James Cameron Talks Alien Covenant in interview with Vulture.com. It's just a short mention about his worries regarding the film!!
Quote On a completely different topic: How do you feel about the upcoming Alien sequel, Alien: Covenant?
The franchise has kind of wandered all over the map. Ridley [Scott] did the first film, and he inspired an entire generation of filmmakers and science-fiction fans with that one movie and there have been so many films that stylistically have derived from it, including my own Aliens, which was the legitimate sequel and, I think, the proper heir to his film. I sort of did it as a fanboy. I wanted to honor his film, but also say what I needed to say. After that, I don't take any responsibility.
I don't think it's worked out terribly well. I think we've moved on beyond it. It's like, okay, we've got it, we've got the whole Freudian biomechanoid meme. I've seen it in 100 horror films since. I think both of those films stand at a certain point in time, as a reference point. But is there any validity to doing another one now? I don't know. Maybe. Let's see, jury's out. Let's see what Ridley comes up with. Let me just add to that — and don't cut this part off, please — I will stand in line for any Ridley Scott movie, even a not-so-great one, because he is such an artist, he's such a filmmaker. I always learn from him. And what he does with going back to his own franchise would be fascinating.
http://www.vulture.com/2017/01/james-cameron-atlantis-rising-alien-covenant.html (http://www.vulture.com/2017/01/james-cameron-atlantis-rising-alien-covenant.html)
I was jus gonna make new topic of this. You were quicker Pvt. Himmel :)
Quote from: Pvt. Himmel on Jan 27, 2017, 06:45:47 PM
James Cameron Talks Alien Covenant in interview with Vulture.com.
It's just a short mention about his worries regarding the film!!
Quote On a completely different topic: How do you feel about the upcoming Alien sequel, Alien: Covenant?
The franchise has kind of wandered all over the map. Ridley [Scott] did the first film, and he inspired an entire generation of filmmakers and science-fiction fans with that one movie and there have been so many films that stylistically have derived from it, including my own Aliens, which was the legitimate sequel and, I think, the proper heir to his film. I sort of did it as a fanboy. I wanted to honor his film, but also say what I needed to say. After that, I don't take any responsibility.
I don't think it's worked out terribly well. I think we've moved on beyond it. It's like, okay, we've got it, we've got the whole Freudian biomechanoid meme. I've seen it in 100 horror films since. I think both of those films stand at a certain point in time, as a reference point. But is there any validity to doing another one now? I don't know. Maybe. Let's see, jury's out. Let's see what Ridley comes up with. Let me just add to that — and don't cut this part off, please — I will stand in line for any Ridley Scott movie, even a not-so-great one, because he is such an artist, he's such a filmmaker. I always learn from him. And what he does with going back to his own franchise would be fascinating.
http://www.vulture.com/2017/01/james-cameron-atlantis-rising-alien-covenant.html (http://www.vulture.com/2017/01/james-cameron-atlantis-rising-alien-covenant.html)
As much as he's tried to save face with his last sentence, he's just slighted Ridley Scott. I find the hypocrisy astonishing. News has just come out he's resurrecting Terminator isn't he? f**k off James Cameron, we're not done with Alien but everyone is sure as shit done with Terminator. Now that's milked out.
And didn't he endorse Neil Blomkamp's Aliens sequel script?!
Quote from: SuicideDoors on Jan 27, 2017, 06:53:07 PM
Quote from: Pvt. Himmel on Jan 27, 2017, 06:45:47 PM
James Cameron Talks Alien Covenant in interview with Vulture.com.
It's just a short mention about his worries regarding the film!!
Quote On a completely different topic: How do you feel about the upcoming Alien sequel, Alien: Covenant?
The franchise has kind of wandered all over the map. Ridley [Scott] did the first film, and he inspired an entire generation of filmmakers and science-fiction fans with that one movie and there have been so many films that stylistically have derived from it, including my own Aliens, which was the legitimate sequel and, I think, the proper heir to his film. I sort of did it as a fanboy. I wanted to honor his film, but also say what I needed to say. After that, I don't take any responsibility.
I don't think it's worked out terribly well. I think we've moved on beyond it. It's like, okay, we've got it, we've got the whole Freudian biomechanoid meme. I've seen it in 100 horror films since. I think both of those films stand at a certain point in time, as a reference point. But is there any validity to doing another one now? I don't know. Maybe. Let's see, jury's out. Let's see what Ridley comes up with. Let me just add to that — and don't cut this part off, please — I will stand in line for any Ridley Scott movie, even a not-so-great one, because he is such an artist, he's such a filmmaker. I always learn from him. And what he does with going back to his own franchise would be fascinating.
http://www.vulture.com/2017/01/james-cameron-atlantis-rising-alien-covenant.html (http://www.vulture.com/2017/01/james-cameron-atlantis-rising-alien-covenant.html)
As much as he's tried to save face with his last sentence, he's just slighted Ridley Scott. I find the hypocrisy astonishing. News has just come out he's resurrecting Terminator isn't he? f**k off James Cameron, we're not done with Alien but everyone is sure as shit done with Terminator. Now that's milked out.
And didn't he endorse Neil Blomkamp's Aliens sequel script?!
Yep!!
"He shared it with me, and I think it's a very strong script, and he can go make it tomorrow." http://screencrush.com/james-cameron-alien-5-screenplay/ (http://screencrush.com/james-cameron-alien-5-screenplay/)
Pretty strange critique imo
Even he was interested in doing another alien film like 10 years back wasn't he? I also think he said that he actually liked AvP as well. Not to mention he had good things to say about Blomkamp's alien script.
Its just a weird thing for him to say.
Quote from: Ingwar on Jan 27, 2017, 06:47:37 PM
I was jus gonna make new topic of this. You were quicker Pvt. Himmel :)
:)
He's bitter as f**k. Fox went back to Ridley Scott to reinvigorate the franchise before Alien 0 became Prometheus, even though Aliens is the most popular entry.
He sure as well wouldn't say it's a worn out concept if Fox would have came crawling to him to resurrect the franchise true and proper.
I wouldn't be surprised if it stings a little when he reads/hears Ridley saying "I can't believe no one asked the question of 'who the hell was the space jockey'?" in relation to the sequels to Alien, either.
All in all, it's supremely annoying to hear James Cameron not only devalue the franchise, but effectively call "us" (the fanbase) unimaginative cause we're still obsessed with it.
Well, I think it's fair to say, "let's wait and see." Granted, I love the genre and you could make movies about this sort of thing forever and potentially produce good films, continually. Not every time, but Alien itself was a retread in so many ways but took it's tired, cliched material and elevated it with a hive-mind, organic, group effort from a corpus of writers and artists, all of whom were very talented. It's not the ingredients, nor the cooks, but both, and how former are combined by the latter to produce something out of household materials.
I am starting to get more and more respect for Cameron. He makes a fair point when he says : "is there any point in doing another one" . I assume he means another "alien" movie. ie facehuggers eggs big chap etc. And I think no . He sounds sincere to me.
Hopefully we will have the Bad angels " bad boys get the girls" movie after Covvie .
You know you can't really blame Scott he has to make a movie that puts bums on seats. With Prometheus a lot of misdirection as to what the movie was going to be and now as other have stated an over compensation.
Let's hope Alien: Lucifer hets greenlit in this year!!
Lovin' Cameron's words.
That show about Atlantis looks interesting.
Quote from: SuicideDoors on Jan 27, 2017, 06:53:07 PM
As much as he's tried to save face with his last sentence, he's just slighted Ridley Scott.
I don't believe anything there can be read as a personal insult against Scott (unless you're of the view the guy has never done a mediocre film).
QuoteNews has just come out he's resurrecting Terminator isn't he? f**k off James Cameron, we're not done with Alien but everyone is sure as shit done with Terminator. Now that's milked out.
The rights are automatically reverting back to him, that's all. He may or may not serve as a producer on the next one, should it occur.
Nothing about '
The Terminator' is "milked out". The series just hasn't been handled right since his last one.
QuoteHe's bitter as f**k. Fox went back to Ridley Scott to reinvigorate the franchise before Alien 0 became Prometheus, even though Aliens is the most popular entry.
How do you figure he's bitter? He's the one who's repeatedly said he's not interested in helming one.
http://www.avpgalaxy.net/2016/07/18/james-cameron-unlikely-return-another-alien-film/
QuoteHe sure as well wouldn't say it's a worn out concept if Fox would have came crawling to him to resurrect the franchise true and proper.
I'm sure he
would, actually. He's never been shy of thinking that - and many fans would agree.
Whether or not someone will reinvigorate it, who can say? Don't think he's ever been asked about the '
Alien Isolation' game. I'd imagine that he would consider that beautiful.
QuoteI wouldn't be surprised if it stings a little when he reads/hears Ridley saying "I can't believe no one asked the question of 'who the hell was the space jockey'?" in relation to the sequels to Alien, either.
Why? Cameron was handed an idea the producers wanted him to undertake. The only thing he's mentioned feeling annoyed by, was in it stating, "And then some other bullshit happens," because he felt that was insulting to the original project's source material.
QuoteAll in all, it's supremely annoying to hear James Cameron not only devalue the franchise, but effectively call "us" (the fanbase) unimaginative cause we're still obsessed with it.
He doesn't say anything about the fandom being unimaginative. He's asked his thoughts on the future of the series and literally says, "I don't know. Maybe. Let's see, jury's out. Let's see what Ridley comes up with."
In what possible way is that controversial? He's verbally shrugging his shoulders because there have been so many duds over the years. That's the view most cinema-goers tend to express. Will '
Covenant' reverse that trend? We'll just have to wait and see how it's like. That's what he says, too. If it's not much better than '
Prometheus', then a lot of us are going to feel increasingly cynical about what's ahead.
I find his words dissrespectful in a covered way.
Talking like that over the alien franchise and at the same time making kiddy stuff like Avatar, yeah right James.
Quote from: oduodu on Jan 27, 2017, 08:30:48 PM
I am starting to get more and more respect for Cameron. He makes a fair point when he says : "is there any point in doing another one" . I assume he means another "alien" movie. ie facehuggers eggs big chap etc. And I think no . He sounds sincere to me.
Not sure how that statement makes you respect him more, especially since almost every post has pointed out how hypocritical that statement makes him considering his previous statements on the franchise.
He had no problem with a sequel to aliens just last july.
"He shared it with me, and I think it's a very strong script, and he can go make it tomorrow."
Quote from: Infected on Jan 27, 2017, 08:46:19 PM
I find his words dissrespectful in a covered way.
Talking like that over the alien franchise and at the same time making kiddy stuff like Avatar, yeah right James.
I agree.
Xenomorphine you're entitled to your opinion as well.
Jesus Christ, some of you are taking this so personally. Calm your damn tits, people!
Cameron was totally behind Blomkamp's Alien film at last years comic con.
He's just not very convinced of the validity of "this" particular film. :laugh:
Seriously it's a joke?
The guy loved Genisys, and wants to make a Terminator 6 and 7. And he's just pissing us off about Alien?
Quote from: SiL on Jan 27, 2017, 08:51:37 PM
Jesus Christ, some of you are taking this so personally. Calm your damn tits, people!
Calm down you're going to pop a blood vessel. Easy there you'll get a chance one day. :P
Quote from: SiL on Jan 27, 2017, 08:51:37 PM
Jesus Christ, some of you are taking this so personally. Calm your damn tits, people!
I find it the same as supporting a football team. Alien is near and dear to me, I want Covenant to succeed more than anyone. We all have an unconditional love for the franchise. It's broke our hearts but we all remember how good the first two made us feel.
