*link removed. Please don't share links to this pirated footage in the public boards. Hicks.*
Soooo tempting, but I can't do it! Or can I? :-\
I downloaded it and after I did it said, "this file can harm your computer." So I discarded it. Sounds like a virus.
'tis easier to suppress the first desire, than to satisfy all that follow it.
People, don't click. Experience it in the theater! Experiencing the movie like this is unhealthy. Experience the content the way it was meant to be experienced. Viral content is one thing, this is another.
I wanted to, but yeah, probably a virus, in'it?
Quote from: NickisSmart on Apr 27, 2017, 08:38:50 PM
I wanted to, but yeah, probably a virus, in'it?
yeah I got a warning thing
NO VIRUS. Ridley know how to direct!!!
Great looking movie, although this clip is poorly recorded :laugh:
I downloaded from the browser and it's not a virus. The footage is sideways though. I'll see it the right way.
Ive downloaded it but im just resisting temptation as im holding out to see the neomorph scenes at the cinema.
I watched a few seconds of the crew talking. Acting seems good.
I watched it and now I have been infected with an alien virus, my back feels weird guys....
Backburster is f**king awesome... :D
Intense sequence.
I want to watch it, but I feel like I should wait...
Someone told me that the
Spoiler
throat burster
made them feel sick when they saw it.
Quote from: echobbase79 on Apr 27, 2017, 08:59:45 PM
Someone told me that the Spoiler
throat burster
Yes, its quite brutal.
Quote from: echobbase79 on Apr 27, 2017, 08:59:45 PM
Someone told me that the Spoiler
throat burster
yeah did you watch it or saving for theaters?
So is this a virus or not. I don't want an alien to monitorburst from my screen!
Quote from: salomonj on Apr 27, 2017, 09:06:24 PM
Quote from: echobbase79 on Apr 27, 2017, 08:59:45 PM
Someone told me that the Spoiler
throat burster
yeah did you watch it or saving for theaters?
Saving for theaters. I just watched when the drop ship broke off from the Covenant. Why's there always a storm happening when these ships go in for a landing?
Quote from: whiterabbit on Apr 27, 2017, 09:06:56 PM
So is this a virus or not. I don't want an alien to monitorburst from my screen!
No virus.
Oh and btw guys, you can use alt + the numpad keys to rotate video in mpc. Just an fyi. alt + 1 to go left, 5 to reset, etc.
Just found the footage right-side up on FB. Impressive so far.
Can't tell who to root for more in that ugly situation, Karine or Faris. I do like Amy Seimetz (Faris) a lot from other work and she is great in the opening landing sequence
I watched it. I liked it. Mostly.
WOW ;D anyone else hungry? :laugh:
So do these burstings top the original?
I am still very iffy on the creative direction overall, but that neomorph sequence is exactly the level of horror and suspense the franchise has needed back for a long time. Really impressive from top to bottom.
I don't think it tops the original chestburster in terms of intensity but it's still quite gross. I was incredibly impressed with the little creature that emerges. I do think they skimped a little on showing what it did to Karine, but that may just be the cut for the preview or the quality of the handheld recording (which is HD, but still recorded off the screen).
Also: Excellent music, especially when the neomorph emerges.
Quote from: echobbase79 on Apr 27, 2017, 09:19:33 PM
So do these burstings top the original?
Well, I'm a gorehound, and when I saw them, I burst (no pun intended) out laughing and cried to myself "That is f**king awesome!"
Straight-up nasty. But the quality of the footage is not the best. Still, it's good enough to see most of what's happening and it's gnarly with a capital G. However, the chest-bursting scene in Alien happens without warning and in Alien: Covenant, because the subjects who 'burst" are sick as dogs for 3-4 minutes leading up to the big moment, it's not exactly a surprise in the same sense. Still, super-gross.
Do they mostly come out at night? Mostly?
Quote from: NickisSmart on Apr 27, 2017, 09:23:00 PM
Well, I'm a gorehound, and when I saw them, I burst (no pun intended) out laughing and cried to myself "That is f**king awesome!"
Straight-up nasty. But the quality of the footage is not the best.
On the version I saw you could enhance it to HD - far from ideal in a tiny box off the screen, but still pretty detailed.
It wasn't as violent as I thought it was going to be but oh man those little neomorphs are f**king great! Plus the effects clearly weren't finished, plus the video is cam-quality.
Quote from: Enoch on Apr 27, 2017, 09:15:00 PM
Quote from: NickisSmart on Apr 27, 2017, 09:13:57 PM
I watched it. I liked it. Mostly.
Mostly? :D
Spoiler
I thought the neomorphs looked rather digital, and not entirely in a convincing way. But this could just be the footage I watched. It is no doubt incomplete footage. And cam-quality (though today's phone cameras are admittedly pretty powerful).
.
I can post a quick video (under 5 minutes long) and give my impressions, if people like.
Me on the Alien day here un Spain:
https://mobile.twitter.com/John_D_Reviews/status/857317257457872897/photo/1
Quote from: NickisSmart on Apr 27, 2017, 09:25:04 PM
Quote from: Enoch on Apr 27, 2017, 09:15:00 PM
Quote from: NickisSmart on Apr 27, 2017, 09:13:57 PM
I watched it. I liked it. Mostly.
Mostly? :D
Spoiler
I thought the neomorphs looked rather digital, and not entirely in a convincing way. But this could just be the footage I watched. It is no doubt incomplete footage. And cam-quality (though today's phone cameras are admittedly pretty powerful).
I can post a quick video (under 5 minutes long) and give my impressions, if people like.
Sure, I'd watch it.
I saw the 10 minutes and they are mindblowing.
Quote from: NickisSmart on Apr 27, 2017, 09:25:04 PM
Quote from: Enoch on Apr 27, 2017, 09:15:00 PM
Quote from: NickisSmart on Apr 27, 2017, 09:13:57 PM
I watched it. I liked it. Mostly.
Mostly? :D
Spoiler
I thought the neomorphs looked rather digital, and not entirely in a convincing way. But this could just be the footage I watched. It is no doubt incomplete footage. And cam-quality (though today's phone cameras are admittedly pretty powerful).
I can post a quick video (under 5 minutes long) and give my impressions, if people like.
Yeah, I'd like to hear them. If you can avoid spoiling the buster scenes themselves that'd be cool.
Speaking of neomorphs did you guy noticed
Spoiler
that that baby neomorph escaped the explosion?
Quote from: Enoch on Apr 27, 2017, 09:39:59 PM
Speaking of neomorphs did you guy noticed
Spoiler
that that baby neomorph escaped the explosion?
I didn't see that, no. I thought
Spoiler
Faris' body rolled down the landing platform, though.
Who was it who got the mouthburster?
Quote from: SpeedyMaxx on Apr 27, 2017, 09:40:39 PM
Quote from: Enoch on Apr 27, 2017, 09:39:59 PM
Speaking of neomorphs did you guy noticed
Spoiler
that that baby neomorph escaped the explosion?
I didn't see that, no. I thought Spoiler
Faris' body rolled down the landing platform, though.
Who was it who got the mouthburster?
Spoiler
one of the gay guys I think
Quote from: SpeedyMaxx on Apr 27, 2017, 09:40:39 PM
Who was it who got the mouthburster?
Spoiler
Baby neomorph 100% escaped, watch again! Just after first burst!!! Faris body rolled after the final explosion! ;)
Spoiler
Lope's boyfriend got the mouthburster I think...
Edit: Yes, Hallett!
Oh, I thought it might be him. Poor guy.
How could you tell
Spoiler
it escaped? I thought it got caught up in the blast.
You see it
Spoiler
run out the ramp and away.
decided to watch it. indeed. that's gory. nasty.
i feel bad for carmen ejogo's treatment in the movie though. I'll admit she looks so absolutely gorgeous that i get a soft spot for her,
but i think her 'death' if you may, was a bit meh. yes, the creature was rather vicious in it's attack, but i don't understand why it didnt
prefer to flee from the scene first and foremost. it attacked ejogo, i liked it got a good boot to the wall though. But then it just clawed and bited,
but despite having a good amount of blood, i didnt take that as much convincing it was any way directly lethal.
also rather prometheus level stupidity to gun on it, and destroy the ship instead of running outside to be confronted by yet another, but hey, plot conveniant i guess.
throatburster scene was much better to be honest. the backburster was uncomfortable, but not as shocking as i expected. despite the actor doing a absolutely stellar job, man, that was some great acting it must be said, it didnt do much honestly.
the throatbursting looked a lot more gruesome and nasty. that was really uncomfortable to watch.
it thenk took off bambi-burster style, suprisingly, as its 'brother' immediately attacked its surroundings.
but i must say i had a feeling of definitive unease with the throatburster scene. cinematically well done.
Karine is a better person than I am to touch that dude. No chance. I did like how, after all the fussing over touching things and contamination,
Spoiler
Faris still leaves and locks them in despite already being 'contaminated' herself by the spray of blood from Ledward's back.
That's a human reaction. Though she does then
Spoiler
go for the guns and try to save Karine - too little too late.
I love Carmen Ejogo but I still can't tell if she is using her natural British accent in the movie or if it just comes out when she's screaming.
Quote from: cliffhanger on Apr 27, 2017, 09:44:25 PM
also rather prometheus level stupidity to gun on it
She was injured and terrified, and the thing was jumping all over the place. She could not have outrun it. I think her leg might have been broken.
Ok well, that was intense!!
Religious fcks and hipsters, and there you are, being asshanded on an alien planet, this movie is gonna be awesome!!
Just saw it and ...
H
O
L
Y
S
H
I
T
! ! !
This 10 minutes clip is 10 times better than Prometheus itself.
So this is the aftermath of throat burster?
Spoiler
(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FFheUtQS.png&hash=c9499564f3efb71d4616de3db6481e4a6d357d1a)
Quote from: echobbase79 on Apr 27, 2017, 09:49:04 PM
So this is the aftermath of throat burster?
Spoiler
(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FFheUtQS.png&hash=c9499564f3efb71d4616de3db6481e4a6d357d1a)
Looks like.
not sure, i get the feeling that's the aftermath of a more adult nemorph on someone else, which was visible in the trailer.
btw, scene reminded me a bit of the moments when holloway was infected and then later fifield sits like a zombie and unleashes havoc on the crew.
They pulled the punch on Holloway - I was expecting him to turn into a psychotic mutant. And the Fifield sequence in the final film is too brief (they also should've gone with the CG version, IMO). This material is much more satisfying on that level.
Haven't read any spoilers in this thread (thanks btw for being considerate) but on the surface it sounds like a lot happens in this ten minutes so for that reason I'm out.
The amount of stuff I watched for Prometheus pretty much ruined the film (not that it needed much help IMO) as there wasn't that much I hadn't seen or couldn't put together in terms of the story.
After the latest Shaw / David sequence yesterday (from which I gather no one is sure how much if any of it will be in the film) and the rest of the trailers and prologues (which have exposed quite a lot) I'm stopping for the next two weeks.
Hopefully it makes the experience of the film better. Wish me luck!
Quote from: SpeedyMaxx on Apr 27, 2017, 09:56:18 PM
They pulled the punch on Holloway - I was expecting him to turn into a psychotic mutant. And the Fifield sequence in the final film is too brief (they also should've gone with the CG version, IMO). This material is much more satisfying on that level.
Yeah, I totally agree with you there. What was the reasoning for changing that anyway?
Yeah, I think it may have been a mistake for them to show so much. OTOH, I think there is a concerted effort by Fox and Scott to try and win back lapsed fans and releasing this material is a part of that.
Quote from: echobbase79 on Apr 27, 2017, 09:57:31 PM
Quote from: SpeedyMaxx on Apr 27, 2017, 09:56:18 PM
They pulled the punch on Holloway - I was expecting him to turn into a psychotic mutant. And the Fifield sequence in the final film is too brief (they also should've gone with the CG version, IMO). This material is much more satisfying on that level.
Yeah, I totally agree with you there. What was the reasoning for changing that anyway?
IIRC Scott decided he was enamored of doing it practically with the actor - which I can understand - which he felt would be more real. It was technically, but I thought the original sequence looked fine and was far more strange.
I do really hope the VFX gets polished and it's not the latest build.
Spoiler
Mouahahaha it was so bad I was laughing.
Gore here, gore there, a bit more gore here...
No tension, barely any kind of suspense.
It's like a re-act of Fifield attack. Except they thought doubling it would make it better.
Also the there and back again and there and back again and there and back again totally made me laugh.
It's funny cos I think he tried to show people as realistically as possible in panic situation but for some reason, I can't feel the panic :D Same problem Prometheus had, poor edit kills the action on screen.
Anyone else got the "do the Mario" song vibe when you saw this?
Spoiler
(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi68.tinypic.com%2F300d6dh.jpg&hash=b3639f1c18b3db269f53cee9099dd6792f8789a9)
The first part, dropship sequence is very reminiscent of Aliens or rather a mix of Alien and Aliens in a rather unspectacular way, with utterly forgettable modern style jokes that have no place in this series, unlike Aliens where the humor felt real. The cast is hit and miss. Overall that scene at least looked good and is serviceable, nothing to write home about.
The second part is a very much in essence a post 2000 b-grade sci-fi material. It's vicious and violent but nothing about it is shocking or scary nowadays. It's impossible look past the obvious cgi yet parts of it look really fkn good. It would be a lot more effective if they didn't show the creature that much and left out all the unconvincing bits. The cgi is completely overused, is this a cartoon or a videogame or what. Have some standards! I feel i have to tape it on to a very dirty vhs to hide the shitty effects. Don't kid yourseld by thinking that the cgi will improve.
They should wear their freakin helmets, the crew is no wiser than the incompetent idiots from Promethus.
I'll watch it to see how David is handled, but from now it's pretty safe to say that this film will not touch the original trilogy.
Quote from: Le Celticant on Apr 27, 2017, 10:00:05 PM
I do really hope the VFX gets polished and it's not the latest build.
Spoiler
Mouahahaha it was so bad I was laughing.
Gore here, gore there, a bit more gore here...
No tension, barely any kind of suspense.
It's like a re-act of Fifield attack. Except they thought doubling it would make it better.
Also the there and back again and there and back again and there and back again totally made me laugh.
It's funny cos I think he tried to show people as realistically as possible in panic situation but for some reason, I can't feel the panic :D Same problem Prometheus had, poor edit kills the action on screen.
What did you expect seeing Alien coming through the spine and throat? No blood? It has to be bloodshed.
No tension? Barely any kind of suspence? No panic? We might have seen different video clip :)
Poor edit? Are you for real? :) This is one of the best editing I have ever seen in action sequence. It's mindlowing!
Quote from: Ingwar on Apr 27, 2017, 10:11:12 PM
Quote from: Le Celticant on Apr 27, 2017, 10:00:05 PM
I do really hope the VFX gets polished and it's not the latest build.
Spoiler
Mouahahaha it was so bad I was laughing.
Gore here, gore there, a bit more gore here...
No tension, barely any kind of suspense.
It's like a re-act of Fifield attack. Except they thought doubling it would make it better.
Also the there and back again and there and back again and there and back again totally made me laugh.
It's funny cos I think he tried to show people as realistically as possible in panic situation but for some reason, I can't feel the panic :D Same problem Prometheus had, poor edit kills the action on screen.
What did you expect seeing Alien coming through the spine and throat? No blood? It has to be bloodshed.
No tension? Barely any kind of suspence? No panic? We might have seen different video clip :)
Poor edit? Are you for real? :) This is one of the best editing I have ever seen in action sequence. It's mindlowing!
The utterly fake color grading and overused cgi makes it about as scary as watching Milla Jovovich kick a dog in a Resident Evil.
. .you really hate everything about this movie. .nothing is sacred either. .it's always negative with you. .no mattet how this movie turns out. .nothings gonna please you. .not an attack but then why come here if all u do is have a negative opinion about every aspect and detail?. . .can't u just apreciate that we getting another alien movie. .did u actually apreciate any alien movie so far?
Quote from: reecebomb on Apr 27, 2017, 10:08:40 PM
The first part, dropship sequence is very reminiscent of Aliens or rather a mix of Alien and Aliens in a rather unspectacular way, with utterly forgettable modern style jokes that have no place in this series, unlike Aliens where the humor felt real. The cast is hit and miss. Overall that scene at least looked good and is serviceable, nothing to write home about.
The second part is a very much in essence a post 2000 b-grade sci-fi material. It's vicious and violent but nothing about it is shocking or scary nowadays. It's impossible look past the obvious cgi yet parts of it look really fkn good. It would be a lot more effective if they didn't show the creature that much and left out all the unconvincing bits. The cgi is completely overused, is this a cartoon or a videogame or what. Have some standards! I feel i have to tape it on to a very dirty vhs to hide the shitty effects. Don't kid yourseld by thinking that the cgi will improve.
They should wear their freakin helmets, the crew is no wiser than the incompetent idiots from Promethus.
I'll watch it to see how David is handled, but from now it's pretty safe to say that this film will not touch the original trilogy.
It could be your lack of imagination?
Ever been to another country like Thailand or Mexico, and got food poisoning or you got really sick all of a sudden due to bad hyghiene there, well imagine that, but ten or fifty times worse and you are as a young man running back to your ship because you really dont wanna die, and heavily breathing, feeling like you got a 100 degrees fever, i already felt that part when i saw him stumbling towars the dropship.
After that you see the neo climbing onto the woman on the ground, my mother has a jack russel, same size as the neomorph when born, a jack russel when in hype mode, all of his muscles tighten up and he just feels like a stone ball and is strong as hell and is gonna get what he wants, now imagine a alien small neomorph with the power of maybe 20 jack russell terriers? and being slippery as hell, feeling like a wet slippery newborn baby with spikes and claws, and going for your throat and you cant do much about it, cut it open and what happens? acid bloods pours over your chest?? i dont know but i instantly felt pretty sorry for those two people.
Quote from: Ingwar on Apr 27, 2017, 10:11:12 PM
Quote from: Le Celticant on Apr 27, 2017, 10:00:05 PM
I do really hope the VFX gets polished and it's not the latest build.
Spoiler
Mouahahaha it was so bad I was laughing.
Gore here, gore there, a bit more gore here...
No tension, barely any kind of suspense.
It's like a re-act of Fifield attack. Except they thought doubling it would make it better.
Also the there and back again and there and back again and there and back again totally made me laugh.
It's funny cos I think he tried to show people as realistically as possible in panic situation but for some reason, I can't feel the panic :D Same problem Prometheus had, poor edit kills the action on screen.
What did you expect seeing Alien coming through the spine and throat? No blood? It has to be bloodshed.
No tension? Barely any kind of suspence? No panic? We might have seen different video clip :)
Poor edit? Are you for real? :) This is one of the best editing I have ever seen in action sequence. It's mindlowing!
Have to agree. This is one of the best action sequences of all time. I just saw this filmed clip and its great but way scarier on the big screen
Quote from: Infected on Apr 27, 2017, 10:15:29 PM
Quote from: reecebomb on Apr 27, 2017, 10:08:40 PM
The first part, dropship sequence is very reminiscent of Aliens or rather a mix of Alien and Aliens in a rather unspectacular way, with utterly forgettable modern style jokes that have no place in this series, unlike Aliens where the humor felt real. The cast is hit and miss. Overall that scene at least looked good and is serviceable, nothing to write home about.
The second part is a very much in essence a post 2000 b-grade sci-fi material. It's vicious and violent but nothing about it is shocking or scary nowadays. It's impossible look past the obvious cgi yet parts of it look really fkn good. It would be a lot more effective if they didn't show the creature that much and left out all the unconvincing bits. The cgi is completely overused, is this a cartoon or a videogame or what. Have some standards! I feel i have to tape it on to a very dirty vhs to hide the shitty effects. Don't kid yourseld by thinking that the cgi will improve.
They should wear their freakin helmets, the crew is no wiser than the incompetent idiots from Promethus.
I'll watch it to see how David is handled, but from now it's pretty safe to say that this film will not touch the original trilogy.
It could be your lack of imagination?
Ever been to another country like Thailand or Mexico, and got food poisoning or you got really sick all of a sudden due to bad hyghiene there, well imagine that, but ten or fifty times worse and you are as a young man running back to your ship because you really dont wanna die, and heavily breathing, feeling like you got a 100 degrees fever, i already felt that part when i saw him stumbling towars the dropship.
After that you see the neo climbing onto the woman on the ground, my mother has a jack russel, same size as the neomorph when born, a jack russel when in hype mode, all of his muscles tighten up and he just feels like a stone ball and is strong as hell and is gonna get what he wants, now imagine a alien small neomorph with the power of maybe 20 jack russell terriers? and being slippery as hell, feeling like a wet slippery newborn baby with spikes and claws, and going for your throat and you cant do much about it, cut it open and what happens? acid bloods pours over your chest?? i dont know but i instantly felt pretty sorry for those two people.
I've been to Thailand, never had any food poisoning there or anywhere. Can't see how this is related to this though. Are you comparing eating in Thailand and having the shits from up and below with being on a unknown planet with no cautionary procedures.
I believe that well shot jack russel attack will be far more scarier than this space fantasy.
Wow. That was incredibly well done.
The CGI -is- a bit wonky on the neomorphs and I'm not sure why they didn't go entirely practical for it. That said, Prometheus had nearly flawless CGI in the end so I'm not worried.
But wow. I don't regret watching that in the least. Amazing. Can't wait for the whole movie.
Quote from: reecebomb on Apr 27, 2017, 10:22:50 PM
Quote from: Infected on Apr 27, 2017, 10:15:29 PM
Quote from: reecebomb on Apr 27, 2017, 10:08:40 PM
The first part, dropship sequence is very reminiscent of Aliens or rather a mix of Alien and Aliens in a rather unspectacular way, with utterly forgettable modern style jokes that have no place in this series, unlike Aliens where the humor felt real. The cast is hit and miss. Overall that scene at least looked good and is serviceable, nothing to write home about.
The second part is a very much in essence a post 2000 b-grade sci-fi material. It's vicious and violent but nothing about it is shocking or scary nowadays. It's impossible look past the obvious cgi yet parts of it look really fkn good. It would be a lot more effective if they didn't show the creature that much and left out all the unconvincing bits. The cgi is completely overused, is this a cartoon or a videogame or what. Have some standards! I feel i have to tape it on to a very dirty vhs to hide the shitty effects. Don't kid yourseld by thinking that the cgi will improve.
They should wear their freakin helmets, the crew is no wiser than the incompetent idiots from Promethus.
I'll watch it to see how David is handled, but from now it's pretty safe to say that this film will not touch the original trilogy.
It could be your lack of imagination?
Ever been to another country like Thailand or Mexico, and got food poisoning or you got really sick all of a sudden due to bad hyghiene there, well imagine that, but ten or fifty times worse and you are as a young man running back to your ship because you really dont wanna die, and heavily breathing, feeling like you got a 100 degrees fever, i already felt that part when i saw him stumbling towars the dropship.
After that you see the neo climbing onto the woman on the ground, my mother has a jack russel, same size as the neomorph when born, a jack russel when in hype mode, all of his muscles tighten up and he just feels like a stone ball and is strong as hell and is gonna get what he wants, now imagine a alien small neomorph with the power of maybe 20 jack russell terriers? and being slippery as hell, feeling like a wet slippery newborn baby with spikes and claws, and going for your throat and you cant do much about it, cut it open and what happens? acid bloods pours over your chest?? i dont know but i instantly felt pretty sorry for those two people.
I've been to Thailand, never had any food poisoning there or anywhere. Can't see how this is related to this though. Are you comparing eating in Thailand and having the shits from up and below with being on a unknown planet with no cautionary procedures.
I believe that well shot jack russel attack will be far more scarier than this space fantasy.
Well then it proves my point, its not the movie, its your lack of imagination.
If you didnt get my reference of food poisoning with the situation on Covenant, then its not the movie.
Thanks for your cooperation.
Quote from: reecebomb on Apr 27, 2017, 10:13:59 PM
The utterly fake color grading and overused cgi makes it about as scary as watching Milla Jovovich kick a dog in a Resident Evil.
I end that "conversation" :)
Quote from: juxtapose on Apr 27, 2017, 10:14:26 PM
. .you really hate everything about this movie. .nothing is sacred either. .it's always negative with you. .no mattet how this movie turns out. .nothings gonna please you. .not an attack but then why come here if all u do is have a negative opinion about every aspect and detail?. . .can't u just apreciate that we getting another alien movie. .did u actually apreciate any alien movie so far?
Some people just don't like anything. Just leave it. No point of getting angry about things we cannot change.
Quote from: juxtapose on Apr 27, 2017, 10:14:26 PM
. .you really hate everything about this movie. .nothing is sacred either. .it's always negative with you. .no mattet how this movie turns out. .nothings gonna please you. .not an attack but then why come here if all u do is have a negative opinion about every aspect and detail?. . .can't u just apreciate that we getting another alien movie. .did u actually apreciate any alien movie so far?
Pretty sure i'm not all negative, there are some aspects i still look forward to. But so far what i've seen gives a huge cause for concern. For me Alien is pretty sacred as far as movies go. I'd rather have no Alien film than a shitty one, so why should i appreciate it. Just for being made?
I like how the Neomorph's movements seem to be foreshadowing the xenomorph's spider-like body stance and propensity to break through glass later on in the movie.
Quote from: Le Celticant on Apr 27, 2017, 10:00:05 PM
I do really hope the VFX gets polished and it's not the latest build.
Spoiler
Mouahahaha it was so bad I was laughing.
Gore here, gore there, a bit more gore here...
No tension, barely any kind of suspense.
It's like a re-act of Fifield attack. Except they thought doubling it would make it better.
Also the there and back again and there and back again and there and back again totally made me laugh.
It's funny cos I think he tried to show people as realistically as possible in panic situation but for some reason, I can't feel the panic :D Same problem Prometheus had, poor edit kills the action on screen.
You haven't seen it in context.
Not being rude but I think you're all a bunch of idiots for watching the backburster scene. That's the sort of thing that needs context and build up, if you don't have that it's gore and spoils the scene.
I watched the drop ship scene and breathed a sigh of relief that it's not as stilted as the last supper promo.
Quote from: Ingwar on Apr 27, 2017, 10:11:12 PM
Quote from: Le Celticant on Apr 27, 2017, 10:00:05 PM
I do really hope the VFX gets polished and it's not the latest build.
Spoiler
Mouahahaha it was so bad I was laughing.
Gore here, gore there, a bit more gore here...
No tension, barely any kind of suspense.
It's like a re-act of Fifield attack. Except they thought doubling it would make it better.
Also the there and back again and there and back again and there and back again totally made me laugh.
It's funny cos I think he tried to show people as realistically as possible in panic situation but for some reason, I can't feel the panic :D Same problem Prometheus had, poor edit kills the action on screen.
What did you expect seeing Alien coming through the spine and throat? No blood? It has to be bloodshed.
No tension? Barely any kind of suspence? No panic? We might have seen different video clip :)
Poor edit? Are you for real? :) This is one of the best editing I have ever seen in action sequence. It's mindlowing!
Well just to point 1 edit problem that struck me:
Spoiler
The "Lock" door shot of a few frames.
Problem? Well I don't care when she "reveals" that she has locked her.
Because:
1) I had this information prior to the interaction of the two character.
2) Something happened in between (rather long) that I forgot about her and considered her dead already.
So when she goes back to the med bay I'm like "Oh wait... again? ok show me the drama you have locked her please... ok done, next.
Showing it was merely to pick my curiosity.
So what's left? Yeah please show me the bloodbath... and... here... we... go! Ok, next? Oh yeah the shotgun.
She lost it... oh yeah the shotgun again.
You seriously need to open an NLE if you think it's genius edit.
It's a few frame, but it's enough to kill the entire action.
Quote from: juxtapose on Apr 27, 2017, 10:14:26 PM
. .you really hate everything about this movie. .nothing is sacred either. .it's always negative with you. .no mattet how this movie turns out. .nothings gonna please you. .not an attack but then why come here if all u do is have a negative opinion about every aspect and detail?. . .can't u just apreciate that we getting another alien movie. .did u actually apreciate any alien movie so far?
Hm blablabla hater/lover non argument.
I'm full of positive vibe, just not for this film. And it's not like I want to hate it.
At this point I barely care, I just come to see if it can surprises me in any way.
Not this time, maybe tomorrow who knows? ::)
Conext is that some of the crew got infected. It's no brainer.
So neomorph process is a like a super cancer? From infection to the birth of the new beast seems fairly fast.
Quote from: echobbase79 on Apr 27, 2017, 10:41:12 PM
So neomorph process is a like a super cancer? From infection to the birth of the new beast seems fairly fast.
I guess we don't know how long they've been out there/when they ingested the spores?
Quote from: Ingwar on Apr 27, 2017, 10:25:39 PM
Quote from: reecebomb on Apr 27, 2017, 10:13:59 PM
The utterly fake color grading and overused cgi makes it about as scary as watching Milla Jovovich kick a dog in a Resident Evil.
I end that "conversation" :)
Quote from: juxtapose on Apr 27, 2017, 10:14:26 PM
. .you really hate everything about this movie. .nothing is sacred either. .it's always negative with you. .no mattet how this movie turns out. .nothings gonna please you. .not an attack but then why come here if all u do is have a negative opinion about every aspect and detail?. . .can't u just apreciate that we getting another alien movie. .did u actually apreciate any alien movie so far?
Some people just don't like anything. Just leave it. No point of getting angry about things we cannot change.
So the shark breaking through the glass in Jaws 3D is actually good and i think it's not too scary because i lack imagination?
I saw this at a Regal RPX showing with Alien and everyone in the theatre seemed pretty well hyped afterwards and enjoyed what they saw. I would highly advise anyone who has not seen it in the theatre to not watch this because it might take away from seein it fresh properly and not with someone's head in the field of view and covering 20% of the screen!
That being said, I do think the CGI on the
Spoiler
neomorphs
could use some touching up. Anyone know if its too late for them to make final edits? Perhaps this footage was submitted a while ago and it has already been polished up. I know someone else on here was complaining about the blood but I feel the amount and color of the blood was perfectly done. Either way, still an intense and well done scene and has me properly hyped.
Quote from: Ingwar on Apr 27, 2017, 10:39:04 PM
Conext is that some of the crew got infected. It's no brainer.
There's no build up to the scene in a thematic way. That's context.
Quote from: Le Celticant on Apr 27, 2017, 10:38:49 PM
Quote from: Ingwar on Apr 27, 2017, 10:11:12 PM
Quote from: Le Celticant on Apr 27, 2017, 10:00:05 PM
I do really hope the VFX gets polished and it's not the latest build.
Spoiler
Mouahahaha it was so bad I was laughing.
Gore here, gore there, a bit more gore here...
No tension, barely any kind of suspense.
It's like a re-act of Fifield attack. Except they thought doubling it would make it better.
Also the there and back again and there and back again and there and back again totally made me laugh.
It's funny cos I think he tried to show people as realistically as possible in panic situation but for some reason, I can't feel the panic :D Same problem Prometheus had, poor edit kills the action on screen.
What did you expect seeing Alien coming through the spine and throat? No blood? It has to be bloodshed.
No tension? Barely any kind of suspence? No panic? We might have seen different video clip :)
Poor edit? Are you for real? :) This is one of the best editing I have ever seen in action sequence. It's mindlowing!
Well just to point 1 edit problem that struck me:
Spoiler
The "Lock" door shot of a few frames.
Problem? Well I don't care when she "reveals" that she has locked her.
Because:
1) I had this information prior to the interaction of the two character.
2) Something happened in between (rather long) that I forgot about her and considered her dead already.
So when she goes back to the med bay I'm like "Oh wait... again? ok show me the drama you have locked her please... ok done, next.
Showing it was merely to pick my curiosity.
So what's left? Yeah please show me the bloodbath... and... here... we... go! Ok, next? Oh yeah the shotgun.
She lost it... oh yeah the shotgun again.
You seriously need to open an NLE if you think it's genius edit.
It's a few frame, but it's enough to kill the entire action.
1. Because you have that information (that she's locked) it doesn't mean that the character cannot reveal that. Characters don't give a monkey about your reaction because they "exist" in different reality. Action scenes should be as realistis as possible and this one is.
2. You consider her dead already? I haven't. So here we go.
Seriously you should get out more often.
The effort some people put in to hate a product they are by no means forced to grapple with never ceases to amaze me. :D
Quote from: hfeldhaus on Apr 27, 2017, 10:44:09 PM
Quote from: Ingwar on Apr 27, 2017, 10:39:04 PM
Conext is that some of the crew got infected. It's no brainer.
There's no build up to the scene in a thematic way. That's context.
Fine but even without that context I have enjoyed it immensely. Besides I can figure out thematic way. It's straight forward.
The people complaining about this footage are crazy! :o
Well.. maybe I'm exaggerating a little bit, but I think it's pretty damn good. The only complaint I have is that the CGI could be a little bit better.
Quote from: Evanus on Apr 27, 2017, 10:49:18 PM
The people complaining about this footage are crazy! :o
Tell me about it :)
Quote from: Ingwar on Apr 27, 2017, 10:46:09 PM
Quote from: Le Celticant on Apr 27, 2017, 10:38:49 PM
Quote from: Ingwar on Apr 27, 2017, 10:11:12 PM
Quote from: Le Celticant on Apr 27, 2017, 10:00:05 PM
I do really hope the VFX gets polished and it's not the latest build.
Spoiler
Mouahahaha it was so bad I was laughing.
Gore here, gore there, a bit more gore here...
No tension, barely any kind of suspense.
It's like a re-act of Fifield attack. Except they thought doubling it would make it better.
Also the there and back again and there and back again and there and back again totally made me laugh.
It's funny cos I think he tried to show people as realistically as possible in panic situation but for some reason, I can't feel the panic :D Same problem Prometheus had, poor edit kills the action on screen.
