Prey Producer Talks Franchise Future and Possible New AVP Film!

Started by RidgeTop, Aug 18, 2022, 04:57:52 AM

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Prey Producer Talks Franchise Future and Possible New AVP Film! (Read 22,040 times)

SiL

Nah, you don't need to nerf the Predators with surprise. That only works once.

PAS Spinelli

The Aliens are meant to be rare, not something common that all Predator knows about, this is not nerfing the Predator, specially because the Alien is nerfed in every AvP situation

BlueMarsalis79

Quote from: [cancerblack] on Sep 29, 2022, 08:12:55 PMI think one way to achieve that is to throw all the film and EU lore out the window and have the Predators genuinely surprised and backfooted by the existence of the Aliens.

Yes please.

It should be Alien to them, not a known quantity.

[cancerblack]

Watching them adapt and overcome that (or not...) with a bruised and beaten but unbowed "hero" Pred being the only survivor from his party (without resorting to explicit canon fodder Pred "extras") could be fun too.

SiL

Quote from: PAS Spinelli on Sep 29, 2022, 08:29:59 PMThe Aliens are meant to be rare, not something common that all Predator knows about, this is not nerfing the Predator, specially because the Alien is nerfed in every AvP situation
They can be rare and familiar.

If the premise is "use surprise to make it harder for the Predator" then yes, you're trying to nerf the Predator and you're not really giving the Alien any credit.

"Aliens are only dangerous when you don't know what they are" is not glowing praise.

PAS Spinelli

Funny, the premise of almost every AVP story/movie is "Predator knows and is prepared to hunt Alien", yet somehow that's not nerfing the Alien..

SiL

SiL

#96
Yeah because the full premise is "...because they're a dangerous and interesting species to hunt."

If you want the conflict to be even actually have the Predators on a hunt and show the Aliens as the stealthy natural born hunter they are. Hunter vs Hunter. Let each play to their strengths.

"They're young, he's a cleaner, it's their first time" - we don't need a gimmick within a gimmick, just treat them both with love.


I should specify I don't think a first encounter is a bad idea for a story, it just doesn't solve the underlying issue past that first encounter.

PAS Spinelli

Good to see the "dangerous and interesting" species being easy to capture and breed, with their queen being tied up and tortured to lay eggs while the Predators are literally treated as gods, such an equal and fair crossover that respects both sides ;D

SiL

Aliens are easy to capture what with the eggs they leave lying around often unattended, and their whole thing is breeding.

I'm not sure where I said the scenario you're presenting is better, you seem to have pulled this out of thin air. I just said "not new".

[cancerblack]

Quote from: SiL on Sep 29, 2022, 08:18:58 PMThat only works once.

Only needs to, for a film.

SiL

SiL

#100
And then the sequel rolls around.

Like I said it could be an interesting story, but if the discussion is "don't make the Predators OP" it's a temporary fix. I'm trying to talk about making the whole concept more engaging for both.


In the interest of actually providing thoughts and not just saying "no, not like that":

How to make it less one sided:

Understand their different hunting approaches and play with it.

Predators hunt like humans - lures, artificial camouflage, specialised weapons.

Aliens hunt like animals - lying in wait, stalking, attacks of opportunity.

Predators like high vantage points and open space to move around. They attack from above, often wounding at range but will come in for the kill.

Aliens like enclosed spaces, tight environments, attacking from any direction but from close proximity.

Give a location that allows both to be in their element - and have each try to draw the other to their home turf. Predators lose advantages when they are enclosed, Aliens are susceptible to being shot in the open.

Minimise wrestling matches. This isn't WWE. Let them stalk and hunt each other. The last act of Predator should be used as reference - cat and mouse tit for tat, but the Predator is now in Dutch's shoes.

Predators should try to keep Aliens at a distance. The problem is Aliens are really good at closing that distance, without them knowing. See also, getting the Predators into tight spaces.

Both creatures can always see each other. Invisibility means nothing to Aliens, Predators have multiple vision modes. Distance and visual obstruction are necessary for both to effectively stalk the other. The Alien wins out here with its preference for tight spaces.

Hand to hand fights should be short, brutal, and in the Alien's favour. They're both strong, but Aliens have the advantage of not giving a f**k. They're unrestrained, while the Predator is worrying about acid blood.

Predators want trophies. This should disadvantage them as they try to not just shoot everything in the head.

Predators like to get in close for the kill after maiming from a distance - this should be a mistake.

A Predator vs more than one Alien in an enclosed space is a dead Predator unless some serious effort is put into the fight choreography. And not without serious injury to the Predator.

The longer the hunt goes, the worse it gets for the Predators. Damaged or depleted weapons, wounds, exhaustion. Aliens don't tire and they heal quickly.

PAS Spinelli

 The concept could be interesting if it's done in a well that has both the Alien and the Predator not knowing how to deal with eachother, we don't need some sort of long lasting rivalry or deep connection, we don't need their lores to be integral to one another.
 Say a human colony in a jungle planet has a mining facility and also serves as a training ground for the UACM, which is very necessary atm due to the whole UUP war, a Predator recently started hunting in that planet and the disappearance of promising recruits is being blamed on UUP spies, creating a kind of who done scenario from the human POV, meanwhile, the miners find a derelict ship and you already know how it goes, eventually this leads to a lone Xenomorph heading towards the camp, and it turns into a situation of a single Xeno (Big Chap) vs a single Predator equipped to only hunt humans(Jungle Hunter) vs unprepared marines who don't really trust eachother.

OpenMaw

To be completely fair to the AVP Comics - Capturing the queen was a very dangerous endeavor that got a lot of Predators killed as I recall. I would tend to agree that it does dampen the initial outing between the two if we see they're already very familiar with one another. Any film adaptation of that original comic would do well to cut out anything dealing with seeing inside the Predator's world. Seeing so explicitly, yes, the Predator's have a queen, and yes, they are harvesting her for eggs... And yes she has to find a way to sneak a "royal" egg past them to mess up their hunt... It's a lot, and it puts the aliens into an underdog posture from the start. Which isn't helped by the conventional wisdom that the alien really does need to lose the match. I'm speaking from a mainstream audience perspective on that. The humans are more than likely going to side with the Predator if any such alliances are to be made, and the aliens are the ones we really don't want to win.

I'm very much in favor of going one on one. I think it raises the tension in each encounter, and with each bit of damage each creature takes. if it's plotted well and organically you can have things starting off very controlled with both creatures at full power, and as Sil was saying, Predator gets tired, Alien begins to take immense physical damage... Until the two are left torn up and fighting like barbaric animals. Down to the last ounce of primal energy.

One thing to consider also with regards to the Predator and his vision modes... He has to keep going back and forth when he's dealing with both humans and aliens. While he's tracking the humans he's basically blind to the alien, and vice versa.

SiL

I still don't see how them knowing each other means much in the context of them fighting.

Aliens are born ignorant, so they never know the Predators. They just wake up and choose violence.

The second Predators realise Aliens bleed acid and can see them cloaked, they've basically learned everything they need to know. They're another animal at that point -- but one with an aggressive reproductive strategy and that can become a fully-grown, apex hunter within a few hours of birth.

The only thing them not knowing about Aliens beforehand would really justify is them not destroying eggs, only to realise later -- whoops, now there are shitloads of Aliens.

And as we've seen, you don't need them to be new to have that happen.

It's a fun premise but feels more like dressing than anything substantial to the narrative.

BlueMarsalis79

I think Prey showed it can be substantial.

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