Which film do you prefer Predator 2 or Aliens?

[426Buddy]

Aliens without question.

I do love me some Predator 2 also though.

[SM]

When it comes to scenes where a bunch of guys go into dark place with video cameras and guns mounted on steady-cam harnesses and get stalked by a monster they can't see and a tracking device shows it closing in on their position while the hero shouts at them to get out of there and they get killed and the hero has to go in and try to help them - I liked it better the first time.

[Voodoo Magic]

When it comes to scenes where a bunch of guys go into dark place with video cameras and guns mounted on steady-cam harnesses and get stalked by a monster they can't see and a tracking device shows it closing in on their position while the hero shouts at them to get out of there and they get killed and the hero has to go in and try to help them - I liked it better the first time.

The same can be about Aliens and Robert Heinlein's Starship Troopers x 10.

Fortunately with Predator 2, the bodycam portion lasts only approximately 12 minutes and is not at all the backbone of the film nor weighted with much significance where it becomes a reocurring heavily used criticsm, except for a select few. 

[Huggs]

This was a tough one.

Rabbit's going to strangle me for saying that.

[TheSailingRabbit]

This was a tough one.

Rabbit's going to strangle me for saying that.

It'll take more than that to make me want to strangle you.

[Huggs]

Phwew.

Thought I was a goner.

[Voodoo Magic]

Phwew.

Thought I was a goner.

Come on... does this face look angry to you?

[Huggs]

Phwew.

Thought I was a goner.

Come on... does this face look angry to you?

https://i.pinimg.com/originals/8d/22/03/8d2203cda6b087092cfc3572367b1dcc.jpg

[SiL]

The same can be about Aliens and Robert Heinlein's Starship Troopers x 10.

Name a single scene in Aliens lifted anywhere near as blatantly from the book as that scene in Predator 2.

Beyond the concept of "space marines", "bug hunts", and a few of the technology concepts (drop ships, orbiting space stations, armoured power suits -- and even then those are pushing it. The powerloader is a forklift, not a weapon) Aliens and Starship Troopers have all of about nothing actually in common. Cameron got the actors to read it to get them into the mindset of the soldiers, not because he was aping scenes wholesale.

[Voodoo Magic]

Beyond the concept of "space marines", "bug hunts", and a few of the technology concepts (drop ships, orbiting space stations, armoured power suits -- and even then those are pushing it. The powerloader is a forklift, not a weapon) Aliens and Starship Troopers have all of about nothing actually in common.

I'm going to let that gestate for a few beats.




Now I love BOTH Aliens and Predator 2. Everyone here knows that. But out of all the comparison debates to be had between the two... acting, direction, pacing, dialogue, score... the old Predator 2 'ripped off' Aliens in a scene is very throwing stones from glass-houses to me.  Predator 2 is just a 12 minute scene, but Aliens' entire miltary bug hunt backbone was pulled from Troopers and is much more egregious to me.  Basically if they properly adapted to film Robert Heinlein's Starship Troopers say in 1984, I don't think Aliens proceeds as-is for its obvious rips.

[Kimarhi]

This is also falling into the category of directors changing shit the later the game goes on.



Now Cameron says he had them read Forever War, not SST. 

[Voodoo Magic]

This is also falling into the category of directors changing shit the later the game goes on.



Now Cameron says he had them read Forever War, not SST.

Really? I hadn't heard that.

What's with these legendary filmakers and their revisionist history anyway? Maybe changes and embellishments is just a part of getting older.  I used to walk a mile to school in some snow becomes I used to walk ten miles in a blizzard with no shoes and a younger sibling on my back! 

[SM]

The same can be about Aliens and Robert Heinlein's Starship Troopers x 10.

Name a single scene in Aliens lifted anywhere near as blatantly from the book as that scene in Predator 2.

Beyond the concept of "space marines", "bug hunts", and a few of the technology concepts (drop ships, orbiting space stations, armoured power suits -- and even then those are pushing it. The powerloader is a forklift, not a weapon) Aliens and Starship Troopers have all of about nothing actually in common. Cameron got the actors to read it to get them into the mindset of the soldiers, not because he was aping scenes wholesale.

Indeed.

"x 10" lol

[SiL]

I'm going to let that gestate for a few beats.

SM was talking about a specific scene being lifted wholesale.

Your response to this was that this could be applied "x10" to Starship Troopers. If you can please point out a single scene -- let alone ten -- where this is the case, that would actually address the point I made.

Predator 2 is just a 12 minute scene

Considering the film's 108 minutes long, that's over 10% of the run time

but Aliens' entire miltary bug hunt backbone was pulled from Troopers and is much more egregious to me.

Beyond the concept of "space marines fight space insects" there's nothing terribly substantial in the comparison. Starship Troopers isn't even about fighting space insects, it's about growing through the ranks of the fascistic space military, who happen to be fighting bugs (amongst other things, such as the Skinnies).

And, again, isn't a specific scene.

Don't get me wrong, nobody would argue Aliens is a pure, unique, utterly original film (and if they do, they're seriously misinformed or deluding themselves). Hell, the plot is beat-for-beat a retread of Alien.

But this isn't about taking concepts ("I didn't steal Alien from anyone; I stole it from everyone" - Dan O'Bannon), it's about lifting scenes.

Also worth noting:

I don't give a crap, I love Predator 2, it's just that the claim that the accusation of scene stealing can be labelled at Aliens x10 relative to Starship Troopers is just wrong.

[SM]

I dig Predator 2 as well.

But that sequence was about as blatantly and stupidly shameless as it gets.