What did you expect seeing Alien coming through the spine and throat? No blood? It has to be bloodshed.
No tension? Barely any kind of suspence? No panic? We might have seen different video clip :)
Poor edit? Are you for real? :) This is one of the best editing I have ever seen in action sequence. It's mindlowing!
Well just to point 1 edit problem that struck me:
Spoiler
The "Lock" door shot of a few frames.
Problem? Well I don't care when she "reveals" that she has locked her.
Because:
1) I had this information prior to the interaction of the two character.
2) Something happened in between (rather long) that I forgot about her and considered her dead already.
So when she goes back to the med bay I'm like "Oh wait... again? ok show me the drama you have locked her please... ok done, next.
Showing it was merely to pick my curiosity.
So what's left? Yeah please show me the bloodbath... and... here... we... go! Ok, next? Oh yeah the shotgun.
She lost it... oh yeah the shotgun again.
You seriously need to open an NLE if you think it's genius edit.
It's a few frame, but it's enough to kill the entire action.
1. Because you have that information (that she's locked) it doesn't mean that the character cannot reveal that. Characters don't give a monkey about your reaction because they "exist" in different reality. Action scenes should be as realistis as possible and this one is.
2. You consider her dead already? I haven't. So here we go.
Seriously you should get out more often.
Of course it can not mean the characters "can't" reveal it, but should it reveal it?
You make a movie for people not for the fictional character?
Spoiler
There's not point showing that after, you already know it.
Imagine Dallas' Vent scene where you show Dallas rushing to escapes.
Then a counter shot showing the Alien on another level setting a trap.
Then back to dallas to fall into the trap BOOM!
Genius edit, yeah ::) I can guarantee the suspense.
And yeah I considered her dead, I have the bad habit to be a filmaker.
All my friends always asks me "how do you know this is going to happen".
I always tell them: It's a no brainer, that's the first thing a rookie would have done.
So yeah, I'd like to be surprised, and it's not really hard to be honest.
The only complaint I haven as well is the CGI. Is there a chance it'll be better in the final product?
Quote from: salomonj on Apr 27, 2017, 10:56:46 PM
The only complaint I haven as well is the CGI. Is there a chance it'll be better in the final product?
This is my concern too. I am not sure how much tuning up they can do at this point but perhaps this footage was submitted a while ago and work has been done between now and then.
Quote from: cucuchu on Apr 27, 2017, 10:58:53 PM
Quote from: salomonj on Apr 27, 2017, 10:56:46 PM
The only complaint I haven as well is the CGI. Is there a chance it'll be better in the final product?
This is my concern too. I am not sure how much tuning up they can do at this point but perhaps this footage was submitted a while ago and work has been done between now and then.
I hope so. I think the Xeno shot on head butting the ship with McBride had updated CGI in the international trailer (I think that was the one)
The VFX doesn't actually "looks" bad (after a second viewing) BUT:
It's just what's happening with it that makes it utterly screams fake on screen.
How can you expect any VFX company to deliver something believable when the script is screaming at you nope.
You got a baby that just erupted from a guy back going full murderer by eating someone alive to then break a window and do monkey style jump inside a ship to kill someone else and expect anyone to believe that?
The script of the action is already screaming fake.
Then of course, there's the actual action and the way the neomorph moves and do thing to kill and escapes. It's pretty unconvincing.
And your brain has no time to adjust, it goes like Fifield scene, full speed in less than 30 seconds you have guys killed, monkey jump, running, screaming, more kill, guy with flamethrower, rover driving, crushing.
It's unreadable, brain be like "Nope this is fake" (and yet it was mostly practical in fifield sequence. For some weird reason, I find the unfinished CG [especially the movement] more unsettling than the zombie real prop).
Quote from: Le Celticant on Apr 27, 2017, 10:56:19 PM
Of course it can not mean the characters "can't" reveal it, but should it reveal it?
You make a movie for people not for the fictional character?
Why shouldn't she? I know that you make movies for people but movies should feel
real and that's what characters should do. Act as real as possible.
Quote from: Le Celticant on Apr 27, 2017, 10:56:19 PM
And yeah I considered her dead, I have the bad habit to be a filmaker.
All my friends always asks me "how do you know this is going to happen".
I always tell them: It's a no brainer, that's the first thing a rookie would have done.
So yeah, I'd like to be surprised, and it's not really hard to be honest.
Sorry but what movies have you made?
Quote from: Ingwar on Apr 27, 2017, 11:05:53 PM
Quote from: Le Celticant on Apr 27, 2017, 10:56:19 PM
Of course it can not mean the characters "can't" reveal it, but should it reveal it?
You make a movie for people not for the fictional character?
Why shouldn't she? I know that you make movies for people but movies should feel real and that's what characters should do. Act as real as possible.
The thing you do not understand then is that showing that she has locked the door is an editing/director's choice.
It has nothing to do with the revealing of the two character.
The reveal could actually work but not with that deliberate shot already showing it.
We know it's going to happen.It's why it kills the action, and I think it's an editing error.
Quote from: Le Celticant on Apr 27, 2017, 11:05:28 PM
The VFX doesn't actually "looks" bad (after a second viewing) BUT:
It's just what's happening with it that makes it utterly screams fake on screen.
How can you expect any VFX company to deliver something believable when the script is screaming at you nope.
You got a baby that just erupted from a guy back going full murderer by eating someone alive to then break a window and do monkey style jump inside a ship to kill someone else and expect anyone to believe that?
The script of the action is already screaming fake.
Then of course, there's the actual action and the way the neomorph moves and do thing to kill and escapes. It's pretty unconvincing.
And your brain has no time to adjust, it goes like Fifield scene, full speed in less than 30 seconds you have guys killed, monkey jump, running, screaming, more kill, guy with flamethrower, rover driving, crushing.
It's unreadable, brain be like "Nope this is fake" (and yet it was mostly practical in fifield sequence. For some weird reason, I find the unfinished CG [especially the movement] more unsettling than the zombie real prop).
I find nothing unbelievable about a neomorph erupting from someone's back and attacking someone else. Like, why not? Sounds good to me.
QuoteMouahahaha it was so bad I was laughing.
I already got that from the
Mouahahaha.
Quote from: Evanus on Apr 27, 2017, 10:49:18 PM
The people complaining about this footage are crazy! :o
Well.. maybe I'm exaggerating a little bit, but I think it's pretty damn good. The only complaint I have is that the CGI could be a little bit better.
you talk about people complaining, then you complain
Quote from: Le Celticant on Apr 27, 2017, 11:09:47 PM
Quote from: Ingwar on Apr 27, 2017, 11:05:53 PM
Quote from: Le Celticant on Apr 27, 2017, 10:56:19 PM
Of course it can not mean the characters "can't" reveal it, but should it reveal it?
You make a movie for people not for the fictional character?
Why shouldn't she? I know that you make movies for people but movies should feel real and that's what characters should do. Act as real as possible.
The thing you do not understand then is that showing that she has locked the door is an editing/director's choice.
It has nothing to do with the revealing of the two character.
The reveal could actually work but not with that deliberate shot already showing it. We know it's going to happen.
It's why it kills the action, and I think it's an editing error.
It didn't kill the action for me at all.
Quote from: Le Celticant on Apr 27, 2017, 11:05:28 PM
The VFX doesn't actually "looks" bad (after a second viewing) BUT:
It's just what's happening with it that makes it utterly screams fake on screen.
How can you expect any VFX company to deliver something believable when the script is screaming at you nope.
You got a baby that just erupted from a guy back going full murderer by eating someone alive to then break a window and do monkey style jump inside a ship to kill someone else and expect anyone to believe that?
The script of the action is already screaming fake.
Then of course, there's the actual action and the way the neomorph moves and do thing to kill and escapes. It's pretty unconvincing.
And your brain has no time to adjust, it goes like Fifield scene, full speed in less than 30 seconds you have guys killed, monkey jump, running, screaming, more kill, guy with flamethrower, rover driving, crushing.
It's unreadable, brain be like "Nope this is fake" (and yet it was mostly practical in fifield sequence. For some weird reason, I find the unfinished CG [especially the movement] more unsettling than the zombie real prop).
Understand your concerns but I took at as the
Spoiler
neomorph is born insanely aggressive and matures physically literally by the second. I actually quite liked that it could smash through the window because it portrayed it as being the apex of vicious. But yeah That really just comes down to perspective vs context of,how they build up the neomorphs before and after this scene.
Quote from: kwisatz on Apr 27, 2017, 11:10:10 PM
QuoteMouahahaha it was so bad I was laughing.
I already got that from the Mouahahaha.
He
edited that line wrongly :D
Quote from: Ragonk_Force on Apr 27, 2017, 11:11:08 PM
Quote from: Evanus on Apr 27, 2017, 10:49:18 PM
The people complaining about this footage are crazy! :o
Well.. maybe I'm exaggerating a little bit, but I think it's pretty damn good. The only complaint I have is that the CGI could be a little bit better.
you talk about people complaining, then you complain
I think he means bitching. Have one complaint is different than bitching about the entire scene.
Quote from: salomonj on Apr 27, 2017, 11:09:59 PM
I find nothing unbelievable about a neomorph erupting from someone's back and attacking someone else. Like, why not? Sounds good to me.
Sounds bloody good :) It's space horror movie.
:laugh: :laugh:
Quote from: Ingwar on Apr 27, 2017, 11:13:15 PM
Quote from: kwisatz on Apr 27, 2017, 11:10:10 PM
QuoteMouahahaha it was so bad I was laughing.
I already got that from the Mouahahaha.
He edited that line wrongly :D
:laugh: :laugh: :laugh:
Quote from: Enoch on Apr 27, 2017, 09:39:59 PM
Speaking of neomorphs did you guy noticed
Spoiler
that that baby neomorph escaped the explosion?
I'll have to watch it, again. Nice catch! :)
Quote from: Ingwar on Apr 27, 2017, 11:13:15 PM
Quote from: kwisatz on Apr 27, 2017, 11:10:10 PM
QuoteMouahahaha it was so bad I was laughing.
I already got that from the Mouahahaha.
He edited that line wrongly :D
The
line could actually work but not with that deliberate
laugh already showing it.
We know it's going to happen.No offense, pal! 8)
Quote from: Le Celticant on Apr 27, 2017, 11:05:28 PM
The VFX doesn't actually "looks" bad (after a second viewing) BUT:
It's just what's happening with it that makes it utterly screams fake on screen.
How can you expect any VFX company to deliver something believable when the script is screaming at you nope.
You got a baby that just erupted from a guy back going full murderer by eating someone alive to then break a window and do monkey style jump inside a ship to kill someone else and expect anyone to believe that?
The script of the action is already screaming fake.
Then of course, there's the actual action and the way the neomorph moves and do thing to kill and escapes. It's pretty unconvincing.
And your brain has no time to adjust, it goes like Fifield scene, full speed in less than 30 seconds you have guys killed, monkey jump, running, screaming, more kill, guy with flamethrower, rover driving, crushing.
It's unreadable, brain be like "Nope this is fake" (and yet it was mostly practical).
At least they don't crank the shutter speed this time, it felt so out place in Prometheus. The whole sequence in Covenant felt off, fast editing may seem exciting for some but in reality it's rather more tedious than exciting. As i've said it could be much more effective if some of the shitty cgi effects were replaced with something that envokes imagination and perhaps real dread and fear. I believe the editing could be different in the full movie, but afraid that all the cgi will still be there. We'll see. I only watched it once, already i'm forgetting what i saw so i'm not too mad at myself for seeing this.
Quote from: NickisSmart on Apr 27, 2017, 11:16:24 PM
Quote from: Enoch on Apr 27, 2017, 09:39:59 PM
Speaking of neomorphs did you guy noticed
Spoiler
that that baby neomorph escaped the explosion?
I'll have to watch it, again. Nice catch! :)
I didn't catch it on the small clip but in the theater, it is super obvious when he runs out.
Quote from: salomonj on Apr 27, 2017, 11:09:59 PM
Quote from: Le Celticant on Apr 27, 2017, 11:05:28 PM
The VFX doesn't actually "looks" bad (after a second viewing) BUT:
It's just what's happening with it that makes it utterly screams fake on screen.
How can you expect any VFX company to deliver something believable when the script is screaming at you nope.
You got a baby that just erupted from a guy back going full murderer by eating someone alive to then break a window and do monkey style jump inside a ship to kill someone else and expect anyone to believe that?
The script of the action is already screaming fake.
Then of course, there's the actual action and the way the neomorph moves and do thing to kill and escapes. It's pretty unconvincing.
And your brain has no time to adjust, it goes like Fifield scene, full speed in less than 30 seconds you have guys killed, monkey jump, running, screaming, more kill, guy with flamethrower, rover driving, crushing.
It's unreadable, brain be like "Nope this is fake" (and yet it was mostly practical in fifield sequence. For some weird reason, I find the unfinished CG [especially the movement] more unsettling than the zombie real prop).
I find nothing unbelievable about a neomorph erupting from someone's back and attacking someone else. Like, why not? Sounds good to me.
Spoiler
And what about the, ok I stop attacking, I escapes shotgun shot, try to escapes, fail, break the window, jump like a monkey, escapes more shotgun, kawawanga ultimate monkey jump oh no there's a net, more shotgun, boom boom boom BAM! I was wondering if the neomorph wasn't going to show some Samurai skill and takes it's katana.
Quote from: cucuchu on Apr 27, 2017, 11:12:07 PMUnderstand your concerns but I took at as the Spoiler
neomorph is born insanely aggressive and matures physically literally by the second. I actually quite liked that it could smash through the window because it portrayed it as being the apex of vicious. But yeah That really just comes down to perspective vs context of,how they build up the neomorphs before and after this scene.
Spoiler
Sure, but was it necessary (exactly like prometheus scene) to jump between shaw, the captain, vicker, the crew attacked by fifield constantly in a poor edit?
Cos here the:
-I'm getting on the Medbay
-This is the covenant, what's happening?
-I'm telling you what's happening there's something horrible in the medbay
-We're heading back to the ship, we'll be there in minute to help ya
kinda made me think I was seeing a copy/paste version of prometheus already terrible fifield scene where the movie edit starts to completely fall down from there to the next 30 minutes.
Quote from: reecebomb on Apr 27, 2017, 11:18:03 PM
Quote from: Le Celticant on Apr 27, 2017, 11:05:28 PM
The VFX doesn't actually "looks" bad (after a second viewing) BUT:
It's just what's happening with it that makes it utterly screams fake on screen.
How can you expect any VFX company to deliver something believable when the script is screaming at you nope.
You got a baby that just erupted from a guy back going full murderer by eating someone alive to then break a window and do monkey style jump inside a ship to kill someone else and expect anyone to believe that?
The script of the action is already screaming fake.
Then of course, there's the actual action and the way the neomorph moves and do thing to kill and escapes. It's pretty unconvincing.
And your brain has no time to adjust, it goes like Fifield scene, full speed in less than 30 seconds you have guys killed, monkey jump, running, screaming, more kill, guy with flamethrower, rover driving, crushing.
It's unreadable, brain be like "Nope this is fake" (and yet it was mostly practical).
At least they don't crank the shutter speed this time, it felt so out place in Prometheus. The whole sequence in Covenant felt off, fast editing may seem exciting for some but in reality it's rather more tedious than exciting. As i've said it could be much more effective if some of the shitty cgi effects were replaced with something that envokes imagination and perhaps real dread and fear. I believe the editing could be different in the full movie, but afraid that all the cgi will still be there. We'll see. I only watched it ones, already i'm forgetting what i saw so i'm not too mad at miself for seeing this.
Both of you're
opinions are duly noted, but you may be in the minority on this "issue".
Quote from: Le Celticant on Apr 27, 2017, 11:19:25 PM
Quote from: salomonj on Apr 27, 2017, 11:09:59 PM
Quote from: Le Celticant on Apr 27, 2017, 11:05:28 PM
The VFX doesn't actually "looks" bad (after a second viewing) BUT:
It's just what's happening with it that makes it utterly screams fake on screen.
How can you expect any VFX company to deliver something believable when the script is screaming at you nope.
You got a baby that just erupted from a guy back going full murderer by eating someone alive to then break a window and do monkey style jump inside a ship to kill someone else and expect anyone to believe that?
The script of the action is already screaming fake.
Then of course, there's the actual action and the way the neomorph moves and do thing to kill and escapes. It's pretty unconvincing.
And your brain has no time to adjust, it goes like Fifield scene, full speed in less than 30 seconds you have guys killed, monkey jump, running, screaming, more kill, guy with flamethrower, rover driving, crushing.
It's unreadable, brain be like "Nope this is fake" (and yet it was mostly practical in fifield sequence. For some weird reason, I find the unfinished CG [especially the movement] more unsettling than the zombie real prop).
I find nothing unbelievable about a neomorph erupting from someone's back and attacking someone else. Like, why not? Sounds good to me.
Spoiler
And what about the, ok I stop attacking, I escapes shotgun shot, try to escapes, fail, break the window, jump like a monkey, escapes more shotgun, kawawanga ultimate monkey jump oh no there's a net, more shotgun, boom boom boom BAM! I was wondering if the neomorph wasn't going to show some Samurai skill and takes it's katana.
Lmfao. kawawanga ultimate monkey jump?
Sounds like a movie i would watch.
Im just glad MTV prepared my brain to appropriately perceive monkey edited films like Prometheus and Aliens.
My preview of the 10-minute sneak peak of Alien: Covenant. I tried to keep it shorter and not spoil too much, but talk about things in context with the series as a whole:
Overall, I am quite eager to see the finished film, come May 19th.
Okay, I watched up until the they put the guy
Spoiler
on table and Faris tears his shirt off and there's a brief pop where his back begins to go!
I can't spoil that moment on a computer. No way!
I'm loving the feel of this movie. And Ridley said he couldn't make Aliens scary again!?! Right...
Quote from: echobbase79 on Apr 27, 2017, 11:39:52 PM
Okay, I watched up until the they put the guySpoiler
on table and Faris tears his shirt off and there's a brief pop where his back begins to go!
I'm loving the feel of this movie. And Ridley said he couldn't make Aliens scary again!?! Right...
Yeah i wouldn't go any further on a grainy cam shot.
Quote from: salomonj on Apr 27, 2017, 11:49:35 PM
Quote from: echobbase79 on Apr 27, 2017, 11:39:52 PM
Okay, I watched up until the they put the guySpoiler
on table and Faris tears his shirt off and there's a brief pop where his back begins to go!
I'm loving the feel of this movie. And Ridley said he couldn't make Aliens scary again!?! Right...
Yeah i wouldn't go any further on a grainy cam shot.
Yeah, I can tell by the way Ridley shot this that it's going to be a big crowd pleasing moment. So I want to experience that with them. Feel bad for that character though. He has no idea what the hell's going on like Kane did while he was dying. That's why I was so disturbed by the original burster scene.
Quote from: echobbase79 on Apr 27, 2017, 11:54:47 PM
Quote from: salomonj on Apr 27, 2017, 11:49:35 PM
Quote from: echobbase79 on Apr 27, 2017, 11:39:52 PM
Okay, I watched up until the they put the guySpoiler
on table and Faris tears his shirt off and there's a brief pop where his back begins to go!
I'm loving the feel of this movie. And Ridley said he couldn't make Aliens scary again!?! Right...
Yeah i wouldn't go any further on a grainy cam shot.
Yeah, I can tell by the way Ridley shot this that it's going to be a big crowd pleasing moment. So I want to experience that with them. Feel bad for that character though. He has no idea what the hell's going on like Kane did while he was dying. That's why I was so disturbed by the original burster scene.
Yeah, you feel bad for the other girl as well.
You feel bad for no one because monkey edit.
Damn should i watch it. I know i wont have the self-control to abort in between.
Must resist omg..
Watch it up until
Spoiler
Faris rips the guys shirt off and there's a brief pop where the neomorph is working it's way out.
It reminded me of the quick pop from Kane's burster in the original. That should wet your whistle for the time being.
Omg I couldn't resist... even watching it on my phone, I was literally moving the phone further away from me as the scene played out. It made me really uncomfortable and that is good.
My takeaways from this: I'm not sitting in front rows of the theater (no way I want to be that close after seeing this)... and I'm skipping the snacks. A soda is all I trust myself to have... pretty sure I don't want to see this movie with food in my stomach.
Quote from: kwisatz on Apr 27, 2017, 11:58:47 PM
You feel bad for no one because monkey edit.
Damn should i watch it. I know i wont have the self-control to abort in between.
Must resist omg..
Don't do it, it doesn't look that great and someone's head is covering the lower bit of the screen
It was what I expected it to be, There was nothing surprising about it because most was shown in the trailers (except for the actual bursting and neomorph). they should have kept the whole thing and the neomrph a secret. When Alien came out I don.t think anyone knew about the chestburster or what the alien looked like.
Thanks i think i can resist now. Camera rip is just too unpalatable.
Quote from: NickisSmart on Apr 27, 2017, 11:34:41 PM
My preview of the 10-minute sneak peak of Alien: Covenant. I tried to keep it shorter and not spoil too much, but talk about things in context with the series as a whole:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qMo6svTyB8U
Overall, I am quite eager to see the finished film, come May 19th.
I am a long time lurker, new poster, and really enjoy your analysis!
You mentioned this footage is 5 months old... where did you read or hear this? Great to hear if so, that means they have probably properly touched up the CGI and maybe even replaced some of it with practical effects by now!
My thoughts are as follows (I'll spoiler mark them; even though if you're reading this thread and don't want to be exposed to spoilers then quite frankly, you're a fool and deserve everything you get in terms of spoilers)...
Spoiler
1/ I hated the "sugar tits" dialogue. Absolutely hated it with a passion. Am I supposed to find that crass nonsense funny because I surely don't. Already I can tell that I'm going to have to make a 'MU-TH-UR Cut' edit for this film in addition to my 'Alien Resurrection' and 'Prometheus' fan-edits. That's yet more hours of my life spent fixing silly things in films which I desperately want to love instead of rolling my eyes at, when I'd rather be doing something else; such as wanking myself dry like a filthy gibbon*. First world problems, hey?
2/ Aside from the aforementioned "sugar tits" bollocks, I really dug the general dialogue during the landing sequence. It's very reminiscent of 'Alien', in as much as it's grounded. It makes me curiously happy to hear people talk a load of technical jargon while landing a spaceship and I'm not sure as to why. Maybe I have a fetish?
3/ Despite my reservations towards the overt references to Jerry Goldsmith's score for 'Alien' (which I previously expressed in the soundtrack thread), I absolutely loved what little we heard of the soundtrack in these clips. Majestic. Beautiful. Tense. It hit all the right notes (pun absolutely intended because contrary to popular belief; puns are brilliant. I could quite happily gorge myself on puns all day long. Heck, I'd eat a burger in a pun if I could).
4/ The backburster sequence was great. It really is nice to see the series return to its no-holds-barred approach to cinematic horror after the watered down shite which we've had to endure the last couple of times around in this series. Having said that, it bothered me how the newborn creature was so quick to launch straight into attack mode. Surely it would be frightened and want to escape to safety until it's had time to grow and become accustomed to its surroundings and even its own biology. Also, why didn't the woman it was attacking defend herself more? I liked that she initially kicked the creature straight into a wall (which got a laugh out of me, even though I'm not entirely sure that was the intended effect from the filmmaker's perspective) but then she seemed to just let it rip her to shreds, despite holding a perfectly good stabby-in-the-xeno-ribs knife. Why didn't she attempt to frantically stab it a new arsehole whilst it was tearing her throat out instead of waving her arms around and performing jazz hands?
All in all, I was actually fairly impressed by what I saw here. I'm still not getting my hopes up after the bitter disappointment of
'Prometheus' but I must admit that I'm somewhat cautiously optimistic now.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
*Yes, I'm aware of the hypocrisy, given my disdain towards the
"sugar tits" dialogue. However, I'm merely typing a load of waffle and making bad jokes on a forum and not writing a multi-million dollar movie. So, you know...
Quote from: St_Eddie on Apr 28, 2017, 12:36:57 AM
My thoughts are as follows (I'll spoiler mark them; even though if you're reading this thread and don't want to be exposed to spoilers then quite frankly, you're a fool and deserve everything you get in terms of spoilers)...
Spoiler
1/ I hated the "sugar tits" dialogue. Absolutely hated it with a passion. Am I supposed to find that crass nonsense funny because I surely don't. Already I can tell that I'm going to have to make a 'MU-TH-UR Cut' edit for this film in addition to my 'Alien Resurrection' and 'Prometheus' fan-edits. Le sigh... that's yet more hours of my life spent fixing silly things in films which I desperately want to love instead of rolling my eyes at, when I'd rather be doing something else; such as wanking myself dry like a filthy gibbon*. First world problems, hey?
2/ Aside from the aforementioned "sugar tits" bollocks, I really dug the general dialogue during the landing sequence. It's very reminiscent of 'Alien', in as much as it's grounded and also curiously engaging to hear people talk about a load of technical jargon in relation to landing a ship. It makes me happy and I'm not sure why.
3/ Despite my reservations towards the overt references to Jerry Goldsmith's score for 'Alien' (which I previously expressed in the soundtrack thread), I absolutely loved what little we heard of the soundtrack in these clips. Majestic. Beautiful. Tense. It hit all the right notes (pun absolutely intended because contrary to popular belief; puns are brilliant. I could quite happily gorge myself on puns all day long. Heck, I'd eat a burger in a pun if I could).
4/ The backburster sequence was great. It really is nice to see the series return to its no-holds-barred approach to cinematic horror after the watered down shite that we've had to endure the last couple of times around in this series. Having said that, it bothered me how the newborn creature was so quick to launch straight into attack mode. Surely it would be frightened and want to escape to safety until it's had time to grow and become accustomed to its surroundings and even its own biology. Also, why didn't the woman it was attacking defend herself more? I liked that she initially kicked the creature straight into a wall (got a laugh out of me, even if I'm not entirely sure that was the intended effect) but then she seemed to just let it rip her to shreds, despite holding a perfectly good stabby-in-the-xeno-ribs knife. Why didn't she attempt to frantically stab it whilst it was tearing her throat out instead of waving her arms around and performing jazz hands?
All in all, I was actually very impressed by what I saw here. I'm still not getting my hopes up after the bitter disappointment of 'Prometheus' but I must admit that I'm somewhat cautiously optimistic now.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
*Yes, I'm aware of the hypocrisy, given my disdain towards the "sugar tits" dialogue. However, I'm merely typing a load of waffle and making bad jokes on a forum and not writing a multi-million dollar movie. So, you know...
Spoiler
As someone who spent 12 years of my childhood in Tennessee, I can assure you that is not something I would be surprised to hear from someone that is from that area. Especially in a relaxed, giving each other shit atmosphere. I feel like Ridley Scott gave these guys freedom to improvise and this was probably straight from McBride. Not trying to be an apologist but in my opinion, it fits what I know of his character.
Per the tenacity if the neo, I believe that might be the entire point. It is not methodical like the xeno but rather completely driven by impulse to kill from the start. Or you know, maybe it was scampering at her initially for some motherly love and then she kicked the hell out of it into the wall and then turned aggressive :laugh:
The sugar tits line made me laugh. It was good banter between the crew members.
Quote from: cucuchu on Apr 28, 2017, 12:50:01 AM
As someone who spent 12 years of my childhood in Tennessee, I can assure you that is not something I would be surprised to hear from someone that is from that area. Especially in a relaxed, giving each other shit atmosphere. I feel like Ridley Scott gave these guys freedom to improvise and this was probably straight from McBride. Not trying to be an apologist but in my opinion, it fits what I know of his character.
The problem is that surely we, as an audience should care about the characters whom are shortly about to suffer horrible and horrendous deaths. Whereas, that dialogue actively makes me want to witness said characters suffer horrible and horrendous deaths.
Quote from: cucuchu on Apr 28, 2017, 12:50:01 AM...maybe it was scampering at her initially for some motherly love and then she kicked the hell out of it into the wall and then turned aggressive :laugh:
Poor little neomorph. All it wanted was to be sung a lullaby whilst suckling upon a teat or two. Instead it got curb-kicked and introduced to the harsh realities of physics. It's all rather tragic really.
Quote from: echobbase79 on Apr 28, 2017, 12:54:54 AMThe sugar tits line made me laugh. It was good banter between the crew members.
Well, your mileage my vary of course. Personally speaking, I was out of gas and unprepared to walk to the nearest gas station within seconds of that sugar tit talk commencing.
I tried to resist, but I have no will power. Ive watched it several times and it gets better with each viewing. I enjoyed the banter during the drop, seemed natural, just enough light hearted joking, worked well imo, and the visuals, and soundtrack are just amazing. The terror in the back bursting scene is palpable. Its very intense. Ferris' terror is very real, and it is gruesome as hell, but very realistic. The soundtrack during that scene, perfection. builds and gets very creepy. The neo is f**king nuts, savage as hell and very cool looking, scary. mouthburster was brutal too, the noise he made before it came out was just sick. So Ridley sets up 2 neomorphs running around. I suspect the following events will be very tense indeed. Overall, amazing stuff, if you are an Alien fan and this doesn't get you pumped, check your pulse
If anyone's worried about a download it's on the LV-426 Reddit page as a stream
Quote from: Ragonk_Force on Apr 28, 2017, 01:06:20 AMOverall, amazing stuff, if you are an Alien fan and this doesn't get you pumped, check your pulse
Agreed 100%. You have no business calling yourself an Alien fan if your heart rate doesn't increase after viewing this. I couldn't care less if the neomorphs are CG at this point (the folks over at Alien Minute Podcast are banging on the "it doesn't look real" drum and I swear I wish I could show them the backburster and throatburster scene). It looks amazing and really captures the essence of the classic chestburster scene in new and thrilling ways. I really can't wait to see it in a theater and see everyone's response to this.
The neomorph births aren't quite as intense as Kane's birth... but they do come VERY close.
EDIT: Thank you St_Eddie for pointing out my grammar error. I had typed "I could care less" when I should have typed "I couldn't care less". Fixed and added this note to publicly acknowledge my error.
The sets, and acting were amazing. The mouth and back burster equally amazing. The CGI on the baby neo-morphs...ehh. This still gets a 10/10 for me. Cannot wait.
Holy crap this looks terrible. The CGI is really bad on the backburster,,,,,bad acting....This is on par with the AVP films, complete shit.
Quote from: sugarhigh on Apr 28, 2017, 01:22:02 AM
Holy crap this looks terrible. The CGI is really bad on the backburster,,,,,bad acting....This is on par with the AVP films, complete shit.
lol
Quote from: sugarhigh on Apr 28, 2017, 01:22:02 AM
Holy crap this looks terrible. The CGI is really bad on the backburster,,,,,bad acting....This is on par with the AVP films, complete shit.
I take it you were in that film class mentioned earlier?
I actually think the CGI looks pretty solid, but my view was cam-quality. The only place I think it could be touched up is when the neomorph is battering the glass with its head. I loved it coming out of the amniotic sac/placenta.
Quote from: sugarhigh on Apr 28, 2017, 01:22:02 AM
Holy crap this looks terrible. The CGI is really bad on the backburster,,,,,bad acting....This is on par with the AVP films, complete shit.
jesus, you people smh
If the footage is 5 months old, I am sure the CGI has been polished and perhaps replaced in some parts with practical effects.
I thought the acting was great personally and their reactions to the situations are far more believable than Prometheus, which I kind of excused to it being a bunch of people randomly picked for a science expedition. The reason for the cutting between all the characters is probably to convey shit hitting the fan and these people
Spoiler
hearing their loved ones in a state of terror dealing with a life threatening situation, in the case of Tennessee
I feel there was a significant effort to prioritize character development and relationships this time around.
Quote from: cucuchu on Apr 28, 2017, 02:06:22 AM
If the footage is 5 months old, I am sure the CGI has been polished and perhaps replaced in some parts with practical effects.
I thought the acting was great personally and their reactions to the situations are far more believable than Prometheus, which I kind of excused to it being a bunch of people randomly picked for a science expedition. The reason for the cutting between all the characters is probably to convey shit hitting the fan and these people Spoiler
hearing their loved ones in a state of terror dealing with a life threatening situation, in the case of Tennessee
I thought the cutting between characters during that scene was great. Added to the stressfulness of the situation
Quote from: echobbase79 on Apr 28, 2017, 12:54:54 AM
The sugar tits line made me laugh. It was good banter between the crew members.
Well that and I mean seriously, what are they going to do to him. Sue him for sexual harassment in the ass end of space. :laugh:
Plus, she replied with "sugar dick"; so in space all's fair in love and war.
i cant tell whats good or bad anymore. theres just too much everything today.
the editing was perfect
Not going to watch the clip, just reading everyone's reactions makes me giddy enough! ;D
What concerns me is that almost everyone is saying the cgi is...not up to par. They'll be working on cgi up until about the week of release, but this scene should have been completed considering it's part of an exclusive promotion. If it's finished, then that's even more worrisome. There is no excuse for such integral scenes to have sub par cgi.
For anyone who has watched this: Is the cgi in these scenes more akin to Jurassic World or The Mummy? Because if it's Mummy cgi in a new Alien film, I'm going to have some problems. It's a personal issue, I just can't stand fakey cgi.
Quote from: newagescamartist on Apr 28, 2017, 02:33:35 AM
Not going to watch the clip, just reading everyone's reactions makes me giddy enough! ;D
What concerns me is that almost everyone is saying the cgi is...not up to par. They'll be working on cgi up until about the week of release, but this scene should have been completed considering it's part of an exclusive promotion. If it's finished, then that's even more worrisome. There is no excuse for such integral scenes to have sub par cgi.
For anyone who has watched this: Is the cgi in these scenes more akin to Jurassic World or The Mummy? Because if it's Mummy cgi in a new Alien film, I'm going to have some problems. It's a personal issue, I just can't stand fakey cgi.
Its far better than The Mummy. The CGI isn't bad, its just not perfect.
