Poll
Question:
Which trio of films is better?
Option 1: Prometheus, Alien Covenant and Alien
votes: 44
Option 2: Aliens, Alien 3 and Alien Resurrection
votes: 40
If you had to choose between watching Prometheus, Alien Covenant and Alien in one sitting or Aliens, Alien 3 and Alien Resurrection which would you choose?
As much as I love Alien and Covenant, I would go with Aliens, 3 and Resurrection as I find them as the more entertaining of the 6 films.
...f**k me.
I'd have to go for the first option simply because Alien is my favourite film ever, and I'd still rather sit through two films I don't like to watch it, than not watch it.
The first option, alternatively Alien, Aliens and A3.
Option 1. Prometheus and Covenant are just a smidge better than Alien 3 and Resurrection anyway.
Can I just watch Sophie's Choice? Because that's what this poll is like.
Well Streep was considered for Ripley if memory serves...
Quote from: The Old One on Sep 30, 2018, 08:08:02 AM
The first option, alternatively Alien, Aliens and A3.
How about Prometheus, Alien Resurrection and AvPR?
Why not be direct about it and lobotomize me?
It's Requiem that would push me over the edge though.
Quote from: SM on Sep 30, 2018, 09:06:12 AM
Option 1. Prometheus and Covenant are just a smidge better than Alien 3 and Resurrection anyway.
But
Aliens is significantly better than both.
I guess each option contains one classic film and two take-it-or-leave-it options ...
I thought SiL liked the prequels.
Quote from: SiL on Sep 30, 2018, 07:27:49 AM
...f**k me.
I'd have to go for the first option simply because Alien is my favourite film ever, and I'd still rather sit through two films I don't like to watch it, than not watch it.
Yea but there is a major movie missing between covenant and alien. I mean shit that is one hell of a jump.
At least aliens, alien3 and A:R would make more sense. We'd be looking at it as a Ripley mystery in aliens. Like what happened. We'd be like the marines, she apparently saw an alien and then bam, aliens everywhere. It was the mystery that made alien so great so I think that would be the better choice imo.
Quote from: whiterabbit on Sep 30, 2018, 10:10:30 AM
Yea but there is a major movie missing between covenant and alien. I mean shit that is one hell of a jump.
Yeah, but I don't care if there's a progression necessarily; I care about the films themselves.
Quote from: Local Trouble on Sep 30, 2018, 10:04:55 AM
I thought SiL liked the prequels.
I enjoyed watching
Prometheus in theaters, but stopped liking it after it hit home media.
What a difficult poll.
I chose promy, covy, and Alien, but it was a difficult choice. In the end I like all the films on the list more than AR lol.
The first choice for me. Like several others here ALIEN is my all time favorite film. If I could pick out the 3 films. I'd go with ALIEN,ALIENS & ALIEN3. Though I like Prometheus and Covenant very much. I still have many viewings to go to come close to the number of times I've watched the first 3.
First option for me. ALIEN is my favourite film (as is JAWS). I don't mind sitting through PROMETHEUS and ALIEN: COVENANT to get to the real gold.
I voted ALIEN, PROMETHEUS and COVENANT.
PROMETHEUS and ALIEN: COVENANT are The Most Underrated movies of All Time.
Underrated indeed.
Unfortunate that because of the scripts, the reach exceeded the grasp.
Quote from: The Old One on Sep 30, 2018, 11:38:58 PM
Underrated indeed.
Unfortunate that because of the scripts, the reach exceeded the grasp.
You could said the same about most of the Ridley Scott movies. But I don't care. His Visual Imagination is second to none. He has the best eye in the business.
He does indeed, I wish he acquired a script worthy of it.
One last time.
Quote from: The Old One on Sep 30, 2018, 11:51:30 PM
He does indeed, I wish he acquired a script worthy of it.
One last time.
Well, The Martian was great. I hope he directs Battle of Britain. I love World War II movies.
I personally would never watch any of those combinations.
I only watch the films in these..... groups, if you will
Prometheus & Alien Covenant
Alien, Aliens & Alien 3
Alien Resurrection.
The reason I will only watch them this way is because the original three movie are one complete story.
The two prequels are one story, albeit incomplete.
Resurrection is like it own thing in my eyes. An Alien comic book movie.
Watching them in any other way, for me, does not work. They don't compliment each other any other way.
(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi67.tinypic.com%2F1hx8yg.jpg&hash=3ed7cc3d589d893c026f391eba20c451ecaced89)
Spectacular: how one letter can change so much.
I vote for another direction, have Prometheus and Covenant flying off to the far right of alien. Actually the best ending would have been a shot of the covenant traveling through the night sky of some distant planetoid and then pan down to a shot of the Derelict and Calpamos rising in the sky. I mean a total mindf**k.
Why is the OG trilogy not an option here?!
Quote from: CristianoRonaldo7 on Sep 30, 2018, 11:24:33 PM
I voted ALIEN, PROMETHEUS and COVENANT.
PROMETHEUS and ALIEN: COVENANT are The Most Underrated movies of All Time.
Good to see someone acknowledge that. Underrated indeed.
Quote from: The Old One on Sep 30, 2018, 11:51:30 PM
He does indeed, I wish he acquired a script worthy of it.
One last time.
I was listening to the Covenant commentary yesterday. From what I can gather from this (and the special features of the Prometheus set that has everything on it) I think he's really "hands on" when it comes to the script writer. He said that he always "develops" his projects these days (save the Martian in recent times which just loved the script for).
In other words, lot of "blame" can be laid at Scott's feet. I think the writer is really interpreting what Scott ultimately wants (I could be wrong in that, but that's the impression I get).
He kicks off the commentary by saying that he just didn't understand why the "other three films" didn't ask the question who created the Alien and why (I sense he hates all these movies, he never acknowledges them).
I think the Alien being created by David is a shit idea and it offends my preconceptions, but more power to you if you think this is great - I get it. I hate that direction, but ... yeah - that's a creative choice. It's not great and I think it's subverting the 'verse (perhaps the intention?) cos we all "know" the Xeno is ancient and malignant and that the derelict has been fossilised for zillions of years. (not anymore!)
All that said, I'd watch Prometheus/Cov/Alien over the second choice because even if the David thing offends me, Resurrection rams a twelve gauge into the anus of my sensibilities and pulls the trigger.
Quote from: Corporal Hicks on Oct 01, 2018, 10:00:31 AM
Why is the OG trilogy not an option here?!
Because thats the easy answer >: )
Blimey, this is an odd thread.
Can I choose my own three please?
Alien, Alien 3, Covenant
because they're the three that I find scariest, and at the end of the day, I want to be scared. The others have their own qualities, but they're not scary
Second option, if only because 2/3 of the first option made an even more mess of the mythology than Resurrection did and at least the latter does have genetic crossing excuse even if its over the top.
IMO the stuff with the pathogen in Prometheus and Covenant and the genetic crossing in Resurrection go pretty hand in hand. The pathogen definitely (unintentionally by Scott I'm sure) lends a lot more credence to Ripley 8, the Newborn, etc.
Quote from: Frosty Venom on Oct 01, 2018, 11:33:30 AM
Quote from: Corporal Hicks on Oct 01, 2018, 10:00:31 AM
Why is the OG trilogy not an option here?!
Because thats the easy answer >: )
That's my actual answer, though! :laugh:
I'm trying to pick between the two options but I'm not sure. :-\
Its either the three current Ridley Scott Alien films or three very unique Alien movies.
Quote from: Corporal Hicks on Oct 02, 2018, 07:40:57 AM
Quote from: Frosty Venom on Oct 01, 2018, 11:33:30 AM
Quote from: Corporal Hicks on Oct 01, 2018, 10:00:31 AM
Why is the OG trilogy not an option here?!
Because thats the easy answer >: )
That's my actual answer, though! :laugh:
I'm trying to pick between the two options but I'm not sure. :-\
It's the Kobayashi Maru.
Quote from: Corporal Hicks on Oct 01, 2018, 10:00:31 AM
Why is the OG trilogy not an option here?!
What is the OG trilogy? Thanks in advance :)
It means original gangster but it's just shorthand for original.
Quote from: whiterabbit on Oct 02, 2018, 11:02:17 AM
It's the Kobayashi Maru.
Have to tip my cap to you for that one sir.
(https://media1.giphy.com/media/bKBM7H63PIykM/giphy.gif?cid=19f5b51a5bb39f893838324a67459bb3)
Alien > The rest.
I'll take the first batch easily, but Aliens is still tied for first with Alien or 2nd. Alien 3 and Res drag that batch under water.
Although:
Aliens, Alien³ > Prometheus, Covenant
That's just not fair. It's liking comparing red apples to green apples. :P
I'd have to go with the first option myself, but only because Alien probably is my all time favorite film.
I empathize.
Just curious: What are the voting results looking like? (I chose abstention :))
Option 1 2:1.
I can dig that. However if there could only be three...
Aliens is hard to pass up because that film is such a force to be reckoned with, but I chose the first option just because I prefer the more horror-centric Alien and Covenant, and which I think are better than Alien 3 and Res by quite a big margin. So it's just a case of two movies I like the most versus one.
Quote from: Nightmare Asylum on Oct 01, 2018, 04:50:06 AM
(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi67.tinypic.com%2F1hx8yg.jpg&hash=3ed7cc3d589d893c026f391eba20c451ecaced89)
Aw, dude! you win the Matrix! ^
Quote from: PsyKore on Oct 17, 2018, 01:32:35 AM
Aliens is hard to pass up because that film is such a force to be reckoned with, but I chose the first option just because I prefer the more horror-centric Alien and Covenant, and which I think are better than Alien 3 and Res by quite a big margin. So it's just a case of two movies I like the most versus one.
