Prey Catch All Thread

Started by Corporal Hicks, May 22, 2021, 07:54:07 AM

Author
Prey Catch All Thread (Read 306,241 times)

SiL

SiL

#450
It was set there because it's an isolated, hostile environment. That was Anderson's reasoning for Antarctica.

And to his credit, he does explain that the pyramid was built when Antarctica wasn't frozen (which is before humans but whatever), so it's not like he's suggesting the Predators intentionally built it on the ice.

He also implies that the other pyramids around earth - which were in warmer climates, such as the Americas - have gradually all been destroyed until this is the last one left. So they also don't really have a choice.

There's a lot wrong with AvP but he at least made the effort to explain the decision in-universe.

Voodoo Magic

Voodoo Magic

#451
I remember reading Antarctica was all initially driven from Anderson being a big fan of The Thing, and to me, the lack of logic shows that, but alas, I digress...

It still doesn't work. It wasn't like Predators should have been surprised by Earth's climate - an Ooh! We should have dressed warmer realization. Chronological Predator visits kept them abreast and they certainly can key on yearly ideal climate situations from afar to signal when & where are the best times & places to hunt on Earth.

Again, it all could have been explained away with some extra effort, show the audience Predators compensating for the cold in some way - via technology, medicine or apparel. A syringe shot resulting in their veins illuminating with a momentarily red glow, even. Something simple that doesn't leave Predator fans scratching their head, which obviously, many did.

But Anderson to me doesn't seem to follow the Stan Winston way of thinking: Function over Form. He's all form over function. If it looks cool, it rules.

SiL

SiL

#452
I just went with the novel's explanation that their netting provided warmth. They have more coverage from their netting than the first two Predators (both arms are covered), not to mention more coverage from their armour overall.

I never took Predators liking the heat for Predators necessarily needing the heat, and I know I'm not alone in that.

But sure, even just showing the netting periodically glowing as it heats up would've been a nice touch.

Voodoo Magic

Voodoo Magic

#453
Hmm. The netting since the first Thomas Hunter script we have in public consumption has always camouflage related. It's been at least 15 years since I read the novelization, I'll have to revisit that.




But either way, the netting's purpose has never been explained to the audiences, so it's irrelevant to the point that audiences only know Predators come to environments that are at its hottest temperatures.  One would logically ask - why care if the netting was already keeping them hot? So the logic doesn't quite fit.

Quote from: SiL on Aug 11, 2021, 12:58:40 PM
I never took Predators liking the heat for Predators necessarily needing the heat, and I know I'm not alone in that.

Perhaps they like it warm because it allows them to wear the loincloth speedos?  ;D

But again, why bother if the netting was already keeping them hot. They can wear their speedos all day long in the cold. So I don't think those theories ultimately mesh. :)

Corporal Hicks

Corporal Hicks

#454
Quote from: Voodoo Magic on Aug 11, 2021, 01:22:32 PM
Hmm. The netting since the first Thomas Hunter script we have in public consumption has always camouflage related. It's been at least 15 years since I read the novelization, I'll have to revisit that.

IIRC SiL means the AvP novelization?

Voodoo Magic

Voodoo Magic

#455
Quote from: Corporal Hicks on Aug 11, 2021, 01:36:18 PM
Quote from: Voodoo Magic on Aug 11, 2021, 01:22:32 PM
Hmm. The netting since the first Thomas Hunter script we have in public consumption has always camouflage related. It's been at least 15 years since I read the novelization, I'll have to revisit that.

IIRC SiL means the AvP novelization?

Ah, I never read that. Glad it's not my often shoddy memory to blame.

And I agree with SiL that showing the netting periodically glowing / heating up would've gone a long way.

But in context of the entire movie, clearly Anderson was willing to bypass established lore (even Earth history itself) when it conflicted with the movie he was trying to make, leaving fans and other creators searching for explanations for things that he didn't care to include in his movie. And after listening to Peter Briggs, I know he wouldn't have done that in his script, which just saddens me even more how everything played out. :-[

Mr.Turok

Mr.Turok

#456
Quote from: Voodoo Magic on Aug 11, 2021, 02:19:36 PM
Quote from: Corporal Hicks on Aug 11, 2021, 01:36:18 PM
Quote from: Voodoo Magic on Aug 11, 2021, 01:22:32 PM
Hmm. The netting since the first Thomas Hunter script we have in public consumption has always camouflage related. It's been at least 15 years since I read the novelization, I'll have to revisit that.

IIRC SiL means the AvP novelization?

Ah, I never read that. Glad it's not my often shoddy memory to blame.

And I agree with SiL that showing the netting periodically glowing / heating up would've gone a long way.

