From The Other Side, Discussing Dan Trachtenerg's Predator 5 (aka Skulls) - AvP Galaxy Podcast #119

Started by Corporal Hicks, Dec 09, 2020, 04:00:50 PM

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From The Other Side, Discussing Dan Trachtenerg's Predator 5 (aka Skulls) - AvP Galaxy Podcast #119 (Read 14,684 times)

Voodoo Magic

Quote from: Wysps on Dec 18, 2020, 08:55:12 PM
Really enjoyed the podcast!  Listening to it in one sitting really does require a time commitment  :laugh:  I'm putting my thoughts under the Spoilers since I hate just leaving a wall of text.

Spoiler
First off, I'm so excited that we don't have to wait another 5, 10+ years for another Predator film.  I thought because of how poorly received the last one was, we'd definitely be looking at a 10+ year hiatus. I feel so lucky to be a Predator fan right now.  Both A and P fans have so much to look forward to going into the 2020's  :)

When you guys were talking about the potential mystical angle (portraying the Predator as if it were like a ghost or paranormal figure, rather than a Scifi alien monster), I think this could very well be an angle that they go with.  Especially with the way in which they were wanting to keep the involvement of the Predator under wraps.  It may be their intent to go back to the roots of the first movie and focus mostly on the characters outruning/out smarting the Predators, with the suspense of the Predator in the shadows/backround.  Kind of like the "monster" in It Follows.  We get to see it and recognize it's power, but we're always kept at two arm's length without really ever understanding it, if that makes sense.

I don't think it would be a stretch at all to somehow tie this film into the Predator 2 ending with the flintlock pistol.  It seems like it would be more of a hop than a leap, per se.  The setting works, loosely, as does the time period (though to be honest, it's hard for me to imagine a Predator movie taking place in the Plains or desert.  Won't that have an effect on the mystery?  Where will everyone hide?)  But going back to the setting/time period, I suppose it depends on what they mean by pre-colonization: pre-contact or pre-colony building (and then, which colonies). 

I'd love to see a female protagonist go up against a female Predator.  I think this would be the perfect opportunity to finally use one and it feel just natural to the script.  My guess is that they'll go with the portrayal in Hunting Grounds (not my first choice, but eh).  I've never really liked the reasoning that because the males are muscular with linear torsos, they are the equivalent to human males.  And therefore, the females are supposed to have breasts.  I don't buy it. 

But as far as casting choices for the female Comanche protagonist, it's too bad there aren't more known actresses to pull from.  I do see some potential problems that could impact how the film is received.  There's already a lot of issues with people acknowledging their Native American ancestry, who gets to claim their ancestry and what checkboxes they have to mark in order to do so.  Just some quick googling of the actress that you mentioned, Voodoo, already shows some controversy on the subject.  I'd hate for this film to be rejected or denounced  because of a cultural oversight or something.  That was my first thought when you guys mentioned the possibility of somehow tying in the Predators with some of the existing folklore of the tribes.   

Spoiler
So also, like what was brought up in the podcast about the contemporary gender politics, it did give me pause when I first read the movie description. Idk, I suppose whenever there's a female main it feels personal.  Like I get extra invested in it.  I'd like the female main to be taken seriously and be a good character.  The last thing I want is to be pandered to or patronized.  I truly hope they reach out to experts and give an accurate representation of life within the tribe, and not just superimpose the gender experience of Europeans at the time or in modern times.  Though I will say, from what I've read so far, there are similarities.  The captivity story of Bianca Babb is an interesting read.
[close]
[close]

Wow great post Wysps! I say remove those spoilers and let your wall of text shine!

In regards to controversy in relation to native american ancestry, who are decedents of what tribes, and accurately depicting proper behavior in said tribes, it almost feels like a field of landmines to navigate. Maybe they'll hire a consultant from the Comanche tribe to keep it all straight. But these days, even if they do that, it feels like someone getting pissed off with something is inevitable. :-\

BigDaddyJohn

Quote from: Voodoo Magic on Dec 19, 2020, 01:15:00 PM
Quote from: Wysps on Dec 18, 2020, 08:55:12 PM
Really enjoyed the podcast!  Listening to it in one sitting really does require a time commitment  :laugh:  I'm putting my thoughts under the Spoilers since I hate just leaving a wall of text.

