about the Alien making more eggs :

Quote from: StrangeShape on Jul 22, 2012, 06:13:32 PM
If you have other quotes from him in mind, you know hes talking about facehuggin or turning her into alien. He elaborated more on that scene in different places, and explained the alien wants to survive and make more eggs and hes interested in the crew to get more eggs, shutting down any sexual interest which Weaver suggested and Scott described as an odd comment. Lamber died in the locker/airshaft, which is revealed in novelization , by Scott and Lambert

Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SiL on Oct 12, 2012, 10:10:15 AM
It doesn't leave just one so the population can expand.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: samoht on Oct 12, 2012, 12:57:35 PM
Quote from: PrimitifAlien on Oct 12, 2012, 08:54:30 AM
Yes, it's fulfilled its primary function by making at least 2 eggs (but then why 2 and not just one ?...in a way, it gives more mystery to Alien's behaviour  :))

Actually, I had in mind this quote of StrangeShape about the Alien making more eggs :

Quote from: StrangeShape on Jul 22, 2012, 06:13:32 PM
If you have other quotes from him in mind, you know hes talking about facehuggin or turning her into alien. He elaborated more on that scene in different places, and explained the alien wants to survive and make more eggs and hes interested in the crew to get more eggs, shutting down any sexual interest which Weaver suggested and Scott described as an odd comment. Lamber died in the locker/airshaft, which is revealed in novelization , by Scott and Lambert

So the population can expand of course.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Space7Horror on Oct 14, 2012, 01:07:31 PM
Egg morphing would be such a slow process how are the aliens supposed to take over if they can make like 2 eggs and die I like the queen she is Cool and the aliens and take over better with her.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SM on Oct 14, 2012, 10:12:39 PM
It's exponential.

Lets pretend they can only make two eggs.  Egg morphing takes about 3 hours tops.  So if you nab two hosts at the same time, within 3 hours you have to more eggs.  If those have hosts about 16 hours (give or take) later you have two more Aliens.  They morph two eggs each, etc etc.  So if they can only make two eggs each and if they only live 24 hours, you'll still have a constantly replenishing and growing supply of Aliens, even with those restricted conditions.

Queens on the other hand take 2-3 days to gestate then another 3 days or so to start laying.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: stephen on Oct 15, 2012, 12:01:23 AM
Quote from: SM on Oct 14, 2012, 10:12:39 PM
Egg morphing takes about 3 hours tops. 

Where the hell are you getting that from?
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SM on Oct 15, 2012, 12:44:47 AM
Estimating based on the state of Brett when Ripley finds him and Dallas.  Could be shorter, but 3 hours is my best conservative guess.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: stephen on Oct 15, 2012, 01:12:28 AM
Quote from: SM on Oct 15, 2012, 12:44:47 AM
Estimating based on the state of Brett when Ripley finds him and Dallas.  Could be shorter, but 3 hours is my best conservative guess.

But it is a complete and utter assumption.  We don't know what "state" Brett was in when Ripley finds him.  The egg morphing process could have taken another day for all we know.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SM on Oct 15, 2012, 01:14:54 AM
He's almost fully an egg - what evidence do you have that it'll take "another day"?

And you accuse me of "complete and utter assumption"...
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: stephen on Oct 15, 2012, 01:17:30 AM
Ahhh none.

Thats my point.  We don't know how long the egg morphing process takes - and just because something LOOKS like an egg doesn't mean that it is fully "morphed" into an egg.

My whole point is that there is nothing to say one way or another.  I'm not saying that it will take another day at all.  I'm saying that for all we know it could take another day.  Hell two days.  I'm not assuming anything.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SM on Oct 15, 2012, 01:20:56 AM
QuoteMy whole point is that there is nothing to say one way or another.

Except there is - it's there in the film, and I'm making an estimate based on what's in the film.

You want to make stuff up - fair enough, but I'll go with what's in the film as much as possible.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: stephen on Oct 15, 2012, 01:24:18 AM
Quote from: SM on Oct 15, 2012, 01:20:56 AM
QuoteMy whole point is that there is nothing to say one way or another.

Except there is - it's there in the film, and I'm making an estimate based on what's in the film.

You want to make stuff up - fair enough, but I'll go with what's in the film as much as possible.

But I'm not making stuff up.  You are.  Tell me what there is in the film to state that egg morphing takes 3 hours?

All you've got is a visual of Brett. And the fact that it was still recognizable (if not of Brett then at least human) shows that there is still some way to go before it becomes an egg.  How long? who the f**k knows!

I'm not making stuff up - I don't know - and I'm quite open in saying so.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SM on Oct 15, 2012, 01:29:53 AM
I haven't made anything up.

For the third or fourth time, we see Brett almost fully eggmorphed, and I'm making as estimate that he was nabbed a couple of hours earlier, based on what's gone on in the film in the interim, and there is a little way to go before he could hatch a hugger.

If you still want to accuse me of making things up - go ahead.  No amount of further explaining on my part is going to stop you going "Nuh-uh" as nauseum.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: stephen on Oct 15, 2012, 01:31:28 AM
Quote from: SM on Oct 15, 2012, 01:29:53 AM
I haven't made anything up.

For the third or fourth time, we see Brett almost fully eggmorphed, and I'm making as estimate that he was nabbed a couple of hours earlier, based on what's gone on in the film in the interim, and there is a little way to go before he could hatch a hugger.

If you still want to accuse me of making things up - go ahead.  No amount of further explaining on my part is going to stop you going "Nuh-uh" as nauseum.

"f**king people baffle me."
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SM on Oct 15, 2012, 01:43:46 AM
Still?
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: stephen on Oct 15, 2012, 02:48:28 AM
always
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Primordial on Oct 15, 2012, 11:31:49 AM
Yes SiL and samoht, true that just one egg doesn't allow the Alien population to expand (except if this only egg contains a superfacehugger (giving birth to a Queen)).

Quote from: SM on Oct 14, 2012, 10:12:39 PM
It's exponential.

Lets pretend they can only make two eggs.  Egg morphing takes about 3 hours tops.  So if you nab two hosts at the same time, within 3 hours you have to more eggs.  If those have hosts about 16 hours (give or take) later you have two more Aliens.  They morph two eggs each, etc etc.  So if they can only make two eggs each and if they only live 24 hours, you'll still have a constantly replenishing and growing supply of Aliens, even with those restricted conditions.
Ok I see, this works, but needs also an exponential number of hosts.
In the Nostromo case, suppose Lambert and Parker were facehugged by Dallas egg and Brett's egg. 2 new xeno's ready to eggmorph but only Ripley is available. At the end, just 1 egg is there.
If Kane's son is intelligent enough to know how many hosts are still on the spaceship (which I doubt), he would present (for example) Lambert to an egg. A new xeno which eggmorphs Parker and Ripley. At the end, 3 eggs are there.

To these space parasites to exist through the centuries, the more they have eggs and the better so I hope for them they are able to eggmorph as many hosts as possible.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SM on Oct 15, 2012, 10:01:02 PM
Better for the Alien to eggmorph everyone it can get its mitts on - Brett, Dallas, Parker, Lambert, Ripley - and Kane had he not been ejected.  So there's six eggs to infect the boarding party when they get back to Earth.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: The Runner on Oct 15, 2012, 10:45:25 PM
You forgot the Kitty.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SM on Oct 15, 2012, 10:51:28 PM
Kitty was in cahoots with the Alien.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: The Runner on Oct 15, 2012, 11:05:23 PM
Except when the Alien swatted the Cat out of his way.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SM on Oct 15, 2012, 11:06:59 PM
And didn't actually harm him...
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: The Runner on Oct 15, 2012, 11:22:03 PM
Could of been saving him and Ripley as hosts.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Xenorape on Oct 20, 2012, 02:03:59 PM
The following is a possible description of Lambert rape scene. Reader description is advised:

QuoteLambert was terrified by seeing the alien killing Parker and it would be just a matter of time until it kill her too. But unlucky of her the alien wasn't interested in killing her. At least not yet. It approached Lambert curious almost in a sexual way. Lambert was petrified by fear. The alien extended its tail between her legs and in a heartbeat she was lifted off the ground bleeding, penetrated by it. This was no ordinary f**k. In a matter of seconds Lambert was orgasming and squirting like never before. The alien was literately f**king Lambert's womb with its erectile appendage. But it wasn't pleased just by hitting her hard. Its wicked behaviour went even further by taking off Lambert's shoes and socks. It sucked her smelly and sweaty feet so hard that it broke her toes. But the agonizing f**k wasn't over yet. The alien teared what was left of Lambert's clothes off and with its long, tongue-like proboscis it drilled her ass in. In a mixture of screams, blood and body fluids the alien f**ked her all open until she died. Satisfied the alien leaved just before Ripley showed up to witness the disturbing scene.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: The Runner on Oct 20, 2012, 02:48:58 PM
I'm going to....um go back to what I was doing before....*leaves thread*
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: chupacabras acheronsis on Oct 20, 2012, 03:00:08 PM
i did't know aliens could suck anything
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: The Runner on Oct 20, 2012, 03:05:30 PM
Same here.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Amaterasu on Oct 20, 2012, 08:52:54 PM
Quote from: Xenorape on Oct 20, 2012, 02:03:59 PM
The following is a possible description of Lambert rape scene. Reader description is advised:

QuoteLambert was terrified by seeing the alien killing Parker and it would be just a matter of time until it kill her too. But unlucky of her the alien wasn't interested in killing her. At least not yet. It approached Lambert curious almost in a sexual way. Lambert was petrified by fear. The alien extended its tail between her legs and in a heartbeat she was lifted off the ground bleeding, penetrated by it. This was no ordinary f**k. In a matter of seconds Lambert was orgasming and squirting like never before. The alien was literately f**king Lambert's womb with its erectile appendage. But it wasn't pleased just by hitting her hard. Its wicked behaviour went even further by taking off Lambert's shoes and socks. It sucked her smelly and sweaty feet so hard that it broke her toes. But the agonizing f**k wasn't over yet. The alien teared what was left of Lambert's clothes off and with its long, tongue-like proboscis it drilled her ass in. In a mixture of screams, blood and body fluids the alien f**ked her all open until she died. Satisfied the alien leaved just before Ripley showed up to witness the disturbing scene.

(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fmedia.tumblr.com%2Ftumblr_lqeqbiexHY1qdl8yz.gif&hash=080d14e3cafc140bc530e3dd231a465acd6900fd)
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Omegamorph on Oct 20, 2012, 08:55:56 PM
This is turning into the weird part of AvPG again
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SiL on Oct 20, 2012, 08:57:43 PM
Huzzah terribly written fanfic.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Amaterasu on Oct 20, 2012, 08:59:24 PM
Quote from: OmegaZilla on Oct 20, 2012, 08:55:56 PM
This is turning into the weird part of AvPG again

(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fmedia.tumblr.com%2Ftumblr_ma4e4qByyw1r19hec.gif&hash=b470c86a0e30321d6edac4995a076517bcff49a4)
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Gates on Oct 20, 2012, 09:55:03 PM
Quote from: SiL on Oct 20, 2012, 08:57:43 PM
Huzzah terribly written fanfic.

It's somehow worst than the garbage XXX fanfics that chick wrote way-back-when...
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: whiterabbit on Oct 20, 2012, 10:16:31 PM
Hell of a first post though.  :D

That was a fan fic because we all know the alien has a normal monster cock hidden behind that crotch zipper. Badejo said so.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SM on Oct 20, 2012, 10:52:31 PM
50 Shades of Lambert.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: chupacabras acheronsis on Oct 20, 2012, 11:04:56 PM
i'm tempted to write something myself.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Amaterasu on Oct 20, 2012, 11:06:54 PM
Yes, Chupa. Do eet.  ;)
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: whiterabbit on Oct 21, 2012, 01:16:12 AM
"Lambert, terrified, unable to move, much less run away. ("unzippppppssss"). Lambert hushes, then lets out a screeching scream; oh myyyyyyyyy! What a big f**king dick you have!"

Then she dies. End of Story.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: samoht on Oct 21, 2012, 02:11:26 AM
There is no proof that it wasn't consensual.

I think both parties we up for it, but shit happened. It's a shame really, how tragically it ended.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: chupacabras acheronsis on Oct 21, 2012, 02:30:04 AM
Quote from: Amaterasu on Oct 20, 2012, 11:06:54 PM
Yes, Chupa. Do eet.  ;)

i'd have to put my heart into it.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Amaterasu on Oct 21, 2012, 03:59:13 AM
Quote from: chupacabras acheronsis on Oct 21, 2012, 02:30:04 AM
Quote from: Amaterasu on Oct 20, 2012, 11:06:54 PM
Yes, Chupa. Do eet.  ;)

i'd have to put my heart into it.

And soul!  ;)
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Omegamorph on Oct 21, 2012, 06:58:51 AM
Quote from: SM on Oct 20, 2012, 10:52:31 PM
50 Shades of Lambert.
:laugh:
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Amaterasu on Oct 21, 2012, 08:40:34 PM
Quote from: whiterabbit on Oct 21, 2012, 01:16:12 AM
"Lambert, terrified, unable to move, much less run away. ("unzippppppssss"). Lambert hushes, then lets out a screeching scream; oh myyyyyyyyy! What a big f**king dick you have!"

Then she dies. End of Story.

:laugh:
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Valaquen on Oct 24, 2012, 03:42:23 PM
I wrote an article of sorts on this topic: http://alienseries.wordpress.com/2012/10/22/debate-loving-lambert/ (http://alienseries.wordpress.com/2012/10/22/debate-loving-lambert/)

Can someone tell me how it's handled in ADF's novelisation?
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SM on Oct 24, 2012, 07:44:13 PM
Happens off 'screen' in that too.  ExceptRipley  doesn't find any bodies.  Just the result of the Alien squeezing itself and Parker and Lambert into the airduct.  Which is implied to be unpleasant.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: enyapneb on Oct 25, 2012, 10:08:33 PM
There was no rape scene. If you watch the VHS directors cut you will see the alien cocooning Bret and Dallas.

That is pending for a face hugger (which never comes). All the alien does is kill lambert and semi hang her upside down.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SM on Oct 26, 2012, 12:14:26 AM
I don't believe the Directors Cut ever got an official release on VHS.

And Lambert seems to be hanging right way up.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: enyapneb on Oct 26, 2012, 08:56:09 AM
Quote from: SM on Oct 26, 2012, 12:14:26 AM
I don't believe the Directors Cut ever got an official release on VHS.

And Lambert seems to be hanging right way up.

It was in the facehugger black suitcase/box set. There was a additional cassette :)


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eR5jYeIMBKk# (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eR5jYeIMBKk#)

No sound but interesting to watch (nothing dodgy)


Here is the full original scene:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KzRXrPl-OoA#ws (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KzRXrPl-OoA#ws)

And if you watch the extended Bret scene you will notice the Alien does the same "tail" thing. Its like it holds then steady to kill?http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UYPaQfLg08c#ws (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UYPaQfLg08c#ws)
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Gash on Oct 28, 2012, 10:42:33 PM
Did the alien rape Dallas?
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SM on Oct 28, 2012, 10:52:24 PM
Why'd you think he has trouble talking?
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Gash on Oct 28, 2012, 11:21:45 PM
Because he's had a facehugger embryo injected up his bum.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Amaterasu on Oct 29, 2012, 12:52:27 AM
Quote from: Gash on Oct 28, 2012, 11:21:45 PM
Because he's had a facehugger embryo injected up his bum.

:laugh:

And now we know why, thanks for clearing that up.
Title: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: LastSurvivor92 on Apr 04, 2014, 02:26:37 AM
(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fladymanson.com%2Fgalleries%2Fmovies%2FMoviesAC%2Falbums%2F06152012%2FAlien%2F16%2Faliendc_2897.jpg&hash=c8c9b15e06c16518bd57e667ab3a022d22862b7a)
(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fladymanson.com%2Fgalleries%2Fmovies%2FMoviesAC%2Falbums%2F06152012%2FAlien%2F16%2Faliendc_2898.jpg&hash=4f8053cc5104d4c7702c3aae8eb894e857b71292)

I've always wandered how the Alien really killed Lambert. The last thing we see is her screaming and the Alien's tail going between her legs. Than we hear in the distance as Ripley is racing down those dark rustic corridors Lambert screaming in pure agony and fear. As Ripley approaches the room where Parker and Lambert were getting the coolant for the air support system she see's Parker slumping over with blood running down his face and than the Ripley see's Lambert, her feet dangling above the ground with blood running between her toes. Her big toe seems to be dislocated and her pants are completley gone. Makes you think how demented the Alien could really be. From what it looks like in my opinion, it looks like she might of been brutally raped.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SM on Apr 04, 2014, 02:38:56 AM
Maybe.  Maybe not.

We're not supposed to know either way.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: LastSurvivor92 on Apr 04, 2014, 02:41:27 AM
Quote from: SM on Apr 04, 2014, 02:38:56 AM
Maybe.  Maybe not.

We're not supposed to know either way.

She has no shoes or pants on dude....She must of been raped. Why would her clothes of been off for no reason? And what is she dangling from?
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Cvalda on Apr 04, 2014, 02:42:54 AM
I NEED TO KNOW IF SHE WAS RAPED DUDE

FOR RESEARCH PURPOSES
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SM on Apr 04, 2014, 02:45:06 AM
 :laugh:

QuoteShe has no shoes or pants on dude....She must of been raped. Why would her clothes of been off for no reason? And what is she dangling from?

What do you think, Sherlock?

"Must" is a long bow to draw.
"Must of" is just flat out gramatically incorrect.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: LastSurvivor92 on Apr 04, 2014, 02:50:38 AM
Quote from: Cvalda on Apr 04, 2014, 02:42:54 AM
I NEED TO KNOW IF SHE WAS RAPED DUDE

FOR RESEARCH PURPOSES


:laugh:


Quote from: SM on Apr 04, 2014, 02:45:06 AM
:laugh:

QuoteShe has no shoes or pants on dude....She must of been raped. Why would her clothes of been off for no reason? And what is she dangling from?

What do you think, Sherlock?

"Must" is a long bow to draw.
"Must of" is just flat out gramatically incorrect.


In your opinion SM what do you think happend and what do you think she might be hanging from?
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: MrSpaceJockey on Apr 04, 2014, 03:02:33 AM
Tail probably went through her pants, impaled through her body, and when the alien dragged out the tail, the pants and shoes came off with it.  That's how I always imagined it.  Rape from a human perspective, but not necessarily because the alien had any sexual lust, it's just that the way it killed her that invokes a sense of rape in our minds.

It's really an open topic not even the filmmakers can agree on.  After all, didn't Ridley said she died of fear?  But the scene's obviously edited to look like rape, taking deleted portions from Brett's death scene and splicing in them for extra disturbance.  :P
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: StrangeShape on Apr 04, 2014, 03:03:57 AM
Lambert's fate was not clear in the movie due to an afterthought editing insert, and it created some confusion as to why or how did it kill her. It is hinted that the alien is about to use its bladed tail to kill her, however that is not the case. The insert is taken from an earlier scene with Brett, and from that scene we know the alien used the tail to lift him up and take him to the vents. The 1979 Illustrated Story showed the alien as actually stabbing the back. There have even been some suggestions of some sort of sexual act, however that would make no sense since the alien does not have any reproductive organs and does not need to engage in a sexual act. This wild theory has originated from Sigourney Weaver, but Ridley Scott was puzzled by it himself

Q: Sigourney Weaver told me that she believed the Alien looked at Ripley in the final scene with curiosity and perhaps sexual interest.
Ridley Scott: I never thought about it that way. I find that her comment is ... certainly odd (via alienseries blog)

Ron Shusset: 'People have read all kinds of things into it that we didn't intend, not even subconsciously. (2004 doc)

Scott naturally denied the creature having sexual desires, and its an "insect" and "natural animal", which was "completely instinctual". Today, in the age of easy access to information, it is more commonly known what had happened to Lambert. She simply unintentionally killed herself , dying from fright trying to escape/hide in a small lock, getting a heart attack and hurting herself in the process

Cartwright: Ridley wanted to do a thing where I freak out and crowded back into one of those lockers that the cat came out of. I sort of crawl up into it and dire of fright.

In the novelization also, its described that Ripley finds Lambert's body squeezed violently into the airshaft (in the movie its been said to be the locker). Lambert pretty much died of fright and panickly tried to hide in a small locker, breaking her bones and ripping her clothes and eventually panicking to the point her heart stopped. This is what she is hanging from, the locker that she stuffed herself into

Scott: Veronica was always great at barely controlled terror. Catatonic terror. She's always like, two steps from a heart attack, which I think she finally does at the end - have a heart attack. 'You'd probably die before the thing touched you anyway. I mean, you'd have a heart attack, right? You'd turn and see it and last about four seconds before you had a coronary

Dan Obannon confirmed what actually happened to Lambert in Famous Monster #159

O'Bannon: "Finally, returning to Lambert & Parker's murders, when we see the result of the creature's attack we notice that her bare legs are hung midair but we are not shown why. Well. the alien came thru the airshaft; that's where it shoved the body."


http://www.jamescamerononline.com/AlienandAliens.htm (http://www.jamescamerononline.com/AlienandAliens.htm)

(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.jamescamerononline.com%2Fcp23.png&hash=11a0e9a3baa9ad40974cca6a86b59f90f67a0ee7)


She was shoved into the locker or air shaft, depending on who you listen
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SM on Apr 04, 2014, 03:23:53 AM
QuoteIn your opinion SM what do you think happend and what do you think she might be hanging from?

It's impossible to make a judgement.  Guessing - there's a bench in the crabwalk scene, next to where she's standing, that she could've been slumped on, with her feet dangling.  Though the scene is meant to look like it, the camera angle of the bodies isn't Ripley's POV.  And the direction she is looking isn't where Lamberts body would be (though it would be the direction of Parkers body)

As for the rape thing - it's implied it did something to her with it's tail.  Xhan has speculated in the past that Lambert's screams suggested a sucking chest wound.  As for her pants - they're loose fitting.  If the waist band got torn in ther struggle, they'll fall off.  The boots are harder to explain.  Can't see the Alien needing to remove them.

Even if we are talking rape, then it's rape by a creature who doesn't know the meaning of the word.

Ripley just sees "carnage" in the script.  No details.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Apr 04, 2014, 03:49:03 AM
The Alien was curious by nature,we got a sense of that with Brett's alternate death,the way it reached out to him while he was trying to scream.Lambert's clothing might have been removed by the Alien-not for the purpose of rape,but to examine the human female form,of which she was the first to be encountered by the creature.The creature's curious habit of removing crew member's clothing wasn't just reserved for females,Capt Dallas was also missing his jacket,sock and shoe ( cocoon scene ).
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: PsyKore on Apr 04, 2014, 08:09:44 AM
I remember on the Quadrilogy DVD somewhere Ridley Scott says the Alien does something more "heinous" to Lambert. However, I think it's open to interpretation. The rape thing is appealing, though, because it adds another disturbing layer to the horrific creature.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Russ on Apr 04, 2014, 08:36:22 AM
Also, didn't O'Bannon say in one of the documentaries that the Eureka! moment was when he mate said to him "what if it f**ks them?"

At the time, there was no back-story, no legion of fans and all that stuff - I can imagine them saying "let's make it look as though its going to rape her - that'll freak the shit out of people." "Let's do it!"

Retrofitting reasons into the stuff we see is great fun, but I reckon these guys just wanted to think of the sickest stuff to scare our parents (OK, my parents) in the 70s. Everyone on this forum knows that the inherent horror of "Alien" was the fear of our bodies being violated - I guess this scene is just more overt?

That said, the evidence below would contradict that - she got stuffed in the locker and died of fright: But I don't believe 'em! I really think that was their intent - amping up the horror, amping up the horror, amping up the horror.

Blanking our mind's canvass of what we know about the Xeno now compared to that first movie - Facehugger impregnates Kane, Kane "hatches" the Xeno... there's no more facehugger, so... what is that Xeno doing with its tail thing that's going up between poor Lambert's legs.

I'm actually grossing myself as I type - which, as I say, I feel was their intent back in the day.



Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SiL on Apr 04, 2014, 09:00:43 AM
The "What if it has sex with one of them" was the face-hugger, not the adult.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: irn on Apr 04, 2014, 09:34:57 AM
It would definitely fit the psycho-sexual imagery of the alien better.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SM on Apr 04, 2014, 10:34:24 AM
QuoteEveryone on this forum knows that the inherent horror of "Alien" was the fear of our bodies being violated - I guess this scene is just more overt?

How overt can it be when we never see what happens to Lambert or what's left?
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Russ on Apr 04, 2014, 11:21:03 AM
Quote from: SM on Apr 04, 2014, 10:34:24 AM
How overt can it be when we never see what happens to Lambert or what's left?

Something vaguely phallic heading up between her legs? Overt's the wrong word, though - It's implied. I just think they wanted to freak people - and that was all part of it.


Quote from: SiL on Apr 04, 2014, 09:00:43 AM
The "What if it has sex with one of them" was the face-hugger, not the adult.

I'm not sure the full lifecyle had really been thought out at stage of the game, so as I say above, I think that they may have wanted to imply that something had happened.

Or, you can just go with what you see. Lambert got scared and off camera the alien took her trousers and shoes off and hung her up, killing her in the process somehow. Maybe she wasn't even dead, maybe the tail was supposed to be like a scorpion sting that paralysed her ready to be cocooned. 

Or ,as Elmazalman points out, it might just have been curious.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: LastSurvivor92 on Apr 04, 2014, 12:33:36 PM
Quote from: SM on Apr 04, 2014, 10:34:24 AM
QuoteEveryone on this forum knows that the inherent horror of "Alien" was the fear of our bodies being violated - I guess this scene is just more overt?

How overt can it be when we never see what happens to Lambert or what's left?

I agree with SM here. Without seeing factual film of Lambert falling to her fate we won't ever REALLY know what happened to her. Her dieing of fright is extremely possible but I like to be a little more creative in my thinking and assume she was violently raped in some way or attacked brutally. Lambert seemed the most afraid of the creature and I think that building up of fear led to one of the most brutal attacks left on a crew member. Its one of the death scenes that will always be left up for interpretation. And if you think about it, Lambert is the only crew member that doesn't have a complete death scene where we actually see her death. Its left for us to create the nightmare in our own heads.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Gash on Apr 04, 2014, 01:40:50 PM
I think, what with the tail heading where it's heading, and the grunting of the alien, it's certainly implied to be something of a sexual assault. Her scream seems to fit with that better than dying of fright as well.

But that's why it's off screen, so you can use your imagination and conjure up the worst. The bare legs and dripping blood are all you need to see to know that Lambert probably suffered more than anyone else, 'cept Dallas.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Valaquen on Apr 04, 2014, 02:35:03 PM
I wonder what the threads would be like if Scott kept the Alien tail clip in its original place.