But in context of the entire movie, clearly Anderson was willing to bypass established lore (even Earth history itself) when it conflicted with the movie he was trying to make, leaving fans and other creators searching for explanations for things that he didn't care to include in his movie. And after listening to Peter Briggs, I know he wouldn't have done that in his script, which just saddens me even more how everything played out. :-[

He did say in the making of section of the AVP DVD, that he chose Antarctica due to being the closest thing we can have of space; being cold, hostile, and isolated and I understand that thought, since Fox wouldn't allow a future space setting due to their dumb reasons.

There is also the fact that like us humans, Predators do have the ability to adapt or change the environment to suit their needs. I doubt they would skip the chance to hunt dangerous prey in the cold due to the cold. I always thought the added armor and netting from AVP reflects them wearing specialized gear for the climate.

Isn't this also touched upon with the new lore based on this very said clan from AVP, The Isolated Clan: the one clan that purposely live on a mountainous world in the most hottest and coldest areas of the planet. It adds more diverse lore the Predator society, that there are just some exceptions that want to live more dangerously than others.

SuperiorIronman

SuperiorIronman

#457
Given the temple was hot enough to be noticed and thaw the Queen as well as the Predators supposed to be hunting in that and not on the surface you can argue they'd be miserable on the surface but it's not an issue in the actual hunting ground. They f**k shit up on the way in and on the way out but they're supposed to do the ritual in the temple where it's warm enough, not on the surface where they'd be uncomfortable.

Also as a side note, while they could be attracted to heat, what if that summer is just really hot but nothing's happening? You end up with Ahab killing a platypus. So just going where the conflict is weather be damned makes way more sense to me.

Voodoo Magic

Voodoo Magic

#458
Quote from: Mr.Turok on Aug 11, 2021, 05:34:16 PM
There is also the fact that like us humans, Predators do have the ability to adapt or change the environment to suit their needs. I doubt they would skip the chance to hunt dangerous prey in the cold due to the cold.

I agree, I would imagine they would adapt accordingly. But show us Anderson, don't hand waive it and discard it.

QuoteI always thought the added armor and netting from AVP reflects them wearing specialized gear for the climate.

Yeah, geared up to fight Aliens. Again, as far as the Thomas Brothers goes, the netting was for camouflage  - hence drawn by heat and conflict. If the netting is designed for warmth, Predators only need to be drawn to conflict, not heat - who cares about the climate.

My belief is while the fans come up with explanations, Anderson just discarded established lore he didn't like. Esthetics of their steamy ancient ship in Predator 2 and video games? Nah, let's change it to cold hard human-like steel. Smart-Discs? Nah, those are lame frisbees. I'll replace them with Shurikens (which admittedly are also cool). Predators only come when it's hottest? Nah, Antarctica pyramid will be so cool on screen. Alien life cycle takes how many hours? Nah, let's make it fast!

SiL

SiL

#459
Quote from: Corporal Hicks on Aug 11, 2021, 01:36:18 PM

IIRC SiL means the AvP novelization?
That's the one. Even then I'm relying on my memory.

Considering the netting doesn't cover the whole body in the original films I think it's fair to say its exact function was left up in the air on-screen - and Predators discarded it completely for the berserker Predators and yet they cloak fine.

Of course, it can be both a thermal regulator and part of the cloak, if we consider what it's cloaking may be the Predator's body temperature, not visible light (after all, don't they need to cover the City Hunter in radioactive dust to see him in the meat locker? Why bother if they could just use IR?)

And Anderson didn't really ignore drawn to heat and conflict, he just presented a different type of hunt - these Predators aren't being attracted to human conflict to find worthy prey in the struggle like the originals. This isn't a hunt of opportunity. They're here to fight Aliens, and they're buried under the ice. The temperature really isn't a calling card here.

I'm sure they would've preferred somewhere warm, but their last pyramid froze over and they have to deal with it.

Proteus

Proteus

#460
Quote from: Voodoo Magic on Aug 11, 2021, 07:35:17 PM
Quote from: Mr.Turok on Aug 11, 2021, 05:34:16 PM
There is also the fact that like us humans, Predators do have the ability to adapt or change the environment to suit their needs. I doubt they would skip the chance to hunt dangerous prey in the cold due to the cold.

I agree, I would imagine they would adapt accordingly. But show us Anderson, don't hand waive it and discard it.

QuoteI always thought the added armor and netting from AVP reflects them wearing specialized gear for the climate.

Yeah, geared up to fight Aliens. Again, as far as the Thomas Brothers goes, the netting was for camouflage  - hence drawn by heat and conflict. If the netting is designed for warmth, Predators only need to be drawn to conflict, not heat - who cares about the climate.

My belief is while the fans come up with explanations, Anderson just discarded established lore he didn't like. Esthetics of their steamy ancient ship in Predator 2 and video games? Nah, let's change it to cold hard human-like steel. Smart-Discs? Nah, those are lame frisbees. I'll replace them with Shurikens (which admittedly are also cool). Predators only come when it's hottest? Nah, Antarctica pyramid will be so cool on screen. Alien life cycle takes how many hours? Nah, let's make it fast!