Quote from: SuicideDoors on Jan 27, 2017, 09:03:53 PM
Quote from: SiL on Jan 27, 2017, 08:51:37 PM
Jesus Christ, some of you are taking this so personally. Calm your damn tits, people!
I find it the same as supporting a football team. Alien is near and dear to me, I want Covenant to succeed more than anyone. We all have an unconditional love for the franchise. It's broke our hearts but we all remember how good the first two made us feel.
This^.
The timing of this in relation to Blomkamp's film is very peculiar. I also recognize a negative tone in James Cameron here but can't quite pinpoint where his gripe is, given his previous statements.
Quote from: 426Buddy on Jan 27, 2017, 08:49:08 PM
Quote from: oduodu on Jan 27, 2017, 08:30:48 PM
I am starting to get more and more respect for Cameron. He makes a fair point when he says : "is there any point in doing another one" . I assume he means another "alien" movie. ie facehuggers eggs big chap etc. And I think no . He sounds sincere to me.
Not sure how that statement makes you respect him more, especially since almost every post has pointed out how hypocritical that statement makes him considering his previous statements on the franchise.
He was down for another alien film just last july. "He shared it with me, and I think it's a very strong script, and he can go make it tomorrow."
I gain respect for him because :
1
He has openly admitted in a letter to Giger that he apologises for not giving him (Giger) the due respect for using some of his ....stuff / ideas and didn't try to repeat it. He did his own thing and never tried to improve on what was so great about alien. It was a rewrite of alien but then that's what happens in most sequels of a great movie. But well done.
2
He is correct in his appraisal of the state of the franchise . The franchise has been all over the place. And just doing another alien movie was never going to work. And Scott backtracked on doing away from eggs facehuggers xenos out of necessity. Yet he remains appreciative and respectful towards Scott.
I agree with him that the first 2 movies are By themselves. I think the implications are that the franchise should have ended there. I respect his judgement in what works and what doesn't.
Quote from: oduodu on Jan 27, 2017, 09:14:44 PM
Quote from: 426Buddy on Jan 27, 2017, 08:49:08 PM
Quote from: oduodu on Jan 27, 2017, 08:30:48 PM
I am starting to get more and more respect for Cameron. He makes a fair point when he says : "is there any point in doing another one" . I assume he means another "alien" movie. ie facehuggers eggs big chap etc. And I think no . He sounds sincere to me.
Not sure how that statement makes you respect him more, especially since almost every post has pointed out how hypocritical that statement makes him considering his previous statements on the franchise.
He was down for another alien film just last july. "He shared it with me, and I think it's a very strong script, and he can go make it tomorrow."
I gain respect for him because :
1
He has openly admitted in a letter to Giger that he apologises for not giving him (Giger) the due respect for using some of his ....stuff / ideas and didn't try to repeat it. He did his own thing and never tried to improve on what was so great about alien. It was a rewrite of alien but then that's what happens in most sequels of a great movie. But well done.
2
He is correct in his appraisal of the state of the franchise . The franchise has been all over the place. And just doing another alien movie was never going to work. And Scott backtracked on it out of necessity. Yet he remains appreciative and respectful towards Scott.
I agree with him that the first 2 movies are By themselves. I think the implications are that the franchise should have ended there. I respect his judgement in what works and what doesn't.
1: I didn't ask why you respect him, just why that statement in particular made you respect him more. Of course we all have or should have respect for the man he's brought us some of the best films in scifi.
2:I understand you like the position he took in that interview, I'm saying he's a hypocrite because he's taken a completely different view of the franchise when asked as recently as last july.
Relax and calm down guys. Cameron also said:
QuoteLet's see what Ridley comes up with. Let me just add to that — and don't cut this part off, please — I will stand in line for any Ridley Scott movie, even a not-so-great one, because he is such an artist, he's such a filmmaker. I always learn from him. And what he does with going back to his own franchise would be fascinating.
As he said, let's see what Scott comes up with. Patience.
Would you guys calm down and quit telling everyone to calm down, there is nothing to calm down from because no one has been uncalm.
Ok you're right . He has been very considerate towards Scott l love the sense of mutual respect and how he acknowledges others for their effort. He is doing the same here. He hasn't been condescending in his remark towards Scott as for the need of another alien movie.
I just feel perhaps he is right that no need for another "alien" movie. He is honest. And I agree with him.
Nothing wrong with making another though if it rakes in the cash.
Has he said something that changes his stance on the franchise ?
Oh yes and his ability to judge what works and what doesn't and stating it. His comments reflects this in this article.
i love ridley and i love cameron and what cameron said in that interview rings true, plus he expresses his great admiration for ridleys craft. .al his saying imo is that going back is going to be tricky. .and we all know that and we all have our concerns. .but the way some of u are carrying on. .omg. .how very dare he have the least bit of concern. .lol. .what?. . must he just go on his knees and praise ridley and suck his cock. .i mean seriously?
Quote from: juxtapose on Jan 27, 2017, 09:30:02 PM
.but the way some of u are carrying on. .omg. .how very dare he have the least bit of concern. .lol. .what?. . must he just go on his knees and praise ridley and suck his cock. .i mean seriously?
I can play the hyperbole game to.
but the way some of u are carrying on. .omg. .how very dare you question Jame cameron's statement. .lol. .what?. . must we just go on our knees and praise everything Cameron says and suck his cock. .i mean seriously?Lets forget any valid points people on both sides have made in this thread and hand wave it all away with statements like this.
Same goes for SM directly below this post.
Oh noes! Cameron be talking smack about some piece of make believe that I like. Except he's not really talking that much smack, but I must express my righteous indignation!!11!!! ZOMG
f**ks sake...
Come-on gents, let's act like the grown-ups we all apparently are.
QuoteLets forget any valid points people on both sides have made in this thread and hand wave it all away with statements like this.
Same goes for SM directly below this post.
Must've missed those "valid points"...
Quote from: SM on Jan 27, 2017, 09:42:50 PM
QuoteLets forget any valid points people on both sides have made in this thread and hand wave it all away with statements like this.
Same goes for SM directly below this post.
Must've missed those "valid points"...
Unless you're the one making them you always do.
Ooooh! Saucer of milk, table 5!
But please, "valid points". What are they? It's one guy trying to express an honest opinion as diplomatically as possible - and people predictably get unnecessarily bent out of shape.
Why does Cameron's opinion mean so much? Especially in light of the end of what he said.
Quote from: 426Buddy on Jan 27, 2017, 09:43:24 PM
Quote from: SM on Jan 27, 2017, 09:42:50 PM
QuoteLets forget any valid points people on both sides have made in this thread and hand wave it all away with statements like this.
Same goes for SM directly below this post.
Must've missed those "valid points"...
Unless you're the one making them you always do.
Come on, don't make me ask again please fellas.
And snipped.
Quote from: SM on Jan 27, 2017, 09:45:07 PM
Ooooh! Saucer of milk, table 5!
But please, "valid points". What are they? It's one guy trying to express an honest opinion as diplomatically as possible - and people predictably get unnecessarily bent out of shape.
I said valid points on both sides, which there are. Are you saying there are no valid points on either side of this or just those that didn't agree with his opinion? Cameron has expressed a fairly different opinion when asked about the franchise before so yeah I question his total honesty here.
Only a couple posters actually seemed bent out of shape, maybe even only one, and why does that bother you so much?
@hicks - Okay i'll stop now.
QuoteI said valid points on both sides, which there are. Are you saying there are no valid points on either side of this or just those that didn't agree with his opinion?
No, I asked what the valid points were.
Quote from: SM on Jan 27, 2017, 09:45:07 PM
Ooooh! Saucer of milk, table 5!
But please, "valid points". What are they? It's one guy trying to express an honest opinion as diplomatically as possible - and people predictably get unnecessarily bent out of shape.
Why does Cameron's opinion work so much? Especially in light of the end of what he said.
Maybe you're inciting fellow fans? Yeah, some of us have an opinion against Cameron's words, but you've degenerated it into uneducated text speak. No need for it. No one is insulting you personally?
Quote from: 426Buddy on Jan 27, 2017, 08:49:08 PM
He had no problem with a sequel to aliens just last july. "He shared it with me, and I think it's a very strong script, and he can go make it tomorrow."
So? He's entitled to have a high opinion of an unfilmed script. Maybe it's got that spectacular new take on the series, which he's said he'd like to see. Maybe it really does add something new and interesting which he found compelling.
I've always felt underwhelmed by the third and fourth films, too. Doesn't mean I don't acknowledge they have good points, but on the whole, I've never really been wowed by them. He's done the same in previous interviews. He's pointed out stuff about '
Alien 3' which he likes, even though he would have preferred it if it had gone in a completely different direction.
I honestly don't understand why this is so controversial. He's not saying anything here which he hasn't in other interviews.
Quote from: Perfect-Organism on Jan 27, 2017, 09:14:05 PM
The timing of this in relation to Blomkamp's film is very peculiar. I also recognize a negative tone in James Cameron here but can't quite pinpoint where his gripe is, given his previous statements.
There's nothing conspiratorial about it. A journalist asked his opinion and he gave an honest answer. Most of the interview is about a completely unreleated documentary.
Quote from: SuicideDoors on Jan 27, 2017, 10:04:31 PM
Quote from: SM on Jan 27, 2017, 09:45:07 PM
Ooooh! Saucer of milk, table 5!
But please, "valid points". What are they? It's one guy trying to express an honest opinion as diplomatically as possible - and people predictably get unnecessarily bent out of shape.
Why does Cameron's opinion work so much? Especially in light of the end of what he said.
Maybe you're inciting fellow fans? Yeah, some of us have an opinion against Cameron's words, but you've degenerated it into uneducated text speak. No need for it. No one is insulting you personally?
I just find the over-reaction ridiculous.
But seriously, you're right. There was no need for me to get involved in the whinge-fest.
cameron is going to be making avatar sequals and eventually maybe prequals till the day he dies and ridley will be making alien prequals till he himself turn into a fossilised space jockey. .asuming covenant will be a fanancial success. .i guess he will do the odd thriller inbetween. .but thats how i see their futures panned out. .and theirs certainly nothing wrong wiith that. .what cameron said was and honest and diplomatic responce to the question he was asked. . All i saw was his great adoration for ridley mixed with some concern . . . He seems cautiously excited about the prospect af another alien prequal. .now lets f**king stone him to death!. .lol. .a mean how absurd?
Quote from: SiL on Jan 27, 2017, 08:51:37 PM
Jesus Christ, some of you are taking this so personally. Calm your damn tits, people!
That's what I thought as I read through the first page
I don't find any of what Cameron said to be back handed or an insult...
Meh He may have a point, but personally I'd still rather sit through another few Alien films than another 4 Avatar sequels any day! ;D
Quote from: SM on Jan 27, 2017, 10:09:24 PM
Quote from: SuicideDoors on Jan 27, 2017, 10:04:31 PM
Quote from: SM on Jan 27, 2017, 09:45:07 PM
Ooooh! Saucer of milk, table 5!
But please, "valid points". What are they? It's one guy trying to express an honest opinion as diplomatically as possible - and people predictably get unnecessarily bent out of shape.
Why does Cameron's opinion work so much? Especially in light of the end of what he said.
Maybe you're inciting fellow fans? Yeah, some of us have an opinion against Cameron's words, but you've degenerated it into uneducated text speak. No need for it. No one is insulting you personally?
