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Posted by irn
 - May 01, 2020, 11:50:32 AM
Quote from: Nightmare Asylum on Apr 30, 2020, 08:24:28 PM
I am curious about what Blomkamp/Ed Neumeier's Robocop Returns would have been, as that franchise feels like something much more suited to Blomkamp's style.

Defintely. It's a shame that he left the project. Blomkamp entering the Alien series raised some concerns but Robocop is something that could really benefit from him.
Posted by Nightmare Asylum
 - Apr 30, 2020, 08:24:28 PM
I still remain more curious about what Blomkamp's pre-Ripley pitch was, before his conversion with Sigourney on the set of Chappie.

And even more than that, I am curious about what Blomkamp/Ed Neumeier's Robocop Returns would have been, as that franchise feels like something much more suited to Blomkamp's style.
Posted by OpenMaw
 - Apr 30, 2020, 07:39:03 PM
Quote from: SiL on Apr 30, 2020, 01:28:09 AM
If you factor in inflation it took until Prometheus for a movie to earn more than Alien even with increasing budgets (again, adjusted for inflation). It's been diminishing returns almost all the way down.

But all of this is truly besides the point of what the post was about in the first place. I get it. AvP maybe didn't earn as much if you factor in a bunch of shit. Whatever. The point was that it was still a financial successful and didn't have Marines. Can we move the f**k on already?


When you factor in a bunch of the important details it wasn't that successful, that's my point. I certainly wasn't trying to atagonise, you Sil. I'm just saying, If we're going to measure a films financial success as the ultimate success, you have to factor in inflation, the time of release, the state of the economy, and what the competition was.  AvP's lack of success is why AvP:R was a borderline direct-to-dvd release and skirted by teetering on that edge of absolute schlock.

I am both disagreeing and agreeing. Absolutely true, the marines are not a marker for success. AvP wasn't the marine-absent success to hold up as proof of that, though. The real truth is, we haven't had that success yet.

One last thing on financial success in this series. The only reason Prometheus strikes so high is "Director Ridley Scott returns to Alien franchise" being all over the place. HUGE, TOWERING, UNBELIEVABLE hype. Everybody was going to see that movie.

I don't think success is objectively measured in financial gain, though. If we're talking engaging, enduring, fun, exciting, intelligent stories... Then, yeah, the last time we had a truly great, well-crafted film in this series with a coherent plot, relatable characters, and a solid beginning, middle and, end. It was the one with the marines.

Alien 3 is a beautifully shot mess. Resurrection is a joke. AVP and AVP:R are boring and trashy. Prometheus, meanders beautifully. Alien Covenant is what Alien could have been if directed by someone other than Ridley Scott, ironically enough.

The only way for us to know if Neill Blomkamp would have been a genuine success is to actually see what he wrote. Who knows, if he was inspired and passionate enough about the project he might have had a brilliant pitch that would have revitalized the whole franchise and been the next great movie in the franchise after Aliens...

...I wouldn't bet on that one, though.
Posted by 𝔗𝔥𝔢 𝔈𝔦𝔤𝔥𝔱𝔥 𝔓𝔞𝔰𝔰𝔢𝔫𝔤𝔢𝔯
 - Apr 30, 2020, 03:24:12 PM
Oh, nobody's denying that AvP didn't make money (Marines or no), we were just pointing out that it certainly wasn't "the most successful Alien or Predator film on release".

I suspect you were just trying to fudge the numbers so you can get to make that new AvP flick. Yeah, don't you deny it!  :P



Posted by SiL
 - Apr 30, 2020, 01:28:09 AM
Quote from: OpenMaw on Apr 30, 2020, 12:58:02 AM
Not when you factor in inflation.
If you factor in inflation it took until Prometheus for a movie to earn more than Alien even with increasing budgets (again, adjusted for inflation). It's been diminishing returns almost all the way down.

But all of this is truly besides the point of what the post was about in the first place. I get it. AvP maybe didn't earn as much if you factor in a bunch of shit. Whatever. The point was that it was still a financial successful and didn't have Marines. Can we move the f**k on already?
Posted by Rankles75
 - Apr 30, 2020, 01:26:31 AM
Quote from: 426Buddy on Apr 29, 2020, 09:39:47 PM
That trailer for prometheus still the best ever

Never watched a film trailer so much in my life! Oh, what could have been...
Posted by OpenMaw
 - Apr 30, 2020, 12:58:02 AM
Quote from: SiL on Apr 29, 2020, 09:05:13 PM

True, but it was a substantially bigger budget. And at the last, it was a financial success without colonial marines.

Not when you factor in inflation. AVP was not a rip roaring success in the same way that Alien and Aliens had been. That's why AVPR was given such a low budget. Paul Anderson did one thing right on AVP. He made it look like money. It really wasn't, though.
Posted by SiL
 - Apr 29, 2020, 11:46:31 PM
Quote from: The Eighth Passenger on Apr 29, 2020, 09:35:45 PM
Wikipedia has Aliens' production budget at $17–18 million and the box office at $131.3–183.3 million.
Box Office Mojo lists earnings as $131M from release. The extra is probably re-releases.