Did the Alien rape Brett?   :laugh:
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Russ on Apr 04, 2014, 02:51:57 PM
Possibly  - "what if the alien f**ks them?" doesn't have to apply to just the facehugger. Or the girls. That's why its so horrid and scary, I guess
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: wmmvrrvrrmm on Apr 04, 2014, 06:32:03 PM
Ridley's actual view of what was going on with Lambert when he talked about it in the Alien Quadrilogy commentary, where he seems to suggest that he accepted the implications of the sexual ambiguity of the scene and if he's changed his view since then, well, that's up to him.

Ridley Scott: I mean we didn't know how she died but er, the implication that there was a kind of sexuality to this androgenous male/female who could give birth itself, it could also impregnate, so it's like a , there are insects like that, we based that on a , you know a little bit of good old mother nature and erm, was that some dreadful ending, was that some terrible you know invasion of her body, a rape and therefore would there be a version of the Cartwright character. There'll certainly whatever happens, there'd be more humanoid aliens now on board this craft and that's what she's now got to destroy.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: LastSurvivor92 on Apr 04, 2014, 06:52:15 PM
Quote from: Gash on Apr 04, 2014, 01:40:50 PM
I think, what with the tail heading where it's heading, and the grunting of the alien, it's certainly implied to be something of a sexual assault. Her scream seems to fit with that better than dying of fright as well.

But that's why it's off screen, so you can use your imagination and conjure up the worst. The bare legs and dripping blood are all you need to see to know that Lambert probably suffered more than anyone else, 'cept Dallas.

I agree man and I think it makes sense for the Alien to be 'somewhat' sexual considering how sexual Giger's art is. To assume that she just died of fright is rather blaze. I think anyone with an imagination would think up something much darker than "Oh! she just died of a heartattack." The way she was dangling and screaming should indicate to anyone that she was being attacked or violated in some way, shape or form.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Valaquen on Apr 04, 2014, 06:57:50 PM
Ridley also said in the commentary:  "She's always like, two steps from a heart attack, which I think she finally does at the end – have a heart attack."

It's really not meant to be obvious what happened. You're not meant to be able to say 100% either way.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: LastSurvivor92 on Apr 04, 2014, 07:06:28 PM
Quote from: Valaquen on Apr 04, 2014, 06:57:50 PM
Ridley also said in the commentary:  "She's always like, two steps from a heart attack, which I think she finally does at the end – have a heart attack."

It's really not meant to be obvious what happened. You're not meant to be able to say 100% either way.

Wouldn't you rather assume though that she was just scared and was brutally attacked by the Alien. To say she just died of a heartattack doesn't really make the Alien frightening. To assume the Alien actually did something to her makes that scene wayyyyyy more scary.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Valaquen on Apr 04, 2014, 07:28:39 PM
Quote from: Flight Officer Lambert on Apr 04, 2014, 07:06:28 PM
Wouldn't you rather assume though that she was just scared and was brutally attacked by the Alien. To say she just died of a heartattack doesn't really make the Alien frightening. To assume the Alien actually did something to her makes that scene wayyyyyy more scary.

The Alien is the cause of the heart attack. Scott said in '84: "You'd probably die before the thing touched you anyway. I mean, you'd have a heart attack, right? You'd turn and see it and last about four seconds before you had a coronary, okay ... run-ins with the Alien [were] always done with the ultimate feeling of a heart attack. The rush of a heart attack, even if the thing didn't ever touch them."
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: The1PerfectOrganism on Apr 04, 2014, 07:38:05 PM
You can take it either way.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: wmmvrrvrrmm on Apr 04, 2014, 07:40:20 PM
Well, it looks as if Ridley imagined at the time that she was being raped but succumbed to a heart attack.

Perhaps there might be a third idea to connect with it that we don't yet know about.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Valaquen on Apr 04, 2014, 08:11:48 PM
Quote from: Erik Lehnsherr on Apr 04, 2014, 07:38:05 PM
You can take it either way.

That's the beauty of the scene.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Apr 04, 2014, 08:43:32 PM
Quote from: Valaquen on Apr 04, 2014, 07:28:39 PM
Quote from: Flight Officer Lambert on Apr 04, 2014, 07:06:28 PM
Wouldn't you rather assume though that she was just scared and was brutally attacked by the Alien. To say she just died of a heartattack doesn't really make the Alien frightening. To assume the Alien actually did something to her makes that scene wayyyyyy more scary.

The Alien is the cause of the heart attack. Scott said in '84: "You'd probably die before the thing touched you anyway. I mean, you'd have a heart attack, right? You'd turn and see it and last about four seconds before you had a coronary, okay ... run-ins with the Alien [were] always done with the ultimate feeling of a heart attack. The rush of a heart attack, even if the thing didn't ever touch them."
If it was a heart attack,how would you explain her blood stained legs and the large pool of blood beneath her dangling foot.I don't believe she did that to herself,by trying to jam herself into a locker or air shaft to escape the Alien,as some have suggested.Since we know the Alien's preferred method of dispatch is a tongue strike,i can only guess it could of been - delivered off-screen.As for the tail rape theory,never believed it,the tail is used ( as seen in the film )in attacks for defence/offence.If the tail was a sex organ it would be extremely sensitive,swatting Parker with it would have caused the Alien considerable pain.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: wmmvrrvrrmm on Apr 04, 2014, 09:00:07 PM
Quote from: Elmazalman on Apr 04, 2014, 08:43:32 PM
Quote from: Valaquen on Apr 04, 2014, 07:28:39 PM
Quote from: Flight Officer Lambert on Apr 04, 2014, 07:06:28 PM
Wouldn't you rather assume though that she was just scared and was brutally attacked by the Alien. To say she just died of a heartattack doesn't really make the Alien frightening. To assume the Alien actually did something to her makes that scene wayyyyyy more scary.

The Alien is the cause of the heart attack. Scott said in '84: "You'd probably die before the thing touched you anyway. I mean, you'd have a heart attack, right? You'd turn and see it and last about four seconds before you had a coronary, okay ... run-ins with the Alien [were] always done with the ultimate feeling of a heart attack. The rush of a heart attack, even if the thing didn't ever touch them."
If it was a heart attack,how would you explain her blood stained legs and the large pool of blood beneath her dangling foot.I don't believe she did that to herself,by trying to jam herself into a locker or air shaft to escape the Alien,as some have suggested.Since we know the Alien's preferred method of dispatch is a tongue strike,i can only guess it could of been - delivered off-screen.As for the tail rape theory,never believed it,the tail is used ( as seen in the film )in attacks for defence/offence.If the tail was a sex organ it would be extremely sensitive,swatting Parker with it would have caused the Alien considerable pain.

well, how do you know that the alien's so called "sex organ" must be sensitive like a human's, and why can't the alien violently impregnate Lambert leading to her death by heart attack?
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SM on Apr 04, 2014, 09:11:32 PM
QuoteI think, what with the tail heading where it's heading, and the grunting of the alien, it's certainly implied to be something of a sexual assault. Her scream seems to fit with that better than dying of fright as well.

What "grunting"?
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Apr 04, 2014, 09:13:36 PM
Quote from: wmmvrrvrrmm on Apr 04, 2014, 09:00:07 PM
Quote from: Elmazalman on Apr 04, 2014, 08:43:32 PM
Quote from: Valaquen on Apr 04, 2014, 07:28:39 PM
Quote from: Flight Officer Lambert on Apr 04, 2014, 07:06:28 PM
Wouldn't you rather assume though that she was just scared and was brutally attacked by the Alien. To say she just died of a heartattack doesn't really make the Alien frightening. To assume the Alien actually did something to her makes that scene wayyyyyy more scary.

The Alien is the cause of the heart attack. Scott said in '84: "You'd probably die before the thing touched you anyway. I mean, you'd have a heart attack, right? You'd turn and see it and last about four seconds before you had a coronary, okay ... run-ins with the Alien [were] always done with the ultimate feeling of a heart attack. The rush of a heart attack, even if the thing didn't ever touch them."
If it was a heart attack,how would you explain her blood stained legs and the large pool of blood beneath her dangling foot.I don't believe she did that to herself,by trying to jam herself into a locker or air shaft to escape the Alien,as some have suggested.Since we know the Alien's preferred method of dispatch is a tongue strike,i can only guess it could of been - delivered off-screen.As for the tail rape theory,never believed it,the tail is used ( as seen in the film )in attacks for defence/offence.If the tail was a sex organ it would be extremely sensitive,swatting Parker with it would have caused the Alien considerable pain.

well, how do you know that the alien's so called "sex organ" must be sensitive like a human's, and why can't the alien violently impregnate Lambert leading to her death by heart attack?
If It is a sex organ,it would be sensitive.Impregnate lambert with what?

Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: The1PerfectOrganism on Apr 04, 2014, 09:14:39 PM
Why would does it have to sensitive?

The whole point is that it's "Alien" after all.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Valaquen on Apr 04, 2014, 09:14:43 PM
Quote from: Elmazalman on Apr 04, 2014, 08:43:32 PM
If it was a heart attack,how would you explain her blood stained legs and the large pool of blood beneath her dangling foot.I don't believe she did that to herself,by trying to jam herself into a locker or air shaft

The Alien was meant to have mangled her corpse by trying to yank it through a duct. Cartwright said when she did the scene she was meant to crawl into a locker and die of fright (she didn't see the implied rape until the premiere, since it was invented in post-production). She thought the leg dangling (which she posed for in a harness) was to be a glimpse of her body being bent and broken and pulled through the vents.

The Alien mangling her and the heart attack are not mutually exclusive things.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SM on Apr 04, 2014, 09:20:49 PM
I agree, but I'm off the whole 'trying to shove her into an airduct' thing.  I don't believe there is any airduct in the spot she was killed.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Apr 04, 2014, 09:21:29 PM
Quote from: Erik Lehnsherr on Apr 04, 2014, 09:14:39 PM
Why would does it have to sensitive?

The whole point is that it's "Alien" after all.
If it was a sex organ which I don't believe it was, it would be sensitive.A sex organ that is numb and can't feel anything would defeat its purpose.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Vertigo on Apr 04, 2014, 09:29:58 PM
Quote from: StrangeShape on Apr 04, 2014, 03:03:57 AMDan Obannon confirmed what actually happened to Lambert in Famous Monster #159

O'Bannon: "Finally, returning to Lambert & Parker's murders, when we see the result of the creature's attack we notice that her bare legs are hung midair but we are not shown why. Well. the alien came thru the airshaft; that's where it shoved the body."[/i]

Doesn't really confirm how she died, just that the alien tried to move her afterwards. But according to SM, she's found on a bench rather than hanging out of an airshaft (or a locker), and that's always been the sense I've gotten. Her foot isn't close to a wall as far as I can see in my brief Google skim.

Might explain Lambert's missing shoes and dislocated toe if she'd ran off and tried to hide in a locker. If it was too tight to fit her toe, it would have been much too tight to fit her shoes. And any bare-skin contact with the metal of the ship might have precipitated the "cold, so cold" and blowing noises (also, getting very frightened can make you particularly shivery and susceptible to cold).
As we later see with Ripley on the Narcissus, the alien isn't in any particular hurry to dispatch people that don't threaten it. It's possible for her to briefly escape it, despite its proximity.

:edit: Ninja'd a bit there.


By the way, are there any fan edits out there which restore the full original Brett and Parker death sequences in decent quality? And were these the only edits that were made for censorship?
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Valaquen on Apr 04, 2014, 09:30:41 PM
Quote from: SM on Apr 04, 2014, 09:20:49 PM
I agree, but I'm off the whole 'trying to shove her into an airduct' thing.  I don't believe there is any airduct in the spot she was killed.

I'm sure it was a duct that they might've pulled out of thin air for the convenience. Ridley does things like that all the time - think of the reflected water in Tyrell's office in Blade Runner, or re-using shots from the end of the film when introducing Batty at the beginning, or the dripping water in the Nostromo 'leg room'. I'm sure it wouldn't make sense but he'd do it anyway. Hell, just like Brett's feet suddenly becoming Lambert's.

I could be wrong, of course. I can't say I'm 100% about the ducts.

I do have Cartwright talking about the scene as she shot it:

Quote"[Lambert's death] was supposed to be done different," she told Fantastic Films magazine in 1979, "but they ran out of time so they changed it. Ridley wanted to do a thing where I freak out and crowded back into one of those lockers that the cat came out of. I sort of crawl up into it and die of fright. But that got changed."

She also told Starlog that she "was supposed to sneak along the wall and get into the locker – the same one the cat was in earlier. The Alien is supposed to track me down with his sensory things and I die of fright. Well, that's what they told me, but the next thing is I'm hanging from a meat hook."

She also said last year:

QuoteWell, originally my death was meant to take place in one of the lockers. I was supposed to crawl into the lockers like the cat ... We shot for five days ... Well, somebody asked me once, 'how did it feel for that tail to go up between your legs', but those were Harry Dean Stanton's legs. If you notice I wear cowboy boots throughout the movie. But that was the end result – we never did shoot my death, so, what I thought was going to happen -getting caught up inside that locker- was never shot. I asked them what was going to happen, they said they had enough footage. And the next thing I'm in a week later and I was hanging from a jockstrap contraption for a couple of hours, just so they could see my foot dangling and then they decided that was what my death would be.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Apr 04, 2014, 09:35:29 PM
Quote from: Valaquen on Apr 04, 2014, 09:14:43 PM
Quote from: Elmazalman on Apr 04, 2014, 08:43:32 PM
If it was a heart attack,how would you explain her blood stained legs and the large pool of blood beneath her dangling foot.I don't believe she did that to herself,by trying to jam herself into a locker or air shaft

The Alien was meant to have mangled her corpse by trying to yank it through a duct. Cartwright said when she did the scene she was meant to crawl into a locker and die of fright (she didn't see the implied rape until the premiere, since it was invented in post-production). She thought the leg dangling (which she posed for in a harness) was to be a glimpse of her body being bent and broken and pulled through the vents.

The Alien mangling her and the heart attack are not mutually exclusive things.
Hard to say whether it was a heart attack or tongue strike since it happens off-screen.Going by the Alien's previous methodology concerning attacks,i would say tongue strike,a deleted portion of Lambert's attack clearly shows the Alien readying for a tongue strike as it moves toward Lambert just as Parker begins his attack.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: The1PerfectOrganism on Apr 04, 2014, 09:57:41 PM
But what if it's not a sex organ in the traditional sense?

The Alien perhaps only is attracted by the thought and the tail is more like a stinger that injects fluids.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Apr 04, 2014, 10:22:16 PM
Quote from: Erik Lehnsherr on Apr 04, 2014, 09:57:41 PM
But what if it's not a sex organ in the traditional sense?

The Alien perhaps only is attracted by the thought and the tail is more like a stinger that injects fluids.
I never believed the tail to be anything other than a tail,certainly not a sex organ to rape victim's with-as some other's think.To me,as seen in the final film the tail was used as a weapon,defence/offence or as a aid for enveloping it's victims.The stinger at the end of the tail could be used for stabbing victims or injecting a paralysing venom into it's victims to subdue resistance,or both.We don't know for sure.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: wmmvrrvrrmm on Apr 04, 2014, 10:32:28 PM
Quote from: Elmazalman on Apr 04, 2014, 09:13:36 PM
If It is a sex organ,it would be sensitive.Impregnate lambert with what?

This is an alien creature, and Ridley had the idea the body part we assumed was a tale is an organ capable of implanting embryos into humans , but whether you want to include what Ridley didn't directly state in the movie itself is another question 
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Apr 04, 2014, 10:46:06 PM
Quote from: wmmvrrvrrmm on Apr 04, 2014, 10:32:28 PM
Quote from: Elmazalman on Apr 04, 2014, 09:13:36 PM

If It is a sex organ,it would be sensitive.Impregnate lambert with what?

This is an alien creature, and Ridley had the idea the body part we assumed was a tale is an organ capable of implanting embryos into humans , but whether you want to include what Ridley didn't directly state in the movie itself is another question
[/quote] I haven't heard that theory before,have you got that quote.I'd like to read it.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Xhan on Apr 04, 2014, 11:46:49 PM
Quote from: SM on Apr 04, 2014, 09:20:49 PM
I agree, but I'm off the whole 'trying to shove her into an airduct' thing.  I don't believe there is any airduct in the spot she was killed.

There's not an airduct, but there is a bulkhead slat, the same style of one that Parker gets upended into and smashed into on the other accessway to the room.

The context here is this is the scene that made people leave the theater and cause the two barf attacks during the prescreening, not the chestbursting. People have been combining the guy running screaming from the New York premier chestbursting scene into traffic with the test audience's reaction for years (decades). This scene is vastly truncated from what it was meant to be.

What was filmed is Parker is literally laminated into the bulkhead the Alien tail slap-stiff-arms him into, so his getting headbit is pretty much a mercy stroke, and the brain getting stuck on the strike teeth was pretty much the straw that broker several peoples' threshhold of movie going sanity.

Lambert doesn't get treated any better, and her scene stops with the Alien having his tail jammed firmly in her back, which is consistent with a pneumothrorax, which is the noise we hear until she screams. The thing to note here in respect to any opinion is her scream is full. It's not cut short, it doesn't have any attendant effects, because it was supposed to be in a locker, where Ripley would find her all folded up without a mark on her.

As for her body, she is literally jammed into the bulkhead access lip, just like Parker was. What you see is her leg hanging in space off of it. Where Parker got jammed into the side, Lambert is on the top of the other hallway.

The main point of contention of rape is subjugation and willful malice with intent to take from the victim for direct gratification.

That isn't present here at all in any kind of cultural connotation, nor was it ever meant to be. This is the scene where Scott talked to  Sorensen and others about "people being turned into meat", where the human element was completely stripped and people were subjected to the whims of an uncaring universe like prey animals in a nature documentary.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Apr 05, 2014, 12:29:01 AM
Quote from: Xhan on Apr 04, 2014, 11:46:49 PM


As for her body, she is literally jammed into the bulkhead access lip, just like Parker was. What you see is her leg hanging in space off of it. Where Parker got jammed into the side, Lambert is on the top of the other hallway.


Parker wasn't jammed into anything.He's up against a wall not far from the doorway,cross-legged and slumped over, with his brains leaking into his lap.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SiL on Apr 05, 2014, 01:04:08 AM
QuoteWhat was filmed is Parker is literally laminated into the bulkhead the Alien tail slap-stiff-arms him into,
Not unless the Alien had some plastic and a heat press.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Gash on Apr 05, 2014, 02:29:33 AM
Quote from: SM on Apr 04, 2014, 09:11:32 PM
QuoteI think, what with the tail heading where it's heading, and the grunting of the alien, it's certainly implied to be something of a sexual assault. Her scream seems to fit with that better than dying of fright as well.

What "grunting"?

Ok well I always assumed as there's two distinct vocalisations overlapping, puffing and panting rather than grunting I guess, but one's gotta be the alien, right?
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Xhan on Apr 05, 2014, 03:10:51 AM
Quote from: Elmazalman on Apr 05, 2014, 12:29:01 AM
Quote from: Xhan on Apr 04, 2014, 11:46:49 PM


As for her body, she is literally jammed into the bulkhead access lip, just like Parker was. What you see is her leg hanging in space off of it. Where Parker got jammed into the side, Lambert is on the top of the other hallway.


Parker wasn't jammed into anything.He's up against a wall not far from the doorway,cross-legged and slumped over, with his brains leaking into his lap.

Might wanna check his height again, cause he's not at ground level.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SiL on Apr 05, 2014, 03:35:05 AM
He is going by the two screencaps at the start of the thread.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SM on Apr 05, 2014, 03:55:07 AM
Quote from: Gash on Apr 05, 2014, 02:29:33 AM
Quote from: SM on Apr 04, 2014, 09:11:32 PM
QuoteI think, what with the tail heading where it's heading, and the grunting of the alien, it's certainly implied to be something of a sexual assault. Her scream seems to fit with that better than dying of fright as well.

What "grunting"?

Ok well I always assumed as there's two distinct vocalisations overlapping, puffing and panting rather than grunting I guess, but one's gotta be the alien, right?

It's all Lambert on the comm line.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Xhan on Apr 05, 2014, 04:17:44 AM
Quote from: SiL on Apr 05, 2014, 03:35:05 AM
He is going by the two screencaps at the start of the thread.

And that's perfectly reasonable, except where they died is off ground level, considering they could have shot it Ripley's POV with Parker downagnled at said level and just had Cartwright lay on a conveniently handy cart shown in the making of pics in the background with her leg hanging off it instead of building a stork delivery contraption thereof at more time and expense.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Apr 05, 2014, 05:24:02 AM
Quote from: Xhan on Apr 05, 2014, 04:17:44 AM
Quote from: SiL on Apr 05, 2014, 03:35:05 AM
He is going by the two screencaps at the start of the thread.

And that's perfectly reasonable, except where they died is off ground level, considering they could have shot it Ripley's POV with Parker downagnled at said level and just had Cartwright lay on a conveniently handy cart shown in the making of pics in the background with her leg hanging off it instead of building a stork delivery contraption thereof at more time and expense.
Parker's corpse is sitting on the ship's deck cross-legged and slumped over,resting against a wall not far from a doorway,you can see the coolant bottles that litter the ship's deck not far from his splayed out arms.You've already mentioned the behind the scenes pic of their remains,from the 20th anniversary edition DVD photo gallery.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: wmmvrrvrrmm on Apr 05, 2014, 01:23:39 PM
Quote from: Elmazalman on Apr 04, 2014, 10:46:06 PM
Quote from: wmmvrrvrrmm on Apr 04, 2014, 10:32:28 PM
Quote from: Elmazalman on Apr 04, 2014, 09:13:36 PM
If It is a sex organ,it would be sensitive.Impregnate lambert with what?

This is an alien creature, and Ridley had the idea the body part we assumed was a tale is an organ capable of implanting embryos into humans , but whether you want to include what Ridley didn't directly state in the movie itself is another question
I haven't heard that theory before,have you got that quote.I'd like to read it.

It's a question of piecing things together because he has only talked about it in abstract terms.

Let's see, in the original alien commentary, Ridley talked about promoting the question about whether the alien impregnated the cat, and then in the quadrilogy commentary mixed with the Blu-Ray which I had posted here the other day, Ridley talked about the implicated that Lambert had been impregnated following and the possibility that she had had her body invaded by the alien , which also to him meant a rape and this would lead to an alien humanoid that would be a version of Lambert on board the craft.

And back in Fantastic Films, he talked about the tail , or as he often referred to it, an umbilical cord, and really  "it's a long muscle with an immense tensile strength but it looks like am umbilical."

And what we see is the tail coming up between the legs of what was supposed to be Lambert (although it was borrowed from the Brett's death scene) and it would be implied that she was being raped by this body part if that was happening to Lambert in Ridley's mind.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Valaquen on Apr 05, 2014, 03:26:52 PM
Quote from: Xhan on Apr 05, 2014, 03:10:51 AM
Quote from: Elmazalman on Apr 05, 2014, 12:29:01 AM
Quote from: Xhan on Apr 04, 2014, 11:46:49 PM


As for her body, she is literally jammed into the bulkhead access lip, just like Parker was. What you see is her leg hanging in space off of it. Where Parker got jammed into the side, Lambert is on the top of the other hallway.


Parker wasn't jammed into anything.He's up against a wall not far from the doorway,cross-legged and slumped over, with his brains leaking into his lap.

Might wanna check his height again, cause he's not at ground level.

(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi104.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fm191%2FIzzys88%2FAliens%2Fpicture042.jpg&hash=00305e920cea623a47ab38911501b15cd9e71c8d)

He's killed when held up, yeah. Body is on the floor though.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: LastSurvivor92 on Apr 05, 2014, 04:04:50 PM
Quote from: Valaquen on Apr 05, 2014, 03:26:52 PM
Quote from: Xhan on Apr 05, 2014, 03:10:51 AM
Quote from: Elmazalman on Apr 05, 2014, 12:29:01 AM
Quote from: Xhan on Apr 04, 2014, 11:46:49 PM


As for her body, she is literally jammed into the bulkhead access lip, just like Parker was. What you see is her leg hanging in space off of it. Where Parker got jammed into the side, Lambert is on the top of the other hallway.


Parker wasn't jammed into anything.He's up against a wall not far from the doorway,cross-legged and slumped over, with his brains leaking into his lap.

Might wanna check his height again, cause he's not at ground level.

(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi104.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fm191%2FIzzys88%2FAliens%2Fpicture042.jpg&hash=00305e920cea623a47ab38911501b15cd9e71c8d)

He's killed when held up, yeah. Body is on the floor though.

Really cool picture Valaquen!  :)
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Bat Chain Puller on Apr 05, 2014, 04:18:17 PM
Whether she died of fright or not, Lambert was horribly abused before the alien left the scene. Pants, socks, shoes, gone. Pretty crazy actually. But I think that's the point.

I wonder even if Ridley filmed that aftermath shot. Looks like something a second unit might pick up. Depending on the time schedule and who was involved it may have been a slap dash effort with last minute details that didn't adhere to the original script.

There is obviously no way Lambert is squeezed into a vent or a locker in the final film.

And what she is hanging from? Perhaps tangled in wires or chains?
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: StrangeShape on Apr 05, 2014, 05:52:34 PM
Well shes obviously hanging off of something, the script and obannon and.cartwright said she was stuffed to a vent so ill go by that. Alien by all admissions was an insectal animal focused on.survivall and fascinated by such things as blinking light,, not some space Gacy
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Darwinsgirl on Apr 05, 2014, 06:35:12 PM
Quote from: Flight Officer Lambert on Apr 05, 2014, 04:04:50 PM
Quote from: Valaquen on Apr 05, 2014, 03:26:52 PM
Quote from: Xhan on Apr 05, 2014, 03:10:51 AM
Quote from: Elmazalman on Apr 05, 2014, 12:29:01 AM
Quote from: Xhan on Apr 04, 2014, 11:46:49 PM


As for her body, she is literally jammed into the bulkhead access lip, just like Parker was. What you see is her leg hanging in space off of it. Where Parker got jammed into the side, Lambert is on the top of the other hallway.


Parker wasn't jammed into anything.He's up against a wall not far from the doorway,cross-legged and slumped over, with his brains leaking into his lap.

Might wanna check his height again, cause he's not at ground level.

(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi104.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fm191%2FIzzys88%2FAliens%2Fpicture042.jpg&hash=00305e920cea623a47ab38911501b15cd9e71c8d)

He's killed when held up, yeah. Body is on the floor though.

