The first time I saw Predator (1987), I missed about the first 30 seconds. So I missed the scene of the alien ship dropping some pod off down to Earth.
I saw it on rented VHS at a friend's house, and the tape box was just a generic one from the store. So I had no idea what the movie was about going into it. I recognized Arnie of course once it started.
To this day I still think the movie was better for it. I thought it was just a solid Arnie actioner for a good while into the movie. Then it became ????? Then of course you can imagine how the last 30 mins blew my mind.
Anyone else think the opening scene was unnecessary, and a bit too much of a spoiler?
I think the intro was great but simple. It had you thinking about what the ship dropped on earth, and it added to the suspense and mystery until we actually saw the creature.
The opening sets up the threat in a way that others don't, the threat isn't that it's a super strong alien with advanced technology, the threat is that it's an alien that causally kicks ass and leaves just as quietly as it arrived. Dutch may be a tough guy with a mission to complete but the Predator only cares as much as anything can reasonably provide a challenge. It's king shit and it knows it which also sets up it's fall when Dutch tricks it at the end. The reveal of the ship helps inform the audience the creature is intelligent and later on kind of full of himself. He knows he's king of the jungle and it's what helps sell his eventual downfall because outside of sheer strength and intelligence none of that technology or intelligence saved him from a falling log.
And even then this also builds up as to what's behind the mask and that's really important for a Predator film. We know what's on the other end of it by now but at the time all of the build up of an advanced creature that views us as little more than game sets a bit of expectations. Then all of a sudden it's the mother of all ugly crab monsters and it helps subvert expectations especially seeing as how a lot of rubber suit creatures are humanoid. You just expect to see something you can empathize with. A lot of the setup for the creature's unmasking is done in the little things it has and does before it gets into a fist fight with Arnold.
But if his technology isn't his threat, then why bother showing it at the start.
If you don't see the ship then you have no idea who he is, or his capabilities.
If you see the ship, surely he's less of a badass, because you know he has all this advanced tech that just makes it a walk in the park for him.
And because Predator is a movie with a big 'reveal', I think not knowing he was an alien adds to it.
Also, while watching the movie and having no clue what's hunting them, less still suspect an alien, puts you right in the shit with Dutch's squad.
When you know from the start it's an alien, then you're more of just a spectator. "What cool thing will the alien do next!?"
If they didn't show the spacecraft, then you'd think the predator were some kind of concoction made by the military to create a super soldier. LMFAO
The script starts without the ship.
I like it how it is, but I definitely see how completely removing any trace of the alien organism before it shows up could add an extra layer.
It's there for two reasons:
Foreshadowing:
https://literarydevices.net/foreshadowing/
And genre expectations:
http://www.umontanamediaarts.com/MART101L/genre-and-the-power-of-expectation
Apparently these storytelling devices weren't necessary for your enjoyment. But I bet they worked for most people.
TC
The Pred didn't need his technology to be a threat or look badass. He man handled Arnold Schwarzenegger like he was nothing.
I definitely didn't think it needed either of those devices. The foreshadowing was a bit heavy when actually showing a spaceship, and as for expectation, I think it worked well when you were as lost as Dutch and co.
Too bad I'll never get the chance to see Predator again without knowing what's going on :(
Quote from: TC on Mar 31, 2020, 05:01:57 AM
It's there for two reasons:
Foreshadowing:
https://literarydevices.net/foreshadowing/
And genre expectations:
http://www.umontanamediaarts.com/MART101L/genre-and-the-power-of-expectation
Apparently these storytelling devices weren't necessary for your enjoyment. But I bet they worked for most people.
TC
I don't see any issues with the opening. It's basically the same as the opening for The Thing.
The music cues as the ship appears out of the darkness and then something falls to earth gives the movie an ominous start. It's one of my favorite moments of the film.
I mean it's kind of obvious from trailers, pop culture, posters, etc.
@Ronoc
Did you ever see the movie (or read the comic)
Cowboys and Aliens? What a great title! It sets up the audience's genre expectations to accept the conventions of both the cowboy film
and the sci-fi film. What do you think audience reception would have been if it was just called "Cowboys"? A lot of annoyed patrons, that's what. Because the expectations of those who love westerns but hate sci-fi would have been defied.