Quote from: rabidranger on Apr 28, 2017, 01:30:29 AM
Quote from: sugarhigh on Apr 28, 2017, 01:22:02 AM
Holy crap this looks terrible. The CGI is really bad on the backburster,,,,,bad acting....This is on par with the AVP films, complete shit.
I take it you were in that film class mentioned earlier?
;D ;D
These film students --
Here's some quick screen grabs that I made. It doesn't show anything because I've only watched it up to this point. So no backbursters or anything like that.
Spoiler
(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FEuvODSA.png&hash=dbfc785146fc08a043fc643687a9653354cb6c6e)
Spoiler
(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2F25ffidt.png&hash=edd0b94dabacf51617ea38591bd4aafb7b276fb5)
Spoiler
(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FxU7kLtZ.png&hash=4d190e320b0e2a46eb1d42cd4ab437fb62809835)
Looks pretty raw, i like it.
Somehow im getting Starship Troopers vibes from these, could be due to a combination of the clip quality and the lighting Ridley has chosen this time. But theres also some sort of minimalism going on, at least in these interior shots.
Quote from: newagescamartist on Apr 28, 2017, 02:33:35 AM
For anyone who has watched this: Is the cgi in these scenes more akin to Jurassic World or The Mummy? Because if it's Mummy cgi in a new Alien film, I'm going to have some problems. It's a personal issue, I just can't stand fakey cgi.
It's not Mummy level... nor is it Jurassic World level. It is obviously CG and if someone wanted to, they could say it doesn't look real enough. To someone like that, I say learn to get used to being disappointed. Because for every Jurassic World, there's at least a dozen Mummy's. You want bad CG? Go watch a low to mid-budget flick from the 90's like Lawnmower Man. Then come talk to me about bad CG. What we have today in movies like The Mummy are leaps and bounds better than what used to be passed off as CG.
In other words... if you can't discern the individual polygons in the character model, then the CG is fine. And the CG is fine in this movie.
And it's not even finished, yet, in Covenant's case (I hope).
Quote from: kwisatz on Apr 28, 2017, 02:59:38 AM
Looks pretty raw, i like it.
Somehow im getting Starship Troopers vibes from these, could be due to a combination of the clip quality and the lighting Ridley has chosen this time.
Yeah, it makes it feel like you're there with the characters.
The head of that guy (/girl) though. :D
Im kinda glad i didnt watch it (yet).
Quote from: oberonqa on Apr 28, 2017, 02:59:56 AM
Quote from: newagescamartist on Apr 28, 2017, 02:33:35 AM
For anyone who has watched this: Is the cgi in these scenes more akin to Jurassic World or The Mummy? Because if it's Mummy cgi in a new Alien film, I'm going to have some problems. It's a personal issue, I just can't stand fakey cgi.
It's not Mummy level... nor is it Jurassic World level. It is obviously CG and if someone wanted to, they could say it doesn't look real enough. To someone like that, I say learn to get used to being disappointed. Because for every Jurassic World, there's at least a dozen Mummy's. You want bad CG? Go watch a low to mid-budget flick from the 90's like Lawnmower Man. Then come talk to me about bad CG. What we have today in movies like The Mummy are leaps and bounds better than what used to be passed off as CG.
In other words... if you can't discern the individual polygons in the character model, then the CG is fine. And the CG is fine in this movie.
Thanks, that's a good way of putting it.
Quote from: sugarhigh on Apr 28, 2017, 01:22:02 AM
Holy crap this looks terrible. The CGI is really bad on the backburster,,,,,bad acting....This is on par with the AVP films, complete shit.
on par with avp? lol
I saw it, and while the CGI used in the neomorphs is not so bad as some posters have claimed, I still prefer the med pod scene from Prometheus, and of course, the Kane chestburster from the original film (just my personal taste). On the other hand, the dropship sequence was just perfect, like a nice homage to Alien. That being said, I'm really looking forward to seeing this next chapter of the prequel series by the legendary Ridley Scott :)
Well.
Suitably messed up stuff. I can see why some are nipping at the Neomorph CG; though I'm sure it looks better firsthand, unfinished or not. Still... in any case. Yikes.
Quote from: echobbase79 on Apr 28, 2017, 12:54:54 AM
The sugar tits line made me laugh. It was good banter between the crew members.
I liked that as well :)
Spoiler
Oram wasn't impressed.
Watched, really liked it, bloodbath.
One question though, how can anyone complain about the CGI when the quailty of the recording is so bad and low resolution? come on guys.
Quote from: St_Eddie on Apr 28, 2017, 12:36:57 AM
My thoughts are as follows (I'll spoiler mark them; even though if you're reading this thread and don't want to be exposed to spoilers then quite frankly, you're a fool and deserve everything you get in terms of spoilers)...
Spoiler
1/ I hated the "sugar tits" dialogue. Absolutely hated it with a passion. Am I supposed to find that crass nonsense funny because I surely don't. Already I can tell that I'm going to have to make a 'MU-TH-UR Cut' edit for this film in addition to my 'Alien Resurrection' and 'Prometheus' fan-edits. That's yet more hours of my life spent fixing silly things in films which I desperately want to love instead of rolling my eyes at, when I'd rather be doing something else; such as wanking myself dry like a filthy gibbon*. First world problems, hey?
2/ Aside from the aforementioned "sugar tits" bollocks, I really dug the general dialogue during the landing sequence. It's very reminiscent of 'Alien', in as much as it's grounded. It makes me curiously happy to hear people talk a load of technical jargon while landing a spaceship and I'm not sure as to why. Maybe I have a fetish?
3/ Despite my reservations towards the overt references to Jerry Goldsmith's score for 'Alien' (which I previously expressed in the soundtrack thread), I absolutely loved what little we heard of the soundtrack in these clips. Majestic. Beautiful. Tense. It hit all the right notes (pun absolutely intended because contrary to popular belief; puns are brilliant. I could quite happily gorge myself on puns all day long. Heck, I'd eat a burger in a pun if I could).
4/ The backburster sequence was great. It really is nice to see the series return to its no-holds-barred approach to cinematic horror after the watered down shite which we've had to endure the last couple of times around in this series. Having said that, it bothered me how the newborn creature was so quick to launch straight into attack mode. Surely it would be frightened and want to escape to safety until it's had time to grow and become accustomed to its surroundings and even its own biology. Also, why didn't the woman it was attacking defend herself more? I liked that she initially kicked the creature straight into a wall (which got a laugh out of me, even though I'm not entirely sure that was the intended effect from the filmmaker's perspective) but then she seemed to just let it rip her to shreds, despite holding a perfectly good stabby-in-the-xeno-ribs knife. Why didn't she attempt to frantically stab it a new arsehole whilst it was tearing her throat out instead of waving her arms around and performing jazz hands?
All in all, I was actually fairly impressed by what I saw here. I'm still not getting my hopes up after the bitter disappointment of 'Prometheus' but I must admit that I'm somewhat cautiously optimistic now.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
*Yes, I'm aware of the hypocrisy, given my disdain towards the "sugar tits" dialogue. However, I'm merely typing a load of waffle and making bad jokes on a forum and not writing a multi-million dollar movie. So, you know...
Good, i hated the part when Cruddup looks at them with a grudge look on his face, while others are laughing.
I really hate those people, you cant laugh or have to much fun because its not nice to god.
Thank GOD, that David will trick and kill one of his servants and worshippers, thats ironic, being killed by one of humans inventions, scientist inventions, while you believe in a higher god, god laughs at you and he allows you to be killed by something that is below a human ( no offence David) ;)
Quote from: sugarhigh on Apr 28, 2017, 01:22:02 AM
Holy crap this looks terrible. The CGI is really bad on the backburster,,,,,bad acting....This is on par with the AVP films, complete shit.
Let me guess... IMDB right??
Whilst I'm still refusing to watch, there sounds like a lot for 10 mins? Is this a continuous 10 minute sequence or pieced together scenes from different points in the film?
I.e. Dropship, backburster, neomorph attacks etc.
lol @ all the haters.
here, have a glass of milk
(https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/b3/69/f2/b369f225b4cfd38bc1814a8787928582.jpg)
jeesh. cgi bad? that was exactly what didnt set me off at all. I expected it to be more brutal to be honest, really that's all that's the thing, but i think it's cinematographically well executed, so no real complaints. Would i wanted to see the backburster guy laying head down on the table, grabbing onto anything out of sheer pain, and slowly and violently seeing the neomorph break out of his back, literally seeing his spine and ribs crack open, including the sound of splintering bone and sounds of dispair - not yelling - and then the loss of life. The mouthbursting scene was spot on. I don't think there's anyhting to comment there but that the neo simply takes off rather fast and doesnt bite or attack the bystanders whilst escaping, but i'msure 2 minutes later, they will.
as for the 10 minutes, it's 2 scenes. 1 of the dropship, which is okay, not all that special to be honest, i dont feel enriched seeing it or at a loss that i have seen it before the actual movie. The second scene is when the crewmembers are infected with the spores and the alien parasites start developing into birthing. there's some stuff going on but it's not overly fast-paced and it feels like it's going relatively fast but in a realistic manner.
did it remind me of the fifield scene? yes. is it bad? not at all, far , far from it.
but bad CGI is the last of critisism i could think of.
Quote from: cliffhanger on Apr 28, 2017, 10:29:46 AM
lol @ all the haters.
here, have a glass of milk
https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/b3/69/f2/b369f225b4cfd38bc1814a8787928582.jpg
jeesh. cgi bad? that was exactly what didnt set me off at all. I expected it to be more brutal to be honest, really that's all that's the thing, but i think it's cinematographically well executed, so no real complaints. Would i wanted to see the backburster guy laying head down on the table, grabbing onto anything out of sheer pain, and slowly and violently seeing the neomorph break out of his back, literally seeing his spine and ribs crack open, including the sound of splintering bone and sounds of dispair - not yelling - and then the loss of life. The mouthbursting scene was spot on. I don't think there's anyhting to comment there but that the neo simply takes off rather fast and doesnt bite or attack the bystanders whilst escaping, but i'msure 2 minutes later, they will.
as for the 10 minutes, it's 2 scenes. 1 of the dropship, which is okay, not all that special to be honest, i dont feel enriched seeing it or at a loss that i have seen it before the actual movie. The second scene is when the crewmembers are infected with the spores and the alien parasites start developing into birthing. there's some stuff going on but it's not overly fast-paced and it feels like it's going relatively fast but in a realistic manner.
did it remind me of the fifield scene? yes. is it bad? not at all, far , far from it.
but bad CGI is the last of critisism i could think of.
Tell it like it is. 8)
Quote from: oberonqa on Apr 28, 2017, 01:18:05 AM
You have no business calling yourself an Alien fan if your heart rate doesn't increase after viewing this.
I hate nonsense such as this. Don't be such a fanboy. Personally I liked what I saw in this 10 minute clip but to say that anybody who doesn't agree with you isn't a fan is preposterous, condescending and elitist.
Quote from: oberonqa on Apr 28, 2017, 01:18:05 AMI could care less if the neomorphs are CG at this point...
The phrase you're looking for is 'I couldn't care less'. Take it away, Mr. Cleese...
Quote from: cliffhanger on Apr 28, 2017, 10:29:46 AM
lol @ all the haters.
here, have a glass of milk
https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/b3/69/f2/b369f225b4cfd38bc1814a8787928582.jpg
jeesh. cgi bad? that was exactly what didnt set me off at all. I expected it to be more brutal to be honest, really that's all that's the thing, but i think it's cinematographically well executed, so no real complaints. Would i wanted to see the backburster guy laying head down on the table, grabbing onto anything out of sheer pain, and slowly and violently seeing the neomorph break out of his back, literally seeing his spine and ribs crack open, including the sound of splintering bone and sounds of dispair - not yelling - and then the loss of life. The mouthbursting scene was spot on. I don't think there's anyhting to comment there but that the neo simply takes off rather fast and doesnt bite or attack the bystanders whilst escaping, but i'msure 2 minutes later, they will.
as for the 10 minutes, it's 2 scenes. 1 of the dropship, which is okay, not all that special to be honest, i dont feel enriched seeing it or at a loss that i have seen it before the actual movie. The second scene is when the crewmembers are infected with the spores and the alien parasites start developing into birthing. there's some stuff going on but it's not overly fast-paced and it feels like it's going relatively fast but in a realistic manner.
did it remind me of the fifield scene? yes. is it bad? not at all, far , far from it.
but bad CGI is the last of critisism i could think of.
Yes, after rewatching it (once in Theatre and a couple times with the download), I have to say the only area the CGI looked off was the short bit after
Spoiler
it slides out of the embryonic sac and is standing up getting ready to try to attack her
. Otherwise its pretty solid and I am sure better now after some touch up since then.
Per the back burster, yeah, I think a lot of us have had our imaginations on overdrive thinking of what it would be like. He did seem to be in pretty bad pain and hard to grab onto anything though, and I would assume at that point if the neomorph inside had poppes his spine (we heard cracks and snaps), he probably lost control of his body. Also I think myself and others might be slightly incorrect calling it a back burster, since (as seen with other neo birth) it seems that it gestates in a host and the embryotic sac with the neo just forces itself outside the host any way possible. Hell, if any other people get infected with the spores we could even have ass bursters for all we know
Quote from: Bonus Situation on Apr 28, 2017, 10:10:12 AM
Whilst I'm still refusing to watch, there sounds like a lot for 10 mins? Is this a continuous 10 minute sequence or pieced together scenes from different points in the film?
I.e. Dropship, backburster, neomorph attacks etc.
This particular footage/scene is actually less than that - the first clip is on the ship with the crew for maybe 2 minutes, then the second clip where everything else goes down is about 8 minutes. Didn't feel rushed, though. Intense and chaotic, but not too fast.
Quote from: St_Eddie on Apr 28, 2017, 10:46:28 AM
Quote from: oberonqa on Apr 28, 2017, 01:18:05 AM
You have no business calling yourself an Alien fan if your heart rate doesn't increase after viewing this.
I hate nonsense such as this. Don't be such a fanboy. Personally I liked what I saw in this 10 minute clip but to say that anybody who doesn't agree with you isn't a fan is preposterous, condescending and elitist.
Quote from: oberonqa on Apr 28, 2017, 01:18:05 AMI could care less if the neomorphs are CG at this point...
The phrase you're looking for is 'I couldn't care less'. Take it away, Mr. Cleese...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uCUsPnKD1gk
Thank you for correcting my poor grammar in that instance. Your a peach. =)
I'm a bit sceptic about all this "bad CGI craze", which I see on this forum and on a Star Wars forum too.
Nowadays movies with gigantic budgets tend to have, thanks to the technological advancements, very good CGI in my opinion in most cases : I mean that even though someone watching a movie 20 years from now will maybe say that the effects could be improved through the more advanced means of his time, that person will still say the effects are still very good.
I'd say it's a difference between the movies of the 2000 decade and nowadays.
I thought the visual effects were very good... and it terms of scare factor, those scenes were up there with the best of the Alien films so far.
Quote from: oberonqa on Apr 28, 2017, 11:19:18 AM
Thank you for correcting my poor grammar in that instance. Your a peach. =)
It's not really a case of poor grammar. It's more a case of not considering the words which you're using to construct a phrase, to the point where the bastardised phrase you use has the exact opposite intention of what it is you're attempting to communicate. An awful lot of Americans wrongly say
"I could care less" when what they're actually trying to do is emphasise how they don't care one iota for something and like Mr. Cleese, I try to put an end to it whenever I happen across it.
Oh and you're perfectly welcome.
Yours sincerely,
Mr. A. Peach
Quote from: St_Eddie on Apr 28, 2017, 01:05:16 PM
Quote from: oberonqa on Apr 28, 2017, 11:19:18 AM
Thank you for correcting my poor grammar in that instance. Your a peach. =)
It's not really a case of poor grammar. It's more a case of not considering the words which you're using to construct a phrase, to the point where the bastardised phrase you use has the exact opposite intention of what it is you're attempting to communicate. An awful lot of Americans wrongly say "I could care less" when what they're actually trying to do is emphasise how they don't care one iota for something and like Mr. Cleese, I try to put an end to it whenever I happen across it.
Oh and you're perfectly welcome.
Yours sincerely,
Mr. A. Peach
Ok... now your just being a condescending prick about it. I thanked you for pointing out my error and rather than moving on, you go back for a second helping.
Quote from: Darth Vile on Apr 28, 2017, 12:20:59 PM
I thought the visual effects were very good... and it terms of scare factor, those scenes were up there with the best of the Alien films so far.
This is what I'm very happy about. I haven't found the Aliens to be intimidating since
Aliens.
Alien 3 did give the beast it's moments of grace, but the movie wasn't scary at all.
After waiting 5 years after Prometheus and with 3 weeks to go are you people actually going to spoil it for yourselves by watching some leak?
Yeah, that's not very smart. Wait until you can see it on the big screen, please! Much better than this crappy recording.
Quote from: oberonqa on Apr 28, 2017, 01:32:19 PMOk... now your just being a condescending prick about it. I thanked you for pointing out my error and rather than moving on, you go back for a second helping.
Actually, I thought that you were being a little unnecessarily snide by calling me a peach with purposefully bad grammar but I accept that I may have interpreted that comment in the wrong way. Either way, my second post on the matter wasn't intended as being condescending; I was merely elaborating on the nature of why you'd used the phrase in the wrong way, given that you'd stated it as being noting more than
"bad grammar", which wasn't entirely true. I'm sorry that you took it as condescending. I can only speak for myself but I'm always glad to have errors in my use of the English language pointed out to me. How else is one to learn?
Having said that, I must say that I consider calling me a "prick" to be uncalled for. Still, back on topic...
Quote from: Denton Smalls on Apr 28, 2017, 02:20:30 PMAfter waiting 5 years after Prometheus and with 3 weeks to go are you people actually going to spoil it for yourselves by watching some leak?
Personally I'm extemerely wary as to whether
'Alien: Covenant' will be any good after the disappointment of
'Prometheus', so I'm watching any and all spoilers in the interest of getting a better idea of whether I'll bother going to the cinema to watch this film or not. I'm certainly not going to pay good money for a ticket simply because I'm a fan of the series in general.
You'll all be kicking yourselves for watching a terrible cam video of this instead of enjoying it in the cinema. Completely different experiences.
Quote from: St_Eddie on Apr 28, 2017, 02:24:43 PM
Quote from: oberonqa on Apr 28, 2017, 01:32:19 PMOk... now your just being a condescending prick about it. I thanked you for pointing out my error and rather than moving on, you go back for a second helping.
Actually, I thought that you were being a little unnecessarily snide by calling me a peach with purposefully bad grammar but I accept that I may have interpreted that comment in the wrong way. Either way, my second post on the matter wasn't intended as being condescending; I was merely elaborating on the nature of why you'd used the phrase in the wrong way. I can only speak for myself but I'm always glad to have errors in my use of the English language pointed out to me. How else is one to learn?
Having said that, I must say that I consider calling me a "prick" to be uncalled for. Still, back on topic...
Perhaps you should use Google before jumping to conclusions. The phrase "Your a peach" is a phrase of endearment that basically says your really nice. I added the smiley face at the end of the sentence so as to impart the emotion of happiness/goodwill towards you and to remove any indication that I was using the phrase sarcastically (as not having the smiley face or using a winking face would imply a degree of sarcasm that I did not want implied or inferred).
And of course you want to take the conversation back on topic... you dug yourself into a hole because you typed a response without thinking. You fired from the hip and now it's backfiring on you.
Seriously... how dare you sit there after being so condescending and want to go back to the topic at hand. You have a lot of nerve and not a lot of common sense. You want sarcastic... here is sarcastic:
What would Mr Cleese have to say about your failed display of academic superiority? What sagely advice would he give such a petulant individual about the merits of thinking things through before opening their mouths (or typing a post, in this instance)? Sometimes it's better to let people assume you are an idiot rather than speaking and proving them right.
Quote from: oberonqa on Apr 28, 2017, 02:39:32 PMPerhaps you should use Google before jumping to conclusions. The phrase "Your a peach" is a phrase of endearment that basically says your really nice. I added the smiley face at the end of the sentence so as to impart the emotion of happiness/goodwill towards you and to remove any indication that I was using the phrase sarcastically (as not having the smiley face or using a winking face would imply a degree of sarcasm that I did not want implied or inferred).
And of course you want to take the conversation back on topic... you dug yourself into a hole because you typed a response without thinking. You fired from the hip and now it's backfiring on you.
Seriously... how dare you sit there after being so condescending and want to go back to the topic at hand. You have a lot of nerve and not a lot of common sense. You want sarcastic... here is sarcastic:
What would Mr Cleese have to say about your failed display of academic superiority? What sagely advice would he give such a petulant individual about the merits of thinking things through before opening their mouths (or typing a post, in this instance)? Sometimes it's better to let people assume you are an idiot rather than speaking and proving them right.
Actually, I'm certain that I've heard the phrase
"you're a peach" being used in a derogatory manner before. However, I may well have read the intent of your comment wrong, for which I've already apologised. I only tried to get this forum topic back on course because it's unfair on other users should this particular forum topic descend into pages and pages of an argument about the use of the English language (though I accept that I started it).
I will
illiterate reiterate; I'm sorry that you took my post in a manner which was not intended. Having said that, you're now being extremely rude, insulting and unpleasant. So far you've called me a
"prick" and a
"petulant individual" and an
"idiot". You also told me that I have
"no common sense". Whereas I have, not once stooped to insulting you in such a manner, so let's just leave it at that, shall we? Once again (purely for the sake of other members); back on topic...
I loved the footage I seen. The scenes involving the neomorph were so gripping and grotesque. I was literally on the edge of my seat with my hand across my mouth. Can't wait for the full film.
Quote from: St_Eddie on Apr 28, 2017, 02:46:54 PM
I will illiterate;
Reiterate
http://www.dictionary.com/browse/reiterate
Does anyone else think that the newborn neomorph was directly inspired by the 'bambi burster' from the assembly cut of
'Alien 3'?
I think that it might well have been and that's all good in my book because I love that little oxymoron of a cute & creepy critter. The neomorph in
'Alien: Covenant' even makes the same sound as the bambi burster!
Quote from: oberonqa on Apr 28, 2017, 02:53:37 PM
Reiterate
http://www.dictionary.com/browse/reiterate
Ha! Yes, good call. That was sloppy of me.
Quote from: hfeldhaus on Apr 28, 2017, 02:54:23 PMTake this to PMs. Don't clutter the board.
Agreed about not cluttering the board (that's what I was trying to do; get the thread back on topic).
Quote from: Citadel on Apr 28, 2017, 02:36:22 PM
You'll all be kicking yourselves for watching a terrible cam video of this instead of enjoying it in the cinema. Completely different experiences.
Very true, but sadly it's like trying to "
Lead a Horse to Water, and trying to make it drink."
Quote from: Pvt. Himmel on Apr 28, 2017, 03:00:34 PMVery true, but sadly it's like trying to "Lead a Horse to Water, and trying to make it drink."
Possibly but at the same time; to each their own, even if it should lead to death by dehydration.
QuoteI think that it might well have been and that's all good in my book because I love that little oxymoron of a cute & creepy critter. The neomorph in 'Alien: Covenant' even makes the same sound as the bambi burster!
Yes, it was one of their inspirations. ;)
I find interesting and great the uncanny aspect of the bambi burster, the deacon, the young Covenant two beasts.
Quote from: Ulfer on Apr 28, 2017, 03:13:52 PMYes, it was one of their inspirations. ;)
Ooh, no kidding? Do you have a source for that, if you don't mind me asking?
Ah, I answered to quickly I guess, so it was misleading. I've no sources about that. I just thought it was evident. I mean, it's from an Alien movie, it is not a coincidence. It would be strange if the artists did not know this scene, no ? We're speaking about a movie that, after Prometheus, continues to build upon the idea of the first Alien movie, but can draw also some elements from the other films.
Quote from: Ulfer on Apr 28, 2017, 03:43:11 PM
Ah, I answered to quickly I guess, so it was misleading. I've no sources about that. I just thought it was evident. I mean, it's from an Alien movie, it is not a coincidence. It would be strange if the artists did not know this scene, no ? We're speaking about a movie that, after Prometheus, continues to build upon the idea of the first Alien movie, but can draw also some elements from the other films.
Oh, okay. Yes I agree with your thoughts and suspicions but there's no way to be sure, I guess. Though unlikely, it could just be a coincidence.
I love Walter's reaction to whats going on. See's and explosion and an alien burst out of a mans mouth and he's thinking.. interesting. So great
As of now, it can lead to several outcomes in what regards Walter. But given what has been said up to now in articles and interviews, provided they are not misleading, it seems Walter has the well-being and the defense of the crew as an objective.
So he observes and he is the only one who can be really calm in this kind of situation, which can be extremely helpful.
Quote from: Ragonk_Force on Apr 28, 2017, 03:59:01 PM
I love Walter's reaction to whats going on. See's and explosion and an alien burst out of a mans mouth and he's thinking.. interesting. So great
Agreed. I love his impassive reaction as an android.
Quote from: Ulfer on Apr 28, 2017, 04:03:42 PM
As of now, it can lead to several outcomes in what regards Walter. But given what has been said up to now in articles and interviews, provided they are not misleading, it seems Walter has the well-being and the defense of the crew as an objective...
Spoiler
You are correct. As per the leaked synopsis; Walter has only the well-being of the crew on his mind. He is not corrupted and essentially malfunctioning, as David is, due to a lack of maintenance over a ten year long period.
Are we sure Walter is benevolent? Seems like a likely sleeper agent for the Company.
If there is a twist with him, I hope it's more complicated or at least more original than that.
QuoteAgreed. I love his impassive reaction as an android.
Fassbender is a great actor. It's understandable Scott wanted to use his talents again, with two characters this time. It would have been more rational to have a different robot and a different actor for Walter, but it's better this way, I guess.
Saw this in the cinema after
Prometheus the other day. I really enjoyed the sequence. Intense. Loved the way the crew broke down believably once the shit hit the fan.
Also thought it was really interesting how
Spoiler
Tennessee and a few of the others were still on the ship in orbit while hell was breaking loose on the ground. Interested to see how that develops. Obviously Tennessee at least ends up down on the surface at some point.
Quote from: HuDaFuK on Apr 28, 2017, 04:56:18 PM
Saw this in the cinema after Prometheus the other day. I really enjoyed the sequence. Intense. Loved the way the crew broke down believably once the shit hit the fan.
Also thought it was really interesting how Spoiler
Tennessee and a few of the others were still on the ship in orbit while hell was breaking loose on the ground. Interested to see how that develops. Obviously Tennessee at least ends up down on the surface at some point.
What also was Prometheus like to me, is what you are saying, a few stayed on the ship in orbit, the whole crew instantly went down to the planet, i mean really?? 2000 embryo's or 2000 people in cryo is kind of a precious cargo, wasnt the dropship pilot and the android for reckon much safer and enough?
Quote from: Infected on Apr 28, 2017, 07:35:41 PM
Quote from: HuDaFuK on Apr 28, 2017, 04:56:18 PM
Saw this in the cinema after Prometheus the other day. I really enjoyed the sequence. Intense. Loved the way the crew broke down believably once the shit hit the fan.
Also thought it was really interesting how Spoiler
Tennessee and a few of the others were still on the ship in orbit while hell was breaking loose on the ground. Interested to see how that develops. Obviously Tennessee at least ends up down on the surface at some point.
What also was Prometheus like to me, is what you are saying, a few stayed on the ship in orbit, the whole crew instantly went down to the planet, i mean really?? 2000 embryo's or 2000 people in cryo is kind of a precious cargo, wasnt the dropship pilot and the android for reckon much safer and enough?
Spoiler
A few stayed behind on the Covenant. They also had a scan of the area around the landing site similiar to the holoscanner in Prometheus. It looks like 6 people and 1 android made the trip down and of that, it looks like they split into two teams of 3 each with Faris (I think) staying behind to mind the drop ship.
I dont know the total crew size... but I want to say 13... in which case 6 stayed behind on the Covenant while the rest went down.
Seems pretty logical and safe to me. If bad stuff happened to away team, at least 6 would be left on the main ship, which includes the captain I might add. Mcbride stays on the Covenant and does not join the away team.
Quote from: oberonqa on Apr 28, 2017, 08:07:27 PM
Quote from: Infected on Apr 28, 2017, 07:35:41 PM
Quote from: HuDaFuK on Apr 28, 2017, 04:56:18 PM
Saw this in the cinema after Prometheus the other day. I really enjoyed the sequence. Intense. Loved the way the crew broke down believably once the shit hit the fan.
Also thought it was really interesting how Spoiler
Tennessee and a few of the others were still on the ship in orbit while hell was breaking loose on the ground. Interested to see how that develops. Obviously Tennessee at least ends up down on the surface at some point.
What also was Prometheus like to me, is what you are saying, a few stayed on the ship in orbit, the whole crew instantly went down to the planet, i mean really?? 2000 embryo's or 2000 people in cryo is kind of a precious cargo, wasnt the dropship pilot and the android for reckon much safer and enough?
Spoiler
A few stayed behind on the Covenant. They also had a scan of the area around the landing site similiar to the holoscanner in Prometheus. It looks like 6 people and 1 android made the trip down and of that, it looks like they split into two teams of 3 each with Faris (I think) staying behind to mind the drop ship.
I dont know the total crew size... but I want to say 13... in which case 6 stayed behind on the Covenant while the rest went down.
Seems pretty logical and safe to me. If bad stuff happened to away team, at least 6 would be left on the main ship, which includes the captain I might add. Mcbride stays on the Covenant and does not join the away team.
I wouldnt, im to sceptic, i would send a few people, and never leave the original mission behind with a skeleton crew.
little neomorphs sure are fun lol. Both brutal births, and quick. I think backbuster wins todays gore contest
Now seriously, the ambience music certainly goes with these scenes. Reminds me of even the tension of alien tension for moments. Looks like we could be having a good alien movie after so much time at long last
Quote from: fernandito on Apr 28, 2017, 08:47:12 PM
little neomorphs sure are fun lol. Both brutal births, and quick. I think backbuster wins todays gore contest
Now seriously, the ambience music certainly goes with these scenes. Reminds me of even the tension of alien tension for moments. Looks like we could be having a good alien movie after so much time at long last
Agreed. I showed the footage to a couple of coworkers and just watching their faces and body language is priceless. The neomorph birthing scene is totally going to be a talking point for the public.
Even better... since Ridley is showing us this... I have high hopes for what he isn't showing us. The best is yet to come I think.
After re-watching it I have a theory that the Neomorphs might be blind. It looked like they responded to noises much more. However, I dont think it will hold up since the one was able to break through glass....meaning it knew the glass was there.
Quote from: oberonqa on Apr 28, 2017, 08:55:39 PM
... since Ridley is showing us this... I have high hopes for what he isn't showing us. The best is yet to come I think.
Not necessarily. I doubt that it was Ridley Scott's call to choose which footage was shown. It was much more likely down to Fox's marketing department and judging by how the trailers thus far have shown us way too much of the film's plot (basically the exact same thing which happened with the marketing for
'Prometheus'), I wouldn't be at all surprised if these clips were chosen as a highlight reel. Then again, I am very cynical by nature but with good cause I feel.
Quote from: St_Eddie on Apr 28, 2017, 10:40:52 PM
Quote from: oberonqa on Apr 28, 2017, 08:55:39 PM
... since Ridley is showing us this... I have high hopes for what he isn't showing us. The best is yet to come I think.
Not necessarily. I doubt that it was Ridley Scott's call to choose which footage was shown. It was much more likely down to Fox's marketing department and judging by how the trailers thus far have shown us way too much of the film's plot (basically the exact same thing which happened with the marketing for 'Prometheus'), I wouldn't be at all surprised if these clips were chosen as a highlight reel. Then again, I am very cynical by nature but with good cause I feel.
I think Fox should've only showed the backburster scene. From the positive response from fans on this site that would've been enough to give the fans/general audience the incentive to see the movie.
I don't think for one moment that Ridley didn't clear them showing that footage. He is now the undisputed franchise ringmaster. What he says goes.
Quote from: SpeedyMaxx on Apr 29, 2017, 12:40:40 AM
I don't think for one moment that Ridley didn't clear them showing that footage. He is now the undisputed franchise ringmaster. What he says goes.
I remember on the commentary track for
Prometheus he said that the higher-ups were asking him why he was shooting scenes a certain way. He said something like this, "After all these years directing you'd think they'd let me be."
Now that was with old regime under Rothman, the new one might have said (and I believe this) "Go make the film you want Ridely."
Yeah, I always wondered which specific higher-ups were questioning him. On the first day of my previous job, we went out to lunch at ROC Sawtelle. Me, my boss and his executives ran into Michael Ellenberg, and I was incredibly tempted to ask him all about Prometheus.
Quote from: BishopShouldGo on Apr 29, 2017, 01:25:06 AM
Yeah, I always wondered which specific higher-ups were questioning him. On the first day of my previous job, we went out to lunch at ROC Sawtelle. Me, my boss and his executives ran into Michael Ellenberg, and I was incredibly tempted to ask him all about Prometheus.
Good to hear that you got into the biz Bishop. I know you always wanted to.
Anyway, if you see him again you should ask him.
Quote from: echobbase79 on Apr 29, 2017, 12:45:48 AM
Now that was with old regime under Rothman, the new one might have said (and I believe this) "Go make the film you want Ridely."
I suspect they've given him carte blanche after the mixed reception to
Prometheus. They're looking to maximize dollar value and in this post-
Deadpool age that means hard R and fan service.
Ironically, it makes me wonder what kind of gore and visceral punch
Prometheus might've had more of if not for Rothman. Despite his historical meddling throughout his studio tenure, I actually think his instinct was correct on trying for new monsters vs. the alien, but here we are, with them now being inclined to hedge their bets and lean on the alien for box office - and I don't think it necessarily had to be that way if the prior film had been a bit more focused and a bit less focus-tested.