Really cool picture Valaquen!  :)

I've never seen that pic before...is it from an article? I don't have all the Famous Monsters or Fantastic Film mags yet..one day ;)
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Apr 05, 2014, 07:49:40 PM
Quote from: Valaquen on Apr 05, 2014, 03:26:52 PM
Quote from: Xhan on Apr 05, 2014, 03:10:51 AM
Quote from: Elmazalman on Apr 05, 2014, 12:29:01 AM
Quote from: Xhan on Apr 04, 2014, 11:46:49 PM


As for her body, she is literally jammed into the bulkhead access lip, just like Parker was. What you see is her leg hanging in space off of it. Where Parker got jammed into the side, Lambert is on the top of the other hallway.


Parker wasn't jammed into anything.He's up against a wall not far from the doorway,cross-legged and slumped over, with his brains leaking into his lap.

Might wanna check his height again, cause he's not at ground level.

(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi104.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fm191%2FIzzys88%2FAliens%2Fpicture042.jpg&hash=00305e920cea623a47ab38911501b15cd9e71c8d)

He's killed when held up, yeah. Body is on the floor though.
Yes,he's held aloft,has his skull punched then released by the Alien,his lifeless body slumps to the ground in a cross- legged position,slumped over-as Ripley finds him.If that's what Xhan was trying to say I agree with him.


Quote from: wmmvrrvrrmm on Apr 05, 2014, 01:23:39 PM
Quote from: Elmazalman on Apr 04, 2014, 10:46:06 PM
Quote from: wmmvrrvrrmm on Apr 04, 2014, 10:32:28 PM
Quote from: Elmazalman on Apr 04, 2014, 09:13:36 PM
If It is a sex organ,it would be sensitive.Impregnate lambert with what?

This is an alien creature, and Ridley had the idea the body part we assumed was a tale is an organ capable of implanting embryos into humans , but whether you want to include what Ridley didn't directly state in the movie itself is another question
I haven't heard that theory before,have you got that quote.I'd like to read it.

It's a question of piecing things together because he has only talked about it in abstract terms.

Let's see, in the original alien commentary, Ridley talked about promoting the question about whether the alien impregnated the cat, and then in the quadrilogy commentary mixed with the Blu-Ray which I had posted here the other day, Ridley talked about the implicated that Lambert had been impregnated following and the possibility that she had had her body invaded by the alien , which also to him meant a rape and this would lead to an alien humanoid that would be a version of Lambert on board the craft.

And back in Fantastic Films, he talked about the tail , or as he often referred to it, an umbilical cord, and really  "it's a long muscle with an immense tensile strength but it looks like am umbilical."

And what we see is the tail coming up between the legs of what was supposed to be Lambert (although it was borrowed from the Brett's death scene) and it would be implied that she was being raped by this body part if that was happening to Lambert in Ridley's mind.
I haven't read that magazine article in a while,but I'm sure Ridley referred to the tongue as the "umbilical cord" with immense tensile strength,NOT the tail.


Quote from: Bat Chain Puller on Apr 05, 2014, 04:18:17 PM
Whether she died of fright or not, Lambert was horribly abused before the alien left the scene. Pants, socks, shoes, gone. Pretty crazy actually. But I think that's the point.

I wonder even if Ridley filmed that aftermath shot. Looks like something a second unit might pick up. Depending on the time schedule and who was involved it may have been a slap dash effort with last minute details that didn't adhere to the original script.

There is obviously no way Lambert is squeezed into a vent or a locker in the final film.

And what she is hanging from? Perhaps tangled in wires or chains?
Another poster thought she might be slumped over a bench,but she's to high off the ground for that.It might be a unseen air vent or jammed into the rack area where the coolant bottles are stored,where that OXYGEN sign is stencilled on the wall.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: The1PerfectOrganism on Apr 05, 2014, 08:42:20 PM
Quote from: StrangeShape on Apr 05, 2014, 05:52:34 PM
Well shes obviously hanging off of something, the script and obannon and.cartwright said she was stuffed to a vent so ill go by that. Alien by all admissions was an insectal animal focused on.survivall and fascinated by such things as blinking light,, not some space Gacy

Completely disagree more than half of the film revolves around sexual fears.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: LastSurvivor92 on Apr 05, 2014, 10:05:26 PM
Quote from: Erik Lehnsherr on Apr 05, 2014, 08:42:20 PM
Quote from: StrangeShape on Apr 05, 2014, 05:52:34 PM
Well shes obviously hanging off of something, the script and obannon and.cartwright said she was stuffed to a vent so ill go by that. Alien by all admissions was an insectal animal focused on.survivall and fascinated by such things as blinking light,, not some space Gacy

Completely disagree more than half of the film revolves around sexual fears.

agreed. the Alien from the film was only inspired by the H.R. Giger and much of his art is conveyed sexually in a dark psychological way that creates fear. Its boldy implied that she was raped or sexually touched in some way by the alien. The bare legs and feet with blood dripping down them indicate that strongly. To imply otherwise is boring in my opinion. That dieing of fright idea sounds like rubbish almost as bad as the deleted crab walk. Eeekk thinking of that makes me think of an old silent 40's horror film. Those woman fainting after they see those mosnters. Yeah this is the late 70's man. Glad Ridley left it up to our imaginations. Smart man...
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: wmmvrrvrrmm on Apr 05, 2014, 10:42:12 PM
Quote from: Elmazalman on Apr 05, 2014, 07:49:40 PM

I haven't read that magazine article in a while,but I'm sure Ridley referred to the tongue as the "umbilical cord" with immense tensile strength,NOT the tail.


Well, I think that sounds a bit too abstract even for Ridley

Here is what I have gathered so far on his use of the term "Umbilical" in relation to the alien

http://alienexplorations.blogspot.co.uk/1979/12/umbilical.html (http://alienexplorations.blogspot.co.uk/1979/12/umbilical.html)
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Apr 05, 2014, 10:57:32 PM
Quote from: wmmvrrvrrmm on Apr 05, 2014, 10:42:12 PM
Quote from: Elmazalman on Apr 05, 2014, 07:49:40 PM

I haven't read that magazine article in a while,but I'm sure Ridley referred to the tongue as the "umbilical cord" with immense tensile strength,NOT the tail.


Well, I think that sounds a bit too abstract even for Ridley

Here is what I have gathered so far on his use of the term "Umbilical" in relation to the alien

http://alienexplorations.blogspot.co.uk/1979/12/umbilical.html (http://alienexplorations.blogspot.co.uk/1979/12/umbilical.html)
[/quote] The Fantastic Films article the interviewer brought up the subject of the tongue and how it had the ability to penetrate the skull and enter the brain,then Ridley referred to it as the "umbilical cord".Then I seem to remember some talk about animation of the tail and how it was fastened to a metal plate as a base,I think he said something along the lines of,it looked like a giant tentacle.I could be wrong,it's been years since i read that article,Still got the stuff all packed away but it's a pain in the backside trying to get it out.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Xhan on Apr 05, 2014, 11:11:07 PM
That's what I meant (was actually going to use that picture and this one: (https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.markta.co.uk%2Falien%2Fscreens11%2Falien_306.JPG&hash=f1709a9b60ec848fbab0820bd675635b57d282ac)

and

(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.markta.co.uk%2Falien%2Fscreens11%2Falien_286.JPG&hash=a03f52ec737bc1d273cb013a63309aa4415c854d)

and

(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.markta.co.uk%2Falien%2Fscreens11%2Falien_290.JPG&hash=99af9793020ddbf7e185ff07d3340e726e046533)

As you can see, there's A no vent, and B the cart in the shot doesn't go up to her hips, so plying her over it wouldn't produce the hanging effect to begin with, unless she was literally reduced to just legs.

We know from her screams when she dies and we can time how fast Ripley arrives (generally speaking, editing notwithstanding)

Now the heart angle may still have relevance, but she wasn't jammed into a locker or vent, cause we can see pretty cleanly there ain't one on that side.

Quoteabused

Umm no. That's the rub and the main contention, she wasn't "abused" any more than anyone else, and the insinuation that she somehow was is telling. Just because Lambert is female doesn't somehow tip some kind of invisible metric that makes the Alien "more evillerest" and the notion that it does or should is patently childish and absurd. We know for a fact Kane and Dallas were raped-fullstop, not "raped" (leer face) or "brutalized" or "savagely sexually assaulted", they were reduced to members of the phylum chordata and little else in pretty short order.

Now with the tail in place, the breathing thing makes sense, and whether the tail was also the organ by which egg morphing occurs might change the connotation slightly, but it's pretty clear from intent and Ripley's reaction that she's dead, not "ravished" or any ridiculous connotation thereof.

I don't think Lambert's fate is somehow "worse" than any other member of the Nostromo, in any kind of context, implied or otherwise, in fact if she was hyperventilating and did die of a heart attack, she pretty much had the best death possible on a sliding scale of "that sucked" to "OMFG".

Pretty sure Dallas wins the "wow, sucks to be you" award by a rather wide margin.

Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Apr 05, 2014, 11:28:07 PM
Quote from: Xhan on Apr 05, 2014, 11:11:07 PM
That's what I meant (was actually going to use that picture and this one: (https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.markta.co.uk%2Falien%2Fscreens11%2Falien_306.JPG&hash=f1709a9b60ec848fbab0820bd675635b57d282ac)

and

(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.markta.co.uk%2Falien%2Fscreens11%2Falien_286.JPG&hash=a03f52ec737bc1d273cb013a63309aa4415c854d)

and

(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.markta.co.uk%2Falien%2Fscreens11%2Falien_290.JPG&hash=99af9793020ddbf7e185ff07d3340e726e046533)

As you can see, there's A no vent, and B the cart in the shot doesn't go up to her hips, so plying her over it wouldn't produce the hanging effect to begin with, unless she was literally reduced to just legs.

We know from her screams when she dies and we can time how fast Ripley arrives (generally speaking, editing notwithstanding)

Now the heart angle may still have relevance, but she wasn't jammed into a locker, cause we can see pretty cleanly there ain't one on that side.

Quoteabused

Umm no. That's the rub and the main contention, she wasn't "abused" any more than anyone else, and the insinuation that she somehow was is telling. Just because Lambert is female doesn't somehow tip some kind of invisible metric that makes the Alien "more evillerest" and notion that it does or should is patently childish and absurd. We know for a fact Kane and Dallas were raped-fullstop, not "raped" (leer face) or "brutalized" or "savagely sexually assaulted", they were reduced to members of the phylum chordata and little else in pretty short order.

Now with the tail in place, the breathing thing makes sense, and whether the tail was also the organ by which egg morphing occurs might change the connotation slightly, but it's pretty clear from intent and Ripley's reaction that she's dead, not "ravished" or any ridiculous connotation thereof.

I don't think Lambert's fate is somehow "worse" than any other member of the Nostromo, in any kind of context, implied or otherwise, in fact if she was hyperventilating and did die of a heart attack, she pretty much had the best death possible on a sliding scale of "that sucked" to "OMFG".

Pretty sure Dallas wins the "wow, sucks to be you" award by a rather wide margin.
That last image,there's a small bench to the right off of Lambert loaded with bottles,it looks about the right hight for her corpse to be slumped over.That heart attack business,she was certainly hyperventilating as the Alien approached her.She could have begun to have a heart attack as the Alien prepared for a tongue strike.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Xhan on Apr 06, 2014, 01:19:42 AM
Except it's not in the right spot and it's too short.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: wmmvrrvrrmm on Apr 06, 2014, 01:34:15 AM
Quote from: Elmazalman on Apr 05, 2014, 10:57:32 PM
The Fantastic Films article the interviewer brought up the subject of the tongue and how it had the ability to penetrate the skull and enter the brain,then Ridley referred to it as the "umbilical cord".Then I seem to remember some talk about animation of the tail and how it was fastened to a metal plate as a base,I think he said something along the lines of,it looked like a giant tentacle.I could be wrong,it's been years since i read that article,Still got the stuff all packed away but it's a pain in the backside trying to get it out.

Well the interviewer asks about the alien's intermediate stage in an attempt to show its growth when it kills Brett, because Ridley did plan to have one before in the storyboards, but it seems that Ridley does talk about the "umbilical cord" and it just seems as if he wanted to talk about the tail as it was when it was protruding from the Alien's groin
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SiL on Apr 06, 2014, 04:19:12 AM

QuoteAs you can see, there's A no vent
Unless it's in the ceiling, which we can't see.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Apr 06, 2014, 05:41:47 AM
Quote from: Xhan on Apr 06, 2014, 01:19:42 AM
Except it's not in the right spot and it's too short.
Just spitballing some ideas here. Well,if it's a cart or a bench  it could have been moved.Lambert's body could have been draped further over the side to give clearance between the bloody foot and ship's deck.Personally i think it might be an unseen air shaft or vent she was partially stuffed into,maybe something off screen as SIL suggested.Or she was left hanging from the same hooks used for the spare space suits.


Quote from: wmmvrrvrrmm on Apr 06, 2014, 01:34:15 AM
Quote from: Elmazalman on Apr 05, 2014, 10:57:32 PM
The Fantastic Films article the interviewer brought up the subject of the tongue and how it had the ability to penetrate the skull and enter the brain,then Ridley referred to it as the "umbilical cord".Then I seem to remember some talk about animation of the tail and how it was fastened to a metal plate as a base,I think he said something along the lines of,it looked like a giant tentacle.I could be wrong,it's been years since i read that article,Still got the stuff all packed away but it's a pain in the backside trying to get it out.

Well the interviewer asks about the alien's intermediate stage in an attempt to show its growth when it kills Brett, because Ridley did plan to have one before in the storyboards, but it seems that Ridley does talk about the "umbilical cord" and it just seems as if he wanted to talk about the tail as it was when it was protruding from the Alien's groin
The tail protruding from the groin was fitted there for ease of movement and not restrict the stuntman's movements during the tail unfurling behind Brett scene.Nothing more,and was never meant to be seen on screen,despite the Jesus Christ Superstar on a crucifix  deleted sequence.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: RobThom on Apr 06, 2014, 05:55:59 AM
I dont think Alien has a weenie.
Although I suppose it could be a hidden weapon like the tongue.
Aggressively revealing itself while she's in thrall and least expects it.

He probably at least drooled on her.
I would.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Apr 06, 2014, 06:44:19 AM
Quote from: RobThom on Apr 06, 2014, 05:55:59 AM
I dont think Alien has a weenie.
Although I suppose it could be a hidden weapon like the tongue.
Aggressively revealing itself while she's in thrall and least expects it.

He probably at least drooled on her.
I would.
Let's play hide the salami with Lambert.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Xhan on Apr 06, 2014, 07:31:38 AM
Quote from: SiL on Apr 06, 2014, 04:19:12 AM

QuoteAs you can see, there's A no vent
Unless it's in the ceiling, which we can't see.

Unless her legs are suspended from her intestines, pretty unlikely.

Quote
The tail protruding from the groin was fitted there for ease of movement and not restrict the stuntman's movements during the tail unfurling behind Brett scene.Nothing more,and was never meant to be seen on screen,despite the Jesus Christ Superstar on a crucifix deleted sequence.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Vertigo on Apr 06, 2014, 08:01:25 AM
Veronica Cartwright mentioned something about being "on a meat hook" during the scene. I wonder if there's something on the ceiling that she's been suspended from.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SiL on Apr 06, 2014, 08:07:46 AM
Quote from: Xhan on Apr 06, 2014, 07:31:38 AM
Unless her legs are suspended from her intestines, pretty unlikely.
Depends on what part was jammed into the vent, but point taken.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Xhan on Apr 06, 2014, 08:18:03 AM
Quote from: Vertigo on Apr 06, 2014, 08:01:25 AM
Veronica Cartwright mentioned something about being "on a meat hook" during the scene. I wonder if there's something on the ceiling that she's been suspended from.

Suit racks are WAAAAAAY on the other side.

(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2F2.bp.blogspot.com%2F-jL78Mt8YkIA%2FT8jGmrsNB4I%2FAAAAAAAANpg%2FI2OvyBX4Vio%2Fs1600%2Falien12.jpg&hash=97b132a7d846ab0f724a2269c14d2fb83e5f8ac6)
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SiL on Apr 06, 2014, 08:27:50 AM
The reveal shot would have to be from the point of view of the cabinets in the background for those to be where Lambert ended up, wouldn't it? Seeing as she's in front of Parker relative to the camera.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Apr 06, 2014, 08:53:44 AM
Quote from: SiL on Apr 06, 2014, 08:27:50 AM
The reveal shot would have to be from the point of view of the cabinets in the background for those to be where Lambert ended up, wouldn't it? Seeing as she's in front of Parker relative to the camera.
Something like that.The doorway Ripley looks through to find their remains is the same doorway that is next to parker's corpse,because of this editing now the room looks like it has two entrances.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SiL on Apr 06, 2014, 09:08:17 AM
For Parker's corpse to be on the left of screen, the shot has to be from in the room looking at him from the reverse angle of what Xhan posted (As he gets swiped to the right of frame from that angle). And there's no reason Lambert couldn't have been taken to the other side of the room by the Alien.

Never noticed those hooks before. Sure would explain a lot.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: wmmvrrvrrmm on Apr 06, 2014, 09:33:39 AM
Quote from: Elmazalman on Apr 06, 2014, 05:41:47 AM

The tail protruding from the groin was fitted there for ease of movement and not restrict the stuntman's movements during the tail unfurling behind Brett scene.Nothing more,and was never meant to be seen on screen,despite the Jesus Christ Superstar on a crucifix  deleted sequence.

Well, when we're dealing with Ridley's imagination, so just because the reason the tail has been placed where it appears to be is for mechanical reasons, what Ridley was thinking to explain it all is not necessarily so black and white.

But still I'm trying to work out if he was calling the tail an "umbilical" all the way through the production or just for that scene
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Vepariga on Apr 06, 2014, 12:27:29 PM
I wouldnt say she was raped just killed in a suggestive way. unless the alien jammed its tail right up her,all the way. not a pretty way to go.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Apr 06, 2014, 08:32:16 PM
Quote from: SiL on Apr 06, 2014, 09:08:17 AM
For Parker's corpse to be on the left of screen, the shot has to be from in the room looking at him from the reverse angle of what Xhan posted (As he gets swiped to the right of frame from that angle). And there's no reason Lambert couldn't have been taken to the other side of the room by the Alien.

Never noticed those hooks before. Sure would explain a lot.
You can clearly see another doorway past Parker's corpse,Parker was killed near the doorway.Yet we see Ripley also at a doorway,the same doorway where the trolley is parked.From Ripley's POV it looks like across the room.This room should only have one entrance not two.If that doorway where Ripley stands is the same as the one near Parker's body,shouldn't she also be in shot ( in the background ) as the camera pans upwards to reveal Parker's corpse?
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Xhan on Apr 06, 2014, 08:38:18 PM
Quote from: wmmvrrvrrmm on Apr 06, 2014, 09:33:39 AM
Quote from: Elmazalman on Apr 06, 2014, 05:41:47 AM

The tail protruding from the groin was fitted there for ease of movement and not restrict the stuntman's movements during the tail unfurling behind Brett scene.Nothing more,and was never meant to be seen on screen,despite the Jesus Christ Superstar on a crucifix  deleted sequence.

Well, when we're dealing with Ridley's imagination, so just because the reason the tail has been placed where it appears to be is for mechanical reasons, what Ridley was thinking to explain it all is not necessarily so black and white.

But still I'm trying to work out if he was calling the tail an "umbilical" all the way through the production or just for that scene

He meant ship's umbilical see : Foss

Quotereverse

This would mean that there would be little time for "a Lambert is fine too", especially seeing as we hear how long the encounter lasted directly.

Problem though, no suit racks or coolant cart. It would also mean Ripley ran the long way through the bay, which doesn't seem to fit her sprint, and there's no coolant in the foreground towards Lambert, it's behind Parker, where it was left to begin with.

Quoteone not two

Both coolant rooms had an in and an out.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Apr 06, 2014, 08:58:17 PM
Quote from: Xhan on Apr 06, 2014, 08:38:18 PM
Quote from: wmmvrrvrrmm on Apr 06, 2014, 09:33:39 AM
Quote from: Elmazalman on Apr 06, 2014, 05:41:47 AM

The tail protruding from the groin was fitted there for ease of movement and not restrict the stuntman's movements during the tail unfurling behind Brett scene.Nothing more,and was never meant to be seen on screen,despite the Jesus Christ Superstar on a crucifix  deleted sequence.

Well, when we're dealing with Ridley's imagination, so just because the reason the tail has been placed where it appears to be is for mechanical reasons, what Ridley was thinking to explain it all is not necessarily so black and white.

But still I'm trying to work out if he was calling the tail an "umbilical" all the way through the production or just for that scene

He meant ship's umbilical see : Foss

Quotereverse

This would mean that there would be little time for "a Lambert is fine too", especially seeing as we hear how long the encounter lasted directly.

Problem though, no suit racks or coolant cart. It would also mean Ripley ran the long way through the bay, which doesn't seem to fit her sprint, and there's no coolant in the foreground towards Lambert, it's behind Parker, where it was left to begin with.

Quoteone not two

Both coolant rooms had an in and an out.
If you're referring to the room Ripley,Parker and Brett enter and find Jones in the locker,i could only see one entrance near where the coolant is stored beyond that was the area where the space suits are hanging.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: wmmvrrvrrmm on Apr 06, 2014, 09:18:08 PM
Quote from: Xhan on Apr 06, 2014, 08:38:18 PM

He meant ship's umbilical see : Foss


well Ridley was talking about the Alien's umbilical
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Xhan on Apr 06, 2014, 09:21:21 PM
He is, and he's likening it to a ship's umbilical, aka bridge aka check out some Chris Foss paintings of the time along with giger's stuff.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: wmmvrrvrrmm on Apr 06, 2014, 09:30:43 PM
Quote from: Xhan on Apr 06, 2014, 09:21:21 PM
He is, and he's likening it to a ship's umbilical, aka bridge aka check out some Chris Foss paintings of the time along with giger's stuff.


No he wasn't. You're just coming up with this wrong stuff for the sake of it
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Xhan on Apr 06, 2014, 10:58:31 PM
Yeah, he was  (https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.therpf.com%2Fattachments%2Ff45%2Fprop-store-first-look-nostromo-legend-born-born-again-part-3-foss-space-train.jpg-50245d1302259116&hash=95555139557122e981f08e2d9c72874b875d9a36) (https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.badhaven.com%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2012%2F06%2FRon_Cobb_Alien_concept_art.jpg&hash=de3e7fbaef2f957a3eafa9ecc92bfd18646069e8) (https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.markta.co.uk%2Falien%2Fscreens11%2Falien_294.JPG&hash=fcf324a7f1c1baa689ee018756e7d908fb89ecf2)
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: RobThom on Apr 07, 2014, 02:12:06 AM
Quote from: wmmvrrvrrmm on Apr 06, 2014, 09:33:39 AM
Well, when we're dealing with Ridley's imagination, so just because the reason the tail has been placed where it appears to be is for mechanical reasons, what Ridley was thinking to explain it all is not necessarily so black and white.
But still I'm trying to work out if he was calling the tail an "umbilical" all the way through the production or just for that scene

Although it was definitely mounted at the crotch as a suit, I always figured "in world" that it was just the tail curled up in a funny way. Like the way dogs can contort themselves when they curl up to sleep. Plus the Alien was "striking a pose".

Quote from: SiL on Apr 06, 2014, 09:08:17 AM
Never noticed those hooks before. Sure would explain a lot.

That is a good catch.
Although the reason for it never bothered me, I agree that suddenly provides an solid physical explanation.

We already know that TCM was Ridley's template.
So Christianson or whoever was dressing the set and hung the suits up on these hooks,
Ridley looks up see's this hook and goes "Ooh, ooh, ooh! I got an idea!"

I always did figure that it had something to do with Chainsaw just visually.
But I thought they just forced it for the visual without any particular in world function.
Throw that there was actually a hook there and for a reason other then just to hang Lambert on,
onto the giant pyramid of things big and small that make Alien one of the most well thought out, narratively justified and brilliant movies of all time.

Or it was some sort of divine intervention that everything just kept falling into place almost perfectly.
Maybe a little bit of both.



Edit: Although it still doesn't explain why he pulled her pants off.
But any reasons good enough.
I would.



Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Apr 07, 2014, 03:32:44 AM
Quote from: RobThom on Apr 07, 2014, 02:12:06 AM
Quote from: wmmvrrvrrmm on Apr 06, 2014, 09:33:39 AM
Well, when we're dealing with Ridley's imagination, so just because the reason the tail has been placed where it appears to be is for mechanical reasons, what Ridley was thinking to explain it all is not necessarily so black and white.
But still I'm trying to work out if he was calling the tail an "umbilical" all the way through the production or just for that scene

Although it was definitely mounted at the crotch as a suit, I always figured "in world" that it was just the tail curled up in a funny way. Like the way dogs can contort themselves when they curl up to sleep. Plus the Alien was "striking a pose".

Quote from: SiL on Apr 06, 2014, 09:08:17 AM
Never noticed those hooks before. Sure would explain a lot.

That is a good catch.
Although the reason for it never bothered me, I agree that suddenly provides an solid physical explanation.

We already know that TCM was Ridley's template.
So Christianson or whoever was dressing the set and hung the suits up on these hooks,
Ridley looks up see's this hook and goes "Ooh, ooh, ooh! I got an idea!"

I always did figure that it had something to do with Chainsaw just visually.
But I thought they just forced it for the visual without any particular in world function.
Throw that there was actually a hook there and for a reason other then just to hang Lambert on,
onto the giant pyramid of things big and small that make Alien one of the most well thought out, narratively justified and brilliant movies of all time.

Or it was some sort of divine intervention that everything just kept falling into place almost perfectly.
Maybe a little bit of both.



Edit: Although it still doesn't explain why he pulled her pants off.
But any reasons good enough.
I would.
Just one problem with the hook theory,as Xhan pointed out,the hooks are over the other side of the room where Parker originally was.Lambert's body was close to where she was working.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Xhan on Apr 07, 2014, 04:47:52 AM
Except she may not be hung there at all.

QuoteDefinitely

Not definitely, it was mounted that way once for a particular reason.

Quoteroom

Le ceiling un

(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.markta.co.uk%2Falien%2Fscreens11%2Falien_269.JPG&hash=a51d8fdc7b5b3b2d7c2b1da3e291e762e79259b0)

Le ceiling deux

(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.markta.co.uk%2Falien%2Fscreens11%2Falien_300.JPG&hash=f25ad587522455232b4900542069d879255fca22)

Le porte énigmatique

(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.markta.co.uk%2Falien%2Fscreens11%2Falien_276.JPG&hash=b82b23bd64903d9c1e22898ab561da361118a319)

Le chanteuse passager ahn hahn hahn

(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.markta.co.uk%2Falien%2Fscreens11%2Falien_305.JPG&hash=45b476f513a7465219d33c17cbf4096dc49e78cf)

Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SM on Apr 07, 2014, 05:06:18 AM
Parker grabs a hook from the ceiling just before attacking the Alien.