Covenant is more slasher than horror in my opinion, especially with the way the deaths are set up, along with character decisions.
Wait..
So slasher films aren't horror? :laugh:
No, they lack a little thing called "intelligent characters" among a lot other things and rely solely upon tropes.
That is not to say the genre's don't cross or that slasher isn't a sub-genre of horror. But you know which one you're watching by quality of the characters, the tropes involved and so on.
Covenant was more slasher than horror.
Quote from: The Cruentus on Oct 19, 2018, 04:15:28 PM
No, they lack a little thing called "intelligent characters" among a lot other things and rely solely upon tropes.
That is not to say the genre's don't cross or that slasher isn't a sub-genre of horror. But you know which one you're watching by quality of the characters, the tropes involved and so on.
Covenant was more slasher than horror.
Slashers are horror films, end of story. Even you have sort of just conceded this fact.
Alien, Aliens, Alien 3.
As it should be.
I said they are a sub-genre, never said it was dead on horror but it still a difference, otherwise they won't classified as a subgenre, besides I'm drunk, I can say what I want. :laugh:
My point still stands though, Covenant is a slasher rather than intelligent horror, to clarify for those who don't see the difference... Covenant is more like Friday the 13th whereas the first Alien was like the shinning or the thing. :)
Quote from: The Cruentus on Oct 19, 2018, 08:54:34 PM
I said they are a sub-genre, never said it was dead on horror but it still a difference, otherwise they won't classified as a subgenre, besides I'm drunk, I can say what I want. :laugh:
My point still stands though, Covenant is a slasher rather than intelligent horror, to clarify for those who don't see the difference... Covenant is more like Friday the 13th whereas the first Alien was like the shinning or the thing. :)
You originally quite literally said that Slashers aren't horror films. If it's a sub genre then it's still horror by definition. I think I get what you're trying to say nonetheless.
Been on the sauce all day ;D
Quote from: The Cruentus on Oct 19, 2018, 08:54:34 PM
I'm drunk, I can say what I want.
"Got it....Officer?" :D
Quote from: Nyarlathotep on Oct 19, 2018, 09:14:48 PM
Quote from: The Cruentus on Oct 19, 2018, 09:08:45 PM
Been on the sauce all day ;D
I can tell. :laugh:
Was it being mentioned in every thread that tipped you off?
Quote from: SM on Oct 19, 2018, 11:50:41 PM
Quote from: Nyarlathotep on Oct 19, 2018, 09:14:48 PM
Quote from: The Cruentus on Oct 19, 2018, 09:08:45 PM
Been on the sauce all day ;D
I can tell. :laugh:
Was it being mentioned in every thread that tipped you off?
Yeah, that and him straight up talking about barbecue sauce in a thread about predator dogs.
Quote from: Nyarlathotep on Oct 20, 2018, 01:39:46 AM
Quote from: SM on Oct 19, 2018, 11:50:41 PM
Quote from: Nyarlathotep on Oct 19, 2018, 09:14:48 PM
Quote from: The Cruentus on Oct 19, 2018, 09:08:45 PM
Been on the sauce all day ;D
I can tell. :laugh:
Was it being mentioned in every thread that tipped you off?
Yeah, that and him straight up talking about barbecue sauce in a thread about predator dogs.
Way too coherent to be drunk. I think he literally had too much BBQ sauce.
Quote from: The Cruentus on Oct 19, 2018, 03:57:46 PM
Quote from: PsyKore on Oct 17, 2018, 01:32:35 AM
Aliens is hard to pass up because that film is such a force to be reckoned with, but I chose the first option just because I prefer the more horror-centric Alien and Covenant, and which I think are better than Alien 3 and Res by quite a big margin. So it's just a case of two movies I like the most versus one.
Covenant is more slasher than horror in my opinion, especially with the way the deaths are set up, along with character decisions.
Yes and no. Covenant has some red shirt characters which makes it feel like a slasher at times, but compare it with other modern horror films of the time and you can see how far better quality Covenant actually is as a horror film. The backburster sequence is literally minutes long and has the longest buildup in the whole franchise; I was glued to the screen when watching that for the first time. The film also has a lot more artistry involved which sets it above the bar. And dumb decisions are something common in all the Alien films, it's just that Covenant doesn't get a pass from people because it's modern or people don't like the film.
Quote from: whiterabbit on Oct 20, 2018, 04:31:28 AM
Quote from: Nyarlathotep on Oct 20, 2018, 01:39:46 AM
Quote from: SM on Oct 19, 2018, 11:50:41 PM
Quote from: Nyarlathotep on Oct 19, 2018, 09:14:48 PM
Quote from: The Cruentus on Oct 19, 2018, 09:08:45 PM
Been on the sauce all day ;D
I can tell. :laugh:
Was it being mentioned in every thread that tipped you off?
Yeah, that and him straight up talking about barbecue sauce in a thread about predator dogs.
Way too coherent to be drunk. I think he literally had too much BBQ sauce.
Yeah, there should've been no spacing and a lot of run-on sentences. :D Way too clean. Unless he was like Niles Crane with that hash brownie. One sip and he's like "Cool I'm drunk!". ;D
Quote from: Huggs on Oct 20, 2018, 02:51:00 PM
Quote from: whiterabbit on Oct 20, 2018, 04:31:28 AM
Quote from: Nyarlathotep on Oct 20, 2018, 01:39:46 AM
Quote from: SM on Oct 19, 2018, 11:50:41 PM
Quote from: Nyarlathotep on Oct 19, 2018, 09:14:48 PM
Quote from: The Cruentus on Oct 19, 2018, 09:08:45 PM
Been on the sauce all day ;D
I can tell. :laugh:
Was it being mentioned in every thread that tipped you off?
Yeah, that and him straight up talking about barbecue sauce in a thread about predator dogs.
Way too coherent to be drunk. I think he literally had too much BBQ sauce.
Yeah, there should've been no spacing and a lot of run-on sentences. :D Way too clean. Unless he was like Niles Crane with that hash brownie. One sip and he's like "Cool I'm drunk!". ;D
Actually it was too much gin, I was fairly coherent for the state I was in given how much of it I had, especially since I haven't really had a proper drink in awhile thanks to work, but I do know how to hold my liquor :laugh: That being said, I actually did make a few mistakes, I just had the luck (and experience from previous mishaps) of focusing my eyes just before I pressed "Post" to correct them. :P
Didn't enjoy the near almost instant headache I had though, first time drinking that gin since my usual drinking partner is good old Jack. Yes, I am boring that way. ;D
Quote from: PsyKore on Oct 20, 2018, 09:51:08 AM
Quote from: The Cruentus on Oct 19, 2018, 03:57:46 PM
Quote from: PsyKore on Oct 17, 2018, 01:32:35 AM
Aliens is hard to pass up because that film is such a force to be reckoned with, but I chose the first option just because I prefer the more horror-centric Alien and Covenant, and which I think are better than Alien 3 and Res by quite a big margin. So it's just a case of two movies I like the most versus one.
Covenant is more slasher than horror in my opinion, especially with the way the deaths are set up, along with character decisions.
Yes and no. Covenant has some red shirt characters which makes it feel like a slasher at times, but compare it with other modern horror films of the time and you can see how far better quality Covenant actually is as a horror film. The backburster sequence is literally minutes long and has the longest buildup in the whole franchise; I was glued to the screen when watching that for the first time. The film also has a lot more artistry involved which sets it above the bar. And dumb decisions are something common in all the Alien films, it's just that Covenant doesn't get a pass from people because it's modern or people don't like the film.
I agree there is some good stuff in Covenant and that there are dumb decisions in other alien movies, but I feel that Covenant is the worst in that regard and some deaths are just set up so poorly. Ledworth claims he going to take a leak just to have a ciggy, it is a pointless lie with no reason to it, also you know what is coming when someone goes to take a leak or wander off somewhere. I want some surprises in films like these. The backburster scene is definitely a highpoint.
Quote from: The Cruentus on Oct 20, 2018, 08:01:03 PM
I agree there is some good stuff in Covenant and that there are dumb decisions in other alien movies, but I feel that Covenant is the worst in that regard and some deaths are just set up so poorly. Ledworth claims he going to take a leak just to have a ciggy, it is a pointless lie with no reason to it, also you know what is coming when someone goes to take a leak or wander off somewhere. I want some surprises in films like these. The backburster scene is definitely a highpoint.
Alien is the same though. You know when people are going to be killed. Does that mean it's set up poorly? As soon as Brett separates and calls for Jones - "Here kitty kitty!" - you know he's a goner. When Dallas goes into the vents, you know he's not coming back. Etc.
While Covenant doesn't have the memorable characters from the first, it doesn't really do anything else differently from the first.
Brett I agree but Dallas was thought to be the lead up until his death, so there was probably peeps that thought he was going to make it.
Brett only ended up on his own because he let the cat go and the others told him to get it so that it would not show up on the tracker again. It is all how it is set up. Ledward's death was not set up as well. The guy lies for no reason.
I don't agree Ledward lies for no reason. The reason itself is probably unimportant which is why it's disregarded, but it's evident he needs to sneak in a smoke which isn't unrelatable.