But back to
Predator: The spaceship flyby tells the audience that this is a sci-fi story, so expect some sci-fi action.
Believe it or not, there are people that love war films but hate sci-fi. I know some of them. To them, sci-fi is cheesy, escapism for adolescent boys who can't deal with real life, whereas war films are real life business for men (even if so-called "real life" is Rambo!). You don't want that type of viewer settling into your movie only to be confronted halfway through by a bug-eyed monster from outer space sporting a ray-gun. As the filmmaker, you'd only be setting your movie up for a 1 star rating.
Not every viewer is going to be as embracing as you are, willing to accept whatever the filmmaker serves up.
Quote from: SiL on Mar 31, 2020, 12:03:02 PM
I mean it's kind of obvious from trailers, pop culture, posters, etc.
True, these things do a lot to "position" an audience for the story (if you'll excuse my marketing-101 speak). The choice of title is also good for this.
Alien is a great title.
Snakes on a Plane is a great title.
Gigli is not.
Trailers and posters do a lot to establish genre expectations for your story, but they are remedial, an adjunct. Most storytellers who take pride in their craft want the actual story and its title (which I consider an important part of the story) to be a standalone work of its own, without all the marketing bumph that goes to with it.
TC
I get all that, but as I say, I saw the movie in total isolation. This was in 1987/88, video rental, when I was 11. I hadn't seen the poster, hadn't seen any trailers, no idea of it's existence. Just popped round a friend's house, and it was starting. So I'm talking about a case like that. Going in blind.
I remember years later seeing the full movie, and was very surprised to see that they revealed the protagonist in the very first scene! I thought it was a mistake to be honest. Like I said it worked for me being as in the dark as much as Dutch.
But of course yeah, people like to know what they're about to watch, at least even just the genre
Always loved that opening shot, it actually disturbed me a little as a kid.
Quote from: Ronoc on Mar 31, 2020, 01:36:44 PM
I remember years later seeing the full movie, and was very surprised to see that they revealed the protagonist in the very first scene!
Even if you did not see its posters or trailers before watching it the first time, they did not reveal anything. You just saw a space ship dumping something on the Earth and it could be anything. A robot, an alien tech, a probe, a mutagen, etc.
Also, now that I think about it, without that opening spaceship shot I don't think there's any kind of explanation anywhere in the film as to where the Predator comes from. No one ever refers to it as an alien or speculates about its origin. Am I right?
There's only this:
Anna : When I was little, we found a man. He looked like - like, butchered. The old women in the village crossed themselves, and whispered crazy things, strange things. "El diablo cazador de hombres". Only in the hottest years this happens. And this year, it grows hot. We begin finding our men. We found them sometimes without their skin... and sometimes much, much worst. "El que hace trofeos de los hombres" means "the demon who makes trophies of men".
It seems obvious to us now, but in 1987 maybe John McTiernan thought he owed the audience a definitive answer to that question.
TC
The first time I missed the opening scene.
Personally, I'd be good without it. It's just several brief shots which doesn't really add much . It would make the reveal more effective, I guess.
I don't think the intro has any real affect on the big reveal at the end, seeing as we get a a few glimpses of the Predator creature beforehand. If anything, it just clues the audience in on the creature being alien, as TC mentioned. He's not just a creature from the Black Lagoon.
Yeah, though I think I always assumed he was an alien after seeing it. The tech and his face I guess
This ^^^
True, the tech definitely gives it away if nothing else.
I still don't think it ruins the reveal at the end as that was more shocking due to the impressive design and creature effects. Though maybe it would have been more effective for the med kit scene. It's just foreshadowing though, a quick shot to let people know that something sc-fi-y is going on before jumping into what seems like a typical 90s action flick.
It was probably the best way to include the ship since, at one point, they considered having Dutch and Anytime duke things out right outside the thing.
It is important for general audiences. It's typical Mcternian direction.
This movie is about an alien hunter. Right up front. The next half hour of movie is concerned with ratcheting the tension. You know there's something, you're just waiting for it to show up.