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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2_GWJ1qbSf0#ws (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2_GWJ1qbSf0#ws)

In this special edition, Actor, Artist, Lance Henriksen comes on the show to talk about his film career including his newest project, Harbinger Down. Lance also talks about his Comic Book and his Pottery Art.

Kind of surprised she didn't discuss Alien vs. Predator with Lance, considering he played a particularly big part in the movie but I am somewhat more surprised she chose to speak to him about Prometheus,  a film he had nothing to do with.

not a bad interview, i laughed at the pumpkin head 3 stuff

Glad Lance still has all his wits and contributes accordingly!

Can't say I disagree with his response. Would have liked to hear his own views on the differing Weyland portrayals.

Quote from: FiorinaFury161 on Sep 11, 2014, 05:39:12 PM
Glad Lance still has all his wits and contributes accordingly!

Indeed - the man is a class act and he clearly loves to tell a good anecdote or two from his time on various movie productions.

As for them not talking AvP, well who cares? That film had very little of interest to contribute to the Alien-side of anything AvP universe related anyway. It was much more interesting (imo) to hear his opinion on the various iterations and film portrayals of android characters. Some of his critique on Prometheus is spot-on as well.

Tbh, it would be surprising if he did love Prometheus; Lance Henriksen has worked with James Cameron on more than one occasion so I sense that Prometheus isn't exactly his style of film.  Plus, I think it's pretty clear that Prometheus was never meant to be a true Alien film at all, but a movie masquerading as a "spin-off" simply to attract more viewers.  For example, if you re-named or re-sketched all the characters, logos, designs, in the movie that connected it to Alien then the film would be completely different, you can't do that with any of the Alien movies, even the AVP movies; if you look at Alien vs. Hunter, people have said multiple times that it's an obvious rip of AVPR.  I think the fact that the producers have said Prometheus 2 will have even FEWER connections to Alien further drives in my point.

I thought the interview was very good. 8) She was well prepared and was genuinely a fan. He was taken aback with her knowing of his hung over knife scene re-shoot. ;)

I remember someone posting in the ALIENS Exposed thread how board he looked on that panel. She didn't repeat the same stale questions. I liked his insite on going back to his childhood to form the Bishop personality.

5 stars! * * * * *

Quote from: predxeno on Sep 11, 2014, 09:07:17 PM
Tbh, it would be surprising if he did love Prometheus; Lance Henriksen has worked with James Cameron on more than one occasion so I sense that Prometheus isn't exactly his style of film.  Plus, I think it's pretty clear that Prometheus was never meant to be a true Alien film at all, but a movie masquerading as a "spin-off" simply to attract more viewers.  For example, if you re-named or re-sketched all the characters, logos, designs, in the movie that connected it to Alien then the film would be completely different, you can't do that with any of the Alien movies, even the AVP movies; if you look at Alien vs. Hunter, people have said multiple times that it's an obvious rip of AVPR.  I think the fact that the producers have said Prometheus 2 will have even FEWER connections to Alien further drives in my point.

Well, I didn't read his comments and opinion on Prometheus as hinging on how close it connects to ALIEN/ALIENS. I heard him express how he feels that the film to some extent drowns in the bigger ideas, while neglecting the aspects that makes films feel 'real' and relatable to him. Hence why he didn't really know what he was supposed to feel about it after leaving the theater.

What he says about the character of Vickers is also very true. Her arc in the story (motives, actions, family issues etc) seems very diffuse. Is she a protagonist? An antagonist? A supporting character? Even I am in doubt.

QuoteFor example, if you re-named or re-sketched all the characters, logos, designs, in the movie that connected it to Alien then the film would be completely different

:laugh:

If you change Weyland to another name and change the Derelict and Jockey to another kind of extraterrestrial - it's still precisely the same film.

I probably didn't make myself clear in my earlier post, yes, it's the same film but the problem is it can still function as one.  As I said earlier, if you renamed other films in the series then fans will immediately point to the original source and label it as a rip off, but if you do the same with Prometheus then it still stands as its own story unconnected to the others; I think this goes to show that the movie isn't a genuine story told for the Alien franchise rather than a shallow developed tale made to piggyback on the success of the former. 

What makes Prometheus especially shallow is the fact that it was never created to be its own story but an obvious attempt to start a new trilogy; all the questions asked in the trailer such as why were we created and what happens when we die aren't answered but are left open for the SEQUEL to deal with.  All in all, Prometheus is a story most fans can  easily predict from the beginning; crew lands on planet, crew gets killed by aliens, alien tries to destroy earth, humans save the day, with only one question answered (who created us?) which is immediately answered in the film's trailers rather than the film itself.

Quote from: Eva on Sep 11, 2014, 08:45:39 PM
As for them not talking AvP, well who cares? That film had very little of interest to contribute to the Alien-side of anything AvP universe related anyway.

One could arguably level that accusation at 'Prometheus', too. They're as valid as one another. The first of the AVPs even more so, since he was actually, y'know... In it. :)

Quote from: predxeno on Sep 11, 2014, 09:07:17 PM
Tbh, it would be surprising if he did love Prometheus; Lance Henriksen has worked with James Cameron on more than one occasion so I sense that Prometheus isn't exactly his style of film.

What's that got to do with the price of fish? He's worked with tons of people of all different stripes.

Lance Henriksen and me both have very similar feelings on the film Prometheus tbh, personally I thought the film was just too ambiguous and the meaning of the story not firmly set into place. 

All of the movies (and games ;)) I saw Lance Henriksen in were pretty much straight to the point; yes, not all of them may have been popular but I felt I could understand the characters and why they were doing what they did than I could in Prometheus.  For me, the character of Elizabeth Shaw was perhaps the most confusing character to understand and she's the film's star.

QuoteI think this goes to show that the movie isn't a genuine story told for the Alien franchise

Intentionally so.  They were going to do something more tied to Alien with the Engineers script, and they ended up moving away from that.