I just find the over-reaction ridiculous.
But seriously, you're right. There was no need for my to get involved in the whinge-fest.
That was an extremely level-headed response. Respect to you.
I've personally read into Cameron's comments a bit more than your average fan, but where would we would be without opinions?
Nothing to see hear. Cameron is basically reiterating what Scott himself has said about Alien tropes and memes. They are both right. On the face of it the Alien franchise didn't need another entry. In a few months we'll get a feel for if Prometheus/Alien Covenant have added texture and narrative to validate more films...
Strange that Cameron is discussing A:C as though Prometheus hasn't already happened? Ridley already began revisiting the franchise 5 years ago.
What I took from this is that Alien hasn't exactly evolved past the constraints of it concept of a Parasitic Freudian biomechanoid that kills and spawns more of its kind. In a way he's kind of right.
Though you could argue the movies that came after attempted to explore new territory, the gloomy religious tone to Alien3 viewing the alien as demonic.
To the zany dark comedic mutative nature of Alien Resurrection witnessing the birth of cross species.
Then the bombastic action and blood shed of Alien vs Predator, two space monsters clash in the ultimate battle.
And now the ancient astronaut theory in Prometheus and what lies in store with Alien Covenant. Its tricky to introduce a new element and concept for an alien movie that doesn't stray too far from the Alien concept.
Trust me if Cameron wanted to make another Alien movie Fox would tell Ridley to screw off, and let Cameron make whatever the hell he wanted to.
Where do you get that idea?
For all Cameron's success he still has to prove himself to the studio every time he makes a movie.
. .far as i can remember cameron really liked prometheus. .he did mention that the plot did not always add up. .but overall he thought it was way superior to alien 3 and resurrection. . Not to mention the avp crap. .
Cameron liked AvP.
James Cameron is so right though. To quote Protozoid from IMDB, whose thoughts I share 100%: "The Alien series was not planned well enough, so the story does not accumulate story power as it goes along. Each movie is just an unrelated episode, not building, expanding, or anything. It wandered around, got lost, and ended. Why would you make a prequel to a story that goes nowhere and ended in an unpopular way? Why would you make a sequel, either?"
Many people are of the mind that Prometheus is confused about what it wants to be, but ironically I think it is ALIEN: COVENANT that doesn't know what it wants to be. How do you make a simple action-horror sequel to a movie like Prometheus? It's both a sequel and a prequel? The main character is gone?
I've always sort of felt the story and characters for Covenant were off. A colony ship, really now?
Quote from: Xenomorphine on Jan 27, 2017, 10:05:08 PM
Quote from: 426Buddy on Jan 27, 2017, 08:49:08 PM
He had no problem with a sequel to aliens just last july. "He shared it with me, and I think it's a very strong script, and he can go make it tomorrow."
So? He's entitled to have a high opinion of an unfilmed script. Maybe it's got that spectacular new take on the series, which he's said he'd like to see. Maybe it really does add something new and interesting which he found compelling.
I've always felt underwhelmed by the third and fourth films, too. Doesn't mean I don't acknowledge they have good points, but on the whole, I've never really been wowed by them. He's done the same in previous interviews. He's pointed out stuff about 'Alien 3' which he likes, even though he would have preferred it if it had gone in a completely different direction.
I honestly don't understand why this is so controversial. He's not saying anything here which he hasn't in other interviews.
Quote from: Perfect-Organism on Jan 27, 2017, 09:14:05 PM
The timing of this in relation to Blomkamp's film is very peculiar. I also recognize a negative tone in James Cameron here but can't quite pinpoint where his gripe is, given his previous statements.
There's nothing conspiratorial about it. A journalist asked his opinion and he gave an honest answer. Most of the interview is about a completely unreleated documentary.
The point i was unsuccessfully making was that Cameron has had a fairly positive view of the franchise in previous statements with the exception maybe that he didn't like how alien3 treated the survivors of his film. He seemed to have a positive opinion when asked about his thoughts on avp and on blomkamps script and I think he even had positive things to say on Prometheus.
To me it seemed far different to what he says in this interview-
QuoteI don't think it's worked out terribly well. I think we've moved on beyond it. It's like, okay, we've got it, we've got the whole Freudian biomechanoid meme. I've seen it in 100 horror films since. I think both of those films stand at a certain point in time, as a reference point. But is there any validity to doing another one now? I don't know.
Maybe he's changed his mind I dunno but I do know he thought there was a validity in doing blomkamps film not long ago but maybe not anymore. It was just something that surprised me. I'm not angry at what he said and I don't think its controversial. Its just something I thought was interesting
I love Cameron, but he hasn't made a good movie in 20 years, and after he praised Terminator: Genisys, I don't take him all that seriously anymore.
Quote from: Ultramorph on Jan 27, 2017, 11:20:53 PM
I love Cameron, but he hasn't made a good movie in 20 years, and after he praised Terminator: Genisys, I don't take him all that seriously anymore.
Lol @ Titanic and Avatar, two critically and commercially successful movies that have made nearly $5 billion combined as bad movies. "Pocahontas in Space!" they all snicker behind their Dorito-dusted keyboards.
Lol he barely,
barely praised Genisys. He principally talked about what he was seeing, not really commenting on the quality. And any person could discern his lack of sincerity.
So he didn't mean what he said about the first 2 movies? Or about Scott?
Quote from: BishopShouldGo on Jan 27, 2017, 11:32:53 PM
Lol @ Titanic and Avatar, two critically and commercially successful movies that have made nearly $5 billion combined as bad movies. "Pocahontas in Space!" they all snicker behind their Dorito-dusted keyboards.
You're a sycophant, you know that, right?
Quote from: SiL on Jan 27, 2017, 10:58:19 PM
Cameron liked AvP.
There's for sure a quote out there where he says he likes
AVP better than the last two
Alien movies, but then he turns around and says something like this:
Quote from: SiL on Jan 28, 2017, 12:08:04 AM
Quote from: BishopShouldGo on Jan 27, 2017, 11:32:53 PM
Lol @ Titanic and Avatar, two critically and commercially successful movies that have made nearly $5 billion combined as bad movies. "Pocahontas in Space!" they all snicker behind their Dorito-dusted keyboards.
You're a sycophant, you know that, right?
Lol.. You took the words right out of my mouth. :laugh:
I think Cameron must be harboring hard feelings over something. Honestly I think he just realized what Ridley meant by "letting his baby get away from him". Why else would he turn 180 on the Terminator franchise. He also had his chance to do alien(ses)(3)(5)(insert title) I bet and let all of them get away from him. Also Avatar and Titanic are good pictures. I mean they are bad in an artistic sense (both had marketing and favorable exchange rates going for them, more than anything else) but they are entertaining and well made. Avatar was a pioneer in 3D, I guess.
I actually just don't know what he is thinking. I mean Cameron's making a total of 4 avatar films so it boggles logic why he would bitch about Ridley making more alien films. They dude might have just been hung over. Yes, it is bitching. :P
Quote from: SiL on Jan 28, 2017, 12:08:04 AM
Quote from: BishopShouldGo on Jan 27, 2017, 11:32:53 PM
Lol @ Titanic and Avatar, two critically and commercially successful movies that have made nearly $5 billion combined as bad movies. "Pocahontas in Space!" they all snicker behind their Dorito-dusted keyboards.
You're a sycophant, you know that, right?
Yes sir. Probably one of the biggest there is. :)
I wouldn't know, Avatar was such garbage that I turned it off halfway through. :P
I liked Titanic, for the record. The last good Cameron film.
The one thing I can say about James Cameron. Since 1986, he has been consistently, inconsistent. On his feelings towards the Alien/s franchise.
Well there is one thing you gotta credit Cameron on for the past 30 some years. He's a team player and supported the industry. The man will go out there and back colleagues and productions. Cough, T:G being a natural progression and AVP at least at first being better than everything else. He gives everything a fair shot before back tracking later on. You know, instead of just coming out like some RT critic and bemoaning a film before it even hits the theater. If someone asks him for support he usually obliges.
Which is why it's odd that he would step on Ridley's foot in this instance.
Quote from: whiterabbit on Jan 28, 2017, 12:34:08 AM
Which is why it's odd that he would step on Ridley's foot in this instance.
I personally don't think he meant what he said as slight against Ridley. I think it's just how Jim Cameron is. People ask for his opinion and He obliges with a candid response. Which is nice, but I don't think he realizes how much weight his words carry or how they can affect others? That's generally why I think for so long, he was completely unaware as to how rude he came off to his production crews i.e. Aliens and so forth.
Quote from: GQSioux on Jan 28, 2017, 12:11:04 AM
Quote from: SiL on Jan 27, 2017, 10:58:19 PM
Cameron liked AvP.
There's for sure a quote out there where he says he likes AVP better than the last two Alien movies, but then he turns around and says something like this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aKnS7CGWNmU
I don't think AvP had been released when he was asked this question.
He never struck me as ever having any great passion for the franchise. He seemed attracted to Alien because of the design of the first film and the way Ridley Scott made it, as opposed to the story and the creature itself. That's the way it's always come across to me so his thoughts now are no surprise.
He has passion, but he's asking a reasonable question. Look at how well he's planning the Avatar sequels, having them being written concurrently. Taking his time, not rushing towards a release date a'la Alien 3. The Avatar universe is being much more meticulously thought out than Alien ever was. In fact, Fox announcing Covenant as the beginning of a new trilogy may be the most planned its ever been. Hopefully Logan and Scott have devised a nice bible for the next two.
Quote from: GQSioux on Jan 28, 2017, 12:11:04 AM
Quote from: SiL on Jan 27, 2017, 10:58:19 PM
Cameron liked AvP.
There's for sure a quote out there where he says he likes AVP better than the last two Alien movies, but then he turns around and says something like this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aKnS7CGWNmU
The quote saying he liked it came after.
I'm trying to remember the last Cameron film I genuinely liked. I'm going with Terminator 2. That was a really good movie. I think maybe the Terminator series has more problems than the Alien series right now. I'm glad Ridley is in charge of Covenant. Just my opinion. ;D
He is right in some respects. Even if Covenant proves to be successful, what story is there left to tell that will cover two more prequels before we arrive at Alien? I'm an avid fan but even I fail to see the point of two more films after this one.
Cameron obviously liked AVP enough to hire Shane Salerno to write one of his Avatar sequels.
True Lies was fun. I wish that would get a bluray release already.
Quote from: echobbase79 on Jan 28, 2017, 02:01:48 AM
True Lies was fun. I wish that would get a bluray release already.
Agreed. That is the last Cameron film that I throughly enjoyed.
Now for the next two films.......
Cameron Direct and Scott Produce.
And then.....
Scott Direct and Cameron Produce.
Make it happen. 8)
Eh, I respect Cameron, but he's said what any reasonable person would say about any new entry in a long established franchise. The jury is always out, for any film.
Quote from: Pvt. Himmel on Jan 28, 2017, 02:45:29 AM
Now for the next two films.......
Cameron Direct and Scott Produce.
And then.....
Scott Direct and Cameron Produce.