Quote from: SpeedyMaxx on Apr 29, 2017, 02:34:23 AM
Quote from: echobbase79 on Apr 29, 2017, 12:45:48 AM
Now that was with old regime under Rothman, the new one might have said (and I believe this) "Go make the film you want Ridely."
I suspect they've given him carte blanche after the mixed reception to Prometheus. They're looking to maximize dollar value and in this post-Deadpool age that means hard R and fan service.
Ironically, it makes me wonder what kind of gore and visceral punch Prometheus might've had more of if not for Rothman. Despite his historical meddling throughout his studio tenure, I actually think his instinct was correct on trying for new monsters vs. the alien, but here we are, with them now being inclined to hedge their bets and lean on the alien for box office - and I don't think it necessarily had to be that way if the prior film had been a bit more focused and a bit less focus-tested.
I think he made that decision because of the
negative reception the
AvP films received. From a business point of view I can totally understand his reasoning.
I think Ridley felt the same way too and viewed the creatures differently after those films. Luckily, he found a way to make them interesting again. At least I think so.
I think it can't be discounted, though, that IMO a huge reason they came back to the alien and more direct prequels vs. following David, Shaw and the Prometheus mythos somewhere new is because of the mixed reception and box office of the last film. This was a business decision and it was likely a wise one. I just wish there could be more of a balance between art and commerce.
Wow! That was brutal. I liked the sound track, it had a very ominous feel to it and I think it went well with the 2nd sequence. I must say, I do feel a little sick after watching that even though in poor quality!
That scene of Rigby falling over on his back was so sickening.
Early parts are very "Aliens" feeling in how they are trying to add characterization to cannon fodder characters (they are trying to use the Cameron/Marines thing where most only have a few lines that epitomize their character) . The tension at the beginning of the second scene is good, but the pay off feels super rushed. After seeing this I am less interested in this movie than before. It's not a film for me. It's just another horror movie with a familiar monster. A well shot version of Friday the 13th part 8: Jason takes Manhattan.
Decent. ☺
This has been bugging me for a while.
Why in the hell
Spoiler
Did Karine went back from arguing with Faris to touch Ledward´s back when she clearly saw it was no good to do so
Did I missed anything?
I think
Spoiler
Karine was just trying to comfort him anyway she could. She had no idea a monster was going to burst from his back.
I don't have the viral marketing dossiers in front of me but I think Karine may be the medic/life sciences officer.
ETA: Per the Death Bracket dossiers, Karine is "lead biologist" and 'empathetic'. It also says that it's actually Faris who is both co-pilot and "ship's medical support".
I think Karine felt that if she was somehow infected it was already a foregone conclusion given her proximity to Ledward and his bodily fluids, and she made the decision that she wanted to try and ease his pain as best she could. Faris tells Karine to put on gloves but Karine ignores her because she is focused on trying to help Ledward.
Spoiler
Sure but it still does not make any sense at all. She doesn´t even have gloves as she comforts and touches him.
I hope this is no superficial complain. But as you´ve pointed out, SpeedyMaxx, I hope her reasons are clarified with prior character development.
Because Karine had decided gloves wouldn't help her at that point if she was to be taken ill - she was in the closest proximity to Ledward and his infection.
I still haven't watched...this I have to see on the big screen!
The footage was gory.. not really "scary".
Tiny albino kitten-monsters are goofy looking.
How did that tiny squishy albino alien manage to break the glass?
???
Faris slipping on the blood was... dumb.
All the dialogue was really dumb.
Prometheus-level storytelling all over again. :-X
I don't know why people find terrified humans with no frame of reference for monstrous alien butchery slipping in pools of blood to be silly or unrealistic. I find it all too realistic and plausible. If something like that erupted without warning that is exactly the kind of fevered chaos that would likely follow.
Quote from: skhellter on Apr 29, 2017, 07:05:39 AMFaris slipping on the blood was... dumb.
I suppose you've never slipped on something wet in your life :laugh:
. .actually jumped out of a jacuzi and slipped and broke my forearm once. .true story!. .but anyway i think that the general consensus on those ten minutes are pretty good so far. .most people seemed to have liked it. .should have had a poll for this. .
I like how you're all arguing that "slipping on the blood was NOT dumb"
(it was kinda like bad slapstick comedy, getting a giggle out of the crowd
in a moment that's supposed to be OMGSCARY!).
but nobody's really arguing against the young neomorphs looking goofy.
;D
It was like watching a young woman wrestling with a cat.
(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Flh5.ggpht.com%2F-8QLcwGQ3Pzo%2FUV3hioi9gyI%2FAAAAAAAAUhw%2FR60no0aWIPk%2Fblad%25252520cute%25252520cat_thumb%2525255B3%2525255D.jpg%3Fimgmax%3D800&hash=5ab7e0ba3d77e26a75802ab55d7e77eba8d43e72)
What was dumb was Faris refusing to let her out in order to contain the infection, yet the first thing she does is go and get a gun then open the door anyway...
That was Milburn and Fifield level stuff.
IT WAS SCARY!
the crowd was giggling in places.
:-\
Quote from: skhellter on Apr 29, 2017, 09:40:37 AM
IT WAS SCARY!
the crowd was giggling in places.
:-\
I get that. I was kinda smirking throughout it but just because I couldn't believe how intense it was. I loved it. But each to their own.
Quote from: TheBATMAN on Apr 29, 2017, 09:36:47 AM
What was dumb was Faris refusing to let her out in order to contain the infection, yet the first thing she does is go and get a gun then open the door anyway...
That was Milburn and Fifield level stuff.
That wasnt dumb, that was selfish and those ladies most likely had a grunge against each other and each others men, as you can see in the last supper trailer, there is a little friction underneath, the woman acted in her own hatefull selfish favor, there is a little bible and humanity in its worst form going on in this one and in Prometheus.
Quote from: TheBATMAN on Apr 29, 2017, 09:36:47 AM
What was dumb was Faris refusing to let her out in order to contain the infection, yet the first thing she does is go and get a gun then open the door anyway...
That was Milburn and Fifield level stuff.
Especially as Faris herself got sprayed in the face with blood.
I enjoyed it the preview tho it was beautiful.
TBH if the infection was a fear, then from a lab perspective I would not have asked to be let out I would have demanded that Faris get her ass back inside ASAP to contain it. You'd think a space crew would have protocols for such situations..
Also 2 against 1 w the wee bugger would have given them a better chance. People do panic and do stupid things so not quite Milburn cuddle the snake stupid.
The problem with Fifield and Milburn is both a question of tone (as a black comedy and horror, it's ok, but the movie seemed serious) and plausability. It's just too much to assume that you could have these two for a high level mission of this kind, after training and careful selection of scientists. Everyone can act stupidly and be fearful, of course, but...
Let's say that this aspect of Prometheus did not work very well.
In Covenant, it's not the same thing : there are specialists among the colonists, but they're not on a top level secret mission to explore a planet explicitly linked to a species really much more advanced than humanity.
Quote from: TheBATMAN on Apr 29, 2017, 09:36:47 AM
What was dumb was Faris refusing to let her out in order to contain the infection, yet the first thing she does is go and get a gun then open the door anyway...
That was Milburn and Fifield level stuff.
Eh, the situation and protocol changed once a living creature came out of the guy's back and started attacking.
Quote from: shawsbaby on Apr 29, 2017, 11:45:06 AM
Quote from: TheBATMAN on Apr 29, 2017, 09:36:47 AM
What was dumb was Faris refusing to let her out in order to contain the infection, yet the first thing she does is go and get a gun then open the door anyway...
That was Milburn and Fifield level stuff.
Eh, the situation and protocol changed once a living creature came out of the guy's back and started attacking.
Indeed.
However it's bullshit claiming that she needs to stop the spread of the infection through quarantine protocols. She got a face load of blood from the guys back before hightailing it out of there; thus being outright contaminated herself and contaminating the entire landing craft. I mean what the heck lady, you already spread the "infection". She should have let the other women out. I have to be honest, Prometheus' ugly logic is turning it's ugly head once again.
Quote from: whiterabbit on Apr 29, 2017, 12:13:40 PM
Quote from: shawsbaby on Apr 29, 2017, 11:45:06 AM
Quote from: TheBATMAN on Apr 29, 2017, 09:36:47 AM
What was dumb was Faris refusing to let her out in order to contain the infection, yet the first thing she does is go and get a gun then open the door anyway...
That was Milburn and Fifield level stuff.
Eh, the situation and protocol changed once a living creature came out of the guy's back and started attacking.
Indeed.
However it's bullshit claiming that she needs to stop the spread of the infection through quarantine protocols. She got a face load of blood from the guys back before hightailing it out of there; thus being outright contaminated herself and contaminating the entire landing craft. I mean what the heck lady, you already spread the "infection". She should have let the other women out. I have to be honest, Prometheus' ugly logic is turning it's ugly head once again.
I don't disagree, but something about the way this plays out feels more natural and realistic than what went down in Prometheus (you know, if we can get past the fact that in both films no one is wearing any goddamn protective gear on an alien planet). They all seem more genuinely petrified and surprised by what's happened.
I'm also wondering if the Last Supper video focusing on Faris being drunk all the time is supposed to play a role in this? Like, is she wasted while this all goes down?
They have really sold the fact that they are terrified and panicking in this scene, so their actions seem fine with me.
Quote from: SpeedyMaxx on Apr 29, 2017, 08:26:36 AM
I don't know why people find terrified humans with no frame of reference for monstrous alien butchery slipping in pools of blood to be silly or unrealistic. I find it all too realistic and plausible. If something like that erupted without warning that is exactly the kind of fevered chaos that would likely follow.
I agree..... Faris was terrified and stressed out. And as any video footage of a real disaster would show, people quickly get lost in panic and ensuing chaos during periods of extreme terror and/or stress. So I'm with you.... I don't know why people are giving Faris such a hard time about slipping in blood. In such situations, the very first thing to go out the window is rational thought and that is followed up by logic taking a vacation. Even the most level-headed people suffer from this when adrenaline enters the equation.
Quote from: skhellter on Apr 29, 2017, 09:33:20 AM
I like how you're all arguing that "slipping on the blood was NOT dumb"
(it was kinda like bad slapstick comedy, getting a giggle out of the crowd
in a moment that's supposed to be OMGSCARY!).
but nobody's really arguing against the young neomorphs looking goofy.
;D
It was like watching a young woman wrestling with a cat.
Were you expecting something cute and cuddly? The newborn neomorphs don't look goofy to me... they look fine. I mean, in a universe where you have snake-like dildo's with teeth and t-rex limbs (classic chestburster), the newborn neomorphs fit right in. These descriptions, by the way, are actual descriptions from cast members. Veronica Cartwright described the chestburster as a dildo with t-rex limbs and Sigourney Weaver described it as a dildo with teeth.
Quote from: TheBATMAN on Apr 29, 2017, 09:36:47 AM
What was dumb was Faris refusing to let her out in order to contain the infection, yet the first thing she does is go and get a gun then open the door anyway...
That was Milburn and Fifield level stuff.
The problem here is your expecting clarity and logic from a pair of women that are scared out of their minds and obviously aren't thinking clearly. Faris was fine being in the room until she freaked out when first backburster "pop" occurred. At that point, she hightailed it out of there. This is a perfectly natural response considering she was scared senseless and just wanted to get away.
Karine stayed behind because, as The Last Supper video showed, there was something going on between her and the infected guy (whose name escapes me... I'm still attaching names to faces!) She was worried about his well being and wanted to stay to comfort him. What your seeing here is basically the fight or flight response. In Faris's case, the adrenaline dump prompted a flight response, whereas Karine's dump triggered a fight response.
The scene is layered with nuance so what you take away from it really depends on how much your paying attention and how much you know about human nature/psychology. If you have seen the Last Supper vid, you know there's a thing going on between Karine and the backburster guy. If you pay attention to the banter between Karine and Faris in that vid, you know there's a little bit of tension between the two (they don't hate each other, but also clearly don't care for one another which provides another motivator for Faris to abandon Karine and not let her out). And depending on what you know about human nature/psychology, then you can recognize the fight or flight response from both women. So that's four layers of nuance in one scene.
To compare this scene to the Hammerpede scene, which had zero nuance and was essentially a pair of dudes being stupid, is a bit unfair. In my opinion, at any rate.
Quote from: Ulfer on Apr 29, 2017, 11:44:01 AMIn Covenant, it's not the same thing : there are specialists among the colonists, but they're not on a top level secret mission to explore a planet explicitly linked to a species really much more advanced than humanity.
If in the 20th century NASA was already caring to sterilize all their modules and each company have safety protocole that are most of the time respected, I don't see why WY hasn't issue a training to each people hired to colonization to at least have the basic.
Unless enrolling to colonization is like going for a job interview at McDonald.
The atmosphere / contamination problem was already addressed in Prometheus of how stupid top noch scientist were.
But even rookie should have basic training to understand that:
YOU DON'T LAND ON A PLANET WITHOUT SAFETY PRECAUTION.
If not for you, at least for the Fauna/Flore of the planet to protect it from being wiped at by a simple flu.
It's common knowledge and it's twice the stupidity re-harsh on screen.
That and the whole quarantine thing. ::) Sure sure, there may be a grudge between the two women but even then, if your argument is to respect quarantine, at least respect it yourself OR just don't respect it at all. Don't be like "oh, I'm gonna lock you up to die because I think we'll have higher rate of survival if you die" kind of thought. :D
I can't believe she's thinking this while she consistently show that SHE is contaminated through touching thing and getting blood.
And being in quarantine does't mean you gonna die, they know absolutely nothing of what this pathogen is, if it can be transferred, if they've all been infected already. It's really just for the sake of the action/gore of the scene that is story driven because something needs to happen by any mean necessary.
Quote from: skhellter on Apr 29, 2017, 07:05:39 AM
The footage was gory.. not really "scary".
Tiny albino kitten-monsters are goofy looking.
How did that tiny squishy albino alien manage to break the glass?
???
Faris slipping on the blood was... dumb.
All the dialogue was really dumb.
Prometheus-level storytelling all over again. :-X
so what you're saying is you don't like this, you dont like this movie, you dont like this genre, why are you herE?
QuoteYOU DON'T LAND ON A PLANET WITHOUT SAFETY PRECAUTION.
(https://vignette2.wikia.nocookie.net/avp/images/7/76/Hicks_and_others_waiting_for_Dropship.png/revision/latest?cb=20140803020259)
Why don't you mention 'Aliens'?
The marines have no protection while the station has been ravaged by an unknown threat ...
Dumb dialogue? What kind of dialogue does one expect in a scene like this?
Quote from: Stolen on Apr 29, 2017, 02:29:20 PM
QuoteYOU DON'T LAND ON A PLANET WITHOUT SAFETY PRECAUTION.
(https://vignette2.wikia.nocookie.net/avp/images/7/76/Hicks_and_others_waiting_for_Dropship.png/revision/latest?cb=20140803020259)
Why don't you mention 'Aliens'?
The marines have no protection while the station has been ravaged by an unknown threat ...
Because the planet was a dead rock so you want to create life where there's none.
No need to be scared of pathogen.
Because people have been living here for years.
Because The marine are here in case it's not a "malfunction" and are supposed to eliminate the threat if there are any.
Because even in the case there were xenomorph, nobody ever suspected the idea of a queen and a rapid growing of an Alien colony (under-estimated their enemy) but they still chose to take an entire squad of USCM to be prepared just in case.
And lastly because thanks to Ripley, they know how you get infected by a xenomorph, the company has read the report.
There's no reason to believe an Helmet in that situation would be useful.
Although, they all know the protocole if they get caught by Aliens.
Also, even if the title says there's going to be Alien, beside Burke, everyone thinks its probably a Malfunction.
Plop!
CG is a bit rubbery, but I imagine they've been using the same clips from the showcase back in December when post was still in its early days.
Like that the first scene had actual characters in it (Though I'm tempted to say "I HATE SPACE" is the new "I LOVE ROCKS"), and I imagine the second scene will be insane in the theater.
Do these scenes take place after they've been to the Juggernaut?
Quote from: Le Celticant on Apr 29, 2017, 02:41:36 PM
Quote from: Stolen on Apr 29, 2017, 02:29:20 PM
QuoteYOU DON'T LAND ON A PLANET WITHOUT SAFETY PRECAUTION.
(https://vignette2.wikia.nocookie.net/avp/images/7/76/Hicks_and_others_waiting_for_Dropship.png/revision/latest?cb=20140803020259)
Why don't you mention 'Aliens'?
The marines have no protection while the station has been ravaged by an unknown threat ...
Because the planet was a dead rock so you want to create life where there's none.
No need to be scared of pathogen.
Because people have been living here for years.
Because The marine are here in case it's not a "malfunction" and are supposed to eliminate the threat if there are any.
Because even in the case there were xenomorph, nobody ever suspected the idea of a queen and a rapid growing of an Alien colony (under-estimated their enemy) but they still chose to take an entire squad of USCM to be prepared just in case.
And lastly because thanks to Ripley, they know how you get infected by a xenomorph, the company has read the report.
There's no reason to believe an Helmet in that situation would be useful.
Although, they all know the protocole if they get caught by Aliens.
Also, even if the title says there's going to be Alien, beside Burke, everyone thinks its probably a Malfunction.
Plop!
Your also looking at this from the perspective of a person who already knows what is going on. You do make a valid argument about the marines not observing proper safety rules. However... if it's good for the goose, it's good for the gander. You can't give Aliens a pass for the very thing you are holding against other movies. Yes LV-426 was a dead rock and they were there under the assumption that there was a malfunction and not an alien infestation. However, if you will recall, they had setup operation in the colony complex and had discovered the facehuggers in their holding tubes prior to heading out to the atmosphere processor where the hive was. At that point, it should have been clear that they weren't dealing with just a malfunction and that there was something to Ripley's story (especially since she verified it was the same when Burke asked her directly if it was the same). And since they had no idea what they were walking into when they went into the atmosphere processor (airborne contagions, environmental conditions, etc), they should have been observing the same safety protocols that you are slamming the Covenant crew of disregarding.
Is it entirely possible that maybe, just maybe, they performed a scan of the atmosphere composition of the planet and determined it was completely habitable and had no sign of contagion or radioactive isotopes prior to heading down on the drop ship? Is it possible that they may have even conducted a surface scan of the potential landing sites to ensure there was minimal risk? Or, along that same line of thought, is it possible that they may have launched probes to scan the planet before they even got there to get all of this information when the distress beacon was picked up?
We don't have all the information at this point regarding the lead up to the Covenant crew landing on the planet. To make any kind of judgement at this point would be premature at best. But I am going to stand by the assertion that you can't give Aliens a pass for the very thing you are condemning Covenant for. Furthermore, Prometheus is an entirely different load of crap and the sins of that movie should not be visited upon Covenant until such a time that such comparison can be made fairly and with clear understanding of the events of the movie. Making the comparison now just comes off as blind hatred for hatred sake and judging a book by it's cover and not it's contents.
Quote from: Le Celticant on Apr 29, 2017, 02:41:36 PM
Quote from: Stolen on Apr 29, 2017, 02:29:20 PM
QuoteYOU DON'T LAND ON A PLANET WITHOUT SAFETY PRECAUTION.
(https://vignette2.wikia.nocookie.net/avp/images/7/76/Hicks_and_others_waiting_for_Dropship.png/revision/latest?cb=20140803020259)
Why don't you mention 'Aliens'?
The marines have no protection while the station has been ravaged by an unknown threat ...
Because the planet was a dead rock so you want to create life where there's none.
No need to be scared of pathogen.
Because people have been living here for years.
Because The marine are here in case it's not a "malfunction" and are supposed to eliminate the threat if there are any.
Because even in the case there were xenomorph, nobody ever suspected the idea of a queen and a rapid growing of an Alien colony (under-estimated their enemy) but they still chose to take an entire squad of USCM to be prepared just in case.
And lastly because thanks to Ripley, they know how you get infected by a xenomorph, the company has read the report.
There's no reason to believe an Helmet in that situation would be useful.
Although, they all know the protocole if they get caught by Aliens.
Also, even if the title says there's going to be Alien, beside Burke, everyone thinks its probably a Malfunction.
Plop!
You're wrong. In Aliens they sent the marines to check out why communications from the colonists had ceased. They (whomever green lit the expedition) assumed loss of communication was due to either Ripley's 'alien monsters' or something else (and that 'something else' could be anything from a communicable disease to bad weather right?). So what do they do? They assign Lieutenant Gorman, whose experience consisted of one previous combat drop, to oversee a potentialy deadly mission that could have involved anything from 8ft aliens to space pirates. And then when the marines get into orbit, they send everybody (that's EVERYBODY) down to the surface not knowing what the issue is. Why not leave one person on the Sulaco? Why not send a probe in the first instance? Why not send Bishop?
And you have a problem with the crew of the Covenant not wearing helmets? ::)
Quote from: Darth Vile on Apr 29, 2017, 03:31:55 PM
Quote from: Le Celticant on Apr 29, 2017, 02:41:36 PM
Quote from: Stolen on Apr 29, 2017, 02:29:20 PM
QuoteYOU DON'T LAND ON A PLANET WITHOUT SAFETY PRECAUTION.
(https://vignette2.wikia.nocookie.net/avp/images/7/76/Hicks_and_others_waiting_for_Dropship.png/revision/latest?cb=20140803020259)
Why don't you mention 'Aliens'?
The marines have no protection while the station has been ravaged by an unknown threat ...
Because the planet was a dead rock so you want to create life where there's none.
No need to be scared of pathogen.
Because people have been living here for years.
Because The marine are here in case it's not a "malfunction" and are supposed to eliminate the threat if there are any.
Because even in the case there were xenomorph, nobody ever suspected the idea of a queen and a rapid growing of an Alien colony (under-estimated their enemy) but they still chose to take an entire squad of USCM to be prepared just in case.
And lastly because thanks to Ripley, they know how you get infected by a xenomorph, the company has read the report.
There's no reason to believe an Helmet in that situation would be useful.
Although, they all know the protocole if they get caught by Aliens.
Also, even if the title says there's going to be Alien, beside Burke, everyone thinks its probably a Malfunction.
Plop!
You're wrong. In Aliens they sent the marines to check out why communications from the colonists had ceased. They (whomever green lit the expedition) assumed loss of communication was due to either Ripley's 'alien monsters' or something else (and that 'something else' could be anything from a communicable disease to bad weather right?). So what do they do? They assign Lieutenant Gorman, whose experience consisted of one previous combat drop, to oversee a potentialy deadly mission that could have involved anything from 8ft aliens to space pirates. And then when the marines get into orbit, they send everybody (that's EVERYBODY) down to the surface not knowing what the issue is. Why not leave one person on the Sulaco? Why not send a probe in the first instance? Why not send Bishop?
And you have a problem with the crew of the Covenant not wearing helmets? ::)
Your absolutely right Darth. I didn't even think about the fact that everyone on the Sulaco went down to the surface before verifying the situation on the planet. That's another botched safety protocol right there. Another instance of double standards being applied. :(
Quote from: oberonqa on Apr 29, 2017, 03:36:12 PM
Your absolutely right Darth. I didn't even think about the fact that everyone on the Sulaco went down to the surface before verifying the situation on the planet. That's another botched safety protocol right there. Another instance of double standards being applied. :(
The thing is that these elements only really grate when the rest of the film isn't working. There's plenty of bad science, dodgy dialogue and irrational/stupid behaviour in Alien and Aliens... but it doesn't really matter because the films work. Those elements become irrelevant. It's more obvious in Prometheus (although I like the film), because it isn't half as successful at being scary or as entertaining as Alien/Aliens.
Quote from: Darth Vile on Apr 29, 2017, 03:48:02 PM
Quote from: oberonqa on Apr 29, 2017, 03:36:12 PM
Your absolutely right Darth. I didn't even think about the fact that everyone on the Sulaco went down to the surface before verifying the situation on the planet. That's another botched safety protocol right there. Another instance of double standards being applied. :(
The thing is that these elements only really grate when the rest of the film isn't working. There's plenty of bad science, dodgy dialogue and irrational/stupid behaviour in Alien and Aliens... but it doesn't really matter because the films work. Those elements become irrelevant. It's more obvious in Prometheus (although I like the film), because it isn't half as successful at being scary or as entertaining as Alien/Aliens.
Translation: People are less likely to nitpick something when they are being entertained.
Quote from: Infected on Apr 29, 2017, 11:14:55 AM
That wasnt dumb, that was selfish and those ladies most likely had a grunge against each other and each others men, as you can see in the last supper trailer, there is a little friction underneath, the woman acted in her own hatefull selfish favor, there is a little bible and humanity in its worst form going on in this one and in Prometheus.
I think you are reaching there. Whatever friction existed between them I highly doubt it was deep enough for Farris to decide to just lock her in there to die. Yes she was selfish, that goes without saying, but the point is she was always going to go back inside, therefore she should have let her out, especially when she went back the second time.
Quote from: shawsbaby on Apr 29, 2017, 11:45:06 AM
Eh, the situation and protocol changed once a living creature came out of the guy's back and started attacking.
Did it? Why did it change exactly? So you're suggesting you need to quarantine an alien pathogen but there's no need for quarantine when an actual alien emerges? Yup, that makes sense... ???
Quote from: oberonqa on Apr 29, 2017, 01:18:01 PM
The problem here is your expecting clarity and logic from a pair of women that are scared out of their minds and obviously aren't thinking clearly. Faris was fine being in the room until she freaked out when first backburster "pop" occurred. At that point, she hightailed it out of there. This is a perfectly natural response considering she was scared senseless and just wanted to get away.
Karine stayed behind because, as The Last Supper video showed, there was something going on between her and the infected guy (whose name escapes me... I'm still attaching names to faces!) She was worried about his well being and wanted to stay to comfort him. What your seeing here is basically the fight or flight response. In Faris's case, the adrenaline dump prompted a flight response, whereas Karine's dump triggered a fight response.
The scene is layered with nuance so what you take away from it really depends on how much your paying attention and how much you know about human nature/psychology. If you have seen the Last Supper vid, you know there's a thing going on between Karine and the backburster guy. If you pay attention to the banter between Karine and Faris in that vid, you know there's a little bit of tension between the two (they don't hate each other, but also clearly don't care for one another which provides another motivator for Faris to abandon Karine and not let her out). And depending on what you know about human nature/psychology, then you can recognize the fight or flight response from both women. So that's four layers of nuance in one scene.
To compare this scene to the Hammerpede scene, which had zero nuance and was essentially a pair of dudes being stupid, is a bit unfair. In my opinion, at any rate.
The panic stuff I don't mind, it's the fact that she locked Karine in there and steadfastly refused to let her out - despite her sole intention being to go and get a weapon and then go straight back inside - it makes zero sense whatsoever. Karine didn't stay behind, she was locked inside. I've watched the Last Supper and the back burster guy isn't even in it so I'm not sure what you are referring to there. It's not flight or flight either when she purposefully intends to go back inside. Had she just ran off, the scene would make sense. Psychology doesn't come into it. Even if it was as you suggested, and Farris purposefully locked her in because she did not like her - it makes no sense that she would later then go back inside - both to kill the alien and to save her, when she could have just let her out to begin with.
-And just to weigh in on the whole Colonial Marines going down to LV-426 without protective headgear argument, I don't think that is the same thing considering colonists had been living down there there for 20 years.
that was f**king intense
Quote from: oberonqa on Apr 29, 2017, 03:36:12 PM
Quote from: Darth Vile on Apr 29, 2017, 03:31:55 PM
Quote from: Le Celticant on Apr 29, 2017, 02:41:36 PM
Quote from: Stolen on Apr 29, 2017, 02:29:20 PM
QuoteYOU DON'T LAND ON A PLANET WITHOUT SAFETY PRECAUTION.
(https://vignette2.wikia.nocookie.net/avp/images/7/76/Hicks_and_others_waiting_for_Dropship.png/revision/latest?cb=20140803020259)
Why don't you mention 'Aliens'?
The marines have no protection while the station has been ravaged by an unknown threat ...
Because the planet was a dead rock so you want to create life where there's none.
No need to be scared of pathogen.
Because people have been living here for years.
Because The marine are here in case it's not a "malfunction" and are supposed to eliminate the threat if there are any.
Because even in the case there were xenomorph, nobody ever suspected the idea of a queen and a rapid growing of an Alien colony (under-estimated their enemy) but they still chose to take an entire squad of USCM to be prepared just in case.
And lastly because thanks to Ripley, they know how you get infected by a xenomorph, the company has read the report.
There's no reason to believe an Helmet in that situation would be useful.
Although, they all know the protocole if they get caught by Aliens.
Also, even if the title says there's going to be Alien, beside Burke, everyone thinks its probably a Malfunction.
Plop!
You're wrong. In Aliens they sent the marines to check out why communications from the colonists had ceased. They (whomever green lit the expedition) assumed loss of communication was due to either Ripley's 'alien monsters' or something else (and that 'something else' could be anything from a communicable disease to bad weather right?). So what do they do? They assign Lieutenant Gorman, whose experience consisted of one previous combat drop, to oversee a potentialy deadly mission that could have involved anything from 8ft aliens to space pirates. And then when the marines get into orbit, they send everybody (that's EVERYBODY) down to the surface not knowing what the issue is. Why not leave one person on the Sulaco? Why not send a probe in the first instance? Why not send Bishop?
And you have a problem with the crew of the Covenant not wearing helmets? ::)
Your absolutely right Darth. I didn't even think about the fact that everyone on the Sulaco went down to the surface before verifying the situation on the planet. That's another botched safety protocol right there. Another instance of double standards being applied. :(
It's not a double standard at all. If they had received a transmission from the colony that people were sick and dying from a highly contagious pathogen, you'd have a point. No one believed anything Ripley was saying about the Alien for even a second. The scenes in the processor are believable as well. Those chain of events in ALIENS are not comparable to the instances of sheer idiocy that occurred with the
Prometheus crew. Holloway and Millburn's actions were akin to having a death wish.
Jesus Christ here we go again with safety protocols...it was silly and annoying and f**king stupid and bizarre and made me wanna vomit when people started doing this to Prometheus...i mean seriously can't people just enjoy a movie for what it is....instead of picking apart every f**king detail of every f**king scene....when people panic they do silly things...they don't think straight...she ran of cause she was scared ...and then she probably thought...no wait...i cannot leave her their...i am getting the shotgun and going back...not everyone is Ripley or Shaw or Daniels or Hicks for that matter...not everyone is that brave...so panic can cause a lot of weird behavior...not wearing safety gear was perhaps a bad decision... so was landing on that f**king planet in the first place....but they did and if they didn't...then would their even be a movie?..
From what I saw of the clip the character Faris seemed to be very concerned about safety protocol. I watched up until she locks the door to the medbay. After that, I can't comment.
Quote from: juxtapose on Apr 29, 2017, 05:06:29 PM
Jesus Christ here we go again with safety protocols...it was silly and annoying and f**king stupid and bizarre and made me wanna vomit when people started doing this to Prometheus...i mean seriously can't people just enjoy a movie for what it is....instead of picking apart every f**king detail of every f**king scene....when people panic they do silly things...they don't think straight...she ran of cause she was scared ...and then she probably thought...no wait...i cannot leave her their...i am getting the shotgun and going back...not everyone is Ripley or Shaw or Daniels or Hicks for that matter...not everyone is that brave...so panic can cause a lot of weird behavior...not wearing safety gear was perhaps a bad decision... so was landing on that f**king planet in the first place....but they did and if they didn't...then would their even be a movie?..
Millburn wasn't panicking when he tried to
pet a space cobra.
Quote from: juxtapose on Apr 29, 2017, 05:06:29 PM
Jesus Christ here we go again with safety protocols...it was silly and annoying and f**king stupid and bizarre and made me wanna vomit when people started doing this to Prometheus...i mean seriously can't people just enjoy a movie for what it is....instead of picking apart every f**king detail of every f**king scene....when people panic they do silly things...they don't think straight...she ran of cause she was scared ...and then she probably thought...no wait...i cannot leave her their...i am getting the shotgun and going back...not everyone is Ripley or Shaw or Daniels or Hicks for that matter...not everyone is that brave...so panic can cause a lot of weird behavior...not wearing safety gear was perhaps a bad decision... so was landing on that f**king planet in the first place....but they did and if they didn't...then would their even be a movie?..
Yes, annoying as f**k offering opinion on the only scenes of the movie we have available. Shame on us.
Quote from: Predaker on Apr 29, 2017, 05:12:14 PM
Quote from: juxtapose on Apr 29, 2017, 05:06:29 PM
Jesus Christ here we go again with safety protocols...it was silly and annoying and f**king stupid and bizarre and made me wanna vomit when people started doing this to Prometheus...i mean seriously can't people just enjoy a movie for what it is....instead of picking apart every f**king detail of every f**king scene....when people panic they do silly things...they don't think straight...she ran of cause she was scared ...and then she probably thought...no wait...i cannot leave her their...i am getting the shotgun and going back...not everyone is Ripley or Shaw or Daniels or Hicks for that matter...not everyone is that brave...so panic can cause a lot of weird behavior...not wearing safety gear was perhaps a bad decision... so was landing on that f**king planet in the first place....but they did and if they didn't...then would their even be a movie?..
Millburn wasn't panicking when he tried to pet a space cobra.
He was in a protective suit.
Quote from: Predaker on Apr 29, 2017, 04:55:39 PM
Quote from: oberonqa on Apr 29, 2017, 03:36:12 PM
Quote from: Darth Vile on Apr 29, 2017, 03:31:55 PM
Quote from: Le Celticant on Apr 29, 2017, 02:41:36 PM
Quote from: Stolen on Apr 29, 2017, 02:29:20 PM
QuoteYOU DON'T LAND ON A PLANET WITHOUT SAFETY PRECAUTION.