Fair enough, but I think if they did something like that then they should have made their own standalone film rather than stay tied down to an old one.  A:CM is a better Alien story than Prometheus simply because it features actual Aliens and Prometheus 2 is promised to have fewer Alien references than the first one. 

Couple this with the fact that Scott paid no heed to the canon to either the AVP films nor Alien films (including his own), this shows how little Scott cares about his 1979 "masterpiece".  Scott is making his own story and ignoring all the rules, when the time comes to contradict his own title, you can bet he'll trade the old for the new.

QuoteFair enough, but I think if they did something like that then they should have made their own standalone film rather than stay tied down to an old one.

That's what they did.  Ridley wanted to explore the Jockey, and used it as a springboard to something else.

QuoteA:CM is a better Alien story than Prometheus simply because it features actual Aliens and Prometheus 2 is promised to have fewer Alien references than the first one.  Couple this with the fact that Scott paid no heed to the canon to either the AVP films nor Alien films (including his own), this shows how little Scott cares about his 1979 "masterpiece".

As difficult as it is to ignore the first sentence - Riddles didn't need nor want to reference AvP.  And what did he ignore about Alien - a film about which he obviously cares very much.

Scott ignored his own style set in his original film; one of the unique elements that Alien had was its idea that the future wasn't some glamorous place with shiny starships, but a place where many of today's problems still exist; bad machinery and wage issues.  One of the elements that Alien: Isolation will have is the retro-technology look that the first film had, but Prometheus is the opposite of that and features that bright shiny future that is so unlike the Alien films.  This is a small detail, true, but it's the small details that show how much the director cares about the film. 

Movies like Terminator 3 and 4 and Silent Hill: Revelation failed because the new directors didn't care about the themes nor the symbolism present in the previous films and therefore created a new film that was completely lacking in those areas.  This is what Ridley Scott did with Prometheus; he set a dark and rusty world in Alien and then proceeded to take it away in Prometheus.  This shows that either 1) he did even care for his original work enough to realize he was doing this or 2) he did realize this but chose to sacrifice the older look for a newer one to entice a wider audience rather than appease his longtime fans.

As has been said ad nauseum - Nostromo is a battered old tug that's almost falling apart; Prometheus is a brand new corporate flagship.

That's a retcon explanation, it can work but fans shouldn't have to retcon stories in; as with EU the same will apply to Prometheus.  Do you really think in the future, spaceships will keep that retro look or go for a more modern one?  There's no reason even an old tugboat would have that look unless it was the look all spaceships had.

Quote[Arthur Max] said that he wanted "to do something that was state-of-the-art, which would represent a flagship spacecraft with every technology required to probe into the deepest corners of the galaxy."

Quote from: predxeno on Sep 12, 2014, 01:42:22 AM
That's a retcon explanation, it can work but fans shouldn't have to retcon stories in; as with EU the same will apply to Prometheus.  Do you really think in the future, spaceships will keep that retro look or go for a more modern one?  There's no reason even an old tugboat would have that look unless it was the look all spaceships had.

It might be a "retcon", but it's a fairly plausible one.
I'm not going to deny that it causes a pretty jarring disconnect between Prometheus and the Alien movies, though.

I read the Alien: Isolation prequel comic and if I remember correctly, the Sevastopol is supposed to be one of the most advanced space stations created by mankind yet it uses retro-technology 35 years after Alien (I don't know how many years after Prometheus).

It's set 15 years after Alien and the station is being decommissioned.  Meaning it's a similar vintage to the Nostromo - though obviously the station was at it's current location after 2122.

And how do design choices in a video game based on Alien have anything to do with Ridley Scott?

Sorry, must have got confused with Out of the Shadows; it's relevant however because an entire space station is quite a different thing than an old tugboat.

And that's relevant to Riddles design choices on Prometheus how?

Because Ridley Scott could have easily have peered into the future while doing Prometheus..
and seen the designs for Alien Isolation.

DUH.

(https://i.chzbgr.com/maxW500/4618377472/h97BFBED4/)

It's an inconsistency, a plot contradiction as you guys like to put it; I can never get how this doesn't bother you but flaws in other movies like AVPR could.

Dat good old AVPR with its Rasfatari Xenomorph.

You betta not be hatin' on da Requiem, babylon!

Quote from: predxeno on Sep 12, 2014, 02:46:52 AM
It's an inconsistency, a plot contradiction as you guys like to put it; I can never get how this doesn't bother you but flaws in other movies like AVPR could.

I can never get the straws at which you clutch in utter futility to make a non existant argument.

There was a deliberate decision taken by Riddles to differentiate Nostromo and Prometheus.  Max outlined the reasoning.

To suggest it's somehow Ridley's fault that there might be inconsistencies between Prometheus and a video game he had nothing to do with, is asinine.

Can you forward me to a source on this "deliberate decision"?  This is the first I'm hearing if it.

...
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.....slams head on keyboard....


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Oops.

Guess all that concept art for the film was done by accident.

I meant deliberate proof that Ridley Scott knew he was deviating from the style of Alien, if all you have is concept art then I'm not impressed.

Quote from: predxeno on Sep 12, 2014, 03:14:45 AM
I meant deliberate proof that Ridley Scott knew he was deviating from the style of Alien, if all you have is concept art then I'm not impressed.

I'm gonna have to go with SM on this one, I'm pretty sure Ridley Scott knew what he was doing.

Quote from: predxeno on Sep 12, 2014, 03:14:45 AM
I meant deliberate proof that Ridley Scott knew he was deviating from the style of Alien, if all you have is concept art then I'm not impressed.

So the guy makes a movie with a deliberately old and battered tug as a reaction to things like Star Trek; then 30 years later he makes another movie, with a spaceship with a very different use and context - and he doesn't know what he's doing?

I've seen a lot of directors who claim to know what they're doing but turn out not to, I don't give special credit when it isn't due.  Would you have defended Paul Anderson when he was making AVP or even the Strause Brothers when they were making AVPR?

Depends - what am I defending them about?

Perhaps eggbarfing.  Either way it's not important, I honestly don't see Ridley Scott seeing Alien as anything more than a cheap way to 2x Prometheus's viewing audience.