Make it happen. 8)
Turn this around and that was originally the plan, I believe.
i am sort of offended he said the things he said today, i for one am happy new movies are being made, and they are looking to be downright terrifying, i first saw alien at 5 yrs old in the drive ins with my dad, something ill never forget, and it etched horror and sci fi into me like nothing ive ever known, but what i found most absurd about camerons comments today, his very own terminator series is in shambles, everything hes said about current alien films, i couldnt even bring myself to buy terminator genysis , and i have a huge sci fi collection, i almost got the feeling james was a lil jealous of ridley
number 1. James Cameron's name loves art.
number 2. James Cameron's name is no artist. He has money to make big budget movies and get away with cashing in on franchises that have great buzz.
number 3. James Cameron's name has lots of money for R&D alone
number 4. James Cameron's name has lots of money for making more money.
number 5. James Cameron is likely 50 different departments ready and willing to generate even more money for those 50 different departments.
number 6. James Cameron doesn't need Ridley Scott to make more money than he does.
Exactly my thoughts about Furrytar... I mean... AVATAR... ::)
Apparently this is all because Ridley wanted to direct an animated The Abyss prequel.
Cameron is asking legitimately fair questions but when you read the entire post he's clearly alluding to Ridley's Alien:Covenant as "even a not-so-great one". I mean sure, Ridley has many not so great movies but in the context of the sentence I think he wholly means Alien: Covenant.
I have no problems suggesting that maybe there is a little pride at work here. I mean really, it's Ridley Scott's Alien vs James Cameron Avatar. Which would make a hell of a match up. Aliens vs Ponies. In all seriousness though, why couldn't it be shots fired?
Quote from: whiterabbit on Jan 28, 2017, 06:28:45 AM
Cameron is asking legitimately fair questions but when you read the entire post he's clearly alluding to Ridley's Alien:Covenant as "even a not-so-great one".
I thought he may be referring to Prometheus there. It can't be about AC because he later remains open to seeing it first. In regards to Prometheus, I remember him saying something along the lines of that even though he liked it, he would have done some things differently.
Quote from: BishopShouldGo on Jan 27, 2017, 11:04:28 PM
James Cameron is so right though. To quote Protozoid from IMDB, whose thoughts I share 100%: "The Alien series was not planned well enough, so the story does not accumulate story power as it goes along. Each movie is just an unrelated episode, not building, expanding, or anything. It wandered around, got lost, and ended. Why would you make a prequel to a story that goes nowhere and ended in an unpopular way? Why would you make a sequel, either?"
Many people are of the mind that Prometheus is confused about what it wants to be, but ironically I think it is ALIEN: COVENANT that doesn't know what it wants to be. How do you make a simple action-horror sequel to a movie like Prometheus? It's both a sequel and a prequel? The main character is gone?
I've always sort of felt the story and characters for Covenant were off. A colony ship, really now?
I've been lurking here for a while, but that quote encompasses two series I am awaiting this year, Covenant and Mass Effect :Andromeda. I hope they both do well.
says the guy who is making THREE SEQUELS TO AVATAR
Quote from: whiterabbit on Jan 28, 2017, 12:19:38 AM
I think Cameron must be harboring hard feelings over something. Honestly I think he just realized what Ridley meant by "letting his baby get away from him". Why else would he turn 180 on the Terminator franchise. He also had his chance to do alien(ses)(3)(5)(insert title) I bet and let all of them get away from him. Also Avatar and Titanic are good pictures. I mean they are bad in an artistic sense (both had marketing and favorable exchange rates going for them, more than anything else) but they are entertaining and well made. Avatar was a pioneer in 3D, I guess.
I actually just don't know what he is thinking. I mean Cameron's making a total of 4 avatar films so it boggles logic why he would bitch about Ridley making more alien films. They dude might have just been hung over. Yes, it is bitching. :P
And I think Cameron knew how his words may have been interpreted when he asks the interviewer not to cut the last part off.
It's quite clear Alien Covenant borrows/is influenced quite heavily from Aliens (i.e Building Better Worlds). I think he's gonna be in for a shock when he sees it.
I think THEN, he'll have a right to express his uncertainty over the franchise. Of course he does now, but we can call him out for it if we don't totally agree.
I know Ridley likes Aliens, but he obviously hasn't obsessively watched it like all of us. I wouldn't be surprised if he's oblivious to how much "Aliens" is in it. I wander how Cameron is gonna gauge that.
Quote"The Alien series was not planned well enough, so the story does not accumulate story power as it goes along. Each movie is just an unrelated episode, not building, expanding, or anything. It wandered around, got lost, and ended. Why would you make a prequel to a story that goes nowhere and ended in an unpopular way? Why would you make a sequel, either?"
Cameron's comments about alien wondering all over the place is unfair. Alien was a standalone film until James Cameron made Aliens. Sure after that it tried to be different and created a disjointed spider nest but what is he comparing the Alien Franchise to? His Terminator series would fit the bill to a tee... but no, I don't think he is thinking about that. No, I honestly believe he is making a comparison to his Avatar Quadrilogy, of which 3 of the 4 movies are being shot one after the other. Why? Because pointing out the Terminator franchise would be like shooting fish in a barrel.
Another thing, just how many people actually "really dislike" the way Prometheus ended? I know some will but most saw it as just an ending. Next question, who here isn't excited for Prometheus 2... yea Alien: Covenant? Even if it is stepping back from Promethean grandeur.
The criticism is unduly harsh. I'd like to tell Cameron to put up or shut up to be honest. He Avatar trilogy could be awesome but like I have said before, out of the two product being offered, I'm invested in the Alien by Ridley Scott.
Quote On a completely different topic: How do you feel about the upcoming Alien sequel, Alien: Covenant?
The franchise has kind of wandered all over the map. Ridley [Scott] did the first film, and he inspired an entire generation of filmmakers and science-fiction fans with that one movie and there have been so many films that stylistically have derived from it, including my own Aliens, which was the legitimate sequel and, I think, the proper heir to his film. I sort of did it as a fanboy. I wanted to honor his film, but also say what I needed to say. After that, I don't take any responsibility.
I don't think it's worked out terribly well. I think we've moved on beyond it. It's like, okay, we've got it, we've got the whole Freudian biomechanoid meme. I've seen it in 100 horror films since. I think both of those films stand at a certain point in time, as a reference point. But is there any validity to doing another one now? I don't know. Maybe. Let's see, jury's out. Let's see what Ridley comes up with. Let me just add to that — and don't cut this part off, please — I will stand in line for any Ridley Scott movie, even a not-so-great one, because he is such an artist, he's such a filmmaker. I always learn from him. And what he does with going back to his own franchise would be fascinating.
I interpret this to mean that Cameron agreed with the original intention to leave the Alien tropes behind a do something new. After Prometheus, he thought we had moved beyond that. Now, he seems to be reacting to the advertising. He isn't in favor of this apparent return to familiar territory, but he's wondering if Ridley has something up his sleeve. But he sounds completely underwhelmed by the advertising, and I agree. So far, it looks like more of the same, and returns are diminishing.
I am going to say something terribly unpopular, but as much as I like Aliens, I think it helped to dilute the whole franchise. I do not like the Queen design over Gigers' designs at all and the idea of an Alien Queen turns the ultimate lifeform from being a scary viral like creature that can make new eggs out of victims into a species that has a huge flaw. The Queen is like the Death Star exhaust port in that respect.
Aliens tried to force political agendas, the vietnam war, globalisation, WMDs and corporate self interest which while noble turned a true horror movie into a war movie.
Quote from: neomorpheus on Jan 28, 2017, 09:42:50 AM
I am going to say something terribly unpopular, but as much as I like Aliens, I think it helped to dilute the whole franchise.
If you are right, don't worry about being popular, and you're right. Even Cameron catches himself thinking at way.
There isn't really anything unpopular about any of that. I love the queen but the entire hive mind bug thing does make the aliens a bit too earthly. Although didn't really notice any of the "self interest" until I was older. It's was just monster and marines and it was perfect. :P
Quote from: Kronnang_Dunn on Jan 28, 2017, 05:25:07 AM
Exactly my thoughts about Furrytar... I mean... AVATAR... ::)
The correct word is
AVATURD. ;)
Quote from: Xenomorphine on Jan 28, 2017, 03:06:10 AM
Quote from: Pvt. Himmel on Jan 28, 2017, 02:45:29 AM
Now for the next two films.......
Cameron Direct and Scott Produce.
And then.....
Scott Direct and Cameron Produce.
Make it happen. 8)
Turn this around and that was originally the plan, I believe.
Well they could still do it. How amazing would it be a team up like that!! Or tackle Alien 5 together knock it out of the park, and give it an amazing end to the franchise. 8)
Glad my view on that is shared by some. I think Cameron has got some idea of where Scott has taken Alien now and perhaps sees it as having written his work out of the franchise as well as the other movies, hence an outspoken U-turn on the franchise as a whole. The way I see it, Scott has taken a few bits he liked from Cameron's Aliens (building better worlds mainly) but I think the idea of a Queen for example might be written out or explained as a freak of evolution.
I'll repeat my personal preference for 'fixing' the queen and eggmorphing abilities. Have the queen produced by a 'victim' getting eggmorphed, and then the morphed egg produces a queen-embryo-laying facehugger.
Normal 'drone' will neutralize a personally selected area for it to be a safe haven to house a queen. Grab multiple victims and render them immovable. Produce an enzym that will eggmorph the victim into an egg. when finished, that egg will grow a facehugger and facehug another victim. a queen will burst then from that victim. keep guarding the queen untill it's able to defend itself and jointly locate an area to start a hive, if the current location isn't supportive. queen will slowly grow additional resin objects to hang on the area to grow it's eggsack and start producing eggs.
first batch will be a dozen drones that will create the hive. next batch will be warriors. when the vincinity has been freed of any potential threats, the drones will act like scouts and find suitable new area, upon which the warriors will infest the area and prepare the queen moving.
anyway, i like cameron's work, but i don't want him to touch another alien movie.
I don't get the hatred towards avatar. .i thought it was one hell of a popcorn fest. .the special effects and 3D ws groundbreaking. .i saw it twice at the cinema. .second time with a buddy who also enjoyed it.. .seriously am i the only person here that actualy enjoyed avatar. .sure the story was a bit similar to dances with wolves and pochahontas. .but i did not even realize that till people started pointing it out all over the net. .u can say what u like about avetar. .it.s still sitting on top for the last. .what 8 years or something. .?
. . And i never even saw a trailer for that movie before it happened. .i just went and saw it. .and when it started i thought. .aww i can tell this is cameron. .it's got that aliens feel to it.. All thats missing is ripley and then sigourney awakes and askes for a smoke. . I was so smitten and immediately immersed. .i love that movie. .not as much as alien and aliens. .but still imo a very awesome sci fi experience. .why the intense hatred towards it. .i will never inderstand. .just because it borrowed some story elements. .?. .whats new these days in any case?
Yeah, my first reaction was "Oh god... They axed Aliens out of continuity, didn't they?" But that can't be it, surely? :o
I've spat on Avatar only because this is an Aliens website. Nothing nocking avatar down , just that it's not a horror featuring the xeno.
I don't think JC meant any disrespect towards Sir Ridley.
And I highly doubt JC feels bitter. The guy has the two most financially successful films under his belt with records that even Star Wars has trouble coming close to.
Quote from: juxtapose on Jan 28, 2017, 05:33:37 PM
I don't get the hatred towards avatar. .i thought it was one hell of a popcorn fest. .the special effects and 3D ws groundbreaking. .i saw it twice at the cinema. .second time with a buddy who also enjoyed it.. .seriously am i the only person here that actualy enjoyed avatar. .sure the story was a bit similar to dances with wolves and pochahontas. .but i did not even realize that till people started pointing it out all over the net. .u can say what u like about avetar. .it.s still sitting on top for the last. .what 8 years or something. .?