(https://vignette2.wikia.nocookie.net/avp/images/7/76/Hicks_and_others_waiting_for_Dropship.png/revision/latest?cb=20140803020259)
Why don't you mention 'Aliens'?
The marines have no protection while the station has been ravaged by an unknown threat ...
Because the planet was a dead rock so you want to create life where there's none.
No need to be scared of pathogen.
Because people have been living here for years.
Because The marine are here in case it's not a "malfunction" and are supposed to eliminate the threat if there are any.
Because even in the case there were xenomorph, nobody ever suspected the idea of a queen and a rapid growing of an Alien colony (under-estimated their enemy) but they still chose to take an entire squad of USCM to be prepared just in case.
And lastly because thanks to Ripley, they know how you get infected by a xenomorph, the company has read the report.
There's no reason to believe an Helmet in that situation would be useful.
Although, they all know the protocole if they get caught by Aliens.
Also, even if the title says there's going to be Alien, beside Burke, everyone thinks its probably a Malfunction.
Plop!
You're wrong. In Aliens they sent the marines to check out why communications from the colonists had ceased. They (whomever green lit the expedition) assumed loss of communication was due to either Ripley's 'alien monsters' or something else (and that 'something else' could be anything from a communicable disease to bad weather right?). So what do they do? They assign Lieutenant Gorman, whose experience consisted of one previous combat drop, to oversee a potentialy deadly mission that could have involved anything from 8ft aliens to space pirates. And then when the marines get into orbit, they send everybody (that's EVERYBODY) down to the surface not knowing what the issue is. Why not leave one person on the Sulaco? Why not send a probe in the first instance? Why not send Bishop?
And you have a problem with the crew of the Covenant not wearing helmets? ::)
Your absolutely right Darth. I didn't even think about the fact that everyone on the Sulaco went down to the surface before verifying the situation on the planet. That's another botched safety protocol right there. Another instance of double standards being applied. :(
It's not a double standard at all. If they had received a transmission from the colony that people were sick and dying from a highly contagious pathogen, you'd have a point. No one believed anything Ripley was saying about the Alien for even a second. The scenes in the processor are believable as well. Those chain of events in ALIENS are not comparable to the instances of sheer idiocy that occurred with the Prometheus crew. Holloway and Millburn's actions were akin to having a death wish.
Have you not seen Aliens? They sent a bunch of marines. They (the company) believed, or obviously suspected, Ripley was telling the truth as soon as they lost contact with Hadley's Hope. The marines are portrayed as being pretty stupid in the film. It doesn't deminish the film, but there are numerous gaps in logic. Why try and deny it?
Quote from: oberonqa on Apr 29, 2017, 03:53:51 PM
Quote from: Darth Vile on Apr 29, 2017, 03:48:02 PM
Quote from: oberonqa on Apr 29, 2017, 03:36:12 PM
Your absolutely right Darth. I didn't even think about the fact that everyone on the Sulaco went down to the surface before verifying the situation on the planet. That's another botched safety protocol right there. Another instance of double standards being applied. :(
The thing is that these elements only really grate when the rest of the film isn't working. There's plenty of bad science, dodgy dialogue and irrational/stupid behaviour in Alien and Aliens... but it doesn't really matter because the films work. Those elements become irrelevant. It's more obvious in Prometheus (although I like the film), because it isn't half as successful at being scary or as entertaining as Alien/Aliens.
Translation: People are less likely to nitpick something when they are being entertained.
Translation: You are projecting your own bias onto a film you haven't even seen yet.
Quote from: TheBATMAN on Apr 29, 2017, 04:25:20 PM
Quote from: Infected on Apr 29, 2017, 11:14:55 AM
That wasnt dumb, that was selfish and those ladies most likely had a grunge against each other and each others men, as you can see in the last supper trailer, there is a little friction underneath, the woman acted in her own hatefull selfish favor, there is a little bible and humanity in its worst form going on in this one and in Prometheus.
I think you are reaching there. Whatever friction existed between them I highly doubt it was deep enough for Farris to decide to just lock her in there to die. Yes she was selfish, that goes without saying, but the point is she was always going to go back inside, therefore she should have let her out, especially when she went back the second time.
Quote from: shawsbaby on Apr 29, 2017, 11:45:06 AM
Eh, the situation and protocol changed once a living creature came out of the guy's back and started attacking.
Did it? Why did it change exactly? So you're suggesting you need to quarantine an alien pathogen but there's no need for quarantine when an actual alien emerges? Yup, that makes sense... ???
Quote from: oberonqa on Apr 29, 2017, 01:18:01 PM
The problem here is your expecting clarity and logic from a pair of women that are scared out of their minds and obviously aren't thinking clearly. Faris was fine being in the room until she freaked out when first backburster "pop" occurred. At that point, she hightailed it out of there. This is a perfectly natural response considering she was scared senseless and just wanted to get away.
Karine stayed behind because, as The Last Supper video showed, there was something going on between her and the infected guy (whose name escapes me... I'm still attaching names to faces!) She was worried about his well being and wanted to stay to comfort him. What your seeing here is basically the fight or flight response. In Faris's case, the adrenaline dump prompted a flight response, whereas Karine's dump triggered a fight response.
The scene is layered with nuance so what you take away from it really depends on how much your paying attention and how much you know about human nature/psychology. If you have seen the Last Supper vid, you know there's a thing going on between Karine and the backburster guy. If you pay attention to the banter between Karine and Faris in that vid, you know there's a little bit of tension between the two (they don't hate each other, but also clearly don't care for one another which provides another motivator for Faris to abandon Karine and not let her out). And depending on what you know about human nature/psychology, then you can recognize the fight or flight response from both women. So that's four layers of nuance in one scene.
To compare this scene to the Hammerpede scene, which had zero nuance and was essentially a pair of dudes being stupid, is a bit unfair. In my opinion, at any rate.
The panic stuff I don't mind, it's the fact that she locked Karine in there and steadfastly refused to let her out - despite her sole intention being to go and get a weapon and then go straight back inside - it makes zero sense whatsoever. Karine didn't stay behind, she was locked inside. I've watched the Last Supper and the back burster guy isn't even in it so I'm not sure what you are referring to there. It's not flight or flight either when she purposefully intends to go back inside. Had she just ran off, the scene would make sense. Psychology doesn't come into it. Even if it was as you suggested, and Farris purposefully locked her in because she did not like her - it makes no sense that she would later then go back inside - both to kill the alien and to save her, when she could have just let her out to begin with.
-And just to weigh in on the whole Colonial Marines going down to LV-426 without protective headgear argument, I don't think that is the same thing considering colonists had been living down there there for 20 years.
Well, playing devil's advocate here but when she locked them inside the med bay, she assumed it was something like a virus or contagion, not some monstrosity about to tear through his insides and then proceed to viciously assault everyone it sees. Once she witnesses the neo birth, she then runs and gets the gun while keeping it contained in the med bay. Yeah, its shitty what she did to the other woman, locking her in there, but in a panicked mindset (which she clearly is panicking), I could easily see her actions as reasonable. She made clutch decisions in a panicked state during a situation I am sure she never anticipated. She also might not of thought the creature could kill her friend as quickly as it did.. Seeing as though she probably did not grow up watching the alien films...
Edit: Basically what I am trying to say is she made bad decisions, not necessarily unreasonable ones.
Quote from: Predaker on Apr 29, 2017, 04:55:39 PM
Quote from: oberonqa on Apr 29, 2017, 03:36:12 PM
Quote from: Darth Vile on Apr 29, 2017, 03:31:55 PM
Quote from: Le Celticant on Apr 29, 2017, 02:41:36 PM
Quote from: Stolen on Apr 29, 2017, 02:29:20 PM
QuoteYOU DON'T LAND ON A PLANET WITHOUT SAFETY PRECAUTION.
(https://vignette2.wikia.nocookie.net/avp/images/7/76/Hicks_and_others_waiting_for_Dropship.png/revision/latest?cb=20140803020259)
Why don't you mention 'Aliens'?
The marines have no protection while the station has been ravaged by an unknown threat ...
Because the planet was a dead rock so you want to create life where there's none.
No need to be scared of pathogen.
Because people have been living here for years.
Because The marine are here in case it's not a "malfunction" and are supposed to eliminate the threat if there are any.
Because even in the case there were xenomorph, nobody ever suspected the idea of a queen and a rapid growing of an Alien colony (under-estimated their enemy) but they still chose to take an entire squad of USCM to be prepared just in case.
And lastly because thanks to Ripley, they know how you get infected by a xenomorph, the company has read the report.
There's no reason to believe an Helmet in that situation would be useful.
Although, they all know the protocole if they get caught by Aliens.
Also, even if the title says there's going to be Alien, beside Burke, everyone thinks its probably a Malfunction.
Plop!
You're wrong. In Aliens they sent the marines to check out why communications from the colonists had ceased. They (whomever green lit the expedition) assumed loss of communication was due to either Ripley's 'alien monsters' or something else (and that 'something else' could be anything from a communicable disease to bad weather right?). So what do they do? They assign Lieutenant Gorman, whose experience consisted of one previous combat drop, to oversee a potentialy deadly mission that could have involved anything from 8ft aliens to space pirates. And then when the marines get into orbit, they send everybody (that's EVERYBODY) down to the surface not knowing what the issue is. Why not leave one person on the Sulaco? Why not send a probe in the first instance? Why not send Bishop?
And you have a problem with the crew of the Covenant not wearing helmets? ::)
Your absolutely right Darth. I didn't even think about the fact that everyone on the Sulaco went down to the surface before verifying the situation on the planet. That's another botched safety protocol right there. Another instance of double standards being applied. :(
It's not a double standard at all. If they had received a transmission from the colony that people were sick and dying from a highly contagious pathogen, you'd have a point. No one believed anything Ripley was saying about the Alien for even a second. The scenes in the processor are believable as well. Those chain of events in ALIENS are not comparable to the instances of sheer idiocy that occurred with the Prometheus crew. Holloway and Millburn's actions were akin to having a death wish.
I'm not even referring to Prometheus... that is it's own bag of worms. I am simply referring to Covenant being persecuted for the very thing that Aliens gets a pass for.
And it is a double standard. Once the marines entered the science labs and found the facehugger specimens in the jar, every single action taken from that point forward is a violation of safety protocols. They all went into that atmosphere processor after discovering the facehugger specimens and reading about embryo implantation (Maracheck, John J died before embryo implantation)... so they all knew Ripley was on the level. They just disregarded it because they were the Ultimate Badasses and Ultimate Badasses don't need to worry about safety protocols, am I right?
It's a double standard and you can't disagree with that. If Ultimate Badasses can disregard safety protocols, then the crew of a colonization expedition that are clearly in a state of extreme terror and panic can be forgiven their not acting in a perfectly rational manner and observing safety protocols to a letter.
And don't bring up Prometheus again, please. There's no excuse for the behavior of the crew in that movie.
Quote from: Darth Vile on Apr 29, 2017, 05:22:00 PM
Translation: You are projecting your own bias onto a film you haven't even seen yet.
Whoa there buddy.... I'M AGREEING WITH YOU!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Chill the <bleep> out!
Quote from: BishopShouldGo on Apr 29, 2017, 05:20:39 PMHe was in a protective suit.
It was a spacesuit.
Hardly anything designed to protect against animal attack.
What I find compelling (and terrifying) about the scene is the flawed humanity in it. From the moment she sees Ledward, Faris is very concerned and becomes incredibly cautious around him. Karine wants her help and Faris clearly does not want to be anywhere near him - she backs off even touching the headphones for the comms uplink, dumps his gear and her jacket on the landing ramp. She is very focused on not being vulnerable to infection. She tries to tell Karine to put on gloves but Karine is much more focused on saving Ledward's life (and has already been far too exposed to still worry about it).
What's really interesting is that even after Ledward's blood gets on her, Faris still behaves the same way - with the only exemption from quarantine being, naturally, herself. She locks them in despite having his blood on her as well. It's what an increasingly panicked person would do; it is a natural, selfish, frightened human reaction. She cries to her husband that she thinks she and Karine may have the same thing. But when the shit hits the fan, she does try to do the right thing and go for the guns to help.
Her reactions are both contradictory and human and sympathetic, if flawed. It's a whole little character play in a series of beats over a swift sequence. I was impressed with it and wasn't expecting it. If you're only in these movies to see hardened pros and badasses at work I can understand the complaint - and I can understand some of the complaints about, say, the scientists in Prometheus. These characters in AC are considerably more salt of the earth, despite their job titles. They're a close-knit group, not just professionals brought together on a mission.
Millburn, Fielfield and Holloway are the worst most stupid characters in the whole series in my opinion. So stupid and inconsistently written.
Quote from: SpeedyMaxx on Apr 29, 2017, 06:11:54 PM
What I find compelling (and terrifiyng) about the scene is the flawed humanity in it. From the moment she sees Ledward, Faris is very concerned and becomes incredibly cautious around him. Karine wants her help and Faris clearly does not want to be anywhere near him - she backs off even touching the headphones for the comms uplink, dumps his gear and her jacket on the landing ramp. She is very focused on not being vulnerable to infection. She tries to tell Karine to put on gloves but Karine is much more focused on saving Ledward's life (and has already been far too exposed to still worry about it).
What's really interesting is that even after Ledward's blood gets on her, Faris still behaves the same way - with the only exemption from quarantine being, naturally, herself. She locks them in despite having his blood on her as well. It's what an increasingly panicked person would do; it is a natural, selfish, frightened human reaction. She cries to her husband that she thinks she and Karine may have the same thing. But when the shit hits the fan, she does try to do the right thing and go for the guns to help.
Her reactions are both contradictory and human and sympathetic, if flawed. It's a whole little character play in a series of beats over a swift sequence. I was impressed with it and wasn't expecting it. If you're only in these movies to see hardened pros and badasses at work I can understand the complaint - and I can understand some of the complaints about, say, the scientists in Prometheus. These characters in AC are considerably more salt of the earth, despite their job titles. They're a close-knit group, not just professionals brought together on a mission.
Sounds like a fair assessment and to me seems like natural behaviour.
I will add I saw no evidence of a deep grudge between Karine and Faris, or anything between Karine and Ledward (in this clip or the Last Supper, where he never speaks or interacts with her). I do think it's reasonable to assume based on the Last Supper - which, again, is not in the movie and may be less relevant to the narrative itself - that there is tension between the Orams and Faris/Tennessee in terms of professionalism, as Faris also snaps at Oram for nagging her as they're landing on the planet ("stop asking me if I've got it, I've got it").
But I saw no evidence of either woman putting any animosity before the crisis with Ledward in this sequence. I do think they were on different wavelengths; Faris was focused on not spreading contagion, Karine was focused on helping Ledward. And Karine seemed exasperated with Faris' reluctance to help from the beginning. One assumes that, as in the Last Supper, she doesn't find Faris all that competent. But that's not the same thing as a grudge.
Quote from: SpeedyMaxx on Apr 29, 2017, 06:11:54 PM
What I find compelling (and terrifying) about the scene is the flawed humanity in it. From the moment she sees Ledward, Faris is very concerned and becomes incredibly cautious around him. Karine wants her help and Faris clearly does not want to be anywhere near him - she backs off even touching the headphones for the comms uplink, dumps his gear and her jacket on the landing ramp. She is very focused on not being vulnerable to infection. She tries to tell Karine to put on gloves but Karine is much more focused on saving Ledward's life (and has already been far too exposed to still worry about it).
What's really interesting is that even after Ledward's blood gets on her, Faris still behaves the same way - with the only exemption from quarantine being, naturally, herself. She locks them in despite having his blood on her as well. It's what an increasingly panicked person would do; it is a natural, selfish, frightened human reaction. She cries to her husband that she thinks she and Karine may have the same thing. But when the shit hits the fan, she does try to do the right thing and go for the guns to help.
Her reactions are both contradictory and human and sympathetic, if flawed. It's a whole little character play in a series of beats over a swift sequence. I was impressed with it and wasn't expecting it. If you're only in these movies to see hardened pros and badasses at work I can understand the complaint - and I can understand some of the complaints about, say, the scientists in Prometheus. These characters in AC are considerably more salt of the earth, despite their job titles. They're a close-knit group, not just professionals brought together on a mission.
And that's exactly what your supposed to see here. All this talk about safety protocols and Prometheus idiocy is just trying to explain what you just said so simply and succinctly. I can't speak for anyone else, but I know if I was in a situation like this, I would probably do exactly what Faris did. You don't act rational and logical in extreme situations. That's why they are called extreme situations.
I think its called 'being human'
I just watched the backburster clip... holy shit it looks so bad what the f**k did ridley smoke... look like a f**king comedy and i hope the cgi it's not finished because otherwise..
I will add that in no version of Prometheus, including the pre-Lindelof drafts written by Spaihts, did the scientists act much smarter.* (Though IIRC in the original version Milburn and Fifield are not scientists at all, just mining grunts, and still get lost in a comedy sequence.) I think that could have been mitigated but I think there will always be a human factor.
* - there is a sequence where the older, more seasoned Holloway literally falls into a Looney Tunes trap door hole in the floor unnoticed by all. I didn't mind it but this forum would've torn it apart.
Quote from: BishopShouldGo on Apr 29, 2017, 05:20:39 PM
Quote from: Predaker on Apr 29, 2017, 05:12:14 PM
Quote from: juxtapose on Apr 29, 2017, 05:06:29 PM
Jesus Christ here we go again with safety protocols...it was silly and annoying and f**king stupid and bizarre and made me wanna vomit when people started doing this to Prometheus...i mean seriously can't people just enjoy a movie for what it is....instead of picking apart every f**king detail of every f**king scene....when people panic they do silly things...they don't think straight...she ran of cause she was scared ...and then she probably thought...no wait...i cannot leave her their...i am getting the shotgun and going back...not everyone is Ripley or Shaw or Daniels or Hicks for that matter...not everyone is that brave...so panic can cause a lot of weird behavior...not wearing safety gear was perhaps a bad decision... so was landing on that f**king planet in the first place....but they did and if they didn't...then would their even be a movie?..
Millburn wasn't panicking when he tried to pet a space cobra.
He was in a protective suit.
A lot of good that did and it still doesn't explain why he would pet the thing. What was he going to do next, scoop it up into his arms and tickle its belly?
Quote from: Darth Vile on Apr 29, 2017, 05:22:00 PM
Have you not seen Aliens?
::)
QuoteThey sent a bunch of marines. They (the company) believed, or obviously suspected, Ripley was telling the truth as soon as they lost contact with Hadley's Hope.
No, they still didn't believe her until they started exploring Hadley's Hope and began to see it for themselves. Sending the colonial marines could be considered SOP, especially with Hudson's talk of embarking upon another boring mission. Also that still doesn't explain why they would need some type of protection from microscopic pathogens.
QuoteThe marines are portrayed as being pretty stupid in the film. It doesn't deminish the film, but there are numerous gaps in logic. Why try and deny it?
How so, and in what way is that comparable to Holloway and Millburn?
Quote from: Predaker on Apr 29, 2017, 06:43:56 PM
Quote from: BishopShouldGo on Apr 29, 2017, 05:20:39 PM
Quote from: Predaker on Apr 29, 2017, 05:12:14 PM
Quote from: juxtapose on Apr 29, 2017, 05:06:29 PM
Jesus Christ here we go again with safety protocols...it was silly and annoying and f**king stupid and bizarre and made me wanna vomit when people started doing this to Prometheus...i mean seriously can't people just enjoy a movie for what it is....instead of picking apart every f**king detail of every f**king scene....when people panic they do silly things...they don't think straight...she ran of cause she was scared ...and then she probably thought...no wait...i cannot leave her their...i am getting the shotgun and going back...not everyone is Ripley or Shaw or Daniels or Hicks for that matter...not everyone is that brave...so panic can cause a lot of weird behavior...not wearing safety gear was perhaps a bad decision... so was landing on that f**king planet in the first place....but they did and if they didn't...then would their even be a movie?..
Millburn wasn't panicking when he tried to pet a space cobra.
He was in a protective suit.
A lot of good that did and it still doesn't explain why he would pet the thing. What was he going to do next, scoop it up into his arms and tickle its belly?
Quote from: Darth Vile on Apr 29, 2017, 05:22:00 PM
Have you not seen Aliens?
::)
QuoteThey sent a bunch of marines. They (the company) believed, or obviously suspected, Ripley was telling the truth as soon as they lost contact with Hadley's Hope.
No, they still didn't believe her until they started exploring Hadley's Hope and began to see it for themselves. Sending the colonial marines could be considered SOP, especially with Hudson's talk of embarking upon another boring mission. Also that still doesn't explain why they would need some type of protection from microscopic pathogens.
QuoteThe marines are portrayed as being pretty stupid in the film. It doesn't deminish the film, but there are numerous gaps in logic. Why try and deny it?
How so, and in what way is that comparable to Holloway and Millburn?
Once it was clear they were dealing with something other than a simple malfunction, they had no way of knowing what was going on in terms of microscopic pathogens or other environmental factors. For example, what kind of effect does the hive material have when it comes into contact with human skin? What kind of atmosphere is inside the hive (is it breathable or does it perform a primitive terraforming process to make the atmosphere inside the hive more hospitable to the Aliens but not so breathable for humans)? Do the Aliens have microscopic particles that fall off of them when they move around like you see with certain insects (and if so, what effect would those particles have on humans?) If the Aliens breath (inhale/exhale), what are they exhaling out (humans breath in oxygen and exhale carbon dioxide)?
The devil is in the details here and since we're talking about safety protocols, there are plenty of details to look at.
They weren't clueless about the goings on at that point, they had concluded they were dealing with the aliens Ripley had told them about. Neither Ripley nor her crew died or were inflicted with anything that would require the sort of safety measures you are talking about and colonists had already been living there for decades without requiring such protection. There is simply no precedent set by the film which would make that recommendable or required.
Quote from: Predaker on Apr 29, 2017, 08:49:03 PM
They weren't clueless about the goings on at that point, they had concluded they were dealing with the aliens Ripley had told them about. Neither Ripley nor her crew died from anything that would require the sort of safety measures you are talking about and colonists had already been living there for decades without requiring such protection. There is simply no precedent set by the film which would make that recommendable or required.
You know that... but the characters wouldn't. Not even Ripley could give definitive answers to some of these questions and without definitive answers, then safety protocols would be necessary.
And the colonists living there for decades without incident became a moot point the moment Russ Jordan was brought back with a facehugger attached to his face.
EDIT: To clarify the colony safety point.... the colonists were fine until they came into contact with the Xeno. Up until then, you are correct that there was no risk that would necessitate safety protocols being put into place. But once they encountered the Xeno, then definitive answers to the questions I posed need to be presented and the absence of definitive answers would require the safety protocols being put into place to ensure everyone's safety.
Quote from: SpeedyMaxx on Apr 29, 2017, 06:33:19 PM
I will add that in no version of Prometheus, including the pre-Lindelof drafts written by Spaihts, did the scientists act much smarter.* (Though IIRC in the original version Milburn and Fifield are not scientists at all, just mining grunts, and still get lost in a comedy sequence.) I think that could have been mitigated but I think there will always be a human factor.
* - there is a sequence where the older, more seasoned Holloway literally falls into a Looney Tunes trap door hole in the floor unnoticed by all. I didn't mind it but this forum would've torn it apart.
I am in the military and work in a career field where I am performing analysis alongside individuals with doctorates in Math and computer science. Some of these individuals are cryptologic geniuses but have ZERO common sense, and I can immediately think of a few that would of attempted to pet the hammerpede without second thought. So yeah, I have always been able to suspend my disbelief with the idiocy of characters' actions in Prometheus as technically intelligent scientists with no common sense. :'(
Quote from: oberonqa on Apr 29, 2017, 08:52:26 PM
Quote from: Predaker on Apr 29, 2017, 08:49:03 PM
They weren't clueless about the goings on at that point, they had concluded they were dealing with the aliens Ripley had told them about. Neither Ripley nor her crew died from anything that would require the sort of safety measures you are talking about and colonists had already been living there for decades without requiring such protection. There is simply no precedent set by the film which would make that recommendable or required.
You know that... but the characters wouldn't. Not even Ripley could give definitive answers to some of these questions and without definitive answers, then safety protocols would be necessary.
And the colonists living there for decades without incident became a moot point the moment Russ Jordan was brought back with a facehugger attached to his face.
EDIT: To clarify the colony safety point.... the colonists were fine until they came into contact with the Xeno. Up until then, you are correct that there was no risk that would necessitate safety protocols being put into place. But once they encountered the Xeno, then definitive answers to the questions I posed need to be presented and the absence of definitive answers would require the safety protocols being put into place to ensure everyone's safety.
It had been established that Ripley had already encountered the alien and she didn't get sick or die from anything like that. Besides that, there is a certain amount of suspension of disbelief that comes with the territory and it works just fine in ALIENS. That the marines and co. should have been wearing protection from microscopic pathogens is not a serious or valid criticism because there was no precedent set for that.
With
Prometheus, Holloway is suited with such protection and knowingly decides to endanger a trillion dollar mission with his recklessness. The film is self-aware in this regard to portray the character in such a fashion. While not everyone may have a problem with this kind of characterization, I believe it's a much more valid criticism than saying the marines in ALIENS should have worn similar outfits.
Quote from: oberonqa on Apr 29, 2017, 05:55:58 PM
Whoa there buddy.... I'M AGREEING WITH YOU!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Chill the <bleep> out!
Apologies - my misinterpretation... I thought you were being purposely facetious.
Quote from: Predaker on Apr 29, 2017, 09:14:04 PM
Quote from: oberonqa on Apr 29, 2017, 08:52:26 PM
Quote from: Predaker on Apr 29, 2017, 08:49:03 PM
They weren't clueless about the goings on at that point, they had concluded they were dealing with the aliens Ripley had told them about. Neither Ripley nor her crew died from anything that would require the sort of safety measures you are talking about and colonists had already been living there for decades without requiring such protection. There is simply no precedent set by the film which would make that recommendable or required.
You know that... but the characters wouldn't. Not even Ripley could give definitive answers to some of these questions and without definitive answers, then safety protocols would be necessary.
And the colonists living there for decades without incident became a moot point the moment Russ Jordan was brought back with a facehugger attached to his face.
EDIT: To clarify the colony safety point.... the colonists were fine until they came into contact with the Xeno. Up until then, you are correct that there was no risk that would necessitate safety protocols being put into place. But once they encountered the Xeno, then definitive answers to the questions I posed need to be presented and the absence of definitive answers would require the safety protocols being put into place to ensure everyone's safety.
It had been established that Ripley had already encountered the alien and she didn't get sick or die from anything like that. Besides that, there is a certain amount of suspension of disbelief that comes with the territory and it works just fine in ALIENS. That the marines and co. should have been wearing protection from microscopic pathogens is not a serious or valid criticism because there was no precedent set for that.
With Prometheus, Holloway is suited with such protection and knowingly decides to endanger a trillion dollar mission with his recklessness. The film is self-aware in this regard to portray the character in such a fashion. While not everyone may have a problem with this kind of characterization, I believe it's a much more valid criticism than saying the marines in ALIENS should have worn such outfits.
First off, why do you keep bringing up Prometheus? I've said three times now I am not referring to Prometheus in this discussion, but am discussing Alien: Covenant and Aliens. But yet, this is the third time you have brought up Prometheus. Do you keep bringing it up because it's the only way you can illustrate your points? I'm not saying that to be a dick... am genuinely curious why you keep bringing up examples from Prometheus when we are discussing the crew of the Covenant walking around the planet in Alien: Covenant being dissed for not observing safety protocols when the marines in Aliens did the exact same thing.
Now then... moving right along...
Now it's OK to mention suspension of disbelief? A few pages back people were lambasting the crew of the Covenant for being idiots for walking around the planet without any regards for safety... but now it's OK to suspend disbelief? You'll need to do better than that, Predaker.
Here are the questions I posed that are safety concerns:
1) What kind of effect does the hive material have when it comes into contact with human skin?
Ripley and the crew of the Nostromo never came into contact with hive material, so Ripley cannot give a definitive answer to this.
2) What kind of atmosphere is inside the hive (is it breathable or does it perform a primitive terraforming process to make the atmosphere inside the hive more hospitable to the Aliens but not so breathable for humans)?
Ripley and the crew of the Nostromo never went inside of the hive, so Ripley cannot give a definitive answer to this.
3) Do the Aliens have microscopic particles that fall off of them when they move around like you see with certain insects (and if so, what effect would those particles have on humans?)
I think it's safe to say Ripley wasn't going around the Nostromo looking for places the Alien had been with a handheld microscope in order to check for particles. Furthermore, her close contact with the Alien was extremely limited to about 5 seconds in the hallway leading to the Narcissis and then inside the Narcissis, which was depressurized when she opened the airlock to blast the Alien into space. Any particles that may have been present would have been blown out of the airlock along with the Alien (this is even referenced in Aliens with the following lines:
VAN LUEN: The analysis team that went over the lifeboat centimeter by centimeter found no physical evidence of the creature you describe.
RIPLEY: Good. That's because I blew it out of the god damn airlock. Like I said before.
That being said, Ripley cannot give a definitive answer to this.
4) If the Aliens breath (inhale/exhale), what are they exhaling out (humans breath in oxygen and exhale carbon dioxide)?
Ripley cannot give a definitive answer to this, as her contact with the Alien was limited in one instance and in the other instance, anything the Alien exhaled would have gone out the airlock along with the oxygen.
Ergo, safety protocols would be necessary for the marines to ensure their safety. So the crew of the Covenant, after doing what I would presume would be standard analysis of the planets atmosphere to determine the air was breathable and a battery of tests and surface scans to determine a safe landing zone for the dropship, is thrown under the bus for the following sins:
1) Going down to the planet without space suits and/or protective gear
2) Failing to observe safety protocols when the shit hits the fan and a neomorph is getting ready to be born.
So you tell me, Predaker.... why exactly is it OK to give the marines a pass for ignoring safety protocols, but say that the crew of the Covenant are a bunch of idiots that are no better than the headcases in Prometheus that thought it was OK to take their helmets off in an alien atmosphere, get high while sitting out a storm inside an alien structure, and getting up close and personal with an alien lifeform because "she was a pretty pretty girl"? The people in Covenant appear to be much more intelligent than your buddies on the Prometheus, but they are still held to some imaginary standard that doesn't apply to the Ultimate Badasses in Aliens.
I require an explanation for this gross inequity, if you would be so kind, Predaker.
Faris' reaction to the situation was (for me) realistic, absolutely panicked and scared for her own safety, thus not caring for infecting the shuttle at that moment in time.
Even with nose bleeds or vomiting, I've seen people panic despite it being a very minor thing, and start touching their surroundings without a thought of covering everything in crap.
People aren't very rational when anxiety kicks in. So at no point did I think what Faris was doing was unbelievable... just selfish and petrified.
Which is completely different to the Milburn and Fifield scene which I just thought was down to bad writing. Although I found a lot of the Prometheus characters to be jarring and off. From what I've seen so far, the Covenant crew are a more believeable bunch that I actually could care for.
Side note* (Apologies I can't remember the users name) Did you get confused with Oram and the backbuster guy? Cause Karine doesn't speak to Backbuster dude at all in the Last Supper vid and Oram is her a husband... who she's bitching with about Faris and Tennesse to.
Yeah, Karine has no interaction with Ledward/backburster guy in the Last Supper that I can recall.
Quote from: M_Tak on Apr 29, 2017, 09:37:16 PM
Side note* (Apologies I can't remember the users name) Did you get confused with Oram and the backbuster guy? Cause Karine doesn't speak to Backbuster dude at all in the Last Supper vid and Oram is her a husband... who she's bitching with about Faris and Tennesse to.
Your absolutely right! I was totally confusing backburster guy with Orem.
Some one made a cropped version of the video. Also, I'm putting this in spoiler tags because the image that's shown on the video before you play it reveals a little to much. Nothing major to spoil any big moments, but still just to be safe. I still haven't watched the full clip. I only watch up until the guy starts to freak out.
Spoiler
https://vimeo.com/215290905
Quote from: Predaker on Apr 29, 2017, 09:14:04 PM
Quote from: oberonqa on Apr 29, 2017, 08:52:26 PM
Quote from: Predaker on Apr 29, 2017, 08:49:03 PM
They weren't clueless about the goings on at that point, they had concluded they were dealing with the aliens Ripley had told them about. Neither Ripley nor her crew died from anything that would require the sort of safety measures you are talking about and colonists had already been living there for decades without requiring such protection. There is simply no precedent set by the film which would make that recommendable or required.
You know that... but the characters wouldn't. Not even Ripley could give definitive answers to some of these questions and without definitive answers, then safety protocols would be necessary.
And the colonists living there for decades without incident became a moot point the moment Russ Jordan was brought back with a facehugger attached to his face.
EDIT: To clarify the colony safety point.... the colonists were fine until they came into contact with the Xeno. Up until then, you are correct that there was no risk that would necessitate safety protocols being put into place. But once they encountered the Xeno, then definitive answers to the questions I posed need to be presented and the absence of definitive answers would require the safety protocols being put into place to ensure everyone's safety.
It had been established that Ripley had already encountered the alien and she didn't get sick or die from anything like that. Besides that, there is a certain amount of suspension of disbelief that comes with the territory and it works just fine in ALIENS. That the marines and co. should have been wearing protection from microscopic pathogens is not a serious or valid criticism because there was no precedent set for that.
With Prometheus, Holloway is suited with such protection and knowingly decides to endanger a trillion dollar mission with his recklessness. The film is self-aware in this regard to portray the character in such a fashion. While not everyone may have a problem with this kind of characterization, I believe it's a much more valid criticism than saying the marines in ALIENS should have worn similar outfits.