Maybe the Alien, in turn, decided to use it on Lambert.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Xhan on Apr 07, 2014, 05:21:02 AM
...


ow.

There's only metal and red in his right hand at the point of the hit, and his left is pretty much completely obscured after he sidles past the suit.

feh.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SM on Apr 07, 2014, 05:29:04 AM
You goddamn right "ow".
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Xhan on Apr 07, 2014, 05:32:12 AM
Well that would explain the pneumothorax not being hyperventilation though, with or without tail.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Apr 07, 2014, 06:19:59 AM
Just what is that red ball-like object in Parker's hand,something to do with the incinerator unit?
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SM on Apr 07, 2014, 06:45:59 AM
Ball gag for when Brett too lippy.

It had sentimental value.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Xhan on Apr 07, 2014, 06:47:51 AM
right
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Apr 07, 2014, 06:59:28 AM
Quote from: SM on Apr 07, 2014, 06:45:59 AM
Ball gag for when Brett too lippy.

It had sentimental value.
Ripley was the one with the mouth.Check out the photo gallery for the Alien Quadrilogy,and there's an image of Parker trying to jam that very same object into the Alien's mouth to avoid it's teeth.Might be a deleted scene.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SM on Apr 07, 2014, 07:14:50 AM
I know the picture but don't have it handy to have a look.

(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.alienscollection.com%2Fnosemer.jpg&hash=37d971881dca7fc749c53af59a88cb1824c69ff1)

Thought it might be red thing off the emergency helmet but I don't think the shape is quite right.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Xhan on Apr 07, 2014, 07:47:00 AM
Also too small.

Looks more like the lip of the flashlight.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: wmmvrrvrrmm on Apr 07, 2014, 10:17:47 AM
Quote from: RobThom on Apr 07, 2014, 02:12:06 AM

Although it was definitely mounted at the crotch as a suit, I always figured "in world" that it was just the tail curled up in a funny way. Like the way dogs can contort themselves when they curl up to sleep. Plus the Alien was "striking a pose".



I suppose we are still to look for Ridley's ultimate definition of the thing, but it looks as if he perceived it as a tentacle and I am viewing that perhaps  the body of the alien had having no more solidity than an octopus or squid, and then he possibly perceived the tail as a tentacle in general


Quote from: Xhan on Apr 06, 2014, 10:58:31 PM
Yeah, he was 

Put it this way, the "Umbilical" is a nick name for the muscular structure that the alien seems to have as its tail from Ridley and he wanted it to look like an umbilical cord in the way it was to be seen.

I don't think this Foss drawing would have helped them understand what he wanted when he was filming because it doesn't really look  like an umbilical cord. That ship is usually compared to a train.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: LastSurvivor92 on Apr 09, 2014, 06:59:05 PM
Quote from: SM on Apr 07, 2014, 05:06:18 AM
Parker grabs a hook from the ceiling just before attacking the Alien.

Maybe the Alien, in turn, decided to use it on Lambert.

haha that would be painful. Ouch!
Title: Re: ALIEN Rape scene
Post by: Chup@Cabra on Aug 09, 2014, 02:41:49 PM
Quote from: Fiorina 161 on Nov 04, 2007, 07:19:44 PM
Another question then... What did the alien actually rape Lambert with?

Okay, I know this is an old thread (the things you come across when you google "Alien" and forget to turn on the 'safety' filters  :D).

For my 2 cents: I don't think it was actually 'rape', in the sense that the Alien has sex with Lambert (the only thing shaped like a penis on it was its head, after all   ;D

As gruesome as it is to think about it, I think it 'simply' used its barbed tail to kill her, and that may or may not have been by way of entering her 'private parts' (this could account for the missing pants, as they were torn away in the process).

I first saw this movie when I was 15, and got to admit I'm surprised I didn't develop some kind of complex with Fear and Sex (all the pseudo Penises [Penii?] and Vagina imagery, along with the first 'nude' woman I ever saw on the big screen [Ripley stripping down to those teeny, tiny panties  :o])
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: MH-875 on Aug 09, 2014, 10:22:05 PM
In my opinion, no.  I'll ignore (other than to indicate what I'm ignoring... and thereby not really ignore it at all) the fact that the legs we see the tail go between are Harry Dean Stanton's and that the clip was part of an alternate version of his death scene.

Every time I see it I have trouble deciding where the tip of the tail ends up but I tend to side with "her back".  After this, the way the scene plays out in my mind:

After the cut, at the moment the tip of the tail touches Lambert, wherever that is, her flight response finally kicks in and she tries to bolt.  The first thing that happens is that she trips over the alien's tail and begins to scramble backwards away from it.  The alien grabs for her but is leisurely enough (it seems to be fascinated when its prey are crazed with terror) about it that it only manages to catch hold of her legs, rather, her pants.  Those come off violently enough that they take her boots with them.

Lambert gets a few more feet away, babbling/gasping incoherently the whole while, before the alien decides it has had a enough and goes in for the kill with a bite, provoking her final shriek.

That or something for which there's nothing on screen to even suggest it but presented here as another mishmash of unused ideas for her death and because it seemed disturbing when I first thought of it moments ago: Lambert does finally try to hide, now that the alien is inches away.  And for some alien reason (see what I did... oh never mind) Kane's Son "helps" her get in the much too small locker.  When she's dead the alien yanks her out, separating her from her pants in the process.

I have nothing for why she was hanging from something because I have no idea what she was hanging from.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Xenomorphine on Aug 10, 2014, 01:52:26 AM
This, again?

Short answer is, we'll probably never know, unless there's a flashback in a future film or something.

The slightly longer answer is that, while there's no deliberate proof, the way it was shot was deliberately suggestive, like it or not. You're meant to get disturbingly sexual undertones from it. Everything, from the way it lingers over her to the purposeful reinsertion (no pun intended) of Brett's feet, all the way through to the woman-in-childbirth style of weird panting noises Lambert gives (and let's not forget the heavily implied nudity after the thing has left) is supposed to make you dwell on these things. The creature is one big walking metaphor for violation and that's probably at its most obvious here.

If you want to go down the route of imagining nothing too disturbing happened, then go for it (although, I suspect Lambert would have done less hyperventilating if it was a simple death). If you want to imagine it was especially gruesome, then there's room to suspect it may even have done whatever it did to Brett/Dallas and was going to come back to collect her possibly unconscious form, which Ripley mistakenly assumes to be dead.

Neither view is wrong. It's completely up to the viewer's own personal interpretation.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: A_Sexual_Tyrannosaurus on Aug 10, 2014, 05:58:14 AM
Lets just say that the Alien raped everyone on that ship (except MAYBE Jonsey) and call it a day...
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: MH-875 on Aug 10, 2014, 08:03:17 AM
Quote from: Xenomorphine on Aug 10, 2014, 01:52:26 AM
...
The creature is one big walking metaphor for violation and that's probably at its most obvious here.
...

Quite so.  I wonder if it was intentional that the most easily unhinged and terrified character received a greater share of that symbolism.  The TC version of Brett's death always made him seem more curious than frightened before he gets the "simple" headbite ("tis but a scratch").  The alternate version has him sounding like he's suffering a heart attack from the stress of it, and his death is more brutal.  He stands and makes these helpless moaning/puffing noises just before his head is apparently partially crushed, which on some level seems worse than having a hole punched into your skull.  And then there's Dallas, who was well into losing it when the alien took him seemingly very much alive.

Most likely all a setup to make you expect Ripley's subsequent panics to result in a horrific (vs. merely unpleasant) end?  Is this a standard horror movie practice and I'm just wasting space here?

Quote from: Xenomorphine on Aug 10, 2014, 01:52:26 AM
...
If you want to imagine it was especially gruesome, then there's room to suspect it may even have done whatever it did to Brett/Dallas and was going to come back to collect her possibly unconscious form, which Ripley mistakenly assumes to be dead.
...

Interesting.  Lambert's legs are swinging.  She's hung from the chains (probably--you here them clinking, yes?) but the movement is eerie.  The alien just put her there, she's still alive, or, not so eerie, post-mortem muscle twitching.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: PsyKore on Aug 10, 2014, 10:09:12 AM
I used to think it was along the lines of rape, but now I prefer to think that the Alien just treated Lambert like meat, much the same way a predator in the wild would treat its prey, and her legs dangling after the event is like a carcass in a slaughterhouse.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: markweatherill on Oct 01, 2014, 07:36:39 PM
Has anyone seen 'Galaxy of Terror'?
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Gash on Oct 01, 2014, 08:00:47 PM
Quote from: markweatherill on Oct 01, 2014, 07:36:39 PM
Has anyone seen 'Galaxy of Terror'?

Hardly anyone.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Jango1201 on Oct 03, 2014, 01:45:12 AM
Alien is love, Alien is life?
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: markweatherill on Oct 04, 2014, 11:49:03 PM
Quote from: Gash on Oct 01, 2014, 08:00:47 PM
Quote from: markweatherill on Oct 01, 2014, 07:36:39 PM
Has anyone seen 'Galaxy of Terror'?

Hardly anyone.

but those that have...
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Eva on Oct 04, 2014, 11:55:59 PM
I'm fairly sure that I heard or read someone say, that Lambert died from fright. Whether that was Ridley, O'Bannon or someone else, I can't remember.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Born Of Cold Light on Oct 05, 2014, 12:12:46 AM
Quote from: Jango1201 on Oct 03, 2014, 01:45:12 AM
Alien is love, Alien is life?

"This is my hive."
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Inverse Effect on Oct 05, 2014, 03:40:03 AM
This thread makes me horny
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Jango1201 on Oct 06, 2014, 04:49:09 AM
You guys are the greatest  :D :D :D
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: HuDaFuK on Oct 06, 2014, 09:50:37 AM
Quote from: Eva on Oct 04, 2014, 11:55:59 PMI'm fairly sure that I heard or read someone say, that Lambert died from fright. Whether that was Ridley, O'Bannon or someone else, I can't remember.

That was the plan originally. She was going to crawl into a locker and die of fright. But given how long she's heard screaming in the film, it sounds like more than fright that's killing her.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: p1nk81cd on Oct 06, 2014, 10:30:29 AM
The topic is a horrible thought to ponder. Was she simply butchered or was there some sick perverted fate  that was left out of the script regarding Lambert's death?
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: HuDaFuK on Oct 06, 2014, 10:32:28 AM
Quote from: Mr. Runner on Oct 06, 2014, 10:30:29 AMThe topic is a horrible thought to ponder. Was she simply butchered or was there some sick perverted fate  that was left out of the script regarding Lambert's death?

No. I'm pretty sure none of the scripts ever suggested she was raped. And she went through a whole bunch of different deaths.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: p1nk81cd on Oct 06, 2014, 10:35:18 AM
Thank god for that...poor Lambert.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Omegamorph on Oct 06, 2014, 12:47:20 PM
It was an editing room decision.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Eva on Oct 06, 2014, 05:44:47 PM
Quote from: HuDaFuK on Oct 06, 2014, 09:50:37 AM
Quote from: Eva on Oct 04, 2014, 11:55:59 PMI'm fairly sure that I heard or read someone say, that Lambert died from fright. Whether that was Ridley, O'Bannon or someone else, I can't remember.

That was the plan originally. She was going to crawl into a locker and die of fright. But given how long she's heard screaming in the film, it sounds like more than fright that's killing her.

Ay, it is mentioned in the blu-ray commentary track during the actual scene. Just checked it. Cartwright confirms what you're describing, but they never filmed the locker scene. Just before it happens on screen, Ridley mentions that he imagines that she dies from having a heart attack.

As for the rape theory, there's nothing in the film to suggest that something like that actually happens. Neither does it makes sense, when you think about it. The only suggested rape scene in the film, remains Ash's attack on Ripley.

Incidently, the shot of the xeno's tale moving up Lambert's leg, is actually Harry Dean Stanton/Brett - not Veronica Cartwright. It was just inserted here because they needed a shot of psychical contact between the two and they then allowed your own imagination to fill out the blanks. :D
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: HuDaFuK on Oct 06, 2014, 06:18:03 PM
Quote from: Eva on Oct 06, 2014, 05:44:47 PMAs for the rape theory, there's nothing in the film to suggest that something like that actually happens. Neither does it makes sense, when you think about it. The only suggested rape scene in the film, remains Ash's attack on Ripley.

When people say rape, I don't they literally mean 'rape'. Just... violate horribly.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Oct 06, 2014, 08:54:01 PM
Quote from: Eva on Oct 06, 2014, 05:44:47 PM
Quote from: HuDaFuK on Oct 06, 2014, 09:50:37 AM
Quote from: Eva on Oct 04, 2014, 11:55:59 PM

As for the rape theory, there's nothing in the film to suggest that something like that actually happens. Neither does it makes sense, when you think about it. The only suggested rape scene in the film, remains Ash's attack on Ripley.


The unclothed state of the corpse would suggest otherwise.I don't think it was rape,but some sort of examination before,during or after death of Lambert by the Alien.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Darwinsgirl on Oct 19, 2014, 10:42:56 PM

Here is a scan from one of the magazines in my collection. From the title I thought it was going to mention her death scene. Its just a "teaser". In the interview she talks about the chestburster scene,how physically taxing the film was and her experiences in filming "The Birds".   

This is from Famous Monsters of Filmland #166 August 1980 for those interested. :)

(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2F8QieDdK.jpg&hash=d704ee109dfa5cd2ef056b2e45b6d59bfae25cab)
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: markweatherill on Oct 20, 2014, 05:23:28 PM
https://e621.net/post/show/543737/2014-3d-abs-alien-alien_-franchise-animated-big_br

:o :o :o
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: StrangeShape on Oct 20, 2014, 06:16:52 PM
Quote from: markweatherill on Oct 20, 2014, 05:23:28 PM
https://e621.net/post/show/543737/2014-3d-abs-alien-alien_-franchise-animated-big_br

:o :o :o

Well, the alien of the first two films does have a vagina
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Local Trouble on Oct 20, 2014, 08:13:24 PM
Why is that link not on AvPG's main page?
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Gash on Oct 21, 2014, 01:44:45 AM
The feet bother me. Alien in a onesie.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Corporal Hicks on Oct 21, 2014, 07:21:37 AM
This webpage is not available.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: HuDaFuK on Oct 21, 2014, 10:39:03 AM
I literally may never sleep again.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Inverse Effect on Oct 27, 2014, 11:49:21 AM
Well as the games expanded upon, didn't the Alien simply impale her through her butt hole through to her mouth? and when it pulled its tail out her pants ripped off too?

Or you could go with the more perverted theory that it rammed its tail into her back and forth in and out for some Alien sexual pleasure. Hmm which one.
Title: Re: ALIEN Rape scene
Post by: USCM1776 on Mar 08, 2016, 09:52:01 PM
Quote from: Fitzley on Nov 02, 2007, 07:45:36 PM
When the Alien kills Lambert...you have a shot of the tail slowly coming up between her legs. Later when Ripley finds her, you see her leg hanging there with no shoe or pants it appears. It has been said that the sequence is an allusion to rape.


Above is true but the legs with the tail between them are not actually Lamberts they are the legs of another crew member killed earlier in the film, not a mistake, just footage used due to time constraints in the editing. still i think the impression is pretty clear and leaving the mystery of the true nature of what happened makes it more terrifying. the sound editing also makes the entire sequence just chilling.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Ropley on Mar 09, 2016, 02:22:25 AM
I think it's clear the alien raped and tortured Lambert from her multiple creams and the bleeding from her legs, this to me solidifies the Alien as an intelligent malicious being,   
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: StrangeShape on Mar 12, 2016, 03:42:27 PM
Weve been over it quite few times, the alien, as an insect-animal that was even fascinated just by flashing light, wouldnt rape anybody, but the other versions of what happened to Lambert as explained by Scott, Veronica and the novelization are just as bizarre
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: The Alien Predator on Mar 12, 2016, 04:45:40 PM
Quote from: StrangeShape on Mar 12, 2016, 03:42:27 PM
Weve been over it quite few times, the alien, as an insect-animal that was even fascinated just by flashing light, wouldnt rape anybody, but the other versions of what happened to Lambert as explained by Scott, Veronica and the novelization are just as bizarre

What did Scott, Veronica and the novel say happened?
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: StrangeShape on Mar 12, 2016, 05:59:12 PM
Quote from: The Alien Predator on Mar 12, 2016, 04:45:40 PM
Quote from: StrangeShape on Mar 12, 2016, 03:42:27 PM
Weve been over it quite few times, the alien, as an insect-animal that was even fascinated just by flashing light, wouldnt rape anybody, but the other versions of what happened to Lambert as explained by Scott, Veronica and the novelization are just as bizarre

What did Scott, Veronica and the novel say happened?

Scott and Veronica said she died of a heart attack, the novelization and Obannon explained the position of her body - that she was violently being stuffed to either air shaft (according to Obannon) or locker (according to novelization)

O'Bannon: "Finally, returning to Lambert & Parker's murders, when we see the result of the creature's attack we notice that her bare legs are hung midair but we are not shown why. Well. the alien came thru the airshaft; that's where it shoved the body."
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: The Alien Predator on Mar 12, 2016, 06:05:54 PM
Quote from: StrangeShape on Mar 12, 2016, 05:59:12 PM
Quote from: The Alien Predator on Mar 12, 2016, 04:45:40 PM
Quote from: StrangeShape on Mar 12, 2016, 03:42:27 PM
Weve been over it quite few times, the alien, as an insect-animal that was even fascinated just by flashing light, wouldnt rape anybody, but the other versions of what happened to Lambert as explained by Scott, Veronica and the novelization are just as bizarre

What did Scott, Veronica and the novel say happened?

Scott and Veronica said she died of a heart attack, the novelization and Obannon explained the position of her body - that she was violently being stuffed to either air shaft (according to Obannon) or locker (according to novelization)

O'Bannon: "Finally, returning to Lambert & Parker's murders, when we see the result of the creature's attack we notice that her bare legs are hung midair but we are not shown why. Well. the alien came thru the airshaft; that's where it shoved the body."

I see, thanks for explaining it.  :)
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: THE CITY HUNTER on Mar 25, 2016, 09:40:56 PM
f**k man but how does an Alien get pleasure even though he was using its tail was Lambert alive when "if"she was getting raped.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Vermillion on Mar 26, 2016, 12:22:00 AM
Disturbing.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Ropley on Mar 28, 2016, 04:35:30 AM
Duh it raped her that is clear from the film and it's sexual themes, I don't care what Out of Shadows or anyone else says the blood is clearly dripping down from her legs.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Omegamorph on Mar 28, 2016, 11:57:21 AM
Some comments on here are far more disturbing than whatever happened to Lambert.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: 426Buddy on Mar 28, 2016, 03:08:06 PM
I would say that the death is ambiguous enough for people to make up their own minds and be just as legit as any other explanation. We'll simply never know the exact nature of her demise but thats part of why its so memorable.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Mar 30, 2016, 09:22:23 PM
I like to believe that the blood running down her legs was from a fatal head wound-a hole punched into her skull-like Parker before her,and the unclothed body the result of being stripped,either while alive,during or after death for a simple examination of the naked female form - which would fit with the Alien's curious nature towards humans.The unusual position of the body,due to being unsuccessfully made to fit into an undersized air duct.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: THE CITY HUNTER on Mar 30, 2016, 09:30:02 PM
Wait does anyone remember in Alien Isolation when the Alien kills you from behind it simply kill you by stabbing you in the chest is it some Aliens have sexual feelings or maybe it was to graphical to show on a game.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: HuDaFuK on Mar 31, 2016, 07:37:26 AM
In the 2010 AVP game, one of the Alien trophy kills was to impale the victim lengthwise with your tail, crotch to mouth.

That's kinda what I imagine might have happened to Lambert.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: StrangeShape on Mar 31, 2016, 02:29:38 PM
Quote from: HuDaFuK on Mar 31, 2016, 07:37:26 AM
In the 2010 AVP game, one of the Alien trophy kills was to impale the victim lengthwise with your tail, crotch to mouth.

That's kinda what I imagine might have happened to Lambert.

Thats why I always assumed too
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: THE CITY HUNTER on Mar 31, 2016, 07:50:38 PM
Quote from: HuDaFuK on Mar 31, 2016, 07:37:26 AM
In the 2010 AVP game, one of the Alien trophy kills was to impale the victim lengthwise with your tail, crotch to mouth.

That's kinda what I imagine might have happened to Lambert.
Wasnt it through the chest.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: future_Tarzan³ on Apr 01, 2016, 07:25:50 AM
yes he was. Oral rape was part of the inspiration
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: HuDaFuK on Apr 01, 2016, 07:41:15 AM
Quote from: THE CITY HUNTER on Mar 31, 2016, 07:50:38 PMWasnt it through the chest.

There were a bunch of different ones, the one I'm thinking of was definitely impaled longitudinally, coming out of the mouth.

That game was f*cking grim when you think about it :laugh:
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Corporal Hicks on Apr 01, 2016, 07:46:56 AM


About 50 seconds in.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Olde on Apr 01, 2016, 07:46:30 PM
Quote from: Ropley on Mar 09, 2016, 02:22:25 AM
I think it's clear the alien raped and tortured Lambert from her multiple creams...
Hot.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: 426Buddy on Apr 01, 2016, 08:03:48 PM
Those stealth kills were just plain cool, to bad they killed the MP.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Kaltes on May 27, 2016, 07:00:48 PM
Given the fact the movie is filled with sexual assault imagery and symbolism (and given what we see of the aftermath) I'd say yes.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Gash on Jun 06, 2016, 04:45:26 PM
A lot of people seem to get hung up on the idea, (that they dislike) of the alien get sexual pleasure out of this rape. I've always seen it as a violation, horrifying and a sexual assault from Lambert's perspective, but from the alien just as sort of rythmic examination that was a too violent for Lambert to survive.

But yeah, the imagery is all there throughout the film, and the tail between the legs, and the jolt reaction from Lambert, all suggest that basically she was sexually violated to death. I'd call that rape, but others seem to require an alien penis and alien sexual pleasure to be part of the 'rape' scenario.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Jun 06, 2016, 08:50:07 PM
Too bad Ridley Scott never shot Lambert's final moments.It would have been the most horrific moment in the film-easily surpassing the chestburster imo.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Gash on Jun 07, 2016, 12:53:29 AM
I think it is the most disturbing part of the film because you only hear it and see Ripley's reaction to the aftermath.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Kaltes on Jun 07, 2016, 03:22:25 AM
Quote from: Gash on Jun 07, 2016, 12:53:29 AM
I think it is the most disturbing part of the film because you only hear it and see Ripley's reaction to the aftermath.

I agree, the implication and Lambert's screams of agony along with the Alien's shriek without seeing a thing made it incredibly effective.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Jun 07, 2016, 05:42:30 AM
Quote from: Gash on Jun 07, 2016, 12:53:29 AM
I think it is the most disturbing part of the film because you only hear it and see Ripley's reaction to the aftermath.
It is disturbing because you see nothing but hear it and the imagination fills in the blanks,just saying If it was filmed (effectively enough) it still could have had the potential to be the film's strongest moment.

I agree, the implication and Lambert's screams of agony along with the Alien's shriek without seeing a thing made it incredibly effective.
[/quote] The Alien's shriek?It sounded like Lambert was doing all the shrieking followed by a weird sucking sound which could have been the Alien,followed by a final scream which definitely was Lambert.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Gash on Jun 07, 2016, 06:37:07 AM
Some will insist that the sounds are all Lambert. I've always felt that part of that audio was the alien.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Jun 07, 2016, 06:49:49 AM
Quote from: Gash on Jun 07, 2016, 06:37:07 AM
Some will insist that the sounds are all Lambert. I've always felt that part of that audio was the alien.
I believe this also-but which part of the audio was the Alien is still unclear.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: HuDaFuK on Jun 07, 2016, 09:43:54 AM
I still wish they'd gone with/been able to film the original idea of Lambert getting sucked out piecemeal through a tiny hole in the ship's hull. That could've been horrific if directed with a little more class than Resurrection did it.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Adam802 on Jun 30, 2016, 04:14:03 AM
Yeah, I always believed(and still do) that the Alien raped Lambert to some degree at least.  I always imagined the Alien in the 1st film to have some level of intelligent "sexual-deviancy" to it in a creepy way.  Made it even more scary and horrific. 
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Kaltes on Jun 30, 2016, 05:06:26 AM
Quote from: Adam802 on Jun 30, 2016, 04:14:03 AM
I always imagined the Alien in the 1st film to have some level of intelligent "sexual-deviancy" to it in a creepy way.  Made it even more scary and horrific.

Agreed. Part of the reason why I think of the first Alien as being the only time I've found the Xenomorph legitimately unnerving.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Jul 02, 2016, 08:57:50 PM
(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimgur.com%2F1VrgABt.jpg&hash=955882a0de4fb12c3a2b38c1e634f1684f99495d)

Could this be what Lambert was dangling from?
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Corporal Hicks on Jul 03, 2016, 08:05:42 AM
It'd have to be near Parker's resting place. Probably somewhere closer to the door.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Jul 03, 2016, 08:29:37 AM
(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimgur.com%2FABe74P3.jpg&hash=f21a1b1e8688a2736f5bb375f641bca0d861c917)

From the contact sheet.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Corporal Hicks on Jul 03, 2016, 09:49:14 AM
I'm sorry, I can't really see anything in that.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SiL on Jul 03, 2016, 10:01:02 AM
There are hooks that spare suits are hanging off over where Parker is.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Corporal Hicks on Jul 03, 2016, 10:10:40 AM
Fair enough. Struggling to see that myself. Even then, those hooks could be elsewhere in the room. Sorry, I think it's just the picture you posted in the Best Non-Alien pics thread made it look like they were quite close together and it always seemed to me that Parker was knocked across the room, away from Lambert's position. That's not to say that the Alien couldn't have moved either of them.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SiL on Jul 03, 2016, 10:17:15 AM
I can't see it in that image, but watch the scene and you'll see the hanging suits and the empty hooks.

EDIT

Just checked on YouTube, can't see empty hooks but there's suits aplenty.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Jul 03, 2016, 01:48:47 PM
Quote from: Corporal Hicks on Jul 03, 2016, 09:49:14 AM
I'm sorry, I can't really see anything in that.
I couldn't get the image any larger.Lambert looks further away than in the film.Perhaps the camera angle or the lens used made them look closer.