. . And i never even saw a trailer for that movie before it happened. .i just went and saw it. .and when it started i thought. .aww i can tell this is cameron. .it's got that aliens feel to it.. All thats missing is ripley and then sigourney awakes and askes for a smoke. . I was so smitten and immediately immersed. .i love that movie. .not as much as alien and aliens. .but still imo a very awesome sci fi experience. .why the intense hatred towards it. .i will never inderstand. .just because it borrowed some story elements. .?. .whats new these days in any case?
No one hates Avatar, well I'm sure some do. It was just boring for me. Also I'm old, so it was the same boring movie that I have seen countless times before. If you're a younger person and saw Avatar, then it could very well be what Aliens is to me. The greatest movie ever made. :) It also follows the Prometheus "taking off their helmets as soon as you landed" thing; apparently you can't have a great movie without having stupid people. Also I'm not Asian I suppose, Asia freaking digged Avatar. Plus the exchange rate in 2010 were ridiculously in favor of Avatar WW gross. 3D had a big deal in that as well. Still, I have no desire to see another. It's like Cameron said, the stories been told already, like a hundred times before Avatar told yet again the same story with the same human like aliens and the same gung-ho marines. It's Transformers by James Cameron. :P
Quote from: BishopShouldGo on Jan 28, 2017, 08:37:30 PM
lol. bitterness. loooooololol.
I wouldn't want to disabuse any haters of that fantasy, but that is absurd.
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-SWK-JNFIfNU/TqTTVRlZbLI/AAAAAAAAFMA/H0DCujlYbKQ/s320/JamesCameron00.jpg
I think it's competition and the stress related to it. Cameron has been taking a lot of crap from his fan base. Crap that I think he takes more seriously than Ridley Scott.
I like James Cameron and I understand people's opinions and views can change over time, but seriously stop flip flopping back and fourth saying there needs to be another alien and you'l do it to there doesn't need to be more. I've seen him do this 4 or 5 times now, I'm getting whip lash.
I think people keep making Alien movies in a way because unconsciously I'm convinced that audiences and fans are disappointed in filmmakers inability to match the quality of those first 2 films. Alien just blew people away and Aliens threw you in for a rollercoaster ride. No other Alien film since has really left such an invigorating IMPACT on people.
Ridley Scott I think is trying too hard to recreate those feelings audiences had back in 1979. Alien Covenant I think has a very solid shot compared to Prometheus which no offense was an utter drag. So I'm hoping as Cameron would say, "Lets see what Ridley comes up with first."
Quote from: whiterabbit on Jan 28, 2017, 09:31:22 PM
Quote from: juxtapose on Jan 28, 2017, 05:33:37 PM
I don't get the hatred towards avatar. .i thought it was one hell of a popcorn fest. .the special effects and 3D ws groundbreaking. .i saw it twice at the cinema. .second time with a buddy who also enjoyed it.. .seriously am i the only person here that actualy enjoyed avatar. .sure the story was a bit similar to dances with wolves and pochahontas. .but i did not even realize that till people started pointing it out all over the net. .u can say what u like about avetar. .it.s still sitting on top for the last. .what 8 years or something. .?
. . And i never even saw a trailer for that movie before it happened. .i just went and saw it. .and when it started i thought. .aww i can tell this is cameron. .it's got that aliens feel to it.. All thats missing is ripley and then sigourney awakes and askes for a smoke. . I was so smitten and immediately immersed. .i love that movie. .not as much as alien and aliens. .but still imo a very awesome sci fi experience. .why the intense hatred towards it. .i will never inderstand. .just because it borrowed some story elements. .?. .whats new these days in any case?
No one hates Avatar, well I'm sure some do. It was just boring for me. Also I'm old, so it was the same boring movie that I have seen countless times before. If you're a younger person and saw Avatar, then it could very well be what Aliens is to me. The greatest movie ever made. :) It also follows the Prometheus "taking off their helmets as soon as you landed" thing; apparently you can't have a great movie without having stupid people. Also I'm not Asian I suppose, Asia freaking digged Avatar. Plus the exchange rate in 2010 were ridiculously in favor of Avatar WW gross. 3D had a big deal in that as well. Still, I have no desire to see another. It's like Cameron said, the stories been told already, like a hundred times before Avatar told yet again the same story with the same human like aliens and the same gung-ho marines. It's Transformers by James Cameron. :P
Quote from: BishopShouldGo on Jan 28, 2017, 08:37:30 PM
lol. bitterness. loooooololol.
I wouldn't want to disabuse any haters of that fantasy, but that is absurd.
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-SWK-JNFIfNU/TqTTVRlZbLI/AAAAAAAAFMA/H0DCujlYbKQ/s320/JamesCameron00.jpg
I think it's competition and the stress related to it. Cameron has been taking a lot of crap from his fan base. Crap that I think he takes more seriously than Ridley Scott.
Lol Cameron's too busy expanding the world of Avatar, New Zealand farming, philanthropic endeavors, creating new technology, etc. He doesn't have time for that. And he's not in competition with Ridley, and is a guy that doesn't get stressed and if he does get stressed it's for something that actually matters and he would be able to manage it anyway.
He's a playboy is what you mean to say.
Quote from: Chronicle on Jan 28, 2017, 10:36:20 PM
I think people keep making Alien movies in a way because unconsciously I'm convinced that audiences and fans are disappointed in filmmakers inability to match the quality of those first 2 films. Alien just blew people away and Aliens threw you in for a rollercoaster ride. No other Alien film since has really left such an invigorating IMPACT on people.
Ridley Scott I think is trying too hard to recreate those feelings audiences had back in 1979. Alien Covenant I think has a very solid shot compared to Prometheus which no offense was an utter drag. So I'm hoping as Cameron would say, "Lets see what Ridley comes up with first."
Alien³ is a great movie even with Bishop planting the egg on the sulaco thereby killing Hick's and Newt. It a damn fine film that knew how to rip ones soul out and step all over it. :)
Quote from: whiterabbit on Jan 29, 2017, 12:06:26 AM
Alien³ is a great movie even with Bishop planting the egg on the sulaco thereby killing Hick's and Newt. It a damn fine film that knew how to rip ones soul out and step all over it. :)
Wait. I don't remember hearing Bishop say he planted the egg on the sulaco in Alien³? Unless it was mentioned in Colonial Marines? Or was that the explanation for the eggs appearance in the W-Y report?
Quote from: JungleHunter87 on Jan 29, 2017, 12:17:55 AM
Quote from: whiterabbit on Jan 29, 2017, 12:06:26 AM
Alien³ is a great movie even with Bishop planting the egg on the sulaco thereby killing Hick's and Newt. It a damn fine film that knew how to rip ones soul out and step all over it. :)
Wait. I don't remember hearing Bishop say he planted the egg on the sulaco in Alien³? Unless it was mentioned in Colonial Marines? Or was that the explanation for the eggs appearance in the W-Y report?
Oh no, don't take that as anything but sarcasm on my part. Although we all choose to believe what we want too. :P
Quote from: whiterabbit on Jan 29, 2017, 12:20:27 AM
Quote from: JungleHunter87 on Jan 29, 2017, 12:17:55 AM
Quote from: whiterabbit on Jan 29, 2017, 12:06:26 AM
Alien³ is a great movie even with Bishop planting the egg on the sulaco thereby killing Hick's and Newt. It a damn fine film that knew how to rip ones soul out and step all over it. :)
Wait. I don't remember hearing Bishop say he planted the egg on the sulaco in Alien³? Unless it was mentioned in Colonial Marines? Or was that the explanation for the eggs appearance in the W-Y report?
Oh no, don't take that as anything but sarcasm on my part. Although we all choose to believe what we want too. :P
Okay, gotcha! ;)
At first I was like "What?!", I must of missed something somewhere.
huh?. .did bishop plant that egg. .omg are u kidding?. .is that what actually happened. .cause i always thought that a facehigger must have slipped onboard while no one was looking. .i never knew. .i should watch it again. .
oh ok. .never mind. .lol. .u really had me their. .what an interesting twist that would have been. .bishop turning out to be another evil android. .just as he gained everyone's trust. . Lol
NO MORE EGG TALK FOR THE LOVE OF GOD MAKE IT STOP NOT AGAIN IT IS MADNESS! NO! *Cover ears and sings really loudly* "Goodbye horses, I'm flying over you....!"
Yea, my bad. All this egg talk will ruin breakfast. :P Although there is a hundred page thread in the Alien forum for those who dare wonder.... http://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/index.php?topic=9.0
Bishop planting the egg there is one of many theories which attempt - and fail - to logically account for the magical teleporting egg. From what I remember, the producers literally thought the audience would be dumb enough not to question its existence. No deeper than that.
Quote from: whiterabbit on Jan 28, 2017, 06:28:45 AM
Cameron is asking legitimately fair questions but when you read the entire post he's clearly alluding to Ridley's Alien:Covenant as "even a not-so-great one". I mean sure, Ridley has many not so great movies but in the context of the sentence I think he wholly means Alien: Covenant.
Far more likely to mean euther '
Prometheus' (which I believe he referred to, in a Reddit session, as feeling it, "Didn't add up logically," which is the opinion of much of the fandom) or one of his other films which weren't exactly a classic.
Ridley Scott doesn't shit gold. He has his own share of flawed projects, too.
QuoteI have no problems suggesting that maybe there is a little pride at work here. I mean really, it's Ridley Scott's Alien vs James Cameron Avatar.
Why? It was never exclusively Scott's. '
Alien' was very much a collaborative venture.
There's no 'versus' about it and they're good friends.
I even remember something about an advanced screening of '
Avatar' being what convinced RS to make '
Prometheus' a 3D project.
Quote from: neomorpheus on Jan 28, 2017, 09:42:50 AM
I do not like the Queen design over Gigers' designs at all
For the record, it was based on and heavily inspired by Giger's own earlier art - and Giger, himself, loved her.
Talking about Prometheus to Covenant and it's likely sequels vs Cameron's soon to be 4 Avatar movies. I think it's a little more because for me, it is the director of Alien and the director of Aliens who have two similar yet different products being brought to market over the next few years. The Aliens vs Avatar thing. I'm sure they have great relations but there still has to be some competitive fire there. I mean if there wasn't then why even say anything to begin with.
You trying to taunt us into going full egg? :P
Guys, why are we trying to egg-splain the Alien 3 intro on a James Cameron opinion thread about Alien: Covenant?
The franchise IS all over the place since Prometheus. Im not saying Prometheus was bad or great, its just that Prometheus did create discrepancies and a whole new genisys of the creature. Before Prometheus, everything was pretty much in order for decades - queen lays the egg, egg contains a facehugger, facehugger impregnates the host, chestburster bursts through the chest, an alien is born, gathers hosts, kills enemies, sets up the hive etc. Prometheus changed that and Ridley making it havent even remembered the other movies , at one point he said "one was set in a prison, wasnt it?" so ..you know. Its not your usual sequel that tries to fit in with the mythology and set ground rules, so the alien biology for example now IS all over the place. You can make a case that AVP:R did that first with Predalien tho, but not to that extent
Im also against any more alien movies. I think the story ended beautifully with Alien 3 and it shouldve stayed this way.
Btw, the terminator revival thing is just a hearsay rumor which to my personal knowledge is nothing but a baseless rumor
Im amazed what people read into these comments. Im also personally amazed that people still want more alien movies after everything weve got after Alien 3
tarantino didnt like Prometheus either btw, i guess hes also offending entire alien fanbase
Cameron only wants to ensure his contribution to the franchise remains the test to which all others are measured. Alien 5 needs to be made to end the confusion that the mess called Prometheus created. The ideas blomkamp present are far more interesting than anything Cameron proposes.
for the record, Tarantino liked Prometheus.