Wait, wasn't there a flashback that showed the pyramid before the ice over? And wasn't the only reason they went there was because the humans set off some beacon and they were there to just essentially clean up? Also do a little hunting while at it. I'm not sure he completely disregarded lore. Also, not the first time Predators hunted in cold weather. Are we forgetting the Cold War comic? I think they're drawn more to conflict than just heat. Heat is a bonus.

SiL

SiL

#461
That was a different pyramid. The pyramid turned itself on and the Predators were there to hunt Aliens for their rite of passage - cleaning up is AvPR.

They were stranded in Cold War, not there intentionally.

Mr.Turok

Mr.Turok

#462
Quote from: Voodoo Magic on Aug 11, 2021, 07:35:17 PM
Quote from: Mr.Turok on Aug 11, 2021, 05:34:16 PM
There is also the fact that like us humans, Predators do have the ability to adapt or change the environment to suit their needs. I doubt they would skip the chance to hunt dangerous prey in the cold due to the cold.

I agree, I would imagine they would adapt accordingly. But show us Anderson, don't hand waive it and discard it.

QuoteI always thought the added armor and netting from AVP reflects them wearing specialized gear for the climate.

Yeah, geared up to fight Aliens. Again, as far as the Thomas Brothers goes, the netting was for camouflage  - hence drawn by heat and conflict. If the netting is designed for warmth, Predators only need to be drawn to conflict, not heat - who cares about the climate.

I mean you just answered your own question, they are geared up to fight Aliens. This isn't a regular Hunt, as SIL even brought up here:

Quote from: SiL on Aug 11, 2021, 11:25:44 PM
And Anderson didn't really ignore drawn to heat and conflict, he just presented a different type of hunt - these Predators aren't being attracted to human conflict to find worthy prey in the struggle like the originals. This isn't a hunt of opportunity. They're here to fight Aliens, and they're buried under the ice. The temperature really isn't a calling card here.

I'm sure they would've preferred somewhere warm, but their last pyramid froze over and they have to deal with it.

They are Young Bloods who are not yet seen as true hunters until this trial is complete so the rules here greatly differ from the usual Hunt that Blooded hunters go through. I'm positively sure Predators prefer hunting in the heat but here this is the trial for the Young Bloods to be seen as men in the eyes of their clan so what better way to prove that is to hunt one of the most dangerous and adaptive prey that Predators love to hunt, in the most hostile, coldest, and remote places on Earth that other Predators would not like to endure? That's kind of like extra bragging rights right there that no Young Blood can resist. 

Quote from: Voodoo Magic on Aug 11, 2021, 07:35:17 PM
My belief is while the fans come up with explanations, Anderson just discarded established lore he didn't like. Esthetics of their steamy ancient ship in Predator 2 and video games? Nah, let's change it to cold hard human-like steel. Smart-Discs? Nah, those are lame frisbees. I'll replace them with Shurikens (which admittedly are also cool). Predators only come when it's hottest? Nah, Antarctica pyramid will be so cool on screen. Alien life cycle takes how many hours? Nah, let's make it fast!

I always thought the diverse in ship aesthetics are nice variation that do the extra nice work that reflects the Clans themselves. The Lost Tribe's ship reflects the usual Predator aesthetics with the steamy, hot, and orange reptilians theme while the Isolated Tribe's cold, dark silver, and blues reflect their hardened preference to extreme cold and heat. I do agree, however I did not like how future media used the AVP ships as the go to design for future ships. The Predator film is the greatest sin for this very reason, as the ship design and interior looked very plain and dull.

Can't be mad at Shurikens as in the end, lot of media used both Smart Disk and Shuriken designs so least people love em both.

Antarctica pyramid? Hell I wanted the film to be set in the future space in some colony somewhere but again, Fox had to be a bunch of cheap ass suits that wanted to go for that PG13 rating for the safe easy making money and not spending so much on the future setting that would have been costly in their eyes. Didn't like how humans worshiped Predators as gods angle at all either. More Ancient Alien nonsense I hated so much as it just downplays how ancient humanity can just surprise us with their amazing abilities to do things like build pyramids. Just bad decision overall.

There is no excuse for that Alien life cycle, that was just bad all the way.

SiL

SiL

#463
The modern day setting was something John Davis wanted since he thought it would be 'scarier'. The pyramid sets were no less expensive than a space colony would've been.

Baron Von Marlon

Baron Von Marlon

#464
The pyramid was from the original Alien script if I'm not mistaken.
And the Antarctic setting is similar to Lovecraft's At The Mountains Of Madness which also involves two alien species fighting.

AvPGalaxy: About | Contact | Cookie Policy | Manage Cookie Settings | Privacy Policy | Legal Info
Facebook Twitter Instagram YouTube Patreon RSS Feed
Contact: General Queries | Submit News