Quote from: The Cruentus on Oct 21, 2018, 03:49:14 PM
Brett only ended up on his own because he let the cat go and the others told him to get it so that it would not show up on the tracker again.
I'll never understand that. It's the one thing that's always stood out to me. They've been through all that hell, and they just let him go.
The were scared to death of the facehugger, and it didn't even do anything except fall off and die. They knew there was hostile life, and that the chestburster exhibited enough power to tear through a grown man's chest and run away. Surely they thought it could at least injure somebody?
And, Parker and Brett being friends, he still made him go, alone. I'll never understand it. I just can't see any of them allowing one person to break away from the group and put themselves in danger. It made no sense, other than to line up the first target for the xenomorph.
It was a moment where Ripley did fail to lead.
Quote from: PsyKore on Oct 28, 2018, 10:54:53 AM
I don't agree Ledward lies for no reason. The reason itself is probably unimportant which is why it's disregarded, but it's evident he needs to sneak in a smoke which isn't unrelatable.
This is addressed early on in the movie when what's her name told Oram to let the funeral thing go because soon these people will be his neighbors when they land. The crew wasn't really a team in any sense of the word.
Quote from: Huggs on Oct 28, 2018, 02:09:33 PM
Quote from: The Cruentus on Oct 21, 2018, 03:49:14 PM
Brett only ended up on his own because he let the cat go and the others told him to get it so that it would not show up on the tracker again.
I'll never understand that. It's the one thing that's always stood out to me. They've been through all that hell, and they just let him go.
The were scared to death of the facehugger, and it didn't even do anything except fall off and die. They knew there was hostile life, and that the chestburster exhibited enough power to tear through a grown man's chest and run away. Surely they thought it could at least injure somebody?
And, Parker and Brett being friends, he still made him go, alone. I'll never understand it. I just can't see any of them allowing one person to break away from the group and put themselves in danger. It made no sense, other than to line up the first target for the xenomorph.
It was a moment where Ripley did fail to lead.
When they sent Brett after the cat they still assumed the alien was a 2 foot worm and they thought they could catch it with a fricking net. It is obvious that they're underestimating their adversary. So in their mind, it's just a worm.
And Brett was armed.
You mean cattle prod or the gun? Because I thought only Kane had the gun and that was lost on lv246. In any case he did have two arms.
Quote from: whiterabbit on Oct 28, 2018, 07:40:26 PM
When they sent Brett after the cat they still assumed the alien was a 2 foot worm and they thought they could catch it with a fricking net. It is obvious that they're underestimating their adversary. So in their mind, it's just a worm.
A fast moving 2 foot worm with teeth and the power to blast through a human chest. One recently born from an alien organism that successfully attacked and subdued a member of the crew.
Quote from: whiterabbit on Oct 28, 2018, 07:53:56 PM
You mean cattle prod or the gun? Because I thought only Kane had the gun and that was lost on lv246. In any case he did have two arms.
I thought parker had the prod?
Brett had the prod when Jonesy escaped but I don't remember seeing him with it when the Alien takes him.
Quote from: whiterabbit on Oct 28, 2018, 08:18:30 PM
Brett had the prod when Jonesy escaped but I don't remember seeing him with it when the Alien takes him.
I seem to remember somebody dropped it on the floor when he was taken. So if he didn't have the prod, then he was definitely unarmed.
On a side note, he did say it (the prod) shouldn't damage the creature, so I wouldn't consider that being armed (even if he had it). You're only armed if your weapon can damage your opponent.
The point of the prod was to make the thing f**k off. Damaging it would cause a hull breach.
Quote from: SiL on Oct 28, 2018, 08:55:33 PM
Damaging it would cause a hull breach.
Damn, Parker with the mega prod 5000. Swingin' that thing like a beast.
I know, the acid blood. Still, I'd want something alittle more...sufficient. I certainly wouldn't let a crewmate go alone, especially a friend.
Quote from: whiterabbit on Oct 28, 2018, 08:18:30 PM
Brett had the prod when Jonesy escaped but I don't remember seeing him with it when the Alien takes him.
Would have loved to see him whack the Alien with it. That woulda been stupid funny.
He went off to find Jones. I don't think the idea was to shove the thing in the cat's face a 2nd time. lol. Parker had it. I am sure he drops it when he looks up and is covered in Brett's blood.
-Windebieste.
Quote from: Huggs on Oct 28, 2018, 09:06:02 PM
I know, the acid blood. Still, I'd want something alittle more...sufficient.
But they couldn't. That was literally the point?
Quote from: SiL on Oct 28, 2018, 10:08:40 PM
Quote from: Huggs on Oct 28, 2018, 09:06:02 PM
I know, the acid blood. Still, I'd want something alittle more...sufficient.
But they couldn't. That was literally the point?
Indeed. That's why I said " I'd want ". I'd rather have taken a wrench or a hammer. Something more maneuverable that can ram and crush, but not necessarily slice or poke. And to heck with orders, I'd do it covertly.
Option 1 - all day, every day.
Option 1.
We should throw a monkey wrench into this debate. What if hypothetically they remade Alien and you had to watch the remake four times straight before watching the original Alien and that was the new option 1. Option 2 is still Aliens, 3, AR.
Would that change anyone minds?
Neither then, I never include Resurrection in my retwatches of the series.
Usually I'll watch Alien one night, or earlier in the day and then Aliens and Alien³ as a double feature.
Or Resurrection, Prometheus & Covenant individually.
I would have to go with Aliens, A3, and A:R. Less dumb choices by characters. I rank Alien and Aliens the same. Most days I cant choose which one I like more. It goes in phases. The worst of the 6 movies listed.is A:R though. The others range from okay to amazing.
My thought on Brett is that he might have witnessed the birth, but might have still had sufficient ego to think he could probably handle himself against something he assumed was still only 2 feet long, or at least run if need be, even if he was freaked out. He may have also felt that Jonesy was the sole reason the motion tracker went off. He may have also felt embarrassed to have let Parker and Ripley down by missing the cat, and cowed to their anger.
I assume if the cat ran away, and Brett had already seen the adult he would have told Parker and Ripley to go **** themselves.
It's still Alien, Aliens, Alien³ SE. Every Halloween, to Alien.
Of the choices given, Aliens, Alien 3 and Alien Resurrection.
Alien would be sorely missed, but I love the second and third films and the truth is I enjoy Resurrection far more than Scott's shitshow prequels.
I genuinely don't know, I love Alien,
I don't love Aliens, I love Alien³ SE, I don't love Resurrection.
ALIEN ... always ALIEN.
I already knew your answer before you posted honestly. lol
:D
Yeah with Elmazalman I knew it would be Prometheus, Alien Covenant and Alien and during the first two films he would do his taxes or organize his sock drawer. ;D
VM, you've got a great sense of humour.
Quote from: Fiendishly Inventive on Oct 21, 2019, 03:58:15 PM
VM, you've got a great sense of humour.
Aw thanks sis! Much appreciated! :)
Just the truth.
Why can't I choose all of them ! :'( If only I had enough time I'd happily watch all of them ! But in special order
Spoiler
Resurrection -> Alien -> Aliens -> Prometheus -> Alien 3 -> Alien Covenant
Bizarre order.
Quote from: Kradan on Oct 22, 2019, 05:49:02 PM
Why can't I choose all of them ! :'( If only I had enough time I'd happily watch all of them ! But in special order
Spoiler
Resurrection -> Alien -> Aliens -> Prometheus -> Alien 3 -> Alien Covenant
I honestly like them all, but for different reasons and to different degrees.
Def Aliens , Alien 3, and AR. Aliens is GOAT and I actually like A3.
Quote from: Kradan on Oct 22, 2019, 05:49:02 PM
Why can't I choose all of them ! :'( If only I had enough time I'd happily watch all of them ! But in special order
Spoiler
Resurrection -> Alien -> Aliens -> Prometheus -> Alien 3 -> Alien Covenant
That's an... unique order.
Quote from: Samhain13 on Oct 23, 2019, 12:26:36 AM
Quote from: Kradan on Oct 22, 2019, 05:49:02 PM
Why can't I choose all of them ! :'( If only I had enough time I'd happily watch all of them ! But in special order
Spoiler
Resurrection -> Alien -> Aliens -> Prometheus -> Alien 3 -> Alien Covenant
That's an... unique order.
(https://media.giphy.com/media/l0MYLgNWM3lBGzdcY/giphy.gif)
Quote from: Voodoo Magic on Oct 23, 2019, 01:08:29 PM
Quote from: Samhain13 on Oct 23, 2019, 12:26:36 AM
Quote from: Kradan on Oct 22, 2019, 05:49:02 PM
Why can't I choose all of them ! :'( If only I had enough time I'd happily watch all of them ! But in special order
Spoiler
Resurrection -> Alien -> Aliens -> Prometheus -> Alien 3 -> Alien Covenant
That's an... unique order.
https://media.giphy.com/media/l0MYLgNWM3lBGzdcY/giphy.gif
Oh, it's make perfect sense to me. I increase amount of fun with first three ones, then break it with Prometheus and then enjoyment rises again with 3 and Covenant .
Interesting, I'd just rather not watch the ones I don't enjoy.
Quote from: Huggs on Oct 22, 2019, 11:01:41 PM
I honestly like them all, but for different reasons and to different degrees.
This ^^^ for me
I'm rigging the election to include Alien, Aliens, Alien 3.
Quote from: irn on Oct 24, 2019, 10:21:35 AM
I'm rigging the election to include Alien, Aliens, Alien 3.
