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Author Topic: Alien Covenant - The unlikeable character(s)  (Read 2296 times)

Kimarhi
Oct 20, 2021, 04:11:51 AM
Reply #15 on: Oct 20, 2021, 04:11:51 AM
I didn't really find Covenant characters unlikeable, but they weren't always believable.  I didn't buy the married couple dynamic between a lot of the pairs which I felt was a HUGE wasted opportunity.  I would've dropped the security team and ONLY focused on the married pairs and just had the crew jobs fall within those pairs. 

I actually found Oram to be more believable.  He got caught in a leadership role and instead of being himself he tried to alter himself to play the role as he thought it should be.  Which lead to questionable decision making.  I have seen this kind of bullshit a dozen times IRL so I can relate.  Usually to more severe levels where dudes go into full jackassery mode and then end up swimming neck deep in bad decision making with no one willing to help them out.  But that is what they EXPECT you do do and want you to do so it alters perspectives.  I got in trouble for being too laid back, but then eventually people would leave me alone when all my guys did what they were supposed to do.  But I took my fair share of shit before then. 

So Oram's predicament is definitely one that people who've been in that spot can relate too, even if it isn't how we navigated it.



PsyKore
Oct 20, 2021, 09:02:23 AM
Reply #17 on: Oct 20, 2021, 09:02:23 AM
Covenant tries to portray most of the crew as ordinary people, like Alien,  but it comes across too forced for the most part. A lot of the banter as they approach the planet, for example, feels off and is even cringy at times. That said, I do still think Oram's character is one of the better ones in the film despite some logic flaws.

What little we get is fine. But it’s crumbs. But if crazy old Ridley was intending to make a movie that was just David and Shaw on the engineer homeworld and then got told by the studio he had to go back to square one, I can feasibly see why he’d brush over all that stuff with the bare minimum.

I think that's probably true from what we know (going by past comments of Ridley's). I think he did want to go off in another direction but the studio just wanted to sell more Alien. You can definitely tell this by how ho-hum and by-the-numbers the last chapter with the adult alien is, plus the cynical little homages to the original film here and there.

I feel like the David character obtained special focus because it was an element he could perhaps salvage from his original intentions. Of course, I'm just speculating. But I think it was more interesting to go down the David/Haywire AI route than just produce another typical Alien movie.


Kimarhi
Oct 21, 2021, 01:41:37 AM
Reply #18 on: Oct 21, 2021, 01:41:37 AM
David is easily the best idea developed in the prequels.  His interaction with Walter were the best scenes in the those two films. 




BigDaddyJohn
Oct 26, 2021, 11:14:37 AM
Reply #20 on: Oct 26, 2021, 11:14:37 AM
Apart from Tennessee, Daniels and Walter, there are no truly likeable characters. Just no truly despicable ones either apart from David.


Wweyland
Oct 26, 2021, 11:51:14 AM
Reply #21 on: Oct 26, 2021, 11:51:14 AM
The movie novelization helped with the characters, and some other things as well.
Although the prequel novelization should have helped even more but was somehow very lackluster.



TC
Oct 27, 2021, 02:25:05 PM
Reply #23 on: Oct 27, 2021, 02:25:05 PM
My Favorite David Moments.













The design for this set has always puzzled me. Who in their right mind would place a statue of David in such a small room that it requires the head to stick up through a hole in the ceiling, so that you can't even see the whole thing?

TC



[cancerblack]
Oct 27, 2021, 09:21:18 PM
Reply #25 on: Oct 27, 2021, 09:21:18 PM
The movie novelization helped with the characters, and some other things as well.
Although the prequel novelization should have helped even more but was somehow very lackluster.

It felt like a half-decent but totally unrelated sci fi novel that got shoe-horned into the setting, really.


PsyKore
Oct 27, 2021, 11:33:13 PM
Reply #26 on: Oct 27, 2021, 11:33:13 PM


The design for this set has always puzzled me. Who in their right mind would place a statue of David in such a small room that it requires the head to stick up through a hole in the ceiling, so that you can't even see the whole thing?

TC

Considering the rest of the scene, there maybe some visual metaphor going on. But from an artistic angle, I like how it accentuates the size of the statue and is in the likeness of the Engineers.



Necronomicon II
Nov 02, 2021, 01:33:44 AM
Reply #28 on: Nov 02, 2021, 01:33:44 AM
The giant David in a small room has all sorts of connotations for both David and Weyland. Weyland's head is too big and will be his downfall, same with David.

And not going to lie David is pretty likable amongst the human trash, and those neomorphs as well are pretty sweet. 🤣😘


The Necronoir
Nov 07, 2021, 04:29:10 AM
Reply #29 on: Nov 07, 2021, 04:29:10 AM
I didn't really find Covenant characters unlikeable, but they weren't always believable.  I didn't buy the married couple dynamic between a lot of the pairs which I felt was a HUGE wasted opportunity.  I would've dropped the security team and ONLY focused on the married pairs and just had the crew jobs fall within those pairs. 

I actually found Oram to be more believable.  He got caught in a leadership role and instead of being himself he tried to alter himself to play the role as he thought it should be.  Which lead to questionable decision making.  I have seen this kind of bullshit a dozen times IRL so I can relate.  Usually to more severe levels where dudes go into full jackassery mode and then end up swimming neck deep in bad decision making with no one willing to help them out.  But that is what they EXPECT you do do and want you to do so it alters perspectives.  I got in trouble for being too laid back, but then eventually people would leave me alone when all my guys did what they were supposed to do.  But I took my fair share of shit before then. 

So Oram's predicament is definitely one that people who've been in that spot can relate too, even if it isn't how we navigated it.

I think you're right on the money there. To me, the question of whether or not a character is "likable" is completely arbitrary until they actually seem like a believable character. The inconsistencies in the way people act in Prometheus and Covenant means that it's very hard to even view them as holistic characters, much less relatable ones. I feel like I watching a walking, talking plot device, rather than an autonomous being.

Alien, on the other hand, shows that we can relate to people doing stupid things, as long as that stupidity results from consistent character flaws. Kane is too adventurous, Parker too brash, Lambert too neurotic, etc.

The design for this set has always puzzled me. Who in their right mind would place a statue of David in such a small room that it requires the head to stick up through a hole in the ceiling, so that you can't even see the whole thing?

All that indicates is that you're neither an architect nor an art critic.


 

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