Spoiler
First off, I'm so excited that we don't have to wait another 5, 10+ years for another Predator film.  I thought because of how poorly received the last one was, we'd definitely be looking at a 10+ year hiatus. I feel so lucky to be a Predator fan right now.  Both A and P fans have so much to look forward to going into the 2020's  :)

When you guys were talking about the potential mystical angle (portraying the Predator as if it were like a ghost or paranormal figure, rather than a Scifi alien monster), I think this could very well be an angle that they go with.  Especially with the way in which they were wanting to keep the involvement of the Predator under wraps.  It may be their intent to go back to the roots of the first movie and focus mostly on the characters outruning/out smarting the Predators, with the suspense of the Predator in the shadows/backround.  Kind of like the "monster" in It Follows.  We get to see it and recognize it's power, but we're always kept at two arm's length without really ever understanding it, if that makes sense.

I don't think it would be a stretch at all to somehow tie this film into the Predator 2 ending with the flintlock pistol.  It seems like it would be more of a hop than a leap, per se.  The setting works, loosely, as does the time period (though to be honest, it's hard for me to imagine a Predator movie taking place in the Plains or desert.  Won't that have an effect on the mystery?  Where will everyone hide?)  But going back to the setting/time period, I suppose it depends on what they mean by pre-colonization: pre-contact or pre-colony building (and then, which colonies). 

I'd love to see a female protagonist go up against a female Predator.  I think this would be the perfect opportunity to finally use one and it feel just natural to the script.  My guess is that they'll go with the portrayal in Hunting Grounds (not my first choice, but eh).  I've never really liked the reasoning that because the males are muscular with linear torsos, they are the equivalent to human males.  And therefore, the females are supposed to have breasts.  I don't buy it. 

But as far as casting choices for the female Comanche protagonist, it's too bad there aren't more known actresses to pull from.  I do see some potential problems that could impact how the film is received.  There's already a lot of issues with people acknowledging their Native American ancestry, who gets to claim their ancestry and what checkboxes they have to mark in order to do so.  Just some quick googling of the actress that you mentioned, Voodoo, already shows some controversy on the subject.  I'd hate for this film to be rejected or denounced  because of a cultural oversight or something.  That was my first thought when you guys mentioned the possibility of somehow tying in the Predators with some of the existing folklore of the tribes.   

Spoiler
So also, like what was brought up in the podcast about the contemporary gender politics, it did give me pause when I first read the movie description. Idk, I suppose whenever there's a female main it feels personal.  Like I get extra invested in it.  I'd like the female main to be taken seriously and be a good character.  The last thing I want is to be pandered to or patronized.  I truly hope they reach out to experts and give an accurate representation of life within the tribe, and not just superimpose the gender experience of Europeans at the time or in modern times.  Though I will say, from what I've read so far, there are similarities.  The captivity story of Bianca Babb is an interesting read.
[close]
[close]

Wow great post Wysps! I say remove those spoilers and let your wall of text shine!

In regards to controversy in relation to native american ancestry, who are decedents of what tribes, and accurately depicting proper behavior in said tribes, it almost feels like a field of landmines to navigate. Maybe they'll hire a consultant from the Comanche tribe to keep it all straight. But these days, even if they do that, it feels like someone getting pissed off with something is inevitable. :-\

I think you're right, these days any reason to go off on something seems like a good reason !
Regarding the movie, it may be a silly question but do you think characters could actually speak only the native language of that era, or will it be a standard english speaking movie ? I believe it will probably be the latter, unless they pull an apocalypto on this one.

SiL

It'll be in English. They still need to play it relatively safe

Kradan


Voodoo Magic

Quote from: BigDaddyJohn on Dec 19, 2020, 01:56:58 PM
I think you're right, these days any reason to go off on something seems like a good reason !
Regarding the movie, it may be a silly question but do you think characters could actually speak only the native language of that era, or will it be a standard english speaking movie ? I believe it will probably be the latter, unless they pull an apocalypto on this one.

Well the smart money is on English, but I'd personallly love if they went indigenous language with English subtitles. But for it to work imo, the script would have to be light on dialogue and heavy on scenery and cinematography, with plenty of communication with the eyes, which I would just adore. :)

BigDaddyJohn

Quote from: Voodoo Magic on Dec 19, 2020, 09:59:23 PM
Quote from: BigDaddyJohn on Dec 19, 2020, 01:56:58 PM
I think you're right, these days any reason to go off on something seems like a good reason !
Regarding the movie, it may be a silly question but do you think characters could actually speak only the native language of that era, or will it be a standard english speaking movie ? I believe it will probably be the latter, unless they pull an apocalypto on this one.