Quote from: Elmazalman on Jul 03, 2016, 08:29:37 AM
(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimgur.com%2FABe74P3.jpg&hash=f21a1b1e8688a2736f5bb375f641bca0d861c917)

From the contact sheet.
(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimgur.com%2FF25H2Zn.jpg&hash=8f642c2520ab8fd5db4faf6a204f32f2768278ae)

Going by the contact sheet image i attempted to match the positions of the bodies in the same (redressed) locker room set.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: YouHaveMySympahties on Sep 04, 2020, 12:32:36 PM
Apologies for the thread necromancy, but I felt the want to reply because I honestly can't believe that there are people who think the Xenomorph didn't inflict sexual violence on Lambert. The alien totally raped Lambert. Scott has gone on record many times as saying that the film is an allegory for sexual violence and bodily invasion. The facehugger itself rapes Kane.

I don't know why people seem to want to find a disconnect between a director with a mission statement of conveying sexual violence through the film's imagery, and what is quite obviously intended to be a sexually violent death for Lambert. I mean for God's sake, let's just look at the editing. The tail slithers up between her (Brett's) legs before she suddenly convulses, and then we hear very long and drawn out shudders/shrieks, as if she is struggling to breath through considerable exertion. They're the sorts of sounds a woman makes when she's pushing a baby out of her womb.

I think the implication is pretty clear that the alien is forcing its tail up her vagina. I'm not saying Scott had the idea right from the offset. We all know that isn't true. But I think it's obvious that he saw an opportunity to add an extra dimension of sexual horror to her death scene, through the insertion of the footage of the tail slithering up between Brett's legs. And then of course, when we cut back to the scene of all the carnage, Lambert's pants have been torn off and there's blood pretty clearly running down the length of her legs.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Sep 04, 2020, 09:56:56 PM
Quote from: YouHaveMySympahties on Sep 04, 2020, 12:32:36 PM
Apologies for the thread necromancy, but I felt the want to reply because I honestly can't believe that there are people who think the Xenomorph didn't inflict sexual violence on Lambert. The alien totally raped Lambert. Scott has gone on record many times as saying that the film is an allegory for sexual violence and bodily invasion. The facehugger itself rapes Kane.

I don't know why people seem to want to find a disconnect between a director with a mission statement of conveying sexual violence through the film's imagery, and what is quite obviously intended to be a sexually violent death for Lambert. I mean for God's sake, let's just look at the editing. The tail slithers up between her (Brett's) legs before she suddenly convulses, and then we hear very long and drawn out shudders/shrieks, as if she is struggling to breath through considerable exertion. They're the sorts of sounds a woman makes when she's pushing a baby out of her womb.

I think the implication is pretty clear that the alien is forcing its tail up her vagina. I'm not saying Scott had the idea right from the offset. We all know that isn't true. But I think it's obvious that he saw an opportunity to add an extra dimension of sexual horror to her death scene, through the insertion of the footage of the tail slithering up between Brett's legs. And then of course, when we cut back to the scene of all the carnage, Lambert's pants have been torn off and there's blood pretty clearly running down the length of her legs.
All that's implied is that something unusual and horrific (compared to the previous victims) happened.

The body was partially or completely stripped of clothing, the blood running down the bare legs and pooling under her mangled foot could be from a head wound (head bite), instead of her nether regions.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SM on Sep 04, 2020, 10:14:42 PM
What he said ^.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Huggs on Sep 04, 2020, 10:36:28 PM
Went up the bottom and out the mouth.

As it were.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: kwisatz on Sep 04, 2020, 10:41:33 PM
That a 'No'?


Spoiler
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/proxy/eSHz81LNKH0tnYeSmuKwbvIjWp_Qam9xypKmP1mb74K78I7ddwQm7Qv2zd1HCZC2JrgFV8VJtWpaTAHrW4p53pTvXP4sCa_030PNofo-qnZr4KKim_K1qnkJnfFjfIvFi9qOgpJ4rdDaVmPhStd_Wru02ZED0qr73U5ada3l9aRrJsvXcsDrIiUWQkd7ElgXT-RLBS4eyNkAtYYn)
[close]

Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: razeak on Sep 05, 2020, 01:56:14 AM
I think it's implied. I'm sure someone mentioned the way the tail slowly creeps between her feet at some point in this thread.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Huggs on Sep 05, 2020, 02:17:51 AM
And the little...em..."poke"... in Covenant.

It's not so far fetched.

I believe it's also a finisher in AVP 2010
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Kimarhi on Sep 05, 2020, 02:21:37 AM
All the way through is indeed a finished in 2010. 
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Huggs on Sep 05, 2020, 03:49:08 AM
Yep. Trophy Kill.

(https://i.ytimg.com/vi/FMx_zHMq_hg/hqdefault.jpg)
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: YouHaveMySympahties on Sep 05, 2020, 07:10:37 AM
Quote from: Elmazalman on Sep 04, 2020, 09:56:56 PM
Quote from: YouHaveMySympahties on Sep 04, 2020, 12:32:36 PM
Apologies for the thread necromancy, but I felt the want to reply because I honestly can't believe that there are people who think the Xenomorph didn't inflict sexual violence on Lambert. The alien totally raped Lambert. Scott has gone on record many times as saying that the film is an allegory for sexual violence and bodily invasion. The facehugger itself rapes Kane.

I don't know why people seem to want to find a disconnect between a director with a mission statement of conveying sexual violence through the film's imagery, and what is quite obviously intended to be a sexually violent death for Lambert. I mean for God's sake, let's just look at the editing. The tail slithers up between her (Brett's) legs before she suddenly convulses, and then we hear very long and drawn out shudders/shrieks, as if she is struggling to breath through considerable exertion. They're the sorts of sounds a woman makes when she's pushing a baby out of her womb.

I think the implication is pretty clear that the alien is forcing its tail up her vagina. I'm not saying Scott had the idea right from the offset. We all know that isn't true. But I think it's obvious that he saw an opportunity to add an extra dimension of sexual horror to her death scene, through the insertion of the footage of the tail slithering up between Brett's legs. And then of course, when we cut back to the scene of all the carnage, Lambert's pants have been torn off and there's blood pretty clearly running down the length of her legs.
All that's implied is that something unusual and horrific (compared to the previous victims) happened.

The body was partially or completely stripped of clothing, the blood running down the bare legs and pooling under her mangled foot could be from a head wound (head bite), instead of her nether regions.

I guess the trousers came off because the alien couldn't work out which end was the head?  ;D

Okay so in your opinion, all of the comments that Scott has made over the years, i.e., about the sexually violent implications of the alien's life cycle, about the overtly sexual imagery of the film itself, etc., all that has no substantial bearing on Scott's obviously very deliberate choice to insert an otherwise seemingly random shot of the tail slithering up between Brett's legs, right in the middle of Lambert's very agonising death scene, and just before we hear her babbling and panting through what sounds like a physically exhausting and painful act, and with the alien finally roaring - something it most certainly doesn't do when in the process of headbiting Brett or Parker. I mean just look at the amount of time it takes for Lambert to actually stop screaming. The ordeal last for about 15 seconds. The other headbites in this movie are a pretty unceremonious affair lol.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Kradan on Sep 05, 2020, 10:24:43 AM
QuoteWas Lambert raped by the Alien?

Yes

Spoiler
That's what I choose to believe
[close]
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Sep 05, 2020, 12:36:09 PM
Quote from: YouHaveMySympahties on Sep 05, 2020, 07:10:37 AM
Quote from: Elmazalman on Sep 04, 2020, 09:56:56 PM
Quote from: YouHaveMySympahties on Sep 04, 2020, 12:32:36 PM
Apologies for the thread necromancy, but I felt the want to reply because I honestly can't believe that there are people who think the Xenomorph didn't inflict sexual violence on Lambert. The alien totally raped Lambert. Scott has gone on record many times as saying that the film is an allegory for sexual violence and bodily invasion. The facehugger itself rapes Kane.

I don't know why people seem to want to find a disconnect between a director with a mission statement of conveying sexual violence through the film's imagery, and what is quite obviously intended to be a sexually violent death for Lambert. I mean for God's sake, let's just look at the editing. The tail slithers up between her (Brett's) legs before she suddenly convulses, and then we hear very long and drawn out shudders/shrieks, as if she is struggling to breath through considerable exertion. They're the sorts of sounds a woman makes when she's pushing a baby out of her womb.

I think the implication is pretty clear that the alien is forcing its tail up her vagina. I'm not saying Scott had the idea right from the offset. We all know that isn't true. But I think it's obvious that he saw an opportunity to add an extra dimension of sexual horror to her death scene, through the insertion of the footage of the tail slithering up between Brett's legs. And then of course, when we cut back to the scene of all the carnage, Lambert's pants have been torn off and there's blood pretty clearly running down the length of her legs.
All that's implied is that something unusual and horrific (compared to the previous victims) happened.

The body was partially or completely stripped of clothing, the blood running down the bare legs and pooling under her mangled foot could be from a head wound (head bite), instead of her nether regions.

I guess the trousers came off because the alien couldn't work out which end was the head?  ;D

Okay so in your opinion, all of the comments that Scott has made over the years, i.e., about the sexually violent implications of the alien's life cycle, about the overtly sexual imagery of the film itself, etc., all that has no substantial bearing on Scott's obviously very deliberate choice to insert an otherwise seemingly random shot of the tail slithering up between Brett's legs, right in the middle of Lambert's very agonising death scene, and just before we hear her babbling and panting through what sounds like a physically exhausting and painful act, and with the alien finally roaring - something it most certainly doesn't do when in the process of headbiting Brett or Parker. I mean just look at the amount of time it takes for Lambert to actually stop screaming. The ordeal last for about 15 seconds. The other headbites in this movie are a pretty unceremonious affair lol.
The Alien roars? There was a fair bit of screaming coming from Parker before he died.

The Alien's tail rose up between her parted legs and drove its barbed point into her back, between the shoulder blades. Where is this vaginal intrusion implied later in the death scene? The dripping blood? The blood running down her legs may have come from a fatal head wound.

In an edited shot, Lambert narrowly missed being head bitten first (distracted by Parker, the Alien turned on him instead).

Spoiler
(https://i.postimg.cc/g2vX7XBz/Screen-Shot-2020-09-05-at-9-08-17-pm.png)
[close]

The unclothed body could've been the result of a simple examination by the creature and nothing more - she was the first female it encountered in its adult form. It sensed immediately that she was different, even ignoring Parker in its curiosity.

Victims missing articles of clothing is not unusual. Dallas lost his jacket and a shoe when found by Ripley in the Alien's nest.

If the creature really did enjoy the ladies, why didn't it show the same interest in Ripley after she stripped down, instead of waiting for her to put on that hot, stuffy space suit - and (also) lining her up for a head bite instead of rogering her with its erect tail?   
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: 426Buddy on Sep 05, 2020, 02:43:28 PM
I always took the sexual violence of the scene as sorta subtext. Regarding what actually happens in that scene, I think Elmazalman covers it pretty well in his post above.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: son_of_kane on Sep 05, 2020, 04:07:04 PM
For me, the deaths of Lambert and Parker are the most distressing in the entire series. It's left to the viewer's imagination what actually happens to Lambert which makes it all the more horrifying. I think Dan O Bannon said "this is going to be a film about inter-species rape". So maybe the Alien did rape Lambert. As to why it didn't try to rape Ripley, maybe its sexual appetite had been quelled for the time being. Maybe it didn't particularly "enjoy" violating Lambert. Who knows what the hell it was thinking?
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Its_Auto on Sep 05, 2020, 11:43:49 PM
[Disclaimer: As this is a 45 page thread I am unsure if I have already shared this thought some time ago, so apologies if this is a reiteration.. but hear it goes]

I think the Alien needed a female host to reproduce in the absence of an egg laying queen, and thus was curious about Lambert. It had tried to eggmorph Dallas and Brett.. For arguments sake, let's assume those were 'duds' /non viable eggs. It keys in on Lambert, it senses she is different.. But not *quite* what is needed... It "enters" and "explores" her insides to find she is missing what is required (ovaries) on account of her being transgender. This is why Ripley is not immediately attacked on the shuttle. She is too important.

Evidence to back this up throughout the series: In Alien 3, the superhugger attacks Newt first, though as she has not yet hit puberty, it moves on to Ripley. It doesn't attempt to impregnate Hicks despite him being a large strong individual. In Prometheus, black goo causes mutation in organisms, but in Shaw causes growth of what we can describe as a proto-hugger, and forms the basis of David's experiments. In Alien Covenant, Shaws ovaries are removed and used to create Ovomorphs. In H R Gigers original art showing the fate of the Jocky, the image is framed by his interpretation of Nuit, the Egyptian goddess of the night. From her stomach is where we see the eggs originating.

I put it forward that a viable eggmorph can only be achieved from a female host - a queen however can lay viable eggs.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SiL on Sep 05, 2020, 11:56:16 PM
Kind of a few holes:

Why would the Alien not perform exploratory actions on Dallas and Brett?

Brett's egg seemed to be developing just fine. If it were a dud, why would it not check Dallas to not repeat the mistake?

How can it even detect human ovaries? Specifically, ones that are developed enough to ovulate -- human females are born with all the eggs they'll ever have in their life, they don't appear at puberty.

Facehuggers don't care about age or sex. Newt was closest, Ripley the next closest. The dog was male.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Sep 05, 2020, 11:59:28 PM
If Ripley is so "important", why did the Alien almost head bite her?
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Its_Auto on Sep 06, 2020, 12:39:53 AM
Quote from: SiL on Sep 05, 2020, 11:56:16 PM
Kind of a few holes:

Why would the Alien not perform exploratory actions on Dallas and Brett?

Brett's egg seemed to be developing just fine. If it were a dud, why would it not check Dallas to not repeat the mistake?

How can it even detect human ovaries? Specifically, ones that are developed enough to ovulate -- human females are born with all the eggs they'll ever have in their life, they don't appear at puberty.

Facehuggers don't care about age or sex. Newt was closest, Ripley the next closest. The dog was male.

Good questions! Firstly, it's entirely possible that it *did* check Dallas and Brett once it had them - certain species of parasitoid wasps will repeatedly 'stab' potential hosts *after* they are cocooned to check if they are suitable.

As for how a xenomorph would differentiate male from female hosts - it may use olfactory signals (chemical cues) many species rely on contact cues in reproduction - it may have had to physically touch with its tail to assess.

The dog, in this case wouldn't have mattered, as a queen embryo was already laid in a suitible host for its developmental requirements - the runner was a simple drone, any host was suitable. :-)

Theres also peer reviewed papers that conclude that certain parasitoid species have a sex bias when it comes to hosts - this was one of the first ones to pop up on google where female hosts are actively pursued:
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3823929/
Why does the Alien attempt to head munch Ripley if she is so important? Same reason the runner frantically attempts to attack Ripley whilst she is carrying its future after molten lead is poured on it - self preservation.

As I say, it's just a personal theory, though Prometheus and Covenant have since heavily played into it, especially David's drawings 😊
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SiL on Sep 06, 2020, 03:48:44 AM
Quote from: Its_Auto on Sep 06, 2020, 12:39:53 AM
Good questions! Firstly, it's entirely possible that it *did* check Dallas and Brett once it had them - certain species of parasitoid wasps will repeatedly 'stab' potential hosts *after* they are cocooned to check if they are suitable.
If it found out they were unsuitable, why continue the process -- twice?

Why check Lambert first?

QuoteTheres also peer reviewed papers that conclude that certain parasitoid species have a sex bias when it comes to hosts - this was one of the first ones to pop up on google where female hosts are actively pursued:
The Alien consistently shows no such bias, though. You say it's the presence of ovaries, then say they specifically have to be developed enough for ovulation -- why? Shaw was sterile, but the goo still worked its magic.

More importantly, the study is about a parasitic insect which has a very specific host species. It's not able to determine sex outside of that species, as the study shows. The Alien doesn't have this limit. (EDIT -- that said thanks for linking that article, that is super interesting to read!)

And if you listen to the Strauss Brothers (why would you?), the PredAlien was a juvenile Queen -- born from a male.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SM on Sep 07, 2020, 01:35:53 AM
...or was it?
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Corporal Hicks on Sep 07, 2020, 08:06:48 AM
Also I don't believe Lambert was transgender. I maybe off in the exact wording of the crew bio, but wasn't in something along the lines of gender re-assignment in utero. That reads more like designer baby kind of stuff so I take that to mean she would have had ovaries.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SM on Sep 07, 2020, 08:25:35 AM
It says "at birth".

I've never considered it canonical personally.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Corporal Hicks on Sep 07, 2020, 09:47:21 AM
Quote from: SM on Sep 07, 2020, 08:25:35 AM
It says "at birth".

My mistake. Fair enough!

Quote from: SM on Sep 07, 2020, 08:25:35 AM
I've never considered it canonical personally.

Yeah, it's nearly impossible to read the read the majority of them on the actual film.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Weyland yutani brazilian on Mar 05, 2021, 09:23:44 PM
No she sucked into space like the newborn at the end of alien resurrection
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Immortan Jonesy on Mar 05, 2021, 10:47:42 PM
The what?  :laugh:
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: [cancerblack] on Mar 05, 2021, 11:36:27 PM
Quote from: Immortan Jonesy on Mar 05, 2021, 10:47:42 PM
The what?  :laugh:

THE BLOODSUCKING ALIEN!
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: TNF on Apr 06, 2021, 02:09:15 AM
Quote from: Weyland yutani brazilian on Mar 05, 2021, 09:23:44 PM
No she sucked into space like the newborn at the end of alien resurrection
I don't remember hearing the decompression alarms going off...
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: HuDaFuK on Apr 06, 2021, 08:29:54 AM
That was her original planned death - sucked into space piecemeal through a (very small) hole melted in the hull by the Alien's blood. But when they realised they didn't have the effects technology to pull it off, they scrapped the idea.

Don't really see what relevance it has to the Alien raping her argument though.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: BigDaddyJohn on Apr 06, 2021, 10:34:01 AM
There are definitely some sexual undertones in that scene, like in the whole movie.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: TNF on Apr 06, 2021, 03:21:57 PM
Quote from: BigDaddyJohn on Apr 06, 2021, 10:34:01 AM
There are definitely some sexual undertones in that scene, like in the whole movie.
It only works for me if I overlook the tennis shoes.  ;)
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Inverse Effect on Apr 16, 2021, 06:41:18 AM
Quote from: Elmazalman on Sep 04, 2020, 09:56:56 PM
Quote from: YouHaveMySympahties on Sep 04, 2020, 12:32:36 PM
Apologies for the thread necromancy, but I felt the want to reply because I honestly can't believe that there are people who think the Xenomorph didn't inflict sexual violence on Lambert. The alien totally raped Lambert. Scott has gone on record many times as saying that the film is an allegory for sexual violence and bodily invasion. The facehugger itself rapes Kane.

I don't know why people seem to want to find a disconnect between a director with a mission statement of conveying sexual violence through the film's imagery, and what is quite obviously intended to be a sexually violent death for Lambert. I mean for God's sake, let's just look at the editing. The tail slithers up between her (Brett's) legs before she suddenly convulses, and then we hear very long and drawn out shudders/shrieks, as if she is struggling to breath through considerable exertion. They're the sorts of sounds a woman makes when she's pushing a baby out of her womb.

I think the implication is pretty clear that the alien is forcing its tail up her vagina. I'm not saying Scott had the idea right from the offset. We all know that isn't true. But I think it's obvious that he saw an opportunity to add an extra dimension of sexual horror to her death scene, through the insertion of the footage of the tail slithering up between Brett's legs. And then of course, when we cut back to the scene of all the carnage, Lambert's pants have been torn off and there's blood pretty clearly running down the length of her legs.
All that's implied is that something unusual and horrific (compared to the previous victims) happened.

The body was partially or completely stripped of clothing, the blood running down the bare legs and pooling under her mangled foot could be from a head wound (head bite), instead of her nether regions.

I like to think its doing a vlad the impailer style kill, shoving it's tail up her ass and through her mouth. Even the games have the xenomorpth doing kills like this on humans. And then she was inpailed.through a pipe
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SM on Apr 16, 2021, 08:41:27 AM
Never got that impression based on her screams.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SiL on Apr 16, 2021, 08:45:25 AM
And the lack of blood and gore on/around her feet.

More likely the Alien did to her with its tail what what it originally did to Brett -- pulled her closer.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SM on Apr 16, 2021, 08:55:08 AM
Stabbed in the back would explain the ragged breathing.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SiL on Apr 16, 2021, 08:58:18 AM
The piercing scream at the end wouldn't be possible with a pierced lung.

Which I only know because of Christopher Lee educating Peter Jackson on what sound a person makes when they're stabbed in the back from his WWII experiences during the making of LOTR.

I mean sure it could've stabbed lower, but there's no sign she was gutted like a fish.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: BigDaddyJohn on Apr 16, 2021, 10:12:02 AM
Was the alien responsible also for the twisted toe ? Very important question  ;D
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: HuDaFuK on Apr 16, 2021, 10:42:34 AM
Quote from: SiL on Apr 16, 2021, 08:58:18 AMWhich I only know because of Christopher Lee educating Peter Jackson on what sound a person makes when they're stabbed in the back from his WWII experiences during the making of LOTR.

I don't know if "great" is the appropriate word to describe it, but that story's great. Christopher Lee was such a legend.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Apr 16, 2021, 11:16:49 AM
Quote from: SiL on Apr 16, 2021, 08:45:25 AM
And the lack of blood and gore on/around her feet.

More likely the Alien did to her with its tail what what it originally did to Brett -- pulled her closer.
There's a decent amount of blood pooling under her mangled foot. Most of it passing through the grating of the ship's deck plates.

Parker lost a fair amount too. There's a large patch of blood soaking into the kneecap area of his pants.
Always been curious about the rivulets of blood on his arm(s). What caused this? Did the blood spray out in all directions when his head was smashed in, or could the blood be damage from the Alien's talons when grappling with it?
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SM on Apr 16, 2021, 11:37:25 AM
Lots of blood and water spraying everywhere spreading it around,
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SiL on Apr 16, 2021, 12:48:20 PM
Quote from: Elmazalman on Apr 16, 2021, 11:16:49 AM
There's a decent amount of blood pooling under her mangled foot. Most of it passing through the grating of the ship's deck plates.
Her intestines wouldn't slip through the grating, which you'd expect to see with half the eviscerations suggested.

Quote from: SM on Apr 16, 2021, 11:37:25 AM
Lots of blood and water spraying everywhere spreading it around,
Head wounds bleed like a mother trucker.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Apr 16, 2021, 01:15:40 PM
Quote from: SiL on Apr 16, 2021, 12:48:20 PM
Quote from: Elmazalman on Apr 16, 2021, 11:16:49 AM
There's a decent amount of blood pooling under her mangled foot. Most of it passing through the grating of the ship's deck plates.
Her intestines wouldn't slip through the grating, which you'd expect to see with half the eviscerations suggested.

Quote from: SM on Apr 16, 2021, 11:37:25 AM
Lots of blood and water spraying everywhere spreading it around,
Head wounds bleed like a mother trucker.
I've never believed in the tail rape / evisceration angle for Lambert, and head wounds can get quite messy.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: BlueMarsalis79 on Apr 16, 2021, 02:34:08 PM
Considering the "screams" I'd say Lambert certainly got something different from the rest of the crew.

I'm surprised no one's asked Ridley Scott or anyone else.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: razeak on Apr 16, 2021, 03:04:59 PM
Quote from: HuDaFuK on Apr 16, 2021, 10:42:34 AM
Quote from: SiL on Apr 16, 2021, 08:58:18 AMWhich I only know because of Christopher Lee educating Peter Jackson on what sound a person makes when they're stabbed in the back from his WWII experiences during the making of LOTR.

I don't know if "great" is the appropriate word to describe it, but that story's great. Christopher Lee was such a legend.

Great is correct in this usage lol. I'm sure he was talking about stabbing Nazis. On the flip side, the Wermacht was not the same as the SS and there is a lot more nuance to what happened to the German regular army in WWII. It's all a terrible blight on world history.


As for evisceration, I never felt like she was gutted, but I do think its implied the Alien used it's tail to kill her, probably by piercing her back or up through the bottom.  The movie is about sexual horror and violence, so it's very probable.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: BlueMarsalis79 on Apr 16, 2021, 03:34:45 PM
It always sounded more like choking, or gurgling to me, than screaming until the end of the noises.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: BigDaddyJohn on Apr 16, 2021, 05:31:09 PM
I agree, though it was probably not that thinked through. Most likely they thought it sounded horrific (which it does) thus suiting the scene fine.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Huggs on Apr 16, 2021, 07:18:26 PM
Quote from: Trash Queen on Apr 16, 2021, 03:34:45 PM
It always sounded more like choking, or gurgling to me, than screaming until the end of the noises.

I thought that was the alien making weird alien noises.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: [cancerblack] on Apr 16, 2021, 09:11:32 PM
Reminder:


(https://i.imgur.com/vbQES0B.jpg)
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SiL on Apr 16, 2021, 09:14:54 PM
Quote from: Trash Queen on Apr 16, 2021, 02:34:08 PM
Considering the "screams" I'd say Lambert certainly got something different from the rest of the crew.

I'm surprised no one's asked Ridley Scott or anyone else.
http://alienexplorations.blogspot.com/2015/03/death-switcharounds.html?m=1

They did. Answer: "f**k knows, something rapey?"
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: BlueMarsalis79 on Apr 16, 2021, 09:20:42 PM
Thank you, so my assumption's roughly correct then.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SiL on Apr 16, 2021, 09:22:33 PM
Cartwright was really pissed she didn't get to die in a locker.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Huggs on Apr 16, 2021, 09:31:12 PM
Didn't ripley have to go up one floor to reach the bridge, after she found the bodies?
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SiL on Apr 16, 2021, 09:45:03 PM
Yes, which might have been an error as I thought the locker was on C deck, not B.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Inverse Effect on Apr 18, 2021, 12:49:06 AM
Alien impaled her  ;D :D ;D

Only way to double confirm is to either ask Ridley and/or ask the original script writers and ask their opinion on how they wrote her death.

But like to think, the alien, while Lambert was paralyzed with fear. The Alien got it's tail, and either rammed it's tail through her ass into her mouth, or eh.. and/or, through her vagina through her mouth aka Vlad the Impaler style. Which alot of the games etc seem to suggest.



(Sorry for the crude terms, but these movies are for adults)




Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Apr 18, 2021, 03:32:49 AM
In the editing for the sequence, it was decided to best leave Lambert's death to the imagination: they didn't have the material to show Lambert's heart attack, hiding in the storage locker.

