Jim and John Thomas suing Disney to reclaim Predator rights

Started by Kailem, Apr 16, 2021, 12:46:54 AM

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Jim and John Thomas suing Disney to reclaim Predator rights (Read 39,720 times)

SiL


Voodoo Magic


SiL

I feel considering the mention of an "amicable" solution it's most likely not an agreement on a deadline, but rather a financial agreement that gives the brothers royalties they feel better reflects the value of the property they helped to create. Or at least a deadline for such an agreement to be settled.

I think it's fair to say people can stop worrying about the Predator franchise getting torn apart at this rate.

Kradan

I wasn't worried - I was fascinated to see what interesting would come out of it. Turns out nothing. Pretty dissapointing if you ask me

RidgeTop

Quote from: SiL on Jan 13, 2022, 05:50:33 AM
I feel considering the mention of an "amicable" solution it's most likely not an agreement on a deadline, but rather a financial agreement that gives the brothers royalties they feel better reflects the value of the property they helped to create. Or at least a deadline for such an agreement to be settled.

I think it's fair to say people can stop worrying about the Predator franchise getting torn apart at this rate.

Yeah that's my interpretation as well. It's just not worth it for the Thomas brothers not to make a big sale of the rights as part of this I think. We don't know for certain if it's just a flat out sale, continuous royalties, or what but that's what this sort of thing typically means. Brothers were probably looking for a payday through this whole thing and likely got a handsome one.

Really good news.

SiL

I'd absolutely say royalties, in line with the wording of the initial fillings. The provision was enacted to give writers better bargaining power to renegotiate rights and that's what they evoked in their claim.

Hopefully the brothers now receive a more equitable deal that better reflects the long-term value of their work.

Anonymous

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Corporal Hicks

Corporal Hicks

#532
I think this all over and done with. I know the technicalities of the lawsuit from Fox's POV were over the dates, but unless I'm misremembering, the initial lawsuit was for the copyright and the dates thing was Disney's counter-lawsuit. From what Reuters is saying it seems to me that the whole thing is done with. I've emailed Marc Toberoff to see if he can offer any comment/clarity.

Simply_Kevin

That's a relief! Even more now since we'll have   an ambitious new Predator instalment that could spawn a whole line of movies set in different eras and places around the world.

Xiggz456

I'm guessing the Thomas bros upped their royalties percentage. Good for them and relieved that this is over! Now gimme that Predator comic already!

Corporal Hicks

We don't know what side this came out on yet. Reuters hasn't stated if the rights have gone back, or another settlement was reached.

Voodoo Magic

Voodoo Magic

#536
The Thomas Brothers lawsuit was indeed about dates:
https://www.avpgalaxy.net/2021/04/18/jim-john-thomas-vs-disney-examining-the-battle-for-predator/

So was 20th Century Studio's:
https://www.avpgalaxy.net/2021/04/24/the-battle-for-predator-examining-disneys-complaint/

Both parties were not fighting if the US rights shouldn't revert to the Brothers, just when it should.

Some see "settlement" and immediately think there's money involved. It just means they came to an agreement and won't take these lawsuits to trial. The lawsuit wasn't about financial damages. All I can see is they agreed to pay their own legal fees.

With the HELLRAISER rights, the settlement was about the the date:

Hellraiser' Writer Reclaiming U.S. Franchise Rights After Lawsuit Settlement
https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/business/business-news/hellraiser-writer-reclaiming-u-s-franchise-rights-after-lawsuit-settlement-4098688/

Both parties settled amicably in December 2020 that rights would revert to the author December 2021. That is what the Hellraiser copyright settlement was.

The Predator lawsuits were about dates too. Those lawsuits were indeed settled amicably. I can't assume the two parties wrote up a new contract afterwards for more money. Maybe they did, but that wouldn't be handled through the courts. So we can only interpret the data in front of us.

Voodoo Magic

Quote from: SiL on Jan 13, 2022, 05:50:33 AM
I feel considering the mention of an "amicable" solution it's most likely not an agreement on a deadline, but rather a financial agreement that gives the brothers royalties they feel better reflects the value of the property they helped to create.

"Amicable" is a law term basically meaning agreed by both parties without dispute. Who knows if the Thomas Brothers and 20th Century Studios went on to strike a financial deal, or are currently in negotiations to, but I wouldn't add extra meaning to that term.

SiL

SiL

#538
I suppose it's possible the brothers actually wanted the rights back for whatever reason, but it's incredibly unlikely that was their actual endgame. Their filings spoke to the provision's design as a means of a more equitable negotiation measure for writers, and everyone who seems to know what they're talking about seems to believe that was intent.

It's hardly premature or reading too much into anything to assume there's a good chance this was a financial settlement and not Disney inexplicably handing over the rights to a franchise they're clearly interested in exploiting.

People put far too much emphasis on the arguing over dates, as though that was the actual issue at play. It wasn't. They invoked the provision to return the rights; this normally triggers a discussion and negotiation. In this case it didn't, as Fox seemed to just ignore the whole thing, and so they were legally obliged to follow through. When the dates were argued they reapplied to keep their application to revoke open, otherwise they would've lost that bargaining chip.

The issue has always been about rights and their worth, not dates.

Voodoo Magic

Quote from: SiL on Jan 13, 2022, 09:19:32 PM
Their filings spoke to the provision's design as a means of a more equitable negotiation measure for writers, and everyone who seems to know what they're talking about seems to believe that was intent.

We talked about this before. You're refering to the statuary background potion which is exactly what it is, statutory background of the 1976 Copyright Act. It doesn't represent the Thomas Brothers actual claim nor gives us any indication of what the Thomas Brothers motives are and what will they do when or if they reclaim the US Copyright back (even if we all have our personal suspicions.)

QuoteIt's hardly premature or reading too much into anything to assume there's a good chance this was a financial settlement and not Disney inexplicably handing over the rights to a franchise they're clearly interested in exploiting.

One can make assumptions, guess, speculate, certainly, but we won't in our article.

QuotePeople put far too much emphasis on the arguing over dates, as though that was the actual issue at play. It wasn't. They invoked the provision to return the rights; this normally triggers a discussion and negotiation. In this case it didn't, as Fox seemed to just ignore the whole thing, and so they were legally obliged to follow through. When the dates were argued they reapplied to keep their application to revoke open, otherwise they would've lost that bargaining chip.

We have Miller currently sitting with his "Friday the 13th" US rights back and we have Barker currently sitting with his "Hellraiser" US rights back, with a date decided by settlement. This is precedent enough not to declare what normally happens in cases where authors getting rights back in regards to spec scripts that turned into big franchises.

QuoteThe issue has always been about rights and their worth, not dates.

Rights, no proof yet of worth. Lawsuits are literal. These lawsuits were indeed about dates, about when the inevitability of those rights changing hands is supposed to occur. What Thomas Brothers endgame is, what they actually want to do with it... sell it back... always own a piece... negotiate some creative control.. shelve it, we're not going to assume, whatever we believe the odds favor. We're not in the heads of the Thomas Brothers so we won't pretend to be. We'll just report as it unfolds.

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