Hopefully there are no corporate mercenaries in AvP.

Started by affinity, May 14, 2009, 06:24:12 PM

Author
Hopefully there are no corporate mercenaries in AvP. (Read 4,794 times)

affinity

I'd really like the human vs. human aspect to not be in AvP's campaign.   there's already too many shooters where humans shoot humans (or aliens/mutants that use guns. well the Predator is acceptable cause they are totally different in style, technology and arsenal.)   But yeah I heard in some interview that they want the Marine campaign to be different from other shooters out there that involve humans, so I'm sure they won't throw in some bad humans as enemies.

Let this be like the first AvP where the human species are all on the same side, none of that
betrayal BS and stuff.   This is a species war first and foremost.  And the human species should be only represented by the Colonial Marines in this game.   :)

Speaking of which, anyone thinks there will be a lot of Marine skins players can choose from?
I wonder if there are any female marine skins as badass as Vazquez?  I'm glad their armor looks
like the classic movie instead of the whitish/orange medical team looking stuff from AvP2. 

Well it doesn't sound like the marine campaign will support co-op, which is okay because I think
Rebellion might bring back the Multiplayer Co-op mode from before where we can use the MP
maps with 8+ players and survive against endless respawning aliens, that was my favorite mode.  ;D  Also Rebellion did a better job with the smartgun muzzle flash than monolith (and pretty much better pulse rifle sound too, and more violent sounding/looking minigun.) 

back to the campaign though, having no corporate mercenaries would also allow the cast
of characters to reach its full potential.   I mean it's possible that the Colonial Marine campaign will include a full team of original marines with their own names and stuff.  maybe as many as 12
(but probably split into groups of 3 or 4.)

Not sure how the a.i. would work but I think the story should not conflict with the gameplay, I mean like, the story should not dictate who survives and who doesn't.   If "Marine #11" gets killed in the first level or survives, the player would be able to progress regardless.  This would prevent the campaign from being an escort mission, while still offering some real-time authentic Marine experience without getting lazy and just separating the player from the rest of the team 99% of the time.   But yeah a.i. is tough to make it work properly, so it might be a mainly solo playthrough I guess.

But imagine how much scarier it would be if like, your actions can help protect and save the lives of your fellow marines,  and if the marines get killed off, then the lower your survival chances.
That's why I think an open-ended Marine campaign would be really kickass.

on AvPGold I used to use that cheat that lets you spawn a.i. marines in the campaign and it
was pretty scary (well it was hard cause there was no commands to guide the marines, I had
to use rockets and explosions to have them move in that direction.)  when your trying to avoid
causing friendly fire, and you get scared cause they get killed by aliens and you end up being alone  in most cases.  It really builds tension.  But see that isn't scripted,  non-scripted situations leads to more unpredictable fun.

that's one thing I like about Left 4 Dead's a.i. director.  it makes a single level so unpredictable
and replayable and has new surprises, and at the sametime, your partners are needed but at the same time, the game isn't over if they are killed off.    Not sure how this AvP's marine campaign will work, but it sounds like the marines lives will be scripted, which isn't a bad thing,
the marines vital for progression will probably have infinite health or really good a.i.   But yeah
chances are they are gonna somehow separate us from the team. early on.  :P



GrimyGhost

i hope there is enemy soldiers, it helps pace the game out alittle and can help move the story on. the human vs human aspect of avp2 was great.

affinity

it doesn't help move the story on.   it doesn't help the pacing.   It just turns
Sci-fi xenomorph horror into Saving Private Ryan in Space.

I personally believe the masses had their share of 10000000000 human soldier kills and just
sick of that theme when playing as humans.
and we don't need another Half-Life. 

AvP2 was okay with doing that but this AvP shouldn't borrow from the enemy soldiers theme,
it would remind me of too many shooters out there.

that's why the Aliens movie should be used as an example of how this game's Marine campaign
should flow, cause there was only 1 traitor, not some group of humans bent on shooting our
heroes, and Burke didn't get to shoot anyone, well he never even got to hold a gun, which is good.  But the Marines in Aliens were great, they were loyal, united, and showed the best
of humanity without tearing at each others throats (well okay, maybe some had an attitude problem but overall they wouldn't since so low as to shoot each other.) 

now that was a good story.  the first Alien also had a good story,  there was no traitor except the android (and yeah the company the android worked for, but still...)   
Alien 3....I hate that movie.  no weapons really sucked ass, well Alien 1 only had flamethrower
and stun rod, but heck, I really hated Alien 3. 