That would only make sense if Prometheus had started unrelated to Alien and then been shoehorned into a connection.

It's not like there's any connection now though, anything that has been given isn't something that would firmly make it a story belonging into the Alien series (outside of a small easter egg scene) and the sequel is promised to have even fewer references; to me, this is Ridley Scott throwing away the Alien franchise for something else and just using it as a cheap marketing scheme.

:D

Quote from: SiL on Sep 12, 2014, 06:54:55 AM
That would only make sense if Prometheus had started unrelated to Alien and then been shoehorned into a connection.

To be fair, there was enough waffling back and forth early on in production as to whether or not Prometheus should be an Alien prequel (and to what degree) that one could argue that that was essentially the case. :P
I remember there being discussions on this very forum as to whether or not 'Prometheus' would actually be an Alien series movie, and if there'd be a subforum for it if it wasn't.

I'm of the opinion that Prometheus' connections to 'Alien' don't do either movie any favors, and Prometheus would have been a much more interesting movie had it ditched all overt connections to 'Alien' and done its own thing. Connecting to 'Alien' absolutely felt like a way to drive up ticket sales by capitalizing on that sweet, sweet built-in 'Alien' franchise $$$$$$$$$.

^Exactly my point, Prometheus would have been an interesting enough story without the unnecessary Alien tie-in.

QuotePerhaps eggbarfing.

Indefensible.

Quote from: predxeno on Sep 12, 2014, 07:19:59 AM
It's not like there's any connection now though, anything that has been given isn't something that would firmly make it a story belonging into the Alien series (outside of a small easter egg scene) and the sequel is promised to have even fewer references; to me, this is Ridley Scott throwing away the Alien franchise for something else and just using it as a cheap marketing scheme.

Despite the fact it features the guy who created the Company everyone works for in the Alien films.  And oh yeah, one of those big guys in the chair from Alien.

lol "small easter egg".

I understand you don't like it that Prometheus did a big poo on the Weyland continuity of AvP, but your arguments lack any sort of coherence.  What happened to "everything is canon" and you can make it all work?

First off, everything IS canon and I can make it all work.  Secondly, my point isn't to decanon-ify Prometheus but to point out how lazily fuzed it was into the Alien franchise; as I said, if you re-name all the characters and such then it easily becomes its own film, there's nothing uniquely Alien about it.

They intentionally moved away from Alien - but kept the Space Jockeys.

You've already tried that argument and it too, held no water.  On any level.

lance also praised paul ws anderson for avp. he would be singing a different tune if he had been cast in ridley scotts movie . $!

Quote from: worldpeace on Sep 12, 2014, 08:07:57 AM
lance also praised paul ws anderson for avp. he would be singing a different tune if he had been cast in ridley scotts movie . $!

Prometheus is a better movie on a technical level, but there are absolutely things that AvP does better than Prometheus (which is extra funny since they're both essentially telling the same story - people exploring the origins of mankind and not liking what they find).

Not that it matters anymore but I just looked up the Sevastopol on Google and it seems that the only reason it was decommissioned in the first place was because of the Xenomorph, not because it had outdated technology like you implied, SM.

Quote from: predxeno on Sep 12, 2014, 08:23:39 AM
Not that it matters anymore but I just looked up the Sevastopol on Google and it seems that the only reason it was decommissioned in the first place was because of the Xenomorph, not because it had outdated technology like you implied, SM.

Even I'm not sure on that one, the prequel comic makes it pretty clear it was being shut down prior to the events of the game (which is a convenient explanation as to why it's not crawling with hundreds of civilians and children and stuff during the events of the game).

Really?  Where does it say that?  Last I read, the station intercom was still bragging about how successful the station was in modern times.

Quote from: predxeno on Sep 12, 2014, 08:23:39 AM
Not that it matters anymore but I just looked up the Sevastopol on Google and it seems that the only reason it was decommissioned in the first place was because of the Xenomorph, not because it had outdated technology like you implied, SM.

I implied no such thing.

what do you think avp did better? besides having aliens and predators ????? i tried but cant think of anything else.

Quote from: Xenomrph on Sep 12, 2014, 08:11:53 AM

Quote from: worldpeace on Sep 12, 2014, 08:07:57 AM
lance also praised paul ws anderson for avp. he would be singing a different tune if he had been cast in ridley scotts movie . $!

Prometheus is a better movie on a technical level, but there are absolutely things that AvP does better than Prometheus (which is extra funny since they're both essentially telling the same story - people exploring the origins of mankind and not liking what they find).

Just to clarify few things Prometheus is not an ALIEN/ALIENS movie. It's called Prometheus for  a REASON. The movie tackles greater ideas i.e. bio eng., evolution, religion and is not about a monster in space.
And most importantly, it's not typial spin off since it's part of the canon. People have to get over this fact and that alien/aliens is a actually a part of prometheus timeline. The whole of alien/aliens and WY interactions can be seen as attempts of reverse engineering. Without going into to much detail, prometheus was not bad but it was done the way it was to give 'them' more room for story bending later...quite typical but what can you do. It belongs to Ridley, all we can do is sit back amd appreciate his ideas...they're his in the end.

Quote from: predxeno on Sep 12, 2014, 03:14:45 AM
I meant deliberate proof that Ridley Scott knew he was deviating from the style of Alien, if all you have is concept art then I'm not impressed.

Watch the Furious Gods documentary, documenting how Ridley and his collaboraters came up with the final synopsis for what Prometheus would become. No need to dust up a bunch of pre-release quotes, interviews etc when you can just watch that one thing.

Quote from: worldpeace on Sep 12, 2014, 09:19:02 AM
what do you think avp did better? besides having aliens and predators ????? i tried but cant think of anything else.

Quote from: Xenomrph on Sep 12, 2014, 08:11:53 AM

Quote from: worldpeace on Sep 12, 2014, 08:07:57 AM
lance also praised paul ws anderson for avp. he would be singing a different tune if he had been cast in ridley scotts movie . $!

