Future AVP stories and the Alien prequels

[Immortan Jonesy]

Dear Scott's lawyers, sorry not sorry; but it's enough. I mean, we are just having fun here. Why do you want to destroy us? Just let us to discuss about that hypothetical movie, which even though it doesn't exist yet, shows us that David is full of shit. You can join us on this amazing journey if you want. May the peace be with you! always ^^

But are we talking hypothetical movies? Or responding to statements like "The Predator was a spear that just happened to look like the one from AVP. It doesn't mean that film counts" and "There's nothing in the film Covenant that precludes the existence of human bred xenomorphs on any other planet or in any time prior to David's experiments on Planet 4"?

Predator can flirt as much as it wants with Alien, but in the aforementioned series there is no connection to AVP. That said, David creating the Alien doesn't have any great impact in the AVP concept in the sighlest, since it is its own thing at the moment. Of course things can change in the future, including David as the creator.

My point is that you can speculate freely, even theorizing that the Alien and Predator universes are one and the same. As long as you make it clear that it's your speculation, I don't see anything wrong with it. But yes, there are those who believe that their opinions and theories are facts. Some even go too far with the sometimes overrated excuse that says "art can be interpreted". My appologies if my reply was out of place. 

[Voodoo Magic]

Dear Scott's lawyers, sorry not sorry; but it's enough. I mean, we are just having fun here. Why do you want to destroy us? Just let us to discuss about that hypothetical movie, which even though it doesn't exist yet, shows us that David is full of shit. You can join us on this amazing journey if you want. May the peace be with you! always ^^

But are we talking hypothetical movies? Or responding to statements like "The Predator was a spear that just happened to look like the one from AVP. It doesn't mean that film counts" and "There's nothing in the film Covenant that precludes the existence of human bred xenomorphs on any other planet or in any time prior to David's experiments on Planet 4"?

Predator can flirt as much as it wants with Alien, but in the aforementioned series there is no connection to AVP.

Agreed. I was only speaking AvP in relation to Predator. Sorry if I wasn't very clear.

That said, David creating the Alien doesn't have any great impact in the AVP concept in the sighlest, since it is its own thing at the moment. Of course things can change in the future, including David as the creator.

Agreed again.

My point is that you can speculate freely, even theorizing that the Alien and Predator universes are one and the same. As long as you make it clear that it's your speculation, I don't see anything wrong with it. But yes, there are those who believe that their opinions and theories are facts. Some even go too far with the sometimes overrated excuse that says "art can be interpreted". My appologies if my reply was out of place. 

Agreed yet again! And no apologies necessary my friend!   

[Immortan Jonesy]

Dear Scott's lawyers, sorry not sorry; but it's enough. I mean, we are just having fun here. Why do you want to destroy us? Just let us to discuss about that hypothetical movie, which even though it doesn't exist yet, shows us that David is full of shit. You can join us on this amazing journey if you want. May the peace be with you! always ^^

But are we talking hypothetical movies? Or responding to statements like "The Predator was a spear that just happened to look like the one from AVP. It doesn't mean that film counts" and "There's nothing in the film Covenant that precludes the existence of human bred xenomorphs on any other planet or in any time prior to David's experiments on Planet 4"?

Predator can flirt as much as it wants with Alien, but in the aforementioned series there is no connection to AVP.

Agreed. I was only speaking AvP in relation to Predator. Sorry if I wasn't very clear.

That said, David creating the Alien doesn't have any great impact in the AVP concept in the sighlest, since it is its own thing at the moment. Of course things can change in the future, including David as the creator.

Agreed again.

My point is that you can speculate freely, even theorizing that the Alien and Predator universes are one and the same. As long as you make it clear that it's your speculation, I don't see anything wrong with it. But yes, there are those who believe that their opinions and theories are facts. Some even go too far with the sometimes overrated excuse that says "art can be interpreted". My appologies if my reply was out of place. 

Agreed yet again! And no apologies necessary my friend!   

^^

[EJA]

So, a story depicting the first encounter between Alien and Predator occurring in the future of the Alien movies? Yes or no? I, for one, think it would be interesting. 

[SiL]

No. then it'd be an AvP film.

[SpaceKase]

Basically all I'm saying is, if one takes the hardline stance that David created the alien because of Ridley's supposed intentional master plan, then it nullifies everything outside of the 3 Scott Films, making them their own self contained trilogy, and egg morphing a thing since there is no such thing as a queen because that was Cameron's creation. Ridley certainly had no intentions regarding Cameron's film or anything that came about from it afterward. Which is cool, that's a perfectly valid choice one can make.

But if one is talking about anything relating to AvP, then in that franchise the inclusion of all the related franchises is implicit in the conceit of the thing,

So from that point, one can either accept the inclusion of the EU, in which case David would clearly be a part of but, (barring potential time travel elements from a thus far imaginary fourth Ridley Scott film), he is explicitly not the sole creator of the Aliens as we know them.