I think you are conflating a lack of internal logic with a presumption of internal logic. That Prometheus acknowledges the requirement for protective head gear, but then as part of the narrative, removes the need for it following an 'act of faith' is (IMO) an appropriate way of keeping it in the realms of science fiction, whilst not letting itself get bogged down in the realities.
Aliens plays fast and loose with similar elements... specifically in relation to a really goofy plan for sending all the Sulaco's crew to the planet and how the marines generally operate within the film. Aliens is certainly the better film, IMO, but it has nothing to do with the fact that the Prometheus crew did silly things and the crew of the Sulaco acted more realistically. Not even close...
And in terms of Alien Covenant... the behaviour of the characters thus far seems a lot more realistic/believable than anything in either Prometheus or Aliens.
Quote from: TheBATMAN on Apr 29, 2017, 04:25:20 PM
Quote from: Infected on Apr 29, 2017, 11:14:55 AM
That wasnt dumb, that was selfish and those ladies most likely had a grunge against each other and each others men, as you can see in the last supper trailer, there is a little friction underneath, the woman acted in her own hatefull selfish favor, there is a little bible and humanity in its worst form going on in this one and in Prometheus.
I think you are reaching there. Whatever friction existed between them I highly doubt it was deep enough for Farris to decide to just lock her in there to die. Yes she was selfish, that goes without saying, but the point is she was always going to go back inside, therefore she should have let her out, especially when she went back the second time.
Quote from: shawsbaby on Apr 29, 2017, 11:45:06 AM
Eh, the situation and protocol changed once a living creature came out of the guy's back and started attacking.
Did it? Why did it change exactly? So you're suggesting you need to quarantine an alien pathogen but there's no need for quarantine when an actual alien emerges? Yup, that makes sense... ???
Quote from: oberonqa on Apr 29, 2017, 01:18:01 PM
The problem here is your expecting clarity and logic from a pair of women that are scared out of their minds and obviously aren't thinking clearly. Faris was fine being in the room until she freaked out when first backburster "pop" occurred. At that point, she hightailed it out of there. This is a perfectly natural response considering she was scared senseless and just wanted to get away.
Karine stayed behind because, as The Last Supper video showed, there was something going on between her and the infected guy (whose name escapes me... I'm still attaching names to faces!) She was worried about his well being and wanted to stay to comfort him. What your seeing here is basically the fight or flight response. In Faris's case, the adrenaline dump prompted a flight response, whereas Karine's dump triggered a fight response.
The scene is layered with nuance so what you take away from it really depends on how much your paying attention and how much you know about human nature/psychology. If you have seen the Last Supper vid, you know there's a thing going on between Karine and the backburster guy. If you pay attention to the banter between Karine and Faris in that vid, you know there's a little bit of tension between the two (they don't hate each other, but also clearly don't care for one another which provides another motivator for Faris to abandon Karine and not let her out). And depending on what you know about human nature/psychology, then you can recognize the fight or flight response from both women. So that's four layers of nuance in one scene.
To compare this scene to the Hammerpede scene, which had zero nuance and was essentially a pair of dudes being stupid, is a bit unfair. In my opinion, at any rate.
The panic stuff I don't mind, it's the fact that she locked Karine in there and steadfastly refused to let her out - despite her sole intention being to go and get a weapon and then go straight back inside - it makes zero sense whatsoever. Karine didn't stay behind, she was locked inside. I've watched the Last Supper and the back burster guy isn't even in it so I'm not sure what you are referring to there. It's not flight or flight either when she purposefully intends to go back inside. Had she just ran off, the scene would make sense. Psychology doesn't come into it. Even if it was as you suggested, and Farris purposefully locked her in because she did not like her - it makes no sense that she would later then go back inside - both to kill the alien and to save her, when she could have just let her out to begin with.
-And just to weigh in on the whole Colonial Marines going down to LV-426 without protective headgear argument, I don't think that is the same thing considering colonists had been living down there there for 20 years.
Isnt the last supper also a reference to people stabbing each other in the back?
We dont know if Cruddup sabotaged Franco, it isnt a far stretch, Burke did it in Aliens, Ash tried it in Alien, Prometheus did it, i dont see it as a far stretch, its human nature to do such a thing to one another, with in the back of your mind thinking: you crossed me over, or you took my job, im justified to hurt you.
Heck thats what the Jesus story is all about, forgiving and stabbing each other in the back.
There is absolutely zero evidence that Oram/Crudup killed anyone, or that Karine or Faris were trying to purposefully kill each other in the scene previewed.
Offcourse, except for the door she closed in front of the face of her "friend" while she was more infected.
No evidence, we all treat our friends like that haha. "Oh there is an alien bursting out of his back, wait my dear friend let me lock you in there with it"
Quote from: oberonqa on Apr 29, 2017, 09:36:56 PM
Quote from: Predaker on Apr 29, 2017, 09:14:04 PM
Quote from: oberonqa on Apr 29, 2017, 08:52:26 PM
Quote from: Predaker on Apr 29, 2017, 08:49:03 PM
They weren't clueless about the goings on at that point, they had concluded they were dealing with the aliens Ripley had told them about. Neither Ripley nor her crew died from anything that would require the sort of safety measures you are talking about and colonists had already been living there for decades without requiring such protection. There is simply no precedent set by the film which would make that recommendable or required.
You know that... but the characters wouldn't. Not even Ripley could give definitive answers to some of these questions and without definitive answers, then safety protocols would be necessary.
And the colonists living there for decades without incident became a moot point the moment Russ Jordan was brought back with a facehugger attached to his face.
EDIT: To clarify the colony safety point.... the colonists were fine until they came into contact with the Xeno. Up until then, you are correct that there was no risk that would necessitate safety protocols being put into place. But once they encountered the Xeno, then definitive answers to the questions I posed need to be presented and the absence of definitive answers would require the safety protocols being put into place to ensure everyone's safety.
It had been established that Ripley had already encountered the alien and she didn't get sick or die from anything like that. Besides that, there is a certain amount of suspension of disbelief that comes with the territory and it works just fine in ALIENS. That the marines and co. should have been wearing protection from microscopic pathogens is not a serious or valid criticism because there was no precedent set for that.
With Prometheus, Holloway is suited with such protection and knowingly decides to endanger a trillion dollar mission with his recklessness. The film is self-aware in this regard to portray the character in such a fashion. While not everyone may have a problem with this kind of characterization, I believe it's a much more valid criticism than saying the marines in ALIENS should have worn such outfits.
First off, why do you keep bringing up Prometheus? I've said three times now I am not referring to Prometheus in this discussion, but am discussing Alien: Covenant and Aliens. But yet, this is the third time you have brought up Prometheus. Do you keep bringing it up because it's the only way you can illustrate your points? I'm not saying that to be a dick... am genuinely curious why you keep bringing up examples from Prometheus when we are discussing the crew of the Covenant walking around the planet in Alien: Covenant being dissed for not observing safety protocols when the marines in Aliens did the exact same thing.
Now then... moving right along...
Now it's OK to mention suspension of disbelief? A few pages back people were lambasting the crew of the Covenant for being idiots for walking around the planet without any regards for safety... but now it's OK to suspend disbelief? You'll need to do better than that, Predaker.
Here are the questions I posed that are safety concerns:
1) What kind of effect does the hive material have when it comes into contact with human skin?
Ripley and the crew of the Nostromo never came into contact with hive material, so Ripley cannot give a definitive answer to this.
2) What kind of atmosphere is inside the hive (is it breathable or does it perform a primitive terraforming process to make the atmosphere inside the hive more hospitable to the Aliens but not so breathable for humans)?
Ripley and the crew of the Nostromo never went inside of the hive, so Ripley cannot give a definitive answer to this.
3) Do the Aliens have microscopic particles that fall off of them when they move around like you see with certain insects (and if so, what effect would those particles have on humans?)
I think it's safe to say Ripley wasn't going around the Nostromo looking for places the Alien had been with a handheld microscope in order to check for particles. Furthermore, her close contact with the Alien was extremely limited to about 5 seconds in the hallway leading to the Narcissis and then inside the Narcissis, which was depressurized when she opened the airlock to blast the Alien into space. Any particles that may have been present would have been blown out of the airlock along with the Alien (this is even referenced in Aliens with the following lines:
VAN LUEN: The analysis team that went over the lifeboat centimeter by centimeter found no physical evidence of the creature you describe.
RIPLEY: Good. That's because I blew it out of the god damn airlock. Like I said before.
That being said, Ripley cannot give a definitive answer to this.
4) If the Aliens breath (inhale/exhale), what are they exhaling out (humans breath in oxygen and exhale carbon dioxide)?
Ripley cannot give a definitive answer to this, as her contact with the Alien was limited in one instance and in the other instance, anything the Alien exhaled would have gone out the airlock along with the oxygen.
Ergo, safety protocols would be necessary for the marines to ensure their safety. So the crew of the Covenant, after doing what I would presume would be standard analysis of the planets atmosphere to determine the air was breathable and a battery of tests and surface scans to determine a safe landing zone for the dropship, is thrown under the bus for the following sins:
1) Going down to the planet without space suits and/or protective gear
2) Failing to observe safety protocols when the shit hits the fan and a neomorph is getting ready to be born.
So you tell me, Predaker.... why exactly is it OK to give the marines a pass for ignoring safety protocols, but say that the crew of the Covenant are a bunch of idiots that are no better than the headcases in Prometheus that thought it was OK to take their helmets off in an alien atmosphere, get high while sitting out a storm inside an alien structure, and getting up close and personal with an alien lifeform because "she was a pretty pretty girl"? The people in Covenant appear to be much more intelligent than your buddies on the Prometheus, but they are still held to some imaginary standard that doesn't apply to the Ultimate Badasses in Aliens.
I require an explanation for this gross inequity, if you would be so kind, Predaker.
I never criticized this clip of Covenant or defended anyone else's criticism of it so you're misconstruing my post, and dismissing part of my response with "you'll need to do better than that" is not a substantive reply of any sort. As for the clip in question, I'm waiting for the film to release before watching these particular scenes.
Quote from: Darth Vile on Apr 29, 2017, 10:08:07 PM
Quote from: Predaker on Apr 29, 2017, 09:14:04 PM
Quote from: oberonqa on Apr 29, 2017, 08:52:26 PM
Quote from: Predaker on Apr 29, 2017, 08:49:03 PM
They weren't clueless about the goings on at that point, they had concluded they were dealing with the aliens Ripley had told them about. Neither Ripley nor her crew died from anything that would require the sort of safety measures you are talking about and colonists had already been living there for decades without requiring such protection. There is simply no precedent set by the film which would make that recommendable or required.
You know that... but the characters wouldn't. Not even Ripley could give definitive answers to some of these questions and without definitive answers, then safety protocols would be necessary.
And the colonists living there for decades without incident became a moot point the moment Russ Jordan was brought back with a facehugger attached to his face.
EDIT: To clarify the colony safety point.... the colonists were fine until they came into contact with the Xeno. Up until then, you are correct that there was no risk that would necessitate safety protocols being put into place. But once they encountered the Xeno, then definitive answers to the questions I posed need to be presented and the absence of definitive answers would require the safety protocols being put into place to ensure everyone's safety.
It had been established that Ripley had already encountered the alien and she didn't get sick or die from anything like that. Besides that, there is a certain amount of suspension of disbelief that comes with the territory and it works just fine in ALIENS. That the marines and co. should have been wearing protection from microscopic pathogens is not a serious or valid criticism because there was no precedent set for that.
With Prometheus, Holloway is suited with such protection and knowingly decides to endanger a trillion dollar mission with his recklessness. The film is self-aware in this regard to portray the character in such a fashion. While not everyone may have a problem with this kind of characterization, I believe it's a much more valid criticism than saying the marines in ALIENS should have worn similar outfits.
I think you are conflating a lack of internal logic with a presumption of internal logic. That Prometheus acknowledges the requirement for protective head gear, but then as part of the narrative, removes the need for it following an 'act of faith' is (IMO) an appropriate way of keeping it in the realms of science fiction, whilst not letting itself get bogged down in the realities.
Dandy explanation for those who have no issue with that particular scene but it doesn't make it immune from valid criticisms. Some people just didn't care to see a trillion dollar mission being jeopardized by buffoonery that wasn't at all necessary to tell a good story.
QuoteAliens plays fast and loose with similar elements... specifically in relation to a really goofy plan for sending all the Sulaco's crew to the planet and how the marines generally operate within the film. Aliens is certainly the better film, IMO, but it has nothing to do with the fact that the Prometheus crew did silly things and the crew of the Sulaco acted more realistically. Not even close...
That's certainly your prerogative to consider the marines and how they generally operated in ALIENS as "really goofy," although I would venture a guess that the vast majority of others would disagree with such an assessment.
QuoteAnd in terms of Alien Covenant... the behaviour of the characters thus far seems a lot more realistic/believable than anything in either Prometheus or Aliens.
Good to know. :)
Quote from: Infected on Apr 29, 2017, 10:59:36 PM
Offcourse, except for the door she closed in front of the face of her "friend" while she was more infected.
No one said they were friends. They were co-workers.
Point being: Faris was very concerned about getting infected. Karine was not. Faris did her best to keep away from Ledward until suddenly blood sprayed in her face. Terrified, she had a primal flight/fight reaction and fled the room, sealing it behind her. That is a natural, frightened, selfish reaction borne not out of malice toward Karine but fear. Yes, it was hypocritical but it's what would happen to many of us - she wasn't thinking, she panicked. You are trying to intellectualize what are basic, primal, imperfect human reactions. It's one thing for someone else to expose themselves to contagion but if the untrained person comes face to face with that, goes out of their way to avoid it then gets a faceful of blood spray, they're still going to try to run for the hills.
She also had no idea what would happen to Ledward, as Faris has not seen any of the films in the
Alien franchise, as she is in fact a fictional character.
Though I haven't watched the whole scene, it's obvious that Faris is highly scared of getting infected. Also, she's thinking about the rest of the crew too. I think she wants to open the door for Karine. You can tell it's killing her that she can't.
Faris is so panicked at that point, all she wants to do is get out of there. She's thinking about herself when that blood gets on her, she doesn't think of Karine until Karine calls for her. She wants to let her out but she figures it'd only make the situation worse; I'm sure she feels guilty. Feelings, humans are illogical. By the time she acts to try to help, regardless of the risk of contagion, it's too late.
Personally, I just feel bad for Ledward. Can't imagine the pain that he went through. And in a way, he kinda screwed everything up.
Quote from: Anthony on Apr 30, 2017, 12:52:03 AM
Personally, I just feel bad for Ledward. Can't imagine the pain that he went through. And in a way, he kinda screwed everything up.
Yeah, poor bastard. He just had to have that cigarette.
Quote from: echobbase79 on Apr 30, 2017, 12:54:18 AM
Quote from: Anthony on Apr 30, 2017, 12:52:03 AM
Personally, I just feel bad for Ledward. Can't imagine the pain that he went through. And in a way, he kinda screwed everything up.
Yeah, poor bastard. He just had to have that cigarette.
Once again:
"Don't smoke, or you'll have an alien burst out of your back."
Or alternatively:
Quote from: Anthony on Apr 30, 2017, 12:56:46 AM
Quote from: echobbase79 on Apr 30, 2017, 12:54:18 AM
Quote from: Anthony on Apr 30, 2017, 12:52:03 AM
Personally, I just feel bad for Ledward. Can't imagine the pain that he went through. And in a way, he kinda screwed everything up.
Yeah, poor bastard. He just had to have that cigarette.
Once again:
"Don't smoke, or you'll have an alien burst out of your back."
Or alternatively:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D8M8I2SYEiA
I love how at the end he says,"Please."
What's ironic is that he sounds like he's on coke while doing that commercial.
QuoteErgo, safety protocols would be necessary for the marines to ensure their safety. So the crew of the Covenant, after doing what I would presume would be standard analysis of the planets atmosphere to determine the air was breathable and a battery of tests and surface scans to determine a safe landing zone for the dropship, is thrown under the bus for the following sins:
1) Going down to the planet without space suits and/or protective gear
2) Failing to observe safety protocols when the shit hits the fan and a neomorph is getting ready to be born.
So you tell me, Predaker.... why exactly is it OK to give the marines a pass for ignoring safety protocols, but say that the crew of the Covenant are a bunch of idiots that are no better than the headcases in Prometheus that thought it was OK to take their helmets off in an alien atmosphere, get high while sitting out a storm inside an alien structure, and getting up close and personal with an alien lifeform because "she was a pretty pretty girl"?
ALIENS never portrayed itself as hard sci-fi while
Prometheus attempted to take itself much more seriously than it probably should have. Covenant is a direct sequel to that, however it appears to be shifting away from much of what plagued
Prometheus.
Having the Covenant colonists explore a brand new planet with no protective gear and to then explicitly show them suffering for said foolishness (spore infection) isn't going to do the film any favors, that's for sure - but as long as stuff like that doesn't end up overshadowing what the film sets out to accomplish, it shouldn't be much of a problem.
Though it seems Daniels does show issues with Oram wanting the crew to explore the planet despite knowing they'll be able breathe etc but nothing else, "Are you sure about this?... We don't know what the f*cks down there" I assume this is in relation to them responding to the signal and branching from their original mission... Plus we all know Weyland corp see their staff as expendable and want aliens!!
If Daniels was in charge, I have a feeling they wouldn't be going down there...So quickly.
i love the music by the way
Quote from: SpeedyMaxx on Apr 29, 2017, 11:21:35 PM
Quote from: Infected on Apr 29, 2017, 10:59:36 PM
Offcourse, except for the door she closed in front of the face of her "friend" while she was more infected.
No one said they were friends. They were co-workers.
Point being: Faris was very concerned about getting infected. Karine was not. Faris did her best to keep away from Ledward until suddenly blood sprayed in her face. Terrified, she had a primal flight/fight reaction and fled the room, sealing it behind her. That is a natural, frightened, selfish reaction borne not out of malice toward Karine but fear. Yes, it was hypocritical but it's what would happen to many of us - she wasn't thinking, she panicked. You are trying to intellectualize what are basic, primal, imperfect human reactions. It's one thing for someone else to expose themselves to contagion but if the untrained person comes face to face with that, goes out of their way to avoid it then gets a faceful of blood spray, they're still going to try to run for the hills.
She also had no idea what would happen to Ledward, as Faris has not seen any of the films in the Alien franchise, as she is in fact a fictional character.
Im gonna keep with my bible "people stabbing each other in the back" theory if you dont mind, cos thats what im seeing with Cruddup and with his girl chit chatting in the last supper.
Quote from: Anthony on Apr 30, 2017, 12:56:46 AM
Quote from: echobbase79 on Apr 30, 2017, 12:54:18 AM
Quote from: Anthony on Apr 30, 2017, 12:52:03 AM
Personally, I just feel bad for Ledward. Can't imagine the pain that he went through. And in a way, he kinda screwed everything up.
Yeah, poor bastard. He just had to have that cigarette.
Once again:
"Don't smoke, or you'll have an alien burst out of your back."
Or alternatively:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D8M8I2SYEiA
Jeezzz this guys was Super Mario LoL
Not hatin but, yeahhhhh haha
i love that these people act like...people in these clips and not just act like plot devices.
i like Ferris decisions also how Karin tried to act with the dude. it felt realistic. SO FAR looks like Ridley learnt from his mistakes. fingers crossed for the whole movie
Quote from: Predaker on Apr 30, 2017, 01:56:36 AM
QuoteErgo, safety protocols would be necessary for the marines to ensure their safety. So the crew of the Covenant, after doing what I would presume would be standard analysis of the planets atmosphere to determine the air was breathable and a battery of tests and surface scans to determine a safe landing zone for the dropship, is thrown under the bus for the following sins:
1) Going down to the planet without space suits and/or protective gear
2) Failing to observe safety protocols when the shit hits the fan and a neomorph is getting ready to be born.
So you tell me, Predaker.... why exactly is it OK to give the marines a pass for ignoring safety protocols, but say that the crew of the Covenant are a bunch of idiots that are no better than the headcases in Prometheus that thought it was OK to take their helmets off in an alien atmosphere, get high while sitting out a storm inside an alien structure, and getting up close and personal with an alien lifeform because "she was a pretty pretty girl"?
ALIENS never portrayed itself as hard sci-fi while Prometheus attempted to take itself much more seriously than it probably should have. Covenant is a direct sequel to that, however it appears to be shifting away from much of what plagued Prometheus.
Having the Covenant colonists explore a brand new planet with no protective gear and to then explicitly show them suffering for said foolishness (spore infection) isn't going to do the film any favors, that's for sure - but as long as stuff like that doesn't end up overshadowing what the film sets out to accomplish, it shouldn't be much of a problem.
Well then I guess we're at an impasse then. Your willing to give Aliens a pass on the issue and I believe that all Alien films should be given the same courtesies. Since you haven't seen the Alien Day footage, I'm not even sure why your in this thread, to be honest (I envy your self control, by the way!). That being said, I apologize for getting into a conversation with you when it's clear you weren't even speaking to me (or if you were speaking to me, you probably shouldn't have been since I was referencing stuff you weren't even involved in). I suggest we agree to disagree on the issue of Aliens vs Covenant Safety Protocols. =)
Quote from: Predaker on Apr 29, 2017, 11:11:50 PM
That's certainly your prerogative to consider the marines and how they generally operated in ALIENS as "really goofy," although I would venture a guess that the vast majority of others would disagree with such an assessment.
The "vast majority of other" moviegoers are just as bothered with the logic gaps in behaviour of characters in Aliens as they are with the crew of the Prometheus. That's the point. They aren't that bothered. It's only people like you and me.
Quote from: Predaker on Apr 30, 2017, 01:56:36 AM
Having the Covenant colonists explore a brand new planet with no protective gear and to then explicitly show them suffering for said foolishness (spore infection) isn't going to do the film any favors, that's for sure - but as long as stuff like that doesn't end up overshadowing what the film sets out to accomplish, it shouldn't be much of a problem.
You mean like showing the crew of the Sulaco explicitly suffering for the decision to use ammo underneath/ near the cooling system? Or suffering from the foolishness of taking all crew members down to the surface and leaving the Sulaco unmanned???
@oberonga: I aliens the humans had been there at the acheron for decades already after the Nostromo demise, developìng those atmosphere processors that made the atmosphere breathable. AP processors were also supposed to process such already breathable air from bacteria and patogens, etc, thus alleviating the colonists from the need of using breathing devices or full suits 24/7. The moon was being terraformed in other words, despite it still looked as hostile as in the first film.
In covenant they are in an uncharted planet and should have been wearing a suit. Ask the backbuster guy and the
Spoiler
throatbuster
too.
In Prometheus they were just idiots. Glaring Lindelof writing in the works. Only that
In Aliens the atmosphere on LV-426 was breathable but it didn't mean that Marines shouldn't have worn protective suits. They didn't know what had happened to the colony. It might have been a virus who wiped out people at Hadley's Hope and then what? They weren't fully prepared. That's the fact. Do I care? Not at all. It's just a movie. Sometimes you have to sacrifice scientific accuracy and realism for the sake of the story.
The idiocy of the Prometheus crew was very much obvious for anybody with common sense, not just nerds on the forum. And by no means is it comparable to the Aliens. Yes they didn't think things through in Aliens, but it's no way comparable to the simply bad writing in Prometheus, the end.
We shall see how Covenant turns out, but i personally don't see any improvements when it comes to the crews competency, yet the Faris thing doesn't bother me, but there are way worse offences. Snooping aroung on a unknown and uncharted planet with no protective gear and precautionary measures is pretty damn dumb, and for the final time it's not comparable to Aliens. When Daniels says
you hear that? nothing, no birds, no animals, nothing just shows they did f**k all before they walked out like exiting an airplane in unknown part of Africa.
Saw the Covenant preview on the big screen yesterday. I liked it more this time around but the cgi is at times still very obviously computer generated, especially bad where
Spoiler
the neomorph breaks and crawls out from the door window and some close ups before
. I't was interesting to see how much the A L I E N contrasted with the Covenant. The Alien is very slow burning (but not at all boring) that let's the atmosphere truly sink in and picks up the pace gradually after the chest burst scene. While the Covenant had super quick editing that may become tiresome after awhile. The same could be said about the xenomorph, it's this very mystifying and disturbing elegant creature of unknown origins that kills it's prey like a perverted serial killer while the Covenant creatures act like super aggressive animals with rabies, with none of the grace.
On a positive note i think the dynamic and somewhat organic line delivery between the actors n the dropship scene is definitely an improvement over Prometheus.
I wouldn't call it giving ALIENS a pass and then not doing the same for the other films. If something stupid really sticks out in a film, people will notice and call it out.
Quote from: Darth Vile on Apr 30, 2017, 12:39:39 PM
Quote from: Predaker on Apr 29, 2017, 11:11:50 PM
That's certainly your prerogative to consider the marines and how they generally operated in ALIENS as "really goofy," although I would venture a guess that the vast majority of others would disagree with such an assessment.
The "vast majority of other" moviegoers are just as bothered with the logic gaps in behaviour of characters in Aliens as they are with the crew of the Prometheus. That's the point. They aren't that bothered. It's only people like you and me.
I disagree. ALIENS didn't rise to the level of stupidity seen in
Prometheus and it accomplished what it set out to do as well.
Prometheus, not so much.
Quote from: Predaker on Apr 30, 2017, 01:56:36 AM
Having the Covenant colonists explore a brand new planet with no protective gear and to then explicitly show them suffering for said foolishness (spore infection) isn't going to do the film any favors, that's for sure - but as long as stuff like that doesn't end up overshadowing what the film sets out to accomplish, it shouldn't be much of a problem.
Quote from: Darth Vile
You mean like showing the crew of the Sulaco explicitly suffering for the decision to use ammo underneath/ near the cooling system? Or suffering from the foolishness of taking all crew members down to the surface and leaving the Sulaco unmanned???
Not comparable.
The marines weren't told why they had to give up their ammo and they were also faced with an immediate threat to their lives. The Sulaco was mostly autonomous and Bishop was able to remotely fly the second dropship down to the surface for them.
Quote from: Ingwar on Apr 30, 2017, 02:12:05 PM
In Aliens the atmosphere on LV-426 was breathable but it didn't mean that Marines shouldn't have worn protective suits. They didn't know what had happened to the colony. It might have been a virus who wiped out people at Hadley's Hope and then what? They weren't fully prepared. That's the fact. Do I care? Not at all. It's just a movie. Sometimes you have to sacrifice scientific accuracy and realism for the sake of the story.
Its not really an issue because they never had any reason to believe the colony was wiped out by a virus.
Quote from: Predaker on Apr 30, 2017, 02:39:05 PM
Quote from: Ingwar on Apr 30, 2017, 02:12:05 PM
In Aliens the atmosphere on LV-426 was breathable but it didn't mean that Marines shouldn't have worn protective suits. They didn't know what had happened to the colony. It might have been a virus who wiped out people at Hadley's Hope and then what? They weren't fully prepared. That's the fact. Do I care? Not at all. It's just a movie. Sometimes you have to sacrifice scientific accuracy and realism for the sake of the story.
Its not really an issue because they never had any reason to believe the colony was wiped out by a virus.
They knew they were going to confront with alien species. They barely knew anything about it/them. The key word you used is
believe. You shouldn't make military decisions based upon you beliefs and predictions without appriopriate knowledge when you encounter deadly foreign species. You should know. And if you don't know you should be prepared for anything. Even for deadly alien pathogens. Marines in
Aliens ignored that.
Quote from: Ingwar on Apr 30, 2017, 02:51:25 PM
Quote from: Predaker on Apr 30, 2017, 02:39:05 PM
Quote from: Ingwar on Apr 30, 2017, 02:12:05 PM
In Aliens the atmosphere on LV-426 was breathable but it didn't mean that Marines shouldn't have worn protective suits. They didn't know what had happened to the colony. It might have been a virus who wiped out people at Hadley's Hope and then what? They weren't fully prepared. That's the fact. Do I care? Not at all. It's just a movie. Sometimes you have to sacrifice scientific accuracy and realism for the sake of the story.
Its not really an issue because they never had any reason to believe the colony was wiped out by a virus.
They knew they were going to confront with alien species. They barely knew anything about it/them. The key word you used is believe. You shouldn't make military decisions based upon you beliefs and predictions without appriopriate knowledge when you encounter deadly foreign species. You should know. And if you don't know you should be prepared for anything. Even for deadly alien pathogens. Marines in Aliens ignored that.
The point is that it's not a problem because the film never gives them a solid reason to take such measures. If there was talk of deadly contagious viruses and then they went in without the necessary precautions, that would be something to take issue with. Otherwise it's just nitpicking for the sake of it.
Quote from: reecebomb on Apr 30, 2017, 02:14:41 PM
The idiocy of the Prometheus crew was very much obvious for anybody with common sense, not just nerds on the forum. And by no means is it comparable to the Aliens. Yes they didn't think things through in Aliens, but it's no way comparable to the simply bad writing in Prometheus, the end.
We shall see how Covenant turns out, but i personally don't see any improvents when it comes to the crews competency, yet the Faris thing doesn't bother me, but there are way worse offences. Snooping aroung on a unknown and uncharted planet with no protective gear and precautionary measures is pretty damn dumb, and for the final time it's not comparable to Aliens. When Daniels says you hear that? nothing, no birds, no animals, nothing just shows they did f**k all before they walked out like exiting an airplane in unknown part of Africa.
Saw the Covenant preview on the big screen yesterday. I liked it more this time around but the cgi is at times still very obviously computer generated, especially bad where Spoiler
the neomorph breaks and crawls out from the door window and some close ups before
On a positive note i think the dynamic and somewhat organic line delivery between the actors n the dropship scene is definitely an improvement over Prometheus.
IMHO by far the best comment here!
Quote from: Predaker on Apr 30, 2017, 03:00:50 PM
Quote from: Ingwar on Apr 30, 2017, 02:51:25 PM
Quote from: Predaker on Apr 30, 2017, 02:39:05 PM
Quote from: Ingwar on Apr 30, 2017, 02:12:05 PM
In Aliens the atmosphere on LV-426 was breathable but it didn't mean that Marines shouldn't have worn protective suits. They didn't know what had happened to the colony. It might have been a virus who wiped out people at Hadley's Hope and then what? They weren't fully prepared. That's the fact. Do I care? Not at all. It's just a movie. Sometimes you have to sacrifice scientific accuracy and realism for the sake of the story.
Its not really an issue because they never had any reason to believe the colony was wiped out by a virus.
They knew they were going to confront with alien species. They barely knew anything about it/them. The key word you used is believe. You shouldn't make military decisions based upon you beliefs and predictions without appriopriate knowledge when you encounter deadly foreign species. You should know. And if you don't know you should be prepared for anything. Even for deadly alien pathogens. Marines in Aliens ignored that.
The point is that it's not a problem because the film never gives them a solid reason to take such measures. If there was talk of deadly contagious viruses and then they went in without the necessary precautions, that would be something to take issue with. Otherwise it's just nitpicking for the sake of it.
I'm going to repeat myself. They knew they were going to encounter
alien species. In real life any military leader would make sure that everyone should wear protective suit. We're talking here about
foreign species who were responsible of wiping out whole colony. You never know what can happen. This is extreme situation. For me it would have been sufficient reason even if the words like
virus and
infection haven't been used during the mission briefing. Put the protective suits on. It's no brainer. But as I said before, do I care? No. In the movie/book you have to sometimes sacrifice realism for the sake of the story.
Quote from: Ingwar on Apr 30, 2017, 03:28:30 PM
Quote from: Predaker on Apr 30, 2017, 03:00:50 PM
Quote from: Ingwar on Apr 30, 2017, 02:51:25 PM
Quote from: Predaker on Apr 30, 2017, 02:39:05 PM
Quote from: Ingwar on Apr 30, 2017, 02:12:05 PM
In Aliens the atmosphere on LV-426 was breathable but it didn't mean that Marines shouldn't have worn protective suits. They didn't know what had happened to the colony. It might have been a virus who wiped out people at Hadley's Hope and then what? They weren't fully prepared. That's the fact. Do I care? Not at all. It's just a movie. Sometimes you have to sacrifice scientific accuracy and realism for the sake of the story.
Its not really an issue because they never had any reason to believe the colony was wiped out by a virus.
They knew they were going to confront with alien species. They barely knew anything about it/them. The key word you used is believe. You shouldn't make military decisions based upon you beliefs and predictions without appriopriate knowledge when you encounter deadly foreign species. You should know. And if you don't know you should be prepared for anything. Even for deadly alien pathogens. Marines in Aliens ignored that.
The point is that it's not a problem because the film never gives them a solid reason to take such measures. If there was talk of deadly contagious viruses and then they went in without the necessary precautions, that would be something to take issue with. Otherwise it's just nitpicking for the sake of it.
I'm going to repeat myself. They knew they were going to encounter alien species. In real life any military leader would make sure that everyone should wear protective suit. We're talking here about foreign species who were responsible of wiping out whole colony. You never know what can happen. This is extreme situation. For me it would have been sufficient reason even if the words like virus and infection haven't been used during the mission briefing. Put the protective suits on. It's no brainer. But as I said before, do I care? No. In the movie/book you have to sometimes sacrifice realism for the sake of the story.
ALIENS doesn't have them suffer for it while Covenant does, so they aren't comparable in this regard. To what degree that matters has yet to be seen.
We have to wait. It's hard to judge a movie without seeing it. I assume that they will address protective suit issue in Covenant. There were few stills of the crew having something like the mission briefing.
You guys are making way too much out of both movies.
Here are the facts: In Aliens LV-426/Acheron has been colonized for decades, its atmosphere terraformed to be safe for human life. The Colonial Marines therefore have zero reason to believe (despite Ripley's testimony) that there is a biological/airborne contagion which they must wear protective suits for. "But but but what if they thought the alien could be an airborne infection - " They didn't. The end. No discussion.