Alien Resurrection had its flaws, yeah there was another human traitor who shoots someone,
the mercs end up killing a few soldiers.  but heck at least it had guns (even though they didn't
really use them enough.)   but that is related to my Alien 3 rant.

back to humans vs. humans, that should only be possible in multiplayer. 


I'm almost positive there won't be human enemies in the campaign since Rebellion wants
to stay away from feeling like other shooters.   and if there is, there's only one. 


RumorControl

I liked the marine vs. corporates mission in the game, but not in multiplayer.  Multiplayer is supposed to humans vs aliens vs predators.

affinity

Quote from: RumorControl on May 14, 2009, 08:30:42 PM
I liked the marine vs. corporates mission in the game, but not in multiplayer.  Multiplayer is supposed to humans vs aliens vs predators.

well at least we agree with the humans vs. aliens vs. predators.    ;D

yeah in Multiplayer I'll just do co-op if it's back,   as well as species wars. 

but you know sometimes absolute chaos is fun to experience in vanilla deathmatch, 

cause seeing marines, aliens and preds killing each other indiscriminately can be beautiful at times.   the level of chaos is an art in itself.    :D

but yeah I'll be doing species wars 99% of the time.  that's the true beauty of AvP in its teamwork.   but sometimes I get a kick out of seeing humans and predators joining forces to mow down the aliens in 2 vs. 1 species wars.  it gives me flashbacks of the co-op arcade beat'em up.



;D

The PredBen

Human vs. human is still a good part of the game. I always hated how in monster movies human all stuck together. I honestly throw up when there is no human villain in a sci fi channel movie. WTF... its retarded no offense to have humans all united. It is cool , I love the look on some hero's face when another person ( human. ) goes against him , he acts like... impossible man kills man, oh wait that was the foundation for the planet of the apes movies. Yeah... it adds more realism , when you see an alien you kill it because its a monster , but when a human is evil , you hate it with a passion , you know he is intelligent and the fact that he'd kill another member of his own species , your own species is appalling and you hate him. Predators fit the bill closer but not correctly. But in the game ... I guess its okay because it does slow down some game play......... :'(

affinity

affinity

#6
the problem is that sci-fi/horror tends to overdo it with human villains that they end up looking like a comic-book one-trick pony.

"hahaha I lied and betrayed you all.  ah ha oh what is this!  nooooooo!"   


AvP didn't have a human villain.  AvP2 did.  so this one shouldn't have human enemies.

also if you look at the Alien movies. 

Alien had a villain (android, but I guess can be treated as human.)

Aliens had a villain

Alien 3 had a villain

Alien:R had a villain 

Predator had a human enemies

Predator 2 had....well uh...human vs. humans too.

AvP didnt have villains

AvPR um yeah it had villains but they were scooby doo punks.

too many human villains!

yeah it may be human nature to have internal conflict in the species, but it that drama
doesn't need to stretch to worlds that are not colonized.

no military in the world has so much internal conflict that someone in the military ends up
betraying and killing each other.  well yeah it happens but not at the rate these movies make
it appear.

at this rate the Colonial Marines and humanity might as well have a
Anti-Human Conflict Emergency Bomb.      it blows up the person the instant they think about hurting or killing another human.   
   :P

lol I can imagine now.   

Sgt. Clark:  "Private Keys, where have you been?"
Pvt. Keys: "I got lost, Sarge."
Sgt. Clark: "(I'm gonna kill this guy) [doesn't mean it]"  oh shi-"  KA-BOOOOOOOOM!!!!!!!!!



Übermensch

It's not only a species war, in fact besides human vs human, I'm pretty sure the comics have had alien vs alien and predator vs predator.

It's always been a theme of the alien movies (and the AVP movies) that humans are the worst villains.

WY has got to be in their somewhere, which is cool because as an alien or predator I loved slaughtering those helpless scientist types. [face_evil]

The PredBen

Quote from: DoomsdayApocalypse on May 14, 2009, 10:12:59 PM
It's not only a species war, in fact besides human vs human, I'm pretty sure the comics have had alien vs alien and predator vs predator.

