David did not kill Shaw

[Elmazalman]

If you understood what he meant then what I said followed on pretty naturally from that. He poisoned Holloway in accordance with his programming. Pretty prickish trying to do.

He was a prick from the start. Orders or not. His creator put him in his place by ordering him to make him a cup of tea, or whatever it was. That was my point.

[SiL]

He was a prick from the start. Orders or not. His creator put him in his place by ordering him to make him a cup of tea, or whatever it was. That was my point.

I really don't get what your point is. David was never malfunctioning or damaged, he was operating as designed. His designers maybe didn't appreciate the implications of what they designed, but clearly, he was made with an ability to be a prick built in.

[Elmazalman]

He was a prick from the start. Orders or not. His creator put him in his place by ordering him to make him a cup of tea, or whatever it was. That was my point.

I really don't get what your point is. David was never malfunctioning or damaged, he was operating as designed. His designers maybe didn't appreciate the implications of what they designed, but clearly, he was made with an ability to be a prick built in.

That's what I said. The "prick" attitude was there from the start.

[SiL]

You called it damaged. It wasn't damaged, it was by design.

[Elmazalman]

You called it damaged. It wasn't damaged, it was by design.

Yes, I meant "damaged" in that the negative attitude/opinion he had of human beings was there from the beginning - he wasn't ordered to be a (dangerous) prick - he already was. He did unnerve his creator, hence the little lesson on pouring tea.

[OpenMaw]

Yes. Damaged, as in "emotionally" damaged.

I would argue though that some of Covenant colors Prometheus. My take away from Prometheus was not that David was nefarious, per se, but under the leash of a nefarious individual. Covenant reframes it that both are the case.

One of my favorite touches in the Holloway conversation was that David essentially asks him (unknowingly for Holloway, of course) for permission. "What would you be willing to do?" "Anything and everything." *insert Hannibal Lector mouthing "thank you."*

By the time of Covenant its pretty clear that David has something akin to an Android personality disorder. He's really off the deep end, getting details wrong, lying and seemingly believing his own lies, until he doesn't.

The "damage" may have been in the design, but I think also literally taking a hit to the dome and being put back together with scotch tape and Elmer's glue did him no favors.

[SM]

The only point when it could be argued David is damaged - by any definition- is when he misattributes Ozymandias.

When he pulling shit on Holloway or bombing Engineers he's fine.

[OpenMaw]

The only point when it could be argued David is damaged - by any definition- is when he misattributes Ozymandias.

You only need one. David should have encyclopedic knowledge. He doesn't, because he's damaged.

Not by any definition, no. His instability in the way he relates to Walter, and his delighted sadism towards Daniels, and Oram, are also indications of him being a damaged being. There are two definitions being used here, and they both apply to David by the end of Covenant, they do not both apply until after David gets his head taken off.

[Oasis Nadrama]

David didn't simply kill Shaw, he did worse: he turned her into some kind of biological abomination, to the point where we do not even know, in this mess, if her corpse is dissected or not.

How do you know he was programmed to be a prick?

He was programmed by Weyland. I would be more surprised if he wasn't programmed to be a prick.

[The_Foxcatcher]

David didn't simply kill Shaw, he did worse: he turned her into some kind of biological abomination, to the point where we do not even know, in this mess, if her corpse is dissected or not.

https://www.avpgalaxy.net/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2023/12/what-happened-to-elizabeth-shaw-01-701x291.jpg

How do you know he was programmed to be a prick?

He was programmed by Weyland. I would be more surprised if he wasn't programmed to be a prick.

If Shaw died a natural death, David would have very well done this to her body in his desperate attempt to revive/clone/replicate her in someway.

How do you explain the Memorial Stone Plaque which he made and his tears while laying flowers on it or the tears while he deployed the Black goo or the tears while sitting & playing Prometheus theme music in front of her photo?

He was very rational and firm in his opinions and not a person who'd love and miss a person whom he would kill.

[Oasis Nadrama]

I think David was an already negative figure in Prometheus (albeit an ambiguous one, he certainly had justifications behind his actions and a kind of "moral code") but in Alien: Covenant he has turned entirely satanic.

His behavior turn destructive, exploitative, predatory.

He didn't turn Shaw into a horrible biological experience despite his love, respect and fascination for her, he turned Shaw into a horrible biological experience BECAUSE of his love, respect and fascination for her.






Look at the way he's acting towards Daniels, too. It's just the same.

When it comes to "heterosexuality" (big commas, because the gender politics around David are all over the place), David develops a kind of passionate admiration for strong and smart women with an undying survival instinct. They are his "type", so to speak.

But David does not know how to materialize this attraction in any other way than instrumentalization/consumption/destruction.

He's fundamentally immature, he's unable to value the existence, freedom and social ties of the woman he focuses on, he simply has this urge to turn her into his thing.

[The_Foxcatcher]

I think David was an already negative figure in Prometheus (albeit an ambiguous one, he certainly had justifications behind his actions and a kind of "moral code") but in Alien: Covenant he has turned entirely satanic.

His behavior turn destructive, exploitative, predatory.

He didn't turn Shaw into a horrible biological experience despite his love, respect and fascination for her, he turned Shaw into a horrible biological experience BECAUSE of his love, respect and fascination for her.



https://static0.gamerantimages.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2023/05/alien-covenant-ending-david.jpg

Look at the way he's acting towards Daniels, too. It's just the same.

When it comes to "heterosexuality" (big commas, because the gender politics around David are all over the place), David develops a kind of passionate admiration for strong and smart women with an undying survival instinct. They are his "type", so to speak.

But David does not know how to materialize this attraction in any other way than instrumentalization/consumption/destruction.

He's fundamentally immature, he's unable to value the existence, freedom and social ties of the woman he focuses on, he simply has this urge to turn her into his thing.

For David, Elizabeth Shaw was the only love - a Digital Commitment to one Person. I can imagine, if Shaw hadn't died in spaceship, David wouldn't have killed the humanoids on the Planet 4 and would simply follow Shaw's course of action.

For him, rest of the world equalled to Weyland.

Now...there's this logic of Upbringing. He was brought up in Weyland Corp's corporate ulterior environment with Offsprings/Next generations (Vickers) wanting to secure their parents position in the company...and hence the idea seeded in him that....all children WANT their parents dead' - So he has already learned the selfish side of the world and he also knows the morals and he also knows that entire Humanity as a whole is in the verge of extinction (destroying Earth's eco-system, capitalism and migration to new habitats after the very same corporate giants destroyed the planet and are well-off to control the population)

DAVID REALISED WHAT THE ENGINEERS REALISED. - The mistake in their design.

For David, the love was: Shaw Minus rest of the humans whom he see as corrections. Because, for David, Shaw was a Pure Soul....always...within his broad yet limited Vision.

[Xenomrph]

The only point when it could be argued David is damaged - by any definition- is when he misattributes Ozymandias.

When he pulling shit on Holloway or bombing Engineers he's fine.

In the script I believe the Ozymandias misidentification plays out a little differently - if I remember right, Walter doesn't correct David, but instead privately reveals it to Daniels and says "David is damaged, this is just one symptom of a larger problem" or something like that.

Like he's just following orders in Prometheus, but in Covenant he's committing genocide, freely letting people get killed, doing gross experiments, I'm pretty sure all of that is outside the scope of his original programming; thus, "damaged".
However him expanding outside the scope of his programming is kind of the point of the movie; he might be "damaged", but he's acting more human (therefore humans are also "damaged").

[Immortan Jonesy]

I like to think that it was a stormy and tragic relationship like that of H.R Giger and Li Tobler🥀