In Alien: Covenant you will almost certainly have a scene where the crew runs some sort of scans from orbit and determines that the planet is safe, non-toxic and habitable for human life. Why do they not run around in hazmat suits anyway Just In Case? Because it's a movie. The end.
Have a good Sunday, folks. This is a boring waste of time.
SpeedyMaxx the hero. This protective suit stuff is obnoxious.
Yeah seriously, what the f*ck was that all about?! :D
Quote from: SpeedyMaxx on Apr 30, 2017, 04:06:54 PM
In Alien: Covenant you will almost certainly have a scene where the crew runs some sort of scans from orbit and determines that the planet is safe, non-toxic and habitable for human life. Why do they not run around in hazmat suits anyway Just In Case? Because it's a movie. The end.
Have a good Sunday, folks. This is a boring waste of time.
This indeed is waste of time, but as i've said above the comment from Daniels when they have their first stroll proves they have pretty much no clue what they are doing, forgot to add
we don't know what the f**ks out there, and who could forget
this is wheat lol.
Anything in Aliens isn't as lousy as what we've seen so far in Covenant or the Prometheus clusterf**k, explained multiple times in the last few pages, yet still the arguing hasn't stopped ffss. In Aliens, the company probably thinks it's just a downed transmitter or something. Only Burke hopes there might be something there to make money from and gets a bunch of incompetent overconfident marines with not much combat experience. The Prometheus again, was just bad writing.
Quote from: reecebomb on Apr 30, 2017, 04:39:23 PM
This indeed is waste of time, but as i've said above the comment from Daniels when they have their first stroll proves they have pretty much no clue what they are doing, forgot to add we don't know what the f**ks out there, and who could forget this is wheat lol.
She is speaking more generally. Not about whether they're wearing hazmat suits. If Daniels felt otherwise she wouldn't be out there. But you already knew that because you saw the same clips of her that we did, you're just trying to make an issue of it because you're pissed about the movie.
If you can excuse
Aliens which had a perfectly good in-plot reason, you can excuse
Covenant which very likely has a similar reason baked into dialogue - scans revealing a safe atmosphere and environment they can interact with. Lest we forget, the spores are almost certainly not indigenous to the planet/native to the environment.
I have my own issues with
Covenant and its story. I don't need to make up other ones just to keep hitting it. I see nothing incorrect about its team of colonists exploring a distress call provided they determine the planet is reasonably safe for them to interact with and I'm not going to pretend it's so different from
Aliens just to keep justifying my negativity towards unrelated elements of the movie's plot. I don't just need you to stop insulting my intelligence, I need you to stop circumventing your own.
Oh: And there is also absolutely zero evidence that the Marines in
Aliens are incompetent or inexperienced. James Cameron never presents them that way or suggests that they are. Ever. All he ever says is they are overconfident due to a history of past experience and victory. You don't like them, that's your problem. It has nothing to do with the actual material in the movie.
"How many drops is this for you, Lieutenant?" "Thirty-eight. Simulated." "How many combat drops?" "Uh, two... Including this one."
(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.alicia-logic.com%2Fcapsimages%2Fa_068GormanRipley.jpg&hash=2d1f00c52f9c5cbabf8fb54664f59c6e14e0000e)
;D
Yeah, that's Gorman. Not the rest of them. Gorman is the new lieutenant. He is deliberately set apart from the rest of the Marines in-story.
Definitely in agreement there, just a lil nostalgia to lighten things up.
Quote from: SpeedyMaxx on Apr 30, 2017, 04:55:01 PM
Quote from: reecebomb on Apr 30, 2017, 04:39:23 PM
This indeed is waste of time, but as i've said above the comment from Daniels when they have their first stroll proves they have pretty much no clue what they are doing, forgot to add we don't know what the f**ks out there, and who could forget this is wheat lol.
She is speaking more generally. Not about whether they're wearing hazmat suits. If Daniels felt otherwise she wouldn't be out there. But you already knew that because you saw the same clips of her that we did, you're just trying to make an issue of it because you're pissed about the movie.
If you can excuse Aliens which had a perfectly good in-plot reason, you can excuse Covenant which very likely has a similar reason baked into dialogue - scans revealing a safe atmosphere and environment they can interact with. Lest we forget, the spores are almost certainly not indigenous to the planet/native to the environment.
I have my own issues with Covenant and its story. I don't need to make up other ones just to keep hitting it. I see nothing incorrect about its team of colonists exploring a distress call provided they determine the planet is reasonably safe for them to interact with and I'm not going to pretend it's so different from Aliens just to keep justifying my negativity towards unrelated elements of the movie's plot. I don't just need you to stop insulting my intelligence, I need you to stop circumventing your own.
Oh: And there is also absolutely zero evidence that the Marines in Aliens are incompetent or inexperienced. James Cameron never presents them that way or suggests that they are. Ever. All he ever says is they are overconfident due to a history of past experience and victory. You don't like them, that's your problem. It has nothing to do with the actual material in the movie.
Well for once this isn't Star Trek, The Covenant is probably the first ship in mankind history that gets to travel to a potentially habitable planet that might have flaura and fauna and probably the most important, expensive etc as well. Why they assume that the planet is another earth with birds, butterflies and fluffy bunnies with no potential threats or space aids even if the air is breathable... it's all rather peculiar imo. And maybe yes, they somehow will explain it, we'll see.
And you are wrong about Aliens, i do like them :)
Quote from: Predaker on Apr 30, 2017, 02:39:05 PM
Not comparable.
The marines weren't told why they had to give up their ammo and they were also faced with an immediate threat to their lives. The Sulaco was mostly autonomous and Bishop was able to remotely fly the second dropship down to the surface for them.
Of course it's comparable. You have a crack troop of soldiers who are wilfully disobeying orders (for zero narrative reason) which ultimately leads to the destruction of the entire facility. Talk about dropping a bollock. As far as the drop ship is concerned, the deaths of Gorman, Vasquez, Burke and Hudson are directly attributable to the fact that they couldn't get off the planet quickly enough after the first drop ship is destroyed. Have yah even watched the film recently? 😉
Quote from: Darth Vile on Apr 30, 2017, 05:33:05 PM
Have yah even watched the film recently?
No, I just heard it was a bad action movie about dumb marines that like to squash bugs.
It was either 'willfully disobey orders' re: live ammunition or get killed in the hive then and there. Then nobody would've gotten off-world. There were no good options.
Quote from: Darth Vile on Apr 30, 2017, 05:33:05 PM
You have a crack troop of soldiers who are wilfully disobeying orders (for zero narrative reason) which ultimately leads to the destruction of the entire facility.
Nonsense, they were a squadron of scraps consisting of two former convicts, a coward and other assorted non-achievers led by an extremely green lieutenant. That's enough "narrative reason for willfully disobeying orders".
Quote from: Darth Vile on Apr 30, 2017, 05:33:05 PM
Quote from: Predaker on Apr 30, 2017, 02:39:05 PM
Not comparable.
The marines weren't told why they had to give up their ammo and they were also faced with an immediate threat to their lives. The Sulaco was mostly autonomous and Bishop was able to remotely fly the second dropship down to the surface for them.
Of course it's comparable. You have a crack troop of soldiers who are wilfully disobeying orders (for zero narrative reason) which ultimately leads to the destruction of the entire facility. Talk about dropping a bollock. As far as the drop ship is concerned, the deaths of Gorman, Vasquez, Burke and Hudson are directly attributable to the fact that they couldn't get off the planet quickly enough after the first drop ship is destroyed. Have yah even watched the film recently? 😉
Who knows what shit Burke told the marines before they decided to accept the mission, they went in knowing there will probably be nothing more than a bughunt, easy money. The chain of events after they found out what they were dealing with was very acceptable and not something people had a problem until this thread. The problems with Prometheus are in a different magnitude and can easily become distracting, they are not comparable. From what we've seen so far, Covenant might have the same distracting issues.
Quote from: The Eighth Passenger on Apr 30, 2017, 05:49:33 PM
Quote from: Darth Vile on Apr 30, 2017, 05:33:05 PM
You have a crack troop of soldiers who are wilfully disobeying orders (for zero narrative reason) which ultimately leads to the destruction of the entire facility.
Nonsense, they were a squadron of scraps consisting of two former convicts, a coward and other assorted non-achievers led by an extremely green lieutenant. That's enough "narrative reason for willfully disobeying orders".
I'm well aware of ancillary fanon/EU material, but there is zero evidence given in Cameron's script or the film that the Colonial Marine unit in the film is made up of incompetents or cowards. If you don't like them or the film that's fine, but don't make shit up out of whole cloth.
Quote from: SpeedyMaxx on Apr 30, 2017, 05:54:35 PM
I'm well aware of ancillary fanon/EU material, but there is zero evidence given in Cameron's script or the film that the Colonial Marine unit in the film is made up of incompetents or cowards. If you don't like them or the film that's fine, but don't make shit up out of whole cloth.
Shit dude, have you actually watched the f*cking movie? ??? ::)
Almost right off the bat you already have a major discipline problem.
This thread just keeps on giving.
Quote from: The Eighth Passenger on Apr 30, 2017, 05:59:09 PM
Quote from: SpeedyMaxx on Apr 30, 2017, 05:54:35 PM
I'm well aware of ancillary fanon/EU material, but there is zero evidence given in Cameron's script or the film that the Colonial Marine unit in the film is made up of incompetents or cowards. If you don't like them or the film that's fine, but don't make shit up out of whole cloth.
Shit dude, have you actually watched the f*cking movie? ??? ::)
Yep.
Yet you would maintain that they are a crack squadron of marines?
Quote from: The Eighth Passenger on Apr 30, 2017, 06:04:10 PM
Yet you would maintain that they are a crack squadron of marines?
Yes, and I am pretty sure James Cameron does as well. He presents them as heroic, a bit cocky (like any other military unit in virtually any other action movie of the time) and overconfident. Not incompetent or cowardly.
whats strange to me is that Walter seems to be sitting on the sidelines just spectating both deaths and the panicing crew however in the last supper he was the first one to step in to save a life
Quote from: Predaker on Apr 30, 2017, 06:00:30 PM
This thread just keeps on giving.
Blame the headcases about 5-7 pages back that were comparing Covenant's writing to Prometheus. That's what started this whole debate on safety protocols (of which I really have nothing more to add and am tired of repeating myself).
Quote from: Infected on Apr 29, 2017, 10:59:36 PM
Offcourse, except for the door she closed in front of the face of her "friend" while she was more infected.
No evidence, we all treat our friends like that haha. "Oh there is an alien bursting out of his back, wait my dear friend let me lock you in there with it"
I'm not sure I'd have called them friends. I think there's likely some tension between the two. Karine definitely doesn't seem fond of Faris (I think that comes across pretty clear in the prologue) and I'd imagine if the latter knows, it'd be reciprocated.
Quote from: SpeedyMaxx on Apr 30, 2017, 06:05:29 PM
Quote from: The Eighth Passenger on Apr 30, 2017, 06:04:10 PM
Yet you would maintain that they are a crack squadron of marines?
Yes, and I am pretty sure James Cameron does as well. He presents them as heroic, a bit cocky (like any other military unit in virtually any other action movie of the time) and overconfident. Not incompetent or cowardly.
Quote from: James Cameron"I knew nothing about the US Marine Corps at the time, although curiously, while I was making this film, my youngest brother joined the Marines and was in for six years. I now know a lot more about the Marines and they are much more disciplined than these people ... These guys are definitely Vietnam-era regular army, toward-the-end-of-their-tour kind of motif."
Quote from: SpeedyMaxx on Apr 30, 2017, 06:05:29 PMI'm well aware of ancillary fanon/EU material, but there is zero evidence given in Cameron's script or the film that the Colonial Marine unit in the film is made up of incompetents or cowards.
QuoteFor her character's explosive death scene in the colony vents, Goldstein explained: "I had to get all slimed up. I think Vasquez is just so angry that it has finally got to her. Rather than being scared, she's pissed off she's about to die."
"Conscripted from juvenile prison, the two of them were trained to operate the formidable 'smart-guns'. That is part of their bond."
And Hudson was a coward. Until the end when he re-deemed himself.
Hudson was a lot of things. He went from cocky to frightened when they came into an unusual situation, yes. That doesn't make him a coward. He found his courage again.
And again, nothing Cameron says or writes above contradicts anything I've said. You take that material to see them as incompetent because some of them were in prison (ex-cons can be competent), or because they have had a long tour of duty and discipline is looser due to familiarity. I don't. You're projecting onto them.
Quote from: Corporal Hicks on Apr 30, 2017, 06:12:01 PM
I'm not sure I'd have called them friends. I think there's likely some tension between the two. Karine definitely doesn't seem fond of Faris (I think that comes across pretty clear in the prologue) and I'd imagine if the latter knows, it'd be reciprocated.
They're definitely not friends. But they don't hate each other and aren't trying to kill each other, either. They're both just trying to work through the situation.
Quote from: SpeedyMaxx on Apr 30, 2017, 06:27:09 PM
And again, nothing Cameron says or writes above contradicts anything I've said. You take that material to see them as incompetent because some of them were in prison (ex-cons can be competent), or because they have had a long tour of duty and discipline is looser due to familiarity. I don't. You're projecting onto them.
The issue I'm discussing here is "
DISCIPLINE". Not "
COMPETENCE" and the fact that they were
not a "crack" or elite squadron of marines. In other words, the reason why it makes sense that they disobeyed orders.
QuoteHudson was a lot of things. He went from cocky to frightened when they came into an unusual situation, yes. That doesn't make him a coward. He found his courage again.
"The thing with the knife" scene perfectly sets up his character as a coward.
Hudson was scared shitless, but i wouldn't call him a full coward.
Edit: i'd probably lose my cool too for a second if someone did the knife thing to me.
Quote from: reecebomb on Apr 30, 2017, 06:40:25 PM
Hudson was scared shitless, but i wouldn't call him a full coward.
Edit: i'd probably lose my cool too for a second if someone did the knife thing to me.
I'm right there with ya. I feel no shame in admitting it either.
Quote from: reecebomb on Apr 30, 2017, 06:40:25 PM
Hudson was scared shitless, but i wouldn't call him a full coward.
Edit: i'd probably lose my cool too for a second if someone did the knife thing to me.
But you wouldn't expect someone like him to be serving in the SAS or Delta either, right?
I've completely lost track of where this thread is going.
Did someone try and claim Aliens is as affected by dumb characters as Prometheus? :laugh:
Quote from: HuDaFuK on Apr 30, 2017, 06:57:26 PM
I've completely lost track of where this thread is going.
Did someone try and claim Aliens is as affected by dumb characters as Prometheus? :laugh:
No - someone about 5-7 pages back said Covenant appears to have the same dumb characters as Prometheus, which led to a conversation about safety protocols and how the Covenant crew is no better than Milburn and Fifield and basically just dismissing Covenant because of the lack of respecting safety protocols.
This led to Darth Vile and me bringing up Aliens as a point of comparision to show that safety protocols were ignored even in Aliens and to question why it's OK to give Aliens a pass but castrate Covenant. Like I said, I grew tired of the conversation yesterday after going back and forth with Predaker about it only to find out he hasn't even seen the Covenant footage that was being referred to, which just took the steam right out of me (I still have absolutely no idea why he felt the need to contribute to a conversation about footage he hasn't even seen yet... but meh).
I haven't been right since I watched it. It's like a drug and I just had a taste!!!! I need to see the whole thing like yesterday!!!
"Surgically removed before embryo implantation. Subject: Marachuk, John J., died while reading this thread without a W-Y protective suit. They killed him taking it off."
Quote from: Corporal Hicks on Apr 30, 2017, 06:12:01 PM
Quote from: Infected on Apr 29, 2017, 10:59:36 PM
Offcourse, except for the door she closed in front of the face of her "friend" while she was more infected.
No evidence, we all treat our friends like that haha. "Oh there is an alien bursting out of his back, wait my dear friend let me lock you in there with it"
I'm not sure I'd have called them friends. I think there's likely some tension between the two. Karine definitely doesn't seem fond of Faris (I think that comes across pretty clear in the prologue) and I'd imagine if the latter knows, it'd be reciprocated.
Welk thank god im not the only one seeing that, and imo that is clearly part of the story. And Cruddup alone with David/Walter makes me think Cruddup wants revenge and David gives him what he wants.
That last word i have to Google
I suggested that Faris, having watched the alien burst from the guy's back, then deciding not to let Karine out when she is banging on the door, is quite stupid when her sole intention from that moment onward is to go and get a gun then return immediately and go inside anyway. I don't know where 'safety protocols' came into it, or anything from Aliens.
I get the panic argument - but that is negated by the fact she runs off intending to get a gun and go straight back inside. It is nonsensical why she doesn't let Karine out then re-lock the door if her intention is to immediately go and get a gun to come back and try to save her.
It's not a massive issue, but I'm just offering opinion on what footage of the movie is available at present. Not sure why certain people are being so sensitive about it.
Quote from: oberonqa on Apr 30, 2017, 07:06:04 PM
Quote from: HuDaFuK on Apr 30, 2017, 06:57:26 PM
I've completely lost track of where this thread is going.
Did someone try and claim Aliens is as affected by dumb characters as Prometheus? :laugh:
This led to Darth Vile and me bringing up Aliens as a point of comparision to show that safety protocols were ignored even in Aliens and to question why it's OK to give Aliens a pass but castrate Covenant.
And this is where it went wrong. We can't say anything definite about Covenant for now, from what we've seen so far is not unlike Prometheus, there is no comparison with Aliens, like it was stated on this thread multiple times.
Quote from: reecebomb on Apr 30, 2017, 07:20:35 PMWe can't say anything definite about Covenant for now, from what we've seen so far is not unlike Prometheus...
Not really.
Prometheus is supposedly competent experts doing idiotic things whilst under no pressure whatsoever.
Covenant is untrained crew freaking the hell out when aliens are exploding out of their colleagues.
I fail to see how anyone can find the two comparable.
Quote from: HuDaFuK on Apr 30, 2017, 06:57:26 PM
I've completely lost track of where this thread is going.
Did someone try and claim Aliens is as affected by dumb characters as Prometheus? :laugh:
Here's a gem for ya :D
Quote from: Darth Vile on Apr 30, 2017, 12:39:39 PM
The "vast majority of other" moviegoers are just as bothered with the logic gaps in behaviour of characters in Aliens as they are with the crew of the Prometheus.
Quote from: HuDaFuK on Apr 30, 2017, 07:29:06 PM
Quote from: reecebomb on Apr 30, 2017, 07:20:35 PMWe can't say anything definite about Covenant for now, from what we've seen so far is not unlike Prometheus...
Not really.
Prometheus is supposedly competent experts doing idiotic things whilst under no pressure whatsoever.
Covenant is untrained crew freaking the hell out when aliens are exploding out of their colleagues.
I fail to see how anyone can find the two comparable.
I don't think that the company would send untrained crew to a mission of this magnitude. Anyway You can read the last paged of this thread, no reason to continue with this arguing. :)
Untrained crew sent into space with a trillion dollar ship and tech freaking out at the first signs of stress (hello space travel) is kinda equally worse for me though. How about a little more 2001 professionel situation control, hell how about a little more Ripley, even for minor characters?
edit: ninjaw'd
Quote from: reecebomb on Apr 30, 2017, 07:38:08 PMI don't think that the company would send untrained crew to a mission of this magnitude.
OK, untrained was an exaggeration, but they're basically just the grunt technicians. They're not supposed to be highly intelligent scientists. The crew introduction video proved that much.
"Hey weyland yutani, you just handed the keys of this most expensive ship to a dude who punches horses in the face!"
Quote from: Predaker on Apr 30, 2017, 07:48:35 PM
"Hey weyland yutani, you just handed the keys of this most expensive ship to a dude who punches horses in the face!"
:laugh:
Which raises the question, just exactly how did Tennessee get that job? He must have some mad skillz.
We should have more characters like
Mark Watney in
Alien universe. They would science the shit out of Xenomorphs ;D
Quote from: The Eighth Passenger on Apr 30, 2017, 07:52:38 PM
Quote from: Predaker on Apr 30, 2017, 07:48:35 PM
"Hey weyland yutani, you just handed the keys of this most expensive ship to a dude who punches horses in the face!"
:laugh:
Which raises the question, just exactly how did Tennessee get that job? He must have some mad skillz.
Maybe not everyone wants to travel through space to colonise other planet and never come back to Earth again? :)
Isn't the whole point that the WY company want the teams they send out to unknowingly obtain these alien life forms, no matter the consequence?
Quote from: Ingwar on Apr 30, 2017, 07:53:01 PM
Maybe not everyone wants to travel through space to colonise other planet and never come back to Earth again? :)
Mmm... I suppose it depends on what Earth is like at that point in time. Johner didn't paint a very rosy picture of it a couple centuries later.
Quote from: M_Tak on Apr 30, 2017, 08:00:58 PM
Isn't the whole point that the WY company want the teams they send out to unknowingly obtain these alien life forms, no matter the consequence?
No, not yet. But it sort of is later in the series.
Quote from: Predaker on Apr 30, 2017, 01:56:36 AM
ALIENS never portrayed itself as hard sci-fi while Prometheus attempted to take itself much more seriously than it probably should have.
This is called a double standard, and it's an unintentionally anti-intellectual position to take, too, because you are rewarding the movies that aim lower. Prometheus is being slammed because it aimed for the stars, and Aliens is being rewarded because its a fun movie to watch while drinking beer. I try to apply even standards, especially within the same series.
Quote from: Protozoid on Apr 30, 2017, 09:11:21 PM
This is called a double standard, and it's an unintentionally anti-intellectual position to take, too, because you are rewarding the movies that aim lower. Prometheus is being slammed because it aimed for the stars, and Aliens is being rewarded because its a fun movie to watch while drinking beer. I try to apply even standards, especially within the same series.
Perhaps. But I think what it is aiming for, in Aliens' case, lands closer to the mark than it does in Prometheus' case. Maybe this is grounds for Aliens playing it safer, but there's no debating that what it does, it does well. In Prometheus case, it fails in terms of editing, mainly. And in regards to equal standards, Aliens is a much, much better edited film than Prometheus, but a much tighter script. In regards to its script and focus, Prometheus is a bit of a hot mess.
I like the film. Really, I do. It has great ideas, even if it can't explore them, effectively. It looks great. Also, the characters in Aliens are plentiful and likeable. "Sharply-drawn," as Roger Ebert described it. Prometheus has David, and he is amazing. But apart from him, a large amount of the cast can't hold a candle to anyone in Aliens.
Quote from: Protozoid on Apr 30, 2017, 09:11:21 PM
Quote from: Predaker on Apr 30, 2017, 01:56:36 AM
ALIENS never portrayed itself as hard sci-fi while Prometheus attempted to take itself much more seriously than it probably should have.
This is called a double standard, and it's an unintentionally anti-intellectual position to take, too, because you are rewarding the movies that aim lower. Prometheus is being slammed because it aimed for the stars, and Aliens is being rewarded because its a fun movie to watch while drinking beer. I try to apply even standards, especially within the same series.
Not at all, but please feel free to continue pulling quotes out of context and misrepresenting them so you can vent your frustration with others who didn't like
Prometheus as much as you do.
Quote from: Protozoid on Apr 30, 2017, 09:11:21 PM
Quote from: Predaker on Apr 30, 2017, 01:56:36 AM
ALIENS never portrayed itself as hard sci-fi while Prometheus attempted to take itself much more seriously than it probably should have.
Prometheus is being slammed because it aimed for the stars.
And missed the mark by a wide margin and introduced a lot of clutter to the series apart from David. Aliens is a lot smarter movie in the end.
Quote from: NickisSmart on Apr 30, 2017, 09:45:06 PM
Perhaps. But I think what it is aiming for, in Aliens' case, lands closer to the mark than it does in Prometheus' case. Maybe this is grounds for Aliens playing it safer, but there's no debating that what it does, it does well. In Prometheus case, it fails in terms of editing, mainly. And in regards to equal standards, Aliens is a much, much better edited film than Prometheus, but a much tighter script. In regards to its script and focus, Prometheus is a bit of a hot mess.
I like the film. Really, I do. It has great ideas, even if it can't explore them, effectively. It looks great. Also, the characters in Aliens are plentiful and likeable. "Sharply-drawn," as Roger Ebert described it. Prometheus has David, and he is amazing. But apart from him, a large amount of the cast can't hold a candle to anyone in Aliens.
Sometimes I forget that I read Lindelof's script and watched the deleted scenes when I assess Prometheus. I think the script is essentially quite strong, with characters/dialogue being the main deficiency. But the theatrical cut of the movie was slashed to within an inch of its life - as most of Scott's movies are, actually. Pietro Scalia just has the dubious honor of being the guy who butchers Ridley's movies nowadays. Although Scalia is a very talented and skilled editor, he does butcher Scott's movies. Scott gives him too much say over the final cut, in my opinion. The characters and the messy editing are symptoms of the same problem: the script is an ensemble like Alien, but they re-edited it to focus on Shaw. I don't know who made that decision, but Scalia did carry it out. This led to many scenes without Shaw being cut or fatally shortened. Then the re-shoots resulted in awkward information dumps that try to fit all of the missing exposition into a few breathless sentences uttered to Janek by Shaw.
Scalia also had peculiar, fixed notions about Prometheus that probably hurt it. First, he had a preconceived idea that the movie should be under two hours, but Scott's assembly ran about twenty minutes longer, iirc. Second, he wanted to make the c-section and Fifield attack simultaneously, which meant eliminating Shaw's participation in the Fifield attack. The whole section of the movie - from Holloway's death scene to leaving on their way to meet the final Engineer - is fair to call a "hot mess". It doesn't get incoherent, but it was violently rearranged and even casual filmgoers seem able to detect it. For that reason alone, Scalia should probably reigned in. Pretty strange that the same editor who rearranged Prometheus to focus on Shaw is now cutting Shaw almost completely from the sequel!
But I still think it's a better movie than Aliens, overall. It's charitable to call the characters "sharply drawn" when they are largely stereotypes that had been passed down from war movies. Prometheus may not have characters that leap off the screen, but they are more plausibly motivated and performed. They just don't mug for the camera, and they don't care about being liked. The ones in Aliens are relentlessly obnoxious and dimensionless and not everyone finds that endearing.
Besides being an all around mess mess with messy editing, messy script (that's an understatement), shit main theme and forgettable music, stupid characters and messy ideas... it's really boring. Yeah it often looks great, then again it often looks great in a way like a million dollar advert with perfect artificial lightning. No way it's better than Aliens.
Quote from: reecebomb on Apr 30, 2017, 10:49:01 PM
Besides being an all around mess mess with messy editing, messy script (that's an understatement), shit main theme and forgettable music, stupid characters and messy ideas... it's really boring. Yeah it often looks great, then again it often looks great in a way like a million dollar advert with perfect artificial lightning. No way it's better than Aliens.
Reported. Just kidding, but Jesus! Don't you think you're exaggerating just a
little bit...? Lol.
Quote from: Evanus on Apr 30, 2017, 10:51:36 PM
Quote from: reecebomb on Apr 30, 2017, 10:49:01 PM
Besides being an all around mess mess with messy editing, messy script (that's an understatement), shit main theme and forgettable music, stupid characters and messy ideas... it's really boring. Yeah it often looks great, then again it often looks great in a way like a million dollar advert with perfect artificial lightning. No way it's better than Aliens.
Reported.
Just kidding, but Jesus! Don't you think you're exaggerating just a little bit? Lol.
Maybe a tiny bit, i've not seen it since i saw it twice in the theaters when it came out but it is undeniably a very cluttered film and arguably not very exiting. On a positive note i find David intiguing so far. But no way it's better than Aliens.
I like Prometheus despite it being messy, I'm vocally quite annoyed about its mythos being abandoned, and even I think any suggestion of it being better than Aliens is nonsense.
Quote from: reecebomb on Apr 30, 2017, 11:00:04 PM
Quote from: Evanus on Apr 30, 2017, 10:51:36 PM
Quote from: reecebomb on Apr 30, 2017, 10:49:01 PM
Besides being an all around mess mess with messy editing, messy script (that's an understatement), shit main theme and forgettable music, stupid characters and messy ideas... it's really boring. Yeah it often looks great, then again it often looks great in a way like a million dollar advert with perfect artificial lightning. No way it's better than Aliens.
Reported.
Just kidding, but Jesus! Don't you think you're exaggerating just a little bit? Lol.
Maybe a tiny bit, i've not seen it since i saw it twice in the theaters when it came out but it is undeniably a very cluttered film and arguably not very exiting. On a positive note i find David intiguing so far. But no way it's better than Aliens .
Yeah, I get where you're coming from. It's kind of a mess, but I still like it despite its flaws. I just find it a very interesting movie because of all the ideas and themes it explores. And I was hoping the sequel would continue to do so, but shit happens I suppose. At least we still have David, who is indeed quite intriguing. :)
But David is so good... ;D
Quote from: Evanus on Apr 30, 2017, 11:06:04 PM
Quote from: reecebomb on Apr 30, 2017, 11:00:04 PM
Quote from: Evanus on Apr 30, 2017, 10:51:36 PM
Quote from: reecebomb on Apr 30, 2017, 10:49:01 PM
Besides being an all around mess mess with messy editing, messy script (that's an understatement), shit main theme and forgettable music, stupid characters and messy ideas... it's really boring. Yeah it often looks great, then again it often looks great in a way like a million dollar advert with perfect artificial lightning. No way it's better than Aliens.
Reported.
Just kidding, but Jesus! Don't you think you're exaggerating just a little bit? Lol.
Maybe a tiny bit, i've not seen it since i saw it twice in the theaters when it came out but it is undeniably a very cluttered film and arguably not very exiting. On a positive note i find David intiguing so far. But no way it's better than Aliens .
Yeah, I get where you're coming from. It's kind of a mess, but I still like it despite its flaws. I just find it a very interesting movie because of all the ideas and themes it explores. And I was hoping the sequel would continue to do so, but shit happens I suppose. At least we still have David, who is indeed quite intriguing. :)
Thing is, i would have liked to see the Prometheus and the engineer and space jockey story continue, i do think it would have been possible to bring the story to interesting places that would have redeemed Prometheus and explain the idiotic behaviour of the engineer and make them intriguing and perhaps even scary. Now Ridley said,
they want aliens, i give them f**king aliens while the audience just wants a good f**kin sci-fi. That said i strongly believe that the standards of mainstream filmmaking have fallen over the years, compared to most high budget mainstream sci-fi that's been released in the last decade, Prometheus is allright.
Quote from: NickisSmart on Apr 30, 2017, 11:08:43 PM
But David is so good... ;D
It's literally the only good thing the prequel has introduced us so far, even if he is highly unrealistic character in itself, with it's magic powers to learn and understand everything.
Quote from: Predaker on Apr 30, 2017, 09:49:25 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on Apr 30, 2017, 09:11:21 PM
Quote from: Predaker on Apr 30, 2017, 01:56:36 AM
ALIENS never portrayed itself as hard sci-fi while Prometheus attempted to take itself much more seriously than it probably should have.
This is called a double standard, and it's an unintentionally anti-intellectual position to take, too, because you are rewarding the movies that aim lower. Prometheus is being slammed because it aimed for the stars, and Aliens is being rewarded because its a fun movie to watch while drinking beer. I try to apply even standards, especially within the same series.
Not at all, but please feel free to continue pulling quotes out of context and misrepresenting them so you can vent your frustration with others who didn't like Prometheus as much as you do.
I went back and re-read your post that I quoted, and no, it was not out of context or misrepresented. You stated very clearly that you think Aliens and Prometheus should be held to different standards.
So uh the footage looks cool. ::)
Quote from: Predaker on Apr 30, 2017, 07:32:54 PM
Quote from: HuDaFuK on Apr 30, 2017, 06:57:26 PM
I've completely lost track of where this thread is going.
Did someone try and claim Aliens is as affected by dumb characters as Prometheus? :laugh:
Here's a gem for ya :D
Quote from: Darth Vile on Apr 30, 2017, 12:39:39 PM
The "vast majority of other" moviegoers are just as bothered with the logic gaps in behaviour of characters in Aliens as they are with the crew of the Prometheus.
Are you suggesting that the majority of audiences are bothered by those things?
Quote from: TheBATMAN on Apr 30, 2017, 07:19:29 PM
I suggested that Faris, having watched the alien burst from the guy's back, then deciding not to let Karine out when she is banging on the door, is quite stupid when her sole intention from that moment onward is to go and get a gun then return immediately and go inside anyway. I don't know where 'safety protocols' came into it, or anything from Aliens.
I get the panic argument - but that is negated by the fact she runs off intending to get a gun and go straight back inside. It is nonsensical why she doesn't let Karine out then re-lock the door if her intention is to immediately go and get a gun to come back and try to save her.
It's not a massive issue, but I'm just offering opinion on what footage of the movie is available at present. Not sure why certain people are being so sensitive about it.
And Ripley was a stupid F going back for the cat in Alien....
And she basically killed the cocooned marines not going back for them when Vasquez suggested it after level -3 with marines and with an armored vehicle but she went back for Newt alone. But you always can explain these by the human factor/personality.
Also you can always nitpick. Faris only dared to open the door once she felt safe with the gun after the burst. I would have done the same.
The stupidest thing in this 10 minute clip when Karin yells at the alien. I mean why?? Can you see someone do that in real life when the person in full panic mode during an alien attack? Just dumb. Its not like you know you can yell at an attacking dog to intimidate it but even in that case some people forgot how to act because of panic and she yells just for the sake of a Hollywood thing. Classic C horror thing just like the shower scene.
In the movie Life it was also done so perfectly where Ryan Reynolds character were the only person who wanted to open the contagious room to help their buddy everyone else screamed quarantine protocolls and so he was the one who entered and died first. Ironic. I think thats a great roasting towards all the stupid characters in other movies and scenes like this. I also felt sorry for the character in the same time. So considering that scene Faris even more did the right thing.