It's always been a theme of the alien movies (and the AVP movies) that humans are the worst villains.

WY has got to be in their somewhere, which is cool because as an alien or predator I loved slaughtering those helpless scientist types. [face_evil]
The comics clearly show human vs. human and Predator vs. Predator and a little alien vs. alien too. So it adds to the drama in only a positive way. Even in Planet of the apes 5 , there was both a human and an ape villain despite the whole " ape does not kill ape " part of the whole series.

The PredBen

As stated the whole point of some sci fi films is to show humanity is humanities worst enemy. Also not that out of all the alien species , aliens and predators and humans , in avp , we are the most evil. Aliens are animals , not evil. Predators... are evil to a degree but most , sadly , have strong morals. Humans have no morals and while some of us are hero's , most like greed and lust and power and other factors , revenge.

Aeus

Predators are by far the most evil. They hunt us for nothing more than their own pleasure and enjoyment.

Übermensch

I thought that was the whole point of the Predator movies, the hunters (us) becoming the hunted.

GrimyGhost

Quote from: affinity on May 14, 2009, 07:59:03 PM
it doesn't help move the story on.   it doesn't help the pacing.   It just turns
Sci-fi xenomorph horror into Saving Private Ryan in Space.

I personally believe the masses had their share of 10000000000 human soldier kills and just
sick of that theme when playing as humans.
and we don't need another Half-Life. 

AvP2 was okay with doing that but this AvP shouldn't borrow from the enemy soldiers theme,
it would remind me of too many shooters out there.

that's why the Aliens movie should be used as an example of how this game's Marine campaign
should flow, cause there was only 1 traitor, not some group of humans bent on shooting our
heroes, and Burke didn't get to shoot anyone, well he never even got to hold a gun, which is good.  But the Marines in Aliens were great, they were loyal, united, and showed the best
of humanity without tearing at each others throats (well okay, maybe some had an attitude problem but overall they wouldn't since so low as to shoot each other.) 

now that was a good story.  the first Alien also had a good story,  there was no traitor except the android (and yeah the company the android worked for, but still...)   
Alien 3....I hate that movie.  no weapons really sucked ass, well Alien 1 only had flamethrower
and stun rod, but heck, I really hated Alien 3. 

Alien Resurrection had its flaws, yeah there was another human traitor who shoots someone,
the mercs end up killing a few soldiers.  but heck at least it had guns (even though they didn't
really use them enough.)   but that is related to my Alien 3 rant.

back to humans vs. humans, that should only be possible in multiplayer. 


I'm almost positive there won't be human enemies in the campaign since Rebellion wants
to stay away from feeling like other shooters.   and if there is, there's only one. 



your wrong, alien 3= ripley vs convicts (some of them)
alien 4= the smugglers hated the guards (they had fight in the mess hall)
predator 2= cops vs gang at the begining
avp2 the military bomb the civillians

unless im wrong thats all human vs human, and most of the scenes helped with the story, it lays a foundation so you know, you know whos good and whos bad.

affinity

affinity

#13
the space pirates in Alien 4 did not hate the guard/soldiers.  they didn't kill them because of hate. 

well yeah Johner probably did hate them,  Christie probably didn't give a **** either way,
but they didn't fight them because they hated them. 

Cole (she's called Call but it sounds like Cole when they say it.)  was caught leaving Ripley's  room, and she was labeled as a terrorist.   She broke the rules of entering a restricted area.

That's why the scientist was going to order the soldeirs to put them all to death. 
And that's why the space pirates/mercs/smugglers defended themselves.

Note, the scientist was never planning on using the smugglers as test subjects or killing Cole/Call or killing any of them.  Call broke the rules, and the rules lay down the protocol that they all had to face the same punishment.    Their leader, Elgyn, is in good terms with General Perez, he would not let anything happen to them if they came and left without breaking the rules.   What's interesting is that Perez never found out what the heck happened between them and Dr. Wren.

Übermensch

What does that matter?  Dr. Wren was a total jerk who kidnapped innocent people to use them for breeding aliens.  The bad guy in Alien 4 was Dr. Wren, not the aliens.

And corporate mercs weren't even much in AVP2.  Most of the time, you were pwning WY security guards (that was fun).

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