...and he also thought it was dumb af.
How did Prometheus change the basic life cycle?
http://metro.co.uk/2017/01/29/james-cameron-throws-ironic-shade-at-ridley-scott-for-making-another-alien-sequel-6412750/?ito=twitter
Interesting reading some interpretations from the press.
Quote from: StrangeShape on Jan 29, 2017, 06:58:47 AMIm also personally amazed that people still want more alien movies after everything weve got after Alien 3
I find this positively amazing, myself.
Quote from: StrangeShapetarantino didnt like Prometheus either btw, i guess hes also offending entire alien fanbase
I'll be honest. It's his opinion. However I don't give two rats about tarantino movies. I actually looked up his filmography too. Pulp fiction, inglorious bastards... the hateful 8. Yea, lots of people love that and that's great. The world is a wonderful place with diverse opinions but I don't care about his. I do care about Cameron's though.
Quote from: SuicideDoors on Jan 29, 2017, 10:56:41 AM
http://metro.co.uk/2017/01/29/james-cameron-throws-ironic-shade-at-ridley-scott-for-making-another-alien-sequel-6412750/?ito=twitter
Interesting reading some interpretations from the press.
See, even the sort of press gets it. I mean I full heartily believe it was Cameron's intention to light a fire under someones ass. Presumably Scott's.
Not at all. He's just stating that the Alien franchise has painted itself into a corner, cinematically speaking. We all know that... and that's exactly why Scott made Prometheus in the first place.
I for one am cautiously optimistic, particularly because Alien: Covenant reunites Ridley Scott with screenwriter John Logan. This is the duo responsible for bringing audiences the critically acclaimed 2000 film Gladiator. It earned $457million worldwide, as well as nabbing five Academy Awards and nominations for a further seven.
Prometheus was packed with mesmerizing visuals, and it's my stance that John Logan's take on Covenant's script will balance out the visceral element with equally great storytelling. 8)
I think as long as Scott improves some of the elements that didn't work quite so well in Prometheus, I think Covenant will be at least a good sci-fi/thriller in its own right... wether it expands the narrative in a qualitative way remains to be seen. I certainly think the trailer makes it look a bit more, aesethically, like the original. I'm quietly confident...
Quote from: Pvt. Himmel on Jan 29, 2017, 04:49:41 PM
I for one am cautiously optimistic, particularly because Alien: Covenant reunites Ridley Scott with screenwriter John Logan. This is the duo responsible for bringing audiences the critically acclaimed 2000 film Gladiator. It earned $897 million worldwide, as well as nabbing five Academy Awards and nominations for a further seven.
897 million? Excluding DVD and Blu Ray sells,
Gladiator sold cinema tickets worth 457 million. It didn't earn 457 million. You have to consider budget (103 million), cost of distribution and marketing. Box office is not equal with real profit.
Quote from: Ingwar on Jan 29, 2017, 05:03:53 PM
Quote from: Pvt. Himmel on Jan 29, 2017, 04:49:41 PM
I for one am cautiously optimistic, particularly because Alien: Covenant reunites Ridley Scott with screenwriter John Logan. This is the duo responsible for bringing audiences the critically acclaimed 2000 film Gladiator. It earned $897 million worldwide, as well as nabbing five Academy Awards and nominations for a further seven.
897 million? Excluding DVD and Blu Ray sells, Gladiator sold cinema tickets worth 457 million. It didn't earn 457 million. You have to consider budget (103 million), cost of distribution and marketing. Box office is not equal with real profit.
Oops, typo.. Sorry. :laugh:
Yeah I see what you mean.
Quote from: SM on Jan 29, 2017, 09:53:48 AM
How did Prometheus change the basic life cycle?
We will have to see how Covenant advances the new ideas, but with the black goo introduced that changes everyones dna into something close to xenos and facehuggers, it seems like anyone can become half xeno just by touching, drinking of inhaling the magic goo. Through that, we already had an octopus instead of a facehugger and not a larva bursting from the host but a fully developed specimen
Is there any validity in making 3 more Avatar sequels nobody wants to see?
Quote from: howard.moody.566 on Jan 29, 2017, 09:46:18 PM
Is there any validity in making 3 more Avatar sequels nobody wants to see?
There will NEVER be a time where James Cameron makes a movie that nobody wants to see, since 1984 I can't think of a single movie he's made that hasn't been a huge success. If he seems to think he has 3 more Avatar stories to tell then all power to him, I'm sure they'll make a ton of money.
Quote from: howard.moody.566 on Jan 29, 2017, 09:46:18 PM
Is there any validity in making 3 more Avatar sequels nobody wants to see?
Avatar is the highest grossing movie of all time, that's a really strong argument for making a sequel.
Granted waiting nearly a decade to make a sequel might be a questionable business decision, but the end result might still rake in loads of cash, who knows?
Not sure if the Abyss raked in a ton of money but everything else was pretty much net. Abyss is also a great film though.
Looks like the media is taking a fairly negative spin to Cameron's comments. They're making him look a bit like he's bashing Covenant...
Is Avatar a good movie? I've never seen it.
Quote from: echobbase79 on Jan 30, 2017, 04:53:41 AM
Is Avatar a good movie? I've never seen it.
Neither have I. :P
One of these days I'll get around to it.
Quote from: echobbase79 on Jan 30, 2017, 04:53:41 AM
Is Avatar a good movie? I've never seen it.
srsly?
It's fun but excrutiatingly predictable and lacking in subtlety.
Quote from: Xenomrph on Jan 30, 2017, 04:58:52 AM
Quote from: echobbase79 on Jan 30, 2017, 04:53:41 AM
Is Avatar a good movie? I've never seen it.
Neither have I. :P
One of these days I'll get around to it.
I enjoyed it personally, it's quite fun.
Some bits can be predictable, it's got the "white guy saves natives" kind of plot. People compared it to Dances with Wolves.
But, as a sci fi alien movie, it reverses the roles of your usual alien invasion film where it's humans this time who invade a planet for its resources.
I'd say if you ever get the chance, give it a watch and judge for yourselves.
If for anything else, the final battle is gangbusters Cameron style
Sam Worthington's in it. Yea, whatever happened to that guy. He was rumored to be the next big cheese back then.
Quote from: StrangeShape on Jan 30, 2017, 05:48:24 AM
If for anything else, the final battle is gangbusters Cameron style
I've gotta ask, where did gangbusters come from? First I'd heard of that was Cameron describing Alien 3.2 last year.
In regards to the topic at hand - I'd agree if it was just going to be a retread. But that doesn't seem to be what Scott is doing. He's world building and expanding the mythology. Prometheus was a misfire for me because it took away what Scott was initially doing - explaining the origins of Alien - because it stripped those actual Alien elements and kept the alikes in there. Covenant (and the prequels I'm assuming)seems to be steering back to that original intentional.
Whether we're going to like what Scott is serving is a different question, but it's not like he's rehashing the other films. That we know of, anyway.
Quote from: echobbase79 on Jan 30, 2017, 04:53:41 AM
Is Avatar a good movie? I've never seen it.
It was okay. Nothing special. If anything, I think it's success was likely down to the major turn towards 3D around that time. Narratively, it's quite boring. I fell asleep the second time I tried to watch it. I haven't watched it again since.
Avatar is okay. I watched it once with my brother, and once on my own. The plot really didn't do it for me, and the end battle is okay... Though Camereon's script really had me rooting for Quatrich and his PMC's over the lead(Jake?). Seriously, Our Hero flips sides in a heartbeat by comparison to say... Dances With Wolves, where it takes Dunbar quite awhile before he really flips.
As to Abyss, it was in competition with two... Maybe three other very very similar movies. One of which was Leviathan, and I forget the other one, Deep Water something or other? Basically a bunch of deep sea "horror" movies all at once, and that's why Abyss didn't do as good as it could have.
I don't know how successful it was, but I've always thought True Lies would fit into the realm of "lesser Cameron." Not because it's bad, it's really quite good, but it does come right in between Terminator 2 and Titanic. Surrounded by titans.
Also, i'm still not convinced Ridley is doing a whole other trilogy. My gut really tells me that Covenant is #2, and then he might do one more that leads directly into Alien.
Quote from: OpenMaw on Jan 30, 2017, 10:23:33 AM
Avatar is okay. I watched it once with my brother, and once on my own. The plot really didn't do it for me, and the end battle is okay... Though Camereon's script really had me rooting for Quatrich and his PMC's over the lead(Jake?). Seriously, Our Hero flips sides in a heartbeat by comparison to say... Dances With Wolves, where it takes Dunbar quite awhile before he really flips.
As to Abyss, it was in competition with two... Maybe three other very very similar movies. One of which was Leviathan, and I forget the other one, Deep Water something or other? Basically a bunch of deep sea "horror" movies all at once, and that's why Abyss didn't do as good as it could have.
I don't know how successful it was, but I've always thought True Lies would fit into the realm of "lesser Cameron." Not because it's bad, it's really quite good, but it does come right in between Terminator 2 and Titanic. Surrounded by titans.
Also, i'm still not convinced Ridley is doing a whole other trilogy. My gut really tells me that Covenant is #2, and then he might do one more that leads directly into Alien.
Yeah i think you're right seeing as how there is not that much time left between Covvie, and Alien.
Every interview I read with James Cameron leaves me wonder if he has an uppers habit.
Quote from: OpenMaw on Jan 30, 2017, 10:23:33 AM
Avatar is okay. I watched it once with my brother, and once on my own. The plot really didn't do it for me, and the end battle is okay... Though Camereon's script really had me rooting for Quatrich and his PMC's over the lead(Jake?). Seriously, Our Hero flips sides in a heartbeat by comparison to say... Dances With Wolves, where it takes Dunbar quite awhile before he really flips.
As to Abyss, it was in competition with two... Maybe three other very very similar movies. One of which was Leviathan, and I forget the other one, Deep Water something or other? Basically a bunch of deep sea "horror" movies all at once, and that's why Abyss didn't do as good as it could have.
.
Deep Star Six. The difference is the Abyss, in its full uncut form is a pretty decent movie. The cut version is not so good.
Quote from: Corporal Hicks on Jan 30, 2017, 09:10:44 AM
Quote from: StrangeShape on Jan 30, 2017, 05:48:24 AM
If for anything else, the final battle is gangbusters Cameron style
I've gotta ask, where did gangbusters come from? First I'd heard of that was Cameron describing Alien 3.2 last year.
In regards to the topic at hand - I'd agree if it was just going to be a retread. But that doesn't seem to be what Scott is doing. He's world building and expanding the mythology. Prometheus was a misfire for me because it took away what Scott was initially doing - explaining the origins of Alien - because it stripped those actual Alien elements and kept the alikes in there. Covenant (and the prequels I'm assuming)seems to be steering back to that original intentional.
Whether we're going to like what Scott is serving is a different question, but it's not like he's rehashing the other films. That we know of, anyway.
Quote from: echobbase79 on Jan 30, 2017, 04:53:41 AM
Is Avatar a good movie? I've never seen it.
It was okay. Nothing special. If anything, I think it's success was likely down to the major turn towards 3D around that time. Narratively, it's quite boring. I fell asleep the second time I tried to watch it. I haven't watched it again since.
Gangbusters! Ha! I was thinking the exact same thing..