There's no 'right' or 'wrong' answer to what exactly happened to Lambert. Her final moments will always be a mystery. Good.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Immortan Jonesy on Apr 18, 2021, 04:06:49 AM
A very dirty imagination   :-X

(https://s4.gifyu.com/images/monophy.gif)
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: BigDaddyJohn on Apr 18, 2021, 10:11:48 AM
And sometimes the best thing possible.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: BlueMarsalis79 on Apr 18, 2021, 02:44:58 PM
Indeed it is especially when it concerns horror.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Immortan Jonesy on Apr 18, 2021, 03:54:56 PM
(https://i.ibb.co/sbfTxnm/5666d1.jpg)
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: TNF on Apr 18, 2021, 05:41:37 PM
Quote from: Guts on Apr 18, 2021, 12:49:06 AM
Alien impaled her  ;D :D ;D

Only way to double confirm is to either ask Ridley and/or ask the original script writers and ask their opinion on how they wrote her death.

But like to think, the alien, while Lambert was paralyzed with fear. The Alien got it's tail, and either rammed it's tail through her ass into her mouth, or eh.. and/or, through her vagina through her mouth aka Vlad the Impaler style. Which alot of the games etc seem to suggest.



(Sorry for the crude terms, but these movies are for adults)
That you imagined such a graphic death shows the value in Scott's choice of editing it ambiguously.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Huggs on Apr 18, 2021, 11:00:28 PM
Don't forget the dislocated toe.

That sh*t hurts.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Corporal Hicks on Apr 19, 2021, 08:10:37 AM
Quote from: Elmazalman on Apr 18, 2021, 03:32:49 AM
In the editing for the sequence, it was decided to best leave Lambert's death to the imagination: they didn't have the material to show Lambert's heart attack, hiding in the storage locker.

There's no 'right' or 'wrong' answer to what exactly happened to Lambert. Her final moments will always be a mystery. Good.

I would have really liked if the heart attack concept had been shot. Think that could have been really interesting.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SiL on Apr 19, 2021, 08:12:34 AM
But then we wouldn't have her iconic screams.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Corporal Hicks on Apr 19, 2021, 08:24:37 AM
I'm willing to accept that. There's just something about the idea of literally being scared to death that I think is amazing.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: HuDaFuK on Apr 19, 2021, 08:25:57 AM
I was never keen on the idea of her dying of fright. Seemed like an anti-climax.

The one I wish we'd got is the Newborn-style death, because that would've been horrific.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: BlueMarsalis79 on Apr 19, 2021, 08:36:56 AM
And pure unadulterated schlock.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: HuDaFuK on Apr 19, 2021, 08:37:38 AM
I'd argue Alien's partly that already.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Apr 19, 2021, 08:48:19 AM
I like what we got - even if it's offscreen.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: BlueMarsalis79 on Apr 19, 2021, 08:48:36 AM
Quote from: HuDaFuK on Apr 19, 2021, 08:37:38 AM
I'd argue Alien's partly that already.

That explains a lot. 😶

But seriously it only works in Resurrection because that's already the place that film lives in, and the added dynamic of the shifting emotions, from disgust to pity.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SiL on Apr 19, 2021, 08:48:53 AM
Quote from: HuDaFuK on Apr 19, 2021, 08:25:57 AM
I was never keen on the idea of her dying of fright. Seemed like an anti-climax.

The one I wish we'd got is the Newborn-style death, because that would've been horrific.
That was Parker's fate. Well, Hunter's.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: razeak on Apr 20, 2021, 01:29:15 AM
I like to imagine the alien very gently gripped her toe and psychically told Lambert "Let me show you a little something to take your mind off the pain." Ala Major Payne.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SM on Apr 20, 2021, 04:11:57 AM
Quote from: Corporal Hicks on Apr 19, 2021, 08:24:37 AM
I'm willing to accept that. There's just something about the idea of literally being scared to death that I think is amazing.

There is.

Very difficult to portray on screen though.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Immortan Jonesy on Apr 20, 2021, 05:20:04 AM
I definitely prefer the heart attack.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: HuDaFuK on Apr 20, 2021, 08:47:46 AM
Quote from: Trash Queen on Apr 19, 2021, 08:48:36 AMBut seriously it only works in Resurrection because that's already the place that film lives in, and the added dynamic of the shifting emotions, from disgust to pity.

I'm not suggesting transplanting the Newborn's death directly into the first movie. But the same demise played less gratuitously and more horrifically would've been chilling imo.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: BigDaddyJohn on Apr 20, 2021, 10:29:51 AM
The idea is interesting but I'm fine with what we got.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: dave1978 on Apr 20, 2021, 11:17:05 AM
I highly doubt it,  Lambert was, at the time prior to the prequels the first female human contact the Alien had ever had and without prior knowledge of human anatomy would find things difficult.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: razeak on Apr 20, 2021, 12:14:04 PM
in that case it could be argued it was exploring that anatomy in the scene.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Kradan on Apr 20, 2021, 06:08:25 PM
There definetly was some amount of curiosity in Big Chap, yeah
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: BigDaddyJohn on Apr 20, 2021, 08:32:23 PM
Yep nothing wrong with exploring things. In his very own way.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Marc505 on Apr 21, 2021, 08:08:03 PM
Kin hell, the early pages of this thread from years ago are a lovely read, aren't they.

I'm "happy" with what we got, the ambiguity adds to the horror, for me. Even if the end result was a product of mashed together editing from Brett's death it has led to years of discussion which must be satisfying for a film maker.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: [cancerblack] on Apr 21, 2021, 11:11:16 PM
Quote from: Marc505 on Apr 21, 2021, 08:08:03 PM
Kin hell, the early pages of this thread from years ago are a lovely read, aren't they.

I'm "happy" with what we got, the ambiguity adds to the horror, for me. Even if the end result was a product of mashed together editing from Brett's death it has led to years of discussion which must be satisfying for a film maker.


Loving all the internet tough guy posts from The Diesel.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SM on Apr 21, 2021, 11:22:46 PM
He'd just punch the Alien in the face, then a roundhouse.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: kwisatz on Apr 21, 2021, 11:47:37 PM
If it weren't for the sexual ambiguity, he would rape the Alien.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: [cancerblack] on Apr 22, 2021, 12:41:13 AM
QuoteIf I was on that ship with my kids, it wouldn't have went down like it did. There would have been a lot of acid blood on C deck and then me saying, 'OK, we're going to land somewhere safely, don't worry'.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Inverse Effect on Apr 22, 2021, 01:40:15 AM
It could have pinned her onto something and then repeatedly thrusted her with its tail.  :o :o :o
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: [cancerblack] on Apr 22, 2021, 01:42:58 AM
You seem very interested in the exact details.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: BlueMarsalis79 on Apr 22, 2021, 02:20:05 AM
No kidding...
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: TNF on Apr 22, 2021, 02:54:57 AM
Big "Chap" was equipped (https://thenostromofilesblog.files.wordpress.com/2021/04/alien-costume-sex-organs-close-up.png) to play either side?
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: kwisatz on Apr 22, 2021, 03:34:27 AM
He thought Ripley was finally giving in to temptation when she grasped the harpoon gun. 
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: BlueMarsalis79 on Apr 22, 2021, 08:36:09 AM
Ay lmao
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: BigDaddyJohn on Apr 22, 2021, 10:29:50 AM
Now the sexual undertones are undertones no more.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Marc505 on Apr 23, 2021, 10:08:45 PM
Quote from: [cancerblack] on Apr 21, 2021, 11:11:16 PM
Quote from: Marc505 on Apr 21, 2021, 08:08:03 PM
Kin hell, the early pages of this thread from years ago are a lovely read, aren't they.

I'm "happy" with what we got, the ambiguity adds to the horror, for me. Even if the end result was a product of mashed together editing from Brett's death it has led to years of discussion which must be satisfying for a film maker.


Loving all the internet tough guy posts from The Diesel.

Proper ten men is Diesel! Fair play to him though, maybe he really would put up a decent fight against a creature that had just been shown to crush a man's head with its bare hands, who knows!
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: BlueMarsalis79 on Apr 23, 2021, 10:20:54 PM
Please quote I'm too lazy to go look
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: BigDaddyJohn on Apr 23, 2021, 11:08:25 PM
Quote from: The Diesel on Nov 16, 2007, 05:35:03 AM
Quote from: PredatorBruth on Nov 15, 2007, 01:13:23 PM
Quote from: The Diesel on Nov 15, 2007, 08:02:11 AM
Quote from: gameoverman on Nov 15, 2007, 07:55:56 AM
Quote from: The Diesel on Nov 15, 2007, 07:53:26 AM
Quote from: gameoverman on Nov 15, 2007, 07:49:47 AM
Quote from: wolfboy on Nov 15, 2007, 07:46:04 AM
I found that entire scene retarded. Lambert just stands there and gets killed.

It isn't retarded, it's science.  The fight or flight response is known to activate in all animals depending on circumstances.  With Lambert, it was an unfortunate case that it made her petrified with fear, so much so that she was like completely paralysed.  This was also part of her character.
Lambert was a dumbass. 

No you are the dumbass.  ::)  Honestly, the alien had blocked her exit anyway - there was no where she was going anywhere.  And she was too scared to fight the alien.
I would have ran like Carl Lewis as soon as I saw the thing..  You stand there, you're a dumbass.  She could have moved and Parker could have toasted it extra-crispy. 

Thats east to say, unless your actually in that situation, i bet in th situation you would probably to scared to do anythin, and if ya run you could prokoke it so she didnt no what it could do.
First off, I wouldn't have been on that damn ship unless I had a gun.  I would have slept with it.  You never know what the f**k is out there in space.  So I would have shot the hell out of the thing the first chance I got.  I probably would have killed the whole crew in the process but so what.  I don't want an eight-foot douchebag with a tongue that could split my head open having his way with me.  Better to kill it or die trying.

Secondly, I do a lot of jogging.  I jog over two miles everyday and lift a lot of heavy weights.  I have had dogs try to attack me while I was jogging.  I didn't have my gun with me so I had to improvise by stopping to pick up some rocks and bust the mutherf**kers in the head.  That's the kind of person I am.  My fight-or-flight is kill or be killed.  If I was in a confined space with no gun and something approaching I would have had to make a run for it or improvise with something.  Not stand there like a dear caught in headlights.

This is pure gold.

PS : I lift weights, did street workout, boxing for many years. I'm pretty sure I'd shit my pants any day.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: BlueMarsalis79 on Apr 23, 2021, 11:28:36 PM
Wish we had more morons like that here like the old days.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: razeak on Apr 24, 2021, 03:40:29 AM
It's like the morons that think Tyson could KO a gorilla. Until 2019 I ran a lot morenthan that dude did, boxed and wrestled for years. It ain't happening.
Title: Re: weird thing in alien
Post by: Kradan on Apr 24, 2021, 05:34:11 AM
Quote from: BigDaddyJohn on Apr 23, 2021, 11:08:25 PM
Quote from: The Diesel on Nov 16, 2007, 05:35:03 AM
Quote from: PredatorBruth on Nov 15, 2007, 01:13:23 PM
Quote from: The Diesel on Nov 15, 2007, 08:02:11 AM
Quote from: gameoverman on Nov 15, 2007, 07:55:56 AM
Quote from: The Diesel on Nov 15, 2007, 07:53:26 AM
Quote from: gameoverman on Nov 15, 2007, 07:49:47 AM
Quote from: wolfboy on Nov 15, 2007, 07:46:04 AM
I found that entire scene retarded. Lambert just stands there and gets killed.

It isn't retarded, it's science.  The fight or flight response is known to activate in all animals depending on circumstances.  With Lambert, it was an unfortunate case that it made her petrified with fear, so much so that she was like completely paralysed.  This was also part of her character.
Lambert was a dumbass. 

No you are the dumbass.  ::)  Honestly, the alien had blocked her exit anyway - there was no where she was going anywhere.  And she was too scared to fight the alien.
I would have ran like Carl Lewis as soon as I saw the thing..  You stand there, you're a dumbass.  She could have moved and Parker could have toasted it extra-crispy. 

Thats east to say, unless your actually in that situation, i bet in th situation you would probably to scared to do anythin, and if ya run you could prokoke it so she didnt no what it could do.
First off, I wouldn't have been on that damn ship unless I had a gun.  I would have slept with it.  You never know what the f**k is out there in space.  So I would have shot the hell out of the thing the first chance I got.  I probably would have killed the whole crew in the process but so what.  I don't want an eight-foot douchebag with a tongue that could split my head open having his way with me.  Better to kill it or die trying.

Secondly, I do a lot of jogging.  I jog over two miles everyday and lift a lot of heavy weights.  I have had dogs try to attack me while I was jogging.  I didn't have my gun with me so I had to improvise by stopping to pick up some rocks and bust the mutherf**kers in the head.  That's the kind of person I am.  My fight-or-flight is kill or be killed.  If I was in a confined space with no gun and something approaching I would have had to make a run for it or improvise with something.  Not stand there like a dear caught in headlights.

This is pure gold.

PS : I lift weights, did street workout, boxing for many years. I'm pretty sure I'd shit my pants any day.

OMG  :D :D :D :D
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: razeak on Apr 24, 2021, 05:39:15 PM
i mean yeah, die trying and all that, but the funny thing is when you read that guy's words, its clear he thinks he can take on a xeno barehanded lol.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: BigDaddyJohn on Apr 24, 2021, 06:09:35 PM
I don't wanna drift away further from the topic, but I'll just say I dug up a bit on his older posts and actually found photos of him, for those who are interested to see the man, the G, the legend.  ;)
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: [cancerblack] on Apr 24, 2021, 07:53:39 PM
Quote from: BigDaddyJohn on Apr 24, 2021, 06:09:35 PM
I don't wanna drift away further from the topic, but I'll just say I dug up a bit on his older posts and actually found photos of him, for those who are interested to see the man, the G, the legend.  ;)

Hmmm. Overgrown fratboy.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: BlueMarsalis79 on Apr 24, 2021, 10:18:38 PM
As expected.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: City Hunter Yautja on Jul 08, 2021, 02:55:39 AM
Well the entire life cycle of the Xenomorphis steeped in sexual overtones and undertones. The Facehugger acts like well you know.. turning our mouths into well.. you know. The chestburster is  distortion of a fetus and baby, and so the adult Xeno killing Lambart in this way is a full circle of the reproductive and sexual cycle in its darkest and most distorted vision.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Huggs on Jul 09, 2021, 04:44:08 AM
Quote from: City Hunter Yautja on Jul 08, 2021, 02:55:39 AM
Well the entire life cycle of the Xenomorphis steeped in sexual overtones and undertones. The Facehugger acts like well you know.. turning our mouths into well.. you know.

Don't be afraid to talk dirty.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Kradan on Jul 09, 2021, 06:37:00 AM
f**kholes ...f**kholes everywhere

(https://www.meme-arsenal.com/memes/fd68f5d2345f5290472e0b835df2f985.jpg)
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: City Hunter Yautja on Jul 09, 2021, 09:54:35 PM
Quote from: Huggs on Jul 09, 2021, 04:44:08 AM
Quote from: City Hunter Yautja on Jul 08, 2021, 02:55:39 AM
Well the entire life cycle of the Xenomorphis steeped in sexual overtones and undertones. The Facehugger acts like well you know.. turning our mouths into well.. you know.

Don't be afraid to talk dirty.

Dare I share what I envisioned Chappy did to Lambart?
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Huggs on Jul 10, 2021, 06:40:53 PM
I think kradan beat you too it.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: City Hunter Yautja on Jul 10, 2021, 06:45:51 PM
Quote from: Huggs on Jul 10, 2021, 06:40:53 PM
I think kradan beat you too it.

Then I shall refrain.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Huggs on Jul 10, 2021, 07:42:13 PM
Twas ribbed, but NOT for her pleasure.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: City Hunter Yautja on Jul 10, 2021, 08:09:54 PM
I picture Chappy using its tail to enter the sanctum (private area), raise her in air, that's the sounds we hear of Lambert making as it tears her all the way into her lower abdomen, and then after such torture when she screams its when the Xeno uses its tongue to bite into her forehead.

Was that close to Kardan's description?

Suffice to say the imagination is always worse than seeing something.  :-X  :o
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: judge death on Jul 10, 2021, 09:50:23 PM
Like the one above, this is how I always imagine it doing to lambert but slower:

https://youtu.be/Ini2zcqqlCk?t=115
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Inverse Effect on Jul 11, 2021, 03:18:59 AM
Alien is just one big sexual innuendo, i mean it's head was originally shaped like a penis intentionally.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: City Hunter Yautja on Jul 11, 2021, 03:46:15 AM
Quote from: Guts on Jul 11, 2021, 03:18:59 AM
Alien is just one big sexual innuendo, i mean it's head was originally shaped like a penis intentionally.

The actress who played Lambart said that when the chestburster came out of Kane, she said it looked like a penis to her. So even with design changes, the inference is still there.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: [cancerblack] on Jul 11, 2021, 09:06:14 PM
Quote from: City Hunter Yautja on Jul 10, 2021, 08:09:54 PM
I picture Chappy using its tail to enter the sanctum (private area), raise her in air, that's the sounds we hear of Lambert making as it tears her all the way into her lower abdomen, and then after such torture when she screams its when the Xeno uses its tongue to bite into her forehead.

Was that close to Kardan's description?

Suffice to say the imagination is always worse than seeing something.  :-X  :o


Today, I will remind them:


(https://i.imgur.com/vbQES0B.jpg)
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: PAS Spinelli on Sep 10, 2021, 01:22:08 AM
I'm pretty sure one of the 2010 Alien Stealth Kills is a reference to this, it has the tail going up the back of the victim and then coming out through the mouth.
https://youtu.be/krAyZBzYt98?t=168
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: BigDaddyJohn on Sep 10, 2021, 09:58:53 AM
Stealth kills, the main fun thing for me in this otherwise disappointing game...
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: City Hunter Yautja on Sep 19, 2021, 03:49:14 PM
Quote from: [cancerblack] on Jul 11, 2021, 09:06:14 PM
Quote from: City Hunter Yautja on Jul 10, 2021, 08:09:54 PM
I picture Chappy using its tail to enter the sanctum (private area), raise her in air, that's the sounds we hear of Lambert making as it tears her all the way into her lower abdomen, and then after such torture when she screams its when the Xeno uses its tongue to bite into her forehead.

Was that close to Kardan's description?

Suffice to say the imagination is always worse than seeing something.  :-X  :o


Today, I will remind them:


(https://i.imgur.com/vbQES0B.jpg)

ROFL the Xenomorph is like "everyone is afrsid of me, but I'm just passionate lover. My kisses cause death, but that's not my fault." XD
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: bobby brown on Sep 20, 2021, 08:33:54 AM
Lambert wasn't raped by the alien.

There, Close thread.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: BishopWantsIt on Sep 20, 2021, 09:22:30 AM
I think it was just a way of making the scene more disturbing, playing on the sexual innuendoes of the Alien. People getting killed by a monster is a bad thing but seeing an elongated, wet, sharp thing crawling between a person's legs is sure to make viewers uncomfortable.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: bobby brown on Sep 20, 2021, 02:52:18 PM
Do you know who actually WAS raped?
Kane.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Huggs on Sep 20, 2021, 10:05:02 PM
Quote from: bobby brown on Sep 20, 2021, 02:52:18 PM
Do you know who actually WAS raped?
Kane.

And ASH was alone with him for a long time too.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: City Hunter Yautja on Sep 21, 2021, 11:31:37 PM
Quote from: bobby brown on Sep 20, 2021, 02:52:18 PM
Do you know who actually WAS raped?
Kane.

True. Kane was mouth fracked.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Inverse Effect on Sep 26, 2021, 12:44:08 AM
Ever thought the reason why she was hanging or dangling is she tried to vault or climb over something just as the alien killed her?
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SiL on Sep 26, 2021, 01:19:44 AM
There was nothing to climb on. She's hanging from a hook.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Sep 26, 2021, 04:42:18 AM
Quote from: Inverse Effect on Sep 26, 2021, 12:44:08 AM
Ever thought the reason why she was hanging or dangling is she tried to vault or climb over something just as the alien killed her?
She was rooted to the spot in terror. Too frightened to move, let alone climb anything. When the thing embraced her (offscreen), it had her in a tight grip - tight enough to mangle her big toe - and anything else that wasn't revealed onscreen.

She was either partially stuffed into an opening in the wall (air vent / duct) or hanging from one of the hooks (used for hanging the spacesuits in the room).
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: City Hunter Yautja on Oct 10, 2021, 05:24:30 AM
Quote from: SiL on Sep 26, 2021, 01:19:44 AM
There was nothing to climb on. She's hanging from a hook.

I'll never look at the sentence, "I'm hooked" the same way again.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Huggs on Oct 18, 2021, 03:01:14 AM
She's either on a hook or stuffed in a nook. Either way, all it took was one look and Ripley booked.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Samhain13 on Oct 18, 2021, 03:03:48 AM
It sure gave Ripley some good motivation to run.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Omegamorph on Oct 22, 2021, 12:40:56 AM
On the "literal story" layer of the movie, no she wasn't - no strict indication of it. However, it IS suggestive of rape on a storytelling/metaphor layer and was very likely an intentional choice in the editing room
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: [cancerblack] on Oct 22, 2021, 08:07:00 AM
Today, I will remind them:

(https://i.imgur.com/vbQES0B.jpg)
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Oct 23, 2021, 12:38:51 PM
Alien's murder manual.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: xeno_alpha_07 on Oct 23, 2021, 12:58:02 PM
Quote from: [cancerblack] on Oct 22, 2021, 08:07:00 AM
Today, I will remind them:

(https://i.imgur.com/vbQES0B.jpg)

That storage locker part made me think of what Dan O' Bannon said about Lambert in that scene taken from Famous Monsters of Filmland issue 159:

(https://i.ibb.co/N2Y4zQH/fmofl1.jpg)
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Kradan on Oct 23, 2021, 01:58:14 PM
Quote from: Elmazalman on Oct 23, 2021, 12:38:51 PM
Alien's murder manual.

Just what doctor ordered
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Oct 23, 2021, 02:36:31 PM
Quote from: xeno_alpha_07 on Oct 23, 2021, 12:58:02 PM
Quote from: [cancerblack] on Oct 22, 2021, 08:07:00 AM
Today, I will remind them:

(https://i.imgur.com/vbQES0B.jpg)

That storage locker part made me think of what Dan O' Bannon said about Lambert in that scene taken from Famous Monsters of Filmland issue 159:

(https://i.ibb.co/N2Y4zQH/fmofl1.jpg)

Was footage of the Alien, stuffing Lambert into the opening of an airshaft, really filmed? The article also mentions close-ups of the "box Alien" being shot.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: xeno_alpha_07 on Oct 23, 2021, 02:55:20 PM
Quote from: Elmazalman on Oct 23, 2021, 02:36:31 PM
Was footage of the Alien, stuffing Lambert into the opening of an airshaft, really filmed?

I'm not sure if I'm honest.  Nothing springs to mind article or interview-wise about that besides what Dan O' Bannon said.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Oct 23, 2021, 03:15:54 PM
Quote from: xeno_alpha_07 on Oct 23, 2021, 02:55:20 PM
Quote from: Elmazalman on Oct 23, 2021, 02:36:31 PM
Was footage of the Alien, stuffing Lambert into the opening of an airshaft, really filmed?

I'm not sure if I'm honest.  Nothing springs to mind article or interview-wise about that besides what Dan O' Bannon said.
There is something that may tie in with part of the that passage from the #159 magazine article.

A while back, I think you (or someone else) shared a portion of the liner notes from the ALIEN soundtrack album. The notes describe an earlier edit of the scenes with Parker & Lambert collecting the coolant bottles with Ripley searching for Jones on the bridge. Light strobing close-up shots of the Alien emerging from - or near to - the opening of an airshaft were originally intercut with the two sequences.

The airshaft entrance could be the same one Dallas entered earlier and was covered by Parker & Lambert?
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: xeno_alpha_07 on Oct 23, 2021, 03:31:50 PM
Quote from: Elmazalman on Oct 23, 2021, 03:15:54 PM
There is something that may tie in with part of the that passage from the #159 magazine article.

A while back, I think you (or someone else) shared a portion of the liner notes from the ALIEN soundtrack album. The notes describe an earlier edit of the scenes with Parker & Lambert collecting the coolant bottles with Ripley searching for Jones on the bridge. Light strobing close-up shots of the Alien emerging from - or near to - the opening of an airshaft were originally intercut with the two sequences.

The airshaft entrance could be the same one Dallas entered earlier and was covered by Parker & Lambert?

Ah yes, this:

(https://i.ibb.co/kmZhS54/Alien-Booklet-Inside-8.jpg)

I can't remember who it was who originally posted that.  Also, the tracker was supposed to go off while Parker & Lambert were busy with both of them not noticing it.  There is a slight shot of the camera panning to the tracker before cutting to Ripley in the film.   I also had a quick look at Terry Rawlings's editing script to see if there were any notes regarding Lambert's fate.  There isn't sadly and the script ends on Parker holding the flamethrower like a club as he enters the room.  Scene 187 & 188 for the rest of the scene are missing.  The motion tracker shot is noted in Terry's notes.

Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Oct 23, 2021, 03:56:49 PM
Quote from: xeno_alpha_07 on Oct 23, 2021, 03:31:50 PM

Ah yes, this:

(https://i.ibb.co/kmZhS54/Alien-Booklet-Inside-8.jpg)

I can't remember who it was who originally posted that.  Also, the tracker was supposed to go off while Parker & Lambert were busy with both of them not noticing it.  There is a slight shot of the camera panning to the tracker before cutting to Ripley in the film.   I also had a quick look at Terry Rawlings's editing script to see if there were any notes regarding Lambert's fate.  There isn't sadly and the script ends on Parker holding the flamethrower like a club as he enters the room.  Scene 187 & 188 for the rest of the scene are missing.  The motion tracker shot is noted in Terry's notes.
That's the one!

You mean this shot?

Spoiler
(https://i.postimg.cc/XJwyb5tL/1.jpg)
[close]

The sequence was really cut back to the bare minimum. The unused insert tracker shots, I think, would've added to the tension even more.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: xeno_alpha_07 on Oct 23, 2021, 04:26:18 PM
Quote from: Elmazalman on Oct 23, 2021, 03:56:49 PM
You mean this shot?

Spoiler
(https://i.postimg.cc/XJwyb5tL/1.jpg)
[close]


I thought it was this shot as they enter the room after Parker says the line "OK, check the bottles"  The camera moves over to focus on the tracker.  I think I got mixed up there:

Spoiler
(https://i.ibb.co/QpBnbx2/Untitled-1.jpg)
[close]

QuoteThe sequence was really cut back to the bare minimum. The unused insert tracker shots, I think, would've added to the tension even more.