(https://media.tenor.com/images/1cdd0f0d4cfc8d1c2dbb5d4e54f56af7/tenor.gif)
It's those Russians again! :laugh:
When do we get the Dossier on Alien 3 and the Sulaco Egg Fiasco?
I want to know what SM knew and when!
Quote from: Huggs on Oct 24, 2019, 10:25:46 PM
It's those Russians again! :laugh:
When do we get the Dossier on Alien 3 and the Sulaco Egg Fiasco?
I want to know what SM knew and when!
But the dossier will just turn out to be lies, paid by an Alien Prequel Fan through his or her lawfirm, soooo...
:D
Where was he when Giger tripped?
Uh oh. Is this another ALIEN vs ALIENS and its sequels thread? ::)
I'd watch 4 out of 6 of those movies.
The disc for Prometheus and Resurrection would be beer coasters though, so this poll is stumped either way.
Quote from: Huggs on Oct 24, 2019, 10:25:46 PM
When do we get the Dossier on Alien 3 and the Sulaco Egg Fiasco?
The call sheets for those reshoots were actually sold at auction and let me tell you they do not clear anything up :laugh:
https://alien-archives.com/2019/04/26/alien%c2%b3-the-l-a-reshoots/
Quote from: SiL on Oct 25, 2019, 06:45:23 AM
Quote from: Huggs on Oct 24, 2019, 10:25:46 PM
When do we get the Dossier on Alien 3 and the Sulaco Egg Fiasco?
The call sheets for those reshoots were actually sold at auction and let me tell you they do not clear anything up :laugh:
https://alien-archives.com/2019/04/26/alien%c2%b3-the-l-a-reshoots/
I think the "super-facehugger", being some organism that detached itself from the alien queen's back, being a sentinel last resort parasite of the hive rather than a magical egg appearing on the sulaco would've been much cooler.
Absolutely, I doubt anyone thinks otherwise.
How can anyone not love that ridiculous egg?
Oh, I really dig that upside-down one !
(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.scified.com%2Ftopics%2F7482156699578125.jpg&hash=273babc9151a7bee75c4755800afc57218d4e8fe)
"Magic egg" is a methaphor of Alien 3 itself when you think about it. It shouldn't be there but it exists anyway whether you love it or hate it .
You know, we have another thread for that...
A cursed thing, unlike the Trilogy itself which if present as an option, is the only option.
It's actually going to be doing the first option soon, watching the 4K ones. With Aliens and Alien³ of course.
After rewatching all of them I think it's definitely the first option, in that Resurrection really sours Aliens and Alien³ if you watch them in one sitting.
Aliens and Alien 3 can't be soured
I agree with the sentiment, but I think you understand my meaning.
I went with Aliens, Alien 3 and AR... I'm counting Alien 3 special edition. Aliens and Alien cancel, I'll take A3 SE over Covenant. Prometheus does beat AR, but; I'll stick with my choice.
I want a third option to tingle my sadomasochism.
Covenant, Resurrection, and Prometheus. In that order.
While drinking the cheapest, shittiest vodka I can find.
That's what we call a madness run.
I hold the original three films above any of the rest. Alien 3 is flawed as Hell, but Resurrection is stupid, Prometheus is beautiful, but even dumber, and Covenant is just NOPE THE MOVIE.
How about Predator, Predators and The Predator or Predator 2, AVP, and AVPR in one sitting?
Damn. Predator's great, Predators is meh, and I hate The Predator.
On the other hand, Predator 2 is the best Predator film, and I hate the other two.
I think I'll choose option B, just to get Predator 2. Sorry Arnie. :laugh:
Quote from: Frosty Venom on May 19, 2020, 12:21:33 PMHow about Predator, Predators and The Predator or Predator 2, AVP, and AVPR in one sitting?
Option A.
Predator's a classic,
Predators is far better than it gets credit for, and nothing compares to my hatred for
Requiem.
option A, but ill miss P2
First option. But actually - Covenant, Alien, Aliens.
Quote from: HuDaFuK on May 19, 2020, 12:39:03 PM
Quote from: Frosty Venom on May 19, 2020, 12:21:33 PMHow about Predator, Predators and The Predator or Predator 2, AVP, and AVPR in one sitting?
Option A. Predator's a classic, Predators is far better than it gets credit for, and nothing compares to my hatred for Requiem.
I think I'd go with A because of how much I love Predator and Predators, but man that The Predator is sure a rough option. AvPR is worse, but The Predator is so much sorer atm.
It still blows my mind that The Predator is nearly AVPR level bad... looking at his filmography, with stuff like The Nice Guys, Black should have been an excellent choice for Predator.
Quote from: Nightmare Asylum on May 19, 2020, 04:10:52 PMIt still blows my mind that The Predator is nearly AVPR level bad...
First off, it's really not - the few undeniably decent scenes in it are leagues above the entirety of
Requiem - and secondly, I still believe most of the shittiest stuff in
The Predator was out of Black's hands.
The whole weaponised autism was his idea.
With which (you won't believe it!) I can live
Quote from: SiL on May 20, 2020, 07:29:46 AMThe whole weaponised autism was his idea.
I don't think it was at all well implemented, but as a concept I didn't find the idea of them looking for benefits in the condition that ridiculous.
I was more bothered by the idea they've been harvesting DNA in general instead of just hunting for lulz.
I've still not read the early script draft, but the impression I get from the original plot and additional deleted Predators is the first cut more strongly implied that such hybridisation isn't condoned or carried out by most Predators, which works better for me.
You didn't think the idea of Predators kidnapping children to harvest autism from their spinal columns to make themselves super powered was ridiculous?
...
Different strokes for different folks.
Quote from: SiL on May 20, 2020, 09:50:10 AM
Different strokes for different folks.
Exactly
Quote from: SiL on May 20, 2020, 09:50:10 AMYou didn't think the idea of Predators kidnapping children to harvest autism from their spinal columns to make themselves super powered was ridiculous?
I refer you to my previous answer :)
If that's not the shittiest thing in the film, what in the heck is ???
Still better than AvPR.
Quote from: SiL on May 20, 2020, 11:26:42 AMIf that's not the shittiest thing in the film, what in the heck is ???
The final scene.
Closely followed by the general subplot about Predators invading the planet because global warming.
Compared to those, I can live with the idea some Predators might be trying to hybridise specific traits from other species, especially if its implied the perpetrators are in the minority (which, again, the original cut seemed to do a better job of).
Quote from: HuDaFuK on May 20, 2020, 11:44:35 AM
The final scene.
Fair
QuoteClosely followed by the general subplot about Predators invading the planet because global warming.
Also Black.
QuoteCompared to those, I can live with the idea some Predators might be trying to hybridise specific traits from other species, especially if its implied the perpetrators are in the minority (which, again, the original cut seemed to do a better job of).
Right, but the issue isn't something as broad as "hybridising specific traits". It's very specifically harvesting autism from a child to turn yourself into a better hunter. That is the concept that Black, himself, put into the film. That was not the studio.
Quote from: SiL on May 20, 2020, 11:26:42 AM
If that's not the shittiest thing in the film, what in the heck is ???
"cough" PredKiller suit "cough"
I vote Prometheus, Alien: Covenant and Alien. I prefer PURE Sci-Fi over Action. That's the reason I prefer Ridley Scott(His Epics and pure Sci-Fi) over jim cameron(action movies) any time, any day.
Quote from: Kradan on May 20, 2020, 03:10:41 PM
Quote from: SiL on May 20, 2020, 11:26:42 AM
If that's not the shittiest thing in the film, what in the heck is ???
"cough" PredKiller suit "cough"
Conceptually I'll take a mech suit over weaponised autism.
Just to make it more offensive, I'm surprised that Shane Black didn't write Olivia Munn as a heroic anti-vaxxer.
The climax of the film would be her trading the boy for some vaccines, saying "These will do the same thing."
:laugh:
As I'm a big horror movie buff, Alien is almost certainly my favourite movie of either grouping. Having said that, I don't think I'd be prepared to sit through the tedium of Prometheus and Covenant for it. I can't abide Scott's pseudo-intellectual takes on intelligent design. And David just annoys me to no end.
On the other hand, in addition to being a fun and rousing crowd-pleaser, Aliens is just as good and well crafted a movie as the original, and while I can see that Alien 3 has its flaws, I still think it's great and underrated tragedy movie that doesn't get near enough respect. And of course, Alien Resurrection is just dumb popcorn fun.
So the second grouping undoubtedly gets my vote.
;) 8)
I read all the posts in the thread. Interesting.
For me the choice is easy. Option one
Unlike some people here, I enjoy all six Alien franchise movies enough that I would be fine with watching any of them again.
Also, the poll has the movies in timeline chronological order. It would be natural for me to watch the prequels and then "Alien".
And after that, I would watch the next trilogy.
Observations about the thread; some people consider "Alien 3" an excellent movie far above the prequels. I don't. I prefer "Prometheus" more than A3.
I saw A3 in a theater at release and was disappointed. The assembly cut doesn't fix the main weaknesses I have. And Fincher isn't coming back to do a director's cut. I don't want to get into more details because there is a separate thread about A3.
There is a large time gap between "Covenant" and "Alien" but there is also a significant time gap between A3 and "Alien Resurrection". Not a problem imo.
Also, someone pointed out that the six films have genetic manipulation at the beginning and at the end. True. Some of the things that the Engineers were doing in Pro were being done by human scientists in AR which creates a bit of unity in the entire story. The Dr. Frankenstein/ scientists playing God trope which goes back to the beginning of science-fiction.