Prometheus is a better movie on a technical level, but there are absolutely things that AvP does better than Prometheus (which is extra funny since they're both essentially telling the same story - people exploring the origins of mankind and not liking what they find).

Interesting, memorable characters, for one. Charles Bishop Weyland is a much more sympathetic and relatable character than Peter Weyland is, by a long shot. I actually remember character personalities in 'AvP', as opposed to Prometheus where the only character with a distinct personality (aside from David, who I'll admit is the best character out of both movies) was "the asshole with a mohawk".
The large bulk of Alien movies have been character-driven, because that's what makes it relatable to the audience. When your movie has a bunch of shitty redshirt characters with no defining personalities, it undermines that goal. AvP absolutely did it better than Prometheus in that regard.

....wow.  :D

I don't have any problem with it looking more advanced than the Nostromo. I do, however, think it creates a whole lot of continuity problems when compared to what was shown on the "state of the bad-ass art" Sulaco and, obviously, the near-Earth orbiting Gateway Station... Both of which are being depicted several decades after the events of even the Nostromo's encounter (which was, in turn, in the Prometheus' crew's future).

Then again, the very existence of technology able to read dreams sort of throws a spanner into the works of the eventual inquest into whether Ripley's version of events could be believed. Its inclusion didn't serve much of a purpose in 'Prometheus', but it's difficult to imagine why nobody tried using it on her regular traumatic nightmares (or, alternatively, why she didn't insist upon its use, since she clearly had a problem with others not believing her).

Quote from: SM on Sep 12, 2014, 08:55:06 AM

Quote from: predxeno on Sep 12, 2014, 08:23:39 AM
Not that it matters anymore but I just looked up the Sevastopol on Google and it seems that the only reason it was decommissioned in the first place was because of the Xenomorph, not because it had outdated technology like you implied, SM.

I implied no such thing.

Then why did you bring up the fact that it was being decommissioned in the first place?  Not important, really; as Xenomorphine says, we NEVER see the Prometheus's technology anywhere in the Alien series, not even on the Sulaco either.

100% agree with Axor! :)

The thing about Axor's comment is that he's right, however even a spinoff needs to be consistent with its source material and as Xenomorphine said above, there are contradictions.

Is it just me or is she very attractive .____.

QuoteThen why did you bring up the fact that it was being decommissioned in the first place?

As an aside.  No need to make things up.

QuoteNot important, really; as Xenomorphine says, we NEVER see the Prometheus's technology anywhere in the Alien series, not even on the Sulaco either.

Again nothing to do with Ridley.

It has everything to do with Ridley, he is clearly not being consistent with the Alien universe like you claim.

Quote from: Xenomrph on Sep 12, 2014, 07:31:26 AM
To be fair, there was enough waffling back and forth early on in production as to whether or not Prometheus should be an Alien prequel (and to what degree) that one could argue that that was essentially the case. :P

It started as a straight prequel script. The Alien connection was always there. This wasn't a Die Hard sequel :P

Quote from: predxeno on Sep 12, 2014, 10:19:16 PM
It has everything to do with Ridley, he is clearly not being consistent with the Alien universe like you claim.

Why would the Sulaco need holographic maps in the three or four rooms we see of it?

I don't know, why would government agencies need DVD players when they can simply rely on VHS?  Why would war rooms need HD screens when they can settle for SD screens?  It's called technological evolution, when new technologies come up, people use those instead if the things that originated over 57 years ago.

The question is why would you have a holographic screen in a mess hall. Or a locker room. Or in a garage. Etc. Just because technology exists doesn't mean it needs, or is going, to be ubiquitous.

Also, some missile silos in America still use 8" floppy discs. No, I'm not making that up (http://www.cbsnews.com/news/whos-minding-the-nuclear-weapons/).

Look around you, how many of your friends still use VHS tapes or any tech over half a decade old?  Where are those flying mapping balls as well?  Those would have been VERY useful in Alien and Aliens.

SiL do you use MSN Messenger anymore?

Quote from: predxeno on Sep 12, 2014, 10:43:41 PM
Look around you, how many of your friends still use VHS tapes or any tech over half a decade old?

How many of your friends have a 3DTV with a 3D Blu-Ray player hooked up in their bathroom? That's the point you're adamantly trying to ignore.

QuoteWhere are those flying mapping balls as well?  Those would have been VERY useful in Alien and Aliens.

Fifield designed them. Fifield died.

Quote from: Xenomrph on Sep 12, 2014, 10:49:47 PM
SiL do you use MSN Messenger anymore?

Nope, I'm on Skype these days.

Quote from: RakaiThwei on Sep 11, 2014, 02:56:25 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2_GWJ1qbSf0#ws (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2_GWJ1qbSf0#ws)

In this special edition, Actor, Artist, Lance Henriksen comes on the show to talk about his film career including his newest project, Harbinger Down. Lance also talks about his Comic Book and his Pottery Art.

Kind of surprised she didn't discuss Alien vs. Predator with Lance, considering he played a particularly big part in the movie but I am somewhat more surprised she chose to speak to him about Prometheus,  a film he had nothing to do with.

Watched this earlier today. I haven't really cared all that much for her work before, but this was great fun. :)

Oh hey, I use skype too (sometimes). Find me on there, I'm "Xenomrph".

There's a difference regarding 3D TVs and Prometheus tech; those are still new so no one has them but the Prometheus tech has been around for over 57 years, 257 if you include A:R, yet neither the Sulaco nor the Auriga have it.

Also, even though Fifield invented the mapping balls, it didn't stop Wey-Yu from using them in A:CM and they utilize the exact same weapons and technology as the colonial marines.

Quote from: predxeno on Sep 12, 2014, 11:03:29 PM
There's a difference regarding 3D TVs and Prometheus tech; those are still new so no one has them but the Prometheus tech has been around for over 57 years, 257 if you include A:R, yet neither the Sulaco nor the Auriga have it.

Okay. How many people do you know with old TVs and VHS players hooked up into them in their bathroom.