Quotebut when you reckon in it's huge production and advertising budget (plus inflation) it's performance isn't that impressive.
The average Marvel film "only" makes back 4-5 times its budget, but when your budget is $200 million, nobody's arguing The Blair Witch Project or Paranormal Activity were greater successes.
Posted by 426Buddy
 - Apr 29, 2020, 09:39:47 PM
That trailer for prometheus still the best ever
Posted by 𝔗𝔥𝔢 𝔈𝔦𝔤𝔥𝔱𝔥 𝔓𝔞𝔰𝔰𝔢𝔫𝔤𝔢𝔯
 - Apr 29, 2020, 09:35:45 PM
Quote from: SiL on Apr 29, 2020, 09:05:13 PM
Alien almost did, Aliens didn't. Its estimated budget was $18.5 million, earnings $130m.

Wikipedia has Aliens' production budget at $17–18 million and the box office at $131.3–183.3 million. Given Hollywood accounting I'd say the $17 million production budget and the 183.3 million box office is probably closest to the mark. Either way, it still far outperformed AvP.

QuoteTrue, but it was a substantially bigger budget. And at the last, it was a financial success without colonial marines.

Not that much bigger when you adjust the production budget for inflation. And even then the box office takings was still similar to Aliens without adjusting for inflation (which would make a big difference over a period of 18 years).

One could argue that Prometheus was the most successful film of all considering it made $403.4 million, but when you reckon in it's huge production and advertising budget (plus inflation) it's performance isn't that impressive.
Posted by Nightmare Asylum
 - Apr 29, 2020, 09:12:03 PM
Quote from: irn on Apr 29, 2020, 05:23:55 PM
Quote from: Immortan Jonesy on Apr 29, 2020, 01:19:37 PM
And as I pointed out before, after Cameron's sequel the Colonial Marines reached a "cult status" among the fans, to so to speak.

It's a unique thing to have a sequel be what defines a film series and even crazier that James Cameron managed it twice: Aliens with the guns blazing Colonial Marines, and Terminator 2 with the good guy T-800.

I'd make the argument that the "guns blazing Colonial Marines" concept has really only defined the franchise outside of the films (and even then, most of the best recent Alien EU properties [this being my opinion of course - I'm referring to Isolation, The Cold Forge, and Phalanx] have not used that concept). In terms of the film franchise proper, Aliens really didn't set the course for further Colonial Marines stories at all, and as it stands today in 2020, it is still the only film out of the six to utilize that concept at all.
Posted by SiL
 - Apr 29, 2020, 09:05:13 PM
Quote from: The Eighth Passenger on Apr 29, 2020, 04:00:03 PM
How do you figure that?
As in it made the most at the time.

QuoteAlien and Aliens made back approx X10 their budget at the box office.
Alien almost did, Aliens didn't. Its estimated budget was $18.5 million, earnings $130m.

QuoteAlien vs Predator only made back about x3 times it's budget.
True, but it was a substantially bigger budget. And at the last, it was a financial success without colonial marines.
Posted by Perfect-Organism
 - Apr 29, 2020, 07:34:40 PM
Quote from: Janek on Apr 18, 2020, 02:04:35 PM
Blomkamp has directed no feature film since Chappie and has only been doing shorts. He was never the correct man to lead the Alien franchise to new heights. Im not saying that AC was a breakthrough though.

AC was more of a breakdown.

The shorts look great.  I say let the man have a crack at the Aliens sequel, but please, no Ripley in an Alien suit.
Posted by irn
 - Apr 29, 2020, 05:23:55 PM
Quote from: Immortan Jonesy on Apr 29, 2020, 01:19:37 PM
And as I pointed out before, after Cameron's sequel the Colonial Marines reached a "cult status" among the fans, to so to speak.

It's a unique thing to have a sequel be what defines a film series and even crazier that James Cameron managed it twice: Aliens with the guns blazing Colonial Marines, and Terminator 2 with the good guy T-800.
Posted by 𝔗𝔥𝔢 𝔈𝔦𝔤𝔥𝔱𝔥 𝔓𝔞𝔰𝔰𝔢𝔫𝔤𝔢𝔯
 - Apr 29, 2020, 04:00:03 PM
Ridley also said:

Quote"We have Neill Blomkamp's Alien, which will be out in 2017. We just have the first [screenplay] draft in so far but it looks pretty good."

https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/index.php?topic=53386.msg2079840#msg2079840





Quote from: SiL on Apr 29, 2020, 12:53:32 AM
AvP was the most successful Alien or Predator film on release.

How do you figure that?

Alien and Aliens made back approx X10 their budget at the box office.
Predator made back just over x5 times it's budget.
Alien vs Predator only made back about x3 times it's budget.
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