;)
The genetic manipulation in Resurrection wasn't intentional.
An unexpected benefit from the genetic crossing.
Quote from: Local Trouble on Oct 18, 2020, 03:01:47 AM
An unexpected benefit from the genetic crossing.
Wouldnt call it benefit as it resulted in flawed xenos that is one way ticket, maybe the ripley clone could be seen as a benefit but not for the company that spent millions on the project and she wasnt the goal.
Quote from: SM on Oct 18, 2020, 01:47:49 AM
The genetic manipulation in Resurrection wasn't intentional.
Maybe we both have a different interpretation of what genetic manipulation is? Certainly the genetic manipulation in "Prometheus" goes far beyond what was done in "Resurrection".
But to me the efforts of the scientists in "Resurrection" to create a human/Xenomorph hybrid is based on genetic manipulation.
The Ripley clone with xeno traits in that film is the result of genetic manipulation imo.
Same with the Xenomorph queen who has a uterus and her odd looking offspring who is killed at the end of the movie. Again imo.
Clearly you think there is a difference with what the scientists were doing in AR compared with the Engineer tech in Pro.
Could you please tell me your POV.
;)
Quote from: bb-15 on Oct 18, 2020, 03:21:22 AM
Quote from: SM on Oct 18, 2020, 01:47:49 AM
The genetic manipulation in Resurrection wasn't intentional.
Maybe we both have a different interpretation of what genetic manipulation is? Certainly the genetic manipulation in "Prometheus" goes far beyond what was done in "Resurrection".
But to me the efforts of the scientists in "Resurrection" to create a human/Xenomorph hybrid is based on genetic manipulation.
The Ripley clone with xeno traits in that film is the result of genetic manipulation imo.
Same with the Xenomorph queen who has a uterus and her odd looking offspring who is killed at the end of the movie. Again imo.
Clearly you think there is a difference with what the scientists were doing in AR compared with the Engineer tech in Pro.
Could you please tell me your POV.
;)
What the USM scientists
achieved was absolutely genetic manipulation. But that wasn't intentional on their part. They intended to create a Ripley clone where the chestburster DNA was separate from the human DNA, so that they could retrieve the Queen for their experiments. What they wanted was a Queen - not a medley mixing the Queen and Ripley's DNA, hence them considering Ripleys 1-7 failures. On the surface it looked like they had finally achieved their desired goal on their eighth attempt, until Ripley 8, the Queen, and the Queen's offspring started displaying traits belonging to the opposite species.
Quote from: Nightmare Asylum on Oct 18, 2020, 03:59:00 AM
Quote from: bb-15 on Oct 18, 2020, 03:21:22 AM
Quote from: SM on Oct 18, 2020, 01:47:49 AM
The genetic manipulation in Resurrection wasn't intentional.
Maybe we both have a different interpretation of what genetic manipulation is? Certainly the genetic manipulation in "Prometheus" goes far beyond what was done in "Resurrection".
But to me the efforts of the scientists in "Resurrection" to create a human/Xenomorph hybrid is based on genetic manipulation.
The Ripley clone with xeno traits in that film is the result of genetic manipulation imo.
Same with the Xenomorph queen who has a uterus and her odd looking offspring who is killed at the end of the movie. Again imo.
Clearly you think there is a difference with what the scientists were doing in AR compared with the Engineer tech in Pro.
Could you please tell me your POV.
;)
What the USM scientists achieved was absolutely genetic manipulation. But that wasn't intentional on their part. They intended to create a Ripley clone where the chestburster DNA was separate from the human DNA, so that they could retrieve the Queen for their experiments. What they wanted was a Queen - not a medley mixing the Queen and Ripley's DNA, hence them considering Ripleys 1-7 failures. On the surface it looked like they had finally achieved their desired goal on their eighth attempt, until Ripley 8, the Queen, and the Queen's offspring started displaying traits belonging to the opposite species.
First of all, you are correct that what I mentioned previously came by accident;
"
The Ripley clone with xeno traits in that film is the result of genetic manipulation imo.
Same with the Xenomorph queen who has a uterus and her odd looking offspring who is killed at the end of the movie."
However, that was not the only genetic manipulation which the scientists did in AR in my opinion.
What I am going to do is explain my point of view again in more detail.
* In AR there is a Ripley 8 clone which accidentally has become a human/Xenomorph hybrid.
Is the claim that this is the only genetic manipulation done by the scientists In AR?
* I'll explain that more was going on imo.
- A scientist taking a blood sample and only using that to create a human clone, would require genetic manipulation as I understand it.
- In AR the Ripley blood sample contained both human DNA and Xenomorph queen DNA.
Keeping the Ripley DNA separate from the queen DNA required manipulation or handling of each kind of DNA.
- Also the failures of the previous Ripley clones, with their strange appearance, indicates that the scientists were trying to manipulate the DNA to get a certain result. To get the seemingly correct result, Ripley 8, required a manipulation of the DNA in a certain way.
Anyway, we are all basing our conclusions on the same information. Here is the beginning of the plot descriptions of AR from AVP Galaxy and AVP Fandom.
QuoteIt is 200 years since Ellen Ripley died on Fiorina 161. Ripley's former employers, The Weyland-Yutani Company has dissolved and now the United Systems Military has assumed the task of breeding and harnessing the deadly aliens. With blood samples taken from her previous life, scientists clone a new Ripley in order to extract the queen alien inside of her. The new Ripley, known as number 8, acquires physical and emotional traits from both humanity and the aliens, making her question where her allegiances lie.
https://www.avpgalaxy.net/alien-movies/alien-resurrection/
QuoteSome 200 years after the events on Fiorina "Fury" 161, military scientists on the research vessel Auriga successfully create a clone of Ellen Ripley, using DNA from blood samples taken before her death. They extract from her the embryonic Xenomorph Queen that had been growing inside her at the time of her death and raise it for study. As an afterthought, the Ripley clone, marked by a number "8" lasered onto her arm, is kept alive for further research. As a result of her DNA becoming mixed with that of the Xenomorphs during the imperfect cloning process, Ripley 8 is endowed with enhanced strength and reflexes, acidic blood, "inherited memories" from Ellen Ripley's past and an empathic link with the Xenomorphs, especially the Queen.
https://avp.fandom.com/wiki/Alien_Resurrection
;)
Or, to save a lot of faffing around, the genetic manipulation in Resurrection wasn't intentional.
They
intended to clone Ripley and the Queen inside her.
Everything else was...
Quote from: Local Trouble on Oct 18, 2020, 03:01:47 AM
An unexpected benefit from the genetic crossing.
Quote from: SM on Oct 18, 2020, 05:51:03 AM
They intended to clone Ripley and the Queen inside her.
my pet theory is that the facehugger always changes the host's dna somewhat, with the goal of tricking the host's body into treating the resulting embryo like a new "organ", to prevent tissue rejection while the embryo develops.
with this, theoretically, you could do a "ripley 8" to anyone that was ever infected if you had their blood.
Yeah I've always liked that theory too. Ripley seems to get better pretty quick on Fiorina. She's supposed to be sick for a couple of weeks and her eye heals within hours. Similarly Purvis has a chestburster pressing on his lung and he manages to hold his breath as long as everyone else.
Quote from: SM on Oct 18, 2020, 05:51:03 AM
Or, to save a lot of faffing around, the genetic manipulation in Resurrection wasn't intentional.
They intended to clone Ripley and the Queen inside her.
Everything else was...
Quote from: Local Trouble on Oct 18, 2020, 03:01:47 AM
An unexpected benefit from the genetic crossing.
And my position is; all the attempts to clone Ripley (and the Queen inside her) from a blood sample, including the failures and the apparent successes, required genetic manipulation.
Why?
1. There is no natural process to separate two types of DNA from a blood sample. It requires the efforts of scientists/experts to do that involving genetic manipulation.
2. There is no natural process where blood can simply be put in a test tube with an egg which leads to the egg being fertilized with the DNA from that blood.
The DNA from the blood has to be removed by a scientist/expert. And then the DNA needs to be placed into an egg by a scientist/expert. That is also genetic manipulation.
* The short animated DNA explanation video in "Jurassic Park", which includes a discussion of DNA manipulation, explains most of what I'm talking about.
;)
This feels like a semantics argument where both sides know exactly what the others mean but are getting hung up on their choice of words.
Funny about that.
If we wanna clear up the kerffffle, hybridisation was unintentional.
Quote from: SiL on Oct 18, 2020, 08:54:36 PM
If we wanna clear up the kerffffle, hybridisation was unintentional.
Correct.
Quote from: SiL on Oct 18, 2020, 08:30:54 PM
This feels like a semantics argument where both sides know exactly what the others mean but are getting hung up on their choice of words.
I think you're right. It's partly my fault because I began with the hybridization example in AR and described it as genetic manipulation which I compared to "Prometheus".
SM was correct to say that the hybrids in AR were accidental.
* My first comment sounded like only the hybrids in AR were genetic manipulation. Maybe it would help if I said that genetic manipulation = genetic engineering?
In science fiction the best descriptions of genetic engineering within a film are;
QuoteFew films have informed audiences about genetic engineering as such, with the exception of the 1978 The Boys from Brazil and the 1993 Jurassic Park, both of which made use of a lesson, a demonstration, and a clip of scientific film.