QuoteAlso, even though Fifield invented the mapping balls, it didn't stop Wey-Yu from using them in A:CM and they utilize the exact same weapons and technology as the colonial marines.

That's A:CM's fault for not paying attention, not Ridley's.

That's my point, no one uses outdated technology.

Also, it is NOT A:CM's fault for following the standard Prometheus set; Scott essentially said Blu-Ray technology preceded VHS, this is his fault.  Are you going to blame Alien: Isolation as well for following in Alien's footsteps rather than Prometheus's?

Quote from: predxeno on Sep 12, 2014, 11:41:53 PM
That's my point, no one uses outdated technology.

You really, really aren't getting this, are you?

One, I sent a link to a missile silo that uses 8" floppies. In 2014. Goodbye "No-one uses old tech".

Two, you said the Sulaco should have had it, but we see very little of the Sulaco in the film, and the rooms we do see don't make sense to have Prometheus-like technology in them. We see locker rooms, hangar bays, etc. Even the Prometheus didn't have fancy tech in those places.

QuoteAlso, it is NOT A:CM's fault for following the standard Prometheus set

It IS A:CM's fault for not paying attention that the "pups" were Fifield's.

Quote from: SiL on Sep 12, 2014, 11:29:52 PM

Quote from: predxeno on Sep 12, 2014, 11:03:29 PM
There's a difference regarding 3D TVs and Prometheus tech; those are still new so no one has them but the Prometheus tech has been around for over 57 years, 257 if you include A:R, yet neither the Sulaco nor the Auriga have it.

Okay. How many people do you know with old TVs and VHS players hooked up into them in their bathroom.

QuoteAlso, even though Fifield invented the mapping balls, it didn't stop Wey-Yu from using them in A:CM and they utilize the exact same weapons and technology as the colonial marines.

That's A:CM's fault for not paying attention, not Ridley's.

To be completely fair, the mapping balls are on the Weyland Industries website (http://www.weylandindustries.com/electronics) as proprietary Weyland tech.

So it's the marketing people's fault for not paying attention :P

The point is that W-Y has access to them if they're advertising them on their website. :P

Quote from: SiL on Sep 12, 2014, 11:45:00 PM

Quote from: predxeno on Sep 12, 2014, 11:41:53 PM
That's my point, no one uses outdated technology.

You really, really aren't getting this, are you?

One, I sent a link to a missile silo that uses 8" floppies. In 2014. Goodbye "No-one uses old tech".

Two, you said the Sulaco should have had it, but we see very little of the Sulaco in the film, and the rooms we do see don't make sense to have Prometheus-like technology in them. We see locker rooms, hangar bays, etc. Even the Prometheus didn't have fancy tech in those places.

We see plenty of the Sulaco in A:CM and there's no reference to Prometheus tech.  Also, your missile silo example implies that both the Sulaco and Auriga were constructed during Prometheus's timeframe and that's why neither was upgraded, I find that VERY hard to believe that ships that old would still be in use when more modern ships can be relied on.

Quote from: Xenomrph on Sep 12, 2014, 11:51:32 PM
The point is that W-Y has access to them if they're advertising them on their website. :P

Okay, then let's review for a second:

Why would a tugboat like the Nostromo have them?

Why would Marines use a flying lightshow that would give them away to a potential enemy?

Quote from: predxeno on Sep 12, 2014, 11:54:09 PM
I find that VERY hard to believe that ships that old would still be in use when more modern ships can be relied on.

There are still ships from the 40s and 50s in commission.

Quote from: SiL on Sep 12, 2014, 11:55:42 PM

Quote from: Xenomrph on Sep 12, 2014, 11:51:32 PM
The point is that W-Y has access to them if they're advertising them on their website. :P

Okay, then let's review for a second:

Why would a tugboat like the Nostromo have them?

Why would Marines use a flying lightshow that would give them away to a potential enemy?

I didn't say they would, I was just countering the idea that the mapping balls were one-and-done pieces of tech that were only on the Prometheus mission and never seen again because Fifeld died.

Wey-Yu didn't seem to have a problem using the light balls in A:CM and they managed to capture the Alien Queen.

There are no ships in commission that are 257 years old though.

Quote from: Xenomrph on Sep 12, 2014, 11:49:02 PM

Quote from: SiL on Sep 12, 2014, 11:29:52 PM

Quote from: predxeno on Sep 12, 2014, 11:03:29 PM
There's a difference regarding 3D TVs and Prometheus tech; those are still new so no one has them but the Prometheus tech has been around for over 57 years, 257 if you include A:R, yet neither the Sulaco nor the Auriga have it.

Okay. How many people do you know with old TVs and VHS players hooked up into them in their bathroom.

QuoteAlso, even though Fifield invented the mapping balls, it didn't stop Wey-Yu from using them in A:CM and they utilize the exact same weapons and technology as the colonial marines.

That's A:CM's fault for not paying attention, not Ridley's.

To be completely fair, the mapping balls are on the Weyland Industries website (http://www.weylandindustries.com/electronics) as proprietary Weyland tech.

To be fair, the Weyland industries website is proper wank made up by the marketing people.

But i guess it's canon somehow.

I love this new dynamic where I'm the one attacking canon and SM and SiL are the ones defending it, I still don't get why they can't see AVPR as canon if they're willing to jump through this many hurdles defending Prometheus though.

don't get me wrong, I'm okay with shoehorning Prometheus in with Alien, visual style differences and all, but I'm saying that I totally get why people would consider it an anachronism that not a single iota of the fancy, shiny new holographic tech in Prometheus manages to disseminate into any sort of usage seen in any of the movies or the bulk of the EU, and we get a pretty good cross-section of life across the movies and EU (ranging from civilian, to military, to scientific, to corporate) spanning a timeline of centuries. To date the only EU source I can think of offhand that uses fancy holographic tech is AvP2010 (and that managed to come out pre-Prometheus :P).

