Dark Horse Fire and Stone Sequel On The Way?

Started by Corporal Hicks, Mar 11, 2015, 09:22:00 AM

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Dark Horse Fire and Stone Sequel On The Way? (Read 28,368 times)

Xenomorphine

Xenomorphine

#30
Quote from: Son Of Kane on Mar 23, 2015, 12:15:33 PM
Could it have been the storm?

The Prometheus crew seemed to trigger a storm on the planet when they changed the Atmosphere in the Ampule room, is it possible that- that actually did terraform the planet?

I don't recall any rain being involved. Wasn't it like a big ole' cloud of sand/dust? I got the impression the crew triggered a primitive trap designed to stop anyone interfering with stuff.

Quote from: Corporal Hicks on Mar 23, 2015, 03:31:25 PM
I got from the very start of the series that Elden was supposed to be something other than an android from the term construct. However, I think it could have been said somewhat more blatantly. There's a lot of the feel of Prometheus in this - ambiguity in the story.

Heh, yes, there was. :)

Elden is the biggest flaw, though. As I say, they even call those mechanised crash dummy things 'constructs'. There's literally no definition for if there's even meant to be a difference between those and synthetics, much less what it is. Plus, the whole thing of Elden referring to himself as previously being a "dumb robot".

And if he's meant to be 50% organic, why is he still standing up when his spine is vaporised? :)

There's an off-hand reference to him being termed a "meat robot", but what would even be the point of that? Breeding cloned humans in giant vats with a really basic IQ level? Elden is literally wandering the corridors writing 'hello' on posters on the walls... He's like a child with an adult vocabulary. He's acting like a synthetic (albeit, a slightly demented one). Why create an organic being like that - for incredibly important missions - if you already have access to more conventional - and reprogrammable - androids?

Possibilities:

Elden is organic: Why were the mutations so symmetrical? What made his genetics so superior that the stuff made him a new, streamlined creature, when it just seems to turn everything else into a mess?

Elden is a synthetic: How did the black ooze affect his programming? It's not like it can interface with his CPU and communicate in binary. :) How did it create flesh where none existed?

Either they should have thought through Elden's character a lot more or given him much less of an impact on the story.

Also just remembered there's an example of the ooze somehow turning an Alien's acid into red blood... Much strangeness! ;D

Son Of Kane

IMO Fok Fire & Stone, too many inconsistencys.

Lonely Universe

Also, when a human & Xeno touch the goo at the same time the human gets stuck in it's tummy tum tum. ::)

Ultramorph

My only big complaints are that I wish Derrick Russel's fate had been made more clear, and come up somehow in Omega, and that they had done more with the mountain and the human signal. There's enough info to piece together what was going on with it, but it would have been nice to get a bit more pay-off.

Xenomorphine

I thought it seemed obvious. He procrastinated over whether to infect himself with the black ooze, then the Aliens struck.

happypred

Quote from: Xenomorphine on Mar 23, 2015, 07:28:24 PM
Possibilities:

Elden is organic: Why were the mutations so symmetrical? What made his genetics so superior that the stuff made him a new, streamlined creature, when it just seems to turn everything else into a mess?

Elden is a synthetic: How did the black ooze affect his programming? It's not like it can interface with his CPU and communicate in binary. :) How did it create flesh where none existed?

Elden is part synthetic, part organic

We really don't know how to it operated. It could be some sort of advanced nanotech capable of affecting both organics and non-organics

Xenomorphine

Quote from: happypred on Mar 24, 2015, 05:17:03 AM
Elden is part synthetic, part organic

We really don't know how to it operated. It could be some sort of advanced nanotech capable of affecting both organics and non-organics

There doesn't seem to be any indication of what Elden is, sadly. There's an off-hand "meat robot" reference (which sounds a bit nonsensical), but it seems to be comtradicted by other quotes. Especially with the mechanical crash dummy-like droids also being called 'constructs'.

As for nanotechnology, that should have meant it affected David 8 when he touched it, too. Also still wouldn't explain how Elden's programming was altered. Malfunctoning would have meant he just shut down or became mostly inoperable. It wouldn't make him suddenly develop emotions and a personality.

Also, even if he were a cyborg, like I said, what makes his flesh so superior that his mutation became so sleek and uniform, when it just turns everything else into a chaotic mess?