(link below)
And AR as well as Jurassic Park are among the most famous science-fiction movies about cloning.
Quote Cloning is a recurring theme in science fiction films like Jurassic Park (1993), Alien Resurrection (1997),
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genetics_in_fiction#Cloning
It is a semantics thing. Is cloning genetic engineerIng (manipulation)? I think so.
But I can see where someone would disagree with me which is OK.
;)
Got to be Aliens, 3, AR for me. Prequels are just too poor for me. AR isn't the best but I love the first three films equally.
Quote from: Bonus Situation on Nov 27, 2020, 07:32:39 PM
Got to be Aliens, 3, AR for me. Prequels are just too poor for me. AR isn't the best but I love the first three films equally.
Same. I've watched Prometheus a load of times but wasn't a fan of Covenant.
Quote from: Bonus Situation on Nov 27, 2020, 07:32:39 PM
Got to be Aliens, 3, AR for me. Prequels are just too poor for me. AR isn't the best but I love the first three films equally.
The prequels were probably my biggest cinematic disappointment of the last decade. After eight years, I'm still trying to get my head around the beautifully lit mess that is Prometheus. I only ever watched Covenant twice, maybe it'll improve with more viewings. But I still prefer both prequels to AR by quite a large margin.
Quote from: son_of_kane on Nov 27, 2020, 09:39:05 PM
Quote from: Bonus Situation on Nov 27, 2020, 07:32:39 PM
Got to be Aliens, 3, AR for me. Prequels are just too poor for me. AR isn't the best but I love the first three films equally.
The prequels were probably my biggest cinematic disappointment of the last decade frist decade of XXI century.
I'm sure, you've meant these prequels:
(https://d13ezvd6yrslxm.cloudfront.net/wp/wp-content/images/starwars-prequels-posters-combined.jpg)
With the exception of Revenge of The Sith.
Wow the poll result is beyond me :o
The second option has Alien Resurrection though. I know that some people prefer that movie to the prequels. But it's definitely not a popular opinion.
I sandwich it between the prequels, myself. Covenant > Resurrection > Prometheus.
Quote from: son_of_kane on Nov 27, 2020, 09:39:05 PM
Quote from: Bonus Situation on Nov 27, 2020, 07:32:39 PM
Got to be Aliens, 3, AR for me. Prequels are just too poor for me. AR isn't the best but I love the first three films equally.
The prequels were probably my biggest cinematic disappointment of the last decade. After eight years, I'm still trying to get my head around the beautifully lit mess that is Prometheus. I only ever watched Covenant twice, maybe it'll improve with more viewings. But I still prefer both prequels to AR by quite a large margin.
Me too.
Alien 3
Alien: Resurrection
AvP: Requiem.
Quote from: Kradan on Nov 28, 2020, 06:32:05 AM
Quote from: son_of_kane on Nov 27, 2020, 09:39:05 PM
Quote from: Bonus Situation on Nov 27, 2020, 07:32:39 PM
Got to be Aliens, 3, AR for me. Prequels are just too poor for me. AR isn't the best but I love the first three films equally.
The prequels were probably my biggest cinematic disappointment of the last decade frist decade of XXI century.
I'm sure, you've meant these prequels:
(https://d13ezvd6yrslxm.cloudfront.net/wp/wp-content/images/starwars-prequels-posters-combined.jpg)
With those prequels I mostly go along with the red letter media reviews. I tried hard to like TPM and AOTC. But after years I gave up. I went to the dark side on all three.
;)
PS. As for the Alien prequels, My ratings have only dipped slightly over the years even with all the negative media they have received.
I unabashedly love me so RotS though.
Phantom Menace has benefit of excitement from "Oooh, new Star Wars story, cool !"
Attack of The Clones is so forgetable, I can barely remember anything from it
Revenge of the Sith has benefit of Emperor and cool emotional fight at the end
All three have the benefit of Ewan McGregor being far too good for the movie he's in.
Quote from: Kradan on Dec 01, 2020, 04:48:35 PM
Phantom Menace has benefit of excitement from "Oooh, new Star Wars story, cool !"
Attack of The Clones is so forgetable, I can barely remember anything from it
Revenge of the Sith has benefit of Emperor and cool emotional fight at the end
Attack of the clones has Jango Fett in it ;)
... And Anakin rolling with Padme in the grass !
Did you know the guy who played Jar Jar Binks considered suicide?
Can I just watch Alien Resurrection three times?
Quote from: [cancerblack] on Dec 01, 2020, 09:04:41 PM
Can I just watch Alien Resurrection three times?
(https://64.media.tumblr.com/b2c1b8fd8a9398afeaedcd33288980a1/tumblr_ncdqpju3Mu1rp0vkjo1_500.gif)
Quote from: [cancerblack] on Dec 01, 2020, 09:04:41 PM
Can I just watch Alien Resurrection three times?
That's two times more than ya should!
It has infinite casual re-watch value and I will not be convinced otherwise.
Nor would I try. There's just no cure for crazy! ;)
Now, with that said, I'm off to go watch AvP Requiem again!
Avp > Requiem.
Quote from: [cancerblack] on Dec 01, 2020, 10:39:36 PM
Quote from: Phobos on Dec 01, 2020, 10:10:13 PM
Avp > Requiem.
Ehh, is it though?
AvP is better than Requiem. It might even be a hair better than Covenant.
Them's is fightin words
Alien: Covenant is right up there, not far behind Aliens and Alien 3 for me.
Alien
Aliens/Alien 3
Alien: Covenant
Alien: Resurrection
Prometheus
Covenant sits third behind Alien and Aliens for mine. Bit of a gap between second and third though.
That might upset the Alien 3 deists.
When are they not?
Quote from: SpreadEagleBeagle on Jan 27, 2014, 05:39:27 AM
Alien3 is flawed in many ways, but it's a billion times smarter, more mature, intelligent, beautiful, creative, innovative, interesting than Aliens. The latter is a cheesy McDonalds hack job, where's A3 is just unique and wraps up Ripley's story perfectly.
ALIENS kinda sux.
Quote from: Local Trouble on Dec 01, 2020, 11:24:48 PM
That might upset the Alien 3 deists.
I prefer 3 to Covvie, but will readily admit how busted it is.
Quote from: SM on Dec 01, 2020, 11:23:48 PM
Covenant sits third behind Alien and Aliens for mine. Bit of a gap between second and third though.
1. Alien
2. Aliens
3. Prometheus
4. Alien: Covenant
5. Alien 3
6. Resurrection
Quote from: Phobos on Dec 01, 2020, 10:10:13 PM
Avp > Requiem.
I can't even get through Requiem and I tried hard. AvP is a lot of fun.
Quote from: Phobos on Dec 01, 2020, 10:43:53 PM
AvP ... might even be a hair better than Covenant.
Story wise AvP is very good. But that's where it ends. Paul W. S. Anderson is just not that good directing (except for Event Horizon). The entire AvP production suffered because of that. As directors Scott or Cameron are just much better with science fiction on every level.
;)
The story is where AvP first shits the bed though?
Quote from: bb-15 on Dec 06, 2020, 10:06:09 AMPaul W. S. Anderson is just not that good directing.
I'd question that.
The tone may have been all wrong but he made that film look a hell of a lot more expensive than it was.
Quote from: HuDaFuK on Dec 06, 2020, 04:55:10 PM
Quote from: bb-15 on Dec 06, 2020, 10:06:09 AMPaul W. S. Anderson is just not that good directing.
I'd question that.
The tone may have been all wrong but he made that film look a hell of a lot more expensive than it was.
Yeah, if he'd been allowed to set it in space or use a fresh Alien design, like he wanted, it might even have been good.
Quote from: HuDaFuK on Dec 06, 2020, 04:55:10 PM
Quote from: bb-15 on Dec 06, 2020, 10:06:09 AMPaul W. S. Anderson is just not that good directing.
I'd question that.
The tone may have been all wrong but he made that film look a hell of a lot more expensive than it was.
That doesn't equate to being a good director. That just equates to being thrifty! :D
Quote from: Voodoo Magic on Dec 06, 2020, 05:07:30 PM
Quote from: HuDaFuK on Dec 06, 2020, 04:55:10 PM
Quote from: bb-15 on Dec 06, 2020, 10:06:09 AMPaul W. S. Anderson is just not that good directing.
I'd question that.
The tone may have been all wrong but he made that film look a hell of a lot more expensive than it was.
That doesn't equate to being a good director. That just equates to being thrifty! :D
He gets good mileage out of a polystyrene and cgi pyramid, I'll give him that much.
Quote from: [cancerblack] on Dec 06, 2020, 05:15:17 PM
Quote from: Voodoo Magic on Dec 06, 2020, 05:07:30 PM
Quote from: HuDaFuK on Dec 06, 2020, 04:55:10 PM
Quote from: bb-15 on Dec 06, 2020, 10:06:09 AMPaul W. S. Anderson is just not that good directing.
I'd question that.
The tone may have been all wrong but he made that film look a hell of a lot more expensive than it was.
That doesn't equate to being a good director. That just equates to being thrifty! :D
He gets good mileage out of a polystyrene and cgi pyramid, I'll give him that much.
Indeed!
Quote from: [cancerblack] on Dec 06, 2020, 04:57:54 PM
Quote from: HuDaFuK on Dec 06, 2020, 04:55:10 PM
Quote from: bb-15 on Dec 06, 2020, 10:06:09 AMPaul W. S. Anderson is just not that good directing.
I'd question that.