Agreed.  Don't get me wrong I understand why Alien was cut and edited the way it was and to me, it works like a charm. 
But I'd still like to see the original intended graphic cut of the film that has been talked about over the years in various articles/interviews especially the deaths of both Brett & Parker.  Veronica Cartwright says in issue 158 of Famous monsters of filmland that the fronts and backs of scenes were also cut just leaving the middle segments.  I'm a sucker for deleted and alternate scenes of movies especially the Alien movies.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: BlueMarsalis79 on Oct 23, 2021, 04:48:06 PM
Agreed really wish we got an "Extended Edition" instead of that awful Marketing Cut.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Oct 23, 2021, 05:03:15 PM
Quote from: xeno_alpha_07 on Oct 23, 2021, 04:26:18 PM
Quote from: Elmazalman on Oct 23, 2021, 03:56:49 PM
You mean this shot?

Spoiler
(https://i.postimg.cc/XJwyb5tL/1.jpg)
[close]


I thought it was this shot as they enter the room after Parker says the line "OK, check the bottles"  The camera moves over to focus on the tracker.  I think I got mixed up there:

Spoiler
(https://i.ibb.co/QpBnbx2/Untitled-1.jpg)
[close]

QuoteThe sequence was really cut back to the bare minimum. The unused insert tracker shots, I think, would've added to the tension even more.

Agreed.  Don't get me wrong I understand why Alien was cut and edited the way it was and to me, it works like a charm. 
But I'd still like to see the original intended graphic cut of the film that has been talked about over the years in various articles/interviews especially the deaths of both Brett & Parker.  Veronica Cartwright says in issue 158 of Famous monsters of filmland that the fronts and backs of scenes were also cut just leaving the middle segments.  I'm a sucker for deleted and alternate scenes of movies especially the Alien movies.
I also find alternate versions of films and deleted scenes extremely interesting.

Sadly, with ALIEN, we came so close to getting an extended cut - with apparently - everything thrown in - including previously unreleased material. Then Ridley Scott viewed it and thought it was too long. Damn.

I also have the #158 issue, and remember what she said about the film's editing.

Brett and Parker's deaths have a lot of lost scenes. What I would like to see is the material leading up to their respective deaths: the start of the search for the Alien on B-Deck, before the tracker emits its signal and Ripley, Parker and Brett climb down the service ladder to C-Deck. The additional scenes of Brett searching alone for the cat and cursing it, and Ripley & Parker deciding to go back and find Brett - arriving just in time to see him taken.

The missing shots of the Alien in the garage, stalking Parker and Lambert, and the tracker insert shots sound great.

Best of all, is the alternate, too-gruesome-to-use take of the insert shot for Parker's head-bite - talked about on the first volume of the ALIEN Makers documentary.

Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: xeno_alpha_07 on Oct 23, 2021, 06:42:39 PM
Quote from: Elmazalman on Oct 23, 2021, 05:03:15 PM
Best of all, is the alternate, too-gruesome-to-use take of the insert shot for Parker's head-bite - talked about on the first volume of the ALIEN Makers documentary.

Yes, Neil Swan (RIP) I remember now.  It's been a very long time since I've watched those.  If memory serves Valaquen had a behind-the-scenes picture of the prop they used for Parker's head bite on his blog.  On the Alien Saga documentary, there is extra footage of Parker getting his head squeezed just like Brett.  The quality isn't excellent.


Quote
Sadly, with ALIEN, we came so close to getting an extended cut - with apparently - everything thrown in - including previously unreleased material. Then Ridley Scott viewed it and thought it was too long. Damn.

Such a missed opportunity there and reading that about Riddles just infuriates me.  I remember the disappointment I felt when I first saw the Director's Cut and non of the graphic footage was added back in.  Although I was still happy to see a DC of the film it just wasn't what I wanted.  I wonder if the film reel of the 2-hour rough cut still exists.  I know there is a black and white workprint in existence as the makers of the Alien collector's edition laserdisc almost used it for the deleted scenes on the special features.  Instead, they opted to use 'raw dallies' they put together from what they found instead if I am remembering that correctly.  My memory of all things Alien isn't what it once was since I took my long hiatus from it all.

Sorry for going slightly off-topic by the way.

Regarding whether Lambert was 'violated' or not I never used to think so back in the day.  Based on Dan O' Bannon's comments,  the Alan Dean Foster novel, and the screams she makes I always assumed she was being squeezed to death as the Alien tried to pull her into the vent.  The whole 'rape' thing didn't cross my mind until years later.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Oct 24, 2021, 12:27:55 AM
Quote from: xeno_alpha_07 on Oct 23, 2021, 06:42:39 PM
Such a missed opportunity there and reading that about Riddles just infuriates me.  I remember the disappointment I felt when I first saw the Director's Cut and non of the graphic footage was added back in.  Although I was still happy to see a DC of the film it just wasn't what I wanted.  I wonder if the film reel of the 2-hour rough cut still exists.  I know there is a black and white workprint in existence as the makers of the Alien collector's edition laserdisc almost used it for the deleted scenes on the special features.  Instead, they opted to use 'raw dallies' they put together from what they found instead if I am remembering that correctly.

I think that b/w early edit was used by the composer for timing purposes? I remember reading about it on Facebook. It contains an extended version of the bit where Ripley almost bumps into the Alien on her way to the shuttle. The shot of the Alien squatting in the middle of the corridor is used - and Ripley gets two peeks at the Alien, before backing away. The scene was condensed to just one quick peek and one almost subliminal shot of the creature for the final cut.

Not only did we miss out on an extended cut of ALIEN, but I remember eagerly awaiting the home video SE release of Prometheus - which would've offered an extended edit as an option - before it mysteriously vanished from the "bonus features" list.

I don't believe Lambert's final moments were of interspecies bonding. More like a quick examination of sorts, before the creature's curiosity with her was satisfied. She was rewarded with a hole in her head for her troubles.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SiL on Oct 24, 2021, 12:32:24 AM
Quote from: Elmazalman on Oct 24, 2021, 12:27:55 AM
I think that b/w early edit was used by the composer for timing purposes? I remember reading about it on Facebook
I'd love to see this just to hear Goldsmith's cue for the Parker/Lambert scene line up with the bits he added for when it cut to the Alien sneaking up on them...
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Oct 24, 2021, 12:53:11 AM
Quote from: SiL on Oct 24, 2021, 12:32:24 AM
Quote from: Elmazalman on Oct 24, 2021, 12:27:55 AM
I think that b/w early edit was used by the composer for timing purposes? I remember reading about it on Facebook
I'd love to see this just to hear Goldsmith's cue for the Parker/Lambert scene line up with the bits he added for when it cut to the Alien sneaking up on them...
Same.

You'd probably have as much chance at seeing this as you would the b/w "Lost Cut" of STAR WARS, though ...
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: xeno_alpha_07 on Oct 24, 2021, 01:20:23 AM
QuoteI think that b/w early edit was used by the composer for timing purposes? I remember reading about it on Facebook. It contains an extended version of the bit where Ripley almost bumps into the Alien on her way to the shuttle. The shot of the Alien squatting in the middle of the corridor is used - and Ripley gets two peeks at the Alien, before backing away. The scene was condensed to just one quick peek and one almost subliminal shot of the creature for the final cut.

I would love to see the Ripley glancing at the Alien scene in its entirety as well as the b/w workprint.  But as you said to SiL like the b/w SW workprint it is very unlikely sadly.  Besides the extra little snippet on the Quadrilogy/Anthology documentaries the only other known footage I've ever found of the Alien squatting in the corridor is a 9-second clip.  It was an extremely fast clip I had to slow down:

https://vimeo.com/8973812 (https://vimeo.com/8973812)

Hope the clip works.

QuoteI don't believe Lambert's final moments were of interspecies bonding. More like a quick examination of sorts, before the creature's curiosity with her was satisfied. She was rewarded with a hole in her head for her troubles.

I wonder if Lambert also got the same 'head squeezing' fate as Brett and Parker.  But I agree with you I don't think she was 'violated' just killed off like the others.  Lambert at one stage was to just die of fright in a storage locker.  If that original concept was kept in It definitely wouldn't have the same effect and impact.  The very first time I watched Alien and heard Lambert's screams like that as Ripley ran down the corridor frightened the life out of me.

Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Oct 24, 2021, 02:33:12 AM
Quote from: xeno_alpha_07 on Oct 24, 2021, 01:20:23 AM
QuoteI think that b/w early edit was used by the composer for timing purposes? I remember reading about it on Facebook. It contains an extended version of the bit where Ripley almost bumps into the Alien on her way to the shuttle. The shot of the Alien squatting in the middle of the corridor is used - and Ripley gets two peeks at the Alien, before backing away. The scene was condensed to just one quick peek and one almost subliminal shot of the creature for the final cut.

I would love to see the Ripley glancing at the Alien scene in its entirety as well as the b/w workprint.  But as you said to SiL like the b/w SW workprint it is very unlikely sadly.  Besides the extra little snippet on the Quadrilogy/Anthology documentaries the only other known footage I've ever found of the Alien squatting in the corridor is a 9-second clip.  It was an extremely fast clip I had to slow down:

https://vimeo.com/8973812 (https://vimeo.com/8973812)

Hope the clip works.

QuoteI don't believe Lambert's final moments were of interspecies bonding. More like a quick examination of sorts, before the creature's curiosity with her was satisfied. She was rewarded with a hole in her head for her troubles.

I wonder if Lambert also got the same 'head squeezing' fate as Brett and Parker.  But I agree with you I don't think she was 'violated' just killed off like the others.  Lambert at one stage was to just die of fright in a storage locker.  If that original concept was kept in It definitely wouldn't have the same effect and impact.  The very first time I watched Alien and heard Lambert's screams like that as Ripley ran down the corridor frightened the life out of me.
I remember you posted this ALIEN outtake a few years back. Thank you very much for sharing. I haven't seen this anywhere else. It should've been part of the Anthology set.  ???

No reason to think Lambert didn't get her head squeezed (offscreen) like the others. There is outtake footage of the Alien, about to deliver a head-bite to her, just before Parker intervenes, saving her life (for the moment). It's a lovely, tight head-and-shoulders shot of the creature.

I find it interesting and curios that the two "troublemakers" (as Ridley Scott refers to them), Parker & Brett, are the only characters to be seen having their brains graphically smashed onscreen. It's almost as if Ridley Scott were punishing them for being "blue-collar."  :laugh:

It's a pity the storage locker footage wasn't filmed (to my knowledge), but if it was, I doubt it would've benefited the film. What we got was much more terrifying.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SiL on Oct 24, 2021, 02:45:57 AM
Cartwright said her death was never filmed and she wasn't too happy about the fact. They told her they'd get to it later and never did.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Oct 24, 2021, 02:58:39 AM
Quote from: SiL on Oct 24, 2021, 02:45:57 AM
Cartwright said her death was never filmed and she wasn't too happy about the fact. They told her they'd get to it later and never did.
Probably for the best.

If the ability to use her legs had returned to her, after her initial shock at seeing the creature, why choose to hide in a locker, when she could've made a break for the doorway, instead - as Parker had wanted her to?
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SiL on Oct 24, 2021, 08:24:59 AM
The Alien was still next to that door to be fair
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Oct 24, 2021, 08:44:38 AM
Quote from: SiL on Oct 24, 2021, 08:24:59 AM
The Alien was still next to that door to be fair
I know. But it makes more sense than hiding in a cramped room with the thing still in it.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: xeno_alpha_07 on Oct 24, 2021, 11:47:21 AM
Quote from: Elmazalman on Oct 24, 2021, 02:33:12 AM
I remember you posted this ALIEN outtake a few years back. Thank you very much for sharing. I haven't seen this anywhere else. It should've been part of the Anthology set.  ???

I couldn't remember if I had posted that clip before sorry.  It would have been brilliant if that included that scene and various others as part of the deleted scenes for the Anthology set.  When I used to have Facebook, if memory serves,
Charles de Lauzirika mentioned while looking for negatives he found some footage for Alien that had been lost which he wanted to show Ridley but none of that footage was used for either boxset.  If I'm remembering that wrong someone please correct me  :)

QuoteNo reason to think Lambert didn't get her head squeezed (offscreen) like the others. There is outtake footage of the Alien, about to deliver a head-bite to her, just before Parker intervenes, saving her life (for the moment). It's a lovely, tight head-and-shoulders shot of the creature.

The Alien then strikes Parker into the wall before picking him up and slamming him into the wall and squeezing his head.  Again, footage that should have been added in my opinion.  Those shots of the Alien about to head bite Lambert would have also been a nice inclusion in the scene.  However, as you said what we got, in the end, was way more terrifying.

QuoteI find it interesting and curios that the two "troublemakers" (as Ridley Scott refers to them), Parker & Brett, are the only characters to be seen having their brains graphically smashed onscreen. It's almost as if Ridley Scott were punishing them for being "blue-collar."  :laugh:

I never thought of that  :D  Maybe the Alien was tired of hearing the endless complaints about the 'bonus situation'.

QuoteIt's a pity the storage locker footage wasn't filmed (to my knowledge), but if it was, I doubt it would've benefited the film. What we got was much more terrifying.

In an interview with thespectrtum.com (https://eu.thespectrum.com/story/entertainment/2018/05/14/veronica-cartwright-remembers-battling-alien/608528002/) Veronica Cartwright mentions the original storage locker plan with the Alien pulling her out of it and that she was disappointed about her death scene not being filmed as SiL mentioned.  She also mentions the meat hook.

Quote"I was a bit disappointed they never did shoot my actual death scene – I was supposed to hide in a locker and be pulled out by the alien. So all you see is the alien's tail moving up my body, which was actually Harry Dean's in the scene. Later, they filmed me hanging from a meat hook, but you just see my legs hanging down covered in blood."

I wonder if Lambert hanging from a meat hook was inspired by The Texas Chainsaw Massacre.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SiL on Oct 24, 2021, 12:14:44 PM
I wouldn't be surprised by the last part. Scott did mention it as an influence.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Oct 24, 2021, 01:46:52 PM
Quote from: xeno_alpha_07 on Oct 24, 2021, 11:47:21 AM

The Alien then strikes Parker into the wall before picking him up and slamming him into the wall and squeezing his head.  Again, footage that should have been added in my opinion.  Those shots of the Alien about to head bite Lambert would have also been a nice inclusion in the scene.  However, as you said what we got, in the end, was way more terrifying.


I wonder if Lambert hanging from a meat hook was inspired by The Texas Chainsaw Massacre.

The one deleted fragment I'd most like to see from Parker's death scene would be the shot of the Alien releasing him immediately after head-biting him. Would be a cool shot to see: a freshly killed Parker, slumping lifeless to the deck, with his brains falling into his lap, as the blood pours from the hole in his head - nasty. I wonder if there would be any 'nerve action' acting - like Kane's shaking hands after giving birth to the Chestburster?

Quote from: SiL on Oct 24, 2021, 12:14:44 PM
I wouldn't be surprised by the last part. Scott did mention it as an influence.
He screened the film for the small cast, if I remember correctly?
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: xeno_alpha_07 on Oct 24, 2021, 03:56:59 PM
QuoteThe one deleted fragment I'd most like to see from Parker's death scene would be the shot of the Alien releasing him immediately after head-biting him. Would be a cool shot to see: a freshly killed Parker, slumping lifeless to the deck, with his brains falling into his lap, as the blood pours from the hole in his head - nasty. I wonder if there would be any 'nerve action' acting - like Kane's shaking hands after giving birth to the Chestburster?

Wasn't Kane's hand-shaking ad-libbed?  I'm pretty sure it was and definitely a good idea.  I need to revisit a lot of stuff to rejig my memory a bit.  The description you gave of Parker slumping to the floor and his brains falling out is indeed nasty and gruesome, especially for that time.  Years ago I tried to contact stuntman Clive Curtis regarding his stunt work on both Alien & Aliens but never got a reply, that I can remember.  A lot of his stuntwork filmed for the Parker scene was heavily cut and cut to merely a few seconds.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: nanison on Oct 24, 2021, 07:28:57 PM
Reading all this makes me wonder if you guys are actually ok with the movie how it turned out. Would you have preferred longer shots of the alien on screen? We get quick glimpses and that was part of the mystery of the horror. Give longer shots and all you see is a man in a suit. For example the shot outside the shuttle when it gets burned. That is one shot too much imo.

I would definitely want to see it as outtakes though, very sure about that!
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: xeno_alpha_07 on Oct 24, 2021, 07:47:54 PM
Quote from: nanison on Oct 24, 2021, 07:28:57 PM
Reading all this makes me wonder if you guys are actually ok with the movie how it turned out. Would you have preferred longer shots of the alien on screen? We get quick glimpses and that was part of the mystery of the horror. Give longer shots and all you see is a man in a suit. For example, the shot outside the shuttle when it gets burned. That is one shot too much imo.

I would definitely want to see it as outtakes though, very sure about that!

Hi, nanison yes, I am very happy with how Alien turned out  :) With my love of cut scenes from the Alien movies, I'd just wish we could see how the film was originally cut together before the final edit.  It's a bit of an obsession  :D  And I fully understand Ridley's reasoning for making the edits he did.  The gore that was originally cut didn't necessarily need longer shots of the Alien itself, Brett's original graphic death for example.  It could have still been possible to include the gore without ruining the mystery of the creature.  I'd have been happy if these scenes were restored as deleted scenes for the special features.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: BlueMarsalis79 on Oct 24, 2021, 08:28:06 PM
The Theatrical Cut's perfect.

But the "Director's Cut" or more aptly titled, Marketing Cut, that's pretty much without merit.

I'd much prefer a Extended Edition.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: xeno_alpha_07 on Oct 24, 2021, 08:53:04 PM
Ridley made some questionable edits in the 'Marketing Cut', the Dallas with MU/TH/UR "What are my chances" scene being a prime example.  Why was that even removed?   ::)
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Oct 24, 2021, 09:51:32 PM
Quote from: nanison on Oct 24, 2021, 07:28:57 PM
Reading all this makes me wonder if you guys are actually ok with the movie how it turned out. Would you have preferred longer shots of the alien on screen? We get quick glimpses and that was part of the mystery of the horror. Give longer shots and all you see is a man in a suit. For example the shot outside the shuttle when it gets burned. That is one shot too much imo.

I would definitely want to see it as outtakes though, very sure about that!
The 1979 theatrical release is the ideal cut of the film ... but, loving the film as much as I do, I've got to see all the rest of the missing pieces, before I die.  :laugh:

Quote from: xeno_alpha_07 on Oct 24, 2021, 03:56:59 PM
QuoteThe one deleted fragment I'd most like to see from Parker's death scene would be the shot of the Alien releasing him immediately after head-biting him. Would be a cool shot to see: a freshly killed Parker, slumping lifeless to the deck, with his brains falling into his lap, as the blood pours from the hole in his head - nasty. I wonder if there would be any 'nerve action' acting - like Kane's shaking hands after giving birth to the Chestburster?

Wasn't Kane's hand-shaking ad-libbed?  I'm pretty sure it was and definitely a good idea.  I need to revisit a lot of stuff to rejig my memory a bit.  The description you gave of Parker slumping to the floor and his brains falling out is indeed nasty and gruesome, especially for that time.  Years ago I tried to contact stuntman Clive Curtis regarding his stunt work on both Alien & Aliens but never got a reply, that I can remember.  A lot of his stuntwork filmed for the Parker scene was heavily cut and cut to merely a few seconds.

The shaking hands are a grisly touch to an already horrific sequence. Love that sort of detail in the performance. I'm thinking of the guy's kicking foot, after blowing his brains out in The Final Conflict (1981) and Mac's death from the original Predator.

The stuntman, Clive Curtis, sounds like he's contributed some interesting cut material to the ALIEN films. Looking at ALIEN: The Illustrated Story, there's an alternate attack on Parker - he cops a facepalm instead of being tail-slapped. I'd like to know if this was filmed, or merely invented for the graphic novel?

I don't know if you own a copy of the Art Edition of the Illustrated Story, but as a bonus, there's a very interesting interview with Walt Simonson. He talks about viewing an early edit of ALIEN, that he saw in late 1978. He describes how the early edit for Brett's death scene was much longer and "horrible" and how he "boiled down" what he originally saw to what is presented in the comic adaptation.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: xeno_alpha_07 on Oct 24, 2021, 10:43:51 PM
Quote from: Elmazalman on Oct 24, 2021, 09:51:32 PM
The shaking hands are a grisly touch to an already horrific sequence. Love that sort of detail in the performance. I'm thinking of the guy's kicking foot, after blowing his brains out in The Final Conflict (1981) and Mac's death from the original Predator.

I haven't seen Omen III in years and don't remember much of the film if I'm honest so I must revisit that soon  :)  The one thing that bothers me about Mac's death is Dillon's POV shot as it zooms in on Mac you don't see any visible damage on his head from the Predators blast.

If Ridley screened The Texas Chainsaw Massacre to the cast I wonder if John Hurt got the inspiration for the twitching hands from Kirk's death.  He twitches after Leatherface strikes him on the head with a hammer.

QuoteThe stuntman, Clive Curtis, sounds like he's contributed some interesting cut material to the ALIEN films. Looking at ALIEN: The Illustrated Story, there's an alternate attack on Parker - he cops a facepalm instead of being tail-slapped. I'd like to know if this was filmed, or merely invented for the graphic novel?

Clive took part in a short podcast for Fangoria which discusses the stunts he did for Alien & Aliens: Here (https://podcasts.apple.com/gb/podcast/class-of-79-clive-curtis-alien-series/id1461769100?i=1000450143875)  It's about 28 mins long.  All that work he did and it was merely cut to ribbons.  I don't think Parker's alternate death in the Alien Illustrated story was filmed .  I believe it to be a scaled-down version of the Alien grabbing his head before the head bite.  However, I don't know for definite.

(https://i.ibb.co/hV6Twhg/2ngwfvc.jpg)

Sadly, no I don't own the Art Edition of the Illustrated Story.  I'd love to read that interview though!



Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Darwinsgirl on Oct 24, 2021, 11:40:32 PM
Clive took part in a short podcast for Fangoria which discusses the stunts he did for Alien & Aliens: Here (https://podcasts.apple.com/gb/podcast/class-of-79-clive-curtis-alien-series/id1461769100?i=1000450143875)  It's about 28 mins long.  All that work he did and it was merely cut to ribbons.  I don't think Parker's alternate death in the Alien Illustrated story was filmed .  I believe it to be a scaled-down version of the Alien grabbing his head before the head bite.  However, I don't know for definite.

(https://i.ibb.co/hV6Twhg/2ngwfvc.jpg)

Thanks for posting this it's the first time I ever heard of it.  8)

I also am going back to listen to all the 79 ALIEN podcasts they have listed!  ;D

Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: xeno_alpha_07 on Oct 24, 2021, 11:58:42 PM
I haven't checked out their other Alien podcasts yet  :). Hope you enjoy!
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Oct 25, 2021, 04:37:56 AM
Just finished listening to the podcast.

Good stuff! The only stunt shot described in any detail (from ALIEN) was the tail-slap-into-wall scene, that's available for viewing on the discs.

Sadly, the much longer and more intense fight scene between Parker and the Alien was truncated, so as not to upstage the earlier (iconic) Chestburster scene. Bummer.

Thanks for that!
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: xeno_alpha_07 on Oct 25, 2021, 05:44:30 PM
Quote from: Elmazalman on Oct 25, 2021, 04:37:56 AM
Just finished listening to the podcast.

Good stuff! The only stunt shot described in any detail (from ALIEN) was the tail-slap-into-wall scene, that's available for viewing on the discs.

Thanks for that!

Glad you liked it :)  Ever since I was a kid I've always loved and have been interested in behind the scenes/making of stuff for movies.  Even if I don't like the film I'll still watch behind-the-scenes material.

QuoteSadly, the much longer and more intense fight scene between Parker and the Alien was truncated, so as not to upstage the earlier (iconic) Chestburster scene. Bummer.

Bummer indeed  :-[ That's understandable but for me, personally, I don't think it would have.  What's your opinion on that?
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: nanison on Oct 25, 2021, 07:28:36 PM
The reason why alien and jaws are the definite monster movies is because of technical limitations. Since those limitations are a thing of the past we will never ever get a monster movie as good as either of those. After all the monster is at its scariest when it hides under your bed. When we do get to see it we need our imagination to fill in the blanks. I got to say thank God special effects were not yet perfected.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Oct 25, 2021, 11:15:05 PM
Quote from: xeno_alpha_07 on Oct 25, 2021, 05:44:30 PM
QuoteSadly, the much longer and more intense fight scene between Parker and the Alien was truncated, so as not to upstage the earlier (iconic) Chestburster scene. Bummer.

Bummer indeed  :-[ That's understandable but for me, personally, I don't think it would have.  What's your opinion on that?

I don't think it would've hurt the film to have a more graphic Parker / Alien confrontation, nor do I believe it would've taken anything away from the Chestburster scene.

Emotionally, it wouldn't hurt to see the Engineer put up more of a fight. The film's been leading towards a final confrontation between the two since his friend's death. The dude was seething with hatred and the need for payback.

Yeah, I'd like to see Parker biff the Alien a few times in the head (filmed?) (for Brett) before dying - giving him some small measure of revenge for all the grief the Alien has caused.

A more gruesome exit for the Engineer would've added some personal symmetry between the two - the Alien still holds a grudge against Parker for threatening to stab it at the dinner table.  ;D

I do like his final lines from ALIEN: The Illustrated Story: "Goddamn you Goddamn you Godda - - - " :laugh:
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: xeno_alpha_07 on Oct 26, 2021, 06:19:49 PM
QuoteI don't think it would've hurt the film to have a more graphic Parker / Alien confrontation, nor do I believe it would've taken anything away from the Chestburster scene.

Emotionally, it wouldn't hurt to see the Engineer put up more of a fight. The film's been leading towards a final confrontation between the two since his friend's death. The dude was seething with hatred and the need for payback.

Yeah, I'd like to see Parker biff the Alien a few times in the head (filmed?) (for Brett) before dying - giving him some small measure of revenge for all the grief the Alien has caused.

I remember reading somewhere in the early 2000s, an online article, that mentioned something about Parker striking the Alien a couple of times as it had him pinned against the wall.  However, I can't say for certain if that was filmed or not but I'd like to believe it was.

And I agree with everything you said there as well.

Quotethe Alien still holds a grudge against Parker for threatening to stab it at the dinner table.  ;D

:laugh: :laugh: :laugh: The Chestburster was probably saying, "I'll get you later big man" before it scrurried off.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Oct 26, 2021, 10:05:58 PM
Came across this image.

At first I thought it looked like Parker, trying to shove an object (attachment from the incinerator unit?) into the mouth of the Alien, to avoid its jaws.