Quote from: reecebomb on Apr 30, 2017, 11:00:04 PM
Quote from: Evanus on Apr 30, 2017, 10:51:36 PM
Quote from: reecebomb on Apr 30, 2017, 10:49:01 PM
Besides being an all around mess mess with messy editing, messy script (that's an understatement), shit main theme and forgettable music, stupid characters and messy ideas... it's really boring. Yeah it often looks great, then again it often looks great in a way like a million dollar advert with perfect artificial lightning. No way it's better than Aliens.
Reported.
Just kidding, but Jesus! Don't you think you're exaggerating just a little bit? Lol.
Maybe a tiny bit, i've not seen it since i saw it twice in the theaters when it came out but it is undeniably a very cluttered film and arguably not very exiting. On a positive note i find David intiguing so far. But no way it's better than Aliens.
I'd definitely recommend sitting and watching it again on bluray, not just to see it again before Covenant, but because I think the film works better the more you see it. I certainly thought it better on my first bluray viewing back when it came out, compared to theatre, but I really enjoyed it the first time too. But the artistry in it is more clear I think the second or later viewings, and the music ... the music.
Quote from: zoidy on May 01, 2017, 09:11:12 AM
Quote from: reecebomb on Apr 30, 2017, 11:00:04 PM
Quote from: Evanus on Apr 30, 2017, 10:51:36 PM
Quote from: reecebomb on Apr 30, 2017, 10:49:01 PM
Besides being an all around mess mess with messy editing, messy script (that's an understatement), shit main theme and forgettable music, stupid characters and messy ideas... it's really boring. Yeah it often looks great, then again it often looks great in a way like a million dollar advert with perfect artificial lightning. No way it's better than Aliens.
Reported.
Just kidding, but Jesus! Don't you think you're exaggerating just a little bit? Lol.
Maybe a tiny bit, i've not seen it since i saw it twice in the theaters when it came out but it is undeniably a very cluttered film and arguably not very exiting. On a positive note i find David intiguing so far. But no way it's better than Aliens.
I'd definitely recommend sitting and watching it again on bluray, not just to see it again before Covenant, but because I think the film works better the more you see it. I certainly thought it better on my first bluray viewing back when it came out, compared to theatre, but I really enjoyed it the first time too. But the artistry in it is more clear I think the second or later viewings, and the music ... the music.
Yeah i think i will see it once more before Covenant. First time i also sort of liked it and came out from the cinema smiling, later i realized it was just a shit eating grin.
Scified has leaked the actual Backburster images, and throatburster one too.
http://www.alien-covenant.com/news/exclusive-alien-covenant-neomorph-bursting-scene-images-leaked-major-spoilers (http://www.alien-covenant.com/news/exclusive-alien-covenant-neomorph-bursting-scene-images-leaked-major-spoilers)
**Let's not post these here to avoid any legal issues.** ;)
Quote from: Pvt. Himmel on May 01, 2017, 10:16:11 AM
Scified has leaked the actual Backburster images, and throatburster one too.
http://www.alien-covenant.com/news/exclusive-alien-covenant-neomorph-bursting-scene-images-leaked-major-spoilers (http://www.alien-covenant.com/news/exclusive-alien-covenant-neomorph-bursting-scene-images-leaked-major-spoilers)
**Let's not post these here to avoid any legal issues.** ;)
Um... they're just screengrabs from the leaked footage (there's even that same man's head blocking the lower section of the screen). Why is that site treating it as some kind of exclusive?! Stoopid...
Quote from: St_Eddie on May 01, 2017, 12:03:30 PM
Quote from: Pvt. Himmel on May 01, 2017, 10:16:11 AM
Scified has leaked the actual Backburster images, and throatburster one too.
http://www.alien-covenant.com/news/exclusive-alien-covenant-neomorph-bursting-scene-images-leaked-major-spoilers (http://www.alien-covenant.com/news/exclusive-alien-covenant-neomorph-bursting-scene-images-leaked-major-spoilers)
**Let's not post these here to avoid any legal issues.** ;)
Um... they're just screengrabs from the leaked footage (there's even that same man's head blocking the lower section of the screen). Why is that site treating it as some kind of exclusive?! Stoopid...
Exactly. They're not an exclusive. That footage is all over the internet. They're just playing their usual games in an effort to grab attention again. I really hate that website.
P.S #FloatingHeadConfirmedForAlienCovenant
Quote from: M_Tak on Apr 30, 2017, 08:00:58 PM
Isn't the whole point that the WY company want the teams they send out to unknowingly obtain these alien life forms, no matter the consequence?
Not as far as Covenant is concerned though. This seems to be an entirely coincidental thing.
Quote from: Corporal Hicks on May 01, 2017, 12:08:29 PM#FloatingHeadConfirmedForAlienCovenant
That very same man has attended every single cinema screening which I've ever been to. Without fail, he'll always purposefully choose the seat in front of mine, even if the cinema is empty, except for the two of us. Now he's taken to blocking my view during online videos! It's a step too far and I'm going to report him to the police for stalking.
Don't even get me started on his twin Brother, whom insists on sitting directly behind me and kicking my seat for the duration of the film, whilst noisily grazing on a bag of Revels. Bastards, the pair of them.
Quote from: iain on Apr 27, 2017, 08:33:23 PM
*link removed. Please don't share links to this pirated footage in the public boards. Hicks.*
This is Piracy!
Master Corporal Hicks, this is not good for your web site's reputation.
Anyway, saw it (as I thought it was some official promotional release footage).
The landing and entry scene was not as good and/or gorgeous as in Alien and Prometheus. But the whole sequence was good; a much professional approach from the crews was documented.
The Backburster scene was cool and gruesome. Finally, something different. The pacing was perfect. The performances were good. Overall good built-up of suspense and tension.
The Backburster neomorph was truly vicious. I couldn't see the throat burster scene as the clip was too dark.
Not happy to see the crews walking without helmets. Not happy to see the short-cut 'Spore planting neomorph' concept. Anyway, it sure looks like a hardcore horror slasher film.
Will wait for the grand concepts of Prometheus to evolve in future sequels if this doesn't deliver.
Quote from: The_Foxcatcher on May 01, 2017, 01:09:29 PM
Quote from: iain on Apr 27, 2017, 08:33:23 PM
*link removed. Please don't share links to this pirated footage in the public boards. Hicks.*
This is Piracy!
Master Corporal Hicks, this is not good for your web site's reputation.
Anyway, saw it (as I thought it was some official promotional release footage).
The landing and entry scene was not as good and/or gorgeous as in Alien and Prometheus. But the whole sequence was good; a much professional approach from the crews was documented.
The Backburster scene was cool and gruesome. Finally, something different. The pacing was perfect. The performances were good. Overall good built-up of suspense and tension.
The Backburster neomorph was truly vicious. I couldn't see the throat burster scene as the clip was too dark.
Not happy to see the crews walking without helmets. Not happy to see the short-cut 'Spore planting neomorph' concept. Anyway, it sure looks like a hardcore horror slasher film.
Will wait for the grand concepts of Prometheus to evolve in future sequels if this doesn't deliver.
Agreed completely. When you can actually see the throat burster, it is actually quite gruesome.
Hopefully the spore planting neomorph concept gets some kind of explanation. The life cycle of neomorphs seems far more efficient if your objective is to kill off people asap. I am really excited to see the adult neomorph. My only concern is the CGI with the mouth from that one short promotional video but I'm confident they can make it all look right.
Quote from: skhellter on Apr 29, 2017, 09:33:20 AM
I like how you're all arguing that "slipping on the blood was NOT dumb"
(it was kinda like bad slapstick comedy, getting a giggle out of the crowd
in a moment that's supposed to be OMGSCARY!).
but nobody's really arguing against the young neomorphs looking goofy.
;D
It was like watching a young woman wrestling with a cat.
http://lh5.ggpht.com/-8QLcwGQ3Pzo/UV3hioi9gyI/AAAAAAAAUhw/R60no0aWIPk/blad%252520cute%252520cat_thumb%25255B3%25255D.jpg?imgmax=800
how would you have put the scene together to make it better?...from your shallow standpoint of course...lets hear it
Quote from: The_Foxcatcher on May 01, 2017, 01:09:29 PM
This is Piracy!
Master Corporal Hicks, this is not good for your web site's reputation.
To be honest, I thought I had actually removed the link when I first saw the thread. The footage is pretty much everywhere now, unfortunately. That said, I would ask that people don't share links to this footage on the public forum.
Quote from: cucuchu on May 01, 2017, 01:19:14 PM
Quote from: The_Foxcatcher on May 01, 2017, 01:09:29 PM
Quote from: iain on Apr 27, 2017, 08:33:23 PM
*link removed. Please don't share links to this pirated footage in the public boards. Hicks.*
This is Piracy!
Master Corporal Hicks, this is not good for your web site's reputation.
Anyway, saw it (as I thought it was some official promotional release footage).
The landing and entry scene was not as good and/or gorgeous as in Alien and Prometheus. But the whole sequence was good; a much professional approach from the crews was documented.
The Backburster scene was cool and gruesome. Finally, something different. The pacing was perfect. The performances were good. Overall good built-up of suspense and tension.
The Backburster neomorph was truly vicious. I couldn't see the throat burster scene as the clip was too dark.
Not happy to see the crews walking without helmets. Not happy to see the short-cut 'Spore planting neomorph' concept. Anyway, it sure looks like a hardcore horror slasher film.
Will wait for the grand concepts of Prometheus to evolve in future sequels if this doesn't deliver.
Agreed completely. When you can actually see the throat burster, it is actually quite gruesome.
Hopefully the spore planting neomorph concept gets some kind of explanation. The life cycle of neomorphs seems far more efficient if your objective is to kill off people asap. I am really excited to see the adult neomorph. My only concern is the CGI with the mouth from that one short promotional video but I'm confident they can make it all look right.
Actually, it doesn't sound logical biologically. In what way does the spores plant a Neo-morph embryo inside the host? Does the Spore mutate any one of the human organ into a Neo-morph or does it contains a Neo-morph zygote/blast cyst? And then, only if the adult neomorph lay those pods which produces spores, the life cycle would be complete.
BTW, loved the way the neomorph headbanged the glass and broke the way out. I guess it must be the same one from the trailer which tries to break the window above McBride.
Quote from: The_Foxcatcher on May 01, 2017, 02:03:22 PM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 01, 2017, 01:19:14 PM
Quote from: The_Foxcatcher on May 01, 2017, 01:09:29 PM
Quote from: iain on Apr 27, 2017, 08:33:23 PM
*link removed. Please don't share links to this pirated footage in the public boards. Hicks.*
This is Piracy!
Master Corporal Hicks, this is not good for your web site's reputation.
Anyway, saw it (as I thought it was some official promotional release footage).
The landing and entry scene was not as good and/or gorgeous as in Alien and Prometheus. But the whole sequence was good; a much professional approach from the crews was documented.
The Backburster scene was cool and gruesome. Finally, something different. The pacing was perfect. The performances were good. Overall good built-up of suspense and tension.
The Backburster neomorph was truly vicious. I couldn't see the throat burster scene as the clip was too dark.
Not happy to see the crews walking without helmets. Not happy to see the short-cut 'Spore planting neomorph' concept. Anyway, it sure looks like a hardcore horror slasher film.
Will wait for the grand concepts of Prometheus to evolve in future sequels if this doesn't deliver.
Agreed completely. When you can actually see the throat burster, it is actually quite gruesome.
Hopefully the spore planting neomorph concept gets some kind of explanation. The life cycle of neomorphs seems far more efficient if your objective is to kill off people asap. I am really excited to see the adult neomorph. My only concern is the CGI with the mouth from that one short promotional video but I'm confident they can make it all look right.
Actually, it doesn't sound logical biologically. In what way does the spores plant a Neo-morph embryo inside the host? Does the Spore mutate any one of the human organ into a Neo-morph or does it contains a Neo-morph zygote/blast cyst? And then, only if the adult neomorph lay those pods which produces spores, the life cycle would be complete.
BTW, loved the way the neomorph headbanged the glass and broke the way out. I guess it must be the same one from the trailer which tries to break the window above McBride.
I think that one is one of the Xeno's actually that is trying to get to McBride. But yeah, the aliens in this seem much more relentless than what we have seen before.
I suppose the neo-morph lifecycle is not logical based on what we know NOW but hopefully we learn more about it and the origin. I hope it is more than simply black goo getting on some flowers or plants and mutating them.
Yeah - it will be interesting to see how they work the lifecycle of a neomorph. One would imagine that a creature that can find a host so incongruously, gestate/grow so quickly, and be so aggressive at birth, would have dominance over our beloved xeno. Perhaps for all these advantages, the neomorph is weaker, or only lives for a matter of hours etc?
Quote from: Sgt. Shanx on May 01, 2017, 01:27:12 PM
Quote from: skhellter on Apr 29, 2017, 09:33:20 AM
I like how you're all arguing that "slipping on the blood was NOT dumb"
(it was kinda like bad slapstick comedy, getting a giggle out of the crowd
in a moment that's supposed to be OMGSCARY!).
but nobody's really arguing against the young neomorphs looking goofy.
;D
It was like watching a young woman wrestling with a cat.
http://lh5.ggpht.com/-8QLcwGQ3Pzo/UV3hioi9gyI/AAAAAAAAUhw/R60no0aWIPk/blad%252520cute%252520cat_thumb%25255B3%25255D.jpg?imgmax=800
how would you have put the scene together to make it better?...from your shallow standpoint of course...lets hear it
I actually quite liked the scene and have no real complaints at all. The only thing I might change is that she is laying on the ground holding the knife at it. If something that small, on the ground level, was a threat to me, I would probably stand up to give myself the height advantage and make it harder for it to get to my vitals/neck/head area and allow me to punt the damn thing every time it ran at me. Of course I would probably just end up dead within 30 seconds like her but that is the only thing that I might change.
Quote from: The_Foxcatcher on May 01, 2017, 02:03:22 PM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 01, 2017, 01:19:14 PM
Quote from: The_Foxcatcher on May 01, 2017, 01:09:29 PM
Quote from: iain on Apr 27, 2017, 08:33:23 PM
*link removed. Please don't share links to this pirated footage in the public boards. Hicks.*
This is Piracy!
Master Corporal Hicks, this is not good for your web site's reputation.
Anyway, saw it (as I thought it was some official promotional release footage).
The landing and entry scene was not as good and/or gorgeous as in Alien and Prometheus. But the whole sequence was good; a much professional approach from the crews was documented.
The Backburster scene was cool and gruesome. Finally, something different. The pacing was perfect. The performances were good. Overall good built-up of suspense and tension.
The Backburster neomorph was truly vicious. I couldn't see the throat burster scene as the clip was too dark.
Not happy to see the crews walking without helmets. Not happy to see the short-cut 'Spore planting neomorph' concept. Anyway, it sure looks like a hardcore horror slasher film.
Will wait for the grand concepts of Prometheus to evolve in future sequels if this doesn't deliver.
Agreed completely. When you can actually see the throat burster, it is actually quite gruesome.
Hopefully the spore planting neomorph concept gets some kind of explanation. The life cycle of neomorphs seems far more efficient if your objective is to kill off people asap. I am really excited to see the adult neomorph. My only concern is the CGI with the mouth from that one short promotional video but I'm confident they can make it all look right.
Actually, it doesn't sound logical biologically. In what way does the spores plant a Neo-morph embryo inside the host? Does the Spore mutate any one of the human organ into a Neo-morph or does it contains a Neo-morph zygote/blast cyst? And then, only if the adult neomorph lay those pods which produces spores, the life cycle would be complete.
BTW, loved the way the neomorph headbanged the glass and broke the way out. I guess it must be the same one from the trailer which tries to break the window above McBride.
Not sure it's meant to have a complete life cycle where it can reproduce. Perhaps they are mutant aberrations from the black goo used to kill off life and then die off themselves, which maybe David changes/experiments with to create the Alien as we know it with a complete lifecycle. This way it continues on after he is gone without requiring the black goo anymore, which the engineers used to seed life and then eradicate it.
Quote from: The_Foxcatcher on May 01, 2017, 01:09:29 PM
Quote from: iain on Apr 27, 2017, 08:33:23 PM
*link removed. Please don't share links to this pirated footage in the public boards. Hicks.*
This is Piracy!
Master Corporal Hicks, this is not good for your web site's reputation.
Anyway, saw it (as I thought it was some official promotional release footage).
The landing and entry scene was not as good and/or gorgeous as in Alien and Prometheus. But the whole sequence was good; a much professional approach from the crews was documented.
The Backburster scene was cool and gruesome. Finally, something different. The pacing was perfect. The performances were good. Overall good built-up of suspense and tension.
The Backburster neomorph was truly vicious. I couldn't see the throat burster scene as the clip was too dark.
Not happy to see the crews walking without helmets. Not happy to see the short-cut 'Spore planting neomorph' concept. Anyway, it sure looks like a hardcore horror slasher film.
Will wait for the grand concepts of Prometheus to evolve in future sequels if this doesn't deliver.
Ok Now.....Now I realised what was that thing that's making me less excited for the movie:-
Crews without helmets and setting of Earth like green planet. This is what's bugging my subconscious.
I feel the Lack of off-worldly adventure.
The primary Alien movies i.e. Alien (1979) & Prometheus had crews exploring a strange rocky planet with their helmets on! Their slow expedition is what which set the Alien Adventure & the sense of 'darkest corner in the universe'. It also makes the crews look like Astronauts and draws an outlook of hard sci-fi film. Scott also considered Prometheus crews helmets to be big oval ones so the actors' faces remain prominent.
Looking at Alien: Covenant, I can't feel the characters as astronauts. I feel them like mountaineers with hiker bags adventuring for fun (thanks to the bad costumes). I can't feel the extra-planetary adventure. I can't feel it as an 'Alien' film. I can feel it just like AVP1 set in New Zealand forests. Ofcourse, we shall be seeing Engineers' world, Juggernaut, David's experiments etc. But it still doesn't feel like Alien.
^ Yeah, I think that's been bugging me as well. It's interesting to see an Alien movie taking place on an earth-like planet, but at the same time it feels less like Alien.
Quote from: Evanus on May 02, 2017, 12:15:14 PM
^ Yeah, I think that's been bugging me as well. It's interesting to see an Alien movie taking place on an earth-like planet, but at the same time it feels less like Alien.
I do not mind it because of the idea being they are colonists settling a planet. That coupled with this being the Engineer home world (presumeably ). I am guessing this is at a point in the timeline when terraforming has not been perfected to the point it was on Aliens with the "shake and bake" colonies. Keep in mind that
Spoiler
it looks like the final act takes place on the covenant in space
, so it will not all be on that planet.
Quote from: cucuchu on May 02, 2017, 12:37:58 PM
Quote from: Evanus on May 02, 2017, 12:15:14 PM
^ Yeah, I think that's been bugging me as well. It's interesting to see an Alien movie taking place on an earth-like planet, but at the same time it feels less like Alien.
I do not mind it because of the idea being they are colonists settling a planet. That coupled with this being the Engineer home world (presumeably ). I am guessing this is at a point in the timeline when terraforming has not been perfected to the point it was on Aliens with the "shake and bake" colonies. Keep in mind that Spoiler
it looks like the final act takes place on the covenant in space
Yes, but the Covenant crews doesn't know that they are visiting the supposed Engineers' home world. They would have definitely scanned the planet's atmosphere and found it suitable. But Prometheus was pretty bashed by people for having the crews removing their helmets and that too inside a terraformed artificial facility. Again in Prometheus, there was no airborne pathogens which infected the crews, then too, the film was bashed for no reason.
Now, it seems that Covenant Crews not wearing helmets seems to be a ploy just to have 'airborne spores' work!
They could have decided to show the spores circumventing their helmets in some fashion. The facehugger got through Kane's helmet in ALIEN. It was an aesthetic choice. I remember reading Ridley Scott said something about wanting their outfits to age well with the film, or not look outdated later down the line.
Quote from: The_Foxcatcher on May 02, 2017, 12:12:38 PM
Quote from: The_Foxcatcher on May 01, 2017, 01:09:29 PM
Quote from: iain on Apr 27, 2017, 08:33:23 PM
*link removed. Please don't share links to this pirated footage in the public boards. Hicks.*
This is Piracy!
Master Corporal Hicks, this is not good for your web site's reputation.
Anyway, saw it (as I thought it was some official promotional release footage).
The landing and entry scene was not as good and/or gorgeous as in Alien and Prometheus. But the whole sequence was good; a much professional approach from the crews was documented.
The Backburster scene was cool and gruesome. Finally, something different. The pacing was perfect. The performances were good. Overall good built-up of suspense and tension.
The Backburster neomorph was truly vicious. I couldn't see the throat burster scene as the clip was too dark.
Not happy to see the crews walking without helmets. Not happy to see the short-cut 'Spore planting neomorph' concept. Anyway, it sure looks like a hardcore horror slasher film.
Will wait for the grand concepts of Prometheus to evolve in future sequels if this doesn't deliver.
Ok Now.....Now I realised what was that thing that's making me less excited for the movie:-
Crews without helmets and setting of Earth like green planet. This is what's bugging my subconscious.
I feel the Lack of off-worldly adventure.
The primary Alien movies i.e. Alien (1979) & Prometheus had crews exploring a strange rocky planet with their helmets on! Their slow expedition is what which set the Alien Adventure & the sense of 'darkest corner in the universe'. It also makes the crews look like Astronauts and draws an outlook of hard sci-fi film. Scott also considered Prometheus crews helmets to be big oval ones so the actors' faces remain prominent.
Looking at Alien: Covenant, I can't feel the characters as astronauts. I feel them like mountaineers with hiker bags adventuring for fun (thanks to the bad costumes). I can't feel the extra-planetary adventure. I can't feel it as an 'Alien' film. I can feel it just like AVP1 set in New Zealand forests. Ofcourse, we shall be seeing Engineers' world, Juggernaut, David's experiments etc. But it still doesn't feel like Alien.
Imo the characters look better without the "astronaut" look with the big bubble helmets and spandex suits...in both Alien and Aliens we saw the characters in most scenes without this look...and we have seen the dark rocky unstable environments already...i like this fresh take on the setting of the story...lol and just from the trailers and viral marketing i can tell this is far from an AVP like feature...its freakin Ridley Scott man...feels very "Alien" to me mixing some old stuff that worked with some new ideas...cant wait
Exactly that /\... I'm not sure why some people want homogenised films that have to be exactly like their predecessor...
Quote from: Darth Vile on May 02, 2017, 04:30:03 PM
Exactly that /\... I'm not sure why some people want homogenised films that have to be exactly like their predecessor...
I dont need to see exactly what came before this, to say that a Giger-landscape-setting /planet, is one of those rare cases where it's both really OBVIOUS, but also, in a way that
absolutely still works. Usually the OBVIOUS doesnt work and falls flat... If this series doesn't man-up to something like a
Giger-World at some point in the proliferation of it's already lengthy list of extensive sequels, it will remain one of the most sorely missed opportunities in Genre-filmmaking history, IMO.
Yeah, I've never understood the obsession with people not wearing protective gear. It made some sense with Prometheus purely because it was a high tech scientific expedition, but for this film it's pretty weak.
I mean the entire history of human exploration is full of people going to places where they know there are illnesses that kill people but they have no idea how it was transmitted. Take David Livingstone for example, he lived large portions of his adult life in sub-Saharan Africa in full knowledge that malaria was a thing and that people died from it regularly. He even brought his family with him for a while until they couldn't handle the illness anymore.
We know, from looking at the historical behaviour of humans, that people are totally reckless in this field.
It's just a silly criticism.
I also have a problem with people complaining about Millburn's behaviour towards the snake thing (do you really expect me to believe that Charles Darwin never did anything reckless at all during his voyages to collect samples and do detailed drawings of the natural world?) but that's a different topic all together.
Even if Darwin went around treating deadly snakes as if they were puppy dogs (which is a highly dubious claim,) he still wouldn't have been jeopardizing a trillion dollar mission and potentially putting a whole team of people's lives in danger.
Quote from: Predaker on May 02, 2017, 06:11:33 PM
Even if Darwin went around treating deadly snakes as if they were puppy dogs (which is a highly dubious claim,) he still wouldn't have been jeopardizing a trillion dollar mission and potentially putting a whole team of people's lives in danger.
Uhhh, yes he would. And I'm not sure how Millburn putting himself in danger jeopardises the entire expedition.
In a time when they didn't really understand infectious diseases or the natural world in general he had a live giant tortoise as a pet on his boat. Also incidentally the boat was an expensive scientific vessel travelling to far flung places (a lot like the Prometheus).
The equivalent of this in the film would be, if the snake thing wasn't aggressive, Millburn taking it with him and keeping it as a pet on the Prometheus.
Imagine how stupid people would have thought that was.
i could not agree more clowndog. ..he might also be the type tjat axtually has a pet snake or turantula.. .i had those as a kid. .but i am freaked out by worms.. .lol, but yeah i can totally see how many people could respond in mulburns fashion of almost petting the alien. . .he almost did. .he only almost reached towatds it and then backed away. .the way people carry on you would swear he licked it and had anal sex with it. .
Quote from: CainsSon on May 02, 2017, 05:45:32 PM
Quote from: Darth Vile on May 02, 2017, 04:30:03 PM
Exactly that /\... I'm not sure why some people want homogenised films that have to be exactly like their predecessor...
I dont need to see exactly what came before this, to say that a Giger-landscape-setting /planet, is one of those rare cases where it's both really OBVIOUS, but also, in a way that absolutely still works. Usually the OBVIOUS doesnt work and falls flat... If this series doesn't man-up to something like a Giger-World at some point in the proliferation of it's already lengthy list of extensive sequels, it will remain one of the most sorely missed opportunities in Genre-filmmaking history, IMO.
I'm all for a Giger'esque landscape, or 'alien home-world', and I'm assuming that's where it will go in the next film. My point is that a 'good' Alien film doesn't have to be confined by the limitations of the aesthetic established in Alien and Aliens. Now granted, everything that followed thus far has been inferior... but (fingers crossed) it's looking like Covenant will actually be both good
and provide a different aesthetic. That's a win win in my opinion.
Quote from: juxtapose on May 02, 2017, 09:46:58 PM
.. .lol, but yeah i can totally see how many people could respond in mulburns fashion of almost petting the alien. . .he almost did. .
Sure, I mean there are plenty of videos on YouTube of people doing stupid and dangerous things.
Quote from: Darth Vile on May 02, 2017, 09:58:46 PMbut (fingers crossed) it's looking like Covenant will actually be both good and provide a different aesthetic. That's a win win in my opinion.
For real. The giant alien ship over the ancient alien city is legit... if you had waved that in my face 20 years ago you would of been picking bits of my skull out of your teeth :o
Bits of YOUR skull out of... MY teeth? How does THAT work? :-\
The footage was pretty amazing, too bad it was sideways for some godawful reason. (I actually tilted my laptop to watch it) I probably should have resisted the urge to download/watch it, as the throat bursting and backbursting scenes might not have the same effect the second time around, so if you can wait to the theatrical release, I recommend it. Reading descriptions of the footage or watching videos of people's reaction to the footage is still fine, it definitely won't ruin the experience of seeing the actual scenes.
Quote from: Clowndog on May 02, 2017, 05:48:26 PM
I also have a problem with people complaining about Millburn's behaviour towards the snake thing
(https://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/s--vfWZdUk0--/c_fit,fl_progressive,q_80,w_636/18iw0yvf2lklvjpg.jpg)
(https://img.buzzfeed.com/buzzfeed-static/static/2014-03/enhanced/webdr02/11/5/anigif_enhanced-2529-1394531226-4.gif)
Quote from: CoalescedChaos on May 06, 2017, 03:09:16 AM
https://img.buzzfeed.com/buzzfeed-static/static/2014-03/enhanced/webdr02/11/5/anigif_enhanced-2529-1394531226-4.gif
Sadly, Steve Irwin really is the perfect response to the Milburn criticisms. You don't have to understand Irwin's or Milburn's fatal desire, but you do have to accept that people like them exist. And hopefully sympathize rather than judge.
Quote from: Predaker on May 06, 2017, 02:57:16 AM
Quote from: Clowndog on May 02, 2017, 05:48:26 PM
I also have a problem with people complaining about Millburn's behaviour towards the snake thing
(https://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/s--vfWZdUk0--/c_fit,fl_progressive,q_80,w_636/18iw0yvf2lklvjpg.jpg)
(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FICQZzXp.png&hash=1ad23c50b0091bbe3dd63958a3a56fa6900516d4)
Quote from: gantarat on May 06, 2017, 03:23:11 AM
Quote from: Predaker on May 06, 2017, 02:57:16 AM
Quote from: Clowndog on May 02, 2017, 05:48:26 PM
I also have a problem with people complaining about Millburn's behaviour towards the snake thing
(https://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/s--vfWZdUk0--/c_fit,fl_progressive,q_80,w_636/18iw0yvf2lklvjpg.jpg)
http://i.imgur.com/ICQZzXp.png
:laugh:
Quote from: Protozoid on May 06, 2017, 03:18:37 AM
Quote from: CoalescedChaos on May 06, 2017, 03:09:16 AM
https://img.buzzfeed.com/buzzfeed-static/static/2014-03/enhanced/webdr02/11/5/anigif_enhanced-2529-1394531226-4.gif
Sadly, Steve Irwin really is the perfect response to the Milburn criticisms. You don't have to understand Irwin's or Milburn's fatal desire, but you do have to accept that people like them exist. And hopefully sympathize rather than judge.
Not really. Milburn couldn't hold a candle to Irwin (much less a space cobra!) I think it's safe to say he could have learned a thing or two from him.
Also I wasn't aware the
Prometheus was on LV-223 to film a provocative reality TV show.
At least Steve died doing what he loved most. RIP
Fails to demonstrate the enormous amounts of falling, fiery debris from the Prometheus that would INSTANTLY kill anyone it struck.
The only safe path was the one where the Juggernaut was rolling, thus shielding the 2 fleeing characters as the Juggernaut was slowly rolling.
Watch the movie, next time and work out what you would do... There isn't as much choice as you think. Instant death from fiery debris falling from above or the hopeless situation of getting crushed. Shit. I'd hang onto those last few seconds as much as possible - you would, too - and run underneath the rolling Juggernaut.
-Windebieste.
As for Milburn and the mutated worms - yeah, Steve Irwin is not an accurate comparison. Irwin knew exactly what he was dealing with. Venomous snakes he was familiar with and handled them frequently is nothing compared to handling a mutated alien lifeform you know nothing about.
Clearly, Milburn didn't know what the f**k he was doing. That's a big difference.
-Windebieste.
Quote from: windebieste on May 06, 2017, 05:33:09 AM
The only safe path was the one where the Juggernaut was rolling, thus shielding the 2 fleeing characters as the Juggernaut was slowly rolling.
Watch the movie, next time and work out what you would do... There isn't as much choice as you think. Instant death from fiery debris falling from above or the hopeless situation of getting crushed. Shit. I'd hang onto those last few seconds as much as possible - you would, too - and run underneath the rolling Juggernaut.
-Windebieste.
A
Clearly, Milburn didn't know what the f**k he was doing. That's a big difference.
-Windebieste.
This struck me for the 1st time when I rewatched the film as part of the Alien Day event. I took this as more of the illogical motivation that undermines the charactersation in the film. However the debris from the collison is clearly raining down and the only safe path is underneath the juggernaut. There is a number of shots of them both trying run out from its path only to dodge explosions which sends them back undernerath if for safety. That said there is no way Millburn's reaction can be accounted for given his early reaction to discovering the mummified engineers (unless he had taken a few big puffs from Fifield's respirator.)
Did Milburn not shit himself when he saw a dead Engineer earlier in the movie and then suddenly grow a back bone and start playing with an alien snake? Lol.
Inconsistent as well as stupid
. .different people are scared of different things. .i love snakes and i am not scared of spiders. .but i have a weird phobia towards a worm. .earth worms and maggots especially. .so being freaked out by dead bodies and not by an alien cobra like creature makes sense to me. .besides milburn was not the one that was scared of the dead engineer body. .was'nt it fifield?
Quote from: windebieste on May 06, 2017, 05:33:09 AMThere isn't as much choice as you think. Instant death from fiery debris falling from above or the hopeless situation of getting crushed. Shit. I'd hang onto those last few seconds as much as possible - you would, too - and run underneath the rolling Juggernaut.
There is no need to explain it. She was panicked. Made a bad call.
Quote from: Russ840 on May 06, 2017, 11:09:47 AMDid Milburn not shit himself when he saw a dead Engineer earlier in the movie and then suddenly grow a back bone and start playing with an alien snake?
Milburn did not shit himself. Fifield wigged out at the dead engineer and Milburn went along because he had a man crush. They were both idiots. Made a few bad calls.
Does Faris call the neomorph a f**ker before she shoots it? LOL
I think it was "Bugger".
Cause you know, British accent.
She doesn't have one.
Well she seemed to have one when she said that.
Speaking of British accents, has anyone noticed how Carmen Ejogo has one in the film but doesn't in Last Supper?
. .said this before, vickers dies cause she tripped. .running in a straight line had nothing to do with it. .the derelickt shielded them from the flaming debris like someone else pointed out earlier in this thread. .so it was actually safer to run in a straight line. .
Quote from: Anthony on May 08, 2017, 03:55:27 AM
Well she seemed to have one when she said that.
Speaking of British accents, has anyone noticed how Carmen Ejogo has one in the film but doesn't in Last Supper?
I have not noticed Karine having Ejogo's accent except when Ejogo gets excited and seems to strain to hold it back.
Quote from: Protozoid on May 06, 2017, 03:18:37 AMSadly, Steve Irwin really is the perfect response to the Milburn criticisms.
Irwin never walked up to an aggressive cobra and poked it in the face, as far as I'm aware.