The tone may have been all wrong but he made that film look a hell of a lot more expensive than it was.
Yeah, if he'd been allowed to set it in space or use a fresh Alien design, like he wanted, it might even have been good.
I often think if the design of the creatures was better in AvP, would it be a better movie? You know what? I think yeah. Because if he got anything right it was the delicacy of making sure one creature didn't come across as the whipping boy. It was especially refreshing to revisit AvP after watching Requiem, in which not only was the Alien design/practical effects horrendous, they were literally
useless fodder (nothing to do with the effects of course). The sewer scene in which Wolfe rises with an Alien in each hand? WTF ???
But yeah.... sure as hell takes you out of a movie when you're thinking look how giant those flippity flappy hands are on the Alien suit, among many other things. It's not like Anderson shot them particularly poorly.
It would still be a PG kids friendly movie :P
Quote from: HuDaFuK on Dec 06, 2020, 04:55:10 PM
Quote from: bb-15 on Dec 06, 2020, 10:06:09 AMPaul W. S. Anderson is just not that good directing.
I'd question that.
The tone may have been all wrong but he made that film look a hell of a lot more expensive than it was.
(https://i.ibb.co/K2Qf3qf/4pb4kw.jpg)
https://twitter.com/Variety/status/1335151845820522496
Quote from: seattle24 on Dec 06, 2020, 06:27:54 PM
Quote from: [cancerblack] on Dec 06, 2020, 04:57:54 PM
Quote from: HuDaFuK on Dec 06, 2020, 04:55:10 PM
Quote from: bb-15 on Dec 06, 2020, 10:06:09 AMPaul W. S. Anderson is just not that good directing.
I'd question that.
The tone may have been all wrong but he made that film look a hell of a lot more expensive than it was.
Yeah, if he'd been allowed to set it in space or use a fresh Alien design, like he wanted, it might even have been good.
I often think if the design of the creatures was better in AvP, would it be a better movie? You know what? I think yeah. Because if he got anything right it was the delicacy of making sure one creature didn't come across as the whipping boy. It was especially refreshing to revisit AvP after watching Requiem, in which not only was the Alien design/practical effects horrendous, they were literally useless fodder (nothing to do with the effects of course). The sewer scene in which Wolfe rises with an Alien in each hand? WTF ???
But yeah.... sure as hell takes you out of a movie when you're thinking look how giant those flippity flappy hands are on the Alien suit, among many other things. It's not like Anderson shot them particularly poorly.
I'm not sure better creature design would fix the dull characters, lack of tension and lack of fights.
Quote from: SM on Dec 06, 2020, 08:46:41 PM
I'm not sure better creature design would fix the dull characters, lack of tension and lack of fights.
Much like revisiting the creature effects in Alien 3 wouldn't.
Quote from: Local Trouble on Dec 06, 2020, 09:21:12 PM
Quote from: SM on Dec 06, 2020, 08:46:41 PM
I'm not sure better creature design would fix the dull characters, lack of tension and lack of fights.
Much like revisiting the creature effects in Alien 3 wouldn't.
(https://i.giphy.com/media/YtvCIwqNJhUmA/giphy.webp)
Quote from: HuDaFuK on Dec 06, 2020, 04:55:10 PM
Quote from: bb-15 on Dec 06, 2020, 10:06:09 AMPaul W. S. Anderson is just not that good directing.
I'd question that.
The tone may have been all wrong but he made that film look a hell of a lot more expensive than it was.
(https://i.pinimg.com/originals/70/b0/79/70b0793e8b0ce8afc61eec57629f5944.gif)
nah it's laughable garbage.
Ridley Scott has that super power. His prequels are not cheap, but they look even more expensive, especially Prometheus. Even the Raised by Wolves episode he directed looked Top Tier.
Quote from: SM on Dec 06, 2020, 08:46:41 PM
Quote from: seattle24 on Dec 06, 2020, 06:27:54 PM
Quote from: [cancerblack] on Dec 06, 2020, 04:57:54 PM
Quote from: HuDaFuK on Dec 06, 2020, 04:55:10 PM
Quote from: bb-15 on Dec 06, 2020, 10:06:09 AMPaul W. S. Anderson is just not that good directing.
I'd question that.
The tone may have been all wrong but he made that film look a hell of a lot more expensive than it was.
Yeah, if he'd been allowed to set it in space or use a fresh Alien design, like he wanted, it might even have been good.
I often think if the design of the creatures was better in AvP, would it be a better movie? You know what? I think yeah. Because if he got anything right it was the delicacy of making sure one creature didn't come across as the whipping boy. It was especially refreshing to revisit AvP after watching Requiem, in which not only was the Alien design/practical effects horrendous, they were literally useless fodder (nothing to do with the effects of course). The sewer scene in which Wolfe rises with an Alien in each hand? WTF ???
But yeah.... sure as hell takes you out of a movie when you're thinking look how giant those flippity flappy hands are on the Alien suit, among many other things. It's not like Anderson shot them particularly poorly.
I'm not sure better creature design would fix the dull characters, lack of tension and lack of fights.
Yes, that's fair! Said fights also suffer from poor editing and CGI. "Better" was a poor choice of word.
The fights are half decent. Well the first one is. But it's less than five minutes out of a 90 minute flick.
Quote from: SM on Dec 07, 2020, 12:46:44 AM
The fights are half decent. Well the first one is. But it's less than five minutes out of a 90 minute flick.
Blew their load too early on the flashback
That scene is about 3/4 the way through the movie.
Quote from: skhellter on Dec 06, 2020, 11:45:08 PM
Quote from: HuDaFuK on Dec 06, 2020, 04:55:10 PM
Quote from: bb-15 on Dec 06, 2020, 10:06:09 AMPaul W. S. Anderson is just not that good directing.
I'd question that.
The tone may have been all wrong but he made that film look a hell of a lot more expensive than it was.
https://i.pinimg.com/originals/70/b0/79/70b0793e8b0ce8afc61eec57629f5944.gif
nah it's laughable garbage.
But I love that scene !
Quote from: skhellter on Dec 06, 2020, 11:45:08 PMhttps://i.pinimg.com/originals/70/b0/79/70b0793e8b0ce8afc61eec57629f5944.gif
nah it's laughable garbage.
Way to completely ignore the bit where I said the tone is still all wrong.
I could counter your gif with one of the dropship entering the atmosphere in
Aliens, because frankly those effects look hokey too.
Quote from: HuDaFuK on Dec 07, 2020, 09:36:57 AM
Quote from: skhellter on Dec 06, 2020, 11:45:08 PMhttps://i.pinimg.com/originals/70/b0/79/70b0793e8b0ce8afc61eec57629f5944.gif
nah it's laughable garbage.
Way to completely ignore the bit where I said the tone is still all wrong.
I could counter your gif with one of the dropship entering the atmosphere in Aliens, because frankly those effects look hokey too.
The one of the dropship when Ripley's going back to rescue Newt is worse.
Quote from: HuDaFuK on Dec 06, 2020, 04:55:10 PM
Quote from: bb-15 on Dec 06, 2020, 10:06:09 AMPaul W. S. Anderson is just not that good directing.
I'd question that.
The tone may have been all wrong but he made that film look a hell of a lot more expensive than it was.
Agreed there. Fight chorography, characters, story, etc, all that other stuff aside, AvP didn't look cheap. I'll always appreciate that from AvP. IIRC they could only afford 3 of those torches.
It's a shame we didn't get to see him go future, Event Horizon Paul Anderson could have at least been a little more interesting.
Quote from: SiL on Dec 07, 2020, 04:55:45 AM
That scene is about 3/4 the way through the movie.
Shows how often I watch it then, I guess.
Quote from: Corporal Hicks on Dec 07, 2020, 10:53:27 AM
Agreed there. Fight chorography, characters, story, etc, all that other stuff aside, AvP didn't look cheap.
To be honest that's more production design than direction, which speaks more to his ability as a producer to find the right people.
Quote from: SiL on Dec 07, 2020, 11:41:52 AM
Quote from: Corporal Hicks on Dec 07, 2020, 10:53:27 AM
Agreed there. Fight chorography, characters, story, etc, all that other stuff aside, AvP didn't look cheap.
To be honest that's more production design than direction, which speaks more to his ability as a producer to find the right people.
That's what I was personally alluding to. The sets look great for the money spent? That's a great production designer. The shots make the sets look better than they are? That's a great cinematographer. You're great at maximizing every dollar spent? You're a great producer. You're great at hiring the right people, also you're a great producer.
It's more rare these days, but I know some directors can negotiate final approval on these hires, but as a director you have to bring out the best in these people and make all the pieces come together in a single dramatic vision and work, like a coach, resulting in an entertaining well made film. In that area,
to me, he fails. I just don't think Paul W. S. Anderson is that guy.
This all makes me think of James Cameron, where it's been said multiple times that he can do practically everyone's job better than they can.. cameraman, lighting, cinematography, storyboards, concept art, editing... that with his constant meddling/assistance, he makes almost everyone better around him. Pissed off, yes, :laugh: but also better. Cameron can wear so many hats it frustrates him sometimes he had to rely on other people. But that's of course a rare breed!
Quote from: SiL on Dec 07, 2020, 11:41:52 AM
Quote from: Corporal Hicks on Dec 07, 2020, 10:53:27 AM
Agreed there. Fight chorography, characters, story, etc, all that other stuff aside, AvP didn't look cheap.
To be honest that's more production design than direction, which speaks more to his ability as a producer to find the right people.