(https://i.postimg.cc/Th8Nqghs/230391913-4285407598224695-3930527169505736852-n.jpg)

Notice his fist? It looks like he's punching the Alien?
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: xeno_alpha_07 on Oct 26, 2021, 10:53:51 PM
Quote from: Elmazalman on Oct 26, 2021, 10:05:58 PM
Came across this image.

At first I thought it looked like Parker, trying to shove an object (attachment from the incinerator unit?) into the mouth of the Alien, to avoid its jaws.

(https://i.postimg.cc/Th8Nqghs/230391913-4285407598224695-3930527169505736852-n.jpg)

Notice his fist? It looks like he's punching the Alien?

I forgot about that image.  Nice one  :)

In this image below if you look at Parker's right hand you can see the top of the red cylinder which I'm guessing is a fuel bottle for the incinerator unit (?)  He is holding with the string and handle that the image you posted shows.

(https://i.ibb.co/NNqqS5n/Xenomorph-Attacks-Parker.jpg)

The second image isn't the best but if you look in front of Parker it looks like the cylinder is laying in front of him(?)

(https://i.ibb.co/0s9PzJP/picture042.jpg)

So it's a possibility that shots of Parker punching the Alien could have been filmed.  I think it's safe to say him striking the Alien with the cylinder is a definite or at least using the cylinder to prevent him from getting head bitten.

***EDIT***

Just watched that scene again.  It is a fuel bottle as Parker is trying to refuel the incinerator before the Alien appears.  You can also see him holding it before grabbing a hook and charging.

(https://i.ibb.co/bJWMBcm/vlcsnap-2021-10-27-00h26m47s717.png)

Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Oct 27, 2021, 12:00:23 AM
Yes, I think it's a definite possibility.

The image of Parker, slumped over dead, is interesting in that it shows what could be bloody footprints left by the Alien?

If you own the Rinzler making-of ALIEN book, there's a variation of this image - look closely at the doorway - and you can see Ripley's face through the steam.

I came across an image once, a behind-the-scenes b/w still - a series of them (taken from a contact sheet), of the set up for the filming of the dead bodies. It shows Cartwright, wearing white shorts and bare-legged, standing on something, with Ridley Scott in front of her. Yaphet Kotto is in his sitting position, being tended to by a make-up artist?

I've tried to enlarge the image, but it's so tiny - postage stamp-sized - that it was pointless to upload it. You've probably already seen the image, but if you haven't, I could upload it for you?







Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: xeno_alpha_07 on Oct 27, 2021, 12:44:27 AM
QuoteThe image of Parker, slumped over dead, is interesting in that it shows what could be bloody footprints left by the Alien?

Either footprints or arterial spray from his head wound.  Or even both! :o Either way, it's details like that that would make that final shot more horrific as well as horrifying in my opinion.

QuoteIf you own the Rinzler making-of ALIEN book, there's a variation of this image - look closely at the doorway - and you can see Ripley's face through the steam.

The Rinzler books I don't own yet.  They are on my 'to get' list which in the next month or so I will be buying.  The last book I bought was Roger Christians 'Cinema Alchemist: Designing Star Wars and Alien' not sure if you own or have read that?

QuoteI came across an image once, a behind-the-scenes b/w still - a series of them (taken from a contact sheet), of the set up for the filming of the dead bodies. It shows Cartwright, wearing white shorts and bare-legged, standing on something, with Ridley Scott in front of her. Yaphet Kotto is in his sitting position, being tended to by a make-up artist?

I've tried to enlarge the image, but it's so tiny - postage stamp-sized - that it was pointless to upload it. You've probably already seen the image, but if you haven't, I could upload it for you?

Are those the Bob Penn contacts sheets Charles Lippincott (RIP) posted on his facebook page a while ago?  He was supposed to release a book with those contact sheets, etc in it if memory serves.  I don't have facebook anymore so I can't access them but I'd be happy if you would upload them please to loook at  :)  Thank you.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Oct 27, 2021, 01:49:00 AM
I didn't get all the contact sheets, only those that interested me. Here are the two that feature images from the filming of the 'wet stuff' found by Ripley:

(https://i.postimg.cc/1zsFVHcd/IMG-5714.jpg)

(https://i.postimg.cc/pT157tbN/18815-673509959441412-5235110995899411711-n.jpg)

I'll leave it to you to try and improve on the size of the images.

This one has a barely visible detail that can't be seen in the film:

(https://i.postimg.cc/vHnxPj0j/19225535-1734884529897567-262415333170112379-n.jpg)

What appears to be the Nostromo shoulder patch from Lambert's coat can be seen below her kneecap, and brain matter resting in Parker's lap?
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: HuDaFuK on Oct 27, 2021, 08:28:44 AM
Quote from: nanison on Oct 24, 2021, 07:28:57 PMReading all this makes me wonder if you guys are actually ok with the movie how it turned out. Would you have preferred longer shots of the alien on screen?

No, because honestly, I think it looks kinda silly when you finally see it full-on right at the very end. The test shots of Balaji walking around the ship in the suit also look kinda dumb.

They were absolutely right to keep it largely hidden the way they did.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Oct 27, 2021, 10:06:03 AM
Quote from: HuDaFuK on Oct 27, 2021, 08:28:44 AM
Quote from: nanison on Oct 24, 2021, 07:28:57 PMReading all this makes me wonder if you guys are actually ok with the movie how it turned out. Would you have preferred longer shots of the alien on screen?

No, because honestly, I think it looks kinda silly when you finally see it full-on right at the very end. The test shots of Balaji walking around the ship in the suit also look kinda dumb.

They were absolutely right to keep it largely hidden the way they did.
The tests in full costume were deemed disappointing, but I don't remember seeing any test footage released of Bolaji Badejo, wearing the suit, walking around the ship? Only the movement tests, with him wearing the mock-up Alien head, in his underwear.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: HuDaFuK on Oct 27, 2021, 10:13:31 AM
The test shots are what I'm referring to.

They look goofy imo, and I don't see how putting him in a better suit would've changed it.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Oct 27, 2021, 10:32:26 AM
Quote from: HuDaFuK on Oct 27, 2021, 10:13:31 AM
The test shots are what I'm referring to.

They look goofy imo, and I don't see how putting him in a better suit would've changed it.
I get your point about the tests looking "goofy". But he wasn't wearing any kind of suit for the movement tests - that are viewable on the DVD / BD sets.

The full costume tests of him moving about the ship's corridors haven't been released yet.

I don't understand what you mean by "putting him in a better suit"? He was in his underwear for those tests.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: xeno_alpha_07 on Oct 27, 2021, 10:46:45 AM
Quote from: Elmazalman on Oct 27, 2021, 01:49:00 AM
I didn't get all the contact sheets, only those that interested me. Here are the two that feature images from the filming of the 'wet stuff' found by Ripley:

(https://i.postimg.cc/1zsFVHcd/IMG-5714.jpg)

(https://i.postimg.cc/pT157tbN/18815-673509959441412-5235110995899411711-n.jpg)

I'll leave it to you to try and improve on the size of the images.

This one has a barely visible detail that can't be seen in the film:

(https://i.postimg.cc/vHnxPj0j/19225535-1734884529897567-262415333170112379-n.jpg)

What appears to be the Nostromo shoulder patch from Lambert's coat can be seen below her kneecap, and brain matter resting in Parker's lap?

Thank you for uploading these  :) much appreciated.  It is a shame they were never scanned into a higher resolution but I still enjoy seeing these images.  I do hope 'The Alien Diaries of Bob Penn' will still get published in the future even though Charles Lippincott sadly passed away  :'(

I'm not sure if that is the Nostromo shoulder patch below Lambert's knee cap and it's hard to make out just what that is on Parker's lap.  Could be brain matter but it's difficult to tell.

QuoteI don't understand what you mean by "putting him in a better suit"? He was in his underwear for those tests.

Maybe HuDaFuK meant putting Bolaji in the Alien suit, or something better for that test shot wouldn't have improved or made those tests look any less goofy?  Apologies if I have that incorrect.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Oct 27, 2021, 10:57:04 AM
You can find another contact sheet, with Giger working on his "Alien Dessert", in the "Best Pic of an Alien" thread.

I didn't know about the Cinema Alchemist book. Any rare pics from ALIEN, inside?
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: xeno_alpha_07 on Oct 27, 2021, 11:06:46 AM
Quote from: Elmazalman on Oct 27, 2021, 10:57:04 AM
You can find another contact sheet, with Giger working on his "Alien Dessert", in the "Best Pic of an Alien" thread.

I didn't know about the Cinema Alchemist book. Any rare pics from ALIEN, inside?

Thanks for the heads up on that.  I'll take a look at that on that thread shortly  :)  Sadly, I don't think there are any rare pics of Alien in that book.  All my Alien books and other stuff are stored in boxes at the back of a cupboard so I'll have to dig it out later on if I can and check but I'm sure there isn't. 
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SiL on Oct 27, 2021, 11:10:21 AM
Quote from: HuDaFuK on Oct 27, 2021, 08:28:44 AM
No, because honestly, I think it looks kinda silly when you finally see it full-on right at the very end.
A lot of the longer shots cut aren't full body. Lambert/Parker was full of some beautiful waist up shots.

I think the only shot that's bad is specifically when it bounces on the door. The full body shot itself isn't necessarily bad.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Oct 27, 2021, 11:20:22 AM
Quote from: SiL on Oct 27, 2021, 11:10:21 AM
Quote from: HuDaFuK on Oct 27, 2021, 08:28:44 AM
No, because honestly, I think it looks kinda silly when you finally see it full-on right at the very end.
A lot of the longer shots cut aren't full body. Lambert/Parker was full of some beautiful waist up shots.

I think the only shot that's bad is specifically when it bounces on the door. The full body shot itself isn't necessarily bad.
These are the type of shots I like best. Not so much the full body shots. Also a big fan of the close-ups of the cable-controlled heads.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: HuDaFuK on Oct 27, 2021, 12:04:54 PM
Quote from: xeno_alpha_07 on Oct 27, 2021, 10:46:45 AMMaybe HuDaFuK meant putting Bolaji in the Alien suit, or something better for that test shot wouldn't have improved or made those tests look any less goofy?  Apologies if I have that incorrect.

Yeah, this.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: xeno_alpha_07 on Oct 27, 2021, 12:52:32 PM
Quote from: Elmazalman on Oct 27, 2021, 11:20:22 AM
These are the type of shots I like best. Not so much the full body shots. Also a big fan of the close-ups of the cable-controlled heads.

The end scene just before Ripley blows the creature out of the hatch was also trimmed that featured close-up shots of the cable-controlled head.  Based on some production pictures I think the Alien originally grabbed Ripley's helmet before revealing its inner jaw (?).  It's cut to only a few seconds in the final film. You might have already seen these before so apologies if you have:

(https://i.ibb.co/r7fwSHN/2.jpg)

(https://i.ibb.co/swnykp2/3.jpg)

Three screenshots from outtake footage taken from the Alien Saga documentary:

(https://i.ibb.co/7NHr77z/THE-ALIEN-SAGA-1.jpg)

(https://i.ibb.co/W6QpkHF/THE-ALIEN-SAGA-2.jpg)

(https://i.ibb.co/X8q8GGb/THE-ALIEN-SAGA-7.jpg)

Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Oct 27, 2021, 01:27:38 PM
Yes, I've seen these before. Nice photos!

There's a side view of the scene in the CINEFEX ALIEN (1980) article. It's a b/w image.

Incidentally, watching The Thing 4K last night, and seeing the animatronic dummies set on fire, reminded me of something else from that 1980 article (by Don Shay). A similar sort of dummy was created from a life cast of Tom Skerritt and used for a shot of his twitching, burning body. I didn't think the cocoon scene was filmed in such a graphic manner.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: TC on Oct 27, 2021, 02:12:21 PM
Looking at the outtakes for the Parker/Lambert death scene, it always seemed to me that the guiding principle for the edit was whether or not the alien suffered from even the slightest taint of man-in-a-rubber-suit syndrome. If it did, it was immediately banished to the outtakes bin. Two of those shots were the crab walk shot, and the one where the alien walks to Parker on the floor having just thrown him against the wall. You can tell Bolaji was completely blind inside the suit and was feeling his way forward to find Yaphet's prone body. Even the shot that's in the final edit of an out of focus alien (in the foreground, and in silhouette) sneaking up behind Lambert looks a bit dodgy to me.

https://youtu.be/SmGzYjJYvU4 (https://youtu.be/SmGzYjJYvU4)

The final shot of the alien outside the Narcissus, however--I think they made the right choice of including the full shot of the alien. By the end of the film I feel like they owed me a revealing look at the entire creature.

TC
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Oct 27, 2021, 02:52:08 PM
Quote from: TC on Oct 27, 2021, 02:12:21 PM
Looking at the outtakes for the Parker/Lambert death scene, it always seemed to me that the guiding principle for the edit was whether or not the alien suffered from even the slightest taint of man-in-a-rubber-suit syndrome. If it did, it was immediately banished to the outtakes bin. Two of those shots were the crab walk shot, and the one where the alien walks to Parker on the floor having just thrown him against the wall. You can tell Bolaji was completely blind inside the suit and was feeling his way forward to find Yaphet's prone body. Even the shot that's in the final edit of an out of focus alien (in the foreground, and in silhouette) sneaking up behind Lambert looks a bit dodgy to me.

https://youtu.be/SmGzYjJYvU4 (https://youtu.be/SmGzYjJYvU4)

The final shot of the alien outside the Narcissus, however--I think they made the right choice of including the full shot of the alien. By the end of the film I feel like they owed me a revealing look at the entire creature.

TC
Which shot seems dodgy to you? This one:

(https://i.postimg.cc/d1Z4jwZS/1.jpg)

I like that outtake of the Alien, reaching down for Parker on the deck. Thankfully, it was replaced with a much tighter shot for the final film.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: TC on Oct 27, 2021, 03:58:54 PM
Quote from: Elmazalman on Oct 27, 2021, 02:52:08 PM
Which shot seems dodgy to you?

No, in the youTube fan-extended edit I linked to, it's at 00:04 and another at 00:08, though I'm not sure if the take that's in the released film is the same as either of the ones shown there.

The thing is, just like with CG animations of people, our eye is so finely attuned to the nuance of human movement that we can easily tell when there's an actual person inside the performance.

It's the same with the test footage mentioned earlier of Bolaji creeping through the half-finished Nostromo set, and costumed in only a crude banana head and his skivvies. I think Scott could tell from that early test that there was no way he could film a full body actor walking from A to B and successfully disguise the human inside, no matter how good the suit was. If you compare all the early storyboards of what Scott thought he could achieve, with what's in the actual film, you can see that there are no shots of the alien actually ambulating anywhere—it just couldn't be done without giving the game away. I guess it's one reason why when it's pursuing Dallas in the airshafts we get to watch it moving only as electronic blips on the motion tracker. Kind of like the shark in Jaws when it's chasing the boat; it looked so hokey Spielberg decided the better option was to show us the barrels on the surface instead (being towed around by the shark).

Speaking about movement, and looking at that YouTube fan-edit again, it's interesting how the close-ups of the animatronic head only really come alive when there's additional movement in frame, such as the dribbling drool and the smoke and steam puffs being blown through frame, (and in Brett's death scene, all the rain and rivulets of water). There are outtakes in which there's none of that, and they just seem so dull.

I give it to Scott, he really knows how to dress a scene up to bring it to life. Although the strobe lights in the Ripley escape run were a bit overboard, IMO.

TC
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Oct 27, 2021, 04:29:12 PM
The shots of the silhouette of the Alien (0:04 - 0:08) coming into shot behind Lambert are from the finished film.

Agreed. All the smoke, burning incense, water, scissor arcs, shredded plastic and slime, brought the Alien and the sets to life.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: nanison on Oct 27, 2021, 04:40:21 PM
That full scene is awful to me, the movie edit is by far the best. The silhouette scene is beautiful, looks like an ancient astronaut from another world.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Oct 27, 2021, 04:52:23 PM
Quote from: nanison on Oct 27, 2021, 04:40:21 PM
That full scene is awful to me, the movie edit is by far the best. The silhouette scene is beautiful, looks like an ancient astronaut from another world.
I like the silhouette shots of the Alien, too. I also like how quick glimpses of its elbow can be seen, and the side of its head, as it moves to Lambert, as she stares down at it.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: TheBATMAN on Oct 27, 2021, 05:16:30 PM
Oh to see this iteration of the creature in the films again. The smaller, screeching cats of AVP just dont compare.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: nanison on Oct 27, 2021, 06:54:34 PM
It feels completely otherworldly that is why the film after 40 plus years still feels special. Same for the derelict with its odd design and shape. It simple has never been replicated in any other science fiction monster film.

The alien feels irrational, curious and playful. It feels like a young animal exploring its surroundings. That silhouetted walk just feels weird in a good way, it walks like the boogeyman very slow to creep you out with its arms spread so you feel you have no where to run to.
I actually think Ridley Scott was inspired by Michael Myers. The movie shares the same type of dread and Myers just acts like the alien here.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SiL on Oct 27, 2021, 07:51:37 PM
Quote from: nanison on Oct 27, 2021, 06:54:34 PM

I actually think Ridley Scott was inspired by Michael Myers. The movie shares the same type of dread and Myers just acts like the alien here.
That would be a bit difficult, since Alien wrapped filming four days before Halloween was released ;D
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: xeno_alpha_07 on Oct 27, 2021, 09:02:42 PM
QuoteThere's a side view of the scene in the CINEFEX ALIEN (1980) article. It's a b/w image.

Incidentally, watching The Thing 4K last night, and seeing the animatronic dummies set on fire, reminded me of something else from that 1980 article (by Don Shay). A similar sort of dummy was created from a life cast of Tom Skerritt and used for a shot of his twitching, burning body. I didn't think the cocoon scene was filmed in such a graphic manner.

I have the Alien: The Special Effects book stored away so I will have to revisit that article again as a lot of the contents have left my memory.  On the positive side, I get to re-soak all that information again  ;D  The Cinefex articles are a brilliant and informative source of information.

I didn't think they had filmed something that graphic for the cocoon scene either  :o  So not only did Ripley have to put someone she cared for out of their suffering she watched him twitching and burning  :o 
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Oct 27, 2021, 11:16:23 PM
The fabrication and incineration of the articulated dummy is on the last page of the Creating an Alien Ambience article. Page 43, from ALIEN: The Special Effects.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: xeno_alpha_07 on Oct 27, 2021, 11:51:11 PM
Quote from: Elmazalman on Oct 27, 2021, 11:16:23 PM
The fabrication and incineration of the articulated dummy is on the last page of the Creating an Alien Ambience article. Page 43, from ALIEN: The Special Effects.

Thank you  :). It's coming up to 1 am so will dig the book out at a later time.  I really want to read this again and other books since this discussion  :)
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: nanison on Oct 28, 2021, 12:38:32 AM
Quote from: SiL on Oct 27, 2021, 07:51:37 PM
Quote from: nanison on Oct 27, 2021, 06:54:34 PM

I actually think Ridley Scott was inspired by Michael Myers. The movie shares the same type of dread and Myers just acts like the alien here.
That would be a bit difficult, since Alien wrapped filming four days before Halloween was released ;D

Lol oh dang! Anyway I still find there's similarities. Who knows maybe Ridley knew Carpenter well and picked some things up through chatting up lol
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Darwinsgirl on Oct 28, 2021, 05:23:01 AM

Ivor Powell introduced Ridley to "Texas Chain Saw Massacre" he was very impressed with the film. He had not seen many film's along that line.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SiL on Oct 28, 2021, 06:06:31 AM
Scott said he wanted to make it Texas Chainsaw Massacre in Space.

I think in that regard he failed spectacularly (there is none of TCM's manic energy in Alien) but he did scare the shit out of some peeps that's for sure.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Oct 28, 2021, 06:18:57 AM
Quote from: SiL on Oct 28, 2021, 06:06:31 AM
Scott said he wanted to make it Texas Chainsaw Massacre in Space.

I think in that regard he failed spectacularly (there is none of TCM's manic energy in Alien) but he did scare the shit out of some peeps that's for sure.
Lambert's hysterics have nothing on Sally Hardesty's.  :D
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: TC on Oct 28, 2021, 03:39:03 PM
I've never been a horror fan. I've never really been interested in Jason or Michael Myers or Freddy Krueger. The only reason I used to pick up the occasional Famous Monsters of Filmland was because I enjoyed the makeup effects side of things: the concepts and designs, the sculpting, the mould-making and casting, the painting and application of prosthetic pieces, etc.

For me, Alien '79's appeal has always been as science fiction. I don't class it as a horror film despite the fact that it has horrific elements to it—these things are merely the result of its science fictional premise. I feel the same way about The Thing and Predator.

OTOH, Event Horizon is the other way 'round; it IS a horror film, one that uses the trappings of science fiction to tell its story about supernatural biblical Hell. For this reason I don't have much interest in the film except for its technical craftsmanship.

The Exorcist, however, is a horror exception. I enjoy it because it's simply great filmmaking and great storytelling. Horror be damned.

Texas Chainsaw Massacre I've never sat down and actually watched, beginning to end. It has a certain credibility based purely on its historical notoriety, but that's about it. The same with Night of the Living Dead.

Horror per se, interests me not at all. But when the horror is there to flavour some other genre, notably science fiction, then it can work fantastically well.

Just my .02 cents.

TC
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: razeak on Dec 29, 2021, 03:24:17 AM
Quote from: TC on Oct 28, 2021, 03:39:03 PM
I've never been a horror fan. I've never really been interested in Jason or Michael Myers or Freddy Krueger. The only reason I used to pick up the occasional Famous Monsters of Filmland was because I enjoyed the makeup effects side of things: the concepts and designs, the sculpting, the mould-making and casting, the painting and application of prosthetic pieces, etc.

For me, Alien '79's appeal has always been as science fiction. I don't class it as a horror film despite the fact that it has horrific elements to it—these things are merely the result of its science fictional premise. I feel the same way about The Thing and Predator.

OTOH, Event Horizon is the other way 'round; it IS a horror film, one that uses the trappings of science fiction to tell its story about supernatural biblical Hell. For this reason I don't have much interest in the film except for its technical craftsmanship.

The Exorcist, however, is a horror exception. I enjoy it because it's simply great filmmaking and great storytelling. Horror be damned.

Texas Chainsaw Massacre I've never sat down and actually watched, beginning to end. It has a certain credibility based purely on its historical notoriety, but that's about it. The same with Night of the Living Dead.

Horror per se, interests me not at all. But when the horror is there to flavour some other genre, notably science fiction, then it can work fantastically well.

Just my .02 cents.

TC

I think the science fiction in Alien is merely the wallpaper. I think it's a horror film through and through.  I also think that something like Jason is more of a slasher film with some horror trappings. The blending of genres and the debates are never ending though haha.  Alien Horror with sci fi elements, Aliens  Sci fi-Action-thriller with horror elements, Alien 3 Horror/Slasher/ ummmm.....fatalism? 
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Kradan on Dec 29, 2021, 06:57:52 AM
Alien 3 is drama. On multiple levels
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: [cancerblack] on Dec 29, 2021, 09:33:49 AM
I do appreciate your take there razeak, but I feel like Alien can be fairly described as "proper" sci-fi up until the chestburster scene where it irrevocably shifts gear. It's both.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SiL on Dec 29, 2021, 11:35:28 AM
Alien is a horror through and through, from the foreboding music of the opening score to the classic dark and stormy windswept landscapes of gothic horror to the overt violence of the second half.

But it's also thoroughly a science fiction movie; you could transpose the gist of it to a fantasy setting, but it leans heavily into its scifi trappings for important details and to build the sense of foreboding.

Feels kind of weird to even try to separate the two. It's scifi horror at its best.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Elmazalman on Dec 29, 2021, 11:50:15 AM
A near-perfect blend of sci-fi and horror. ALIEN was a natural.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Stitch on Dec 29, 2021, 03:54:09 PM
Alien, as had been said countless times before, is a haunted house story in space. It's both horror and sci-fi.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Immortan Jonesy on Dec 29, 2021, 10:34:01 PM
Quote from: Kradan on Dec 29, 2021, 06:57:52 AM
Alien 3 is drama. On multiple levels

The Alien 3 of my dreams is even more dramatic:

An age-old vendetta between two powerful families erupts into bloodshed. A group of masked Morse risk further conflict by gatecrashing a Ripley party. A young lovesick Turk Morse falls instantly in love with Amanda Ripley², who is due to marry her father's choice, the Count of the Space Tree; A 9 foot bald albino from a far away lands. With the help of Amanda's syintetic nurse, the women arrange for the couple to marry the next day, but Turk's attempt to halt a wooden street fight with a penis-head monster, born of an elegant Borzoi, leads to the death of Amanda's own mullets-style cousin, Fifield³, for which Turk is banished. In a desperate attempt to be reunited with Turk, Amanda follows the Dwayne Hicks plot and fakes her own death. The message fails to reach Turk, and believing Amanda dead, he takes his life in her tomb. Amanda wakes to find Turk's corpse beside her and kills herself. The grieving family agree to end their feud.

(https://i.ibb.co/938s22y/Pics-Art-12-29-06-43-47.jpg)

In the post credits scene Ridley Scott appears smoking a cigar, while explaining why the traditional drama is cooked.

(https://i.ibb.co/9qHjPBn/db6fc51b974b3f77c4e5f75718f399be.jpg)
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Kradan on Dec 30, 2021, 07:21:07 AM
Neil Blomkamp, eat your heart out
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: City Hunter Yautja on Apr 01, 2022, 10:45:57 PM
Quote from: [cancerblack] on Dec 29, 2021, 09:33:49 AM
I do appreciate your take there razeak, but I feel like Alien can be fairly described as "proper" sci-fi up until the chestburster scene where it irrevocably shifts gear. It's both.

I concur. Science Fiction to me can have strong horror elements, but you tend to get your breath taken away by the scenes of space, tech, architecture (like the Derelict interior with the Spacejockey).
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Immortan Jonesy on Apr 22, 2022, 04:45:27 PM
I guess the OP's question has been solved:

Alien Covenant Shower Scene - Extended Death (https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/index.php?topic=65564.0)
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: Building Better Worlds on Jun 28, 2022, 09:43:38 AM
I've always thought of the tail penetrating her and slicing her in two vertically. Her weird groans over the intercom always conjure up the idea of her being diced to me.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: SiL on Jun 28, 2022, 10:32:29 AM
You wouldn't be screaming if you got split in two.
Title: Re: Was Lambert raped by the Alien?
Post by: BigDaddyJohn on Jun 28, 2022, 12:59:09 PM
The penetrating part I can totally imagine happening, the slicing part not so much.