Corporal Hicks

I thought it was pretty obvious early on he was supposed to be something different, even if they didn't approach it completely clearly. The meat robot comment makes it obvious hes supposed to be organic in some fashion, as does the accerelant's ability to effect him at all.

Visceral_Mass

Quote from: Corporal Hicks on Mar 24, 2015, 03:54:20 PM
I thought it was pretty obvious early on he was supposed to be something different, even if they didn't approach it completely clearly.

Therein lies the problem. If you are going to introduce something different, yet similar to existing things, into an "established" universe, you need to do so in a way that allows the reader to learn what that different thing is and how those difference affect the story.

The way it was handled left more questions than answers and, for me at least, gave the feel of them wanting this thing to exist for the purpose of the story, but not knowing how to explain its existence beyond ambiguous references.

Lonely Universe

This is exactly why I prefer self contained stories. One author with a love of the source material wouldn't cause all of these issues. When you have a bunch of them working in unison wires get crossed.

Besides, I knew as soon as I saw Kelly Sue Deconnick's name attached it was going to be less than stellar. Omega was the most disappointingly written of all. Oh, the Queen is too fat to be a threat & just gets her head lopped off? Talk about anti-climactic & then there's the mountain & signal throwaway.

Corporal Hicks

Quote from: Visceral_Mass on Mar 24, 2015, 05:48:03 PM
Quote from: Corporal Hicks on Mar 24, 2015, 03:54:20 PM
I thought it was pretty obvious early on he was supposed to be something different, even if they didn't approach it completely clearly.

Therein lies the problem. If you are going to introduce something different, yet similar to existing things, into an "established" universe, you need to do so in a way that allows the reader to learn what that different thing is and how those difference affect the story.

The way it was handled left more questions than answers and, for me at least, gave the feel of them wanting this thing to exist for the purpose of the story, but not knowing how to explain its existence beyond ambiguous references.

Oh, I completely agree. It should have been more clearly for us.

Xenomorphine

Even being a cyborg doesn't explain the stuff I pointed out. Why is his flesh (if it even is that) affected so symmetrically and uniformly, where other characters even in the same story aren't? What was the point of bringing along a 'meat robot'? If he is organic, then why are other "constructs" clearly metal/plastic? How was the ooze reprogramming his CPU?

And what was even so special about him that his internal fluids would somehow filter the black ooze? It's the primary focus of what the entire series revolves around and they just kind of hand-wave it without any explanation.

Also really strange to see him drawing "hello" on various random posters in the corridors... I remember thinking it was a hint of something which would make sense later. Seems it was just... There. No rhyme or reason.

There are elements I liked about the series, but Elden is a walking schizophrenic WTF. :)

Also, it's mentioned there are both constructs and synthetics aboard ship. The Working Joe-alikes are termed 'constructs' and the only other machine is Elden. Therefore... Elden = synthetic?

Lonely Universe

Luckily a recent statement says that Blomkamp's Alien 5 has caused another "restart", which has also led to Rage War being rewritten to accommodate. Guess we can toss F&S into the ole' 'What If' pile along with well, pretty much everything else.

RakaiThwei

Quote from: 8BA on Mar 24, 2015, 07:29:30 PM
Luckily a recent statement says that Blomkamp's Alien 5 has caused another "restart", which has also led to Rage War being rewritten to accommodate. Guess we can toss F&S into the ole' 'What If' pile along with well, pretty much everything else.

Well, that statement could mean anything. I mean... Fire and Stone still takes place in 2179, right? Like.. DURING the events of ALIENS, am I correct in this? If that is the case.. that could remain "safe" and Blomkamp's movie doesn't affect it, assuming that movie is a retcon. And statements make it appear as such..

But Rage War? Lebbon said that little was changed. So we don't know what that could mean but methinks that Rage War is going to be released before Blomkamp's movie, and within that time Alien 3 and Resurrection would still be considered "canon" along with Rage War until Blomkamp's movie is released.. Which would negate that stuff.

Lonely Universe

I hope so. I'd hate for it to get pushed back to capitalize on a sales spike stemming from NB's movie. I got the previous trilogy a few weeks ago & am already on River Of Pain. Don't want to wait long!

I seem to remember feeling like things were being pushed back to arrive closer to Prometheus a few years ago.

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