Like yeah, you can handwave the discrepancies on a case-by-case basis, like why there aren't tabletop holograms at Ripley's ICC inquest in 'Aliens' (or why the map of the Hadley's Hope colony isn't a tabletop hologram), but flat-out ignoring the visual style discrepancy as if it isn't there seems silly.
It's obviously not a deal-breaker for me and I can look past it, but I'm not going to act like I don't understand why people might be irked by it.

Quote from: Blacklabel on Sep 13, 2014, 12:02:45 AM

Quote from: Xenomrph on Sep 12, 2014, 11:49:02 PM

Quote from: SiL on Sep 12, 2014, 11:29:52 PM

Quote from: predxeno on Sep 12, 2014, 11:03:29 PM
There's a difference regarding 3D TVs and Prometheus tech; those are still new so no one has them but the Prometheus tech has been around for over 57 years, 257 if you include A:R, yet neither the Sulaco nor the Auriga have it.

Okay. How many people do you know with old TVs and VHS players hooked up into them in their bathroom.

QuoteAlso, even though Fifield invented the mapping balls, it didn't stop Wey-Yu from using them in A:CM and they utilize the exact same weapons and technology as the colonial marines.

That's A:CM's fault for not paying attention, not Ridley's.

To be completely fair, the mapping balls are on the Weyland Industries website (http://www.weylandindustries.com/electronics) as proprietary Weyland tech.

To be fair, the Weyland industries website is proper wank made up by the marketing people.

But i guess it's canon somehow.

Loads of people on this forum were hell-bent as citing it as canon as "proof" that the AvP movies never happened.
I'm okay with it being canon, but I'm also of the opinion that the site is intentionally meant to be taken with a HUGE grain of salt. It's marketing wank, but not the way you're thinking.

Quote from: predxeno on Sep 12, 2014, 10:19:16 PM
It has everything to do with Ridley, he is clearly not being consistent with the Alien universe like you claim.

No, you claimed Ridley ignored his own film.

Again, no need to make things up.

QuoteI love this new dynamic where I'm the one attacking canon and SM and SiL are the ones defending it, I still don't get why they can't see AVPR as canon if they're willing to jump through this many hurdles defending Prometheus though.

I guess because you're incapable of isolating your low opinion of Prometheus from the facts.

And on your continual drive to make things up, I've never found enough evidence to divorce the AvPs from Alien continuity (despite how crap they are).  At least until Prometheus completely ignored them in terms of Weyland.  And Fox is merely backing this up.

No, I claimed Ridley ignored the Alien universe, which includes his own film.

Also, you're making quite a few things up yourself in your attempt to keep Prometheus canon.

Quote from: SM on Sep 13, 2014, 12:19:47 AMAnd Fox is merely backing this up.

Not so sure on this one.

Also, this f**kin' thread.

Also, if people have this low an opinion of Fox already, why are they trusting Fox with the power to decanonize titles for a massive series reboot?  Are we really that confident that Fox won't end up abusing this power somehow?

We don't really get a say in the matter either way, from an "official" standpoint.

But if you don't like what FOX does, you can ignore them and do their own thing. Fans have done that for decades.

Quote from: predxeno on Sep 13, 2014, 12:00:42 AM
Wey-Yu didn't seem to have a problem using the light balls in A:CM and they managed to capture the Alien Queen.

That's Wey-Yu. I asked about the Marines.

QuoteThere are no ships in commission that are 257 years old though.

Nor are there in the first three Alien movies. Point?

Wey-Yu and the marines have the exact same technology, whenever a merc dies the player can easily pick up any compatible weapons and items.

You're suggesting with your missile silo example that the only reason the Auriga wasn't upgraded with the latest tech was cause it was produced 257 years ago of A:R, if it was produced later than it would have been a more modern ship with no need for updating.

QuoteAlso, you're making quite a few things up yourself in your attempt to keep Prometheus canon.

1) Prometheus is quite obviously canon as of right now, so what I attempt is neither here nor there.
2) What am I making up?

QuoteAlso, if people have this low an opinion of Fox already, why are they trusting Fox with the power to decanonize titles for a massive series reboot?  Are we really that confident that Fox won't end up abusing this power somehow?

Because they're making a serious attempt at a cohesive continuity, for what seems like the first time.

Will it all slot flawlessly together - no.  There's already issues with Out Of The Shadows, and I told my contact at Fox as much.  More will no doubt pop up in the comics and Isolation and whatever else follows.

Doesn't mean I don't appreciate the fact they're actively trying to make it fit.

Quote from: predxeno on Sep 13, 2014, 05:52:51 AM
Wey-Yu and the marines have the exact same technology,

Clearly they don't. The Marines aren't shown having Pups available to them.

QuoteYou're suggesting with your missile silo example that the only reason the Auriga wasn't upgraded with the latest tech was cause it was produced 257 years ago of A:R, if it was produced later than it would have been a more modern ship with no need for updating.

I'm saying just cos there's new tech doesn't mean it's going to be used.

And again:

Where do we see in the Auriga that would need fancy holographic screens?
You say that because A:CM doesn't give the Sulaco Prometheus-level tech, that this is Ridley Scott's fault for having more advance technology in a prequel movie. How do you not see how stupid this is?

You're essentially asking why the military needs Blu-Ray players and HD tv, they need it to show they are up-to-date on technology; if not for a practical reason then at least to show the world that they are still on the leading edge of things, if they show inferior technology then that's a psychological invitation for attack.

If an enemy saw the home shopping channel on the Auriga - the Auriga's already under attack.

And the overwhelming majority of screens on Prometheus were not holographic.  There was the mapping table, whatever they used for Weyland's message, Charlie's little rubiks cube and the screen Shaw was using in her quarters.  There's dozens of screens all around the bridge and in medlab that were simple displays or touchscreens.

Quote from: predxeno on Sep 13, 2014, 06:13:32 AM
You're essentially asking why the military needs Blu-Ray players and HD tv, they need it to show they are up-to-date on technology; if not for a practical reason then at least to show the world that they are still on the leading edge of things, if they show inferior technology then that's a psychological invitation for attack.