Or you can reject any story elements not originating from Scott and his apparent intentions and call Alien, Prometheus, and Alien Covenant a self contained trilogy (and possible future Quadrilogy) connected with the Blade Runner Universe as Scott has also said in interviews.

Or you can take a piecemeal approach, curating which elements and which media are and are not included in one's own personal desire-based headcanons; which, given the plethora of artistic contributors involved in the original film and everything that's come afterward in the massive interconnected wealth of creative output over the last several decades, I think is the only rational approach.

And to answer the original poster's question. absolutely not. Ridley Scott has never and will never include any aspect of Predator lore into the universe of his personal films.

[SiL]

if one takes the hardline stance that David created the alien because of Ridley's supposed intentional master plan

What about people who do it because it's what's in the film regardless of what Scott said outside of the film?

[SpaceKase]

if one takes the hardline stance that David created the alien because of Ridley's supposed intentional master plan

What about people who do it because it's what's in the film regardless of what Scott said outside of the film?

I would suggest to those people that David, mechanically and psychologically damaged as he is explicitly portrayed, is making bold and irrational claims that he has no way of proving outside of his own self-assurance. And that just because he's claiming the right of godhood, that doesn't make it a fact.

[SM]

It nullifies what now?

[SpaceKase]

It nullifies what now?

Anything that's not Ridley's personal intentions.

[SiL]

I would suggest to those people that David, mechanically and psychologically damaged as he is explicitly portrayed, is making bold and irrational claims that he has no way of proving outside of his own self-assurance. And that just because he's claiming the right of godhood, that doesn't make it a fact.

David proves his claims with his lab full of experiments and half-completed iterations. Every lie he makes in the film is specifically addressed by the end of the film. The film does show he's capable of lying, but makes zero effort to show the audience he's lying about that.

Audience members wanting it to be a lie or a falsehood is not the same as proof that it is.

[SpaceKase]

I would suggest to those people that David, mechanically and psychologically damaged as he is explicitly portrayed, is making bold and irrational claims that he has no way of proving outside of his own self-assurance. And that just because he's claiming the right of godhood, that doesn't make it a fact.

David proves his claims with his lab full of experiments and half-completed iterations. Every lie he makes in the film is specifically addressed by the end of the film. The film does show he's capable of lying, but makes zero effort to show the audience he's lying about that.

Audience members wanting it to be a lie or a falsehood is not the same as proof that it is.

I am in no way contending that David believes himself to be lying.

[426Buddy]

I would suggest to those people that David, mechanically and psychologically damaged as he is explicitly portrayed, is making bold and irrational claims that he has no way of proving outside of his own self-assurance. And that just because he's claiming the right of godhood, that doesn't make it a fact.

David proves his claims with his lab full of experiments and half-completed iterations. Every lie he makes in the film is specifically addressed by the end of the film. The film does show he's capable of lying, but makes zero effort to show the audience he's lying about that.

Audience members wanting it to be a lie or a falsehood is not the same as proof that it is.

Yeah I dont think David was lying about the author of Ozymandias, he really believed it was Byron.  The idea here is that David really believes he created the Alien but is again wrong and malfunctioning.

The film shows us David created an Alien, David tells us he made the first Alien ever. He really believes he did but the movie also shows that what he believes isnt always correct.

I don't understand why it bothers folks when people continue to look for ways to walk it back in the next film. AC says David made the Alien but if the next film wanted to change that it wouldnt be very difficult. Parade pooping I say.

[SiL]

The film shows us David created an Alien, David tells us he made the first Alien ever. He really believes he did but the movie also shows that what he believes isnt always correct.

And the film points out every example of him being wrong.

I don't understand why it bothers folks when people continue to look for ways to walk it back in the next film. AC says David made the Alien but if the next film wanted to change that it wouldnt be very difficult. Parade pooping I say.

There's a difference between "Here's how they can walk it back" and "Because there's wiggle room to walk it back later it means it's wrong to read it as written now". All for the former, hate the latter.

[426Buddy]

The film shows us David created an Alien, David tells us he made the first Alien ever. He really believes he did but the movie also shows that what he believes isnt always correct.

And the film points out every example of him being wrong.

Wouldn't you have to be the writer to know that? Or is there some writing rule that a character can only have been misleading or wrong if the film explicitly points it out by the end? Can it not be left ambiguos?

*edit not sure if this came off rude but wanted to clarify that im asking because I don't have any education or knowledge regarding story writing/rules/structure.

There's a difference between "Here's how they can walk it back" and "Because there's wiggle room to walk it back later it means it's wrong to read it as written now". All for the former, hate the latter.

I agree but I think the former and the latter have often been lumped together.