Well the smart money is on English, but I'd personallly love if they went indigenous language with English subtitles. But for it to work imo, the script would have to be light on dialogue and heavy on scenery and cinematography, with plenty of communication with the eyes, which I would just adore. :)

I'm with you on that one !


Wysps

Quote from: BigDaddyJohn on Dec 19, 2020, 10:54:17 PM
Quote from: Voodoo Magic on Dec 19, 2020, 09:59:23 PM
Quote from: BigDaddyJohn on Dec 19, 2020, 01:56:58 PM
I think you're right, these days any reason to go off on something seems like a good reason !
Regarding the movie, it may be a silly question but do you think characters could actually speak only the native language of that era, or will it be a standard english speaking movie ? I believe it will probably be the latter, unless they pull an apocalypto on this one.

Well the smart money is on English, but I'd personallly love if they went indigenous language with English subtitles. But for it to work imo, the script would have to be light on dialogue and heavy on scenery and cinematography, with plenty of communication with the eyes, which I would just adore. :)

I'm with you on that one !

Same  :)  Having it subtitled would actually seem more natural (stands to reason!).  I know Dances with Wolves was a bit of a mix, but large portions of it was subtitled and didn't distract from the movie in the least.  That being said, the language piece may end up adding more to the heavy plate for this movie (plus the cost of hiring a language expert).  Do we really need that much talking in a Predator movie though?  :laugh: 

Kradan


XenoHunter99

I'm poised to re-watch P2. We'll see if any of Voodoo's extra enthusiasm infected me  ;D

Kradan



Voodoo Magic

Quote from: XenoHunter99 on Dec 21, 2020, 03:46:23 PM
I'm poised to re-watch P2. We'll see if any of Voodoo's extra enthusiasm infected me  ;D

Infection was always the plan!



;D

Kailem

Great listen guys! You definitely covered just about everything there is to cover at this early stage.

It's still crazy to me that we're getting another Predator movie so soon after the last one's less-than-amazing reception. You might be right in that it may well have been something Dan Trachtenberg pitched to the studio as something he could do on the cheap rather them shopping it around themselves.

I just love that we're finally, finally getting a Predator movie set in the past. As cool as it might be I'd be surprised if they went the subtitle route too, though they could maybe do something like The Hunt for Red October or The 13th Warrior do where they show that the characters are technically speaking their native language but for the audience's benefit we're hearing them in English.

And yeah, Eric's idea could totally have worked as a way of potentially keeping the fact that it was actually a Predator movie under wraps if the whole time it was promoted as "Native Americans vs some strange 'clearly not a Predator' monster", only for the actual movie to reveal that the Predator was originally hunting that instead.

It is a bit of a shame that there's no chance of any sort of "stealth" reveal for this now though, if that ever was the plan. On the one hand it could have been an extremely cool "HOLY CRAP WE'RE GETTING A NEW PREDATOR MOVIE AND IT'S ALREADY BEEN FILMED?!?!" moment, but on the other the majority of people would likely have had it spoiled ahead of watching the trailer anyway as soon as the movie sites realise what it was and every Youtube upload had it listed as "Predator 5" with a Predator thumbnail.

But either way it's super cool that it's happening at all regardless of how we found out about it, even though like you said we'll probably have to wait quite a while before we get any new information now.

xenofeen

I loved the podcast and been a fan of the site for years, and have a few points to make

1.) I would love a fully subtitled movie with the native Americans and I like the movie example of Apocalypto, But I feel this sadly will not be done as I think this kind of movie would serve the fans well but would fall short on attracting new fans of the franchise IMHO.

2.) I hope they do not give the Predator advanced weapons, not even a plasma castor! if this movie takes place during the 16/1700s the only weapons the "prey" will have are bladed weapons and bows and to me, the pred should be leveling the playing field by not using advanced weapons outside the cloak to study the prey.

3.) I also hope to god they actually try and tie the predator into Native American lore and could actually be a memory from an ancestor and build it around a dream/vision from an Ayahuasca retreat. This could be a really cool idea 

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