I saw Avatar twice in theatres. Loved it. But I also got physically ill twice from the epic special effects. Its definitely an eye candy movie. Go in to see beautiful Cameron camera work and let go of clinging onto hopes of a great story. How he hopes to make another 3 films of this? Not sure. But I suspect the whole angle of interconnectivity is what it's going to be about. The blue creatures are connected as if by an organic internet. In a way, this gives them immortality. It's been implied in the film that this is the real treasure of the planet, not unobtainium. I think this is right. By the end of the series, I think we will see this change humanity so that we are all interconnected with a bio-internet.
Quote from: Pvt. Himmel on Jan 30, 2017, 11:14:15 AM
Yeah i think you're right seeing as how there is not that much time left between Covvie, and Alien.
60+ years, isn't there? He's making the trilogy and this is the second movie.
Quote from: Robopadna on Jan 30, 2017, 07:32:37 PM
Quote from: Pvt. Himmel on Jan 30, 2017, 11:14:15 AM
Yeah i think you're right seeing as how there is not that much time left between Covvie, and Alien.
60+ years, isn't there? He's making the trilogy and this is the second movie.
Covenant occurs in 2103 and Alien in 2122 I believe.
Quote from: StrangeShape on Jan 29, 2017, 05:24:41 PM
Quote from: SM on Jan 29, 2017, 09:53:48 AM
How did Prometheus change the basic life cycle?
We will have to see how Covenant advances the new ideas, but with the black goo introduced that changes everyones dna into something close to xenos and facehuggers, it seems like anyone can become half xeno just by touching, drinking of inhaling the magic goo. Through that, we already had an octopus instead of a facehugger and not a larva bursting from the host but a fully developed specimen
Similarities in monsters doesn't change anything in the Alien life cycle though.
To those that mentioned they haven't seen AVATAR yet, may I suggest you forget about watching the 'theatrical' version, and instead seek out the 'extended collector's edition' cut instead.
The additional 'Future Earth' scenes make for a far, far better beginning to the movie in my opinion, and give a satisfyingly grimy juxtaposition before we get to the lush 'Pandora' planet. I really wish that intro. hadn't been cut for the theatrical release version.
https://twitter.com/sjnews/status/826199717696516096
Must say I share the sentiments of this report.
What the everloving f**k is wrong with people, seriously.
"Cameron says sequels to one series aren't necessary while making sequels to another series! LOL WHAT A HYPOCRITE!!"
This is why I hate Internet commentary. People who can't string together a logical argument are given massive platforms to convince others that their inability to interpret information is insight.
Word.
I thought this was going to be about Avatar and Terminator?
Quote from: SM on Jan 30, 2017, 04:59:53 AM
Quote from: echobbase79 on Jan 30, 2017, 04:53:41 AM
Is Avatar a good movie? I've never seen it.
srsly?
It's fun but excrutiatingly predictable and lacking in subtlety.
I think Cameron was focusing on the new tech to deliver the movie instead of the story. It's his
Phantom Menace some have said though I enjoy that film. I'm thinking of picking up a copy of it on Amazon for a $1.
It's curious that Cameronwants to keep taking 3-d to the next level and advancing the technology, while the industry is largely moving away from producing 3-d TVs now. There's not enough good content, and so the production of 3-d tvs is winding down..
Had Cameron picked up the pace on his films, maybe it would have made a difference?
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4170040/Major-3D-TV-manufacturers-scrapping-sets.html
I think he's more focused on cinema. That aside though, George Lucas was pushing for better sound in cinemas since the 70s, but surround sound in the home didn't really get affordable till the late 90s.
Maybe Cameron is looking for what's next.
We have one 3D-TV and have only ever used it on its test channel. It was nausea inducing.
3D doesn't work. We keep trying, it keeps dying. 20s, 50s, 80s, ~2010s (Avatar was what, '09?). Every 30 years we drag its corpse out of the gutter, brush it off, dress it up, say it's new, and then within 10 years it's dead in a ditch again.
I never got the point of the Cameron championed 'depth' look. Where stuff doesn't really pop out, but the image had a 3 dimensional depth. I've heard it works okay for stuff like IMAX where the picture is taking up your whole field of vision, but normal theatres the illusion was immediately wrecked by the edged of the screen.
Plus, I dunno if it's because I where glasses, but those floaty flowery things in Avatar that everyone oohed and aahed about just looked like blurry blobs.
I remember really looking forward to Phantom Menace in 3D, but apart from the opening titles, the 3D angle was just meh. You need to have shit popping out of the screen every now and then. No movie was ever made better by 3D.
Except Jaws 3D. That was f**king ace in 3D.
Quote from: SiL on Jan 30, 2017, 11:50:14 PM
What the everloving f**k is wrong with people, seriously.
"Cameron says sequels to one series aren't necessary while making sequels to another series! LOL WHAT A HYPOCRITE!!"
This is why I hate Internet commentary. People who can't string together a logical argument are given massive platforms to convince others that their inability to interpret information is insight.
This.
It's a moot point of discussion, really. He answers his own question:
"...is there any validity to doing another one now?"
with:
"I will stand in line for any Ridley Scott movie, even a not-so-great one, because he is such an artist, he's such a filmmaker. I always learn from him. And what he does with going back to his own franchise would be fascinating."
I don't see the big deal.
-Windebieste.
Quote from: windebieste on Jan 31, 2017, 01:53:01 AM
It's a moot point of discussion, really. He answers his own question:
"...is there any validity to doing another one now?"
with:
"I will stand in line for any Ridley Scott movie, even a not-so-great one, because he is such an artist, he's such a filmmaker. I always learn from him. And what he does with going back to his own franchise would be fascinating."
I don't see the big deal.
-Windebieste.
^
Quote from: SiL on Jan 30, 2017, 11:50:14 PM
What the everloving f**k is wrong with people, seriously.
"Cameron says sequels to one series aren't necessary while making sequels to another series! LOL WHAT A HYPOCRITE!!"
This is why I hate Internet commentary. People who can't string together a logical argument are given massive platforms to convince others that their inability to interpret information is insight.
But that's what everyone does. Cameron isn't above the criticism because you think us "everloving f**k people" don't honestly believe he put his foot squarely into his own mouth.
Quote from: windebieste on Jan 31, 2017, 01:53:01 AM
It's a moot point of discussion, really. He answers his own question:
"...is there any validity to doing another one now?"
with:
"I will stand in line for any Ridley Scott movie, even a not-so-great one, because he is such an artist, he's such a filmmaker. I always learn from him. And what he does with going back to his own franchise would be fascinating."
I don't see the big deal.
-Windebieste.
Yea it isn't a big deal.
Hypocrisy doesn't invalidate his points.
We can buy tickets for Covenant without approving of what it represents: fan-baiting.
It sounds like Cameron is in the same boat as any Alien fan, except that he knows Ridley personally. He is articulating the same stuff I feel, but he has to be careful about saying it in public because Ridley is a friend.
I think those were probably off the cuff remarks by Cameron and he had no idea how much traction they would get.
But his backhanded compliment was aces. Or gangbusters.
Quote from: whiterabbit on Jan 31, 2017, 03:25:42 AM
Quote from: SiL on Jan 30, 2017, 11:50:14 PM
What the everloving f**k is wrong with people, seriously.
"Cameron says sequels to one series aren't necessary while making sequels to another series! LOL WHAT A HYPOCRITE!!"
This is why I hate Internet commentary. People who can't string together a logical argument are given massive platforms to convince others that their inability to interpret information is insight.
But that's what everyone does. Cameron isn't above the criticism because you think us "everloving f**k people" don't honestly believe he put his foot squarely into his own mouth.
Yeah, absolutely. It's got to that point though now where it's upsetting certain people, cause we're misconstruing what James Cameron said. My fault I should never have shared another link!
Quote from: Protozoid on Jan 31, 2017, 03:38:50 AM
Being a hypocrite doesn't make his points invalid.
We can buy tickets for Covenant without approving of what it represents: fan-baiting.
Ultimately, this is true. Unless Covenant somehow ends up being supremely inventive and a cracking prequel/follow up.
Quote from: whiterabbit on Jan 31, 2017, 03:25:42 AM
But that's what everyone does. Cameron isn't above the criticism because you think us "everloving f**k people" don't honestly believe he put his foot squarely into his own mouth.
Saying he's a hypocrite for saying one particular franchise is run down, while still working on his own, is asinine and grossly misunderstands what hypocrisy is. He's not saying "The Alien franchise is run down"
while making an Alien movie.
That would be hypocrisy. Nor is he saying "All sequels are stupid/pointless/whatever". That would
also be hypocrisy.
Quote from: SiL on Jan 31, 2017, 04:49:57 AM
Saying he's a hypocrite for saying one particular franchise is run down, while still working on his own, is asinine and grossly misunderstands what hypocrisy is. He's not saying "The Alien franchise is run down" while making an Alien movie. That would be hypocrisy. Nor is he saying "All sequels are stupid/pointless/whatever". That would also be hypocrisy.
I'm in the same boat. I don't see the hypocrisy. He clearly had some definite ideas for a cohesive vision for the '
Avatar' series and is going to try and do something about it. The '
Alien' films are very different. There was no one world-building vision, just lots of different people getting hired to make their own differing contributions.
One series has a proverbial shepard in the process of steering it in a particular direction. The other never did and its integrity has suffered as a consequence.
"James Cameron's Notes on Mythbusters's Titanic Episode: 'They Are Full of S**t'"
http://www.vulture.com/2017/01/james-cameron-titanic.html?mid=twitter_vulture
"They're fun guys and I loved doing that show with them, but they're full of shit."
:D
Dude's got a point regarding the myth :P
i had a class tonight where Allison Gillogly Director of Development for Scott Free Productions attended for an interview and she said she saw alien covenant and said it was f@#@$king terrifying.
He kinda contradicted himself when he said he was going to see Alien Covenant...
Quote from: Necronomicon II on Jan 31, 2017, 06:28:18 AM
"James Cameron's Notes on Mythbusters's Titanic Episode: 'They Are Full of S**t'"
http://www.vulture.com/2017/01/james-cameron-titanic.html?mid=twitter_vulture
"They're fun guys and I loved doing that show with them, but they're full of shit."
:D
he's godd*mm right he is.
i never got that stupid episode on mythbusting that scene as you completely ignore that the entire movie was factually incorrect.
that's why cameron is right to mention he gave her a seat on the liferaft, but the dumb b*tch killed jack right there by getting off that f*cking lifeboat,
to then stay on a floating door or whatever it was and see jack die from the cold water, only to later be rescued to board a LIFEBOAT again.
alone, but this time, THANKS TO HER, jack's dead.
for f*cks sake, if she stayed on that effing boat, he could have climbed himself onto a door and float untill the search party came and he'd be ALIVE.
it's the stupidest thing to happen and its covered up by the idea that it was romantic. it was stupid and dumb.
and then mythbusters - short of ideas - follows this dumb idea and presents a even more retarded solution without taking into account reality. tells you all about the show, really. it's not factual, it's entertainment, and then the even dumber braindead general population thinks mythbusting is scientific and then cameron gets shots fired by these nonsense, like has been done to other actors, directors, etc. from these retard episodes.
kudos to cameron for saying it like it is. burn them.
Quote from: SiL on Jan 31, 2017, 04:49:57 AM
Quote from: whiterabbit on Jan 31, 2017, 03:25:42 AM
But that's what everyone does. Cameron isn't above the criticism because you think us "everloving f**k people" don't honestly believe he put his foot squarely into his own mouth.