No, I'm asking why they would have that technology in the areas we see.

I have asked this repeatedly. You refuse to answer.

Seriously, why would you put a holographic screen in a god-damned hangar? Not even Prometheus does this.

Quote from: SM on Sep 13, 2014, 06:18:20 AM
If an enemy saw the home shopping channel on the Auriga - the Auriga's already under attack.

Also this.

So are any of the Prometheus's tech featured in the concept art galleries of the Sulaco or Auriga?  What about Hadley's Hope of which we see more of onscreen?

Or you could just keep avoiding the question and acting like that means you have a case ... ???

For the record, Alien's concept art has some pretty Prometheus-level technology.

How am I avoiding the question?  I already answered your question in my previous post; the military needs to demonstrate that it has up-to-date technology not only to impress the citizens it's supposed to protect, but also to deter enemies from seeing it as a weak and outdated organization.

Quote from: predxeno on Sep 13, 2014, 06:41:47 AM
How am I avoiding the question?  I already answered your question in my previous post; the military needs to demonstrate that it has up-to-date technology not only to impress the citizens it's supposed to protect, but also to deter enemies from seeing it as a weak and outdated organization.

I think that has more to do with what type of weapons they have at their disposal and the damage they can do with them.

And I think that the equipment a scientist would use on an exploreing expidition would be different compareing the equipment used in a scouting/ rescue mission in a possible hostile enviroment. But to be honest I don't know much about how these missions are done irl but I think that if you salvage all the equipment used by scientists/ explorers on a friendly mission to make contact with some tribe in an unexplored region, would be very different compared with all the eqipment used by a navy seal team on a rescue mission in a hostile enviroment, I also think that who's funding each mission is of importance when talking about the quality of the equipment being used.

Here's a funny but true story, on many occasions government technology can be influenced by things designed in TV shows, this was certainly the case with the TV show 24 and its CTU (Counter-Terrorism Unit).

Quote from: predxeno on Sep 13, 2014, 07:57:16 AM
Here's a funny but true story, on many occasions government technology can be influenced by things designed in TV shows, this was certainly the case with the TV show 24 and its CTU (Counter-Terrorism Unit).

I seen some episodes from that show but not as many that I could call myself a fan or follower, still liked it though, might pick up a box some days and go through some of it's seasons :-) What did the goverment pick up frpm that show?

They never mentioned specifically but I think it's things like workplace layouts and designs for various computer programs.

[Eyes the thread for a moment. Blinks and then shakes head]

...At least I get front page credit for sharing this.

Quote from: RakaiThwei on Sep 13, 2014, 08:25:34 AM
[Eyes the thread for a moment. Blinks and then shakes head]

...At least I get front page credit for sharing this.

Sorry RakaiThwei, no disrespect, sometimes you start talking about one thing that leads into another, the thread will go back to it's origins soon I think :-)

Quote from: predxeno on Sep 13, 2014, 06:41:47 AM
How am I avoiding the question?

By not answering it. Why would they need a holographic screen in a locker room, in the mess hall, in the hangar, in any of the locations seen in the movie? "To impress people" is asinine, these people are still working on a budget and still needing to be the least bit practical.

Wow, the way you word things we'd expect the military to still be using Windows 95 because of budgetary issues.  In Aliens, Ripley and co. utilize a table screen to view the blueprints for Hadley's Hope; explain to me why that table isn't using holographic technology if that technology is over 57 years old.

Quote from: Milan on Sep 13, 2014, 08:35:52 AM
Sorry RakaiThwei, no disrespect, sometimes you start talking about one thing that leads into another, the thread will go back to it's origins soon I think :-)

Eh, it's alright I guess, Milan. I just.. can't help but shake my head and roll my eyes.

In regards to this interview as well as some of her other videos, it's clear that ComicBookGirl19 is a Prometheus fangirl. Nothing wrong with that, but it would've been interesting to hear Lance talk about the different Weyland portrayals. At the time when he was filming AvP, Lance seemed to really believe in what he was help putting out. And he still maintains a good relationship with the folks over at ADI. I know that when I spoke with Tom Woodruff Jr., he seemed to still stand by AvP when I told him about the fan reaction and I'm sure he still probably stands by it.

I know that a couple years back, Lance was in Cherry Hill to meet and greet with fans, I wish I would've gotten the chance to speak with him as well as I did with Tom, Ian and Mike Biehn. Would've been interesting to speak with Lance. Personally, I'm surprised he's disappointed with Prometheus and his feelings seem to more or less match up with Cameron's.

I found her Prometheus dissection kinda painful.

QuoteWow, the way you word things we'd expect the military to still be using Windows 95 because of budgetary issues.  In Aliens, Ripley and co. utilize a table screen to view the blueprints for Hadley's Hope; explain to me why that table isn't using holographic technology if that technology is over 57 years old.

Same reason Prometheus used 2D weather radar displays and ultrasounds and video feeds and great big entertainment screens I supposed.

The Sulaco might not necessarily need holographic displays, but the interfaces are quite clearly retro (as are those of the Nostromo personnel files being splashed up on view behind Ripley at Gateway). The APC's command centre, however, would have clearly benefited from something along those lines... Just as the therapeutic room aboard Gateway station would: Why is it using giant flat projectors when it could simply envelope a patient in the illusion of being inside an actual peaceful location?

And, again, the device for monitoring dreams would have been very useful. And if the scene between David 8 and Weyland really was meant to be inferred as allowing for two-way interaction while dreaming, why is Ripley not being at least psychologically treated that way, instead of being fobbed off with sleeping medication?

Also, shouldn't at least Burke have been interested in seeing what she was dreaming about? On the one hand, he's apparently representing her at the hearing, which means he'd at least be obligated to gather what evidence he can to defend her. On the other, we eventually find out he's corrupt enough to send colonists out to the derelict's co-ordinates, purely out of curiosity! So, he's got double the reason to find out what Ripley's dreams are about; for gathering useful data, if nothing else.