Yeah, that's quite true. My mistake.
Spoiler
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XZRBFtmtXpk
Maybe the only creepy Alien moment. AVP needed more of this. Predators also needed one creepy scene, too. Something like the one in the subway from Predator 2.
One AVP3 needs to go in the creepy direction, not in the versus direction.
To the poll:
Alien is best movie, but I can't suffer the prequels to watch in a row.
Alien Resurrection is better to swallow. Second choice I go.
There was potential in the Connors/ Verheiden/ Miller 'death' scenes - but the editing was choppy and I think they overdid the quivery lip thing.
I'm surprised that more people would rather sit through the prequels than watch Aliens and A3.
Quote from: Phobos on Dec 08, 2020, 02:55:37 AM
I'm surprised that more people would rather sit through the prequels than watch Aliens and A3.
Not that much of a gap, and the first option includes Alien.
If Alien-Alien3 was an option one would win no prizes for guessing the most popular answer.
Quote from: SM on Dec 08, 2020, 12:59:48 AM
There was potential in the Connors/ Verheiden/ Miller 'death' scenes - but the editing was choppy and I think they overdid the quivery lip thing.
And the Alien sound effects are bad. But they started chucking the 'less is more' approach out of the window long before AvP.
Quote from: Voodoo Magic on Dec 07, 2020, 02:21:28 PM
This all makes me think of James Cameron, where it's been said multiple times that he can do practically everyone's job better than they can.. cameraman, lighting, cinematography, storyboards, concept art, editing... that with his constant meddling/assistance, he makes almost everyone better around him. Pissed off, yes, :laugh: but also better. Cameron can wear so many hats it frustrates him sometimes he had to rely on other people. But that's of course a rare breed!
And that's why I love the man
Quote from: seattle24 on Dec 08, 2020, 08:32:47 AM
Quote from: SM on Dec 08, 2020, 12:59:48 AM
There was potential in the Connors/ Verheiden/ Miller 'death' scenes - but the editing was choppy and I think they overdid the quivery lip thing.
And the Alien sound effects are bad. But they started chucking the 'less is more' approach out of the window long before AvP.
Alien's headbite in AvP 2004 has metalic sound to it which is weird
Quote from: Kradan on Dec 08, 2020, 02:00:41 PM
Quote from: Voodoo Magic on Dec 07, 2020, 02:21:28 PM
This all makes me think of James Cameron, where it's been said multiple times that he can do practically everyone's job better than they can.. cameraman, lighting, cinematography, storyboards, concept art, editing... that with his constant meddling/assistance, he makes almost everyone better around him. Pissed off, yes, :laugh: but also better. Cameron can wear so many hats it frustrates him sometimes he had to rely on other people. But that's of course a rare breed!
And that's why I love the man
I remember watching a Brad Fiedel interview about scoring The Terminator and Brad said Cameron corrected him on a portion of the score and, wouldn't you know it, Brad admitted Jim was right.
Take that, Cameron haters !!! :P
Quote from: Immortan Jonesy on Dec 06, 2020, 11:52:20 PM
Ridley Scott has that super power. His prequels are not cheap, but they look even more expensive, especially Prometheus. Even the Raised by Wolves episode he directed looked Top Tier.
Agreed. Ridley and Cameron with science fiction have the brilliant talent to make the visuals and the camerawork look great down to the smallest detail.
Add to that they are great in their casting.
Ridley is very good with pace in building a mystery.
Cameron is great with pace in building an action sequence.
And it's not about money, Blade Runner and The Terminator were cheap films.
And as you said; Prometheus, Raised by Wolves episode one (l'd add Covenant) were all low budget and looked very good.
On all those levels PWS Anderson isn't close to being that good (except for Event Horizon). AvP was still fun though.
;)
(1) Alien, (2) Aliens, (3) Alien DC / Aliens DC (alternating).
The rest I can easily do without.
He changed the no-win situation like Kirk and Kobayashi Maru!
Quote from: Rudiger on Dec 09, 2020, 02:58:11 PM
(1) Alien, (2) Aliens, (3) Alien DC / Aliens DC (alternating).
The rest I can easily do without.
Understandable.
Quote from: bb-15 on Dec 09, 2020, 01:26:27 PM
Quote from: Immortan Jonesy on Dec 06, 2020, 11:52:20 PM
Ridley Scott has that super power. His prequels are not cheap, but they look even more expensive, especially Prometheus. Even the Raised by Wolves episode he directed looked Top Tier.
Agreed. Ridley and Cameron with science fiction have the brilliant talent to make the visuals and the camerawork look great down to the smallest detail.
Add to that they are great in their casting.
Ridley is very good with pace in building a mystery.
Cameron is great with pace in building an action sequence.
And it's not about money, Blade Runner and The Terminator were cheap films.
And as you said; Prometheus, Raised by Wolves episode one (l'd add Covenant) were all low budget and looked very good.
On all those levels PWS Anderson isn't close to being that good (except for Event Horizon). AvP was still fun though.
;)
By what measure were Blade Runner and Prometheus cheap or low budget?
Blade Runner definitely looks a hell of a lot more expensive than it was, but "low budget" is pushing it.
Prometheus cost a shit-ton.
Other films around 1982: ET cost $10.5m, Rambo cost $15m, Tron cost $17m, Poltergeist cost $10.7m, Conan cost $20m, Gandhi cost $22m - Blade Runner was around $30m.
Quote from: SM on Dec 09, 2020, 09:28:37 PM
Quote from: bb-15 on Dec 09, 2020, 01:26:27 PM
Quote from: Immortan Jonesy on Dec 06, 2020, 11:52:20 PM
Ridley Scott has that super power. His prequels are not cheap, but they look even more expensive, especially Prometheus. Even the Raised by Wolves episode he directed looked Top Tier.
Agreed. Ridley and Cameron with science fiction have the brilliant talent to make the visuals and the camerawork look great down to the smallest detail.
Add to that they are great in their casting.
Ridley is very good with pace in building a mystery.
Cameron is great with pace in building an action sequence.
And it's not about money, Blade Runner and The Terminator were cheap films.
And as you said; Prometheus, Raised by Wolves episode one (l'd add Covenant) were all low budget and looked very good.
On all those levels PWS Anderson isn't close to being that good (except for Event Horizon). AvP was still fun though.
;)
By what measure were Blade Runner and Prometheus cheap or low budget?
After checking the numbers, Blade Runner had an above average budget for a special effects science fiction movie at that time. Not the most expensive film but still not low budget. I stand corrected.
* Prometheus is low budget for a special effects science fiction film for its time.
* Blade Runner production budget; $28 million
https://www.the-numbers.com/movie/Blade-Runner#tab=summary
1978 Superman cost $55 million
1981 Superman II cost $54 million
https://www.the-numbers.com/movie/Superman-II#tab=summary
* Prometheus (2012) production budget; $125 million
https://www.the-numbers.com/movie/Prometheus#tab=summary
2012 John Carter cost $264 million
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_most_expensive_films
;)
$28 million in the early 80s isn't low budget and $125 million in 2009 wasn't low budget either. $125 million still isn't low budget - $80m is about the cutoff for "mid budget" movies.
Quote from: SiL on Dec 13, 2020, 06:18:13 AM
$28 million in the early 80s isn't low budget and $125 million in 2009 wasn't low budget either. $125 million still isn't low budget - $80m is about the cutoff for "mid budget" movies.
I edited my above post because the way I write, it takes me time to crunch the numbers and get all of the references posted and do my edits.
I agree that 1982 Blade Runner was not a low budget special effects science fiction film. In fact for the genre it was above average in cost for its time. The final version of my comment says that. So, we agree there.
However, with Prometheus, I did not explain myself completely about the genre which is my fault.
I meant low budget in the context of big special effects science-fiction or adventure films. John Carter was an example of the genre. Other movies of this type from 2012 which cost $200 million or more included; Men in Black 3, The Dark Knight Rises, The Avengers, Skyfall, The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey, The Amazing Spider-Man and Battleship.
Films between $150 to $200 million include; Snow White and the Huntsman and Wrath of the Titans. Hugo is not a big adventure film but it cost like one. Same with Dark Shadows.
I could see where are you had the impression that I was comparing Prometheus with every movie that came out that year. That was not my intention.
- I was not comparing the cost of Prometheus to straight dramas like Lincoln or a comedy like Magic Mike which of course are cheaper to make than big special effects sci-fi or adventure.
;)
Man, this is a hard one.
ALIEN and A3 are my two favorite movies in the series, so I'll have to base my choice on the other two movies of each option available. A:R and PROM are my two least favorite Alien series movies, but as I prefer ALIENS over A:C I'd have to say that option no. 2 ought to be my choice... Even so, ALIEN is the original and I have never watched PROM, A:C and ALIEN in one sitting yet, so I'm going to pitch option no. 1...
QuoteHowever, with Prometheus, I did not explain myself completely about the genre which is my fault.
I meant low budget in the context of big special effects science-fiction or adventure films.
Total Recall, Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows Part 1, Fast Five, The Wolverine, Ender's Game, Cloud Atlas all had around the same budget or less, all effects heavy sci fi films.
Prometheus' budget is if anything perfectly average for its size and scale. Despite being a sci fi effects film it has only two primary locations and it's dialogue heavy. It's not on the same scale production wise of something like John Carter or even The Dark Knight Rises (crowd scenes on studio productions are incredibly expensive and TDKR has multiple, for example).