Saying he's a hypocrite for saying one particular franchise is run down, while still working on his own, is asinine and grossly misunderstands what hypocrisy is. He's not saying "The Alien franchise is run down" while making an Alien movie. That would be hypocrisy. Nor is he saying "All sequels are stupid/pointless/whatever". That would also be hypocrisy.
Oh boy, not this again. No one sai... you know what, forget it. Better off having a cup of tea with the aliens.
Quote from: Xenomorphine on Jan 31, 2017, 06:13:41 AM
Quote from: SiL on Jan 31, 2017, 04:49:57 AM
Saying he's a hypocrite for saying one particular franchise is run down, while still working on his own, is asinine and grossly misunderstands what hypocrisy is. He's not saying "The Alien franchise is run down" while making an Alien movie. That would be hypocrisy. Nor is he saying "All sequels are stupid/pointless/whatever". That would also be hypocrisy.
I'm in the same boat. I don't see the hypocrisy. He clearly had some definite ideas for a cohesive vision for the 'Avatar' series and is going to try and do something about it. The 'Alien' films are very different. There was no one world-building vision, just lots of different people getting hired to make their own differing contributions.
One series has a proverbial shepard in the process of steering it in a particular direction. The other never did and its integrity has suffered as a consequence.
This is exactly why an alternative telling of the story IMO is justified (read retcon). It's not like doing that would trample over some sacred vision of the author. If you were to take the Harry Potter series and try to retcon a section, I'd say that's unjustified, but the Aliens series? Anything goes (as long as it's not Alien or Aliens). I agree with Cameron that those two films are the primary building blocks of the series.
Quote from: Perfect-Organism on Jan 31, 2017, 07:29:08 PM
Quote from: Xenomorphine on Jan 31, 2017, 06:13:41 AM
Quote from: SiL on Jan 31, 2017, 04:49:57 AM
Saying he's a hypocrite for saying one particular franchise is run down, while still working on his own, is asinine and grossly misunderstands what hypocrisy is. He's not saying "The Alien franchise is run down" while making an Alien movie. That would be hypocrisy. Nor is he saying "All sequels are stupid/pointless/whatever". That would also be hypocrisy.
I'm in the same boat. I don't see the hypocrisy. He clearly had some definite ideas for a cohesive vision for the 'Avatar' series and is going to try and do something about it. The 'Alien' films are very different. There was no one world-building vision, just lots of different people getting hired to make their own differing contributions.
One series has a proverbial shepard in the process of steering it in a particular direction. The other never did and its integrity has suffered as a consequence.
This is exactly why an alternative telling of the story IMO is justified (read retcon). It's not like doing that would trample over some sacred vision of the author. If you were to take the Harry Potter series and try to retcon a section, I'd say that's unjustified, but the Aliens series? Anything goes (as long as it's not Alien or Aliens). I agree with Cameron that those two films are the primary building blocks of the series.
I know it's not a big deal but just what if that is the reason for Cameron's declaration of "including my own Aliens, which was the legitimate sequel and, I think, the proper heir to his film. I sort of did it as a fanboy. I wanted to honor his film, but also say what I needed to say. After that, I don't take any responsibility." I mean it sure sounds like something is getting retcon, we all assume it's Alien³ and A|R but Ridley and Cameron are friends, what if Ridley told Cameron that he is going to retcon Aliens too?
That would be the Jack..
Quote from: whiterabbit on Jan 31, 2017, 09:07:11 AM
Quote from: SiL on Jan 31, 2017, 04:49:57 AM
Quote from: whiterabbit on Jan 31, 2017, 03:25:42 AM
But that's what everyone does. Cameron isn't above the criticism because you think us "everloving f**k people" don't honestly believe he put his foot squarely into his own mouth.
Saying he's a hypocrite for saying one particular franchise is run down, while still working on his own, is asinine and grossly misunderstands what hypocrisy is. He's not saying "The Alien franchise is run down" while making an Alien movie. That would be hypocrisy. Nor is he saying "All sequels are stupid/pointless/whatever". That would also be hypocrisy.
Oh boy, not this again. No one sai... you know what, forget it. Better off having a cup of tea with the aliens.
I wouldn't say that he is a hypocrite - but I will say this, if - say - Neill Blomkamp made his Aliens movie, with Ripley, Hicks and Newt, and it was
good, or
looked good (he'd need to change some things, in my opinion) - Jim would quite likely throw up his hands and be like, "fine." It is quite obvious from his comments that he was referring to Blomkamp's film, he's obviously got misgivings about it.
Quote from: whiterabbit on Jan 31, 2017, 09:07:11 AM
Oh boy, not this again. No one sai... you know what, forget it. Better off having a cup of tea with the aliens.
That's what that particular video is implying with the "Cameron trashes sequels while making sequels" comment at the beginning, then asking if he should shut up about sequels at the end.
People can criticise Cameron's comments, but the "lol he's making sequels he should shut up about sequels" shit is dumb.
It by itself, perhaps. But is it completely necessary to make 4-5 Avatar sequels, in tandem? He's saying the Alien series is out of steam, and here he is putting all his chips on the table for a series that really isn't a series, yet, just a single film. Furthermore, the writing for that film was so bland and heavy handed, I can't imagine there being 1 or 2 sequels, let alone 4 or 5.
The man can say what he wants, and the fact that he's making sequels in and of itself has nothing to do with my skepticism . I don't think his question is without merit, but again, barring Prometheus, the last Alien film was made in 1997, right? It's been awhile. It's not like Cameron, himself, who's planning on churning one of these Avatar films out every two years without questioning his own motives under the same light, or the rumors behind him resurrecting the Terminator series, after many sub-par outings (all of which I enjoyed, on some level).
I just don't understand his question, given his own actions.
Is anything necessary? Gee, I don't know, Cameron. Ask that question of Shakespeare filmmakers, or Jane Austen nuts. TO them, it certainly is, because they enjoy it, just like you apparently enjoy making Avatar films. It just seems like a rhetorical question what's generated some friction from people who are more invested in the Alien series than Cameron is. Frankly I don't think he cares very much about anything except his own projects, right now, and merely offers Ridley some respect, regardless, because the man is his predecessor and a trailblazer.
Quote from: SiL on Feb 01, 2017, 01:20:30 AM
Quote from: whiterabbit on Jan 31, 2017, 09:07:11 AM
Oh boy, not this again. No one sai... you know what, forget it. Better off having a cup of tea with the aliens.
That's what that particular video is implying with the "Cameron trashes sequels while making sequels" comment at the beginning, then asking if he should shut up about sequels at the end.
People can criticise Cameron's comments, but the "lol he's making sequels he should shut up about sequels" shit is dumb.
I don't want to argue about stupid to be honest. Arguing about "internet opinion" is like pissing xenomorph blood into the wind.
I have no interest in Avatar. That of course can change, I might even like it. Still sticking with my "foot in da mouth" opinion.
There have been six Alien movies after the original, including his own. Ignoring his own, that's five films to look at and say, "You know what? Maybe there's not much left in it."
That's where the question is coming from. Avatar has no sequels. There's everywhere for it to go, for now. That'll shrink after each movie. But for now it's an open slate and he can put whatever creativity he wants into it.
The Alien films have already got a long history of increasingly disappointing films, with one uptick right at the end. It's fine to ask if this particular franchise, with its track record, has much left in it, while working on something that is otherwise fresh.
I wonder if SiL and SM are sometimes part Vulcan with all their logic and wisdom.
/thread
I wouldn't call them wise for saying Avatar is "fresh." '"Yes, guv." My ass!'
The number of a series isn't always important, versus content. The Alien universe, to me, is a lot more interesting than Avatar. I can't stand the lore and writing in that film. I don't care if it's the first film in the series. That doesn't mean anything. Neither doesn't Covenant being at the end of a long-running series. Hell, just look at James Bond. Been around for over 50 years and still making good films.
It's fresh in that there is one film and almost endless possibilities. It's not wise, but it is common sense. Whether you're personally more interested in one or the other is entirely irrelevant.
The Alien movie have been consistently OK at best and terrible at worst for over two decades now. Asking whether there's much point in continuing is fine. Even a lot of fans think they should give it a rest.
Covenant might turn it around. Might not. But for now, the track record is looking pretty miserable.
QuoteI wouldn't call them wise
That's okay. I wouldn't call you smart.
I know that I am, regardless of what you think. Unlike you, I don't need qualification from others. "Oh, look at me! I have a ridiculously high post count and stars next to my name!" Big whoop.
And how do you get "endless possibilities" from Avatar? It's such a derivative, cliched, boring film. The only promising thing about it that has me looking forward to anything it could produce is merely the technological aspects that it trailblazed. That's it. Idea-wise, it's a dry well off the get-go.
Because there's one film and plenty of options for stories to tell. We saw relatively little of the planet. We saw effectively nothing of humanity beyond the settlement. There's as much space to grow as there was with Alien in 1979.
You might not be interested, but again, that's not the least bit relevant. Plenty of people didn't give a shit about Alien, look where we are now.
Quote from: NickisSmart on Feb 01, 2017, 04:51:37 AM
I know that I am, regardless of what you think. Unlike you, I don't need qualification from others. "Oh, look at me! I have a ridiculously high post count and stars next to my name!" Big whoop.
:laugh:
How sad.
QuoteAnd how do you get "endless possibilities" from Avatar? It's such a derivative, cliched, boring film. The only promising thing about it that has me looking forward to anything it could produce is merely the technological aspects that it trailblazed. That's it. Idea-wise, it's a dry well off the get-go.
FYI - I'm not SiL, Herr isSmart, so I didn't say Avatar was "fresh" in the first place. However, in this instance it's an appropriate adjective. As I've said earlier, I found Avatar painfully predictable - but it could literally go anywhere with sequels and with the box office popularity of the first one, making sequels is pretty *ahem* smart.
I think Avatar is the nadir of cinematic writing, but even I can see that at this point there are options.
Quote from: OpenMaw on Feb 01, 2017, 03:26:17 AM
I wonder if SiL and SM are sometimes part Vulcan with all their logic and wisdom.
/thread
Does make sense. At the very least one of them has a decent sized James Cameron collection.... I highly suspect.
Oh and no I do not have Ridley Scott bed sheets! nor undies. not even that much of a blade runner fan for that matter. I'mma Alien fan, here at a Alien vs Predator website... Avatar belongs in the General film thread. I don't mean that. It's just that some are defending it a little too hard. I honestly gave up several post ago.
What I mean by that is that I'm not out to win here.
Pretty sure I have the special edition of The Abyss on VHS somewhere.
I'm not much of a Cameron fan. Don't think SM cares much either. Just hate the modern trends in film commentary which are almost exclusively built on knee jerk responses that aren't thought out.
Quote from: SiL on Feb 01, 2017, 05:35:57 AM
I think Avatar is the nadir of cinematic writing, but even I can see that at this point there are options.
The final nail in the coffin was Jake's voice over telling us everything had changed. Just in case we missed it.
I was willing that movie to surprise me at some point, all the way till the end. It didn't.
Quote from: SM on Feb 01, 2017, 05:45:22 AM
Quote from: SiL on Feb 01, 2017, 05:35:57 AM
I think Avatar is the nadir of cinematic writing, but even I can see that at this point there are options.
The final nail in the coffin was Jake's voice over telling us everything had changed. Just in case we missed it.
I was willing that movie to surprise me at some point, all the way till the end. It didn't.
It was so transparent you could see through to the closing credits before it started.
I was wondering what that was. I thought it was the usual issues I have with 3D glasses.