Considering all of that, I know Ridley Scott clearly wasn't taking any of these ramifications into account, but it almost makes a mockery of the Jordans being sent out... Gather Ripley's dream data and bypass the whole curiosity thing completely: Send out a properly equipped Weyland-Yutani expedition (or at least detour something already out in that neck of the woods). He'd be able to make a case for doing so with that sort of information.

As for holographic displays, Hadley's Hope could have definitely benefited from one. They've got a giant table apparently dedicated to nothing but mapping. :) Slowly labouring through 2D blueprints seems an awfully inefficient way of doing so when you could just punch up a 3D map you can twist and turn around any way you please to. I mean, we could fan-wank an explanation along the lines of the 'holography station' having mysteriously malfunctioned, but it seems weird they didn't just have a back-up laying around instead of having this ominously huge machine just sitting in the middle of the room all the time for the purpose of 2D mapping presentation.

I also remember, back when 'Prometheus' was being released, pointing out that the Auriga's utter lack of any of this technology makes it even stranger (especially medical scans and interfaces). The Nostromo-is-old theory works, sure. You can apply that to the prison planet, too. But Gateway Station is busy and being near Earth would make it especially easy to keep updated, while Hudson's proudly banging on about how the Sulaco's stuff is "state of the bad-ass art" - all of which are long after the Nostromo's encounter. Then we see this super-secret military research ship, even further into the future and, well... Definite inconsistencies.

So, yes, there's an obvious case to be made about Nostomo and Fury comparisons. Not so much when you make them with the Sulaco, Gateway and Auriga.

Quote from: predxeno on Sep 13, 2014, 12:00:42 AM
There are no ships in commission that are 257 years old though.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Constitution (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Constitution)

QuoteJust as the therapeutic room aboard Gateway station would: Why is it using giant flat projectors when it could simply envelope a patient in the illusion of being inside an actual peaceful location?

Why did Vickers suits use a giant flat screen?

QuoteThe APC's command centre, however, would have clearly benefited from something along those lines...

In principal yes; not so much in practicality.  Too small.

QuoteSo, he's got double the reason to find out what Ripley's dreams are about; for gathering useful data, if nothing else.

Do you often have linear, and literally accurate dreams?

Quote from: predxeno on Sep 13, 2014, 08:42:18 AM
Wow, the way you word things we'd expect the military to still be using Windows 95 because of budgetary issues.

The way you word things we'd expect the military to have 3D TVs in the lavatory to impress civilians who will never see them.

The whole thing relies on the idea that just because the technology exists means its use would be ubiquitous in every conceivable application. This isn't how the world works. We've had 3D film since the twenties, but here we are almost a hundred years later and they're still struggling to argue its worth.

There's no need to rely on "Well, the Nostromo is old" when "It wasn't deemed practical or necessary" suits just fine. The Prometheus didn't even have super fancy tech throughout its entire vessel as SM keeps trying to point out, and it didn't have it for anything that was actually critical. All of their navigation systems, read-outs, etc. were done on regular screens. Compare your smartphone to the cockpit of the latest commercial airliner, cruise ship, aircraft carrier, or space shuttle and you'll see that just because touch screens and voice-activated AI are pretty ubiquitous in smartphones these days, doesn't mean they're used for every damn thing.

Jeez.

..what is this page about, again?

Quote from: Blacklabel on Sep 13, 2014, 02:00:05 PM
..what is this page about, again?

A chronicle of predxeno's madness?

Watching the interview now, lorf bless Lance.

Quote from: SiL on Sep 13, 2014, 12:29:52 PM

Quote from: predxeno on Sep 13, 2014, 08:42:18 AM
Wow, the way you word things we'd expect the military to still be using Windows 95 because of budgetary issues.

The way you word things we'd expect the military to have 3D TVs in the lavatory to impress civilians who will never see them.

The whole thing relies on the idea that just because the technology exists means its use would be ubiquitous in every conceivable application. This isn't how the world works. We've had 3D film since the twenties, but here we are almost a hundred years later and they're still struggling to argue its worth.

There's no need to rely on "Well, the Nostromo is old" when "It wasn't deemed practical or necessary" suits just fine. The Prometheus didn't even have super fancy tech throughout its entire vessel as SM keeps trying to point out, and it didn't have it for anything that was actually critical. All of their navigation systems, read-outs, etc. were done on regular screens. Compare your smartphone to the cockpit of the latest commercial airliner, cruise ship, aircraft carrier, or space shuttle and you'll see that just because touch screens and voice-activated AI are pretty ubiquitous in smartphones these days, doesn't mean they're used for every damn thing.

Jeez.

There is a difference here that you are blatantly avoiding at all costs; none of the Prometheus's technology is new anymore, 57 year old technology would be cheap and VERY affordable by Aliens' time and actually quite helpful.

Quote from: Cvalda on Sep 13, 2014, 03:12:24 PM

Quote from: Blacklabel on Sep 13, 2014, 02:00:05 PM
..what is this page about, again?

A chronicle of predxeno's madness?

Watching the interview now, lorf bless Lance.

How am I being mad for stating the most logical fallacies?  Just because my opinion isn't the popularopinion doesn't mean it's wrong, but I wouldn't expect a conformist to understand that.

If Cvalda is a conformist... what does that make you?...

The local rastafari predalien revolutionary? :P

(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2F38.media.tumblr.com%2Ff6b810f286fdace5166997f7341d748f%2Ftumblr_mx919kSlxr1rtegito1_500.jpg&hash=142d2affe16738ac7f9a3f7516ae302f7218dcb9)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4zVtTopKshw# (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4zVtTopKshw#)

I speak my mind on what I believe in, unlike you guys I don't insult people who have different beliefs; I would never call you "mad" just because you have a different perspective, apparently you don't have that same respect for me.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fstGAj7pb4g#ws (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fstGAj7pb4g#ws)

Quote from: SM on Sep 13, 2014, 10:01:09 AM
I found her Prometheus dissection kinda painful.

Aside from her trying to fill the quirky internet geek girl quota.. How was it exactly painful?